Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
T4thH
Topic Author
Posts: 1101
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2019 11:17 pm

Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Mon Nov 11, 2019 4:03 pm

https://simpleflying.com/asiana-airlines-a350-issue/

This is now the third in-flight engine shut down.
First was regarding a broken fuel pipe, to stop the leaking and to shut down the fuel pump, the jet engine fueled by the tank has had to be shut down.
Second was an engine failure (minor)
Third (this one) seems to be again an issue with the engine fuel system (and not with the jet engine itself).
 
LY777
Posts: 2578
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2005 6:58 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Mon Nov 11, 2019 4:06 pm

Another new generation jet with issues...
Flown:717,727,732,733,734,735,738,73H,742/744/748,752,753,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W, 788, 789, DC8,DC10,E190,E195,MD83,MD88, L1011, A3B2,A319,A320-100/200,A321,A332/A333,A343,A388
 
T4thH
Topic Author
Posts: 1101
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2019 11:17 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Mon Nov 11, 2019 5:22 pm

LY777 wrote:
Another new generation jet with issues...

A350 is still doing far better than expected. The Trent XWB engine is just the wet dream (and unbelievable how bad in comparison the Trent 1000 is). The number of issues e.g. is in the normal range, comparable to many other jet families, since prolonged time on duty. So your statement is just wrong.
 
LY777
Posts: 2578
Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2005 6:58 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Mon Nov 11, 2019 5:35 pm

3 IFSD in a rather short period of time is not negligible.
Flown:717,727,732,733,734,735,738,73H,742/744/748,752,753,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W, 788, 789, DC8,DC10,E190,E195,MD83,MD88, L1011, A3B2,A319,A320-100/200,A321,A332/A333,A343,A388
 
ITSTours
Posts: 600
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2017 10:51 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Mon Nov 11, 2019 5:57 pm

HL7579 has already returned to ICN. A replacement was available at MNL, I guess?
 
T4thH
Topic Author
Posts: 1101
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2019 11:17 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Mon Nov 11, 2019 5:58 pm

LY777 wrote:
3 IFSD in a rather short period of time is not negligible.

No, it is around 3 failures in one year timeline., the first was around one year ago. It is still fulfilling all ETOPS criteria. Around every day there is an in flight shut down somewhere in the world. This is part of the job, jet engines will always fail and systems connected to the engines will fail, so engines have to be shut down. Of course, they could always do better.

Uncontained failures and high amount failures in short time as seen for the PW1000G family on the A320 in areas with high air pollution (so as example India) or as seen for the PW1524G of the A220-300 of Swiss in last few month, the RR Trent 1000 issues for the B787; these are critical.
 
rbavfan
Posts: 3629
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:53 am

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Mon Nov 11, 2019 6:07 pm

LY777 wrote:
3 IFSD in a rather short period of time is not negligible.


Over nearly a year it's not unusual.
 
RB211trent
Posts: 163
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2017 11:35 am

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Mon Nov 11, 2019 6:22 pm

Just a quick look on the Aviation Herald website shows a list of Inflight shutdowns and various other aircraft and engine issues. What makes this one different to start a discussion?
 
User avatar
lightsaber
Moderator
Posts: 20556
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:55 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Mon Nov 11, 2019 6:34 pm

Interesting. Fuel systems seem to be the common thread. Not a big deal, but the major subsystem needs some attention.

Nothing dramatic. The LEAP, PW1xxx , and T1000 were all worse.

Lightsaber
Winter is coming.
 
User avatar
zeke
Posts: 15272
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 1:42 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Mon Nov 11, 2019 6:45 pm

T4thH wrote:
https://simpleflying.com/asiana-airlines-a350-issue/

This is now the third in-flight engine shut down.
First was regarding a broken fuel pipe, to stop the leaking and to shut down the fuel pump, the jet engine fueled by the tank has had to be shut down.
Second was an engine failure (minor)
Third (this one) seems to be again an issue with the engine fuel system (and not with the jet engine itself).


The article doesn’t actually say there was an issue with the engine, just that they shut an engine down. Considering another poster has suggested the aircraft is already back in ICN makes me think it wasn’t an engine issue.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
T4thH
Topic Author
Posts: 1101
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2019 11:17 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:27 pm

zeke wrote:
T4thH wrote:
https://simpleflying.com/asiana-airlines-a350-issue/

This is now the third in-flight engine shut down.
First was regarding a broken fuel pipe, to stop the leaking and to shut down the fuel pump, the jet engine fueled by the tank has had to be shut down.
Second was an engine failure (minor)
Third (this one) seems to be again an issue with the engine fuel system (and not with the jet engine itself).


The article doesn’t actually say there was an issue with the engine, just that they shut an engine down. Considering another poster has suggested the aircraft is already back in ICN makes me think it wasn’t an engine issue.

An in flight shutdown of an engine is an in flight shutdown. ETOPS certification does not care, why it has been shut down. The difference is of course, a broken engine is regular highly expensive, a million of $ is nothing...

