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mercure1
Posts: 4884
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Sun Aug 16, 2020 2:35 am

Speedalive wrote:
What's taking CX so long to announce redundancies? Every other major carrier around the world has been quick to react and shrink to the optimal level, but over in HK, it's like CX is paralyzed and not sure what to do. Do they know something the others don't, or are they banking on a quicker recovery?


They don't really need to. As posted prior in this thread more than 25,000 of its 33,000 group employees are on unpaid leaves of absence already.

https://hksar.org/unpaid-leave-for-more ... challenges
.
mercure f-wtcc
 
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zeke
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Sun Aug 16, 2020 3:12 pm

Speedalive wrote:
What's taking CX so long to announce redundancies? Every other major carrier around the world has been quick to react and shrink to the optimal level, but over in HK, it's like CX is paralyzed and not sure what to do. Do they know something the others don't, or are they banking on a quicker recovery?


Care to cite the reference for “Every other major carrier around the world has been quick to react and shrink to the optimal level” ?
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
gabep
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Sun Aug 16, 2020 4:26 pm

zeke wrote:
Speedalive wrote:
What's taking CX so long to announce redundancies? Every other major carrier around the world has been quick to react and shrink to the optimal level, but over in HK, it's like CX is paralyzed and not sure what to do. Do they know something the others don't, or are they banking on a quicker recovery?


Care to cite the reference for “Every other major carrier around the world has been quick to react and shrink to the optimal level” ?


This reply is NOT in support of his thesis, but you ARE aware of the dire condition of the industry. Major and minor actors have announced redundancies, and have or will take action after government subsidies run dry. The problem is further exacerbated by the fact that the worlds largest economy (by nominal GDP) has failed utterly at stanching the COVID tide.

How many jobs are airlines cutting due to coronavirus?

Jobs Are Being Wiped Out at Airlines, And There’s Worse to Come

The 'tsunami' of airline job losses has begun in Europe. US carriers could be next

‘Personnel overhang’: All the job cuts each airline has announced so far

The coronavirus outbreak has triggered unprecedented mass layoffs and furloughs. Here are the major companies that have announced they are downsizing their workforces.

Gabep
 
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zeke
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Sun Aug 16, 2020 6:28 pm

gabep wrote:
This reply is NOT in support of his thesis, but you ARE aware of the dire condition of the industry. Major and minor actors have announced redundancies, and have or will take action after government subsidies run dry. The problem is further exacerbated by the fact that the worlds largest economy (by nominal GDP) has failed utterly at stanching the COVID tide.


Of course I am aware, but my point was the claim that “every other airline has been quick to react and shrink“. It’s a completely false statement, not every airline has put off staff, some have even expended.

CX is not flying anywhere near the number of PX flights as we did same time 12 months ago, however we are still doing short, medium, long, and ULH PX flying at a much reduced schedule. We are also doing a lot of cargo, with a record set during COVID.

Unlike a lot of other airlines, CX has been through SARS, GFC, and now this. The measures that the airline has already taken and timeline for things going forward have been made public in various investor briefings which are available on the company website. I see some slides from one of them posted just above,
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
musapapaya
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Sun Aug 16, 2020 8:15 pm

CX surely has the most complicated situation to resolve on top of covid, and most of them could be related to elements involving politics and how the economy is going to survive with the backdrop of China vs USA and the sanctions going forward.
 
Speedalive
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:48 pm

zeke wrote:
Speedalive wrote:
What's taking CX so long to announce redundancies? Every other major carrier around the world has been quick to react and shrink to the optimal level, but over in HK, it's like CX is paralyzed and not sure what to do. Do they know something the others don't, or are they banking on a quicker recovery?


Care to cite the reference for “Every other major carrier around the world has been quick to react and shrink to the optimal level” ?

:roll: You’re right. Let me amend that statement to say “a concerning amount of other major airlines i.e. BA, VS, US3, ME3, AC, WS, etc. of which, CX competes with directly or indirectly have laid off, or are planning to lay off staff when government subsidies cease to be paid” Hopefully you can now answer the question without harping on the semantics...

You’ve got to be kidding if you think the increased cargo charter flights are enough to offset the reduced pax flights and consequent reduced crewing needs. Many of my friends flying at CX, especially on the 777 fleet, are sitting twisting their thumbs with an empty roster and waiting anxiously for the announcement in September. I guess a better question is, is there any reason at all to not worry about layoffs? This is much worse than SARS, 9/11, etc. The statement that CX survived all that means nothing because they’ve never hit an obstacle quite like this one. It really doesn’t help that they were already running into trouble with the geopolitical situation.
 
