Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
RainerBoeing777
Topic Author
Posts: 593
Joined: Wed Jun 21, 2017 3:43 pm

Osaka Kansai is growing again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 4:04 am

This summer of 2020 brings good news for KIX many airlines return their operations, after the Japanese recession the KIX airport has dramatically reduced its Long Haul operations, I hope that the new generation of aircraft can keep this service profitable.

The new services are:

Zurich (ZRH) with Swiss will operate 5 weekly frequencies with Airbus A340-300
Istanbul (IST) with Turkish Airlines will operate 4 weekly frequencies with Boeing 787-9 Dreamliner
Doha (DOH) with Qatar Airways (QR) with 5 weekly frequencies operated with Airbus A350-900xwb
Moscow (SVO) with Aeroflot with 4 weekly frequencies operated with Airbus A330-200

What other destinations do you think arrive again?

My expectations would be:

Cairo (CAI) Egyptair with Boeing 787-9 Dreamliner
Frankfurt (FRA) Lufthansa with Airbus A340-600
Rome (FCO) Alitalia with Airbus A330 / Boeing 777
Vienna (VIE) Austrian with Boeing 767-300ER
Copenhagen (CPH) Scandinavian Airlines with Airbus A340-300
Delhi (DEL) Air India with Boeing 787-8 Dreamliner
Dallas (DFW) American Airlines with Boeing 777/787
Detroit (DTW) Delta with Airbus A330-900neo
Chicago (ORD) United with Boeing 787 Dreamliner
Toronto (YYZ) with Boeing 787 Dreamliner

Many of these proposed flights can be seasonal
 
User avatar
globetrotter94
Posts: 427
Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2016 5:05 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 4:28 am

Yes, it looks promising for my local airport indeed. I think Egyptair to Cairo already operates as a seasonal charter, but not sure. In terms of the others, Air India just pulled out, so may be a while before they dip their finger again. With LH and LX already in KIX for LH Group, I wonder if there would be any traffic for OS to be sustainable, or if they would just start cannibalizing their own demand on the 2 remaining services.

I also wonder if this boom can be sustained, or if it's just a temporary blip for the Olympics. Out of the services announced, I feel TK is the most likely to survive in the long-run based on past operations (only pulled out in early 2017 due to shortage of aircraft and demand problems due to political issues at that time). Doha was always a tag-on to Tokyo if I remember correctly, and SU and LX pulled out a long time ago (early 2000s).
 
Ishrion
Posts: 3637
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:17 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 5:21 am

New York, anyone?

DFW is reasonable, AA used to fly there with a 772?
 
wenders825
Posts: 389
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2016 7:29 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 6:08 am

DFW would be really smart for the AA/JL JV. would open up so many more connections and also south american connects, which can be very high yielding (and AA has already said this has been a successful factor for DFW profitability)

very nice to see KIX booming. wonder how BA did, and curious how Thai does with the 380 and Malaysia with the 359. lots of impressive capacity as well from existing carriers
 
vishal1996
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Dec 30, 2012 11:41 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 6:15 am

Air India has discontinued the Delhi- Hong Kong- Osaka service since 16 September 2019.
 
TC957
Posts: 4133
Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 1:12 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 6:40 am

KIX was always regarded as a mega-expensive airport to operate too, with very high landing fees. Is that still the case or have the fees been reduced to the point it's no more costly to operate there than anywhere else long-haul ? Also, if KIX is boom-town how come NH / JL don't expand their long-haul from there ?
 
SCQ83
Posts: 5890
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 6:45 am

I flew Alitalia KIX-FCO a few years ago. I didn't even know it was discontinued. The most interesting thing about that flight (which was full) is that we were 3-4 Westeners max. Everybody seemed to be Japanese tourists on groups, like a charter. Which was not bad, it was probably the quietest long-haul flight I have ever had.

So I see the other existing long haul services are AMS (KL), CDG (AF), DXB (EK), LAX (JL), LHR (BA), MUC (LH) and SFO (UA).
 
cedarjet
Posts: 8975
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 1:12 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 6:52 am

Egyptair no way, they only manage Tokyo twice a week, and it’s a 13+ hour trip. Austrian is also on/off to Japan, only just restarted Tokyo after dropping the route a few years ago.
 
