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jupiter2
Posts: 1739
Joined: Tue Jan 02, 2001 11:30 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 3:18 am

lessredtape wrote:
EK413 wrote:
Jetstar pilots decide on Christmas strike


Jetstar ground crews and baggage handlers across the country have voted to strike in the weeks leading up to Christmas and beyond.

The decision was taken after the workers rejected the airline operators rejected their demands for better employment conditions.

These included 30 guaranteed hours of work per week and increases in current wages.

https://www.9news.com.au/national/jetst ... 0bf12cd7a8




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
this is unionism gone mad. We're heading into a massive & long recession. SOme pilots will end with pay cuts of up to 100%


Pilots are not involved, but the staff who are, are some of the lowest paid in the industry, so I can't blame for trying to get a wage increase. Can't ever remember Jetstar having been involved in a strike before,

Well at least they hadn't when I first replied.......edited.
 
waoz1
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 3:54 am

qf789 wrote:
Philippine to start PER-MNL, 4 weekly A321neo from 30 Mar 20

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... la-flights


Glad to see them back
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 4:52 am

lessredtape wrote:
EK413 wrote:
Jetstar pilots decide on Christmas strike


Jetstar ground crews and baggage handlers across the country have voted to strike in the weeks leading up to Christmas and beyond.

The decision was taken after the workers rejected the airline operators rejected their demands for better employment conditions.

These included 30 guaranteed hours of work per week and increases in current wages.

https://www.9news.com.au/national/jetst ... 0bf12cd7a8




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
this is unionism gone mad. We're heading into a massive & long recession. SOme pilots will end with pay cuts of up to 100%


This is not about unionism. This is about offering better pay and working conditions. The majority of ground handlers throughout Australia are only employed part time or casual. If you are permanent part time like myself we are employed for a minimum of 60 hours a month. Now I could be rostered 30 hours 1 week, 20 hours the second, 10 hours the third week and zero hours the last week, that's just how it works. One thing that is being demanded here is better job security. In our new EBA we are being offered regular pay increases, an extra week of annual leave going from 4 to 5 weeks a year, minimum shift hours being increased by an hour along with other things being offered. As pointed out ground staff are some of the lowest paid in the industry. Qantas pays their ground staff an entry pay level of just under $21 an hour though they do offer some good loadings depending an the day and time you work, ground handlers such as Dnata, Swissport and Menzies all offer a higher base rate but not as generous loadings as QF does.

Unfortunately the only way to make airlines pay attention to this is to hit them where it hurts the most, during the peak travel season.
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 4:59 am

waoz1 wrote:
qf789 wrote:
Philippine to start PER-MNL, 4 weekly A321neo from 30 Mar 20

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... la-flights


Glad to see them back


I was surprised to see this but good to see another airline at PER

On a separate note QR will fly A388 to PER tomorrow with 77W operating Sun to Thursday than A388 will be back full time from next Friday
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:11 am

$21 an hour is rediculously low. That's basically the same as what Coles or Woolworths pay for an store hand or service team member.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
vhebb
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:16 am

All frontline QF/JQ staff took a pay cut of 3% a few years ago to now watch the CEO and other senior managers taking home many millions.
 
ben175
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:50 am

waoz1 wrote:
qf789 wrote:
Philippine to start PER-MNL, 4 weekly A321neo from 30 Mar 20

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... la-flights


Glad to see them back


Great news! I hope this goes better for them than their first attempt.

Hopefully we can get a 321neo service to SGN sometime in the next few years.
 
dredgy
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:59 am

RyanairGuru wrote:
$21 an hour is rediculously low. That's basically the same as what Coles or Woolworths pay for an store hand or service team member.


Yup. It’s less than what I pay wait staff at my restaurant.
 
lessredtape
Posts: 120
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 6:10 am

qf789 wrote:
lessredtape wrote:
EK413 wrote:
Jetstar pilots decide on Christmas strike


Jetstar ground crews and baggage handlers across the country have voted to strike in the weeks leading up to Christmas and beyond.

The decision was taken after the workers rejected the airline operators rejected their demands for better employment conditions.

