720B
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Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:44 pm

Air Canada - Rouge announced year round flights between Montreal and Bogota. Flights will start on June 2020. This would be Air Canada's third non-stop service to Colombia, after Toronto-Bogota (daily) and Toronto-Cartagena (seasonal)


https://www.newswire.ca/news-releases/a ... 95908.html
 
Thenoflyzone
Posts: 2855
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 4:42 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Wed Sep 18, 2019 4:34 pm

Great add. YUL's third destination in South America (GRU will launch this December). Avianca had applied to start the route, but their recent financial troubles prevented them from doing so. AC adding it is even better. I guess the frame is coming from NCE going mainline next summer.

YUL keeps gobbling up new airlines/destinations ! We are definitely passing ATL this year in terms of international passengers handled, and at this rate, we are bound to overtake YVR in a year or two. We're not far off. We already handled more international passengers than YVR in March 2019.

2019 Half Year international passenger numbers - North American airports

1. JFK 16,446,821 (+4.5%)
2. YYZ 16,114,002 (+~ 3.4%)
3. LAX 12,537,810 (-1.0%)
4. MIA 11,408,213 (+4.7%)
5. CUN 8,995,343
6. PTY
7. MEX 8,519,587
8. SFO 7,302,001
9. EWR 6,947,478 (+3.2%)
10. ORD 6,908,165 (+4.6%)
11. YVR 6,688,626 (+3.0%)
12. ATL 6,422,853 (+1.8%)
13. YUL 6,301,228 (+7.6%)
14. IAH 5,504,972
15. DFW 4,591,841 (+7.1%)
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
Thenoflyzone
Posts: 2855
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 4:42 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:22 pm

Correction: 4th South American destination for YUL, if we count the winter seasonal TS service to Cartagena.
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
FSDan
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Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:25 pm

It'll be a 3x weekly 763 service, per the article.
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
YYZLGA
Posts: 381
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2016 4:28 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 2:35 am

It's an incredible performance for YUL. A testament to the booming Montreal economy, but I think also to YUL's ability to keep its costs per enplaned passenger low. I'd love to see a comparison with YYZ. I hope YUL will be able to keep that advantage as it expands.
 
yulexpansion
Posts: 78
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:08 pm

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 4:09 am

YYZLGA wrote:
It's an incredible performance for YUL. A testament to the booming Montreal economy, but I think also to YUL's ability to keep its costs per enplaned passenger low. I'd love to see a comparison with YYZ. I hope YUL will be able to keep that advantage as it expands.


YUL had been neglected for years before the mid-2010's. This is just the catch-up to YYZ that we're seeing as well as a management team committed to growing YUL. Keep in mind that finding gates at peak international timings is getting tougher and tougher at YUL. In S20, there are additional 1800-1900 flights to both TLS and BRU (SN) that may find themselves bumping other flights to hard stand, although I would find it hard to believe for AC to hard stand a new TLS service.
 
FabienA380
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Joined: Wed Jul 18, 2012 6:46 pm

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 7:25 am

Just a personal feeling and as we speak about YUL, I feel it's the dirtiest airport I've ever been to (340+ in my count). Greasy floors, garbage on the floor everywhere never cleaned. Yucky.
 
pipeafcr
Posts: 400
Joined: Sat Jun 13, 2009 1:47 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 8:35 am

It seems like the route was coordinated with Avianca according to the official statement: https://aircanada.mediaroom.com/2019-09-18-Air-Canada-To-Begin-Year-Round-Flights-From-Montreal-to-Bogota-Colombia

Flights are timed to optimize connectivity to and from Air Canada's extensive network at its Montreal hub. In addition, flights are timed to connect to Star Alliance partner Avianca's network to other destinations including Medellin, Cartagena, Cali, Lima, Cuzco, Guayaquil and Quito.


This route will be a success and further consolidates BOG as a major international hub for connecting passengers.
Felipe Carrillo
 
RCS763AV
Posts: 3814
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2004 1:22 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:55 am

This is great news for BOG, especially since we've lost a couple of international destinations due to AV's reorganization (MVD, BOS, BGI and ORD in the past year). We had all heard the route was in the making for some time and it's great to see it finally coming to fruition. This further consolidates YUL and BOG and prime connecting hubs in the continent.

Also, the relationship between AC and AV has been more than cordial, with a very succesful codeshare operation on BOG-YYZ, so it's only natural they're cooperating on this flight too.

Reading the press release, the flight seems geared at mostly Colombia o/d traffic, since connection times at BOG for the respective northbound international bank are +/- 4 hours, so not ideal. For the southbound bank the flight actually connects very well to SJO, GYE, UIO, LIM, LPB, VVI, SCL, CUZ and PTY within 2 to 3 hours, as per the press release. How are connection times in YUL?

Also, the current bilateral between Colombia and Canada states that there are only 7 frequencies per week for each country outside of tourism spots (namely, CTG, SMR and ADZ). I wonder when they're going to amend the treaty.
 
yulexpansion
Posts: 78
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:08 pm

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 11:01 am

FabienA380 wrote:
Just a personal feeling and as we speak about YUL, I feel it's the dirtiest airport I've ever been to (340+ in my count). Greasy floors, garbage on the floor everywhere never cleaned. Yucky.