User avatar
RWA380
Posts: 5913
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 7:05 am

SCQ83 wrote:
I flew Alitalia KIX-FCO a few years ago. I didn't even know it was discontinued. The most interesting thing about that flight (which was full) is that we were 3-4 Westeners max. Everybody seemed to be Japanese tourists on groups, like a charter. Which was not bad, it was probably the quietest long-haul flight I have ever had.

So I see the other existing long haul services are AMS (KL), CDG (AF), DXB (EK), LAX (JL), LHR (BA), MUC (LH) and SFO (UA).


HNL has DL, HA & JL n/s to/from KIX ... unless you don't consider it long haul.
 
User avatar
Momo1435
Posts: 1256
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2012 2:33 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 7:23 am

KIX landing fee's for international flights were reduced by 17% in 2017, and there are 3 year long discounts in place for new routes. But Japanese airports in general still have high landing fees, and KIX is not the cheapest out of the 3 large international airports.

With the increasing number of regional flights I wouldn't be surprised if we will see another reduction soon. The new route incentives announced in 2017 end next year, all these recent new routes are likely to still want make use of these discounts. But I fully expect that we will see similar deals being announced next year plus another general reduction of the landing fees.

@SCQ83,
you forgot HEL (AY)
 
MartijnNL
Posts: 1066
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2017 11:44 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 7:34 am

Less than three daily flights extra. Is that really booming?
 
MareBorealis
Posts: 162
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:16 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 7:46 am

SCQ83 wrote:
So I see the other existing long haul services are AMS (KL), CDG (AF), DXB (EK), LAX (JL), LHR (BA), MUC (LH) and SFO (UA).


And HEL (AY), a daily A359 service this winter, 10x weekly next summer season.
 
Toinou
Posts: 352
Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2019 8:21 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 7:51 am

MartijnNL wrote:
Less than three daily flights extra. Is that really booming?

Well, in a quiet society like Japan, maybe a little pop sounds like a big boom elsewhere...
 
Waterbomber2
Posts: 1469
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:44 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 7:56 am

Airlines are flying to KIX out of lack of places to fly to. DL and AA are also making a huge mistake dumping NRT to focus on HND, Tokyo still has huge demand to satisfy. Whatever void they leave will be swooped up very quickly.
Tokyo is where the money is, KIX,... Meeeeh.
 
User avatar
OA940
Posts: 1991
Joined: Fri May 20, 2016 6:18 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 7:58 am

I really don't see AZ, MS or OS going to KIX, and if DL does pull the trigger on it I could only see SEA becoming year-round. DTW doesn't seem like the place for KIX service IMO. Also LH would probably give it a shot with the 359 before (and if ever) they decided to move to the 346. AI also just stopped flying to KIX so I doubt they're gonna restart flights, at least short-term.
 
User avatar
Momo1435
Posts: 1256
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2012 2:33 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 8:03 am

MartijnNL wrote:
Less than three daily flights extra. Is that really booming?

Fair question.

Considering the low number of intercontinental flights it's a significant increase, but not really a boom. The airport is booming though, but mainly because of regional flights. The number of Chinese tourist to Japan and especially the Kansai region has exploded recently. The number of international passengers using the airport has doubled since 2012 after years and years without any growth at all.

you can see the airport statistics here:
http://www.kansai-airports.co.jp/en/com ... s/kix.html
 
konrad
Posts: 601
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2002 3:54 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 8:41 am

RainerBoeing777 wrote:
This summer of 2020 brings good news for KIX many airlines return their operations, after the Japanese recession the KIX airport has dramatically reduced its Long Haul operations, I hope that the new generation of aircraft can keep this service profitable. (...)

What other destinations do you think arrive again?

My expectations would be: (...)


Few years down the way we could see LOT with 3-4 weekly. A second destination in Japan is granted in their PL-JA agreement and NRT is doing extremely well with daily 789 service (full flights) just two years after starting. But before that the 787 RR problems which hit LOT badly must get resolved.
 