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zeke
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Tue Aug 18, 2020 4:09 pm

Speedalive wrote:
You’re right. Let me amend that statement to say “a concerning amount of other major airlines i.e. BA, VS, US3, ME3, AC, WS, etc. of which, CX competes with directly or indirectly have laid off, or are planning to lay off staff when government subsidies cease to be paid” Hopefully you can now answer the question without harping on the semantics...


But that is very different to what you initially claimed, you said every airline except CX has already contracted almost immediately by laying off staff. Most in reality have not been doing that, they have progressively looking at ways to cut staff costs. No airline could have know, or still knows how long this will go on for.

A large number of CX staff have taken no pay leave, they have close some bases, and stood down other crew on bases. At no stage has CX stated that they will do nothing further.

Speedalive wrote:
Many of my friends flying at CX, especially on the 777 fleet, are sitting twisting their thumbs with an empty roster and waiting anxiously for the announcement in September.


What your friends are experiencing is not an indicator of what everyone is doing, I am still flying full rosters every month. I am actually finding these times more fatiguing than normal with the additional testing and isolation that I have to go through.

Speedalive wrote:
I guess a better question is, is there any reason at all to not worry about layoffs?


The company has already made some staff reductions, and has made public statements (copy of the slide posted above on this thread) that the size of the company going forward will be recommended to the board in the fourth quarter. They have already announced the additional aircraft retirements.

The reality of what has been happening is different to what you tried to portray.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
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hongkongflyer
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Tue Aug 18, 2020 4:10 pm

Speedalive wrote:
What's taking CX so long to announce redundancies? Every other major carrier around the world has been quick to react and shrink to the optimal level, but over in HK, it's like CX is paralyzed and not sure what to do. Do they know something the others don't, or are they banking on a quicker recovery?


They received a city-wide subsidiaries from Gov in exchange for no redundancies until the end of Sep 2020.
News said that they are looking at 1/3 cut in Oct 2020.
 
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zeke
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Tue Aug 18, 2020 4:55 pm

hongkongflyer wrote:
News said that they are looking at 1/3 cut in Oct 2020.


That is an unconfirmed rumour, confirmation was sought in this article. I suspect anything will remain unconfirmed until approved by the board.

“Cathay Pacific said it does not respond to rumors of layoffs”

https://hk.on.cc/hk/bkn/cnt/news/202008 ... lhgegGqGfg
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Wed Sep 09, 2020 4:06 am

Sounds like 50% of the fleet might be placed in long term desert storage.

Cathay Pacific planning to ship up to half its fleet to desert as aviation industry struggles
https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/tra ... eet-desert?
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
peterinlisbon
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:10 pm

I still feel a lot of nostalgia for CX because back in the day I flew on their 747 into the old Kai Tak airport when Hong Kong was still a British colony. HK used to be a gateway to China and a gateway to Taiwan, but now with direct flights their importance as a hub has diminished. Hong Kong is still a great city and CX is a great airline, but they have to be realistic about what is possible. The city itself will always have a certain level of demand and (being relatively wealthy) they can charge a premium for direct flights, but I think it's hard for them to be competitive for connecting traffic.
 
itisi
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:36 pm

CX have stored 5 x 330 and 9 x 773 in Alice Springs. Next is more A330's to Europe and more 777's to Alice Springs....
737-300/400/500 ... are NOT classics :)
 
VRHNM
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Wed Sep 09, 2020 4:28 pm

There are rumours that a number of KA A330s and A320/1 aircraft may be subject to early retirement and sent to Tarbes in the coming months..
 
zakuivcustom
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Fri Sep 11, 2020 3:17 pm

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/tra ... age-relief

Layoffs are coming as CX group decided to forgo more COVID-19 relief.

I am not surprise, no matter how much government money is being sinked into CX, they will have to downsized one way or another with no end in sight for border restrictions.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Mon Sep 14, 2020 5:20 am

CX confirms 72 aircraft will be put into overseas storage.

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/tra ... rounds-two

August load factor for the airline was a mere 19.9%!