These included 30 guaranteed hours of work per week and increases in current wages.

https://www.9news.com.au/national/jetst ... 0bf12cd7a8




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
this is unionism gone mad. We're heading into a massive & long recession. SOme pilots will end with pay cuts of up to 100%


This is not about unionism. This is about offering better pay and working conditions. The majority of ground handlers throughout Australia are only employed part time or casual. If you are permanent part time like myself we are employed for a minimum of 60 hours a month. Now I could be rostered 30 hours 1 week, 20 hours the second, 10 hours the third week and zero hours the last week, that's just how it works. One thing that is being demanded here is better job security. In our new EBA we are being offered regular pay increases, an extra week of annual leave going from 4 to 5 weeks a year, minimum shift hours being increased by an hour along with other things being offered. As pointed out ground staff are some of the lowest paid in the industry. Qantas pays their ground staff an entry pay level of just under $21 an hour though they do offer some good loadings depending an the day and time you work, ground handlers such as Dnata, Swissport and Menzies all offer a higher base rate but not as generous loadings as QF does.

Unfortunately the only way to make airlines pay attention to this is to hit them where it hurts the most, during the peak travel season.
you don't get it. Airlines are shrinking & that means less workers required. Many airlines won't survive the recession & many have already folded. Thomas COok was last big one to close down.
 
lessredtape
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 6:15 am

jupiter2 wrote:
lessredtape wrote:
EK413 wrote:
Jetstar pilots decide on Christmas strike


Jetstar ground crews and baggage handlers across the country have voted to strike in the weeks leading up to Christmas and beyond.

The decision was taken after the workers rejected the airline operators rejected their demands for better employment conditions.

These included 30 guaranteed hours of work per week and increases in current wages.

https://www.9news.com.au/national/jetst ... 0bf12cd7a8




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
this is unionism gone mad. We're heading into a massive & long recession. SOme pilots will end with pay cuts of up to 100%


Pilots are not involved, but the staff who are, are some of the lowest paid in the industry, so I can't blame for trying to get a wage increase. Can't ever remember Jetstar having been involved in a strike before,

Well at least they hadn't when I first replied.......edited.
ok but there are lots of airline employees looking for work, as they get laid off
 
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SCFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 6:28 am

lessredtape wrote:
RyanairGuru wrote:
lessredtape wrote:
this is not good as plays into QF hands. VA needs to somehow go daily, even with a smaller aircraft. Surely they could work out something with one of their owners, or send an a330 to LAX via somewhere ?

Where though ?

NAN with absolute min stop ? Fijians wouldn't give them rights NAN/LAX though.

APW ? Sure Samoans would give them rights APW/LAX. No idea what runway at APW is like.


In late August/early September most people won't even notice. It's a seasonal reduction to cover maintenance in low season. There really isn't much to discuss.
no business type wants to go via another OZ city to get to LAX. Via AKL or NAN is still popular with leisure crowd.?


Edit: With the exception of ULCCs/Charters, virtually no long-haul airline are interested in the 1-stop "leisure crowd" routes as it's "low yielding", has increased operating costs and there's not much money to be made from those low yielding routes.
Last edited by SCFlyer on Fri Dec 06, 2019 6:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
jupiter2
Posts: 1739
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 6:34 am

lessredtape wrote:
jupiter2 wrote:
lessredtape wrote:
this is unionism gone mad. We're heading into a massive & long recession. SOme pilots will end with pay cuts of up to 100%


Pilots are not involved, but the staff who are, are some of the lowest paid in the industry, so I can't blame for trying to get a wage increase. Can't ever remember Jetstar having been involved in a strike before,

Well at least they hadn't when I first replied.......edited.
ok but there are lots of airline employees looking for work, as they get laid off


Show me an industry in this country that has wage growth and employment growth, besides maybe I.T. and delivery drivers/warehousing for all the online shopping ? B.T.W. those delivery drivers take home some great pay, after working 60 plus hours every week as a subbie, No annual leave, no sick leave, run your own vehicle as well. The people in the background, who do the hands on manual labour, are the ones getting screwed in the present economic climate, work your arse off, get paid a pittance, little to know chance of a wage rise, speak out and find yourself out the door, plenty of other suckers who'll do the job no questions asked, till they drop at least.