MareBorealis
Posts: 162
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:16 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 8:52 am

Momo1435 wrote:
you can see the airport statistics here:
http://www.kansai-airports.co.jp/en/com ... s/kix.html


Thanks!

Interesting, looks like Finnair is the biggest European in KIX next summer season, with 10 weekly flights. Probably in whole Japan next summer? They'll fly 34x weekly to NRT KIX NGO FUK, plus HND coming in some point.
 
User avatar
Polot
Posts: 12191
Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2011 3:01 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 11:04 am

Waterbomber2 wrote:
Airlines are flying to KIX out of lack of places to fly to. DL and AA are also making a huge mistake dumping NRT to focus on HND, Tokyo still has huge demand to satisfy. Whatever void they leave will be swooped up very quickly.
Tokyo is where the money is, KIX,... Meeeeh.

You do realize that HND is Tokyo (Haneda) International Airport and is closer to the city than NRT, correct?
 
Weatherwatcher1
Posts: 920
Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2019 5:14 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 1:00 pm

I do wonder if the splitting of long haul flights between Narita and Haneda will push more connecting traffic to Osaka. Tokyo was a dominant connecting traffic hub, but it seems like airlines are focused on O/D
 
jplatts
Posts: 4869
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Sun Oct 06, 2019 2:37 pm

RainerBoeing777 wrote:
Dallas (DFW) American Airlines with Boeing 777/787


wenders825 wrote:
DFW would be really smart for the AA/JL JV. would open up so many more connections and also south american connects, which can be very high yielding (and AA has already said this has been a successful factor for DFW profitability)

very nice to see KIX booming. wonder how BA did, and curious how Thai does with the 380 and Malaysia with the 359. lots of impressive capacity as well from existing carriers


There is likely more demand to KIX from DFW than was the case in the past as Osaka-based Kubota now has its North American headquarters in Grapevine near DFW Airport.

RainerBoeing777 wrote:
Chicago (ORD) United with Boeing 787 Dreamliner


There are some business ties between the Kansai region and some Eastern U.S. cities such as the following to support a possible ORD-KIX add by UA:
  • Cincinnati-based P&G having its Japanese headquarters in Kobe
  • Indianapolis-based Eli Lilly having its Japanese headquarters in Kobe
  • Caterpillar Japan (a subsidiary of Deerfield, IL-based Caterpillar) having a major campus in Akashi, which is located just west of Kobe
  • Panasonic (based in the Osaka area in Kadoma) having its North American headquarters in Newark, NJ
  • Osaka-based Sharp having its North American headquarters in Montvale, NJ
 
Pinto
Posts: 121
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:30 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:17 am

UA ORD to KIX will not happen. UA cant even get full loads on nondailey 788 flights to SFO. Also KIX wouldnt work for AA as JAL has no real presence there.
 
User avatar
chunhimlai
Posts: 723
Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2015 11:03 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:23 am

I think KIX would have better opportunity if it was in Kobe airport
 
ilari
Posts: 239
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 11:26 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:26 am

MareBorealis wrote:
SCQ83 wrote:
So I see the other existing long haul services are AMS (KL), CDG (AF), DXB (EK), LAX (JL), LHR (BA), MUC (LH) and SFO (UA).


And HEL (AY), a daily A359 service this winter, 10x weekly next summer season.


Isn't AY doing 10 weekly already? Additional flights at the midnight bank.
 
Ishrion
Posts: 3637
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:17 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:28 am

Pinto wrote:
UA ORD to KIX will not happen. UA cant even get full loads on nondailey 788 flights to SFO. Also KIX wouldnt work for AA as JAL has no real presence there.


Why does JL need a presence there? AA can connect its passengers from DFW to KIX.

It's the same reasoning of practically every other non-partner destination AA flies to.
 
wenders825
Posts: 389
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2016 7:29 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:41 am

Pinto wrote:
UA ORD to KIX will not happen. UA cant even get full loads on nondailey 788 flights to SFO. Also KIX wouldnt work for AA as JAL has no real presence there.

AA is way bigger and has more connecting leverage at DFW than UA has at SFO or ORD. JAL's LAX-KIX has to be doing well as indicated by the upgauge to a 789. I think the market can handle better access to the US
 
Waterbomber2
Posts: 1469
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:44 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:04 am

Polot wrote:
Waterbomber2 wrote:
Airlines are flying to KIX out of lack of places to fly to. DL and AA are also making a huge mistake dumping NRT to focus on HND, Tokyo still has huge demand to satisfy. Whatever void they leave will be swooped up very quickly.
Tokyo is where the money is, KIX,... Meeeeh.

You do realize that HND is Tokyo (Haneda) International Airport and is closer to the city than NRT, correct?


Jee as a JGC member, I hope so.
I'm saying that DL and AA are making a mistake dumping their NRT slots. This is an opportunity for them to double their Tokyo presence. Multiple daily flights between both airports, capisci?
 
LondonXtreme
Posts: 170
Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2018 4:24 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:44 am

I really expect to see KIX-NYC happens as the demand is high.
Also, I can see AA launching LAX-KIX instead of DFW-KIX. The metal neutral JV with JL can release JL’s own 789 for HND expansion( maybe introducing new HND-LAX). JL only has one daily LAX-TYO, far less than what competitors offers, TYO-LAX is a large market, NH has 3 daily flights, most Asian carriers serve LAX more than 1 daily.
 
Theseus
Posts: 287
Joined: Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:35 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:45 am

It is great news that KIX is getting new flights and seeing increased interest. Osaka and the area deserve a major entry point without a connection in Tokyo.
 
Toinou
Posts: 352
Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2019 8:21 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:49 am

chunhimlai wrote:
I think KIX would have better opportunity if it was in Kobe airport

Obviously in this case it would serve well both cities. That said, even if it is on the wrong side of Osaka, it is really not impossible to go to Kobe from KIX (using ferry or train).
 
gloom
Posts: 573
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2016 4:24 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:21 am

I think many of you are missing KIX also serves Kyoto area. Which is (as I remember from my own trip back in 2014) full of "gaijins". Tourist traffic is of course not a good reason to start, but once you have some C seats asked for, full Y makes a nice reason to start.

Cheers,
Adam
 
jplatts
Posts: 4869
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:06 am

wenders825 wrote:
Pinto wrote:
UA ORD to KIX will not happen. UA cant even get full loads on nondailey 788 flights to SFO. Also KIX wouldnt work for AA as JAL has no real presence there.

AA is way bigger and has more connecting leverage at DFW than UA has at SFO or ORD. JAL's LAX-KIX has to be doing well as indicated by the upgauge to a 789. I think the market can handle better access to the US


In addition to AA having more connecting leverage at DFW, there are also business ties between Osaka and Dallas/Fort Worth such as Osaka-based Kubota having its North American headquarters in Grapevine near DFW Airport to support DFW-KIX on AA.

I also previously mentioned that demand for DFW-KIX is likely stronger than was the case in the past due to Kubota now having its North American headquarters in Grapevine.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 10011
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:58 am

jplatts wrote:
wenders825 wrote:
Pinto wrote:
UA ORD to KIX will not happen. UA cant even get full loads on nondailey 788 flights to SFO. Also KIX wouldnt work for AA as JAL has no real presence there.

AA is way bigger and has more connecting leverage at DFW than UA has at SFO or ORD. JAL's LAX-KIX has to be doing well as indicated by the upgauge to a 789. I think the market can handle better access to the US


In addition to AA having more connecting leverage at DFW, there are also business ties between Osaka and Dallas/Fort Worth such as Osaka-based Kubota having its North American headquarters in Grapevine near DFW Airport to support DFW-KIX on AA.

I also previously mentioned that demand for DFW-KIX is likely stronger than was the case in the past due to Kubota now having its North American headquarters in Grapevine.


How much demand for KIX travel do you think a 300-employee HQ location generates from Grapevine?

