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log0008
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Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 10:09 am

Reports on social media that an Air China A330 has been damaged by fire are PEK. Fire reported having begun in the fwd cargo hold. Rego appears to be B-5958 which had landed from Sinagpore

Image

Video

https://twitter.com/airplusnews_EN/stat ... 2153870336
Last edited by log0008 on Tue Aug 27, 2019 10:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
CHRISBA35X
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 10:10 am

Misdeclared DG cargo no doubt. thank God it didn't happen in the air.
 
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LaunchDetected
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 10:26 am

Can the pilot start the cargo compartment fire extinguishing system on ground?

Hope everyone was out before the fire, those smoke are really dangerous long-term.
edit: no one was hurt

source: https://twitter.com/ChinaAvReview/status/1166295176777584645
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N14AZ
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 10:51 am

Image
Habemus Papam!

... but in China? :scratchchin:

on a more serious note: glad no one was hurt.

Regarding the picture above: looks as if the fire engine's operator is targeting the fuselage?
 
juliuswong
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:00 am

Just landed from Singapore 3 hours ago 3pm local time. The fire started at front cargo hold while CA138 was boarding. Crew was last to leave the aircraft. https://twitter.com/ChinaAvReview/statu ... 48000?s=19

The aircraft is gone for good, close to 5 years old of service. https://www.planespotters.net/airframe/ ... na/MjY0TYB

There is a video circulating in FB showing smokes from cabin. https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=517426562394844

Look similar to Qatar Airways A321 burnt out incident two years ago. http://avherald.com/h?article=4b21b6e5
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LoganTheBogan
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:01 am

Sam Chui has reported on it now as well.

https://samchui.com/2019/08/27/air-chin ... WUNUCgzaUk

Quite the unfortunate accident. Shame to lose a young one :(
Glad everyone is safe though!
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eamondzhang
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:04 am

N14AZ wrote:
Habemus Papam!

... but in China? :scratchchin:

on a more serious note: glad no one was hurt.

Regarding the picture above: looks as if the fire engine's operator is targeting the fuselage?

Because the cargo bay can't see any trace of fire externally however the fire went through the roof. It was also during the boarding of CA183 to HND to they're definitely lucky on this one.

Makes me believe someone's bringing dangerous good into the cabin.

Michael
 
seansasLCY
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:05 am

N14AZ wrote:
Image
Habemus Papam!

... but in China? :scratchchin:

on a more serious note: glad no one was hurt.

Regarding the picture above: looks as if the fire engine's operator is targeting the fuselage?


The videos in the twitter feed posted above, appear to show the front fuselage roof smoldering and black.
 
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Erebus
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:47 am

juliuswong wrote:
The aircraft is gone for good, close to 5 years old of service. https://www.planespotters.net/airframe/ ... na/MjY0TYB


To the parts bin! Still lots of value in there. Engines, APU and some other structural stuff from the rear and wings.
 
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zeke
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:53 am

Glad everyone is okay, that smoke appears very thick indeed.

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kaitak
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 12:17 pm

Flight International reports that acft had indeed arrived from SIN, but was actually boarding pax for CA 183 to HND.

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... ta-460486/
 
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Spacepope
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 12:29 pm

Erebus wrote:
juliuswong wrote:
The aircraft is gone for good, close to 5 years old of service. https://www.planespotters.net/airframe/ ... na/MjY0TYB


To the parts bin! Still lots of value in there. Engines, APU and some other structural stuff from the rear and wings.


Now now don’t be hasty. When it cools down I bet someone might try to buff it out.
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Clydenairways
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 2:20 pm

Looks to be burned right through the roof.
 
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sassiciai
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 2:41 pm

Clydenairways wrote:
Looks to be burned right through the roof.

Agreed - it seems evident in the video up thread! I don't think this one will fly again! Stripped of reusable parts then scrapped.

It will be interesting to hear the result of an investigation as to what started this fire, and whose insurance will cover the rather high cost! Someone shipping the wrong type of battery?
 
Austin787
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 3:13 pm

I wouldn't assume the aircraft is a write off yet. Remember that BA 777 which caught fire at LAS - that airplane was repaired and returned to service.
 
WayexTDI
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 3:37 pm

Austin787 wrote:
I wouldn't assume the aircraft is a write off yet. Remember that BA 777 which caught fire at LAS - that airplane was repaired and returned to service.

The BA 777 fire was external to the fuselage; only the skin was affected.
In this case, the fire appears to have been internal to the fuselage; there is most likely much more structural damage than the 777.
 