It seems like you haven't been to any US airport.
 
jfk777
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Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 11:34 am

Is there enough traffic to support a 767 from each Toronto and Montreal ?
 
Thenoflyzone
Posts: 2855
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 4:42 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 12:04 pm

jfk777 wrote:
Is there enough traffic to support a 767 from each Toronto and Montreal ?


AC seems to think so. Quebec has a decent sized Colombian Canadian community, which from the 2011 census hovers around 60,000. That number is surely higher now. LIM is also served from both YYZ and YUL, and soon GRU will be as well. YUL-LIM was launched as 2x weekly, and has been upgraded to 3x weekly. YUL-BOG has the benefit of having Star Alliance feed on both ends and will start right away with 3x weekly service. The route should do well.
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
usflyer msp
Posts: 3417
Joined: Tue May 23, 2000 11:50 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 1:54 pm

Thenoflyzone wrote:
jfk777 wrote:
Is there enough traffic to support a 767 from each Toronto and Montreal ?


AC seems to think so. Quebec has a decent sized Colombian Canadian community, which from the 2011 census hovers around 60,000. That number is surely higher now. LIM is also served from both YYZ and YUL, and soon GRU will be as well. YUL-LIM was launched as 2x weekly, and has been upgraded to 3x weekly. YUL-BOG has the benefit of having Star Alliance feed on both ends and will start right away with 3x weekly service. The route should do well.


Lots of Venezuelans in YUL as well. Alot of them fly to BOG or POS and take ground/sea transport to Venezuela.
 
drgmobile
Posts: 979
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 3:06 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 5:39 pm

I've watched the Colombia market for years (since it's been on my holiday list) and fares would suggest it's doing well for them. We took their Rouge flight last December.. Good flight, good value, surprisingly filled with a lot of people flying onward from Cartagena to Medellin or Bogota on another carrier.
 
jfk777
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Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 7:52 pm

For some reason Air Canada has recently been building a full twin to their Toronto hub in Montreal, new flights to Sao Paulo and Tokyo from YUL to complement YYZ. Montreal does have a market for a full schedule to Europe, but Japan & Brazil and now Colombia.
 
yulexpansion
Posts: 78
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:08 pm

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 8:36 pm

jfk777 wrote:
For some reason Air Canada has recently been building a full twin to their Toronto hub in Montreal, new flights to Sao Paulo and Tokyo from YUL to complement YYZ. Montreal does have a market for a full schedule to Europe, but Japan & Brazil and now Colombia.


AC operates YYZ-HND, which is more of a local airport, while YUL-NRT serves a lot of beyond with Star partner NH.
 
flyyul
Posts: 4441
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2000 11:25 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 8:44 pm

jfk777 wrote:
For some reason Air Canada has recently been building a full twin to their Toronto hub in Montreal, new flights to Sao Paulo and Tokyo from YUL to complement YYZ. Montreal does have a market for a full schedule to Europe, but Japan & Brazil and now Colombia.


Its the beauty of network and partnerships. Tokyo/NRT is meant largely for the beyond Japan network, whereas Avianca provides all of South America on a 1 stop basis from YUL. Today, most itins are 2 stop from YUL to South America. I'm not sure that the Japan and Colombia markets are big enough on their own to sustain these flights.
 
Thenoflyzone
Posts: 2855
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 4:42 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:51 pm

jfk777 wrote:
For some reason Air Canada has recently been building a full twin to their Toronto hub in Montreal, new flights to Sao Paulo and Tokyo from YUL to complement YYZ. Montreal does have a market for a full schedule to Europe, but Japan & Brazil and now Colombia.


Why is that so surprising? O&D is not insignificant, coupled with AC’s buildup of the YUL hub makes these flights viable. Lower airport costs compared to YYZ also help.

Speaking of Japan, announcements like these help sustain YUL-NRT....

https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/mitsubishi- ... -1.1318928
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
alexdelzotto1
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2018 2:05 pm

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 11:01 pm

RCS763AV wrote:
This is great news for BOG, especially since we've lost a couple of international destinations due to AV's reorganization (MVD, BOS, BGI and ORD in the past year). We had all heard the route was in the making for some time and it's great to see it finally coming to fruition. This further consolidates YUL and BOG and prime connecting hubs in the continent.

Also, the relationship between AC and AV has been more than cordial, with a very succesful codeshare operation on BOG-YYZ, so it's only natural they're cooperating on this flight too.

Reading the press release, the flight seems geared at mostly Colombia o/d traffic, since connection times at BOG for the respective northbound international bank are +/- 4 hours, so not ideal. For the southbound bank the flight actually connects very well to SJO, GYE, UIO, LIM, LPB, VVI, SCL, CUZ and PTY within 2 to 3 hours, as per the press release. How are connection times in YUL?

