SpaceshipDC10
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Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 9:17 am

For example:

Out of YUL, LYS will increase to 6x weekly, NCE will become Mainline up to 5x weekly with A333s and TLS will see an A333 5x weekly too.

A333s will also take over YVR-CDG and YYZ-VIE, in place of 788s.


https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-27sep19/
 
Blerg
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 9:26 am

I find the VIE change extremely interesting. Seems that with this switch they will offer slightly more seats. Seems like replacing OS was the right move as they used to send their relatively small B763.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 10:00 am

Blerg wrote:
I find the VIE change extremely interesting. Seems that with this switch they will offer slightly more seats. Seems like replacing OS was the right move as they used to send their relatively small B763.


Indeed and instead of sending a 777 (OS), the A333 is perfect, as on many other routes to Europe.
 
dabc
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 12:24 pm

YUL-ALG is transferred back to AC Rouge with an increase from 5 weekly 333 to daily 763ER
 
Thomaas
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 12:43 pm

I wonder if they will have reconfigured their TP A330s by next summer given the MAX grounding. I'm quite surprised how spread out A330 flying is going to be given that YUL is the only current pilot base for them.
 
hz747300
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 12:56 pm

Seems they changed winter too. Just received word from Air Canada via email that my AC HKG-YVR flight is canceled on 17-December and we’re on the day’s flight. Any official news that AC is reducing HKG at least while the protesting is going on?
Keep on truckin'...
 
CRJ 900
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 2:00 pm

Apparently they are starting to base A330 pilots in YYZ. Not sure of the exact date, but one of my friends was just awarded 330 FO based in YZ.
 
whywhyzee
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 2:59 pm

AC typically shuffles capacity around a few times before settling on a schedule, and is no stranger to changing types mid season to best fit the route. I'd anticipate a few more changes to roll out over the next couple of months, all little adjustments like this.

I am curious about the A333s as well, they were supposed to be reconfigured this winter, though with the max grounding, I don't know what the plan is now. I'm curious to see how it all shakes out.
 
behramjee
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 4:07 pm

Overall it looks very good. Two things that caught my eye were YYz-DXB being increased to 4wk in Summer for the first time and YVR-CDG being reduced from 4 to 3wk.

I’m surprised that they would be reducing YVR-CDG in summer season.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 4:36 pm

behramjee wrote:
I’m surprised that they would be reducing YVR-CDG in summer season.


It's been announced these last few days, to begin in eight months so there might still be changes until then. Perhaps is it also related to fleet dispatch without the Max 8, and load factors, unless they offer attractive one stop fares through YYZ or YUL.


A333 27C 21Y+ 244Y = 292 +7C & +30Y

B788 20C 21Y+ 214Y = 255
 
yyztpa2
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 6:19 pm

Blerg wrote:
I find the VIE change extremely interesting. Seems that with this switch they will offer slightly more seats. Seems like replacing OS was the right move as they used to send their relatively small B763.


With AC in joint venture with LH and other airlines within LHGroup, perhaps the JV wants to take advantage of the EuroWings and OS restructuring in VIE.
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1431955
 
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spinotter
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 6:40 pm

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
For example:

Out of YUL, LYS will increase to 6x weekly, NCE will become Mainline up to 5x weekly with A333s and TLS will see an A333 5x weekly too.

A333s will also take over YVR-CDG and YYZ-VIE, in place of 788s.


https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-27sep19/


Air France should have done this long ago - but AF is so Parisian-centric that it is not even funny. UTA had a number of these routes, like SXB-LIL-YUL, that showed a lot of promise - now served by TS and then eventually AC.
 
Dominion301
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 6:47 pm

Interesting to see the 77W on YYC-FRA and (previously announced) AC and LH are metal swapping YOW-FRA.

Given there's no reference to YYC-NRT, looks like it'll be getting the 763 for one more summer.

Another interesting tidbit is 1 daily YYZ-YHZ will see a 77W over the XMAS/New Year's period: https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... 9jan-2020/
 
berari
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 6:58 pm

My big takeaway here is that Chinese destinations of Beijing, Shanghai and Hong Kong are seeing capacity cuts.

For Calgary, the 77W to FRA is interesting, but so is A333 to LHR instead of B789 especially in light of similar grade aircraft from WS to LGW. How's the hard product on the A333?
 
chrisa330
Posts: 585
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 9:48 pm

berari wrote:
My big takeaway here is that Chinese destinations of Beijing, Shanghai and Hong Kong are seeing capacity cuts.

For Calgary, the 77W to FRA is interesting, but so is A333 to LHR instead of B789 especially in light of similar grade aircraft from WS to LGW. How's the hard product on the A333?