Good luck to these ground staff especially, they work in a crap conditions, get paid crap and often get treated the same way.
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 6:37 am

lessredtape wrote:
qf789 wrote:
lessredtape wrote:
this is unionism gone mad. We're heading into a massive & long recession. SOme pilots will end with pay cuts of up to 100%


This is not about unionism. This is about offering better pay and working conditions. The majority of ground handlers throughout Australia are only employed part time or casual. If you are permanent part time like myself we are employed for a minimum of 60 hours a month. Now I could be rostered 30 hours 1 week, 20 hours the second, 10 hours the third week and zero hours the last week, that's just how it works. One thing that is being demanded here is better job security. In our new EBA we are being offered regular pay increases, an extra week of annual leave going from 4 to 5 weeks a year, minimum shift hours being increased by an hour along with other things being offered. As pointed out ground staff are some of the lowest paid in the industry. Qantas pays their ground staff an entry pay level of just under $21 an hour though they do offer some good loadings depending an the day and time you work, ground handlers such as Dnata, Swissport and Menzies all offer a higher base rate but not as generous loadings as QF does.

Unfortunately the only way to make airlines pay attention to this is to hit them where it hurts the most, during the peak travel season.
you don't get it. Airlines are shrinking & that means less workers required. Many airlines won't survive the recession & many have already folded. Thomas COok was last big one to close down.


It’s you that doesn’t get it. Aircraft are loaded with the bare minimum staff required, cutting that isn’t going to load them faster
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YYZORD
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 7:19 am

Can QF SYD-YVR become year round with the 789? I'm sure it can support some SEA traffic with YVR having multiple daily shuttles to Seattle along with AS flying YVR-SEA which can codeshare to QF SYD-YVR. This idea is similar to what EK does for YVR bound pax on their DXB-SEA route.
 
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SCFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 7:23 am

YYZORD wrote:
Can QF SYD-YVR become year round with the 789? I'm sure it can support some SEA traffic with YVR having multiple daily shuttles to Seattle along with AS flying YVR-SEA which can codeshare to QF SYD-YVR. This idea is similar to what EK does for YVR bound pax on their DXB-SEA route.


IIRC, the remaining 789s are replacing most if not all year round 744 routes out of the SYD hub.

Personally I'd say chances of YVR going full time on the 789 would be low at best.
 
getluv
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 10:42 am

vhebb wrote:
All frontline QF/JQ staff took a pay cut of 3% a few years ago to now watch the CEO and other senior managers taking home many millions.


A CEO's remuneration package and targets for bonuses are approved on by shareholders. If the QF share price was still 99c, I doubt AJ would be enjoying the fruits of his labour.

RyanairGuru wrote:
$21 an hour is rediculously low. That's basically the same as what Coles or Woolworths pay for an store hand or service team member.


I don't see why people at Coles and or Woolies should be paid less than JQ workers. Is the airline industry above the retail industry? Do baggage handlers need to be paid more than people who put Nutri Grain on shelves?

Unfortunately, the airline (and travel) industry is littered with people on barely minimum wages because profit margins are so slim and because people idolise to work in it because it is considered 'glamourous'. Even management or SME jobs within the industry would be considered underpaid compared to the rest of their peers in other industries. If it was not a popular industry to work in, people would be paid more.

I do think JQ staff and the rest of the industry as a whole (including pilots and people who idolise to be a part of the industry), need to realise this isn't going to change and their industry is always going to be ripe for disruption.

I have no issue with worker's striking (it is one of the great things about living in a democracy) provided the union representing them has been open and honest, because at times there's an impression that they just play hard ball for the sake of it, when they too need to be realistic.
I'm that bad type.
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 11:04 am

getluv wrote:
vhebb wrote:
All frontline QF/JQ staff took a pay cut of 3% a few years ago to now watch the CEO and other senior managers taking home many millions.


A CEO's remuneration package and targets for bonuses are approved on by shareholders. If the QF share price was still 99c, I doubt AJ would be enjoying the fruits of his labour.

RyanairGuru wrote:
$21 an hour is rediculously low. That's basically the same as what Coles or Woolworths pay for an store hand or service team member.


I don't see why people at Coles and or Woolies should be paid less than JQ workers. Is the airline industry above the retail industry? Do baggage handlers need to be paid more than people who put Nutri Grain on shelves?

Unfortunately, the airline (and travel) industry is littered with people on barely minimum wages because profit margins are so slim and because people idolise to work in it. Even management or SME jobs within the industry would be considered underpaid compared to the rest of their peers in other industries. If it was not a popular industry to work in, people would be paid more.

I do think JQ staff and the rest of the industry as a whole (including pilots and people who idolise to be a part of the industry), need to realise this isn't going to change and their industry is always going to be ripe for disruption.

I have no issue with worker's striking (it is one of the great things about living in a democracy) provided the union representing them has been open and honest, because at times there's an impression that they just play hard ball for the sake of it, when they too need to be realistic.


Retail staff aren't required to qualify for and maintain an ASIC, and nor do they have to pay stupendously expensive parking (even staff parking isn't cheap) or public transport "access" charges. Additionally, programs like Amadeus or Navitaire are significantly more complex than a sales register, especially if you have to do something like rebook or reroute a passenger.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
getluv
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 1:04 pm

RyanairGuru wrote:
getluv wrote:
vhebb wrote:
All frontline QF/JQ staff took a pay cut of 3% a few years ago to now watch the CEO and other senior managers taking home many millions.


A CEO's remuneration package and targets for bonuses are approved on by shareholders. If the QF share price was still 99c, I doubt AJ would be enjoying the fruits of his labour.

RyanairGuru wrote:
$21 an hour is rediculously low. That's basically the same as what Coles or Woolworths pay for an store hand or service team member.


I don't see why people at Coles and or Woolies should be paid less than JQ workers. Is the airline industry above the retail industry? Do baggage handlers need to be paid more than people who put Nutri Grain on shelves?

Unfortunately, the airline (and travel) industry is littered with people on barely minimum wages because profit margins are so slim and because people idolise to work in it. Even management or SME jobs within the industry would be considered underpaid compared to the rest of their peers in other industries. If it was not a popular industry to work in, people would be paid more.

I do think JQ staff and the rest of the industry as a whole (including pilots and people who idolise to be a part of the industry), need to realise this isn't going to change and their industry is always going to be ripe for disruption. This is why airline employees are paid

I have no issue with worker's striking (it is one of the great things about living in a democracy) provided the union representing them has been open and honest, because at times there's an impression that they just play hard ball for the sake of it, when they too need to be realistic.


Retail staff aren't required to qualify for and maintain an ASIC, and nor do they have to pay stupendously expensive parking (even staff parking isn't cheap) or public transport "access" charges. Additionally, programs like Amadeus or Navitaire are significantly more complex than a sales register, especially if you have to do something like rebook or reroute a passenger.


There are many people willing to attain an ASIC and use Amadeus and Navitaire for a minimum wage if that means not having to stock shelves at Coles that potentially pays more and where they are financially better off.
I'm that bad type.
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 11:08 pm

I read on another forum that it looks like Citilink will be coming to AVV.

This is an interesting development If it comes to fruition as Air Asia are also said to be looking to add DPS services from AVV (along with BKK and possibly more down the track).

If these flights both end up happening, the
Victoria-DPS market will potentially have the following airlines:

MEL
- Jetstar
- Qantas
- Garuda
- Malindo
- Virgin Australia (starting 2020)

AVV
- Citilink
- Air Asia

There was also some talk that Jetstar were looking at AVV-DPS, but given that level of competition, it will be interesting to see if all thrive in the market.

Some added variety in destinations would be welcomed though outside of the heavy DPS focus. Hopefully airlines look at new opportunities.
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Fri Dec 06, 2019 11:48 pm

IndianicWorld wrote:
I read on another forum that it looks like Citilink will be coming to AVV.

This is an interesting development If it comes to fruition as Air Asia are also said to be looking to add DPS services from AVV (along with BKK and possibly more down the track).