Also, the current bilateral between Colombia and Canada states that there are only 7 frequencies per week for each country outside of tourism spots (namely, CTG, SMR and ADZ). I wonder when they're going to amend the treaty.


Flight arrives in YUL with perfect connection times to CDG, LHR, NCE, LYS, GVA, BCN, LIS, DUB, VCE, FCO, BOD, TLS, MRS, CMN, ALG, FRA (both AC & LH), BRU (AC & SN), MUC (LH) and VIE (OS) as well as a bunch of domestic destinations as well as US destinations.
 
HVNandrew
Posts: 499
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2006 1:05 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Thu Sep 19, 2019 11:26 pm

Thenoflyzone wrote:
jfk777 wrote:
For some reason Air Canada has recently been building a full twin to their Toronto hub in Montreal, new flights to Sao Paulo and Tokyo from YUL to complement YYZ. Montreal does have a market for a full schedule to Europe, but Japan & Brazil and now Colombia.


Why is that so surprising? O&D is not insignificant, coupled with AC’s buildup of the YUL hub makes these flights viable. Lower airport costs compared to YYZ also help.

Speaking of Japan, announcements like these help sustain YUL-NRT....

https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/mitsubishi- ... -1.1318928

Montreal's economy is also booming. The construction in the city is really unbelievable right now (and not just on the roads). AC's hub buildup for sure helps fills planes with some connections, but demand to Montreal generally is certainly up from ten or even just five years ago.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 6066
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Fri Sep 20, 2019 12:17 am

alexdelzotto1 wrote:
Flight arrives in YUL with perfect connection times to CDG, LHR, NCE, LYS, GVA, BCN, LIS, DUB, VCE, FCO, BOD, TLS, MRS, CMN, ALG, FRA (both AC & LH), BRU (AC & SN), MUC (LH) and VIE (OS) as well as a bunch of domestic destinations as well as US destinations.


You, too, play jplatt's game of airport code salad, but what's the evidence of any meaningful demand BOG-NCE/LYS/GVA/TLS...?
 
alexdelzotto1
Posts: 55
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2018 2:05 pm

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Fri Sep 20, 2019 12:40 am

MIflyer12 wrote:
alexdelzotto1 wrote:
Flight arrives in YUL with perfect connection times to CDG, LHR, NCE, LYS, GVA, BCN, LIS, DUB, VCE, FCO, BOD, TLS, MRS, CMN, ALG, FRA (both AC & LH), BRU (AC & SN), MUC (LH) and VIE (OS) as well as a bunch of domestic destinations as well as US destinations.


You, too, play jplatt's game of airport code salad, but what's the evidence of any meaningful demand BOG-NCE/LYS/GVA/TLS...?


I don't have evidence, but AC does a great job at marketing one stop connections from their hubs is Canada and the option of reaching BOG will be there if need.
 
RCS763AV
Posts: 3814
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2004 1:22 am

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Fri Sep 20, 2019 8:47 am

Demand from Colombia to Europe and specially demand from Europe to Colombia is booming. Flights are packed to the brim, with airlines charging very high fares with the exception of BOG-MAD which has 5-6 scheduled departures per day, without particularly low fares either.

Traffic to France is growing, and Italy is a huge market without non-stop connections. There is so much demand right now, that AV's flight to MUC is doing well. TK and KL are upping their frequency. A lot of those seats are business passengers and tourists coming to see Colombia.

Secondary French destinations which have some demand from Colombia (students, some business passengers and a bit of VFR), and the north africa market has some tourism (Morocco really in vogue right now for colombians). Switzerland is also a significant market, since there is a significant swiss diaspora settled in Bogota which is particularly rich and has very close ties to the country, as well as a lot of students, diplomats, and NGO traffic. Not to mention the rich Colombians who have money there.

And the Canada-Colombia market is hugely underserved. It was about time we got a direct flight to Quebec. In fact, I could see AV or AC launching YVR in 5 to 10 years.
 
westaust
Posts: 31
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2016 3:05 pm

Re: Air Canada - Rouge launching year round flights between Montreal and Bogota

Fri Sep 20, 2019 1:37 pm

alexdelzotto1 wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
alexdelzotto1 wrote:
Flight arrives in YUL with perfect connection times to CDG, LHR, NCE, LYS, GVA, BCN, LIS, DUB, VCE, FCO, BOD, TLS, MRS, CMN, ALG, FRA (both AC & LH), BRU (AC & SN), MUC (LH) and VIE (OS) as well as a bunch of domestic destinations as well as US destinations.


You, too, play jplatt's game of airport code salad, but what's the evidence of any meaningful demand BOG-NCE/LYS/GVA/TLS...?


I don't have evidence, but AC does a great job at marketing one stop connections from their hubs is Canada and the option of reaching BOG will be there if need.


And they are great at selling really low fares for connecting pax, just as an example, you can grab a NCE-YUL-BOG flight next june for CAD758$ yet the YUL-BOG on the same dates will run you 771$, and the AC flight is at least 400$ less than any 1 stop connection offering.

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