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 3:38 pm

Austin787 wrote:
I wouldn't assume the aircraft is a write off yet. Remember that BA 777 which caught fire at LAS - that airplane was repaired and returned to service.


The roof is burnt through. The cabin floor is probably gone too, same for the entire forward cabin. It's a goner. The BA 777 in Las Vegas didn't even get close to this sort of damage.
 
chonetsao
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 3:39 pm

Austin787 wrote:
I wouldn't assume the aircraft is a write off yet. Remember that BA 777 which caught fire at LAS - that airplane was repaired and returned to service.


I hope they would fix it.

But again, being Chinese myself, I think it would cause too much uproar as Chinese passengers can turn against the idea of flying with a damaged aircraft. The image of B5958 is already everywhere in social media.

Air China may not wish to rescue this aircraft to fence the PR image of itself.
 
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PW100
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 4:12 pm

Will that buff out . . .?
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sassiciai
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 4:45 pm

PW100 wrote:
Will that buff out . . .?

Isn't this "joke" a bit beaten to death? Why not try the "duct tape" version while you're at it!

In the opening post, the video show that a fire reported to have started in the cargo hold, has burned its way through everything up to and including the top of the fuselage, which is burned open and venting smoke. That video was while the fire was still burning, we cant yet be certain how this event will finish, and whether the aircraft will still be supported on its undercarriage, or have burned through and split in half!

Not flying again, IMHO!

In recent times, it seems to me that there are quite a few on-gate incidents where aircraft have burned. This one, Lufthansa 340 quite recently when a tug went on fire, a Chinese 737 burned out somewhere in Asia. Can anyone add other such incidents?
 
HTCone
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 4:56 pm

sassiciai wrote:
PW100 wrote:
Will that buff out . . .?


In recent times, it seems to me that there are quite a few on-gate incidents where aircraft have burned. This one, Lufthansa 340 quite recently when a tug went on fire, a Chinese 737 burned out somewhere in Asia. Can anyone add other such incidents?


A loader caught fire under an EI A330 in MCO a couple of years ago. Worst part was the injuries to 2 of the ground staff, some horrific burns. Aircraft was out of action for a few weeks.
 
PaxPicti
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 4:57 pm

sassiciai wrote:
In recent times, it seems to me that there are quite a few on-gate incidents where aircraft have burned. This one, Lufthansa 340 quite recently when a tug went on fire, a Chinese 737 burned out somewhere in Asia. Can anyone add other such incidents?

EgyptAir flight 667 (B777) at Cairo.

A write-off, as this one will be because the damage is directly behind and is likely to extend into the avionics bay.
 
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N14AZ
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 7:25 pm

sassiciai wrote:

In recent times, it seems to me that there are quite a few on-gate incidents where aircraft have burned. This one, Lufthansa 340 quite recently when a tug went on fire, a Chinese 737 burned out somewhere in Asia.

Well, kind of Chinese 737 - I think you are referring to the China Airlines 737 fire: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Ppp5eO4uGzI

seansasLCY wrote:
N14AZ wrote:
Image
Habemus Papam!

... but in China? :scratchchin:

on a more serious note: glad no one was hurt.

Regarding the picture above: looks as if the fire engine's operator is targeting the fuselage?


The videos in the twitter feed posted above, appear to show the front fuselage roof smoldering and black.

Thank you for your feedback. I hadn’t seen the video before.
 
T4thH
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 7:35 pm

Plainspotters.net is calling the jet already as "written off".
https://www.planespotters.net/airframe/Airbus/A330/B-5958-Air-China/MjY0TYB
It is pretty sure it is till now no official statement, but I believe, they will be right.
Sad to see.
 
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Francoflier
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 7:40 pm

Really curious to know what caused the fire. Obviously, whatever was in there was loaded in PVG for its next flight. It's very lucky that it happened on the ground and not after takeoff...

I hope we eventually find out.
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acavpics
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 8:52 pm

juliuswong wrote:
Just landed from Singapore 3 hours ago 3pm local time. The fire started at front cargo hold while CA138 was boarding. Crew was last to leave the aircraft. https://twitter.com/ChinaAvReview/statu ... 48000?s=19

The aircraft is gone for good, close to 5 years old of service. https://www.planespotters.net/airframe/ ... na/MjY0TYB

There is a video circulating in FB showing smokes from cabin. https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=517426562394844

Look similar to Qatar Airways A321 burnt out incident two years ago. http://avherald.com/h?article=4b21b6e5


Wow, I didn't think that a cargo hold fire could cause an aircraft to be written off. I find this a bit surprising, given that the BA2276 and SQ368 a/c's (which both got severely burnt from engine failures), were returned back to service within a year.
 
787SIN
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:05 pm

The big difference between the BA and SQ ones and this is that the fire was internal to the structure. This leads to an far more intense fire once it gets going and in this case as the cargo doors were open a unlimited source of fresh air too supporting the blaze.

Additionally, very difficult to fight this type of fire by the fire service, limited points of entry to get water/foam on it until the hull is compromised.
 
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Spacepope
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:10 pm

PaxPicti wrote:
sassiciai wrote:
In recent times, it seems to me that there are quite a few on-gate incidents where aircraft have burned. This one, Lufthansa 340 quite recently when a tug went on fire, a Chinese 737 burned out somewhere in Asia. Can anyone add other such incidents?

EgyptAir flight 667 (B777) at Cairo.

A write-off, as this one will be because the damage is directly behind and is likely to extend into the avionics bay.

The floorbeams are toast as well, as is the wiring in that area. Consider the interior a total loss due to smoke damage, all the way down to the insulation.
Malaysian wrote off a pretty new A330 due to a chemical spill in the cargo hold, this is way more damage.
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rjmf22
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:19 pm

https://www.instagram.com/p/B1rAiFZBPnY/ Aircraft seemingly has to be written off.
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airboeingbus
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Tue Aug 27, 2019 10:06 pm

Although this is most likely a write off I'm sure there's still a lot of value left in the undamaged parts of the aircraft. Engines, APU, Landing Gear all will be reusable I'm sure may other components can be re used too.
 
moyangmm
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Thu Aug 29, 2019 2:04 am

Looks like the aircraft is gone, but the engines seems to be okay. Is there any value left in the engines, maybe for parts?
 
juliuswong
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Thu Aug 29, 2019 2:27 am

moyangmm wrote:
Looks like the aircraft is gone, but the engines seems to be okay. Is there any value left in the engines, maybe for parts?

There should some great value left depending on the frame young age. As what airboeingbus has mentioned, APU, engines, winglets, wings, landing gears, most probably the back half seats can still be re-used. However owing to Chinese superstition on "unlucky' items, I am not sure if they will recover these items or even fix the aircraft if it is not a write off.

In this article, it is mentioned Air China will stand to lose USD 237 million if the aircraft is deemed a write off.

I wonder if they are to fix, do they chop off the first half and fix a new one? Like what they did with EK's 345 tail scrap incident few years ago. They are a lot of A330ceo being retired and being scrapped now, no issue of spare parts there.

Prelimiminary investigation result is now published:

A preliminary investigation on Wednesday linked the fire to the lithium battery packs inside the main deck cargo compartment, but questions have been raised about if the batteries were part of a consignment or part of the plane’s own power supply system.

Source: https://www.asiatimes.com/2019/08/artic ... -bln-yuan/
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eamondzhang
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Thu Aug 29, 2019 3:03 am

Rumour currently says that apparently this bird is also fitted with high-altitude ops package and it prompted several Chinese carriers to inspect the pack including oxygen system.

Not sure what this might mean to the fire though.

Michael
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Thu Aug 29, 2019 3:21 am

I honestly believe it will be written off with a large hole in the roof. This isn't one of those 242t A330-300s, which ended up being popular in China (although Delta got the first one). That said, anything behind J should be reusable, as well as avionics. Doors, Y seats, rudder, stabilizer, wings and the parts from them, engines, main landing gear, nose landing gear, most of the doors...could be reused.
 
Dominion301
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Thu Aug 29, 2019 3:32 am

eamondzhang wrote:
Rumour currently says that apparently this bird is also fitted with high-altitude ops package and it prompted several Chinese carriers to inspect the pack including oxygen system.

Not sure what this might mean to the fire though.

Michael


Looking at the photos, this really doesn’t appear to be a cargo hold fire.
 
eamondzhang
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Thu Aug 29, 2019 3:55 am

Dominion301 wrote:
eamondzhang wrote:
Rumour currently says that apparently this bird is also fitted with high-altitude ops package and it prompted several Chinese carriers to inspect the pack including oxygen system.

Not sure what this might mean to the fire though.

Michael


Looking at the photos, this really doesn’t appear to be a cargo hold fire.

I know, but we're not 100% sure if the avionics bay is the source of fire or it's really up in the cabin at this stage.