If these flights both end up happening, the
Victoria-DPS market will potentially have the following airlines:

MEL
- Jetstar
- Qantas
- Garuda
- Malindo
- Virgin Australia (starting 2020)

AVV
- Citilink
- Air Asia

There was also some talk that Jetstar were looking at AVV-DPS, but given that level of competition, it will be interesting to see if all thrive in the market.

Some added variety in destinations would be welcomed though outside of the heavy DPS focus. Hopefully airlines look at new opportunities.

For the highly price sensitive markets like LCC services to DPS, AVV makes great sense. If the passenger charge averages $20 cheaper this can largely be passed onto customers who will travel that little bit further and tolerate a less than stellar terminal experience (not that MEL is stellar anyway) to make the savings. These airlines make serious money out of ancilliaries (luggage, in-flight menu, IFE etc) so loads are really important even if the headline yield is nothing to write home about.

Out of AU, DPS is the low cost traveller market. Fiji, Thailand etc don't quite have that profile in the numbers required. Maybe Scoot could look at AVV for its SIN services though I think Scoot gets most of its pax originating in SIN rather than MEL so maybe a LCC airport further from the city will be a turn-off for them.
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RainerBoeing777
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 1:34 am

Finally what happened with the Qantas slot to Haneda? Will they use it for MEL or the second daily SYD flight? I did not understand why they did not request a new flight to MEL, they should have discussed JAL before as they moved from NRT to HND, and it seems unfair that MEL does not receive slot for HND and BNE if it obtains HND flights
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Flyerqf
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 1:59 am

Seems the IASC preferred SYD (QF) & BNE (VA) rather than SYD (QF) & MEL (QF) for the extra HND slots.

To be fair, BNE is extra capacity whereas MEL was just switching from NRT to HND.
 
ZK-NBT
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 2:01 am

RainerBoeing777 wrote:
Finally what happened with the Qantas slot to Haneda? Will they use it for MEL or the second daily SYD flight? I did not understand why they did not request a new flight to MEL, they should have discussed JAL before as they moved from NRT to HND, and it seems unfair that MEL does not receive slot for HND and BNE if it obtains HND flights


They haven’t announced where the additional HND flight will go. QF would have thought they were going to get both HND slots but VA got 1, QF would have added a second SYD and transferred MEL. I get that HND is the preferred airport but talk that it’s unfair that 1 city gets HND over another being unfair is a little OTT, it’s a business decision at the end of the day.

I’d say QF will add a second SYD-HND unless they are allowed to run an A380 from SYD then maybe they will go for MEL.
 
eamondzhang
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 2:10 am

RainerBoeing777 wrote:
they should have discussed JAL before as they moved from NRT to HND

And then being swiftly fined by authorieis because of cartel conduct.

When it comes to new services 90%+ of time MEL does miss out so this is nothing new to us.

Michael
 
qf2048
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 3:28 am

Just noticed today's MH 122 is operated by A380. Just passed over my house, in regional NSW, and of coarse had to check what it was on Flightradar. Is that a one off or up-gauge for the holidays?
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Thatcher
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 3:44 am

eamondzhang wrote:
RainerBoeing777 wrote:
they should have discussed JAL before as they moved from NRT to HND

And then being swiftly fined by authorieis because of cartel conduct.

When it comes to new services 90%+ of time MEL does miss out so this is nothing new to us.

Michael


MEL posts seem to fall into either "ain't we growing, ain't we grand" or "nobody appreciates us" categories. It's quite odd.
 
chewybacca
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 3:46 am

eamondzhang wrote:
RainerBoeing777 wrote:
they should have discussed JAL before as they moved from NRT to HND

And then being swiftly fined by authorieis because of cartel conduct.

When it comes to new services 90%+ of time MEL does miss out so this is nothing new to us.

Michael

I thought that there was suggestions in last month’s thread that QF doesn’t have much choice but to go MEL-HND instead of SYD.

Also not sure how this could be constituted cartel conduct when the ACCC and IASC had no objections with NH/VA tying up.

Either way, guess anything can happen. Although I do wonder why QF is taking this long when VA has already started selling fares for its BNE-HND flights.
 
Flyerqf
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 3:54 am

chewybacca wrote:
eamondzhang wrote:
RainerBoeing777 wrote:
they should have discussed JAL before as they moved from NRT to HND

And then being swiftly fined by authorieis because of cartel conduct.

When it comes to new services 90%+ of time MEL does miss out so this is nothing new to us.

Michael

I thought that there was suggestions in last month’s thread that QF doesn’t have much choice but to go MEL-HND instead of SYD.

Also not sure how this could be constituted cartel conduct when the ACCC and IASC had no objections with NH/VA tying up.

Either way, guess anything can happen. Although I do wonder why QF is taking this long when VA has already started selling fares for its BNE-HND flights.

There has been some speculation that QF is waiting to see if they will be allowed to fly the A380 to HND.

This requires a change to current HND restrictions on use of A380.

If they are allowed to fly the A380 from SYD, then MEL would almost certainly switch from NRT to HND.
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 4:00 am

qf2048 wrote:
Just noticed today's MH 122 is operated by A380. Just passed over my house, in regional NSW, and of coarse had to check what it was on Flightradar. Is that a one off or up-gauge for the holidays?


It also operated yesterday and A388 is operating next Friday as well. A333 and A359 are also operating this flight over the next week as well, probably just some seasonal increase on days that require it
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chewybacca
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 4:14 am

Flyerqf wrote:
chewybacca wrote:
I thought that there was suggestions in last month’s thread that QF doesn’t have much choice but to go MEL-HND instead of SYD.

Also not sure how this could be constituted cartel conduct when the ACCC and IASC had no objections with NH/VA tying up.

Either way, guess anything can happen. Although I do wonder why QF is taking this long when VA has already started selling fares for its BNE-HND flights.

There has been some speculation that QF is waiting to see if they will be allowed to fly the A380 to HND.

This requires a change to current HND restrictions on use of A380.

If they are allowed to fly the A380 from SYD, then MEL would almost certainly switch from NRT to HND.

My understanding based on the previous post in the Nov thread was flying the A380 wasn’t the issue at the moment, but given these are fairly commercially sensitive insider discussions ongoing, we have no idea how far they have progressed or whether flying the A380 to HND is still even on the table.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 4:15 am

Qantas 789 VH-ZNK taxi test and first flight (5 Dec)

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/12 ... 30304?s=20
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aerokiwi
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 4:41 am

Thatcher wrote:
eamondzhang wrote:
RainerBoeing777 wrote:
they should have discussed JAL before as they moved from NRT to HND

And then being swiftly fined by authorieis because of cartel conduct.

When it comes to new services 90%+ of time MEL does miss out so this is nothing new to us.

Michael


MEL posts seem to fall into either "ain't we growing, ain't we grand" or "nobody appreciates us" categories. It's quite odd.


Ha! Yeah kinda parochial.

In reality Melbourne is doing great with new services and connectivity. El Al being the latest. The airport has to seriously sort out its terminals first and foremost.

As a VA frequent flyer I hope they replicate (albeit likely thinner) the Perth pier for the two in MEL. It's a nice design and would probably blend reasonably well with the latest of MEL's many architectural styles, which really is a hodge podge but has that all too common dark-cladding-with-a-funky-colour-feature (usually some horrible yellow) that you find on a lot of Melbourne apartment developments.

Regarding the parking bays for the VA gates, are those indents into the pier where the nose of the 737 goes actually necessary to accommodate the taxiways behind? Because if not then filling those in would open up a lot more space in the interior for passenger use.
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 4:56 am

Thatcher wrote:
eamondzhang wrote:
RainerBoeing777 wrote:
they should have discussed JAL before as they moved from NRT to HND

And then being swiftly fined by authorieis because of cartel conduct.

When it comes to new services 90%+ of time MEL does miss out so this is nothing new to us.

Michael


MEL posts seem to fall into either "ain't we growing, ain't we grand" or "nobody appreciates us" categories. It's quite odd.


I think that's perennial "second city" syndrome. Manchester Airport (UK) has an entire thread that is entirely dedicated to these two discussion points!
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IndianicWorld
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 7:52 am

RyanairGuru wrote:
Thatcher wrote:
eamondzhang wrote:
And then being swiftly fined by authorieis because of cartel conduct.

