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mercure1
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Air Canada fined for not using French language

Fri Aug 30, 2019 11:41 pm

Since 1960s, Canada has had laws which are meant to ensure French and English are given equal status. Air Canada being former crown corporation is subject to such law and must provide service of equal quality in both English and French.



Air Canada has been ordered to pay a French-speaking couple 21,000 Canadian dollars ($15,700; £12,900) and write them a letter of apology for violating their linguistic rights.

The couple complained that some signs on a domestic flight they took were only in English, while others gave the French version less prominence.

A judge ruled that the airline had breached Canada's bilingualism laws. Air Canada reportedly told the court it would work to replace the signage.

"Air Canada systematically violates the linguistic rights of Francophones," the couple argued, according to the written judgment for the case. In the ruling, the Ottawa court judge agreed that the airline had "not upheld its linguistic obligations".

Air Canada is subject to the country's Official Languages Act, which seeks to ensure that English and French are given equal status.


Air Canada fined for not using French language
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-49532427
mercure f-wtcc
 
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cirrusdragoon
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:02 am

The trials and tribulations of being a country with two official languages. Fair enough it is in the interest of preserving and ensuring the nations languages are properly represented to both groups of language speakers living in the same country. fair is fair but $20,000? Excessive .
 
Lufthansa
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:04 am

Nearly $16000 in damages? Thats ridiculous. An apology sure. Maybe a few free flights and AC being told
it must comply but how are this couple, to pay out that much, to justify that sum? I agree in a bilingual country
both languages must be considered, as it is in many other parts of the world. Airport signs in the US often are
also in spanish. In Australia, in Chinese. In both countries these aren't even offical languages. I bet if this money
went straight to the government in the form of a fine, rather than the PAX they wouldn't have bothered go to
court.
Last edited by Lufthansa on Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
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longhauler
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:08 am

Understand that only Air Canada operates under these restrictions. No other airline in Canada!

So ....... Westjet (for example) does not have to change the “lift” notation on seat belt buckles to bilingual.

Only in Canada.

Also understand this is the same couple that complained about not being able to order “7 Up” in French. (And won).
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SeaEagle8
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:18 am

Wow.
Were they so hard done by that they suffered mental anguish and required compensation.
Ok, if that’s the law in Canada, fair enough but how is it possible that somebody has suffered undue hardship to warrant such a payout?
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ikolkyo
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:22 am

Now that is quick cash.
 
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Vasu
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:23 am

Sounds like this couple will end up in court for something or other and will end up paying back the money anyway.

Sad that the system allows for such payouts for something where a simple apology would suffice. If I see a sign I don’t understand I just go on my phone and translate it. Or ask someone! I wouldn’t expect money if I didn’t understand a sign...
 
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N62NA
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:26 am

longhauler wrote:
Understand that only Air Canada operates under these restrictions. No other airline in Canada!

So ....... Westjet (for example) does not have to change the “lift” notation on seat belt buckles to bilingual.

Only in Canada.

Also understand this is the same couple that complained about not being able to order “7 Up” in French. (And won).



That's interesting, thanks for posting this as I wasn't aware it was just applying to AC.
 
Adipocere
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:30 am

Do foreign airlines have to comply with these laws when they fly into Canada too?
 
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chepos
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:31 am

Adipocere wrote:
Do foreign airlines have to comply with these laws when they fly into Canada too?


Nope.


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longhauler
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:34 am

N62NA wrote:

That's interesting, thanks for posting this as I wasn't aware it was just applying to AC.

Air Canada operates under the Air Canada Public Participation Act. Borne 30+ years ago when they became a public corporation. It makes them much more vulnerable to frivolous lawsuits like this.

So things like always having a bilingual Flight Attendant on all flight applies only to them. (The 7Up case noted above). Other Canadian airlines are allowed French language pre recorded announcements.

While marketing dictates having bilingual F/As on Québéc flights, Air Canada must also include at least one on a LAX-YVR flight for example. It gets cumbersome.
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ac7e7
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:40 am

longhauler wrote:
Understand that only Air Canada operates under these restrictions. No other airline in Canada!

So ....... Westjet (for example) does not have to change the “lift” notation on seat belt buckles to bilingual.

Only in Canada.

Also understand this is the same couple that complained about not being able to order “7 Up” in French. (And won).


Professional gold diggers who should be banned from flying AC.
 
TTailedTiger
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:44 am

ACs should pay them and then blacklist them from flying in the future.
 