Michael
 
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Narfish641
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Thu Aug 29, 2019 4:00 am

Looking at those images, it's definitely game over. I'm glad everyone was not near or onboard at the time of this incident.
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juliuswong
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Thu Aug 29, 2019 4:03 am

Narfish641 wrote:
Looking at those images, it's definitely game over. I'm glad everyone was not near or onboard at the time of this incident.

Apparently the boarding was on-going when the crew spotted the smoke coming up from belly. Around 100 passengers were already boarded, when evacuation was initiated. Glad that the fire started when the aircraft was on the ground, not during flight.
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eamondzhang
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Thu Aug 29, 2019 4:26 am

juliuswong wrote:
Narfish641 wrote:
Looking at those images, it's definitely game over. I'm glad everyone was not near or onboard at the time of this incident.

Apparently the boarding was on-going when the crew spotted the smoke coming up from belly. Around 100 passengers were already boarded, when evacuation was initiated. Glad that the fire started when the aircraft was on the ground, not during flight.

Yep the boarding was ongoing at the time of accident. This is confirmed by CA on Weibo.

Michael
 
Philippine747
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Thu Aug 29, 2019 6:56 am

eamondzhang wrote:
Rumour currently says that apparently this bird is also fitted with high-altitude ops package and it prompted several Chinese carriers to inspect the pack including oxygen system.

Not sure what this might mean to the fire though.

Michael


An improperly fitted oxygen system may add fuel to a fire or cause it to happen in the first place...

Austin787 wrote:
I wouldn't assume the aircraft is a write off yet. Remember that BA 777 which caught fire at LAS - that airplane was repaired and returned to service.


Looks more like that Qatar A321 that caught fire during maintenance at DOH, that one was a complete loss.
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PW100
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Thu Aug 29, 2019 9:11 pm

sassiciai wrote:
PW100 wrote:
Will that buff out . . .?

Isn't this "joke" a bit beaten to death? Why not try the "duct tape" version while you're at it!

In the opening post, the video show that a fire reported to have started in the cargo hold, has burned its way through everything up to and including the top of the fuselage, which is burned open and venting smoke. That video was while the fire was still burning, we cant yet be certain how this event will finish, and whether the aircraft will still be supported on its undercarriage, or have burned through and split in half!

Not flying again, IMHO!

In recent times, it seems to me that there are quite a few on-gate incidents where aircraft have burned. This one, Lufthansa 340 quite recently when a tug went on fire, a Chinese 737 burned out somewhere in Asia. Can anyone add other such incidents?


Yeah, I could/should have known that the three dots at the end would not be sufficient to communicate the sarcasm . . .
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zeke
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Thu Aug 29, 2019 11:10 pm

LaunchDetected wrote:
Can the pilot start the cargo compartment fire extinguishing system on ground


Yes they can, however it would be next to useless with the cargo door open. Cargo bay fire suppression like fuel tank inerting works by reducing oxygen levels down to non combustible levels. The cargo system works as it is an air tight vessel, and the agent added reduces the levels below combustible levels. If the cargo door is open, more ai is free to circulate.

Philippine747 wrote:
An improperly fitted oxygen system may add fuel to a fire or cause it to happen in the first place...



Looking at the past flight history, I think the aircraft would have the optional passenger gaseous oxygen installed. These are behind the cargo lining in the forward cargo hold just aft of the door. If they improperly load or unload cargo to cause a pallet to go through the lining it is possible they could have hit the oxygen bottles.
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THS214
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Thu Aug 29, 2019 11:30 pm

What is wrong with today's planes? Back in the good old days all you needed was Patroni ( or equivalent) some duct tape and a 707 (or Airbus) was ready to fly again.

Good that it was only material damage.
 
eamondzhang
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Fri Aug 30, 2019 12:17 am

THS214 wrote:
What is wrong with today's planes? Back in the good old days all you needed was Patroni ( or equivalent) some duct tape and a 707 (or Airbus) was ready to fly again.

Good that it was only material damage.

Because today's plane is far more capable than a 707 and can fly far more complex missions. That comes with something.

Try getting a 707 onto airports like LXA or doing ETOPS while maintaining enough safety margin for example.

Michael
 
qf772
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Re: Air China A330 fire @ Beijing Airport

Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:48 am

THS214 wrote:
What is wrong with today's planes? Back in the good old days all you needed was Patroni ( or equivalent) some duct tape and a 707 (or Airbus) was ready to fly again.

Good that it was only material damage.


The new planes can read the manuals
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