Hong Kong International Airport handled 84,000 passengers in August, down from July’s 96,000 travellers. It has seen a 98.6 per cent decline from the same period last year
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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mercure1
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Mon Sep 21, 2020 5:14 pm

Hong Kong Civil Aviation Department (CAD) had suspended Cathay Dragon Hong Kong-Kuala Lumpur traffic rights for two weeks after five people aboard KA735 from Kuala Lumpur tested positive to COVID-19. The carrier’s Hong Kong-Kuala Lumpur flights will resume on October 3.

https://www.businesstraveller.com/busin ... la-lumpur/
mercure f-wtcc
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Mon Sep 21, 2020 8:48 pm

LAXintl wrote:
CX confirms 72 aircraft will be put into overseas storage.

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/tra ... rounds-two

August load factor for the airline was a mere 19.9%!

Hong Kong International Airport handled 84,000 passengers in August, down from July’s 96,000 travellers. It has seen a 98.6 per cent decline from the same period last year

Ouch. My heart goes out to those in the industry.

I do not believe CX will be the only one doing this. Until people rebuild their savings, splurge vacations are, in my opinion, on hold for most.
This will slam new aircraft demand.

Lightsaber
Winter is coming.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Tue Sep 22, 2020 4:36 pm

Sign of the times

CX will offer a 12-week 777-300ER cargo run to Pittsburgh!

Flights will operate between Ho Chi Minh with stop in Hong Kong before arrival at Pittsburgh.

https://www.stattimes.com/news/cathay-p ... cargo/amp/
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
itisi
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Tue Sep 22, 2020 11:51 pm

B-HLH A330 arriving in LHR this morning (23rd) from DWC, retirement flight. Dropping cargo at LHR then off to Spain.

B-HLF to follow tomorrow
737-300/400/500 ... are NOT classics :)
 
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75driver
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Wed Sep 23, 2020 2:31 pm

Had an interesting zoom chat with one of my closest friends who went the expat route with Cathay many years ago. He wanted the adventure of living in HK and has loved it but he thinks the airline might have the highest percentage of unneeded pilots industry wide. He said approx 3500 are on property when in his view they only need half that number and maybe as few as 25% over the next few months/year or two. He said there is quite the internal tussle between senior pilots unwilling to accept pay cuts to keep junior crew employed vs those juniors who are fighting to save their jobs. He worries about the climate and if a decision will be made for them. Pilot group contracts seem to have minimal impact in HK’s current situation. He’s thinking a merger/absorption/restructure of Cathay is imminent. I’m thinking Cathay as we knew it might be gone forever. Maybe they turn into another mainland carrier or become a government owned flag carrier? We’ll see what happens but for decades Cathay was considered THE plum job and living in an exotic and exciting HK highly desirable. Not so much now.
 
andrew1996
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Wed Sep 23, 2020 7:28 pm

LAXintl wrote:
Sign of the times

CX will offer a 12-week 777-300ER cargo run to Pittsburgh!

Flights will operate between Ho Chi Minh with stop in Hong Kong before arrival at Pittsburgh.

https://www.stattimes.com/news/cathay-p ... cargo/amp/


Why does it orginate in Ho Chi Minh and not HKG? Will the flight get connecting cargo or drop of cargo in HKG for connections? Is it dependent on trucking routes once the cargo reaches USA to get to other parts of USA/Canada?
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:37 pm

andrew1996 wrote:

Why does it orginate in Ho Chi Minh and not HKG? Will the flight get connecting cargo or drop of cargo in HKG for connections? Is it dependent on trucking routes once the cargo reaches USA to get to other parts of USA/Canada?


Its essentially a charter on behalf of Unique Logistics who purchased the capacity on behalf of a single fashion apparel retailer bringing product to the U.S.

Unique also chartered dozens of other such flights in the coming weeks to EWR, LAX, and ORD on BR, EK, PR and N8 originating in Vietnam.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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albertocsc
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:35 pm

itisi wrote:
B-HLH A330 arriving in LHR this morning (23rd) from DWC, retirement flight. Dropping cargo at LHR then off to Spain.

B-HLF to follow tomorrow


Yes, today B-HLH arrived to CQM, and for tomorrow we are expecting B-HLF together with an A320 from Cathay Dragon (B-HSG).
 
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ChrisNH38
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:08 pm

No sign of Boston coming back; CX did so well there...I thought.
https://my.flightradar24.com/ChrisNH
 
USAirALB
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:40 pm

ChrisNH38 wrote:
No sign of Boston coming back; CX did so well there...I thought.

No US destination is going to come back right now outside of LAX/SFO/JFK.

CX has BOS scheduled to resume Winter 2021 with an 77W.