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/rea ... rs-campus/

It's Kubota, not GM.
 
mfe777
Posts: 289
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 5:35 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 2:34 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
jplatts wrote:
wenders825 wrote:
AA is way bigger and has more connecting leverage at DFW than UA has at SFO or ORD. JAL's LAX-KIX has to be doing well as indicated by the upgauge to a 789. I think the market can handle better access to the US


In addition to AA having more connecting leverage at DFW, there are also business ties between Osaka and Dallas/Fort Worth such as Osaka-based Kubota having its North American headquarters in Grapevine near DFW Airport to support DFW-KIX on AA.

I also previously mentioned that demand for DFW-KIX is likely stronger than was the case in the past due to Kubota now having its North American headquarters in Grapevine.


How much demand for KIX travel do you think a 300-employee HQ location generates from Grapevine?

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/rea ... rs-campus/

It's Kubota, not GM.


Well, DFW has the GM of Japan, Toyota, headquartered in Plano. Toyota City in Japan is much closer to Osaka than Tokyo. Additionally, there are 164 Japanese companies with operations in the DFW area and some of those will be generating traffic to Osaka or places connected to Osaka by JAL.

Texas as a whole has 400 Japanese companies supporting ~50,000 jobs, and DFW is the perfecting connecting point to funnel that traffic to Japan.

Some of the notable Japanese companies with operations in DFW:
American Honda Motor Co. in Irving
Canon Business Solutions in Dallas
Canon USA in Irving
Fuji Semiconductor in Carrollton
Fujifilm USA in Irving
Fujitsu Network Communications in Richardson
Hitachi Data Systems in Addison
Hoya VisionCare North America in Lewisville
Kawasaki Motors USA in Fort Worth
Kubota Tractor in Grapevine
Kyocera Mita in Irving
Mitsubishi International in Irving
NEC Corp. of America in Irving
Panasonic Enterprise Solutions in Coppell
Sanyo Energy USA in Frisco and The Colony
Sony Electronics in Dallas
Sony Pictures in Richardson
Sumitomo Machinery in Carrollton
Tohatsu America in Farmers Branch
Toshiba Business Solutions in Addison
Toyota Motos North America in Plano
Yazaki Energy Solutions in Plano
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 6473
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:12 pm

AA should try to focus on making what it has to Asia profitable before expanding. According to the BTS numbers, its a money drain.
 
Waterbomber2
Posts: 1469
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 3:44 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:16 pm

The only potential for KIX is as alternative connecting hub for JL/NH through their lowcost subsidiaries Jetstar and Peach in an attempt to free up capacity in HND for the higher yielding domestic and international O&D.
I don't know to what extent that is already the case nor to what extent this can be successful. Imo it always makes more financial sense to centralise rather than decentralise.
So that's the potential but still doesn't mean that it can be successful.
 
SteelChair
Posts: 1716
Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2017 11:37 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:10 pm

LAXdude1023 wrote:
AA should try to focus on making what it has to Asia profitable before expanding. According to the BTS numbers, its a money drain.


Isn't the Pacific kind of a bloodbath for everyone right now?
 
MareBorealis
Posts: 162
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:16 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:35 pm

ilari wrote:
MareBorealis wrote:
SCQ83 wrote:
So I see the other existing long haul services are AMS (KL), CDG (AF), DXB (EK), LAX (JL), LHR (BA), MUC (LH) and SFO (UA).


And HEL (AY), a daily A359 service this winter, 10x weekly next summer season.


Isn't AY doing 10 weekly already? Additional flights at the midnight bank.


Yes 10 weekly in S19, the winter schedule from OCT 28.
 
Sooner787
Posts: 2865
Joined: Thu Jul 18, 2013 1:44 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 7:14 pm

Related question... is KIX still dealing with their sinking issues they had when it first opened?

Remember a TV documentary calling KIX Japan's incredible sinking airport.
 
SteelChair
Posts: 1716
Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2017 11:37 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:14 pm

Sooner787 wrote:
Related question... is KIX still dealing with their sinking issues they had when it first opened?

Remember a TV documentary calling KIX Japan's incredible sinking airport.


