AirbusOnly
Topic Author
Posts: 364
Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2006 4:06 am

LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 7:01 am

Anybody know what happend to LH 459? The A 340-600 D-AIHD departed to MUC but immediately after takeoff, the plane began orbiting the Pacific for nearly an hour at 5,000 feet, then landed back in SFO.

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/d-aihd
 
Sand0rf
Posts: 36
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2014 11:12 am

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 7:29 am

According to Tom Podolec on Twitter the aircraft suffered a #1 (outside left) engine failure shortly after departure. It circled to burn up fuel before landing back at SFO.

https://twitter.com/TomPodolec/status/1182162211269222401
 
AirbusOnly
Topic Author
Posts: 364
Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2006 4:06 am

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:06 pm

Does Lufthansa send another plane to pick up the stranded passengers in SFO or do they rebook them on other flights?
 
Bhoy
Posts: 372
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 1:50 pm

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:23 pm

AirbusOnly wrote:
Does Lufthansa send another plane to pick up the stranded passengers in SFO or do they rebook them on other flights?

In the whole, it’ll be quicker for LH to use other carriers flights than scramble an Aircraft (if they even have any spare capacity), fly it out and wait for it to turn around.

They’ll rebook pax with connecting flights in Munich via Frankfurt or (through LX) Zurich, or with their metal neutral JV partners United/Air Canada where possible - so Pax might be rerouted SFO-ORD(or IAH/IAD/YYZ/YUL/LHR)-MUC or similar.
 
330lover
Posts: 607
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2008 7:11 am

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:42 pm

Bhoy wrote:
AirbusOnly wrote:
Does Lufthansa send another plane to pick up the stranded passengers in SFO or do they rebook them on other flights?

In the whole, it’ll be quicker for LH to use other carriers flights than scramble an Aircraft (if they even have any spare capacity), fly it out and wait for it to turn around.

They’ll rebook pax with connecting flights in Munich via Frankfurt or (through LX) Zurich, or with their metal neutral JV partners United/Air Canada where possible - so Pax might be rerouted SFO-ORD(or IAH/IAD/YYZ/YUL/LHR)-MUC or similar.


That's right, by the time a replacement aircraft gets into SFO, most of the pax will have reached (or almost reached) their final destination through reroutings.
Plenty of partners for LH to rerout:
Via FRA on their own flights
Via ORD, EWR, IAH, LHR,... with UA
Via ZRH with LX
Via YVR/YYZ/YUL with AC
...

And in the worst case even reroutings on non-partner airlines (BA, AA, KL, AF, …).
This might sound strange, but when you can get a pax to reach his/her destination smoothly, then you have a satisfied pax who will come back to you.
During my years at BRU, we have rerouted multiple pax on non-partner airlines when there was no 'partner availability'.
Just get your client happy, than he/she will return to you!
Britten Norman Islander VP-FBR on Falkland Islands. THAT'S FLYING!
 
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par13del
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Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:46 pm

So no chance of them flying on 3 engines across the USA to say NYC to allow easier connections for their pax to MUC?
 
sgbroimp
Posts: 199
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2016 6:35 pm

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:49 pm

No silly. Only BA does that and then continues on to LHR also (!!!)
 
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exFWAOONW
Posts: 665
Joined: Wed Nov 25, 2009 10:32 pm

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:53 pm

How would you defend your license if you declare an emergency then pass literally hundreds of suitable alternate airfields to cross an entire continent?
Is just me, or is flying not as much fun anymore?
 
trijetsonly
Posts: 688
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Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 2:58 pm

par13del wrote:
So no chance of them flying on 3 engines across the USA to say NYC to allow easier connections for their pax to MUC?


Lufthansa has done such things in the past.
http://www.avherald.com/h?article=452374ea&opt=0

But there might be other issues preventing it, like performance wise, unknown condition of the engine and the surrounding wing structure, MEL items...
Happy Landings
 
CriticalPoint
Posts: 595
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2017 5:01 pm

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:14 pm

par13del wrote:
So no chance of them flying on 3 engines across the USA to say NYC to allow easier connections for their pax to MUC?


That’s not legal Per the the FAA and BA got in a lot of trouble for doing it.

The rest of the world may allow it but not in the US.
 
sealevel
Posts: 27
Joined: Wed May 23, 2018 9:57 pm

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:26 pm

Interesting, you can dump fuel on the A340, why wait to burn it off?
 
IADCA
Posts: 1868
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 12:24 am

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:37 pm

sealevel wrote:
Interesting, you can dump fuel on the A340, why wait to burn it off?


According to the tweet cited earlier in the thread, they did dump. I wouldn't think they could get a plane fueled for a legal SFO-MUC under MLW in an hour without dumping.
 
shane
Posts: 200
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 2:38 am

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 4:40 pm

sealevel wrote:
Interesting, you can dump fuel on the A340, why wait to burn it off?