When it comes to new services 90%+ of time MEL does miss out so this is nothing new to us.

Michael


MEL posts seem to fall into either "ain't we growing, ain't we grand" or "nobody appreciates us" categories. It's quite odd.


I think that's perennial "second city" syndrome. Manchester Airport (UK) has an entire thread that is entirely dedicated to these two discussion points!


More than likely to be the first city soon... so I guess we will then have some from Sydney playing the same lines as time goes on also :)

As for the QF slots at HND, as the last piece in the puzzle it will be interesting to see what plays out. Certainly has been a more drawn out process, but one would think it would be wise of QF to manage yields instead of trying to get into trying to put all its eggs in one basket.

To best manage yields, moving MEL from NRT to HND will not add capacity, while SYD will likely be pulled back to 787 or A330 as the 747 fleet is phased out. It can then add an additional NRT flight from SYD if it needs to down the track, but having HND services from the 2 largest cities would be a solid offering. My gut feeling says SYD will get the 2nd daily HND slot though.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 10:58 am

chewybacca wrote:
Flyerqf wrote:
chewybacca wrote:
I thought that there was suggestions in last month’s thread that QF doesn’t have much choice but to go MEL-HND instead of SYD.

Also not sure how this could be constituted cartel conduct when the ACCC and IASC had no objections with NH/VA tying up.

Either way, guess anything can happen. Although I do wonder why QF is taking this long when VA has already started selling fares for its BNE-HND flights.

There has been some speculation that QF is waiting to see if they will be allowed to fly the A380 to HND.

This requires a change to current HND restrictions on use of A380.

If they are allowed to fly the A380 from SYD, then MEL would almost certainly switch from NRT to HND.

My understanding based on the previous post in the Nov thread was flying the A380 wasn’t the issue at the moment, but given these are fairly commercially sensitive insider discussions ongoing, we have no idea how far they have progressed or whether flying the A380 to HND is still even on the table.


I am less convinced that the A380 isn’t the issue. JNB and HND are the last two routes where QF hasn’t announced the replacement of the 747 currently operating these routes.

QF has said they want to operate A380 to HND but need a change to the rules at HND.

If they can operate A380 to HND, then JNB can also go A380 (probably 5pw).

This would allow DFW to go from 6pw A380 load restricted to daily 787, and allow MEL TYO to move from NRT to HND.

The A380 at HND is 100% the ideal plan.
 
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Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 12:10 pm

BNE spotters B747 alert for tomorrow morning approximately 0400 local




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sat Dec 07, 2019 3:53 pm

EK413 wrote:
BNE spotters B747 alert for tomorrow morning approximately 0400 local

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Flight QF128 from Hong Kong to Sydney
https://fr24.com/QFA128/231a7349




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:34 am

VKF is operating today's JQ inaugural OOL-ICN

https://www.flightradar24.com/JST49/231c77b5
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:57 am

EK413 wrote:
EK413 wrote:
BNE spotters B747 alert for tomorrow morning approximately 0400 local

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Flight QF128 from Hong Kong to Sydney
https://fr24.com/QFA128/231a7349




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Any word on why it diverted?

I was under the, clearly mistaken, impression that QF127/128 had be upgauged to the A380 for the Christmas through CNY peak. How long will 747s be on the route for, and does it then revert back to 787s?
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 3:01 am

qf789 wrote:
VKF is operating today's JQ inaugural OOL-ICN

https://www.flightradar24.com/JST49/231c77b5


Departed 2 hours late ex-MEL (operates as JQ49 MEL-OOL-ICN twice a week).
 
Flyerqf
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 4:25 am

RyanairGuru wrote:
EK413 wrote:
EK413 wrote:
BNE spotters B747 alert for tomorrow morning approximately 0400 local

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Flight QF128 from Hong Kong to Sydney
https://fr24.com/QFA128/231a7349




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Any word on why it diverted?

I was under the, clearly mistaken, impression that QF127/128 had be upgauged to the A380 for the Christmas through CNY peak. How long will 747s be on the route for, and does it then revert back to 787s?


It was upgauged to 380 but OQJ is not back from maintenance (was supposed to be back yesterday I believe) and therefore 744 is being used until it’s back.

The 787 is back on 127/128 from April.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 4:37 am

Flyerqf wrote:
RyanairGuru wrote:
EK413 wrote:

Flight QF128 from Hong Kong to Sydney
https://fr24.com/QFA128/231a7349




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Any word on why it diverted?

I was under the, clearly mistaken, impression that QF127/128 had be upgauged to the A380 for the Christmas through CNY peak. How long will 747s be on the route for, and does it then revert back to 787s?


It was upgauged to 380 but OQJ is not back from maintenance (was supposed to be back yesterday I believe) and therefore 744 is being used until it’s back.

The 787 is back on 127/128 from April.


It was mentioned in last month’s thread that the A380 was pushed back 2 weeks starting in 18 December instead of the 4th of December
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Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 5:14 am

RyanairGuru wrote:
EK413 wrote:
EK413 wrote:
BNE spotters B747 alert for tomorrow morning approximately 0400 local

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Flight QF128 from Hong Kong to Sydney
https://fr24.com/QFA128/231a7349




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Any word on why it diverted?

I was under the, clearly mistaken, impression that QF127/128 had be upgauged to the A380 for the Christmas through CNY peak. How long will 747s be on the route for, and does it then revert back to 787s?


Tech crew swap and a gas ‘n’ go



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Last edited by EK413 on Sun Dec 08, 2019 5:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
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Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 5:15 am

Double post please delete
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 6:29 am

Project Sunrise decision delayed to February

https://www.airlineratings.com/news/qan ... -sunset-2/
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 6:43 am

Interestingly the article suggests the same aircraft would be used on the BNE/PER to LHR.

Probably would suggest that the current MEL-PER-LHR would become MEL-LHR and BNE-PER-LHR if/should Project Sunrise become reality.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 6:55 am

SCFlyer wrote:
Interestingly the article suggests the same aircraft would be used on the BNE/PER to LHR.

Probably would suggest that the current MEL-PER-LHR would become MEL-LHR and BNE-PER-LHR if/should Project Sunrise become reality.


That’s not what article says, it refers to both PER and BNE operating as non stops
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tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 10:50 pm

qf789 wrote:
SCFlyer wrote:
Interestingly the article suggests the same aircraft would be used on the BNE/PER to LHR.

Probably would suggest that the current MEL-PER-LHR would become MEL-LHR and BNE-PER-LHR if/should Project Sunrise become reality.


That’s not what article says, it refers to both PER and BNE operating as non stops

The grammar is unclear and either interpretation could be made.

What is more news is that the business case is so marginal that it is still not ready to go to the BoD. AJ has gone back to Boeing and Airbus after price decreases but even that is hard to see overcoming such an issue. A price reduction of say $10M per plane approximates to a saving of $1667 per flight (assuming 20 years service with 300 flights per year). $1667 is only around 1.5 economy passengers so hardly significant. The issues appear to be whether the hardware actually exists to reliably complete these flights nonstop and whether customers will be prepared to pay a significant premium to save 3 hours. Unfortunately, the whole project has also got embroiled in a dispute with pilots, some of whom now feel they are being asked to take cuts to fund the project. The upside for the pilots with Sunrise is a bit hard to see so they have decided to play hardball.

Sunrise has been a trophy project for AJ but he is an accountant at heart and, if the numbers don't add up, he will walk away.
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getluv
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 09, 2019 12:52 am

Enhanced Frequent Flyer partnership between QF and AF/KL.

QF Frequent flyers can now earn points on all AF/KL marketed flights.

https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media ... -airlines/
Last edited by getluv on Mon Dec 09, 2019 1:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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qf2220
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 09, 2019 1:05 am

getluv wrote:
Enhanced Frequent Flyer partnership between QF and AF/KL.


I might be late to the party but why were more expansive partnerships like this not entered into earlier (eg after the BA separation)? Given carriers in Europe have similar issues to QF/VA/NZ (ie the Asian and ME hub carrier cost advantage) more deals with the likes of LH, SAS and others could be handy no?

Also, perhaps this is a precursor to Paris/CDG flights - testing how much of a market there is for them?
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