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SQ22
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Updated: PNG Air to be Launch Customer of ATR 42-600S (STOL) Version

Wed Oct 09, 2019 11:11 am

ATR has formally launched the STOL version of the ATR 42-600 called ATR 42-600S.

According to ATR they have so far received 20 commitments from operators and lessors.

Major changes to the standard version are a larger rudder for increased control at lower speads.

Press release to be found here: http://www.atraircraft.com/newsroom/news.html

Link to previous thread on that subject: viewtopic.php?t=1366381
Last edited by SQ22 on Tue Feb 11, 2020 11:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Title updated
 
Northwest1988
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 11:36 am

Going after the Dash 8-100/200 market it looks like.
 
mchei
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 11:45 am

Would love to see it in HGL, Helgoland Island :)
F70-F100-E145-E170-E190-319-320-321-735–736-737-738-752-763–742-744-333-343-ATR72-Metroliner-Saab2000-Lockheed Electra-C172-C182-C182RG-MD11
 
Noshow
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 11:48 am

It will be unable to operate there.
 
SEU
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 11:54 am

So it has 800-1,000m takeoff/Landing capabilities now. That's impressive.
 
Pacific
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:09 pm

Instantly reminded me of this old thread about a hypothetical airport with an 800m runway at Ogasawara.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1402859
 
T4thH
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:16 pm

mchei wrote:
Would love to see it in HGL, Helgoland Island :)


Even Helgoland-Düne airport has three runways and all three concrete....which even many/most big international airports do not have....
The longest of the three is just 480 m. Maximum landing weight is 5 t.
-> No, it is a little bit too short, so by minimum 320 m..
Also a LH B737-200 made a balked-landing in 1972...perhaps we shall classify Heligoland dune airport (HGL) regarding this as "international". :hissyfit:
Last edited by T4thH on Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
N91
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:34 pm

Perhaps Qantas will consider for flights to LDH
 
Noshow
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:37 pm

Who requested this S version? Is any airline or route known that needs this performance? It's not overly STOL just a bit it seems.
 
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TOGA10
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:39 pm

T4thH wrote:
mchei wrote:
Would love to see it in HGL, Helgoland Island :)


Even Helgoland-Düne airport has three runways and all three concrete....which even many/most big international airports do not have....
The longest of the three is just 480 m. Maximum landing weight is 5 t.
-> No, it is a little bit too short, so by minimum 320 m..
Also a LH B737-200 made a balked-landing in 1972...perhaps we shall classify Heligoland dune airport (HGL) regarding this as "international". :hissyfit:

Off topic, do you have any info regarding that LH 'touch and go'? Trying to find some more information, but everything seems to be in German..
Thanks.
I wanna go back upstairs!
 
Noshow
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:50 pm

It was a fake approach meant to be a joke on some training flight with pilots onboard only. AFAIK the tower guy got fired for it the LH captain got degraded to FO status. (Later to become some 747 captain). It happend on march 24, 1974. The captain is said to be retired today but his son seems to be flying for LH.

Look at #3 please for some pic:
https://www.vielfliegertreff.de/hot-spo ... uropa.html
Last edited by Noshow on Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
mchei
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:55 pm

There's only one Youtube Video out there from a simulator.
But talking about landing on runways you shouldn’t land on and talking about the North of Germany, this instantly reminds me of Finkenwerder Airlines aka the Spantax Coronado landing in Hamburg-Finkenwerder instead of Hamburg-Fuhlsbüttel. But that was really off topic, sorry.
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mchei
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 12:56 pm

F70-F100-E145-E170-E190-319-320-321-735–736-737-738-752-763–742-744-333-343-ATR72-Metroliner-Saab2000-Lockheed Electra-C172-C182-C182RG-MD11
 
T4thH
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:29 pm

And the best is, 1974, the longest runway was just 400 m....

And it has not only three concrete runways, it has even additional a helipad.

Bejing Airport has also three runways, so Heligoland Dune Airport is a big as Bejing Airport, the second biggest of the world.

Let us all rename the airport now to:
Heligoland Dune International airport. :rotfl:
.
 
VSMUT
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 3:27 pm

Noshow wrote:
Who requested this S version? Is any airline or route known that needs this performance? It's not overly STOL just a bit it seems.


Air Tahiti, obviously. There are a few other airlines in the Pacific region that are interested in using it for island hopping on routes currently served by much smaller aircraft.
 
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Devilfish
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 3:59 pm

It would make a very fine though too expensive tour plane for Itbayat (RPLT)... :airplane: But since there are very few people there and not much to see, a Caravan will be adequate...while a SkyCourier will be much more than enough... :bigthumbsup: ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rwYx5dUInA


http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=MNL-RPLT,CRK-RPLT&DU=nm

http://www.gcmap.com/airport/RPLT
"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
 
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speedygonzales
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 6:37 pm

VSMUT wrote:
Noshow wrote:
Who requested this S version? Is any airline or route known that needs this performance? It's not overly STOL just a bit it seems.


Air Tahiti, obviously. There are a few other airlines in the Pacific region that are interested in using it for island hopping on routes currently served by much smaller aircraft.

Widerøe is also a hot candidate given their fleet of >20 years old Dash-8 100/200 serving the Norwegian STOL network.
Ignorance kills. :tombstone:
 
T4thH
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 7:10 pm

Some of the features, to be constructed for the STOL version, will be also high interesting for the other members of the ATR family.
The automated breaking system is one of these examples As regional planes, they have often to land on airports with short runways. In bad weather, these runways can get really short. With automated landing system, the risk, a plane will overran a runway is reduced. It will also have a benefit in potential runway excursions while landing. Overran of runways and runway excursions are a general reason for substantial damages or write off*s. Perhaps with time, regarding possibly reduced insurance fees, these additional costs will be worthwhile.

Also they will get the chane to implement and certify many PIPs with the certification of the STOL version. The ATR family will need them, to stay competitive in the next decades.
 
MavyWavyATR
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 8:10 pm

On top of the perspective uses stated here already, this could also offer Dash 7 operators (how many of them are left?) a modern day replacement. While on the subject of ATR offering an STOL version, I wonder how long it'll be before certain carriers ask for an 'S' version of the 72?
 
T4thH
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Wed Oct 09, 2019 9:06 pm

MavyWavyATR wrote:
On top of the perspective uses stated here already, this could also offer Dash 7 operators (how many of them are left?) a modern day replacement. While on the subject of ATR offering an STOL version, I wonder how long it'll be before certain carriers ask for an 'S' version of the 72?


Only three with 8 Dash 7?
Air Tindi with 5
Airkenya: with 2
British Antartica Survey with 1

A S version of the ATR-72; I fear. this will not work.

What is the special feature, which makes of a standard ATR-42 a STOL version? The ATR-42 has the the same engines as the ATR-72, but the maximum power is reduced. The S version has a software update, so during start on short runways, the additional power for the ATR-72 can be used. On normal runways, it will just start with 42 standard power and during flight the power will be also reduced to standard 42 levels. So no additional fuel consumption. So the ATR-42S version can be used as standard version and when needed has additional STOL features.
The ATR-72 S version would need a new engine; so they have to change/upgrade to the more heavy and stronger PW150, used in the Dash 8? This will be a big and high expensive change and a longer more expensive certification. The fuel costs will be higher, for a real limited benefit,
 
VSMUT
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:12 am

T4thH wrote:
MavyWavyATR wrote:
On top of the perspective uses stated here already, this could also offer Dash 7 operators (how many of them are left?) a modern day replacement. While on the subject of ATR offering an STOL version, I wonder how long it'll be before certain carriers ask for an 'S' version of the 72?


Only three with 8 Dash 7?
Air Tindi with 5
Airkenya: with 2
British Antartica Survey with 1

A S version of the ATR-72; I fear. this will not work.

What is the special feature, which makes of a standard ATR-42 a STOL version? The ATR-42 has the the same engines as the ATR-72, but the maximum power is reduced. The S version has a software update, so during start on short runways, the additional power for the ATR-72 can be used. On normal runways, it will just start with 42 standard power and during flight the power will be also reduced to standard 42 levels. So no additional fuel consumption. So the ATR-42S version can be used as standard version and when needed has additional STOL features.
The ATR-72 S version would need a new engine; so they have to change/upgrade to the more heavy and stronger PW150, used in the Dash 8? This will be a big and high expensive change and a longer more expensive certification. The fuel costs will be higher, for a real limited benefit,


Expanding on T4thH:
The ATR 42-600 and 72-600 have the same engines, but due to VMC, the 42 has them limited to a lower power setting. The 42 essentially lacks to tail surface to laterally control the aircraft with one engine failed and the other running at full power. That is the purpose of the bigger rudder, it allows them to unlock the greater power available in the engines. They are not actually putting different engines on the aircraft, hence why a 72-600S won't be likely. The engines don't really have the growth left in them to add anything significant.

The 72-600 is rated at up to 2750 hp in reserve take off power and 2475 hp in takeoff. The 42-600 is rated at only 2400 hp in RTO and 2160 hp in takeoff. Both lie at 2132 hp in cruise. Figures are per engine, with the same engines and propellers mounted on both types.

It will be interesting to see what changes they are making to the 42-600S. Will it get the 72s carbon brakes as well? Auto-braking and spoilers will push the ATR even closer to CAT III capability.

Image
 
Clydenairways
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:50 am

Any changes to the Flaps with this new short field variant?
 
alyusuph
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:08 am

SQ22 wrote:
ATR has formally launched the STOL version of the ATR 42-600 called ATR 42-600S.

According to ATR they have so far received 20 commitments from operators and lessors.

Major changes to the standard version are a larger rudder for increased control at lower speads.

Press release to be found here: http://www.atraircraft.com/newsroom/news.html

Link to previous thread on that subject: viewtopic.php?t=1366381


Didn't they market teh original ATR 42-600 STOL capable right from day one?
I am not an Airbus or Boeing fan, just an aircraft fan
 
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Dublinspotter
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:04 pm

Will be interesting to see how Loganair react. Maybe this is what they have been waiting for.
Dublinspotter
 
VSMUT
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Re: ATR 42-600S (Short Take of and Landing) formally launched

Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:23 pm

Clydenairways wrote:
Any changes to the Flaps with this new short field variant?


It can use the Flaps 25 position for takeoff now:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZiw5SPuZWY
 
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SQ22
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Re: Updated: PNG Air to be Launch Customer of ATR 42-600S (STOL) Version

Tue Feb 11, 2020 11:29 am

FlightGlobal is reporting that PNG Air of Papua New Guinea will be launch customer of the version. The ATR will replace part of the older Q100 fleet operated by the airline. PNG has comitted to take three frames. So far ATR has received 20 commitments in total.

PNG unveiled as launch customer for STOL variant of ATR 42-600

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