Cointrin330
Topic Author
Posts: 1245
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2016 12:23 pm

AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 11:37 am

This from AA's hometown newspaper.

From the looks of it, AA has become the UA from a few years ago. Hopefully for AA, its customers, and employees, it will get back on track and smoothen out its operation. And quickly.

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/loc ... struggles/
 
AABB777
Posts: 571
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 11:53 am

Longtime and loyal AA customer here with Exec Plat status and I started flying DL this week. Onboard my second DL flight currently. AA has a problem and it starts at the top with Doug Parker. He has destroyed AA and its brand and it’s time for him to go and replaced with a new executive management team. From AA operations (which I put much blame on the mechanics union) to the onboard premium products and employee morale, AA is not the AA I have been loyal to and the AA BoD needs to take action soon.
 
FriscoHeavy
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 12:09 pm

AABB777 wrote:
Longtime and loyal AA customer here with Exec Plat status and I started flying DL this week. Onboard my second DL flight currently. AA has a problem and it starts at the top with Doug Parker. He has destroyed AA and its brand and it’s time for him to go and replaced with a new executive management team. From AA operations (which I put much blame on the mechanics union) to the onboard premium products and employee morale, AA is not the AA I have been loyal to and the AA BoD needs to take action soon.


What specifically has caused you to jump ship over to DL?

Thanks
Whatever
 
Eirules
Posts: 1870
Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2007 5:17 am

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 12:17 pm

My biggest gripe with AA is consistency and that comes from the top.

Some great staff, some awful & that’s been the case for too long now. It’s particularly the case when you compare ground staff versus those in the cabin. Onboard, especially domestically in J, you might get a comfortable 737 with PTVs or a bone hard 737 with no TV & it’s complete pot luck which you get. Internationally there’s far too many different J seats; 772 v 773 v 330 v 767

Yes AA suffered cancellations due to the MAX & work at JFK. Yes the mechanics caused issues that didn’t happen at other carriers. But AA have failed to address the things in AA’s control
The way you cut your meat reflects the way you live....
 
alggag
Posts: 411
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2010 6:34 am

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 12:27 pm

Yesterday I had a flight on UA and was actually just thinking about how I actually don't mind flying them and that AA has taken the title of my least favorite big US airline. I would agree with your description of AA now being the UA of a few years ago.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 5850
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 12:32 pm

AABB777 wrote:
AA has a problem and it starts at the top with Doug Parker. He has destroyed AA and its brand and it’s time for him to go and replaced with a new executive management team.


AA hasn't been a reliable, on-time carrier with good baggage handling for at least 15 years. (See regular DOT reports.) Ops unreliability didn't start with Parker. Labor problems didn't start with Parker (although he let the US/HP nonsense fester and brought it to AA). Crandall kept a lid on it but Carty did not, nor Arpey. AA employees are happy being unhappy - it's the only thing many have known. Too often it shows in their service interactions.
 
avi8
Posts: 1100
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 12:43 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
AABB777 wrote:
AA has a problem and it starts at the top with Doug Parker. He has destroyed AA and its brand and it’s time for him to go and replaced with a new executive management team.


AA hasn't been a reliable, on-time carrier with good baggage handling for at least 15 years. (See regular DOT reports.) Ops unreliability didn't start with Parker. Labor problems didn't start with Parker (although he let the US/HP nonsense fester and brought it to AA). Crandall kept a lid on it but Carty did not, nor Arpey. AA employees are happy being unhappy - it's the only thing many have known. Too often it shows in their service interactions.



Yes. I’ve never heard a good thing about AA in maybe 15 years. I pretty much fly AA all the time out of necessity. They usually have better schedules and prices from my hometown but other than that I have no reason to fly them. It sucks that I have a ton of miles with them. Obviously, not all of my flights are delayed and I’ve had plenty of good experiences with them. But they have nothing special to offer that I couldn’t get somewhere else. I remember my mom saying “aMIERDIcan Airlines”, in Spanish.
avi8

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cledaybuck
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 12:45 pm

How about a Hurricane heading in the direction of MIA to really put the cherry on top.
As we celebrate mediocrity, all the boys upstairs want to see, how much you'll pay for what you used to get for free.
 
UWPAviation
Posts: 110
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 12:54 pm

AA to me has become the middle in-between DL, UA and then WN and JetBlue.

They have zero identity. They don’t want to be a premium product like DL and UA. But they don’t want to be a LCC like WN and JetBlue. Like mentioned, you could get a grey 738 with IFE and new seats or a bone dry one.

I loved the old AA pre merger. Was actually my airline of choice. Now I refuse to fly them. I fly WN and DL.
 
Ziyulu
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 1:05 pm

I flew from AUS to CLT and only a drink was served. There were no snacks, not even a little bag of pretzels or peanuts.
 
Insertnamehere
Posts: 122
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2018 3:44 am

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 1:17 pm

AA gutted their JFK hub and for me that moved me from being platinum with them and die hard to becoming more of a free agent going to whomever has the best deal (also thanks to my Amex Platinum card as I can move points to a bunch of airline programs a lot better and get better flexibility). AA has seriously destroyed themselves and is a joke of an airline with management that seems out of touch and unwilling to change anything to become competitive but settling only for mediocrity.
 
kabq737
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 1:21 pm

My company stopped using AA this summer. We used to use them for about 90% of company travel however, they just became too unreliable. Cancelations were all too common. Delta or United is policy now.
Been on: 320, 321, 333, 733, 73G, 738, 739, 744, 752, 763, 764, 772, 789, C208, CR7, CR9, BE20, MD83, MD88, MD90, E70, E75, E90, TRIM
Flown: SEEKER, C150M C172N, C172R, C172S, C182RG, DA40, PA-46
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Miamiairport
Posts: 236
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 1:23 pm

Constant weather in MIA and the Max issue made the summer particularly hellish for AA. AA just doesn't seem to have a robust recovery process. However, for this most recent hurricane hitting FL I was able to get through within minutes (as a PLT) and have my flights rescheduled to a better time.

The biggest issue AA has is with the banking of hubs. They just can't handle it. From a customer prospective AA should de-bank hubs (which years ago LAA did to reduce delays) but I can't see Parker giving up the additional revenue potential. He'd rather have paxs sleeping in the airport. MIA looks like a homeless shelter at night because of all the missed connections going South.
 
LHUSA
Posts: 787
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 1:24 pm

Are things really that bad? Or, is some of those bordering dramatic? I'm not a frequent AA flier, but my experiences on them this year have been on-time and pleasant. I have not heard much criticism of them from friends (non-avgeeks) that are loyal to AA. Don't crucify me for asking, honestly curious.
 
Scarebus34
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 1:26 pm

AA hasn’t been a good airline for at least 15 years - problem is, I don’t think they realize there’s a problem. Parker is so full of himself he’ll never admit to screwing the pooch on the merger. Their operation is completely disjointed. From what I understand, there’s three factions inside the operations center and they’re all on different pages. Old NWA guys running the show, and then AA and US workgroups. Neither of them can get on the same page.
 
himarhernandez
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 1:27 pm

I understand the overall statistics as dire and in need of change. I flew them a lot this summer and found them excellent in every flight. In one of the flights, I had bought business class but the other airline had messed it up and sat us in coach, the AA employees were amazing and fixed it all up when it was not their problem. My kids got an amazing souvenir this summer, a pilot's log book. After the flight all three kids were allowed in the cabin to sit in the pilot seat and got an autograph from them. On another flight I was upgraded to first without asking. I do hope that they fix their act as I do still love them
 
Scarebus34
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 1:28 pm

Miamiairport wrote:
Constant weather in MIA and the Max issue made the summer particularly hellish for AA. AA just doesn't seem to have a robust recovery process. However, for this most recent hurricane hitting FL I was able to get through within minutes (as a PLT) and have my flights rescheduled to a better time.

The biggest issue AA has is with the banking of hubs. They just can't handle it. From a customer prospective AA should de-bank hubs (which years ago LAA did to reduce delays) but I can't see Parker giving up the additional revenue potential. He'd rather have paxs sleeping in the airport. MIA looks like a homeless shelter at night because of all the missed connections going South.

To some regard, the banking has also led to a decline in UAs performance from two years ago when it was at an all-time high. Sure it makes financial sense, but when you don’t have the gate space or refuse to staff for it, it just causes problems. In a perfect day the banking works, but there’s never a perfect day in aviation. Things break, there’s weather, ATC issues, etc.
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 1:47 pm

Eirules wrote:
My biggest gripe with AA is consistency and that comes from the top.

Some great staff, some awful & that’s been the case for too long now. It’s particularly the case when you compare ground staff versus those in the cabin. Onboard, especially domestically in J, you might get a comfortable 737 with PTVs or a bone hard 737 with no TV & it’s complete pot luck which you get. Internationally there’s far too many different J seats; 772 v 773 v 330 v 767

Yes AA suffered cancellations due to the MAX & work at JFK. Yes the mechanics caused issues that didn’t happen at other carriers. But AA have failed to address the things in AA’s control


Dont you dare blame JFK!

ATC has been excellent. It has been nothing but a normal summer at kennedy. Some bad thunderstorm days, but if not 0 delays. Best on time performance of the 3 area airports despite the closure


AA is the only airline to cut 30 percent of its operation at JFK thru NOV under the guise of runway construction. They have a dispensation from the Port Authority.

DL and B6 grew YOY at JFK.

AA is clueless what to do with JFK slots and runs a garbage operation all on its own!
 
maps4ltd
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 1:53 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
Eirules wrote:
My biggest gripe with AA is consistency and that comes from the top.

Some great staff, some awful & that’s been the case for too long now. It’s particularly the case when you compare ground staff versus those in the cabin. Onboard, especially domestically in J, you might get a comfortable 737 with PTVs or a bone hard 737 with no TV & it’s complete pot luck which you get. Internationally there’s far too many different J seats; 772 v 773 v 330 v 767

Yes AA suffered cancellations due to the MAX & work at JFK. Yes the mechanics caused issues that didn’t happen at other carriers. But AA have failed to address the things in AA’s control


Dont you dare blame JFK!

ATC has been excellent. It has been nothing but a normal summer at kennedy. Some bad thunderstorm days, but if not 0 delays. Best on time performance of the 3 area airports despite the closure


AA is the only airline to cut 30 percent of its operation at JFK thru NOV under the guise of runway construction. They have a dispensation from the Port Authority.

DL and B6 grew YOY at JFK.

AA is clueless what to do with JFK slots and runs a garbage operation all on its own!


Well August has been a perfectly awful month for JFK, primarily due to weather (and NY's propensity to delay everything for hours when a raindrop hits the ground). 1 hour taxis have been the norm the last two weeks.
Delta Gold Medallion and Southwest A-List
 
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fsx98
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 2:00 pm

My last time flying AA was on 8/9 of last year when I was flying to ABQ from COU via DFW; it was also my first time on an MD80 and would be the only time, as the fleet is retiring this year; the flight was delayed by around 50 minutes due to weather; glad this was my last leg of the flight, in which was okay, as I had previous weather delays with AA the trip before (MCO-DFW-COU) and had to stay at a hotel near DFW because I missed the last flight back home that night.

While at that time the 8/9/18 trip regained my confidence in flying AA again (in response to the nightmarish trip from 6/7 on my flight back home from Orlando), someone booked us a WN trip for a month later for a family visit in NYC, then a wedding in Northern California (STL-EWR-OAK-STL trip). From here on out, we chose WN for any leisure travel as we have friendlier crews and better experiences with them, especially with the two free checked bags deal! While I'm not a fan of the cattle-call boarding process (I rather have assigned seating for the window seat), nor having to drive two hours to STL to fly WN out to anywhere, WN is now my preferred and favorite airline.

One exception not flying WN so far this year was flying UA for the very first time for a red-eye flight to EWR from SFO to catch my brother's NYU general graduation ceremony - sure their first impressions are anything but (late arrival of the plane and extended clean-up time before my flight); however, it was the only option to get to my brother's graduation ceremony in a short time and somehow, I feel that UA turned the corner in terms of customer service (in contrast to the infamous David Dao incident) and I wouldn't mind flying UA again. I have yet to fly on DL, but will give DL a try sometime!

On 8/9/19, I flew out of town again for the third consecutive year (did flew on 8/9 in 2017 and 2018 with AA), but is with WN, and with mostly positive experiences throughout! In short, I'll definitely looking forward to fly WN again and never looking back at AA unless if it's the "airline of last resort."
 
bpat777
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 2:31 pm

Of the large U.S. carriers, I find AA to be the least reliable particularly in-flight. Their F/As seem miserable and do the bare minimum. I know it's not a big deal big but it seems nearly everytime I board an AA flight the F/As are texting on their phone or engaged in personal conversations not greeting passengers. I fly AA because the flights are often cheap so I guess you get what you pay for.
 
AABB777
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 2:49 pm

FriscoHeavy wrote:
AABB777 wrote:
Longtime and loyal AA customer here with Exec Plat status and I started flying DL this week. Onboard my second DL flight currently. AA has a problem and it starts at the top with Doug Parker. He has destroyed AA and its brand and it’s time for him to go and replaced with a new executive management team. From AA operations (which I put much blame on the mechanics union) to the onboard premium products and employee morale, AA is not the AA I have been loyal to and the AA BoD needs to take action soon.


What specifically has caused you to jump ship over to DL?

Thanks


First, AA needs to fix their operation. Period. It’s become completely unreliable this summer. My first flight on DL was Tuesday morning at 6am. The AA flight at 6am...cancelled. Fixing the operation alone would radically transform their brand, PR and revenue decline vs DL. I see flight attendant morale declining too. They just aren’t happy when serving their customers. AA also needs competent leadership with vision and a whole new marketing team (Andrew Nocella needs to leave). I don’t see a cohesive strategy that tells the AA story and the current folks don’t focus on positive brand building. AA’s PR team is allowing many negative optics to control the narrative with bloggers and media and now with customers.
 
horpdorp
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:00 pm

AABB777 wrote:
. AA also needs competent leadership with vision and a whole new marketing team (Andrew Nocella needs to leave)


I got some news for you, bud....
 
Eirules
Posts: 1870
Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2007 5:17 am

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:03 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
Eirules wrote:
My biggest gripe with AA is consistency and that comes from the top.

Some great staff, some awful & that’s been the case for too long now. It’s particularly the case when you compare ground staff versus those in the cabin. Onboard, especially domestically in J, you might get a comfortable 737 with PTVs or a bone hard 737 with no TV & it’s complete pot luck which you get. Internationally there’s far too many different J seats; 772 v 773 v 330 v 767

Yes AA suffered cancellations due to the MAX & work at JFK. Yes the mechanics caused issues that didn’t happen at other carriers. But AA have failed to address the things in AA’s control


Dont you dare blame JFK!

ATC has been excellent. It has been nothing but a normal summer at kennedy. Some bad thunderstorm days, but if not 0 delays. Best on time performance of the 3 area airports despite the closure



Wow JFK fanboy...

https://crankyflier.com/2019/04/09/afte ... this-fall/
The way you cut your meat reflects the way you live....
 
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chepos
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:08 pm

AABB777 wrote:
FriscoHeavy wrote:
AABB777 wrote:
Longtime and loyal AA customer here with Exec Plat status and I started flying DL this week. Onboard my second DL flight currently. AA has a problem and it starts at the top with Doug Parker. He has destroyed AA and its brand and it’s time for him to go and replaced with a new executive management team. From AA operations (which I put much blame on the mechanics union) to the onboard premium products and employee morale, AA is not the AA I have been loyal to and the AA BoD needs to take action soon.


What specifically has caused you to jump ship over to DL?

Thanks


First, AA needs to fix their operation. Period. It’s become completely unreliable this summer. My first flight on DL was Tuesday morning at 6am. The AA flight at 6am...cancelled. Fixing the operation alone would radically transform their brand, PR and revenue decline vs DL. I see flight attendant morale declining too. They just aren’t happy when serving their customers. AA also needs competent leadership with vision and a whole new marketing team (Andrew Nocella needs to leave). I don’t see a cohesive strategy that tells the AA story and the current folks don’t focus on positive brand building. AA’s PR team is allowing many negative optics to control the narrative with bloggers and media and now with customers.


FYI, Andrew Nocella is at UAL.


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BAINY3
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:32 pm

Scarebus34 wrote:
From what I understand, there’s three factions inside the operations center and they’re all on different pages. Old NWA guys running the show, and then AA and US workgroups. Neither of them can get on the same page.

Do you mean AWA? Or did a bunch of NWA people actually wind up at AA?
 
Cointrin330
Topic Author
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:35 pm

More than likely, AA does need a change in leadership. What might have worked at US/HP does not work for a network carrier of AA's size. AA's glory days are long behind it at the moment. In some ways, the airline feels as though it is stuck in a place between wanting to be something bigger but at an absolutely rock bottom cost. The company shies away from competition and grows operations where it has the least competition (DFW, CLT). It missed opportunities in the aftermath of 9/11. It filed for bankruptcy too late to expand operations at lower costs where there is meaningful competition. The top talent at AA has long decamped to the competition. If the US and global economy take a downward turn, AA will really have missed the boat to right the ship so to speak and will rely on deep cuts to stave off another crisis.
 
jumbojet
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:44 pm

whats making matters worse for AA is that a flight will get delayed by several hours, in some instances passengers have boarded then have had to get off the plane. Crew eventually times out and by the time a new crew is in place, the plane is fixed and all is good for departure, bad weather moves in and the flight ultimately gets cancelled. AA calls it a weather related cancellation to avoid having to pay for hotel and food and other compensation. This often leaves passengers on their own to get to where their going, often having to pay in the thousands of dollars to make last minute hotel reservations and last minute bookings on other airlines. They are losing customers in droves because of this and yes, it reeks of the UA from not to long ago. AA needs to own up to what is and what is really not a weather related cx and compensate people, otherwise they will lose customers for good. DP needs to go ASAP.
 
YoungDon
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:46 pm

Fellow person who quit AA a few weeks ago..the customer service is bottom of the barrel. I have a bunch of miles with them, but I've been flying UA and to a lesser extent DL and think both of those airlines are better overall than AA. UA in particular has really improved over the last couple of years and I've never had a bad experience with DL.

Get it together AA.
 
apodino
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 3:58 pm

BAINY3 wrote:
Scarebus34 wrote:
From what I understand, there’s three factions inside the operations center and they’re all on different pages. Old NWA guys running the show, and then AA and US workgroups. Neither of them can get on the same page.

Do you mean AWA? Or did a bunch of NWA people actually wind up at AA?

A bunch of Northwest people did end up at AA after the AA/US merger. These are the people Delta didn’t want and put on the street. And AA wonders why DL cleans their clock.
 
MSPNWA
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:01 pm

I don't know if anyone has noticed, but AA's "summer from hell" appears to be ending or has ended. Cancellations are down to minimal levels.

That's why you don't jump ship after you've endured the worst of it. It's a highly cyclical industry. You often hurt yourself by always jumping into the slow lane.
 
cedarjet
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:03 pm

Hardcore BA fan but the lounge refurb at JFK T7 is a catastrophe, and check in at the F class counters* was so rude on my last encounter I thought I’d try AA as the route is metal neutral and heard good things about the Flagship Lounge. Purser was nice (I spoke to her about a possible seat change) and Y+ seat was good but the crew in my section were so rude, actually hostile, as bad as United at their worst, so it was an experiment I won’t repeat. I know anecdotal evidence doesn’t mean much but I’ve never had a bad crew on BA. At the US3 I’m not sure I’ve ever had a good crew. Good crew members yes, but all of them in a good mood and working as a team? Nope!

* I fly Y, Y+ and occasionally (very occasionally) J but I have a BA gold card so I can check in at the F counters
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
slider
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:08 pm

Scarebus34 wrote:
AA hasn’t been a good airline for at least 15 years - problem is, I don’t think they realize there’s a problem. Parker is so full of himself he’ll never admit to screwing the pooch on the merger. Their operation is completely disjointed. From what I understand, there’s three factions inside the operations center and they’re all on different pages. Old NWA guys running the show, and then AA and US workgroups. Neither of them can get on the same page.


This is a big part of it--you have widely disparate approaches that stem from pre-merger airlines and cultures, and it congeals horribly under Dougie. The stage is too big for him, I think that much has become clear. Hell, if you contemplate it, HP/US, then US/AA, it's all a bridge too far. Having seen how UA did it, you'd think AA would have plenty of lessons learned.
 
patrickjp93
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:10 pm

FriscoHeavy wrote:

What specifically has caused you to jump ship over to DL?

Thanks

Well, if he's had my recent luck, flight delays and cancellations AFTER PASSENGERS WERE FULLY BOARDED because a baggage handler the night before damaged the cargo hold and didn't report it, and the flight attendants are being overworked or under appreciated to the point their performance feels tired or moody to customers.

I had an A321 at LAX to CLT get fully boarded, and then we sat for 40 minutes before we had to de-plane, and that was after I'd gotten off the BNE-LAX flight by Qantas 3 hours prior. So 25 hours of travel from Brisbane to Norfolk turned into 30.5 hours of Hell all because of irresponsible baggage handlers not reporting damage that could have been fixed overnight. We ended up stealing the plane from the NEXT Charlotte flight, and they got the cascaded delay. No one was compensated, and the flight attendants were visibly exhausted on the flight.

AA is not in good shape if that fiasco is any indication.
 
patrickjp93
Posts: 391
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:12 pm

cedarjet wrote:
Hardcore BA fan but the lounge refurb at JFK T7 is a catastrophe, and check in at the F class counters* was so rude on my last encounter I thought I’d try AA as the route is metal neutral and heard good things about the Flagship Lounge. Purser was nice (I spoke to her about a possible seat change) and Y+ seat was good but the crew in my section were so rude, actually hostile, as bad as United at their worst, so it was an experiment I won’t repeat. I know anecdotal evidence doesn’t mean much but I’ve never had a bad crew on BA. At the US3 I’m not sure I’ve ever had a good crew. Good crew members yes, but all of them in a good mood and working as a team? Nope!

* I fly Y, Y+ and occasionally (very occasionally) J but I have a BA gold card so I can check in at the F counters


It may be time to give Delta a fair go again. They've been improving a lot in the last two years on all of the services in and out of Atlanta.
 
patrickjp93
Posts: 391
Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:00 pm

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:16 pm

jumbojet wrote:
whats making matters worse for AA is that a flight will get delayed by several hours, in some instances passengers have boarded then have had to get off the plane. Crew eventually times out and by the time a new crew is in place, the plane is fixed and all is good for departure, bad weather moves in and the flight ultimately gets cancelled. AA calls it a weather related cancellation to avoid having to pay for hotel and food and other compensation. This often leaves passengers on their own to get to where their going, often having to pay in the thousands of dollars to make last minute hotel reservations and last minute bookings on other airlines. They are losing customers in droves because of this and yes, it reeks of the UA from not to long ago. AA needs to own up to what is and what is really not a weather related cx and compensate people, otherwise they will lose customers for good. DP needs to go ASAP.


Thank God Southwest and Jet Blue can get me where I need to go for all of my business trips coming in from Australia. I always have contingencies planned when I fly AA.
 
patrickjp93
Posts: 391
Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:00 pm

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:17 pm

alggag wrote:
Yesterday I had a flight on UA and was actually just thinking about how I actually don't mind flying them and that AA has taken the title of my least favorite big US airline. I would agree with your description of AA now being the UA of a few years ago.


For regional services on small planes it's tough to say who has the ruder cabin crews, AA or Air Canada.
 
LightChop2Chop
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Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 3:33 pm

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:18 pm

I decided to try AA for my last LHR flight. Went via MIA. For what should have been a very senior, veteran long haul cabin crew, they were unprofessional at best. No need to get into the specifics in a public forum but I will try to avoid AA at all costs now.
 
AABB777
Posts: 571
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 12:05 pm

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:23 pm

chepos wrote:
AABB777 wrote:
FriscoHeavy wrote:

What specifically has caused you to jump ship over to DL?

Thanks


First, AA needs to fix their operation. Period. It’s become completely unreliable this summer. My first flight on DL was Tuesday morning at 6am. The AA flight at 6am...cancelled. Fixing the operation alone would radically transform their brand, PR and revenue decline vs DL. I see flight attendant morale declining too. They just aren’t happy when serving their customers. AA also needs competent leadership with vision and a whole new marketing team (Andrew Nocella needs to leave). I don’t see a cohesive strategy that tells the AA story and the current folks don’t focus on positive brand building. AA’s PR team is allowing many negative optics to control the narrative with bloggers and media and now with customers.


FYI, Andrew Nocella is at UAL.


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Oops, my bad. You’re right.
 
AAORY
Posts: 36
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2008 8:39 pm

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:26 pm

AA also needs competent leadership with vision and a whole new marketing team (Andrew Nocella needs to leave). I don’t see a cohesive strategy that tells the AA story and the current folks don’t focus on positive brand building. AA’s PR team is allowing many negative optics to control the narrative with bloggers and media and now with customers.


Curious what you think of UA's marketing strategy since Andrew Nocella left when Scott Kirby did to join UA.
36 countries visited and counting...
 
tphuang
Posts: 3229
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 4:28 pm

Eirules wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:
Eirules wrote:
My biggest gripe with AA is consistency and that comes from the top.

Some great staff, some awful & that’s been the case for too long now. It’s particularly the case when you compare ground staff versus those in the cabin. Onboard, especially domestically in J, you might get a comfortable 737 with PTVs or a bone hard 737 with no TV & it’s complete pot luck which you get. Internationally there’s far too many different J seats; 772 v 773 v 330 v 767

Yes AA suffered cancellations due to the MAX & work at JFK. Yes the mechanics caused issues that didn’t happen at other carriers. But AA have failed to address the things in AA’s control


Dont you dare blame JFK!

ATC has been excellent. It has been nothing but a normal summer at kennedy. Some bad thunderstorm days, but if not 0 delays. Best on time performance of the 3 area airports despite the closure



Wow JFK fanboy...

https://crankyflier.com/2019/04/09/afte ... this-fall/


anyone that has looked at AA's declining yields in JFK could tell you that they have no clue how to use those slots here. Adding a bunch of within perimeter route with diminishing destinations to connect to is not a real strategy.

And I'm saying this has someone that have had very good experience with AA. Their premium cabin for me is better than UA/DL. And at NYC, I don't sense their OTP is significantly worse than competitors.
 
codc10
Posts: 2540
Joined: Sat Jul 08, 2000 7:18 am

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 5:09 pm

AAORY wrote:
AA also needs competent leadership with vision and a whole new marketing team (Andrew Nocella needs to leave). I don’t see a cohesive strategy that tells the AA story and the current folks don’t focus on positive brand building. AA’s PR team is allowing many negative optics to control the narrative with bloggers and media and now with customers.


Curious what you think of UA's marketing strategy since Andrew Nocella left when Scott Kirby did to join UA.


Right now, it's probably in a better place than at any time post-merger.

There's no doubt that Kirby's arrival at UA coincided with the company really hitting its stride. Many wonder if he was really the brains behind the Parker-Kirby operation.

One thing that is not mentioned often is a lot of young AA talent followed Kirby and Nocella to UA, including network planning people like Ankit Gupta and Patrick Quayle. They've quickly made their mark at UA and are two rising stars in the industry. AA still has some quality network people, but AA's loss certainly has been United's gain.
 
jumbojet
Posts: 2889
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:01 am

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 5:25 pm

tphuang wrote:
Eirules wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:

Dont you dare blame JFK!

ATC has been excellent. It has been nothing but a normal summer at kennedy. Some bad thunderstorm days, but if not 0 delays. Best on time performance of the 3 area airports despite the closure



Wow JFK fanboy...

https://crankyflier.com/2019/04/09/afte ... this-fall/


anyone that has looked at AA's declining yields in JFK could tell you that they have no clue how to use those slots here. Adding a bunch of within perimeter route with diminishing destinations to connect to is not a real strategy.

And I'm saying this has someone that have had very good experience with AA. Their premium cabin for me is better than UA/DL. And at NYC, I don't sense their OTP is significantly worse than competitors.


It largely depends on what aircraft your on when it comes to the overall premium cabin experience between AA and DL, so your statement is obviously biased and in no way shape or form fair, The DL D1 suite on the 777, 350 and 330 NEO handily beats just about anything AA has whereas the DL 763 J seat is just about the worst out there. So, it doesnt surprise me, or anyone else for that matter I am sure, that you take this opportunity to knock DL.

As for why AA cant, or wont make JFK work, its a simple reason that you have wrong. To much competition at JFK and its a lot more expensive to operate out of JFK. By switching to PHL, its cheaper to operate and they pretty much have PHL all to themselves. Pretty damn smart if you ask me.

And lets face facts, how many true DL premium cabins have you been on lately? I bet the # is somewhere between 0 and 0.
 
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American 767
Posts: 4440
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 5:42 pm

jumbojet wrote:
tphuang wrote:
Eirules wrote:


As for why AA cant, or wont make JFK work, its a simple reason that you have wrong. To much competition at JFK and its a lot more expensive to operate out of JFK. By switching to PHL, its cheaper to operate and they pretty much have PHL all to themselves. Pretty damn smart if you ask me.



They must have the same problem in BOS...I mean similar. It is interesting that DL and B6 are both strong at both airports JFK and BOS. No wonder AA has a tough time competing against these two major players at these two airports, that's why they are building PHL for their TATL hub. The only difference with JFK is, MassPort may charge less for slots and landing fees in BOS, than what the PANYNJ charges for slots and landing fees in JFK. The only asset for AA that works well in JFK is the three-class product on multiple daily flights to LAX and SFO because there is a lot of Premium business traffic, especially to LAX. I think that AA sees JFK/LGA combined more as an O & D point, because they have a lot of customers in NYC, than a major connecting hub.
Ben Soriano
 
dcaproducer
Posts: 196
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 5:47 pm

DC based and originally from STL where I was loyal to TWA and then AA. In 2008 I had a client in ATL and started flying frequently with them. Switched to DL. Never looked back.

There’s no comparison. (I’m on a DL plane now)
My client on this trip is using AA and had horrible delays on her outbound flights. I fly 60+ segments a year and can count on one hand delays that aren’t weather related.

DL flight crews, in general, have such a better attitude. They treat frequent fliers well and invest in their fleet and hard product.

There are so many little things DL does well that you don’t realize it until you see how another airline operates. I’m not saying they’re perfect, but AA has issues.
 
Austin787
Posts: 388
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2016 11:39 pm

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Fri Aug 30, 2019 5:50 pm

The biggest problem I see with AA is the inconsistency. Operations can be a complete mess or flow like clockwork. FAs and agents can be anything from "couldn't care less" to "very helpful and professional". Onboard product can be bare bones (cramped seating, no IFE, no power outlets) to full service (PTVs, power outlets, etc). Even MCE (one of the quickest things to implement) is inconsistent: some planes have MCE section while others only have exit/bulkhead rows as MCE. Imagine paying a legacy fare and then getting on a plane with a ULCC product - not a recipe to build customer loyalty.

Cointrin330 wrote:
This from AA's hometown newspaper.

From the looks of it, AA has become the UA from a few years ago. Hopefully for AA, its customers, and employees, it will get back on track and smoothen out its operation. And quickly.

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/loc ... struggles/

I disagree. That is an insult to UA.
 
Justapax
Posts: 65
Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2016 6:31 am

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:18 am

codc10 wrote:
[

There's no doubt that Kirby's arrival at UA coincided with the company really hitting its stride. Many wonder if he was really the brains behind the Parker-Kirby operation.


codc: I remember reading an interview with Doug Parker after Scott Kirby. Parker said he fired Kirby and something like it was the hardest decision of his life.

I now wonder if Parker was the person who kept pushing for cuts at AA and Kirby was the one who resisted some of the things Parker wanted to do.

It certainly has been fascinating to see the success Kirby has had at UA...and how AA has had more than its share of problems.
 
UpNAWAy
Posts: 526
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Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:36 am

I remember when this board hated Kirby. What changed?
 
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chepos
Posts: 6789
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2000 9:40 am

AA's Summer From Hell

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:54 am

UpNAWAy wrote:
I remember when this board hated Kirby. What changed?


He is now with UA, he now walks on water.


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Fly the Flag!!!!
 
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RyanairGuru
Posts: 7888
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:59 am

Re: AA's Summer From Hell

Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:28 am

UpNAWAy wrote:
I remember when this board hated Kirby. What changed?


People assumed that he was the one pushing for ever greater cuts to the product and driving the mantra of cost cutting uber alles. His time at United has shown that almost certainly was not the case, he is a very smart man and understands the balance between running an efficient business and investing in your product to attract higher revenue.
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