The only US destination that I could see being eliminated would be Dulles.
RJ85, F70, E135, E140, E145, E70, E75, E90, CR2, CR7, CR9, 717, 732, 733, 734, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 744ER, 752, 753, 762, 772, 77E, 77W, 789, 319, 320, 321, 332, 333, 343, 359, 388
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:15 pm

CX like other airlines has retrenched to their core routes.
Indeed in the U.S. this has meant JFK, LAX and SFO which are planned to see 7, 14 and 7 weekly frequencies for the W20 season.

CX has done similar in Europe, with historic the LHR link the only market getting daily service, while AMS, CDG and FRA only receive 2x weekly flights each and the dozen other previously served markets seeing no flights at all.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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75driver
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Thu Sep 24, 2020 6:09 pm

Some interesting news on the employment front.

https://hk.appledaily.com/news/20200924 ... Z5T26JCNE/

“Cathay pilots ‘suggest half-pay’ to pre-empt job cuts”

“ The arrangement, dubbed “Half Pay Leave Scheme,” can last till the end of next year, in the suggestion made by the Hong Kong Aircrew Officers Association, which represents pilots of Cathay Pacific and its sister airline Cathay Dragon, according to a source. It may save the beleaguered Cathay HK$145 million (US$18.7 million), or 20% of its annual salary expenditure. No further details were available.”
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Tue Sep 29, 2020 5:52 pm

SCMP got an interview with CX CEO.

Says airline will "soon" move to rationalize and restructure with network and fleet adjustments. Mass layoffs also possible as soon as next month.
Additionally CX reviewing its none core assets for possible sale

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/tra ... et-noncore
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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mercure1
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Sat Oct 03, 2020 5:07 pm

Restructure plan looking at areas such as aircraft design, ratio of economy to business class seats as Covid-19 reshapes travel habits and the airline industry.

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/tra ... t-business?
mercure f-wtcc
 
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75driver
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Sat Oct 03, 2020 6:56 pm

I can’t see Cathay making it out of this mess without a major makeover or getting absorbed/combined/assimilated into or with another carrier. Management has been dancing around staffing for months and the pilot groups standing is about to be non-existent. From the article:

“ The CEO admitted to a staff surplus, in the biggest hint yet that redundancies were likely.”

Chek Lap Kok might be the hardest hit airport in the world as it relates to passenger traffic. They’ve been running 1-2% of previous levels for months which is obviously unsustainable. Cathay is looking to have the steepest road to recovery. Pretty grim outlook.
 
na
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CX sends 6 77Ws to the desert

Sat Oct 03, 2020 8:43 pm

https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=3

Six Cathay 777-300ERs have been ferried to the Australian desert for longterm storage over the past few days.
 
9w748capt
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Sun Oct 04, 2020 1:25 am

Nothing of substance to add but just so sad what is happening to CX and HK. Glad I got to fly CX J and F a few times as who knows when life will ever be "normal" again.
 
Runway28L
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Sat Oct 10, 2020 4:13 pm

Anyone know how many B77Ws CX has converted for freight ops? Apologies if this has been answered here before.
 
airzona11
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Sat Oct 10, 2020 10:08 pm

The events in HKG preCovid already shook the market, now with Covid and the HKG China relationship, we probably saw the high watemark overall and certainly a less premium operation what it all shakes out. Consolidation across brands and heavier Y class focus is my take.
 
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CarbonFibre
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Mon Oct 12, 2020 7:05 pm

Three more A330s heading to CQM via DXB. Will they use LHR as well like the previous two?
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Mon Oct 19, 2020 10:44 pm

Cathay Pacific Group put out press release with updated outlook.


“After carefully studying numerous scenarios facing the industry and our airlines, we expect we will be operating approximately 10% of our pre-pandemic passenger flight capacity for the rest of 2020 and under 50% for overall 2021.
“Among the multiple scenarios studied, this one is already the most optimistic that we can responsibly adopt at this moment. We assume we will be operating well below a quarter of pre-pandemic capacity in the first half of next year but will see a recovery in the second half of the year – only assuming the vaccines currently under development prove to be effective and are widely adopted in our key markets by summer 2021.


https://news.cathaypacific.com/cathay-p ... ember-2020
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
blooc350
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Tue Oct 20, 2020 4:31 am

75driver wrote:
I can’t see Cathay making it out of this mess without a major makeover or getting absorbed/combined/assimilated into or with another carrier.


