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KLMatSJC
Posts: 524
Joined: Sat Oct 02, 2010 1:16 am

Re: AS expands Pacific Northwest to California with 8 new routes & adds frequencies on others

Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:30 pm

AirFiero wrote:
WN has 15 gates...exclusively?
DL was only talking about a percentage growth that projects to 7-8 additional flights. WN already has over 100 flights, pretty much had all the potential nonstop destinations covered before the Max grounding, so I’d assume any additional flights would be a few additional frequency. And I doubt they would put more flights at SJC than OAK. AS is likely maxed out, except for additional frequency. So, by your numbers and the current service levels, it looks like all airlines are already near their theoretical maximum for the near future and still have plenty of room to expand. What do you think?

Yes. All gates that I mentioned were exclusive, except for the additional common-use ones I mentioned with DL.

The percentage growth was only for this year I believe. I'd expect to see a bit more in the next few years. AS definitely has room to grow. AS doesn't have much time around peak hours, but a lot elsewhere, as opposed to DL, who uses their gates well throughout the day.

chrisair wrote:
A bus gate? At SJC? Are they parking a plane over by the old yellow FIS shack and bussing people over there or something?

They were parking at North Cargo and pax were bussed from Gate 7A, which was the old A11, and the Eagle Nest from the 1990s. It's really rarely used, but it's there.
A318/19/20/21/21N A332/3 A343/5 A388 B712 B722 B732/3/4/7/8/9/9ER B744/4M B752/3 B762ER/3/3ER/4ER B77E/L/W B788 CRJ2/7/9 Q400 EMB-120 ERJ-135/140/145/145XR/175 DC-10-10 MD-82/83/88/90

Long Live the Tulip, Cactus, and Redwood
 
flyfresno
Posts: 858
Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 6:18 am

Re: AS expands Pacific Northwest to California with 8 new routes & adds frequencies on others

Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:52 pm

RWA380 wrote:
AirFiero wrote:
SANFan wrote:
Personally, I think we need to keep a close eye on AS in SJC.

With both WN and DL growing to some degree at Mineta, I wonder if AS might back off some of the routes they fly there, as they just did in SAN and SFO? It seems that WN chased AS off several routes so might the same thing also occur in SJC? After all, SJC-DAL and SJC-BUR are being dropped already by AS -- is that it?

Perhaps, as a few hints have suggested, this strategy change by AAG is quite limited in scope, and/or even just temporary. (That would be wonderful news for me!) And it's very possible that everything AS flies to and from SJC is performing great and the network there is just the way AAG wants it.

Remember, SJC and SAN are the 2 AS focus cities with roughly the same number of daily flights. I certainly hope they don't cull several routes from SJC but I will sure be watching what happens next.

bb


Yes, I'm a bit concerned with the direction AS will go and the ramifications for my home airport. I can see your concerns, as well. I was rather alarmed at them dropping DAL and now BUR is troubling, although tphuang pointed out the low LF on the route. I guess I can't blame AS for cutting potential losses.

Also (as echoed buy RWA380), DL's announcement of a build up at SJC is yet another wild card. I have to say, when I first read about that, it nearly knocked me out of my chair. With all the existing competition at SJC, I'm wondering how and why DL decided to jump in. WN has done a crazy amount of build up at SJC, a virtual fortress. AS has been taking them on. Now comes DL. My take on it is that WN is probably seen as less than a top choice for business travelers, and those wanting premium service. For my money, I put up the extra cash and often fly First/Business if for no other reason than my wife has mobility issues that make F/J much more comfortable and convenient. Plus it is deluxe and bitchen. ;) Plus I don't fly WN because I also like to reserve seats. Anyway, I think DL is going for the premium flyers. I don't know how many flights DL has out of SFO, but maybe they see an opportunity for premium passengers in Silicon Valley, and maybe they think they can siphon off some people from SFO who live/work closer to SJC?

It will be interesting to watch what moves AS makes at SJC and SAN. In this week's OAG thread, I noticed that (ignoring the DAL cut), AS cut 3 flights from SJC - all to BUR, but added 3 flights - 1 to PDX and 2 to SAN. So here, no net loss. And unless they are planning more moves, this schedule looks to be all the way to the beginning of next summer. Time will tell.

I wish you well down there in SUN Diego. :D


Hey Fiero, what is the gate situation at SJC? From my current understanding it's nuts to butts down there. If that is the case, how much can DL build up at SJC? It's been a hard road for carriers based or hubbed at SJC. CO & then CO West, QQ, AA after buying QQ. So I guess my question would be what market is DL chasing? The premium passengers that don't like WN because there is no premium cabin, yeah likely. But will that in itself be enough traffic to warrant a focus city?

I have a feeling that they will target BOS, JFK, PDX, SAN. But I believe most of the SJC area travelers are more often UA loyalists, since UA has flown mainline there for 50+ years, even just to SFO for a connection. Now where those premium passengers can't get non-stop from SJC, they can connect or in some cases drive up to SFO & go n/s to the likes of PPT/ZRH/AKL/SYD et al...


Maybe this goes without saying, but while most people in SJC probably don’t care so much about first class to SoCal or even Vegas, there are a lot of people who don’t want to jockey with other pax for a coach seat on a transcon. Maybe that’s the market DL is looking for?
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 6070
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: AS expands Pacific Northwest to California with 8 new routes & adds frequencies on others

Sat Sep 14, 2019 12:26 am

We should get some indication of that as DL announces new services. If they go exclusively with 2-class planes -- as they've done in LAX, BOS and SEA -- we can recognize them positioning themselves as the premium alternative to WN.
 
User avatar
KLMatSJC
Posts: 524
Joined: Sat Oct 02, 2010 1:16 am

Re: AS expands Pacific Northwest to California with 8 new routes & adds frequencies on others

Sat Sep 14, 2019 12:32 am

MIflyer12 wrote:
We should get some indication of that as DL announces new services. If they go exclusively with 2-class planes -- as they've done in LAX, BOS and SEA -- we can recognize them positioning themselves as the premium alternative to WN.

I don't expect a single-class aircraft on any routes that DL will start, nor currently operate.
A318/19/20/21/21N A332/3 A343/5 A388 B712 B722 B732/3/4/7/8/9/9ER B744/4M B752/3 B762ER/3/3ER/4ER B77E/L/W B788 CRJ2/7/9 Q400 EMB-120 ERJ-135/140/145/145XR/175 DC-10-10 MD-82/83/88/90

Long Live the Tulip, Cactus, and Redwood
 
AirFiero
Posts: 1369
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2013 11:43 pm

Re: AS expands Pacific Northwest to California with 8 new routes & adds frequencies on others

Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:00 am

flyfresno wrote:
RWA380 wrote:
AirFiero wrote:

Yes, I'm a bit concerned with the direction AS will go and the ramifications for my home airport. I can see your concerns, as well. I was rather alarmed at them dropping DAL and now BUR is troubling, although tphuang pointed out the low LF on the route. I guess I can't blame AS for cutting potential losses.

Also (as echoed buy RWA380), DL's announcement of a build up at SJC is yet another wild card. I have to say, when I first read about that, it nearly knocked me out of my chair. With all the existing competition at SJC, I'm wondering how and why DL decided to jump in. WN has done a crazy amount of build up at SJC, a virtual fortress. AS has been taking them on. Now comes DL. My take on it is that WN is probably seen as less than a top choice for business travelers, and those wanting premium service. For my money, I put up the extra cash and often fly First/Business if for no other reason than my wife has mobility issues that make F/J much more comfortable and convenient. Plus it is deluxe and bitchen. ;) Plus I don't fly WN because I also like to reserve seats. Anyway, I think DL is going for the premium flyers. I don't know how many flights DL has out of SFO, but maybe they see an opportunity for premium passengers in Silicon Valley, and maybe they think they can siphon off some people from SFO who live/work closer to SJC?

It will be interesting to watch what moves AS makes at SJC and SAN. In this week's OAG thread, I noticed that (ignoring the DAL cut), AS cut 3 flights from SJC - all to BUR, but added 3 flights - 1 to PDX and 2 to SAN. So here, no net loss. And unless they are planning more moves, this schedule looks to be all the way to the beginning of next summer. Time will tell.

I wish you well down there in SUN Diego. :D


Hey Fiero, what is the gate situation at SJC? From my current understanding it's nuts to butts down there. If that is the case, how much can DL build up at SJC? It's been a hard road for carriers based or hubbed at SJC. CO & then CO West, QQ, AA after buying QQ. So I guess my question would be what market is DL chasing? The premium passengers that don't like WN because there is no premium cabin, yeah likely. But will that in itself be enough traffic to warrant a focus city?

I have a feeling that they will target BOS, JFK, PDX, SAN. But I believe most of the SJC area travelers are more often UA loyalists, since UA has flown mainline there for 50+ years, even just to SFO for a connection. Now where those premium passengers can't get non-stop from SJC, they can connect or in some cases drive up to SFO & go n/s to the likes of PPT/ZRH/AKL/SYD et al...


Maybe this goes without saying, but while most people in SJC probably don’t care so much about first class to SoCal or even Vegas, there are a lot of people who don’t want to jockey with other pax for a coach seat on a transcon. Maybe that’s the market DL is looking for?


That’s what I’m guessing. The local West routes are for FF and business loyalty.

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