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Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 1:10 pm
by Max Q
I know there’s been helicopter service between these airports over the years but has any regional or main line carrier ever
operated a shuttle service of some kind between any of these three main NY airports ?


Of course they are all close together mileage wise but actually traveling between them by surface transport can take a long time with the usual congestion


Whereas a turboprop would have you there in minutes and there’s plenty of connecting passengers

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 1:30 pm
by jetskipper
Actual flight time could be minutes, but all three airports have notoriously long taxi times. Let’s say you have to be there 45 minutes before the flight minimum, 30 minute taxi out, 20 minute flight, 10 minute taxi in, you are looking at 1:45. That could easily be done by surface transport for a fraction of the cost. The taxi and flight times could be brought down if flights were scheduled in off times, either way not dependable enough for the price.

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 3:03 pm
by EWRandMDW
If memory serves, in the very late 1960s New York Airways experimented with Twin Otter flights among the 3 airports. I don't know why because the DHC-6 could carry 19 pax whereas the Boeing-Vertol 107 could carry about 25 or so. I think the experiment ended when a DHC-6 taxiing behind a 707 or DC-8 on its take-off run was blown upside down by the jet exhaust. There were some deaths, unfortunately.

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 5:10 pm
by deltairlines
Flight times wouldn't be extremely short either. I've often seen some of the Delta ferry flights between JFK//LGA and flight time is often around 30 minutes in the air once you get into the air and then work themselves into the arrival pattern of the arrival airport. Given the congestion in NYC Airspace, these planes might often go out well into Long Island.

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 6:21 pm
by flyby519
I’d like to see airship service starting at some residential spot in Long Island then making stops in JFK, LGA, Manhattan, EWR, then residential spot in NJ and reverse back again. Blimps! The future of air travel! :bouncy:

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 6:54 pm
by WesternDC6
In 1968 I flew on a Shorts Skyvan commuter from JFK to EWR and then down to Mercer County Airport NJ (I don't think it is there anymore). I don't remember the airline. The flight was at night and we flew directly over the Statue of Liberty. My Dad also took a flight from Mercer County up to JFK in a small Apache a year later.

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 7:27 pm
by AABusDrvr
deltairlines wrote:
Flight times wouldn't be extremely short either. I've often seen some of the Delta ferry flights between JFK//LGA and flight time is often around 30 minutes in the air once you get into the air and then work themselves into the arrival pattern of the arrival airport. Given the congestion in NYC Airspace, these planes might often go out well into Long Island.



Not DL, but when I was based in NY I ferried airplanes from both JFK and EWR, to LGA. The worst was a JFK-LGA, after almost 90 minutes of taxi time at JFK, we had to go north of BOS, and join the arrival stream from there. Hours from gate to gate.

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:02 pm
by N47
AABusDrvr wrote:
deltairlines wrote:
Flight times wouldn't be extremely short either. I've often seen some of the Delta ferry flights between JFK//LGA and flight time is often around 30 minutes in the air once you get into the air and then work themselves into the arrival pattern of the arrival airport. Given the congestion in NYC Airspace, these planes might often go out well into Long Island.



Not DL, but when I was based in NY I ferried airplanes from both JFK and EWR, to LGA. The worst was a JFK-LGA, after almost 90 minutes of taxi time at JFK, we had to go north of BOS, and join the arrival stream from there. Hours from gate to gate.


Wow thats crazy! That must have been longer than a JFK to BOS flight.

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 10:00 pm
by MIflyer12
A.net has strident threads on how the industry shouldn't be forced to reduce greenhouse gas emissions, followed by arguments that carriers should care more about ferry flights, and then this. As hard as public transit sucks in NYC, moving people 30 miles by air is a dumb idea.

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Sun Nov 17, 2019 11:14 pm
by GalaxyFlyer
Bank check operators used to do it a lot. Pretty quick, if it was VFR or any semi-reasonable facsimile of VFR.

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 5:56 am
by mga707
EWRandMDW wrote:
If memory serves, in the very late 1960s New York Airways experimented with Twin Otter flights among the 3 airports. I don't know why because the DHC-6 could carry 19 pax whereas the Boeing-Vertol 107 could carry about 25 or so. I think the experiment ended when a DHC-6 taxiing behind a 707 or DC-8 on its take-off run was blown upside down by the jet exhaust. There were some deaths, unfortunately.


I can find no record of a fatal accident involving a New York Airways DHC-6, which they only flew briefly, in 1969. Three fatal accidents listed, the most famous being the 1977 crash of an S-61L on the rooftop heliport of the Pan Am Building in Manhattan, with 5 fatalities. The other two were a Vertol 107 shortly after takeoff from then-IDL in 1963 (6 fatalities), and a 1979 departure accident at EWR with an S-61L that also had three fatalities. That final accident led to the shutdown of the entire operation shortly thereafter.

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 6:19 am
by SkyVoice
I do remember when an airline had fixed-wing service between a large city's two commercial airports. The city was Houston, Texas. Back in the Eighties, Continental Airlines and/or Continental Express dedicated a DC-9 to shuttle passengers between Hobby (HOU) & Intercontinental (IAH). I read about that in an old issue of Frequent Flyer magazine.

But, I doubt that this would work today, especially in New York, for the reasons already listed above. It's a different world today than it was 35 years ago.

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 7:02 am
by KPWMSpotter
mga707 wrote:
I can find no record of a fatal accident involving a New York Airways DHC-6, which they only flew briefly, in 1969. Three fatal accidents listed, the most famous being the 1977 crash of an S-61L on the rooftop heliport of the Pan Am Building in Manhattan, with 5 fatalities. The other two were a Vertol 107 shortly after takeoff from then-IDL in 1963 (6 fatalities), and a 1979 departure accident at EWR with an S-61L that also had three fatalities. That final accident led to the shutdown of the entire operation shortly thereafter.


https://ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.aviation ... 7117&key=0

N558MA, DHC-6 on 7/15/1969.

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 7:06 am
by cedarjet
FedEx had a scheduled 727 flight that went MEM JFK LGA and v. v. No revenue pax but staff could use it, my buddy jumpseated on it from JFK to LGA.

Re: Any fixed wing operators between JFK-EWR-LGA ?

Posted: Mon Nov 18, 2019 8:11 am
by trees
AAL9649 yesterday was a positioning flight LGA-JFK took 0:30