CX will never get absorbed into another airline. Their brand is too powerful and they are still regarded as one of the top airlines in the world.
 
Guillaume787
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Tue Oct 20, 2020 11:07 am

CX to reduce workforce by 25% and retire Cathay Dragon sister airline brand. Unconfirmed reports but announcement might come on Wednesday:

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/tra ... -brand-bid
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Tue Oct 20, 2020 3:07 pm

25% still seems like a pretty timid move considering the length and severity of the downturn for CX. Shame on Dragon, I always liked that unique brand.

In September passengers carried were down 98.1%!
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
JeremyXWB
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Tue Oct 20, 2020 4:13 pm

So does that mean that KA will essentially suffer the same fate as SilkAir?
 
Fortress11
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Tue Oct 20, 2020 4:53 pm

Guillaume787 wrote:
CX to reduce workforce by 25% and retire Cathay Dragon sister airline brand. Unconfirmed reports but announcement might come on Wednesday:

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/tra ... -brand-bid


Maybe I read the article differently, but they agreed to scale it back 25% from their original plan (8,000 to 6,000) which accounts for an 18% overall reduction and not 25%.
 
Ishrion
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Official: Cathay Dragon Ceases Operations + Cathay Pacific Restructuring

Wed Oct 21, 2020 12:09 am

The Cathay Pacific Group has officially announced Cathay Dragon will cease operations immediately. Routes will be taken over by Cathay Pacific and HK Express.

Other restructuring changes include reducing approximately 8,500 positions across the entire Group, asking Hong Kong-based cabin and cockpit crew members of Cathay Pacific to agree to changes in their conditions of service, and executives will continue to receive pay cuts through 2021.

Cash burn is at HK$1.5-2 billion per month. These changes will reduce cash burn by HK$500 million per month.

https://news.cathaypacific.com/cathay-p ... tructuring
 
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Antaras
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Re: Official: Cathay Dragon Ceases Operations + Cathay Pacific Restructuring

Wed Oct 21, 2020 12:58 am

Ishrion wrote:
The Cathay Pacific Group has officially announced Cathay Dragon will cease operations immediately. Routes will be taken over by Cathay Pacific and HK Express.

Other restructuring changes include reducing approximately 8,500 positions across the entire Group, asking Hong Kong-based cabin and cockpit crew members of Cathay Pacific to agree to changes in their conditions of service, and executives will continue to receive pay cuts through 2021.

Cash burn is at HK$1.5-2 billion per month. These changes will reduce cash burn by HK$500 million per month.

https://news.cathaypacific.com/cathay-p ... tructuring


Will CX merge or discard the whole KA's fleet?
What will happen to KA's upcoming A321neos?
If you disagree with my statement, assume that it was just a joke :duck:
 
BHRN
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Re: Official: Cathay Dragon Ceases Operations + Cathay Pacific Restructuring

Wed Oct 21, 2020 1:05 am

Antaras wrote:
Ishrion wrote:

Will CX merge or discard the whole KA's fleet?
What will happen to KA's upcoming A321neos?


It's time for the older A330s to go anyway...while the newer ones can easily to absorbed back into CX mainline. A few of KA's current A330s are actually owned by CX.

The narrow bodies can be taken over by UO...or maybe we will finally see the first CX narrowbody in decades.
 
Ishrion
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Re: Official: Cathay Dragon Ceases Operations + Cathay Pacific Restructuring

Wed Oct 21, 2020 1:17 am

Antaras wrote:
Ishrion wrote:
The Cathay Pacific Group has officially announced Cathay Dragon will cease operations immediately. Routes will be taken over by Cathay Pacific and HK Express.

Other restructuring changes include reducing approximately 8,500 positions across the entire Group, asking Hong Kong-based cabin and cockpit crew members of Cathay Pacific to agree to changes in their conditions of service, and executives will continue to receive pay cuts through 2021.

Cash burn is at HK$1.5-2 billion per month. These changes will reduce cash burn by HK$500 million per month.

https://news.cathaypacific.com/cathay-p ... tructuring


Will CX merge or discard the whole KA's fleet?
What will happen to KA's upcoming A321neos?


HK Express and Cathay Dragon each have 16 A321neos on order.

Logically, Cathay Dragon's order will be transferred to HK Express.
 
leyland1989
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Wed Oct 21, 2020 1:32 am

Given the downsizing trend in the coming years,
I can see the A321/A321neo have a place in Cathay's fleet.