According to the last update I saw a few years ago, the rate of subsidence (sinking) has greatly decreased. The airport used to publish updates on their website.
 
rbretas
Posts: 76
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2016 10:21 am

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Tue Oct 08, 2019 12:47 am

jplatts wrote:
There are some business ties between the Kansai region and some Eastern U.S. cities such as the following to support a possible ORD-KIX add by UA:
  • Cincinnati-based P&G having its Japanese headquarters in Kobe
  • Indianapolis-based Eli Lilly having its Japanese headquarters in Kobe
  • Caterpillar Japan (a subsidiary of Deerfield, IL-based Caterpillar) having a major campus in Akashi, which is located just west of Kobe
  • Panasonic (based in the Osaka area in Kadoma) having its North American headquarters in Newark, NJ
  • Osaka-based Sharp having its North American headquarters in Montvale, NJ


P&G Asian headquarters is not in Kobe anymore, I think most operations were moved to Singapore a few years ago. Now they only have a few offices in a small building in downtown. Since then the number of westerners in Kobe have decreased significantly. Except maybe for Panasonic and Sharp, those other companies have a rather small presence in the area and would benefit more of a better connected Kobe airport. Most people west of Itami prefer to take the high speed ferry connecting KIX and Kobe Airport than flying from Itami (which strangely makes it faster to reach KIX from Kobe than from Osaka).
 
jplatts
Posts: 4869
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Tue Oct 08, 2019 2:36 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
How much demand for KIX travel do you think a 300-employee HQ location generates from Grapevine?

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/rea ... rs-campus/

It's Kubota, not GM.


While a 300-employee Kubota HQ location in Grapevine does generate some demand for travel between Osaka and DFW by Kubota employees in both Osaka and Grapevine, any demand that exists between DFW and Osaka in connection with Kubota business is likely covered by connecting options on UA through SFO and JL through TYO. AA will also be able to more easily connect passengers onto JL's HND-ITM nonstop flights from DFW once AA starts DFW-HND nonstop service in March 2020.

Another big difference between DFW-OSA and DTW-ICN is that there is more that there is more than just GM or O&D traffic driving demand for DTW-ICN nonstop service as there are some passengers connecting onto KE flights to China and Southeast Asia from DTW through ICN.
 
User avatar
LAXintl
Posts: 25545
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is growing again

Tue Oct 08, 2019 3:15 pm

One of the reasons for new air service is the aggressive incentive program Kansai International Airport Company has available at the moment.

For example, landing fees are waived entirely or reduced for 3-year period, while passenger fees are refunded for transfer connection passengers.

As one of the world's most expensive airports, having a significant portion of your fees reduced or eliminated is a benefit in helping make a routes economics work.

Of course begs the question, what happens when fees revert to their normal amounts. Will the airlines stick around??
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 6473
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is in the BOOM again

Tue Oct 08, 2019 3:16 pm

jplatts wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
How much demand for KIX travel do you think a 300-employee HQ location generates from Grapevine?

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/rea ... rs-campus/

It's Kubota, not GM.


While a 300-employee Kubota HQ location in Grapevine does generate some demand for travel between Osaka and DFW by Kubota employees in both Osaka and Grapevine, any demand that exists between DFW and Osaka in connection with Kubota business is likely covered by connecting options on UA through SFO and JL through TYO. AA will also be able to more easily connect passengers onto JL's HND-ITM nonstop flights from DFW once AA starts DFW-HND nonstop service in March 2020.

Another big difference between DFW-OSA and DTW-ICN is that there is more that there is more than just GM or O&D traffic driving demand for DTW-ICN nonstop service as there are some passengers connecting onto KE flights to China and Southeast Asia from DTW through ICN.


Thers is a bigger difference:

DFW-ICN is a large local market.
DFW-KIX is minuscule.
 
RainerBoeing777
Topic Author
Posts: 593
Joined: Wed Jun 21, 2017 3:43 pm

Re: Osaka Kansai is growing again

Sun Oct 13, 2019 10:40 pm

Egyptair returns again to Osaka-Kansai with charter flight operating with Boeing 777-300ER, last year they flew this charter I think if they consolidate this year they can return the CAI-KIX serice with Boeing 787-9 Dreamliner

https://twitter.com/Airlineroute/status/1183363518738784256

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos