It's been said in the recent past BA will look to add more mid-sized US cities without competition from other carriers. That probably rules out DTW and MSP for the forseeable future. MSP is only one stop on EI anyway.

Based on that, CLE is possible, I think STL is more likely than being given credit for, it's a shame BA allowed Delta into IND - it'd have made a great 787-8 route for BA. MEM is possible too.

Given the ongoing densification of the RR 777s, A350 deliveries will allow some 777s to be displaced down to LGW. Already LGW has announced UVF gets 2 extra frequencies per week, KIN gets an extra frequency while MCO and LAS lose one each to "fund" the UVF increase. Strong rumour is MLE moves to LHR for winter 2020 as the new densified cabins have too few J seats.

After FLL going I'd expect some LGW expansion, especially to take advantage of the ex-Monarch slots. Where they'll go I'm not sure though!

So there'll be additional A350 routes added, some LGW additions and possibly STL, CLE, MEM or another mid-sized US city with little to no transatlantic competition. I'm not sure I'd go as far as calling any changes "major", however. More like tinkering around the edges!

Dare I say it... MAN/GLA-JFK???

It could be the relocation of AA flights to T5 and rescheduling of some BA and AAs flights to suit the gate availability.

IMO Boston has enough service already to LHR/LGW based on 2020 announcements and then of course what JetBlue eventually does down the road. Only thing I could see BA doing here is making the A380 year-round, but even that is probably a stretch.

HP69 wrote:

Word among BA rampers in LHR is that a major TATL route announcement is coming later this week. Anyone have any guesses/additional info? My guesses are the following:

LHR-BDL
LHR-CLE or CMH
LHR-TPA
LHR-PDX
LHR-STL

So your thoughts are that a British based airline expansion plan is to the US only?
They're not interested anywhere else.

FLYKTPA wrote:

Why would rampers know anything about an air service announcement?

Why would pilots?


If it was a skygod most of you would be quick to worship at the feet of the all knowing autopilot activator. :rolleyes:

I do remember the year in which the usual list of people's favourite US airports was dragged out (and to be fair some of them have been launched subsequently) but BA's new TATL route announcement turned out to be SCL. Definitely TATL, but proof that there's a lot of destinations that qualify which aren't in the USA.

SAT, CMH? Those are pleasant regional airports, not international destinations.

I agree about SAT and CMH. If any city is truly lacking LHR-US service it is CLE. CLE is a 4.5MM population air market, one of the largest US economies (and growing healthily) and is the largest US Metro without direct service to Europe. When CO had a hub in CLE, they served CLE-LGW/LHR for about 10 years til the 2008 recession did the route in, when they also cancelled CLE-CDG service. Just saw an article on tourism growth in Cleveland:

"Cleveland welcomed a record 19.2 million visitors in 2018, up 3.9 % from the year before — a rate of increase that outpaced both the rest of Ohio and the nation.....At the same time visitors to Cleveland increased by 3.9 %, visitors to Ohio increased by 1.4 %, according to TourismOhio. Visitation within the United States increased 1.9 %, according to the U.S. Travel Association." (https://www.cleveland.com/business/2019 ... rowth.html) So if Cleveland was +3.9% and Ohio 1.9%, growth was probably negative or close to it in Columbus and other places.

greenair727 wrote:

CMH doesn't make sense, but CLE certainly does as its the largest US metro without direct service to Europe. Population of the CLE air market (4-5MM people) is larger than that of CMH (around 2MM people) and the economy is much larger. Plus Cleveland's economy has begun showing signs of taking off while there are signs that Columbus's is slowing down after a steady period of growth. Back when CO had a hub in CLE, they served CLE-London (initially LGW, then LHR) for ten or so years til the Great Recession.

This again? At CMH we’ve been through this rumor mill so many times it’s hard to believe any of these anymore. But as far as Ohio city tribalism we’ve had thread after thread about how the three “C”’s compare and while you are correct that CLE’s economy is currently bigger, your analysis of the trends is not even close. Where are these signs CMH is “slowing down”? As far as pax, CMH broke it’s all time record last year and is on track to easily beat that this year. Only one of the two airports recently lost their existing TATL service; the one you claim is “showing signs of taking off”. Again, I doubt either airport is truly in the immediate cards based on a rumor, but please- your hope for CLE over CMH does not somehow change the reality regarding the trajectories of these two cities.

^Simply put, all data and trends aside, Cleveland is a major global city; Columbus, Ohio is not. (For example, I just learned that Columbus, Ohio used to completely shut down when Ohio State had a football game. Really.). Yes, CLE had 9x weekly Iceland service last year but its gone this year not as a result of performance: one airline (Wow) dissolved and the other (FI) lost a sizable portion of its fleet due to the Max8 grounding.

greenair727 wrote:

cedarjet wrote:

STL PDX and CMH are all possible, although does a 200 seat 788 count as “major”? The A318 from LCY is major. 787s to Charleston or Nashville, more “incremental”

CMH doesn't make sense, but CLE certainly does as its the largest US metro without direct service to Europe. Population of the CLE air market (4-5MM people) is larger than that of CMH (around 2MM people) and the economy is much larger. Plus Cleveland's economy has begun showing signs of taking off while there are signs that Columbus's is slowing down after a steady period of growth. Back when CO had a hub in CLE, they served CLE-London (initially LGW, then LHR) for ten or so years til the Great Recession.

Cleveland does not have 4-5 million people. It has 3.6 million when Akron, Canton, and Sandusky are included. The population is declining as well.

LAXdude1023 wrote:

greenair727 wrote:

cedarjet wrote:

STL PDX and CMH are all possible, although does a 200 seat 788 count as “major”? The A318 from LCY is major. 787s to Charleston or Nashville, more “incremental”

CMH doesn't make sense, but CLE certainly does as its the largest US metro without direct service to Europe. Population of the CLE air market (4-5MM people) is larger than that of CMH (around 2MM people) and the economy is much larger. Plus Cleveland's economy has begun showing signs of taking off while there are signs that Columbus's is slowing down after a steady period of growth. Back when CO had a hub in CLE, they served CLE-London (initially LGW, then LHR) for ten or so years til the Great Recession.

Cleveland does not have 4-5 million people. It has 3.6 million when Akron, Canton, and Sandusky are included. The population is declining as well.

You have to include the YNG area as well. Its part of the CLE air market. PIT also claims it as well as pax in YNG use both CLE and PIT. But in any event, my point is that CLE is double that of Columbus.

CMHtraveler wrote:

greenair727 wrote:

CMH doesn't make sense, but CLE certainly does as its the largest US metro without direct service to Europe. Population of the CLE air market (4-5MM people) is larger than that of CMH (around 2MM people) and the economy is much larger. Plus Cleveland's economy has begun showing signs of taking off while there are signs that Columbus's is slowing down after a steady period of growth. Back when CO had a hub in CLE, they served CLE-London (initially LGW, then LHR) for ten or so years til the Great Recession.

This again? At CMH we’ve been through this rumor mill so many times it’s hard to believe any of these anymore. But as far as Ohio city tribalism we’ve had thread after thread about how the three “C”’s compare and while you are correct that CLE’s economy is currently bigger, your analysis of the trends is not even close. Where are these signs CMH is “slowing down”? As far as pax, CMH broke it’s all time record last year and is on track to easily beat that this year. Only one of the two airports recently lost their existing TATL service; the one you claim is “showing signs of taking off”. Again, I doubt either airport is truly in the immediate cards based on a rumor, but please- your hope for CLE over CMH does not somehow change the reality regarding the trajectories of these two cities.

Unfortunately, the aforementioned user tends to take any and all opportunity to undermine CMH and Columbus whenever possible. It's a shame; it really shows a lack of confidence and undermines his/her cause.

That being said, as much as I would like to see BA fly CMH-LHR, better opportunities exist elsewhere, in my opinion. Based on previous posts, I'm surprised STL isn't the forerunner in the game - it would seem they have the best combination of qualifications to vie for the route. Many of the other possibilities discussed all have merit as well. Ultimately, we'll find out when once BA issues the press release. It is fun to speculate, though.

Planes4you wrote:

FLYKTPA wrote:

Why would rampers know anything about an air service announcement?

A DFW ramp worker knew about Air France’s plan something to announce dfw

Indeed. Perhaps the rampers work for a contract company that has been approached in advance by a carrier to handle service if it comes to fruition. Not hard to see how they might get the info.

greenair727 wrote:

^Simply put, all data and trends aside, Cleveland is a major global city.

That was my morning laugh.

greenair727 wrote:

LAXdude1023 wrote:

greenair727 wrote:

CMH doesn't make sense, but CLE certainly does as its the largest US metro without direct service to Europe. Population of the CLE air market (4-5MM people) is larger than that of CMH (around 2MM people) and the economy is much larger. Plus Cleveland's economy has begun showing signs of taking off while there are signs that Columbus's is slowing down after a steady period of growth. Back when CO had a hub in CLE, they served CLE-London (initially LGW, then LHR) for ten or so years til the Great Recession.

Cleveland does not have 4-5 million people. It has 3.6 million when Akron, Canton, and Sandusky are included. The population is declining as well.

You have to include the YNG area as well. Its part of the CLE air market. PIT also claims as well as pax in YNG use both CLE and PIT. But in any event, my point is that CLE is double that of Columbus.

No it isn’t. It’s 3.6 million. You can’t pick and choose places for Cleveland to claim. After all, Dayton is the same distance from Columbus that Youngstown is from Cleveland. Can it lay claim to it???

Columbus has 2.6 million and is growing at roughly 9% per year. The Cleveland area is losing about 1% per year. Youngstown has 538,000 and is losing about 5% of its population per year.

Here’s something else to consider. Despite Cleveland being larger, Columbus has more international immigrants. Cleveland gets roughly 2500 international immigrants a year and Columbus gets about 5000 which come largely from Africa.

Sigh, count out any DL hub and STL ain't happening, SAT, CMH and or IND, and lastly PDX

CRJ900 wrote:

10 x daily LCY-JFK with their newly-ordered A220-100

All in F or are you thowing in some Y? THAT would be awesome.

MIflyer12 wrote:

SAT, CMH? Those are pleasant regional airports, not international destinations. Do they even make FAA large Hub status?

Yes, as opposed to the bustling international destinations of PIT, IND, MCI, STL, CLE, AUS, RDU, and BNA which are on everybody from Europe's must-see list.

Not knocking any of them in particular for what they do/don't have, but the last few years have shown that if an airport has the money, an airline has the airplanes. Even if SAT and CMH don't make Large Hub status, does CHS even make Medium Hub status? Who saw them getting TATL?

greenair727 wrote:

LAXdude1023 wrote:

greenair727 wrote:

CMH doesn't make sense, but CLE certainly does as its the largest US metro without direct service to Europe. Population of the CLE air market (4-5MM people) is larger than that of CMH (around 2MM people) and the economy is much larger. Plus Cleveland's economy has begun showing signs of taking off while there are signs that Columbus's is slowing down after a steady period of growth. Back when CO had a hub in CLE, they served CLE-London (initially LGW, then LHR) for ten or so years til the Great Recession.

Cleveland does not have 4-5 million people. It has 3.6 million when Akron, Canton, and Sandusky are included. The population is declining as well.

You have to include the YNG area as well. Its part of the CLE air market. PIT also claims as well as pax in YNG use both CLE and PIT. But in any event, my point is that CLE is double that of Columbus.

Who cares whether the air market is 3-4-5-6-7.... e.t.c million people, it doesn't change much in terms of TATL service.

We have seen this time and time again, CHS, CVG, RDU, IND, MSY, e.t.c are all sizably smaller than the CLE CSA, and all have at least one TATL flight.

All TATL service from mid-sized cities falls into at least 1 of these requirements:
1. Airports have large companies with major travel budgets with HQs/large offices in the area (P&G-CVG, Boeing-CHS, Lilly-IND, e.t.c)
2. Airports have existing TATL service that has been successful (DE coming after BA in MSY, DL coming after AA in RDU, e.t.c)
3. Airports have sizable incentives available, if the market is unproven ($5.5 mil in IND for CDG, $9 mil in PIT for CDG, e.t.c)
4. Airports have a sizable tourism market that compliments a decent sized business market (CHS beach component, MSY Bourbon Street, e.t.c)

Looking at the list, CMH makes just as much sense as CLE. In addition the CO hub point is moot, there was obviously feed that allowed that service to be sustained.

LAXdude1023 wrote:

No it isn’t. It’s 3.6 million. You can’t pick and choose places for Cleveland to claim. After all, Dayton is the same distance from Columbus that Youngstown is from Cleveland. Can it lay claim to it???

Columbus has 2.6 million and is growing at roughly 9% per year. The Cleveland area is losing about 1% per year. Youngstown has 538,000 and is losing about 5% of its population per year.

Here’s something else to consider. Despite Cleveland being larger, Columbus has more international immigrants. Cleveland gets roughly 2500 international immigrants a year and Columbus gets about 5000 which come largely from Africa.

Dayton is part of the Cincinnati air market. Re Youngstown, where do you think the people that live there fly from? Its either PIT or CLE. They're not driving to PHL or Detroit. Its not me who is choosing to include YNG in CLE. Also, what drives a lot of TATL flights is business. So if Columbus is getting a lot of refugees from Africa that doesn't make for likely customers. Economic issues aside, if they are refugees, they likely cannot go back to their homes in Africa or they will be persecuted---hence their status as refugees--at least until a regime or other change in their country of origin.

Ishrion wrote:

FLYKTPA wrote:

Why would rampers know anything about an air service announcement?

My thoughts exactly, but hey, this guy has inside info on the A390. We could end up eating a shoe.

remember that dfw worker did see something about air france

I'll throw a hat in the ring... Less than daily 787 to SMF, just like MSY.

greenair727 wrote:

^Simply put, all data and trends aside, Cleveland is a major global city

This quote should be framed and hung in an office somewhere.

In ranked order:

LHR-CLE
LHR-STL
LHR-BSB

Jshank83 wrote:

usdcaguy wrote:

My guesses, if said rumors are true:

LGW-RSW
Seasonal LGW-PVR
LHR-PDX
LHR-BDL

One potential route that is never discussed is LHR-SAT, which could be run 2x/wk paired with year-round LHR-CHS 2x/wk. In fact, SAT doesn’t have any TATL service at all, which is a surprise given its tourism and military business, which could be had on AA codeshare. There’s LHR-AUS, but driving all the way up there for an international flight would be grueling.

Isn’t it only an hourish from San Antonio to AUS? I’m not sure I would call that grueling. Lots of people drive further than that to catch a flight at their closest airport. I know plenty that drive the 4-5 hours from STL to ORD to catch an Intl flight from Chicago for cheaper (and a nonstop) instead of STL. I think it’s crazy they do but they do.

Indeed, AUS is on the south side of Austin - about 80-90 minutes away. Unfortunately, San Antonio just doesn't have enough of the kind of travelers needed to support LHR. I'd love to be proven wrong!!

HP69 wrote:

Maybe LHR-SAT also.

Considering that SAT is only about 90 miles from AUS, I don't think it would be practical.

LHR - SDF...with half of the plane configured for cargo and leased out to UPS

fingers crossed for lhr-mco, but i'm not holding my breath...

Midwestindy wrote:

greenair727 wrote:

LAXdude1023 wrote:

Cleveland does not have 4-5 million people. It has 3.6 million when Akron, Canton, and Sandusky are included. The population is declining as well.

You have to include the YNG area as well. Its part of the CLE air market. PIT also claims as well as pax in YNG use both CLE and PIT. But in any event, my point is that CLE is double that of Columbus.

Who cares whether the air market is 3-4-5-6-7.... e.t.c million people, it doesn't change much in terms of TATL service.

We have seen this time and time again, CHS, CVG, RDU, IND, MSY, e.t.c are all sizably smaller than the CLE CSA, and all have at least one TATL flight.

All TATL service from mid-sized cities falls into at least 1 of these requirements:
1. Airports have large companies with major travel budgets with HQs/large offices in the area (P&G-CVG, Boeing-CHS, Lilly-IND, e.t.c)
2. Airports have existing TATL service that has been successful (DE coming after BA in MSY, DL coming after AA in RDU, e.t.c)
3. Airports have sizable incentives available, if the market is unproven ($5.5 mil in IND for CDG, $9 mil in PIT for CDG, e.t.c)
4. Airports have a sizable tourism market that compliments a decent sized business market (CHS beach component, MSY Bourbon Street, e.t.c)

Looking at the list, CMH makes just as much sense as CLE. In addition the CO hub point is moot, there was obviously feed that allowed that service to be sustained.

IMO for any adds left in the US #3 is going to be a major factor.

gdg9 wrote:

greenair727 wrote:

^Simply put, all data and trends aside, Cleveland is a major global city.

That was my morning laugh.

How is cleveland a major global city? Their major export is crippling depression.

Maybe RDU will go to BA and take over the AA flight.

musman9853 wrote:

gdg9 wrote:

greenair727 wrote:

^Simply put, all data and trends aside, Cleveland is a major global city.

That was my morning laugh.

How is cleveland a major global city? Their major export is crippling depression.

While I don't agree that Cleveland is a major international city, the end of your post is another reason why we need to get the pay-wall back.

As for BA TATL, who knows after the CHS add. Maybe weekend only service to JAX and ORF.

LHR-RSW seasonal service in winter for all the European snowbirds
LHR-CLE
LHR-SAT

Could any aircraft in the BA fleet make it to HNL nonstop?

greenair727 wrote:

LAXdude1023 wrote:

No it isn’t. It’s 3.6 million. You can’t pick and choose places for Cleveland to claim. After all, Dayton is the same distance from Columbus that Youngstown is from Cleveland. Can it lay claim to it???

Columbus has 2.6 million and is growing at roughly 9% per year. The Cleveland area is losing about 1% per year. Youngstown has 538,000 and is losing about 5% of its population per year.

Here’s something else to consider. Despite Cleveland being larger, Columbus has more international immigrants. Cleveland gets roughly 2500 international immigrants a year and Columbus gets about 5000 which come largely from Africa.

Dayton is part of the Cincinnati air market. Re Youngstown, where do you think the people that live there fly from? Its either PIT or CLE. They're not driving to PHL or Detroit. Its not me who is choosing to include YNG in CLE. Also, what drives a lot of TATL flights is business. So if Columbus is getting a lot of refugees from Africa that doesn't make for likely customers. Economic issues aside, if they are refugees, they likely cannot go back to their homes in Africa or they will be persecuted---hence their status as refugees--at least until a regime or other change in their country of origin.

Dayton is 75 miles from Columbus and 60 from Cincinnati. Youngstown is 75 miles from Cleveland and 65 from Pittsburgh. I dont see any difference. You cant go around and just add cities to your area because you want to. Im sure a good number of people from Youngstown fly from CLE, but its pretty irrelevant. Youngstown has almost no international O&D. CLE is very much a lightweight for its size on international O&D.

As for immigrants into both, its not just Africans. Columbus has more immigrants from every single region except Europe. They have more Asians, Africans, and Latin American immigrants than Cleveland. Cleveland does have a lot more Puerto Ricans but thats not international.

Im not saying CLE couldnt support a seasonal 3x weekly flight to Europe but your opinion of Cleveland on the world stage is over-inflated.

izbtmnhd wrote:

musman9853 wrote:

gdg9 wrote:

That was my morning laugh.

How is cleveland a major global city? Their major export is crippling depression.

While I don't agree that Cleveland is a major international city, the end of your post is another reason why we need to get the pay-wall back.

As for BA TATL, who knows after the CHS add. Maybe weekend only service to JAX and ORF.

i'm guessing you're not very fun at parties. it's just a joke

LAXdude1023 wrote:

Im not saying CLE couldnt support a seasonal 3x weekly flight to Europe but your opinion of Cleveland on the world stage is over-inflated.

CLE could certainly support a daily flight. In any event, I wasn't comparing CLE to NYC or Chicago or LA, I was simply looking at US cities that currently do not have direct TATL service. As the conversation turned towards Columbus, OH, my point was that CLE was a stronger destination for BA/LHR than CMH.

musman9853 wrote:

gdg9 wrote:

greenair727 wrote:

^Simply put, all data and trends aside, Cleveland is a major global city.

That was my morning laugh.

How is cleveland a major global city? Their major export is crippling depression.

Their economy is (was) based on Lebron James.

musman9853 wrote:

izbtmnhd wrote:

musman9853 wrote:

How is cleveland a major global city? Their major export is crippling depression.

While I don't agree that Cleveland is a major international city, the end of your post is another reason why we need to get the pay-wall back.

As for BA TATL, who knows after the CHS add. Maybe weekend only service to JAX and ORF.

i'm guessing you're not very fun at parties. it's just a joke

If we were living in 1973, you'd be the hit of the party. Too bad it's 2019.

Anyway: What about FLL-LHR? They're dropping LGW in Sept.

cranberrysaus wrote:

musman9853 wrote:

gdg9 wrote:

That was my morning laugh.

How is cleveland a major global city? Their major export is crippling depression.