Possibly jettisoned fuel causing greater environmental impact at sea level vs. exhaust in the air? It would be interesting to know the difference. It would also be interesting to know how much of that fuel makes it all the way to sea level vs. dissipation / vaporization in air at various altitudes. Any experts on this? I can imagine Lufthansa might actually care about such things, especially when they are not facing an emergency.
 
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par13del
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Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 6:02 pm

CriticalPoint wrote:
par13del wrote:
So no chance of them flying on 3 engines across the USA to say NYC to allow easier connections for their pax to MUC?


That’s not legal Per the the FAA and BA got in a lot of trouble for doing it.

The rest of the world may allow it but not in the US.

I will have to go and research, but I thought the end result of the investigation was that the BA flight was legal, but the USA authorities thought it was bad judgement, knowing that the a/c was UK not USA registered.
 
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par13del
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Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 6:09 pm

Doing some reading, feel free to join in if you don't already have a copy, the link below was in an A.Net thread
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.u ... _06-06.pdf
viewtopic.php?t=749753
 
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par13del
Posts: 9046
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 9:14 pm

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 6:19 pm

On page 29 of the report I found the FAA requirements, unless they were subsequently changed, the flight was legal. So as another poster said, maybe there were additional issues which made the best course of action a RTB, not what may have been convenient for the airline and customers.

The USA Federal Aviation Regulations (FAR Part
121.565) requires a landing at the nearest suitable airport
following an engine failure or IFSD, except for an aircraft
with three or more engines.
 
sealevel
Posts: 27
Joined: Wed May 23, 2018 9:57 pm

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 6:40 pm

Thanks IADCA, didn't read the tweet like a dummy first.
 
sgbroimp
Posts: 199
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2016 6:35 pm

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Thu Oct 10, 2019 7:15 pm

The discussion reminds me of one reason I go out of my way to select 4 engine aircraft when I fly across the drink.
 
shane
Posts: 200
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 2:38 am

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Fri Oct 11, 2019 12:17 am

Just noticed at 5:00 PM PST that the plane is still parked out at the remote stand.
 
ethernal
Posts: 89
Joined: Mon May 06, 2019 12:09 pm

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Fri Oct 11, 2019 12:29 am

sgbroimp wrote:
The discussion reminds me of one reason I go out of my way to select 4 engine aircraft when I fly across the drink.


But why? The end result of an engine out is the same (a diversion) as evidenced by this thread. You're not avoiding any delays.
 
sgbroimp
Posts: 199
Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2016 6:35 pm

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Fri Oct 11, 2019 2:38 pm

Peace of mind of the wife with me is one reason. And no, if a 380 or 747 loses en engine over Greenland my sense is we will fly on and do so at near cruise altitude. And I don't have to tell you we have a fudge factor if two of them go out. How's that looking on a twin? Remote chance, yes? Impossible? No.
 
Azerir
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Oct 12, 2019 7:40 pm

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Sat Oct 12, 2019 7:58 pm

I was on that flight. I sat on the right wing, the failure was on the left.

Heard a couple of deep claps shortly after the takeoff, with the plane making a small drop after each one. Then people started screaming that there is a fire coming out of the engine, but it turned out to be some flares which disappeared shortly. Passengers got calmed down.

Then, a minute after, I heard a pretty big clap and a pretty heavy altitude drop. Then saw some red blaze-ish light in the right wing window immediately afterwards. I did not see it for sure, but the left wing passengers were screaming that the engine was fully set ablaze and were in panic.

A couple of minutes afterwards the situation got normalized as the fire was shutdown.

We cruised for an hour dumping the fuel and made a bit hardish landing at SFO taking normal approach
 
AirbusOnly
Topic Author
Posts: 364
Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2006 4:06 am

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Mon Oct 14, 2019 7:38 am

Any news about D-AIHD? Is that plane still Standing at SFO or / and is a new engine available to be replaced soon?
 
altbg
Posts: 79
Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2013 9:10 pm

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Mon Oct 14, 2019 10:29 pm

That aircraft is still at SFO. It's actually showing up on FR24 right now.
 
AirbusOnly
Topic Author
Posts: 364
Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2006 4:06 am

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Wed Oct 16, 2019 5:51 am

The aircraft is now on ist way back home to Munich as LH9857. Is that a pure transfer flight without passengers or a regular flight? And are they doing with three engines or has the broken been repaired?
https://www.flightradar24.com/DLH9857/227c7c58
 
eamondzhang
Posts: 1349
Joined: Thu Sep 23, 2010 8:23 am

Re: LH 459 diverted to SFO

Wed Oct 16, 2019 6:01 am

AirbusOnly wrote:
The aircraft is now on ist way back to Munich as LH9857. Is that a pure transfer flight without passengers or a regular flight? And are they doing with three engines or has the broken been repaired?
https://www.flightradar24.com/DLH9857/227c7c58

Given they're flying at FL390 I can only assume it's a four-engined pure ferry flight.

Michael

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