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SuperSix2
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 2:38 pm

Forgive my ignorance, but why would you select gear retract if the pins don't allow the gear physically retract?
 
United857
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 2:57 pm

SuperSix2 wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but why would you select gear retract if the pins don't allow the gear physically retract?

So that the gear doors open and allow you to perform maintenance on the multitude of aircraft systems components housed in the gear bays.
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marc20359
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 3:25 pm

A6-EOP out of service might hurt more than many people think. It is one of only six 2 class (C58 Y557) birds. A6-EOP, A6-EOQ, A6-EOR, A6-EOS, A6-EOX, A6-EOY. Pulling one out of DWC want be the same.

For a total of 615 passengers, the highest number on any A380 and therefore the most seats in commercial aviation.
 
Theseus
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 3:26 pm

United857 wrote:
SuperSix2 wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but why would you select gear retract if the pins don't allow the gear physically retract?

So that the gear doors open and allow you to perform maintenance on the multitude of aircraft systems components housed in the gear bays.


Interesting! I was wondering the same thing actually. But then, why not have a specific command "open the gear doors", just for the maintenance engineers ? This mistake seems to occur regularly. Maybe the cost of having it (and certifying it) would be too high ?
 
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Revelation
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 3:29 pm

dragon6172 wrote:
What I had heard is that it fell off the nose jack. Plausible, aircraft do shake and vibrate quite a bit when the gear is operated. Probably a lot more to it though

I would think we would see some remnants of the jack in the photo, no?

Here's what one looks like:

Image
Ref: https://twitter.com/a380fanclub/status/ ... 7921477633

United857 wrote:
SuperSix2 wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but why would you select gear retract if the pins don't allow the gear physically retract?

So that the gear doors open and allow you to perform maintenance on the multitude of aircraft systems components housed in the gear bays.

Thanks, I learned something new today.

I knew there was a lot of stuff in that area, I never really puzzled out how it gets accessed.

I would guess the vendors would want to implement an interlock where the system made you confirm you really wanted to raise the gear while the plane was not moving and the mass of the plane was still compressing the gears?
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TWA772LR
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 3:38 pm

That'll buff right out.
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emiratesdriver
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 3:59 pm

A thorough internal investigation will conclude that no shortcuts were taken, all procedures were followed and that it was in fact the fault of the Malay/Indian/Bangladeshi/Sri Lankan/Pakistani floor sweeper because his manager had less Wasta than the rest.
Suitable punishment and deportation will follow and then all will be well again as justice will have been served, Inshallah!
 
Tristarsteve
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 7:12 pm

Theseus wrote:
United857 wrote:
SuperSix2 wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but why would you select gear retract if the pins don't allow the gear physically retract?

So that the gear doors open and allow you to perform maintenance on the multitude of aircraft systems components housed in the gear bays.


Interesting! I was wondering the same thing actually. But then, why not have a specific command "open the gear doors", just for the maintenance engineers ? This mistake seems to occur regularly. Maybe the cost of having it (and certifying it) would be too high ?


Do you know that??
Never worked A380, but A320 and A330 have a small handle for each gear to open the doors for maintenance ( and B777 B744), but there is basically nothing in the nose gear bay.
I am surprised that the A380 has no door handle, and has a multitude of aircraft systems in there.

I have moved the gear handle to up on the ramp. I think it was a B744 (or a B767), where the gear handle had to be up to remove the upper centre display screen..
Bit scary, and I made sure there was a pin in, and a tractor parked under the nose!!. And I was the only guy working the aircraft. In a hangar with loads of people, I would be worried.
 
Theseus
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 7:22 pm

Tristarsteve wrote:
Do you know that??
Never worked A380, but A320 and A330 have a small handle for each gear to open the doors for maintenance ( and B777 B744), but there is basically nothing in the nose gear bay.
I am surprised that the A380 has no door handle, and has a multitude of aircraft systems in there.

