anrec80
Topic Author
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DL YVR - SEA runs

Sat Sep 14, 2019 9:37 pm

Today I am traveling to YVR via SEA, and noticed that they are putting 739 on this 1 hour hop, even though you normally would expect (and I flew before) something like E175/195. Is this short run doing so well for DL that they found it’s worth a mainline aircraft?
 
Ishrion
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sat Sep 14, 2019 9:42 pm

Alaska Airlines also operates a 737-900 on the route. It's a rather popular route with quite a lot of frequencies in a day.

Also, in comparison, Alaska operates the A320/739 and Delta operates the A319 on PDX-SEA, which is 2 miles longer than YVR-SEA

Distance does not warrant aircraft.

An example... Dubai to Muscat on the Emirates A380. 217 miles, about 100mi longer than YVR-SEA.
 
hkcanadaexpat
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sat Sep 14, 2019 9:49 pm

its full everytime i fly it
 
77H
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sat Sep 14, 2019 10:24 pm

Ishrion wrote:
Alaska Airlines also operates a 737-900 on the route. It's a rather popular route with quite a lot of frequencies in a day.

Also, in comparison, Alaska operates the A320/739 and Delta operates the A319 on PDX-SEA, which is 2 miles longer than YVR-SEA

Distance does not warrant aircraft.

An example... Dubai to Muscat on the Emirates A380. 217 miles, about 100mi longer than YVR-SEA.


Correct. I’ve flown on a full 739 ORD-MSN which is 94 NM. Coincidently, pushback to departure out of ORD was as long wheels up to wheels down. If the demand is there, it may be more economical to fly 1 large mainline flight than 2-3 regional flights to equal the same capacity.
DL regularly operates 752s MSP-MSN which is 198 NM.

Then of course there are unique examples like WN operating 738s between HNL and OGG which is 87 NM.

77H
 
MIflyer12
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sat Sep 14, 2019 10:47 pm

We're approaching the end of the Alaska cruise season, with ships using Canadian ports because of the U.S. Passenger Vessels Service Act. Don't look for DL 739s on that route in November!

https://www.cruisecritic.com/articles.cfm?ID=3363
 
Cubsrule
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sat Sep 14, 2019 10:54 pm

77H wrote:
Ishrion wrote:
Alaska Airlines also operates a 737-900 on the route. It's a rather popular route with quite a lot of frequencies in a day.

Also, in comparison, Alaska operates the A320/739 and Delta operates the A319 on PDX-SEA, which is 2 miles longer than YVR-SEA

Distance does not warrant aircraft.

An example... Dubai to Muscat on the Emirates A380. 217 miles, about 100mi longer than YVR-SEA.


Correct. I’ve flown on a full 739 ORD-MSN which is 94 NM. Coincidently, pushback to departure out of ORD was as long wheels up to wheels down. If the demand is there, it may be more economical to fly 1 large mainline flight than 2-3 regional flights to equal the same capacity.
DL regularly operates 752s MSP-MSN which is 198 NM.

Then of course there are unique examples like WN operating 738s between HNL and OGG which is 87 NM.

77H


I actually think HNL-OGG isn’t a bad analog. On both it and SEA-YVR, geographic barriers lead to more O&D than one might expect given the very short mileage. Obviously, SEA-YVR is different because ground transportation is an available option, but the concept is similar.
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SyracuseAvGeek
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sat Sep 14, 2019 11:08 pm

DL frequently operates a B737-900 and sometimes a B757-200 from GRR-DTW, that route is 120mi
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32andBelow
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sat Sep 14, 2019 11:21 pm

What time of day? It’s also a technique to overnight airplanes away from Seattle due to gate constraints in SEA
 
303dk
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 2:24 am

anrec80 wrote:
Today I am traveling to YVR via SEA, and noticed that they are putting 739 on this 1 hour hop, even though you normally would expect (and I flew before) something like E175/195. Is this short run doing so well for DL that they found it’s worth a mainline aircraft?

1 hour hop? It’s more like 25 minutes
 
jetmatt777
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 3:09 am

UA runs a 739 on DEN-COS. A 70 mile flight and a 1.5 hour drive. It’s all about maximizing connections at the hub.
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SkyVoice
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 3:33 am

SyracuseAvGeek wrote:
DL frequently operates a B737-900 and sometimes a B757-200 from GRR-DTW, that route is 120mi


That is correct. I have flown into & out of GRR several times this year. Delta also flies, or has flown, an A320 on the route.
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gunsontheroof
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 3:57 am

I'll look into this when I'm back at a proper computer, but are any of the mainline AS/DL runs on SEA-YVR that are continuations of XXX-SEA flights? LAX, SFO and PHX come to mind as possibilities, but it wouldn't surprise me if the late flights are mainline just for the sake having one less airplane overnighting at SEA. The north aprons at SEA have been absolutely packed with AS/DL RONs the last few times I've taken the train into SEA for an early flight.
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behramjee
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 4:13 am

As previously stated by others on this topic thread, the YVR-SEA flights of DL AC AS are mainly filled with connecting pax rather than p2p traffic. The YVR-SEA flying time is actually 25-30 minutes but it is listed as being 1 hour due to taxi times to/from the allocated gate.

This is why JFK-IAD is listed as 1 hour 30 minute block time by DL B6 when in reality the flying time is 45-50 minutes. I’ve flown this route twice before too on B6 and UA.
 
Prost
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 4:45 am

I believe the overnight flights to Vancouver also help with the lack of aircraft parking in Seattle.
 
303dk
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 4:57 am

gunsontheroof wrote:
I'll look into this when I'm back at a proper computer, but are any of the mainline AS/DL runs on SEA-YVR that are continuations of XXX-SEA flights? LAX, SFO and PHX come to mind as possibilities, but it wouldn't surprise me if the late flights are mainline just for the sake having one less airplane overnighting at SEA. The north aprons at SEA have been absolutely packed with AS/DL RONs the last few times I've taken the train into SEA for an early flight.

You can check me, but I believe that the RON plane does YVR-SEA-ATL-MCO
 
F9LASDEN
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 5:38 am

303dk wrote:
gunsontheroof wrote:
I'll look into this when I'm back at a proper computer, but are any of the mainline AS/DL runs on SEA-YVR that are continuations of XXX-SEA flights? LAX, SFO and PHX come to mind as possibilities, but it wouldn't surprise me if the late flights are mainline just for the sake having one less airplane overnighting at SEA. The north aprons at SEA have been absolutely packed with AS/DL RONs the last few times I've taken the train into SEA for an early flight.

You can check me, but I believe that the RON plane does YVR-SEA-ATL-MCO


According to FR24, today it did YVR-SEA-ANC-SEA-LAX-MCO, and tomorrow it looks like it will be doing YVR-SEA-ATL-DEN
Spirit of the West...A Whole Different Animal...Low Fares Done Right
 
speedbird52
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 6:57 am

Isn't it more efficient to just take a bus to Vancouver? Once you factor in airport time the amount of time you save is negligible
 
hkcanadaexpat
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:10 am

speedbird52 wrote:
Isn't it more efficient to just take a bus to Vancouver? Once you factor in airport time the amount of time you save is negligible

you do realize that most passengers are connecting at one end or the other.
the average Seattle guy that goes to Vancouver (and vice versa) for the weekend takes his car.
 
ACDC8
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 8:34 am

speedbird52 wrote:
Isn't it more efficient to just take a bus to Vancouver? Once you factor in airport time the amount of time you save is negligible

2.5 hr drive and the Pacific Crossing isn't always the quickest border to get through, so, yeah, flying would still be quicker.
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RWA380
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 10:22 am

gunsontheroof wrote:
I'll look into this when I'm back at a proper computer, but are any of the mainline AS/DL runs on SEA-YVR that are continuations of XXX-SEA flights? LAX, SFO and PHX come to mind as possibilities, but it wouldn't surprise me if the late flights are mainline just for the sake having one less airplane overnighting at SEA. The north aprons at SEA have been absolutely packed with AS/DL RONs the last few times I've taken the train into SEA for an early flight.


Both AS & DL have been RON'ing mainline aircraft in out stations because of SEA's constraints for years. I think it will show in scheduling as long as each is trying to push every passenger they can through SEA to retain market share, it will be more & more mainline. DL started LAX - SEA with RJ's, now it's all mainline but one.

But AS also flies two mainline jets out of SEA to PDX between 9-11 pm. It used to get so bad with missed connections, prior full flights, weather or whatever, the last couple of Q-400's were always grossly oversold & standby demand was great also, AS started two years ago with that RON. But I think GEG & BOI all see a RON or have, RDM did earlier this year from SEA.
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kavok
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 11:22 am

The main reason is there is very minimal DL service to YVR from DL hubs not located on the west coast (MSP,DTW,even ATL). DTW is just 1x weekly for example. However there is usually at least 5 daily flights on DL between each of those MSP, DTW,ATL hubs and SEA. There are also numerous DL flights to SEA from spoke cities because SEA is now a DL hub.

So basically, rather than run a few long and thin flights from MSP,DTW,ATL, the DL plan is to send pax to SEA, and then connect them up to YVR at various times throughout the day. This makes the pax count large enough to warrant the larger planes. If you think about it, the vast majority of YVR bound pax on DL, coming from the eastern US, are connecting in SEA.
 
F9Animal
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 7:36 pm

The cruise season is another factor for needed seats.
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lugie
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 9:06 pm

AA flies mainline planes on at least one daily rotation on intra-NC hops such as CLT-ILM (usually around 35 mins flying time, 185 mi) or CLT-GSO (flight time ~20 mins, 85 mi).

Meanwhile, CLT-RDU (typically 25-30 mins, 130 mi) is all mainline with as many as 10 daily r/t on all A32x / B738
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Zortan
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 11:11 pm

YVR-SEA is popular, but there's a reason it's AS and DL putting the 737s on it rather than AC or WestJet. Connections through SEA are insanely popular for us Vancouverites, as direct flights to LAX, SFO, etc. are very pricey. The 737s are during DL's and AS's banks, as they get tons of passengers coming into/going out of SEA at those times. Other times you'll see the E175 and Q400 (E for DL and Q for AS, although we've been seeing a couple AS E175s recently), as connection opportunities are more limited.
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Weatherwatcher1
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Re: DL YVR - SEA runs

Sun Sep 15, 2019 11:32 pm

F9Animal wrote:
The cruise season is another factor for needed seats.


The flight isn’t timed for cruise traffic. It is also daily. Cruise traffic is not continuous through the week.

It’s a late arrival in YVR and early departure. It is timed so they don’t have to overnight a 737-900ER in SEA due to ramp congestion

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