The hard product on the A330 right now is OK, but aging and inferior to WS (IMO). Once AC gets the reconfigurations complete it will be equivalent to WS and to AC’s 787/777 fleet
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Mon Sep 30, 2019 11:53 pm

spinotter wrote:
Air France should have done this long ago - but AF is so Parisian-centric that it is not even funny.


Overall France is very Paris-centric, so it's no surprise that AF behave like that. It would be interesting to know what % of passengers from France uses these non-Paris routes on AC and TS.
 
berari
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Tue Oct 01, 2019 3:53 am

Does AC serve LYS and GVA?
 
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chepos
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Tue Oct 01, 2019 4:41 am

berari wrote:
Does AC serve LYS and GVA?


Yes, AC flies to both.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Fly the Flag!!!!
 
matt
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Tue Oct 01, 2019 7:06 pm

berari wrote:
My big takeaway here is that Chinese destinations of Beijing, Shanghai and Hong Kong are seeing capacity cuts.

For Calgary, the 77W to FRA is interesting, but so is A333 to LHR instead of B789 especially in light of similar grade aircraft from WS to LGW. How's the hard product on the A333?


If I'm not mistaken, the 77W on YYC-FRA and the 333 on YYC-LHR are just temporary (spring). The peak summer season seems to show the 789 on both routes.
Next flights: YQM-YUL-MIA-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-LYS-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-FRA-MLA-FRA-YUL-YQM
 
SpaceshipDC10
Topic Author
Posts: 6460
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Tue Oct 01, 2019 7:19 pm

matt wrote:
berari wrote:
My big takeaway here is that Chinese destinations of Beijing, Shanghai and Hong Kong are seeing capacity cuts.

For Calgary, the 77W to FRA is interesting, but so is A333 to LHR instead of B789 especially in light of similar grade aircraft from WS to LGW. How's the hard product on the A333?


If I'm not mistaken, the 77W on YYC-FRA and the 333 on YYC-LHR are just temporary (spring). The peak summer season seems to show the 789 on both routes.



That's right

Calgary – Frankfurt 29MAR20 – 30APR20 400-seater 777-300ER replaces 787-9
Calgary – London Heathrow 29MAR20 – 14JUN20 A330-300 replaces 787-9
 
fly2moon
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Tue Oct 01, 2019 9:13 pm

Is this reshuffle affecting availability of Rouge 763 for launching new services for S20? Number of potential TATL destinations could use 767 as seasonal Rouge routes from YYZ: Dubrovnik DBV, Sofia SOF, Belgrade BEG and Thessaloniki SKG for example?
 
SpaceshipDC10
Topic Author
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Wed Oct 02, 2019 4:29 pm

behramjee wrote:
I’m surprised that they would be reducing YVR-CDG in summer season.


In addition to what I've posted a few days ago, lets consider YVR's passengers stats for this year with August and Year-to-date respectively:

260,976 -1.1% // 1,244,476 0.8%

Of course I don't know routes' performances, however at 4x weekly, with the 788, offered 80C + 84Y+ 856Y one way, whereas with 3x weekly A333 they will have 81C + 63Y+ 734Y. IIRC TS serve the route too once or twice weekly, along with AF.
 
alexdelzotto1
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Wed Oct 02, 2019 10:19 pm

fly2moon wrote:
Is this reshuffle affecting availability of Rouge 763 for launching new services for S20? Number of potential TATL destinations could use 767 as seasonal Rouge routes from YYZ: Dubrovnik DBV, Sofia SOF, Belgrade BEG and Thessaloniki SKG for example?


Rouge is already adding YUL-BOG 3 weekly and YUL-MRS is going up from 3 to 4 weekly.
 
matt
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Thu Oct 03, 2019 12:41 am

fly2moon wrote:
Is this reshuffle affecting availability of Rouge 763 for launching new services for S20? Number of potential TATL destinations could use 767 as seasonal Rouge routes from YYZ: Dubrovnik DBV, Sofia SOF, Belgrade BEG and Thessaloniki SKG for example?


Air Canada rouge's Boeing 767-300s will definitely have more flexibility next summer. This past summer, they ended up operating a lot of flights as substitutes for the 737 MAX8, which was grounded (and still is). For example, the Rouge 767s were used on YYZ-YYC (3x daily), YYZ-YEG (2x daily), YUL-YVR, YUL-YEG, YUL-YHZ and other ad hoc replacements. If the MAX8 is back in the air, that will free up the Rouge 767s. I'm sure there will be more anouncements to come.
Next flights: YQM-YUL-MIA-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-LYS-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-FRA-MLA-FRA-YUL-YQM
 
OlympicATH
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Thu Oct 03, 2019 1:03 am

YYZ-ATH and YUL-ATH are both increasing from 7 to 9 weekly based on current schedules. This was meant to happen this year but didn’t because of the MAX situation and the need to use some Rouge 767s to compensate.
 
nsapounas
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Thu Oct 03, 2019 1:48 am

OlympicATH wrote:
YYZ-ATH and YUL-ATH are both increasing from 7 to 9 weekly based on current schedules. This was meant to happen this year but didn’t because of the MAX situation and the need to use some Rouge 767s to compensate.


They were both 9 weekly this summer.
 
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ACCS300
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Thu Oct 03, 2019 3:58 am

chrisa330 wrote:
berari wrote:
My big takeaway here is that Chinese destinations of Beijing, Shanghai and Hong Kong are seeing capacity cuts.

For Calgary, the 77W to FRA is interesting, but so is A333 to LHR instead of B789 especially in light of similar grade aircraft from WS to LGW. How's the hard product on the A333?


The hard product on the A330 right now is OK, but aging and inferior to WS (IMO). Once AC gets the reconfigurations complete it will be equivalent to WS and to AC’s 787/777 fleet


AC's A330 hard product is still vastly superior to WS 767's, only inferior to their 787s. Extremely comfy Y cabin only the AVOD is a bit old and slow.
 
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cirrusdragoon
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Thu Oct 03, 2019 4:28 am

ACCS300 wrote:
chrisa330 wrote:
berari wrote:
My big takeaway here is that Chinese destinations of Beijing, Shanghai and Hong Kong are seeing capacity cuts.

For Calgary, the 77W to FRA is interesting, but so is A333 to LHR instead of B789 especially in light of similar grade aircraft from WS to LGW. How's the hard product on the A333?


The hard product on the A330 right now is OK, but aging and inferior to WS (IMO). Once AC gets the reconfigurations complete it will be equivalent to WS and to AC’s 787/777 fleet


AC's A330 hard product is still vastly superior to WS 767's, only inferior to their 787s. Extremely comfy Y cabin only the AVOD is a bit old and slow.


with WestJet retiring their 767’s next summer, there will be no comparison.
 
fly2moon
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Thu Oct 03, 2019 6:29 pm

matt wrote:
Air Canada rouge's Boeing 767-300s will definitely have more flexibility next summer. This past summer, they ended up operating a lot of flights as substitutes for the 737 MAX8, which was grounded (and still is). For example, the Rouge 767s were used on YYZ-YYC (3x daily), YYZ-YEG (2x daily), YUL-YVR, YUL-YEG, YUL-YHZ and other ad hoc replacements. If the MAX8 is back in the air, that will free up the Rouge 767s. I'm sure there will be more anouncements to come.


True, if MAX gets back in the air by next summer 767s will have more availability. The thing is, new TATL routes are usually announced around this time of year and can't wait for MAX to actually start flying. Other uncertainties are also at play. With AC/TS deal not formally completed, it is not likely Rouge and Transat can plan TATL services together at this time. Many RV/TS European destinations overlap and even if Transat remains a separate brand for a while, it would make sense to have a holistic view of TATL destinations and optimize network, possibly making Rouge 767 available for new destinations. If deal closes early next year it would likely be too late for S20 new service announcements at that time.

It will be interesting to see if any new Rouge 767 TATL services can be created in upcoming weeks or if we have to wait for destinations like DBV, SOF, BEG and SKG in S21.
 
matt
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Re: Air Canada S20 International network changes

Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:09 pm

fly2moon wrote:
matt wrote:
Air Canada rouge's Boeing 767-300s will definitely have more flexibility next summer. This past summer, they ended up operating a lot of flights as substitutes for the 737 MAX8, which was grounded (and still is). For example, the Rouge 767s were used on YYZ-YYC (3x daily), YYZ-YEG (2x daily), YUL-YVR, YUL-YEG, YUL-YHZ and other ad hoc replacements. If the MAX8 is back in the air, that will free up the Rouge 767s. I'm sure there will be more anouncements to come.


True, if MAX gets back in the air by next summer 767s will have more availability. The thing is, new TATL routes are usually announced around this time of year and can't wait for MAX to actually start flying. Other uncertainties are also at play. With AC/TS deal not formally completed, it is not likely Rouge and Transat can plan TATL services together at this time. Many RV/TS European destinations overlap and even if Transat remains a separate brand for a while, it would make sense to have a holistic view of TATL destinations and optimize network, possibly making Rouge 767 available for new destinations. If deal closes early next year it would likely be too late for S20 new service announcements at that time.

It will be interesting to see if any new Rouge 767 TATL services can be created in upcoming weeks or if we have to wait for destinations like DBV, SOF, BEG and SKG in S21.


You are absolutely right about that. There are still many uncertainties, especially with the AC/TS deal. As S20 gets closer and closer, it will difficult for AC and TS to plan their TATL schedule holistically. We may have to wait until S21 for that... Interesting times.
Next flights: YQM-YUL-MIA-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-LYS-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-FRA-MLA-FRA-YUL-YQM

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