I have moved the gear handle to up on the ramp. I think it was a B744 (or a B767), where the gear handle had to be up to remove the upper centre display screen..
Bit scary, and I made sure there was a pin in, and a tractor parked under the nose!!. And I was the only guy working the aircraft. In a hangar with loads of people, I would be worried.


I have no idea, I am not working in aircraft maintenance, but just wondered from the previous reply why the A380 mechanics would not have used such a handle; it would be interesting to know whether it exists, why not if it does not, and why it was not used in this specific case if it exists...
Thanks for the very informative replies (to laymen like me at least!).
 
queb
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 9:39 pm

Here is a picture of the A380 nose gear bay assembly.

Image

The big panel in the back of the picture is the the front panel of the gear bay and also the first frame just after the radome. The frame who look like a big moustache is also the rear panel of the gear bay. So if one of them is seriously damaged (maybe the front frame is), the easier way to repair is to replace the entire assembly, not an easy job.
 
ZaphodHarkonnen
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 9:56 pm

Oooof. That must have made a big noise.

If it slipped off a jack, would we not also expect one or two punctures from the jacks? The damage might not just be around the nose and the L1 door.
 
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DocLightning
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 11:19 pm

Also, the L1 door was torn off its hinges and you can see it lying on top of the maintenance platform at upper frame right. Moreover, someone on Reddit who says he works on A380s says that in this situation, the #2&3 engines will almost certainly contact the ground, and if that's the case the cowling and inlet ring will need to be repaired/replaced. I hope the T/R mechanisms weren't damaged in the process.

If you look at the side elevation in this pic and imagine drawing a straight line from the MLG to the underside of the nose, you can see that that line passes by the underside of the two inboard engines, so...ouch.

Image
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787SIN
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 11:23 pm

The picture above of structure is part of the pressurised fuselage area. The nose gear bay of a A380 has essentially a large fairing surrounding it. The vertical structure that is said to be by the radome is in-fact not there, its at the aft end of the nose gear bay.

A350s have a similar design too. The cockpit floor up until a partial vertical frame and bulkhead just in front of the windshields makes up the rest of pressurised area.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 11:33 pm

DocLightning wrote:
Also, the L1 door was torn off its hinges and you can see it lying on top of the maintenance platform at upper frame right. Moreover, someone on Reddit who says he works on A380s says that in this situation, the #2&3 engines will almost certainly contact the ground, and if that's the case the cowling and inlet ring will need to be repaired/replaced. I hope the T/R mechanisms weren't damaged in the process.

If you look at the side elevation in this pic and imagine drawing a straight line from the MLG to the underside of the nose, you can see that that line passes by the underside of the two inboard engines, so...ouch.

Image

Oh... If the nacelles hit, that adds another few million to the bill. Oops.

Lightsaber
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queb
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Sun Aug 25, 2019 11:38 pm

787SIN wrote:
The picture above of structure is part of the pressurised fuselage area. The nose gear bay of a A380 has essentially a large fairing surrounding it.


No the gear bay is structural aluminum. I also have picture of an A330 nose gear bay I worked on:

Side view, you can see the gear rotation bushing on the aft (right on the picture):

Image
 
787SIN
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Mon Aug 26, 2019 12:27 am

queb wrote:
787SIN wrote:
The picture above of structure is part of the pressurised fuselage area. The nose gear bay of a A380 has essentially a large fairing surrounding it.


No the gear bay is structural aluminum. I also have picture of an A330 nose gear bay I worked on:

Side view, you can see the gear rotation bushing on the aft (right on the picture):

Image


That is too small for an A380 NLG bay, it actually looks like a A320 series one with the solid FR20 at the same end of the NLG bearing point.

If you want to see what a A380 looks without the fairing installed see the link below:

https://trends.directindustry.com/project-15956.html
 
queb
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Mon Aug 26, 2019 1:19 am

787SIN wrote:
That is too small for an A380 NLG bay, it actually looks like a A320 series one with the solid FR20 at the same end of the NLG bearing point.


As I said it's from an A330. For the A380, you're right, I guess they have to change it. I thought the design was similar to the A330.
 
queb
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Mon Aug 26, 2019 2:17 am

queb wrote:
787SIN wrote:
That is too small for an A380 NLG bay, it actually looks like a A320 series one with the solid FR20 at the same end of the NLG bearing point.


As I said it's from an A330. For the A380, you're right, I guess they have to change it. I thought the design was similar to the A330.


And it's between frame 16-17
 
strfyr51
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Mon Aug 26, 2019 3:32 am

well? It might be the first time this has happened to an A380 but It's NOT the first time this had happened. Seen it happen to a B747 also. It's costly and unfortunate BUT the repair isn't that bad. though expensive,,
 
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BoeingVista
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Mon Aug 26, 2019 3:45 am

United857 wrote:
SuperSix2 wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but why would you select gear retract if the pins don't allow the gear physically retract?

So that the gear doors open and allow you to perform maintenance on the multitude of aircraft systems components housed in the gear bays.


All gear doors would be open anyway if the hydraulic system was depressurised, though its possible that the A380 nose gear doors are electrically operated.
BV
 
strfyr51
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Mon Aug 26, 2019 3:58 am

SuperSix2 wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but why would you select gear retract if the pins don't allow the gear physically retract?



what if you needed to check the NLG retract actuator for a leak from the Piston? You'd Pin all the MLG and select the gear up to pressurize the Piston,
Then you could just Look and see if it's leaking. Other than that? you'd have to Jack the nose, disable the Nose gear doors open and raise the gear. which might take a couple of hours to do, Since it appears it was in a Maintenance Dock already.
someone did NOT have the pins installed for some reason and I cannot say why. since that's SOP.
 
OMAAbound
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Mon Aug 26, 2019 11:02 am

Revelation wrote:
OMAAbound wrote:
Not to worry, there’s plenty of A380’s parked up at DWC that they weren’t using, nothing to see here, move along...

This is the comment I was expecting to read.

Ya got 100+ A380s, what does one less matter?


I was there just a few weeks back, 3/4+ A380’s all parked up, probably 6+ 777’s that I counted.

I’d imagine they’ll put this straight in the spares bin.

OMAA
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ba9216c
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Mon Aug 26, 2019 12:13 pm

1) Yes the A380 NLG, WLG and BLG doors can be opened on the ground with no hydraulics available as they use an electric actuator system for the uplock.

2) There are 4 electrically operated hydraulic pumps (2 per hyd system) allowing hydraulic operations without engines running and as mentioned you can use a ground cart

3) if it has jumped of Jacks you would see the Jack as it sits under aircraft

4) You can operate hydraulics for leak checks and functions

5) I am familar with this aircraft and there is an alternate gear extension operation check which requires functioning of the landing gear lever with hydraulics on. This check also requires simulation of air mode with weight on wheels, so unfortunately if the pins are not checked prior to this test, the aircraft nose gear or body gear will retract with the aircraft on the ground. I would likely assume this was the case here.
 
EK7777
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Re: maintenance mishap causes extensive damage to an Emirates Airbus A380

Thu Aug 29, 2019 7:56 am

xwb777 wrote:
Did this happen at DXB maintenance or AUH maintenance ? EK have been sending B777s and A380s to AUH for maintenance.


AFAIK, only B777s have been going to AUH for maintenance.

This A380 accident happened at DXB.

marc20359 wrote:
A6-EOP out of service might hurt more than many people think. It is one of only six 2 class (C58 Y557) birds. A6-EOP, A6-EOQ, A6-EOR, A6-EOS, A6-EOX, A6-EOY. Pulling one out of DWC want be the same.

For a total of 615 passengers, the highest number on any A380 and therefore the most seats in commercial aviation.


EK has 15 2-class A380s.

A6-EUN - A6-EUQ and A6-EUX - A6-EVB are in the same 58J/557Y config.

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