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TS-IOR
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Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 4:49 pm

According to Tunisair CCO, the rumour of the airline loosing its Heathrow slots is neither true nor false! Talks are in progress with ACL and there is also a diplomatic relay to try to keep the four weekly LHR slots available. According to him, the weekend slots are more likely to go. If so, there will be no interest in keeping the Tuesday and Friday ones. Tunisair also operates out of LGW on days 134, but there's no mean to get more there. STN will more likely become the Tunisair's London gateway where they can operate daily and it's not a coordinated airport. The reason why Heathrow regulators are upset behind Tunisiar is none other than delays, delays, delays!
Last edited by atcsundevil on Sun Nov 24, 2019 5:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Edited spelling in title
 
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DL747400
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Re: Tunisiar to loose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 4:52 pm

VS shall be delighted to get their hands on any commercially viable LHR slots which might become available. If they are good slots, I could even see DELTA writing the cheque to fund the purchase.
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Andy33
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Re: Tunisiar to loose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 5:06 pm

DL747400 wrote:
VS shall be delighted to get their hands on any commercially viable LHR slots which might become available. If they are good slots, I could even see DELTA writing the cheque to fund the purchase.


If it has reached the stages of ACL being involved, it is too late to wave the cheque book. ACL is the slot coordination authority and only gets involved if the slots are likely to be forfeited for breach of operating conditions. Forfeited slots are returned to the unallocated pool, and can be applied for by any airline, with preference given to airlines not already using Heathrow.
 
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TS-IOR
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 5:18 pm

Tunisair should have traded its LHR slots years ago now. LHR is useless in its network map. Any other London airport would fit the need.
 
SueD
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Re: Tunisiar to loose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 5:23 pm

DL747400 wrote:
VS shall be delighted to get their hands on any commercially viable LHR slots which might become available. If they are good slots, I could even see DELTA writing the cheque to fund the purchase.


Very late afternoon and early evening - utterly hopeless for Transatlantic - more likely a Chinese carrier to another city no ones ever heard of a few days a week adding more debt to the billions of losses these services produce !
 
sk736
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Re: Tunisiar to loose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 5:35 pm

SueD wrote:
DL747400 wrote:
VS shall be delighted to get their hands on any commercially viable LHR slots which might become available. If they are good slots, I could even see DELTA writing the cheque to fund the purchase.


Very late afternoon and early evening - utterly hopeless for Transatlantic - more likely a Chinese carrier to another city no ones ever heard of a few days a week adding more debt to the billions of losses these services produce !

Why are you concerned about a Chinese airline losing money?
 
ethernal
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Re: Tunisiar to loose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 5:37 pm

SueD wrote:
DL747400 wrote:
VS shall be delighted to get their hands on any commercially viable LHR slots which might become available. If they are good slots, I could even see DELTA writing the cheque to fund the purchase.


Very late afternoon and early evening - utterly hopeless for Transatlantic - more likely a Chinese carrier to another city no ones ever heard of a few days a week adding more debt to the billions of losses these services produce !


Not sure why you think late afternoon / early evening is a useless transatlantic slot (at least East Coast TATL). If you're doing O&D it's a great time for business travelers. I used to regularly take a 6 PM flight out of Heathrow that would get me home by a bit after 9 PM EST. Was great to fly out Sunday night, work full days Mon-Thurs (cutting out a bit early on Thursday - 3:30 PM or so). Obviously it's a more challenging slot if you need significant feed on the US side.
 
SueD
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 5:43 pm

TS-IOR wrote:
Tunisair should have traded its LHR slots years ago now. LHR is useless in its network map. Any other London airport would fit the need.


Think they stuck it out because for several years after the Port El Kantaoui terrorist outrages when UK carriers were prevented by the UK government from flying to Tunisia.
During this time Tunisair provided the only direct link ,maintained in large part by diplomatic demand including those accessing a certain point to the immediate east !
 
SueD
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 5:59 pm

SueD wrote:
TS-IOR wrote:
Tunisair should have traded its LHR slots years ago now. LHR is useless in its network map. Any other London airport would fit the need.


Think they stuck it out because for several years after the Port El Kantaoui terrorist outrages when UK carriers were prevented by the UK government from flying to Tunisia.
During this time Tunisair provided the only direct link ,maintained in large part by diplomatic demand including those accessing a certain point to the immediate east !


Its a slot PAIR arrival time BST 17.50 (5.50 pm)-Too early for a morning departure from the east coast , and almost two hours after the last west coat realistic arrival.
Depart time summer 19.10 (7.10pm) well yes an East bound could use this I suppose.

But as a pair and as Andy33 rightly said if confiscated they WILL go back in pool and be allocated to a new entrant under rules . That lead me to my previous comment a no mark nowhere Chinese carrier .

Actually lite bulb moment! combine these with the Garuda slots and its forms the framework for China Southerns proposed Daxing service
 
AIR MALTA
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 6:37 pm

TS-IOR wrote:
According to Tunisair CCO, the rumour of the airline loosing its Heathrow slots is neither true nor false! Talks are in progress with ACL and there is also a diplomatic relay to try to keep the four weekly LHR slots available. According to him, the weekend slots are more likely to go. If so, there will be no interest in keeping the Tuesday and Friday ones. Tunisair also operates out of LGW on days 134, but there's no mean to get more there. STN will more likely become the Tunisair's London gateway where they can operate daily and it's not a coordinated airport. The reason why Heathrow regulators are upset behind Tunisiar is none other than delays, delays, delays!

That will serve them right! TU has become a garbage airline with massive delays (7h+ delays are regular), mediocre service and extremely filthy cabins. I have complained to CAA about the delays several times in the hope of having their slots taken.
Next flights : BRU-ZRH-CAI (LX)/ BRU-FCO-TLV (AZ)
 
SueD
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Re: Tunisiar to loose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 6:46 pm

sk736 wrote:
SueD wrote:
DL747400 wrote:
VS shall be delighted to get their hands on any commercially viable LHR slots which might become available. If they are good slots, I could even see DELTA writing the cheque to fund the purchase.


Very late afternoon and early evening - utterly hopeless for Transatlantic - more likely a Chinese carrier to another city no ones ever heard of a few days a week adding more debt to the billions of losses these services produce !

Why are you concerned about a Chinese airline losing money?


Not particularly bothered right now however their long game is far more disturbing imho.

Far more of a threat to commercial western operations than any of the ME3 as they are tools and the vehicle of the PRCs global drive for domination sanctioned from the highest office !
 
AIR MALTA
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 6:48 pm

Any source to that?

It seems also that easyJet has requested some slots at Tunis Carthage airport. We may finally see another airline than Tunisair on the London route.
Next flights : BRU-ZRH-CAI (LX)/ BRU-FCO-TLV (AZ)
 
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DL747400
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Re: Tunisiar to loose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 7:09 pm

SueD wrote:
Very late afternoon and early evening - utterly hopeless for Transatlantic - more likely a Chinese carrier to another city no ones ever heard of a few days a week adding more debt to the billions of losses these services produce !


Haven't airlines operated evening departures in the LHR-JFK market for decades? I know PAN AM operated these for many years. Clearly focused on the traffic for whom NYC was the final destination, but it's not like this would be in the category of "utterly hopeless for Transatlantic."
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SueD
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 7:35 pm

Still do going east right up to about 19.00 [7pm) however this is a slot pair and the arrival is utter useless as I said.

Think about it from both side of the ocean time differences !

Frankly another JFK really isn’t needed is it?
 
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TS-IOR
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 9:25 pm

SueD wrote:
TS-IOR wrote:
Tunisair should have traded its LHR slots years ago now. LHR is useless in its network map. Any other London airport would fit the need.


Think they stuck it out because for several years after the Port El Kantaoui terrorist outrages when UK carriers were prevented by the UK government from flying to Tunisia.
During this time Tunisair provided the only direct link ,maintained in large part by diplomatic demand including those accessing a certain point to the immediate east !


Yes, but this was not a reason to stay at LHR. They could have moved to any other London airport and catered well to any traveller willing to fly UK-Tunisia (and beyond). I think with all the hardships, if you do not have an alliance that fills your seats you do not belong to Heathrow or any other hub of the kind.
 
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TS-IOR
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 9:28 pm

AIR MALTA wrote:
Any source to that?

It seems also that easyJet has requested some slots at Tunis Carthage airport. We may finally see another airline than Tunisair on the London route.


I heard that Nouvelair has been granted rights of traffic on a Tunis-London route. No schedule announcement so far. Nouvelair would go LGW, LTN or STN, all are suitable. easyJet operated regular London-Monastir in 2015, but never heard they expressed interest on linking London to Tunis. They had the rights anyways as long as no other UK airline was competing.
 
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Jamake1
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Re: Tunisiar to loose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 9:55 pm

DL747400 wrote:
VS shall be delighted to get their hands on any commercially viable LHR slots which might become available. If they are good slots, I could even see DELTA writing the cheque to fund the purchase.


I hope it’s JetBlue that prevails...
Come fly the sun.
 
SeanM1997
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 10:08 pm

TS-IOR wrote:
AIR MALTA wrote:
Any source to that?

It seems also that easyJet has requested some slots at Tunis Carthage airport. We may finally see another airline than Tunisair on the London route.


I heard that Nouvelair has been granted rights of traffic on a Tunis-London route. No schedule announcement so far. Nouvelair would go LGW, LTN or STN, all are suitable. easyJet operated regular London-Monastir in 2015, but never heard they expressed interest on linking London to Tunis. They had the rights anyways as long as no other UK airline was competing.


Got a source about Nouvelair being granted rights for Tunis-London?
 
abrelosojos
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Sun Nov 24, 2019 11:11 pm

How would the times work for Vistara ...?

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Alex
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CALMSP
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Re: Tunisiar to loose LHR slots

Mon Nov 25, 2019 12:02 am

SueD wrote:
DL747400 wrote:
VS shall be delighted to get their hands on any commercially viable LHR slots which might become available. If they are good slots, I could even see DELTA writing the cheque to fund the purchase.


Very late afternoon and early evening - utterly hopeless for Transatlantic - more likely a Chinese carrier to another city no ones ever heard of a few days a week adding more debt to the billions of losses these services produce !


for those specific times yes, but what if the likes of hte JV's between UA/LH, BA/AA, DL/KL/AF and the european side changes their flights to these Tunisair times and opens up a morning arrival fro a trans-atlantic.
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Mon Nov 25, 2019 1:16 am

abrelosojos wrote:
How would the times work for Vistara ...?

Saludos,
Alex


They're pretty good slots for India so long as the focus isn't TATL connections, which it wouldn't be for Vista.

DEL-LHR 13:50-17:50
LHR-DEL 19:10-09:10
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Andy33
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Re: Tunisiar to loose LHR slots

Mon Nov 25, 2019 7:41 am

Jamake1 wrote:
DL747400 wrote:
VS shall be delighted to get their hands on any commercially viable LHR slots which might become available. If they are good slots, I could even see DELTA writing the cheque to fund the purchase.


I hope it’s JetBlue that prevails...


I'm hoping that was a joke. If it was serious, well, the slot coordinator is considering forfeiting Tunisair's slots. This can only be for non-compliance with one or more of the conditions under which slots are allocated. We don't know which condition (s) are involved in this case, but one of they key conditions is that slots must actually be operated on at least 80% of dates in each IATA season for which they are valid. JetBlue can't do this because the FAA has not yet given them ETOPS approval, and none of the planes they intend to use on transatlantic operations have been delivered.
It's quite possible under these circumstances that no slots would be allocated to them.
If they were allocated, to avoid forfeiting them, JetBlue would need to do one of the following:
a) Fly the slots themselves but using a US-registered wet-lease airline to provide planes and crews (expensive) or
b) Find another airline willing to use the slots for the indeterminate amount of time until JetBlue can start operations, and then stop immediately - airline would need to have traffic rights for whichever route is involved. or
c) Pay an ECAA registered airline to operate shorthaul slot-sitting flights.
 
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GCT64
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Mon Nov 25, 2019 7:44 am

Pretty awful mismanagement by Tunisair to lose the slots back to ACL (for nothing) and not to sell them to someone else if they couldn't use them properly. Literally throwing money away. Anyway, as mentioned above, a Chinese carrier will probably be happy to pick them up.
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fcogafa
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Mon Nov 25, 2019 8:45 am

Wouldnt be surprised if CAL looked at them to move back up from Gatwick
 
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TS-IOR
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Mon Nov 25, 2019 12:11 pm

GCT64 wrote:
Pretty awful mismanagement by Tunisair to lose the slots back to ACL (for nothing) and not to sell them to someone else if they couldn't use them properly. Literally throwing money away. Anyway, as mentioned above, a Chinese carrier will probably be happy to pick them up.


Absolutely. As a public company this should be considered as mismanagement of public funds and people money. For W18 ACL requested to show effort towards punctuality, but they failed. In April 2019 ALL fined them with £8000 circa 30K Tunisian Dinars which is a good money.
 
AIR MALTA
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Mon Dec 02, 2019 8:54 am

Apparently Tunisair has lost 6 of 8 slots at LHR and 2 of 6 at LGW. So there will be ablt to fly to Heathrow once a week and Gatwick twice a week.
So to me it doesn't make sense to continue operating to LGW and LHR. They should relocate to STN or LTN.

A bit off topic but easyJet and Nouvelair will start operating NBE-LGW route in summer 2020.
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Sokes
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Re: Tunisiar to loose LHR slots

Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:17 am

SueD wrote:
sk736 wrote:
Why are you concerned about a Chinese airline losing money?


Not particularly bothered right now however their long game is far more disturbing imho.

Far more of a threat to commercial western operations than any of the ME3 as they are tools and the vehicle of the PRCs global drive for domination sanctioned from the highest office !


I don't understand. Can you expand?
Why can't the world be a little bit more autistic?
 
stylo777
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:25 am

according to the "initial coordination analysis" by ACL (have seen it on twitter...), Tunisair (8) as well as Turkmenistan Airlines (2) lost all their historical slots. can someone confirm?

new allocations are:
# Year round Incumbent: 2 - Virgin Atlantic
# Year round new entrant: 2 - Shenzen Airlines
# New incumbent: 4 - China Southern / 2 - Tunirair (which doesn't make sense here...)
# New entrant: 6 - Norwegian
 
Arion640
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Re: Tunisiar to loose LHR slots

Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:52 am

SueD wrote:
sk736 wrote:
SueD wrote:

Very late afternoon and early evening - utterly hopeless for Transatlantic - more likely a Chinese carrier to another city no ones ever heard of a few days a week adding more debt to the billions of losses these services produce !

Why are you concerned about a Chinese airline losing money?


Not particularly bothered right now however their long game is far more disturbing imho.

Far more of a threat to commercial western operations than any of the ME3 as they are tools and the vehicle of the PRCs global drive for domination sanctioned from the highest office !


They are currently bringing lots of tourist revenue to lots of countries though.
 
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TS-IOR
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Re: Tunisiar to lose LHR slots

Thu Jan 02, 2020 12:49 am

Latest Amadeus timetable update shows Tunisair TUN-LON service with three flights a week, Tuesday LHR and Wednesday and Thursday LGW. That means they lost the day 1 slot at Gatwick and days 567 at Heathrow. Weird planning to say the few and wonder how much they could save (and not lose) if they close the UK destination and send all that staff home.

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