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CarlosSi
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:55 am

I mean surely most people who speak French in Canada are bilingual, no?
 
max999
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:59 am

longhauler wrote:
Understand that only Air Canada operates under these restrictions. No other airline in Canada!

So ....... Westjet (for example) does not have to change the “lift” notation on seat belt buckles to bilingual.

Only in Canada.

Also understand this is the same couple that complained about not being able to order “7 Up” in French. (And won).


The couple seem culturally American for their ability to leverage inane lawsuits for personal gain.
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chepos
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Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:03 am

I recall flying on a Jazz flight a few years back between PDX and YVR. All French announcements were recorded, I believe.

However, flying mainline between YYZ and YUL, everything was in both French and English. Apparently the cabin crew was mostly Francophone as they spoke amongst themselves in French. Thought jt was pretty neat.


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hitchy81
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:19 am

max999 wrote:
longhauler wrote:
Understand that only Air Canada operates under these restrictions. No other airline in Canada!

So ....... Westjet (for example) does not have to change the “lift” notation on seat belt buckles to bilingual.

Only in Canada.

Also understand this is the same couple that complained about not being able to order “7 Up” in French. (And won).


The couple seem culturally American for their ability to leverage inane lawsuits for personal gain.



Ha! Good one :)
 
hitchy81
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:24 am

longhauler wrote:
Understand that only Air Canada operates under these restrictions. No other airline in Canada!

So ....... Westjet (for example) does not have to change the “lift” notation on seat belt buckles to bilingual.

Only in Canada.

Also understand this is the same couple that complained about not being able to order “7 Up” in French. (And won).



It's the price they have to pay for getting to wrap themselves in the flag. They're happy to take advantage of the branding opportunities that go with being the national airline; "Fly the flag!" they keep telling us, so this is the pricey bad that goes with the lucrative good.
 
DC1979
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:34 am

I’ve always found it shocking that act that applies solely to Air Canada. I’ve never understood how that has been allowed to be the case for so long. It should either apply to all Canadian airlines or none of them.
 
ExMilitaryEng
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:35 am

Before someone brings that one up, the couple are from Ontario, not from Québec...
 
Noise
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:46 am

Gotta love official bilingualism.
 
ual763
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:55 am

CarlosSi wrote:
I mean surely most people who speak French in Canada are bilingual, no?


Yeah, they are. Some of the French ones pretend like to pretend that they don’t, but they do. I’ve had some absolutely refuse to speak English to me as an American on a recent trip to Quebec City. I was treated better in Paris than I was in Quebec (specifically Quebec City, Montreal was fine). Never had a problem anywhere else in Canada.
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steveinbc
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 2:03 am

I know it's easy to mock these guys. But there's an official language act that essentially states that if you're a natural French speaker then you should have equal access to services in your language. Air Canada is part of that service as a legacy if its government ownership. The airline has greatly benefitted from government largesse over decades and therefore I think this aspect is part and parcel of the advantages that the cost relationship provides Air Canada. So I dont have much sympathy for AC on this particular instance. As for the plaintiffs, their award is more to smack AC over the knuckles than reward frivolous complaints
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 2:09 am

English speakers should learn another language, the world is way richer elsewhere ;)
I know this is anathema to monotongues, but this site, born in Europe be it said, fines members likewise should they use another language : posts just are not tolerated. Problem is that narrowing all discussions to one language does keep away many members from other countries ( see all the forums/blogs in German, Russian, French, Spanish ), and the sheer number of threads & the kind of discussion are heavily anglosaxon oriented - yaawn.
On a sidenote to hammer my point, I am always shocked at how US, Canadian, Oz citizens are not the least concerned about having done away with literally hundreds of "languages" by cultures they exterminated.
I am fluent in French by the way & would welcome some discussion in der Sprache Goethes.
I also think they are more Chinese, Japanese and other -nese avgeeks than all of us here combined.
 
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 2:13 am

ual763 wrote:
CarlosSi wrote:
I mean surely most people who speak French in Canada are bilingual, no?


Yeah, they are. Some of the French ones pretend like to pretend that they don’t, but they do. I’ve had some absolutely refuse to speak English to me as an American on a recent trip to Quebec City. I was treated better in Paris than I was in Quebec (specifically Quebec City, Montreal was fine). Never had a problem anywhere else in Canada.


About 1/3 of francophones in Canada aren’t “pretending” and are in fact unilingual, especially in a place like Quebec City. Anglophones often poo poo this, yet hypocritically only about 15% of anglophones are bilingual in the other direction (I feel lucky/thankful to fall into that 15%). Knowing more than one language is both empowering and provides you with a different perspective.

Is singling out AC ridiculous, yes. Quite frankly the level of French on WS is just sad/laughable and quite frankly they should have to provide decent French services on routes that touch cities with +10% francophone population. Are these damages ridiculous? Somewhat. It’s one thing to not get served in French or have primary signage in French, but quite another to complain about a smaller font, which is probably due to needing to squeeze the same message in French (which 90% of the time takes more words to achieve) in the same space as in English.
Last edited by Dominion301 on Sat Aug 31, 2019 2:20 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
MareBorealis
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 2:24 am

Finland is officially bi lingual (Finnish/Swedish) and Finnair used to have a quite strict language policy. Fluent Finnish, Swedish and English were all required to become a cabin crew member. But that has changed, only English is required now. From Finnair's website: "Fluency in English is required, fluency in Finnish is highly valued and other language skills are considered an asset." On their flights to HKG and SIN you don't get service in Finnish/Swedish at all. I haven't heard much complaints but I wonder what would the French passengers say if they didn't get service in French on AF ;)
 
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ztarizona
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 2:33 am

longhauler wrote:
N62NA wrote:

That's interesting, thanks for posting this as I wasn't aware it was just applying to AC.

Air Canada operates under the Air Canada Public Participation Act. Borne 30+ years ago when they became a public corporation. It makes them much more vulnerable to frivolous lawsuits like this.

So things like always having a bilingual Flight Attendant on all flight applies only to them. (The 7Up case noted above). Other Canadian airlines are allowed French language pre recorded announcements.

While marketing dictates having bilingual F/As on Québéc flights, Air Canada must also include at least one on a LAX-YVR flight for example. It gets cumbersome.


One man’s frivolity is another mans 20k payout. If they don’t like the rules, feel they are unfair or punitive in nature, dont operate your airline under the ACPA. Lol
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 2:35 am

Dominion301 wrote:
ual763 wrote:
CarlosSi wrote:
I mean surely most people who speak French in Canada are bilingual, no?


Yeah, they are. Some of the French ones pretend like to pretend that they don’t, but they do. I’ve had some absolutely refuse to speak English to me as an American on a recent trip to Quebec City. I was treated better in Paris than I was in Quebec (specifically Quebec City, Montreal was fine). Never had a problem anywhere else in Canada.


About 1/3 of francophones in Canada aren’t “pretending” and are in fact unilingual, especially in a place like Quebec City. Anglophones often poo poo this, yet hypocritically only about 15% of anglophones are bilingual in the other direction (I feel lucky/thankful to fall into that 15%). Knowing more than one language is both empowering and provides you with a different perspective.

Is singling out AC ridiculous, yes. Quite frankly the level of French on WS is just sad/laughable and quite frankly they should have to provide decent French services on routes that touch cities with +10% francophone population. Are these damages ridiculous? Somewhat. It’s one thing to not get served in French or have primary signage in French, but quite another to complain about a smaller font, which is probably due to needing to squeeze the same message in French (which 90% of the time takes more words to achieve) in the same space as in English.


Some good points here, but we ought to be able to agree that bilingualism is somewhat overblown as applied to AC. There’s no need for bilingual service on routes like YVR-YYC or YYZ-BNA. Service ought to be (and pretty consistently is on AC) bilingual on YUL-LGA or YYZ-YQB.

FWIW (and keep in mind that I read a fair amount of French and speak a bit so maybe my perspective is different than some) I find most of francophone Canada pretty friendly to anglophones who make a genuine effort to do as much in French as they can. It’s rare to find folks in the service sector who don’t speak pretty good English and most written materials are available in both languages. The most significant exception in the tourist world is probably STM in Montreal and even there most employees can get by in English.
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 2:37 am

A few years ago a gentleman from Quebec was pulled over by the police somewhere in the countryside of Alberta. He was able to have the ticket annulled in court because the Alberta police officer was not able to address him in French!
 
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 2:39 am

steveinbc wrote:
I know it's easy to mock these guys. But there's an official language act that essentially states that if you're a natural French speaker then you should have equal access to services in your language. Air Canada is part of that service as a legacy if its government ownership. The airline has greatly benefitted from government largesse over decades and therefore I think this aspect is part and parcel of the advantages that the cost relationship provides Air Canada. So I dont have much sympathy for AC on this particular instance. As for the plaintiffs, their award is more to smack AC over the knuckles than reward frivolous complaints


I love all the people mocking this as if somehow a multimillion dollar company is being unfairly treated operating under rules and requirements they already knew about and agreed to follow. Makes me wonder if these same people would have been the one calling proponents of a spherical earth lunatics back in the day lmao
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IAHWorldflyer
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 2:42 am

I honestly don't remember the seatbelt buckles on Air France having the word for lift in French.
 
Dominion301
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 2:59 am

IAHWorldflyer wrote:
I honestly don't remember the seatbelt buckles on Air France having the word for lift in French.


France French has a lot of English loan words like parking and stop that aren’t used in Canadian French...which itself does have English loan words that largely differ from France. Anglophones, whether they know it or not, have pillaged at least 7,000 French words into the highly parasitic English language. Just think about that the next time you hop into a chic automobile or make a reservation. :spin:
 
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millionsofmiles
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 3:22 am

MareBorealis wrote:
Finland is officially bi lingual (Finnish/Swedish) and Finnair used to have a quite strict language policy. Fluent Finnish, Swedish and English were all required to become a cabin crew member. But that has changed, only English is required now. From Finnair's website: "Fluency in English is required, fluency in Finnish is highly valued and other language skills are considered an asset." On their flights to HKG and SIN you don't get service in Finnish/Swedish at all. I haven't heard much complaints but I wonder what would the French passengers say if they didn't get service in French on AF ;)


Very interesting. I guess that would mean that all flight attendant training and manuals are in English.
 
max999
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 3:25 am

DWC wrote:
English speakers should learn another language, the world is way richer elsewhere ;)
I know this is anathema to monotongues, but this site, born in Europe be it said, fines members likewise should they use another language : posts just are not tolerated. Problem is that narrowing all discussions to one language does keep away many members from other countries ( see all the forums/blogs in German, Russian, French, Spanish ), and the sheer number of threads & the kind of discussion are heavily anglosaxon oriented - yaawn.
On a sidenote to hammer my point, I am always shocked at how US, Canadian, Oz citizens are not the least concerned about having done away with literally hundreds of "languages" by cultures they exterminated.
I am fluent in French by the way & would welcome some discussion in der Sprache Goethes.
I also think they are more Chinese, Japanese and other -nese avgeeks than all of us here combined.


I don't mean to be dismissive of non English languages. But English is the de facto language of aviation, as it's recommended by the ICAO. Since airliners.net is an aviation website, is natural everything is written in English and the website members communicate in English.
Last edited by max999 on Sat Aug 31, 2019 3:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Noise
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 3:28 am

Dominion301 wrote:
ual763 wrote:
CarlosSi wrote:
I mean surely most people who speak French in Canada are bilingual, no?


Yeah, they are. Some of the French ones pretend like to pretend that they don’t, but they do. I’ve had some absolutely refuse to speak English to me as an American on a recent trip to Quebec City. I was treated better in Paris than I was in Quebec (specifically Quebec City, Montreal was fine). Never had a problem anywhere else in Canada.


About 1/3 of francophones in Canada aren’t “pretending” and are in fact unilingual


May God help them.
 
max999
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 3:34 am

Dominion301 wrote:
IAHWorldflyer wrote:
I honestly don't remember the seatbelt buckles on Air France having the word for lift in French.


France French has a lot of English loan words like parking and stop that aren’t used in Canadian French...which itself does have English loan words that largely differ from France. Anglophones, whether they know it or not, have pillaged at least 7,000 French words into the highly parasitic English language. Just think about that the next time you hop into a chic automobile or make a reservation. :spin:


In general, English speaking cultures are flexible and adaptable when it comes to changes in the language.

On the other hand, I understand the French are much more conservative and feel precious about changes to the language and with the use of loanwords.
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hitchy81
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 3:38 am

ual763 wrote:
CarlosSi wrote:
I mean surely most people who speak French in Canada are bilingual, no?


Yeah, they are. Some of the French ones pretend like to pretend that they don’t, but they do. I’ve had some absolutely refuse to speak English to me as an American on a recent trip to Quebec City. I was treated better in Paris than I was in Quebec (specifically Quebec City, Montreal was fine). Never had a problem anywhere else in Canada.


Montreal and Quebec City are quite different lingually. In Montreal almost everyone can speak English, but in Quebec City and much of rural Quebec it's quite common to encounter people who don't speak any. In the last census, over half of Quebec City's residents reported that they are unilingual Francophone.
Last edited by hitchy81 on Sat Aug 31, 2019 3:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
mjoelnir
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 3:58 am

That poor poor airline. They broke the law and get fined. :sarcastic:

A lot of you posters, that bash every passenger for not following all the arcane fine print rules of the airlines, get overly exited when an airline is fined for breaking the law.

When the Canadian law says that Air Canada has to have a French speaking F/A on every flight, than A/F just simply has to do it. Pay F/A's, that speak several languages, considerable more and you will find enough multilingual employees and the problem will solve itself.
 
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chepos
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 4:12 am

MareBorealis wrote:
Finland is officially bi lingual (Finnish/Swedish) and Finnair used to have a quite strict language policy. Fluent Finnish, Swedish and English were all required to become a cabin crew member. But that has changed, only English is required now. From Finnair's website: "Fluency in English is required, fluency in Finnish is highly valued and other language skills are considered an asset." On their flights to HKG and SIN you don't get service in Finnish/Swedish at all. I haven't heard much complaints but I wonder what would the French passengers say if they didn't get service in French on AF ;)


That is very interesting, you would think on all flights Finnish announcements would be made.

Did they change the Finnish language requirement because they where having a hard time recruiting Finnish speakers?


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MareBorealis
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 6:45 am

chepos wrote:

Did they change the Finnish language requirement because they where having a hard time recruiting Finnish speakers?


Yes, they have been very active hiring new people lately, must be harder now than in the past when the contracts were more attractive. They are especially interested in hiring HEL based cabin crew members who speak Asian languages, to work both on SH and LH routes. Most of their LH flights to Asia already have outsourced cabin crew members, typically 2-3 each. HKG and SIN are fully outsourced, for savings.
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 6:52 am

Oh Canada, sometimes you seem like the greatest nation on the planet, and at other times you seem like nothing but a puppet for France.
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jamsco99
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 7:23 am

ual763 wrote:
CarlosSi wrote:
I mean surely most people who speak French in Canada are bilingual, no?


Yeah, they are. Some of the French ones pretend like to pretend that they don’t, but they do. I’ve had some absolutely refuse to speak English to me as an American on a recent trip to Quebec City. I was treated better in Paris than I was in Quebec (specifically Quebec City, Montreal was fine). Never had a problem anywhere else in Canada.


I know lots of people in quebec who dont speak a word of english.

The bilingual people you encountered probably just didnt like arrogant Americans
 
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Francoflier
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 7:23 am

Super80Fan wrote:
Oh Canada, sometimes you seem like the greatest nation on the planet, and at other times you seem like nothing but a puppet for France.


What has France got to do with this? :confused:

French Canadians are very eager to defend their language and cultural heritage, which is understandable to an extent given that they are a minority on a continent largely dominated by English-spoken culture.
Some are even... uh... extremely eager, like this couple. Though one wonders whether they were in to make a quick buck.

The French don't really have that problem and are happy to integrate English as part of their daily vocabulary. In fact, more and more French people speak English nowadays.
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smi0006
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 8:14 am

mjoelnir wrote:
That poor poor airline. They broke the law and get fined. :sarcastic:

A lot of you posters, that bash every passenger for not following all the arcane fine print rules of the airlines, get overly exited when an airline is fined for breaking the law.

When the Canadian law says that Air Canada has to have a French speaking F/A on every flight, than A/F just simply has to do it. Pay F/A's, that speak several languages, considerable more and you will find enough multilingual employees and the problem will solve itself.


Yeah I full agreed with yourselves and a number of posters - this fine is purely for stupidity of AC, they know the law, it’s not complex, all their employees would be aware of it. They should have a simple check of all signage to ensure it bilingual at the time of pre-production approval. Done.

I do think all Canadian airlines should be treated equally and all should need to be compliant to this law however. Simply cost of doing business in canada.
 
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Aquila3
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 9:35 am

TTailedTiger wrote:
ACs should pay them and then blacklist them from flying in the future.

For the same reason they must speak French, I think that they cannot do it.
They want to bear the Flag, so no petty revenges.
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NLDru
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 9:59 am

The signs at Schiphol are only in English. KLM's safety video is also only spoken in English. Although the Dutch speak English very well, English is not their mother tongue.

By the way, it looks a bit like Brussels and Wallonia. In Brussels and Wallonia they speak mainly French, but they do not want or cannot speak Dutch. However, the Flemish speak Dutch and French.
 
Thibault973
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 10:53 am

NLDru wrote:
The signs at Schiphol are only in English. KLM's safety video is also only spoken in English. Although the Dutch speak English very well, English is not their mother tongue.

By the way, it looks a bit like Brussels and Wallonia. In Brussels and Wallonia they speak mainly French, but they do not want or cannot speak Dutch. However, the Flemish speak Dutch and French.


I have never in my life met a Flemish that could speak French. Ever.

Now back on topic. Is anyone going to mention the fact that AC is a Quebecer company, being HQed in Montreal. The sole official language of Quebec is French.
 
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LaunchDetected
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 11:03 am

Dura Lex Sed Lex. The native english speakers will not understand this situation, but language must be defended.

But 20K€ seriously? This fine must be payed to the State.
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longhauler
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:23 pm

mjoelnir wrote:
That poor poor airline. They broke the law and get fined. :sarcastic:

A lot of you posters, that bash every passenger for not following all the arcane fine print rules of the airlines, get overly exited when an airline is fined for breaking the law.

When the Canadian law says that Air Canada has to have a French speaking F/A on every flight, than A/F just simply has to do it. Pay F/A's, that speak several languages, considerable more and you will find enough multilingual employees and the problem will solve itself.


I don't think anyone is bemoaning the "fine", more the mechanics of it.

Namely ... was it a "fine"? The proceeds of the "fine" did not go to a governing body, but to an opportunistic couple who were so stressed with having to look at an English word during their flight, that they require money in exchange. If it were a "fine", it would make more sense in that yes, laws were broken. And ... the proceeds of the "fine" could go toward alleviating the problem in the future. But as noted ... that is not what happened.

In fact, every time this couple finds other "tidbits" in which to complain one has to roll their eyes. (The "lift" on the seat belt buckle and ordering a drink by its marketing name and not "Sept Haut", is just the mere tip of the iceberg.)

The terms of the ACPPA arise every now and then, but to best capabilities, are followed.

Flights are cancelled as the Bilingue F/A was called away and passengers are placed on the (English speaking only) flight of Westjet. Employees are hired by region not capability. A pilot base exists where flying does not exist. etc. etc. etc. The main intent of the ACPPA was to keep Air Canada's corporate headquarters in Quebec during a time when Bill 101 and the threat of separatism had large corporations fleeing the province like rats off a sinking ship.

Air Canada has gladly kept its headquarters in Quebec and had grown its operation there.

What may have made sense in the 1980s now appears a little dated. When the issue of the ACPPA is raised and relief sought, the request is denied. But ... let's face it, in a business of razor sharp margins, it gives other airlines in Canada an edge.
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blueflyer
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Re: Air Canada fined for not using French language

Sat Aug 31, 2019 12:29 pm

longhauler wrote:
Also understand this is the same couple that complained about not being able to order “7 Up” in French. (And won).

Seriously?!? How do you order a 7 Up in Quebec? Even Parisians know they'd be ridiculed for trying to order a Sept Up! I may have to try next time I'm in Montreal just to see what happens...


Lufthansa wrote:
I agree in a bilingual country both languages must be considered, as it is in many other parts of the world.

Give Canada credit where it's due. I can think of several European regions with their own official language fighting tooth and nail through legislative and judicial means to pretend other official languages of their respective countries do not exist. They'll go so far as to deny you access to government services if you happen to make your request in an official language that is not the region's preferred.


steveinbc wrote:
But there's an official language act that essentially states that if you're a natural French speaker then you should have equal access to services in your language. Air Canada is part of that service as a legacy if its government ownership. The airline has greatly benefited from government largesses over decades and therefore I think this aspect is part and parcel of the advantages that the cost relationship provides Air Canada.

And all that is fair and proper, however in order to be awarded damages, they should prove actual damages... If the airline is to be fined for contravening a public law, the fine should go to the government's coffers, not private purses.


Dominion301 wrote:
France French has a lot of English loan words like parking and stop that aren’t used in Canadian French...which itself does have English loan words that largely differ from France.

Not to mention that the Quebec French can be at times so full of Americanism that reverting to English may be easier for someone who learned their French outside of Canada...


NLDru wrote:
By the way, it looks a bit like Brussels and Wallonia. In Brussels and Wallonia they speak mainly French, but they do not want or cannot speak Dutch. However, the Flemish speak Dutch and French.

Thibault973 wrote:
I have never in my life met a Flemish that could speak French. Ever.

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
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