Antarius
Topic Author
Posts: 1723
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 1:27 pm

Drastically different routings

Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:01 pm

I am currently on https://flightaware.com/live/flight/AAL380 and my coworker is on https://flightaware.com/live/flight/SWA ... /KMDW/KLGA

Both flights from Chicago (mine from ORD and theirs from MDW) headed to LGA that left within 20 minutes of each other. Why are the routings so wildly different? We are taking a tour of the Carolinas while the WN flight is dipping south to avoid the WX but otherwise continuing on in a straight route.
2019: SIN HKG NRT DFW IAH HOU CLT LGA JFK SFO SJC EWR SNA EYW MIA BOG LAX ORD DTW OAK PVG BOS DCA IAD ATL LAS BIS CUN PHX OAK SYD CVG PHL MAD ORY CDG SLC SJU BQN MHT YYZ STS BIS DOH BLR KTM MFM MEX MSY BWI DEN
 
PSAatSAN4Ever
Posts: 848
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2018 5:38 pm

Re: Drastically different routings

Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:15 pm

I know that SQ's SIN-EWR flights always flew east to take advantage of winds, and this is true for West Coast USA - Europe flights as well.

As far as weather-avoidance routes, I know this is up to the individual airline, but beyond that, I can't answer.
 
alasizon
Posts: 1944
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:57 pm

Re: Drastically different routings

Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:29 pm

Sequencing and opening/closing of routes into the NYC airspace can play a big role. Certain routes will open and close as the storms move around and that difference can be as little as 10 minutes. It was a 30+ minute difference in take-off time so its certainly possible that the route WN is taking wasn't available when AA took off.
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Antarius
Topic Author
Posts: 1723
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 1:27 pm

Re: Drastically different routings

Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:35 pm

alasizon wrote:
Sequencing and opening/closing of routes into the NYC airspace can play a big role. Certain routes will open and close as the storms move around and that difference can be as little as 10 minutes. It was a 30+ minute difference in take-off time so its certainly possible that the route WN is taking wasn't available when AA took off.


Makes sense. Thanks!

Had seen divergent routings before, but the degree of this one really piqued my curiosity.
2019: SIN HKG NRT DFW IAH HOU CLT LGA JFK SFO SJC EWR SNA EYW MIA BOG LAX ORD DTW OAK PVG BOS DCA IAD ATL LAS BIS CUN PHX OAK SYD CVG PHL MAD ORY CDG SLC SJU BQN MHT YYZ STS BIS DOH BLR KTM MFM MEX MSY BWI DEN
 
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jetblastdubai
Posts: 1867
Joined: Sun Aug 18, 2013 10:23 am

Re: Drastically different routings

Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:00 pm

Antarius wrote:
Why are the routings so wildly different?


Looking at the filed routes (by company dispatchers) AA filed over BVT234014, which would be an initial south routing out of the Chicago terminal area. WN filed over GIJ, which is an east fix out of the terminal area. Once you're established either south or east of Chicago, it's a little tricky maneuvering back to the other area and cris-crossing the arrival stream into Chicago.

Dispatchers might have different criteria for filing flight plans to avoid certain weather areas or avoiding forecast congested ATC sectors.

Having worked ORD ATC for years, it's also possible that the Center (ZAU or ZOB) placed some in-trail restrictions on GIJ traffic out of the area and it was actually faster for AA to depart on a south track and fly a longer route instead of waiting on the ground in line with a handful of other GIJ jets ahead of them. There could be any number of reason for the routing.
Every zoo is a petting zoo......if you're a man!
 
rbretas
Posts: 51
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2016 10:21 am

Re: Drastically different routings

Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:56 am

How about such a long detour depending on the direction on a route this short?
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ANA ... /RJTT/RJNT
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ANA ... /RJNT/RJTT

And that pattern have been stable for years. Is it because of the approach in HND or to avoid the alps? I have always been curious about that.
 
eamondzhang
Posts: 1349
Joined: Thu Sep 23, 2010 8:23 am

Re: Drastically different routings

Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:13 am

rbretas wrote:
How about such a long detour depending on the direction on a route this short?
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ANA ... /RJTT/RJNT
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ANA ... /RJNT/RJTT

And that pattern have been stable for years. Is it because of the approach in HND or to avoid the alps? I have always been curious about that.

The way HND is set up for arrival plus there was a bit in the middle where there's no civil flight path AFAIK. For HND arrival it's either from North (as shown in the routing from TOJ) or from the South - which would be a even bigger detour given they also can't fly over Mt. Fuji.

Michael
 
Scarebus34
Posts: 381
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:54 pm

Re: Drastically different routings

Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:17 am

It's all due to our horribly inefficient ATC system...

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