Older A320/A321 are going to retire, perhaps some will get transfer over to UO

There has been a lot of overlapping between CX and KA anyway.
They used to be two independent company and are competitors, mostly on Mainland China and SEA routes.

Since CX had acquired KA, KA has become CX's regional division focusing on mainland china and supplementing secondary regional routes which are too thin to fill CX's smallest plane (A330).
Although UO target the leisure market, it provides some extra capacity on thinner routes, filling some secondary markets. KA kind of sandwich between the two... I wouldn't say it's redundant,
CX kept the "Dragonair" branding because of its provenance in the chinese market, but after all these year operating as "Cathay Dragon", they have finally decided to retire the dragon from its "shark fin".

I don't see any reasons why Cathay cannot keep the A321 around flying under its banner, there are still routes that are too thin to fill an A330, especially given the current climate.
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zakuivcustom
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Re: Official: Cathay Dragon Ceases Operations + Cathay Pacific Restructuring

Wed Oct 21, 2020 1:33 am

Ishrion wrote:
Antaras wrote:
Ishrion wrote:
The Cathay Pacific Group has officially announced Cathay Dragon will cease operations immediately. Routes will be taken over by Cathay Pacific and HK Express.

Other restructuring changes include reducing approximately 8,500 positions across the entire Group, asking Hong Kong-based cabin and cockpit crew members of Cathay Pacific to agree to changes in their conditions of service, and executives will continue to receive pay cuts through 2021.

Cash burn is at HK$1.5-2 billion per month. These changes will reduce cash burn by HK$500 million per month.

https://news.cathaypacific.com/cathay-p ... tructuring


Will CX merge or discard the whole KA's fleet?
What will happen to KA's upcoming A321neos?


HK Express and Cathay Dragon each have 16 A321neos on order.

Logically, Cathay Dragon's order will be transferred to HK Express.


Per some HK sources (in Chinese) CX Group is looking to transfer most KA routes to UO. So those narrowbodies are likely going to UO.

Otherwise, the layoff is not surprising. CX is being hurt badly like SQ as they got absolutely zero domestic market that some other airlines can at least fall back on.
 
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Antaras
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Re: Official: Cathay Dragon Ceases Operations + Cathay Pacific Restructuring

Wed Oct 21, 2020 2:22 am

zakuivcustom wrote:
Ishrion wrote:
Antaras wrote:

Will CX merge or discard the whole KA's fleet?
What will happen to KA's upcoming A321neos?


HK Express and Cathay Dragon each have 16 A321neos on order.

Logically, Cathay Dragon's order will be transferred to HK Express.


Per some HK sources (in Chinese) CX Group is looking to transfer most KA routes to UO. So those narrowbodies are likely going to UO.

Otherwise, the layoff is not surprising. CX is being hurt badly like SQ as they got absolutely zero domestic market that some other airlines can at least fall back on.


I am expecting all the NEO (and some A330s I guess) would go to CX, as CX requires a higher-class service so the NEO would be beautiful for them.
Meanwhile, UO can receive some young A320s from KA (B-HSU, *HST, *HSQ, and *HSR aging from 7.8 to 8.7 years old, relatively young).

=================================================================================

I just notice that while UO is operating Pratt-GTF engines on the NEOs (-271N) while KA would receive some CFM-LEAP powered A321-251NX. Is it a big maintenance problem when the same group has to maintain two different engine types? Will the CX Group completely drop one type and jump to the other type?
If you disagree with my statement, assume that it was just a joke :duck:
 
filipinoavgeek
Posts: 499
Joined: Mon Mar 04, 2019 1:18 am

Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Wed Oct 21, 2020 2:40 am

I do wonder if retiring Dragon only happened because of the pandemic, or if was something that had been considered since last year during the whole downturn in HKG traffic.
RIP 9V-SKA
2007 - 2019
 
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Antaras
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Re: Cathay Pacific News and Discussion thread

Wed Oct 21, 2020 2:49 am

filipinoavgeek wrote:
I do wonder if retiring Dragon only happened because of the pandemic, or if was something that had been considered since last year during the whole downturn in HKG traffic.

If CX really wanted to scrap KA from last year then it wouldn't spend millions of dollar to just rebrand Dragonair to Cathay Dragon (I mean, the re-painting cost is so expensive, isn't it. Remember that the group had to repaint some 40 airframes.
If you disagree with my statement, assume that it was just a joke :duck:
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