Their economy is (was) based on Lebron James.

Who actually believes an ESPN narrative?

izbtmnhd wrote:

cranberrysaus wrote:

musman9853 wrote:

How is cleveland a major global city? Their major export is crippling depression.

Their economy is (was) based on Lebron James.

Who actually believes an ESPN narrative?

Touchy touchy.

I guess you forgot the comedic comic sans rant by Dan Gilbert? Anyways, am just kidding.

Antarius wrote:

izbtmnhd wrote:

cranberrysaus wrote:

Their economy is (was) based on Lebron James.

Who actually believes an ESPN narrative?

Touchy touchy.

I guess you forgot the comedic comic sans rant by Dan Gilbert? Anyways, am just kidding.

Yes, so touchy. So glad you support people trolling (oh, sorry, “joking”) and trying to take the thread off topic.

As for Dan, he’s from Detroit.

LH748 wrote:

Could any aircraft in the BA fleet make it to HNL nonstop?

LHR-HNL is 7,220 miles, 23 miles shorter than LHR-SCL (BA's longest route, served by a 787-9), so it appears possible in theory. That said, HNL-Europe hasn't been a fan favorite for a number of reasons.

It will probably be GRR. But in the same vein as CHS, BA could do LHR-PSP 2xweek in the winter.

LHR-SWF to supplement JFK and EWR?

flipdewaf wrote:

*Sigh* nothing for the north again...Please BA put more metal in MAN.

Fred

I'm not feeling it, but wish American would try and fight back on behalf of Oneworld.

I always thought IAG would open a Vueling base to try and fight it at MAN for shorthaul but I guess EZY, Jet2, RYR, TCX and TUI have it sewn up.

If BA was ever in a position cost base wise to open MAN then it must be now, alas I cant see it. Ryanair and Easy would still be £30 cheaper.

flipdewaf wrote:

*Sigh* nothing for the north again...Please BA put more metal in MAN.

Fred

BA has had little to no interest in the UK outside of London for a considerable period of time.

MAN is now likely to be VS/DL and partners territory.

GBNWB wrote:

I always thought IAG would open a Vueling base to try and fight it at MAN for shorthaul but I guess EZY, Jet2, RYR, TCX and TUI have it sewn up.

I would not wish a Vueling/Level base on my Mother in Law, let alone MAN.

In re: Switching TPA to LHR from LGW.

Words from my friends in their German counterpart is that they expect them to make the switch at some point. BA apparently was caught off guard how much business traffic LH is able to route through its a FRA hub. That said, could they do a split operation between LHR/LGW? Not sure how BA's crew contracts would view that, but operating a few key days to LHR and the rest to LGW for holiday'ers.

GBNWB wrote:

flipdewaf wrote:

*Sigh* nothing for the north again...Please BA put more metal in MAN.

Fred

I'm not feeling it, but wish American would try and fight back on behalf of Oneworld.

I always thought IAG would open a Vueling base to try and fight it at MAN for shorthaul but I guess EZY, Jet2, RYR, TCX and TUI have it sewn up.

If BA was ever in a position cost base wise to open MAN then it must be now, alas I cant see it. Ryanair and Easy would still be £30 cheaper.

Long haul wise, I would put bets on DL/VS moving to sew that market up in the next few years, especially with the BE/VS connect feed coming online in the very near future. So I do agree, BA/IAG need to set up now if they have any hope of being a viable competitor at MAN. And even then I doubt we would see BA at MAN long haul wise, it would highly likely be in the guise of ‘Level’.

Short haul wise, unless travelling in CE, there is very little difference between say, Easyjet and BA now, same seat pitch, same BOB service, same spaceflex galleys etc, therefore BA would find it very hard to get a foot in the door.

That said, the weekend Cityflyer flights had apparently been quite successful. Now, I’m not going to reopen the whole ‘it’s only because LCY is closed’ debate, but, just debate whether the flights have paid their way or not. Apparently CE uptake is quite high, the loads have been decent and see, to be the only non-Charter operation left outside London (and 2 EDI flights) after expanding a fair bit in past seasons. Whether that success could be transferred to a whole week operation by either an IAG partner or Ba themselves, that’s for the bean counters to decide, but I’m not holding my breath.

On the whole, I feel BA has missed the boat at MAN. I know they had bigger fish to fry, but, regardless of that fact, the boat has sailed.