And yes, "fuel systems" sounds like some external issue, independent of the jet engine itself, so something with leaking pipes or fuel tanks, broken down fuel pump e.g.
 
rbavfan
Posts: 3629
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:53 am

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Mon Nov 11, 2019 8:34 pm

RB211trent wrote:
Just a quick look on the Aviation Herald website shows a list of Inflight shutdowns and various other aircraft and engine issues. What makes this one different to start a discussion?


That it's Ariliners.net, not Aviation harold.
 
User avatar
zeke
Posts: 15272
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 1:42 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Tue Nov 12, 2019 4:15 am

T4thH wrote:
An in flight shutdown of an engine is an in flight shutdown. ETOPS certification does not care, why it has been shut down. The difference is of course, a broken engine is regular highly expensive, a million of $ is nothing...

And yes, "fuel systems" sounds like some external issue, independent of the jet engine itself, so something with leaking pipes or fuel tanks, broken down fuel pump e.g.


I am well aware of how EDTO works, and it is not as cut and dry as you think. Besides you claim in your thread title “Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion”, no evidence has been presented to suggest there was an engine issue.

You also have not provided any evidence of the other engine problems you claim that have occurred.

The Trent XWB has had the best EIS of any large engine in the past two decades.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
mjoelnir
Posts: 9411
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2013 11:06 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Tue Nov 12, 2019 4:29 am

http://avherald.com/h?article=4cf14f72&opt=0

that is the story in the avherald: failure in the engine fuel system
 
T4thH
Topic Author
Posts: 1101
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2019 11:17 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Tue Nov 12, 2019 7:14 am

zeke wrote:
T4thH wrote:
An in flight shutdown of an engine is an in flight shutdown. ETOPS certification does not care, why it has been shut down. The difference is of course, a broken engine is regular highly expensive, a million of $ is nothing...

And yes, "fuel systems" sounds like some external issue, independent of the jet engine itself, so something with leaking pipes or fuel tanks, broken down fuel pump e.g.


I am well aware of how EDTO works, and it is not as cut and dry as you think. Besides you claim in your thread title “Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion”, no evidence has been presented to suggest there was an engine issue.

You also have not provided any evidence of the other engine problems you claim that have occurred.

The Trent XWB has had the best EIS of any large engine in the past two decades.


To avoid a misunderstanding. This is the title of the link, I have not modified it. And yes, you are right, I shall have better modified the title in this single case, as it is misleading, I prefer not to do this. Regarding the other cases, sorry, I have perhaps expected too much, that it is regular knowledge. I can search for them, but only after work, so in several hours.
 
ITSTours
Posts: 600
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2017 10:51 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Tue Nov 12, 2019 7:50 am

HL7579 has by the way been flying without a delay. https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/hl7579
So what was the problem? Let's wait for the report, I guess?
 
User avatar
zeke
Posts: 15272
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 1:42 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Tue Nov 12, 2019 2:49 pm

T4thH wrote:
Regarding the other cases, sorry, I have perhaps expected too much, that it is regular knowledge. I can search for them, but only after work, so in several hours.


I follow A350 events closely, I am not aware of these events.

ITSTours wrote:
HL7579 has by the way been flying without a delay. https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/hl7579
So what was the problem? Let's wait for the report, I guess?


There is published TAB (Temporary Abnormal Behavior) on the newer A350s in the fuel quantity indication and onboard fuel sensing which requires the crew to reset both the fuel quality monitoring systems before start. If the crew failed to perform this action before start it can result in a false fuel leak suspected ECAM, which can drive the crew to shutdown an engine and divert.

This may explain the quick return to service, essentially a known issue, with a known way to resolve. It simply maybe new crew to the aircraft that were not aware of the TAB (much the same as OEBs on older Airbus aircraft).
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
tommy1808
Posts: 13711
Joined: Thu Nov 21, 2013 3:24 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Tue Nov 12, 2019 2:53 pm

zeke wrote:
T4thH wrote:
Regarding the other cases, sorry, I have perhaps expected too much, that it is regular knowledge. I can search for them, but only after work, so in several hours.


I follow A350 events closely, I am not aware of these events.


OT, but not worth a thread, but since you are an A350 Pilot. How does information regarding incidents and accidents get to pilots, before it yielded a directive? Just if they are curious or in a structured fashion?

Best regards
Thomas
Well, there is prophecy in the bible after all: 2 Timothy 3:1-6
 
User avatar
zeke
Posts: 15272
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 1:42 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Tue Nov 12, 2019 3:02 pm

Via the electronic “manual” updates and also with updates from the in house technical boffins.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
ikramerica
Posts: 15100
Joined: Mon May 23, 2005 9:33 am

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Tue Nov 12, 2019 3:06 pm

rbavfan wrote:
RB211trent wrote:
Just a quick look on the Aviation Herald website shows a list of Inflight shutdowns and various other aircraft and engine issues. What makes this one different to start a discussion?


That it's Ariliners.net, not Aviation harold.

Don’t call me harold.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
maint123
Posts: 396
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2018 4:18 pm

Re: Asiana Airlines Airbus A350 Engine Issues Prompts Diversion

Tue Nov 12, 2019 3:45 pm

3 issues vs more than 120 in a year for the PW powered Neos.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos