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Qantas737
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:20 am

Qantas confirms that MEL-TYO will be switched from NRT to HND.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... da-airport
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:30 am

moa999 wrote:
Suspect the 787s have more to do with the 320neoLRs that JQ is soon to get and will likely replace 787s on the DPS routes.

SQ owned Scoot is now up to 19 787s, and AirAsiaX/ThaiAirAsiaX 37 330/330neo so there is seemingly regional demand for widebody LCC (not much profit looking at AirAsiaX though)


Scoot has 20 787's and are adding at least 1 more next year. While I agree that the 787's have more to do with the A321neoLR's the timing is suspect considering what has happened the past few days. Anyway I was under the idea that QF would get the 788's, that's what many have been saying in this thread but they are going to sell them instead
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a320fan
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:30 am

Qantas737 wrote:
Qantas confirms that MEL-TYO will be switched from NRT to HND.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... da-airport

Good news for MEL, gives QF a competitive edge over JAL among corporate traffic and fragments QF away from putting all its eggs into the sudden influx that’s just occurred on SYD-HND.
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chewybacca
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:37 am

Qantas737 wrote:
Qantas confirms that MEL-TYO will be switched from NRT to HND.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... da-airport

Also here: https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media ... -in-japan/

Excellent news for MEL, now we can put this issue to bed.

Given no immediate fleet changes announcements re SYD, I wonder if they’re going to:
a) prolong the 747’s life (doubt it)
b) got approval to send in the 380,
c) downgauge capacity and swap it out for a 787 or
d) long shot, get in a non-PS modified 35K early.
 
a19901213
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:49 am

chewybacca wrote:
Qantas737 wrote:
Qantas confirms that MEL-TYO will be switched from NRT to HND.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... da-airport

Also here: https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media ... -in-japan/

Excellent news for MEL, now we can put this issue to bed.

Given no immediate fleet changes announcements re SYD, I wonder if they’re going to:
a) prolong the 747’s life (doubt it)
b) got approval to send in the 380,
c) downgauge capacity and swap it out for a 787 or
d) long shot, get in a non-PS modified 35K early.


Or they can add in another flight to NRT from Sydney.
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:50 am

lessredtape wrote:
lessredtape wrote:
qf789 wrote:

The aircraft is just being leased by FJ while the 737MAX remain grounded
yes know that, but how far in advance can you find out who's aircraft is operating route ?

friends upgraded & said no service by flight attendant who went to sleep (maybe she was sick?) Complained to airline(FJ), but at last report heard nothing back


Good luck getting a response out of FJ. I have really mixed feelings about that airline. They are either really good or really terrible, with no middle ground. Their service in the air (at least on their own metal) is decent and their lounge in NAN is world class, but their customer service when things go wrong is absolutely appalling. There is 'island time' and then there is 'we don't give an [email protected]#& about our customers'. Unfortunately FJ lean towards the latter end of the scale.
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vhebb
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:57 am

How long until more HND slots become available? It would make sense to move the BNE flight as well so everything is at HND.

Guess the planned NRT lounge upgrade won't be happening?

Any updates on the AKL lounge works?

So still no announcement on what they are doing with the A332 once PEK is cut in the new year...
Last edited by vhebb on Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 1:57 am

lessredtape wrote:
EK413 wrote:
Inaugural seasonal Qantas service to Chitose (CTS), Sapporo Japan commences today 16th December 2019.

Flight QF39/40 will be operated by an Airbus A330-200 and VH-EBR will operate today’s inaugural service.

Flights will operate thrice weekly until 28 March 2020.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
don't think this is 1st year it's operated IIRC.

At 11 hours 5 min the SYD/CTS flight is not that much shorter than BNE/LAX(12:50) or the new BNE/SFO(12:40)

& it really only suits SYD people.

With an arrival time of 1835 means very late arrival into ski resorts.

Crazy part is, this flight is designed for skiers, but it’s now much cheaper to ski in USA than Japan including airfares, if not going in peak season & plenty of flight options to USA west coast including 1 stops.

From any of 5 LA airports or 3 San Fran airports it’s incredibly easy to get to Colorado using Qantas or Virgin ff pts.

You can get lift tickets in Colorado up to 95% off if buy in a package from Australia (Us$37 for an adult for a day with 4 kids total free) & on snow accommodation is cheap as well. Quoted US$162 for small 3 star apartment that sleeps 4, a very short 200m walk to lifts.

Lastly in USA plenty of options to do other things, using ff pts


Only one user could turn a discussion about a new Japanese route into serving Colorado isn't that right USAOZ.
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qf2220
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 2:03 am

Ok, so what does Australia Japan now look like?
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 2:05 am

vhebb wrote:
How long until more HND slots become available? It would make sense to move the BNE flight as well so everything is at HND.

Guess the planned NRT lounge upgrade won't be happening?

Any updates on the AKL lounge works?

So still no announcement on what they are doing with the A332 once PEK is cut in the new year...


It could be a long time unless the Japanese Government decide to deregulate Haneda entirely, which seems very unlikely. The latest round of slots is in part a response to anticipated growth for the Tokyo Olympics. It required an agreement with USAF to relax restrictions on the use of military airspace to improve airspace efficiency (which is why the USA got such a large proportion of the new slots in return). There could be incremental expansion of night time slots, but HND is basically just as functionally full as LHR is.
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lessredtape
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 2:14 am

just read this, buried in link below


Qantas has also announced it will extend its seasonal service to Sapporo for another year.
The flights will operate three times per week during the 2020-21 ski season from 14 December 2020 to 27 February 2021 with the airline’s upgraded A330.

link

https://karryon.com.au/industry-news/ai ... yo-haneda/
 
smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 2:52 am

a320fan wrote:
Qantas737 wrote:
Qantas confirms that MEL-TYO will be switched from NRT to HND.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... da-airport

Good news for MEL, gives QF a competitive edge over JAL among corporate traffic and fragments QF away from putting all its eggs into the sudden influx that’s just occurred on SYD-HND.


Also means that if JL/QF apply for a JV, they have all of AU nicely covered between NRT/HND - could perhaps looks at BNE-HND next round.
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 3:02 am

smi0006 wrote:
a320fan wrote:
Qantas737 wrote:
Qantas confirms that MEL-TYO will be switched from NRT to HND.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... da-airport

Good news for MEL, gives QF a competitive edge over JAL among corporate traffic and fragments QF away from putting all its eggs into the sudden influx that’s just occurred on SYD-HND.


Also means that if JL/QF apply for a JV, they have all of AU nicely covered between NRT/HND - could perhaps looks at BNE-HND next round.


You mean they have eastern Australia nicely covered, last time I checked neither flew to PER or ADL so no they don't have all of AU nicely covered.
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tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 3:09 am

smi0006 wrote:
a320fan wrote:
Qantas737 wrote:
Qantas confirms that MEL-TYO will be switched from NRT to HND.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... da-airport

Good news for MEL, gives QF a competitive edge over JAL among corporate traffic and fragments QF away from putting all its eggs into the sudden influx that’s just occurred on SYD-HND.


Also means that if JL/QF apply for a JV, they have all of AU nicely covered between NRT/HND - could perhaps looks at BNE-HND next round.

As Ryanair Guru pointed out, it will be quite a while before additional slots become available at HND and even when they do they will be subject to an IASC allocation so will not necessarily go to QF.
Last edited by tullamarine on Mon Dec 16, 2019 3:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 3:10 am

LATAM and Malaysia Airlines start codesharing on each other services today

MH will codeshare on LA's MEL-SCL and SYD-AKL-SCL
LA will codeshare on MH's MEL-KUL, SYD-KUL and AKL-KUL

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... -dec-2019/
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smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 3:10 am

qf789 wrote:
smi0006 wrote:
a320fan wrote:
Good news for MEL, gives QF a competitive edge over JAL among corporate traffic and fragments QF away from putting all its eggs into the sudden influx that’s just occurred on SYD-HND.


Also means that if JL/QF apply for a JV, they have all of AU nicely covered between NRT/HND - could perhaps looks at BNE-HND next round.


You mean they have eastern Australia nicely covered, last time I checked neither flew to PER or ADL so no they don't have all of AU nicely covered.


Okay - not Perth. Quiet right. ADL - as its not a current contender for any Japanese route, I’d say it’s irrelevant. But as NH/VA don’t have MEL covered so I’d give QF a head start there.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 3:27 am

Jetstar says it will cancel about 10% of domestic flights in January, financial impact will be $20-25 million

https://www.airlineratings.com/news/jet ... t-january/
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OffTheRails
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 3:56 am

Interesting in a similar article about the Jetstar cancellations in January the ABC is also reporting Jetstar are looking at getting rid of 3 787s a decision due in early 2020

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-12-16/ ... e/11802590
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 4:01 am

qf789 wrote:
Jetstar says it will cancel about 10% of domestic flights in January, financial impact will be $20-25 million

https://www.airlineratings.com/news/jet ... t-january/

This is beginning to sound a bit like the brinksmanship we saw back in 2012. With group profit currently sitting where it is, QF/JQ may find it a bit harder to plead that the future of the airline is on the line.
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tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 4:05 am

OffTheRails wrote:
Interesting in a similar article about the Jetstar cancellations in January the ABC is also reporting Jetstar are looking at getting rid of 3 787s a decision due in early 2020

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-12-16/ ... e/11802590

Does JQ own the 788s or are they owned by the group and leased to JQ? It would be a strange decision to sell given the market for 788s is hardly booming. If anything, you'd expect QF to take them to replace the oldest "Cityflyer" A332s (EBA/EBB/EBC)
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QF742
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 5:13 am

Qantas737 wrote:
Qantas confirms that MEL-TYO will be switched from NRT to HND.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... da-airport


That’s a great outcome for MEL and glad the HND love got shared around in the end.

I am intrigued to see what QF will end up doing with SYD with the impending retirement of the 744.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 5:30 am

QF742 wrote:
Qantas737 wrote:
Qantas confirms that MEL-TYO will be switched from NRT to HND.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... da-airport


That’s a great outcome for MEL and glad the HND love got shared around in the end.

I am intrigued to see what QF will end up doing with SYD with the impending retirement of the 744.


I've long speculated that JQ will be deployed to NRT from SYD which would put the squeeze on pricing at the bottom end of the market while allowing QF to deploy the 789 to HND. I think once the A321 NEO XLR comes online to relieve JQ 788's in DPS we will see this and I'd also think we would see more Japan routes from Queensland with the XLR.

So I think QF have plenty of choices in front of them and plenty of potential options on what to do.
 
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CraigAnderson
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 5:53 am

Qantas737 wrote:
Qantas confirms that MEL-TYO will be switched from NRT to HND.
https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... da-airport


It will be interesting to see how QF handles SYD-TYO now, they still want to retire the B747 but I can't see them down-gauging this to a single A330 and taking a capacity hit when the B747 seems very popular with high loads. So they either have to convince HND to allow an A380, or maybe they can use the vacated NRT slot from the MEL-NRT service to add a second daily A330 so they'd have 1 x A330 SYD-HND and another SYD-NRT?
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 5:53 am

"Qantas plans to have more experienced pilots on board the world’s longest non-stop flights than on its current long-haul flights for the first 18 months as it evaluates fatigue, said sources with knowledge of the matter."

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-qant ... SKBN1YK0AU
 
Captdasbomb
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 6:26 am

Dan23 wrote:
qf789 wrote:
ZNJ still out of action, QF29/30 MEL-HKG was cancelled on Sunday

...and the full MEL-PER-LHR QF9 on the 16th and LHR-PER-MEL QF10 on the 17th have also been cancelled. 14 flights now cancelled due to ZNJ's absence.[/quote
Would have thought they would cancel the MEL-PER-MEL & have metal turning around in Perth
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 6:39 am

Captdasbomb wrote:
Dan23 wrote:
qf789 wrote:
ZNJ still out of action, QF29/30 MEL-HKG was cancelled on Sunday

...and the full MEL-PER-LHR QF9 on the 16th and LHR-PER-MEL QF10 on the 17th have also been cancelled. 14 flights now cancelled due to ZNJ's absence.[/quote
Would have thought they would cancel the MEL-PER-MEL & have metal turning around in Perth


It looks like they are sharing the cancellations around the network, maybe they could give NZ a few tips. It probably isn't helping that they are down an A330 atm after yesterday's incident, today a good portion of trans con flights with QF are delayed
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downdata
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 7:24 am

Didn’t ZNJ had a pump issue as well on the first revenue flight?
 
a320fan
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 7:36 am

MEL currently on the rare easterly flow, landing 09. Which is a little odd as it’s generally the least preferred and there’s next to no wind around the cbd areas. Guess things can have changed up the road at tulla.
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getluv
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 8:02 am

QF have updated their schedule for HND. Timings to SYD will remain as is.

QF79 MEL 1130 HND 2000
QF80 HND 2130 MEL 0900+1

1 hour earlier in MEL after DST ends.
I'm that bad type.
 
Qantas16
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 8:03 am

tullamarine wrote:
qf789 wrote:
Jetstar says it will cancel about 10% of domestic flights in January, financial impact will be $20-25 million

https://www.airlineratings.com/news/jet ... t-january/

This is beginning to sound a bit like the brinksmanship we saw back in 2012. With group profit currently sitting where it is, QF/JQ may find it a bit harder to plead that the future of the airline is on the line.


No way they'll get rid of any 788's completely, at worst they'll end up in QF colours. I think it is clear that JQ doesn't need anymore 787's though and once the A321XLRs arrive they'll probably give some (5-6) back to QF.

The A321XLRs can cover all the DPS flying and potentially a few other routes (CNS-NRT/KIX?).

The current rhetoric is simply to try and scare the employees and it's predictable from the QF Group.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 10:47 am

Qantas16 wrote:
No way they'll get rid of any 788's completely, at worst they'll end up in QF colours. I think it is clear that JQ doesn't need anymore 787's though and once the A321XLRs arrive they'll probably give some (5-6) back to QF.


You probably already know this, the JQ 788s don’t have crew rest. This will impact how they get used.
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QF744ER
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 12:06 pm

zeke wrote:
Qantas16 wrote:
No way they'll get rid of any 788's completely, at worst they'll end up in QF colours. I think it is clear that JQ doesn't need anymore 787's though and once the A321XLRs arrive they'll probably give some (5-6) back to QF.


You probably already know this, the JQ 788s don’t have crew rest. This will impact how they get used.


Hi Zeke correct, however they can be retrofitted as was the case with BI’s 788’s when BWN-LHR became direct and they ditched the DXB stop-over.

Was the rumour about QF ‘acquiring’ a number of JQ’s B788’s actually confirmed by QF insiders or just assumed as that’s what happened with a number of A332’s in the past?

I’m hoping that once JQ get these new A321NEO’s that they open up some KUL or services to other Malaysian ports - fun fact is the no Australian airline flies to any Malaysian city. However take PER for example with the 3 Malaysian carriers serving PER all operating double-daily services on some days of the week.
 
moa999
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 12:25 pm

I highly doubt QF/JQ are going to try and compete with MH/D7/OD - low yields, limited premium demand and competitors with low cost bases and big hub operations.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 6:20 pm

Looks as though VH-OEF will be the next to leave the fleet, departing Sydney Feb 9 at 5PM and arriving in LA Feb 9 11:50AM as QF99. 41900 points for an economy seat if anyone’s interested
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 9:31 pm

qf789 wrote:
redroo wrote:
@qf789 interesting comment you made in the Sunrise thread about change in loads and stopovers from Perth.

From speaking to people here, those that have tried the non stop rave about it and are willing to pay the extra... although some baulk at the cost when taking their whole family on it. The non stoppers have been “converted” and “preach” to the non converted!!

I haven’t heard of anyone recently taking the EK flights. SQ and Qatar get mentioned a lot more than EK these days.

Thoughts?


Yes there has been a definite switch over the past 12-18 months from ME3 back to the traditional connections via SIN, HKG, BKK and KUL. For those who didn't see what I said in the Sunrise thread they are below. Since EY left QR has definitely seen its numbers lift while EK looks like a new Coles add, down, down and staying down. QR only brought back the A388 a couple of days ago yet they were flying around an extra 100 passengers compared to EK421 and QR was only going out with a 90% load. Then EK425 is lucky to go out half full, with these numbers why did EK bring back the second rotation? Even when QR had the 77W they would quite often go out with more passengers than EK. The thing that baffles me is looking at the loads of pretty much all the other carriers with the exception of Batik and Citilink are all going out full or close to it, its concerning EK is not pulling the high loads it would do this time of year.

Meanwhile both SQ and CX have upgraded aircraft in recent months and they are filling them. Prior to CX bringing the A35K I thought with events in HKG they would struggle to fill it and perhaps the A359 was a better fit, but to their credit they kept with their plans. SQ has recently upgraded 3 of 4 flights and they are going out jammed packed. Previously I have said about another flight from SQ, even if it was either seasonal or a few times a week but I think there is a real possibility of SQ adding more services in the future.

Obviously PER-LHR has had an impact on EK and I would expect once the likes of SYD-LHR and MEL-LHR begin EK will be the biggest loser as they are going to loose those premium passengers to the nonstop services which will trash their yields. I also wonder if recent agreements such as the KL/AF codeshare and QF getting closer to CX is also having an impact. I would be interested to hear how EK is fairing out of SYD, BNE and MEL atm

The biggest loser out all of this will be Emirates. Both EK and EY have reduced capacity into Australia over the past 12-18 months. Having watched PER-LHR closely there has been an overall shift of travelling patterns. Since PER-LHR started the traditional connection points of SIN and HKG and to a lesser extent KUL and BKK have come back in favour compared with the likes of the ME3. EY ended up leaving the PER market while EK has cut it down to daily except for Dec/Jan where they run 2 daily. QR on the other hand is the only one of the ME3 to have grown in the market. Look at the departure board the past 2 nights there is a clear evidence EK is suffering. Over the past 2 days alone EK has gone out with over 500 empty seats yet we are less than 2 weeks before Christmas and in previous years these flights would have been full to the gills meanwhile looking at the likes of SQ and CX they are going out full, also what is telling is both these carriers have increased capacity by adding larger aircraft in recent months. There has also been an increased focus from Qantas on SIN, not only does QF other LHR flight goes through SIN they now have codeshare agreements with AF, KL and LO and there has also been AY which has been there for a long time. While SYD is a different market the likes of EK are still going to be affected by these Project Sunrise flights, sure those who want cheaper flights will be attracted to the ME3 but they will lose out on the higher yielding ones



Any thoughts on why?

Anecdotally the QF9 is getting most discussion in the offices and beaches around Perth - amazing, no better way, etc etc. every sand groper that’s done it has raved about it to anyone that will listen.

EK has always been useful for entering via one port and leaving via another. I’ve done it but now I’d probably fly back to London and get the non stop. Being able to get uninterrupted sleep onboard is much better than being woken in middle of night to schlep around the desert.

Again anecdotally the Dubai novelty factor has been and gone. People grumble about the stop over in a way I don’t hear anyone talk about Singapore or Hong Kong (zoo, masses of people, shouted at). The last few people I’ve spoken to are doing Bangkok or Singapore. I can’t remember the last time someone said they were flying Emirates... which probably bears out in the LFs.
 
Kent350787
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 9:38 pm

a320fan wrote:
Qantas737 wrote:
Qantas confirms that MEL-TYO will be switched from NRT to HND.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... da-airport

Good news for MEL, gives QF a competitive edge over JAL among corporate traffic and fragments QF away from putting all its eggs into the sudden influx that’s just occurred on SYD-HND.


Still annoyed that the wholesale switch to HND breaks a bunch of good US connections :(
S340/J31/146-300/F27/F50/Nord 262/Q100/200/E195/733/734/738/744/762/763/77W/788/789/320/321/332/333/345/359
 
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zeke
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 10:25 pm

QF744ER wrote:
Was the rumour about QF ‘acquiring’ a number of JQ’s B788’s actually confirmed by QF insiders or just assumed as that’s what happened with a number of A332’s in the past?


The news surrounding the JQ strike action management have apparently suggested in the media the 787s will be sold.
Human rights lawyers are "ambulance chasers of the very worst kind.'" - Sky News
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:12 pm

Kent350787 wrote:
a320fan wrote:
Qantas737 wrote:
Qantas confirms that MEL-TYO will be switched from NRT to HND.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... da-airport

Good news for MEL, gives QF a competitive edge over JAL among corporate traffic and fragments QF away from putting all its eggs into the sudden influx that’s just occurred on SYD-HND.


Still annoyed that the wholesale switch to HND breaks a bunch of good US connections :(


Certainly a downside, but HND will certainly have other network and convenience benefits for passengers.
 
Sydscott
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Tue Dec 17, 2019 12:23 am

redroo wrote:
qf789 wrote:
redroo wrote:
@qf789 interesting comment you made in the Sunrise thread about change in loads and stopovers from Perth.

From speaking to people here, those that have tried the non stop rave about it and are willing to pay the extra... although some baulk at the cost when taking their whole family on it. The non stoppers have been “converted” and “preach” to the non converted!!

I haven’t heard of anyone recently taking the EK flights. SQ and Qatar get mentioned a lot more than EK these days.

Thoughts?


Yes there has been a definite switch over the past 12-18 months from ME3 back to the traditional connections via SIN, HKG, BKK and KUL. For those who didn't see what I said in the Sunrise thread they are below. Since EY left QR has definitely seen its numbers lift while EK looks like a new Coles add, down, down and staying down. QR only brought back the A388 a couple of days ago yet they were flying around an extra 100 passengers compared to EK421 and QR was only going out with a 90% load. Then EK425 is lucky to go out half full, with these numbers why did EK bring back the second rotation? Even when QR had the 77W they would quite often go out with more passengers than EK. The thing that baffles me is looking at the loads of pretty much all the other carriers with the exception of Batik and Citilink are all going out full or close to it, its concerning EK is not pulling the high loads it would do this time of year.

Meanwhile both SQ and CX have upgraded aircraft in recent months and they are filling them. Prior to CX bringing the A35K I thought with events in HKG they would struggle to fill it and perhaps the A359 was a better fit, but to their credit they kept with their plans. SQ has recently upgraded 3 of 4 flights and they are going out jammed packed. Previously I have said about another flight from SQ, even if it was either seasonal or a few times a week but I think there is a real possibility of SQ adding more services in the future.

Obviously PER-LHR has had an impact on EK and I would expect once the likes of SYD-LHR and MEL-LHR begin EK will be the biggest loser as they are going to loose those premium passengers to the nonstop services which will trash their yields. I also wonder if recent agreements such as the KL/AF codeshare and QF getting closer to CX is also having an impact. I would be interested to hear how EK is fairing out of SYD, BNE and MEL atm

The biggest loser out all of this will be Emirates. Both EK and EY have reduced capacity into Australia over the past 12-18 months. Having watched PER-LHR closely there has been an overall shift of travelling patterns. Since PER-LHR started the traditional connection points of SIN and HKG and to a lesser extent KUL and BKK have come back in favour compared with the likes of the ME3. EY ended up leaving the PER market while EK has cut it down to daily except for Dec/Jan where they run 2 daily. QR on the other hand is the only one of the ME3 to have grown in the market. Look at the departure board the past 2 nights there is a clear evidence EK is suffering. Over the past 2 days alone EK has gone out with over 500 empty seats yet we are less than 2 weeks before Christmas and in previous years these flights would have been full to the gills meanwhile looking at the likes of SQ and CX they are going out full, also what is telling is both these carriers have increased capacity by adding larger aircraft in recent months. There has also been an increased focus from Qantas on SIN, not only does QF other LHR flight goes through SIN they now have codeshare agreements with AF, KL and LO and there has also been AY which has been there for a long time. While SYD is a different market the likes of EK are still going to be affected by these Project Sunrise flights, sure those who want cheaper flights will be attracted to the ME3 but they will lose out on the higher yielding ones



Any thoughts on why?

Anecdotally the QF9 is getting most discussion in the offices and beaches around Perth - amazing, no better way, etc etc. every sand groper that’s done it has raved about it to anyone that will listen.

EK has always been useful for entering via one port and leaving via another. I’ve done it but now I’d probably fly back to London and get the non stop. Being able to get uninterrupted sleep onboard is much better than being woken in middle of night to schlep around the desert.

Again anecdotally the Dubai novelty factor has been and gone. People grumble about the stop over in a way I don’t hear anyone talk about Singapore or Hong Kong (zoo, masses of people, shouted at). The last few people I’ve spoken to are doing Bangkok or Singapore. I can’t remember the last time someone said they were flying Emirates... which probably bears out in the LFs.



I think the answer is pretty easy in that Australians, in general, prefer and are far more familiar with Singapore and Hong Kong than what they are with the Middle Eastern Cities as a shopping and layover destination. I fly to Europe a couple of times a year on business and switched over to flying CX rather than transiting through the Middle East because I prefer Hong Kong as a stopover destination for a day or so to break up the trip on the way back. (Day flights back in Sydney also help)

So while I think there is a healthy traffic flow going to Europe via all destinations, I think QF was missing out on traffic by not having a route to Europe via Asia and it was certainly missing out on connecting traffic onto 3K in Singapore. So from an overall network standpoint, the QF network is stronger and more profitable having LHR through Singapore, and having additional codeshare options into Europe on AF / KL etc via Singapore and DXB than what it was having DXB by itself. It also reflects the turn around that QF International has had as well in that it can now both compete with and bypass competitors hubs with the QF9 service.
 
a19901213
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Tue Dec 17, 2019 1:12 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
Qantas737 wrote:
Qantas confirms that MEL-TYO will be switched from NRT to HND.
https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... da-airport


It will be interesting to see how QF handles SYD-TYO now, they still want to retire the B747 but I can't see them down-gauging this to a single A330 and taking a capacity hit when the B747 seems very popular with high loads. So they either have to convince HND to allow an A380, or maybe they can use the vacated NRT slot from the MEL-NRT service to add a second daily A330 so they'd have 1 x A330 SYD-HND and another SYD-NRT?


Highly doubt they gonna put 330 on SYD-HND as it has smaller premium cabins.

They make more money upfront than back.
 
zkncj
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Tue Dec 17, 2019 1:35 am

zeke wrote:
Qantas16 wrote:
No way they'll get rid of any 788's completely, at worst they'll end up in QF colours. I think it is clear that JQ doesn't need anymore 787's though and once the A321XLRs arrive they'll probably give some (5-6) back to QF.


You probably already know this, the JQ 788s don’t have crew rest. This will impact how they get used.


Couldn't the 788s always re-fitted with crew rest in the future?

How do crew resets on the work for the A231XLR's?
 
jrfspa320
Posts: 577
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Tue Dec 17, 2019 1:45 am

I cant see QF wanting a subfleet of just 3 788s, doesn't seem worth it. The issue is more the economics of long haul LCC competing against similarly priced foreign full service carriers. HNL is apparently a struggle for JQ with long sector lengths and weak demand (compared to DPS etc)
I would have thought KUL would work from SYD/MEL.
 
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SCFlyer
Posts: 577
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Tue Dec 17, 2019 1:53 am

jrfspa320 wrote:
I cant see QF wanting a subfleet of just 3 788s, doesn't seem worth it. The issue is more the economics of long haul LCC competing against similarly priced foreign full service carriers. HNL is apparently a struggle for JQ with long sector lengths and weak demand (compared to DPS etc)
I would have thought KUL would work from SYD/MEL.


JQ has tried SYD-KUL some years back. They couldn't stand the onslaught of the AirAsia group (D7) on the low yielding/VFR side and MH on the premium side.

If there was a A321XLR that could fly SYD-KUL at full payload for a LCC, KUL might stand a chance of being re-instated.
Otherwise any other size aircraft is simply "too big" for JQ, and obviously there is no high yield demand for a QF mainline service to Malaysia in general.
 
myki
Posts: 197
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Tue Dec 17, 2019 2:01 am

QF744ER wrote:
zeke wrote:
Qantas16 wrote:
I’m hoping that once JQ get these new A321NEO’s that they open up some KUL or services to other Malaysian ports - fun fact is the no Australian airline flies to any Malaysian city. However take PER for example with the 3 Malaysian carriers serving PER all operating double-daily services on some days of the week.

Malaysia is not just KUL.

Could their be some sort of resort/honeymoon/premium demand to the resorts of LGK, or the more general PEN for resorts and tourists? Seasonal perhaps? MH run BKI-PER (albeit weekly) and AO used to run BKI-SYD, maybe try again? Get JQ to dip the toes in the waters twice a week and see how it goes?

My $0.02
 
ben175
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Tue Dec 17, 2019 2:38 am

myki wrote:
QF744ER wrote:
zeke wrote:

Malaysia is not just KUL.

Could their be some sort of resort/honeymoon/premium demand to the resorts of LGK, or the more general PEN for resorts and tourists? Seasonal perhaps? MH run BKI-PER (albeit weekly) and AO used to run BKI-SYD, maybe try again? Get JQ to dip the toes in the waters twice a week and see how it goes?

My $0.02


I'm honestly surprised MH PER-BKI is still operating considering the load factors in some of the BITRE figures.
Saying that, back in the day they used to run an A330 on PER-KCH too 2 x weekly.
 
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qf2220
Posts: 1947
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Tue Dec 17, 2019 2:42 am

Sydscott wrote:
I think the answer is pretty easy in that Australians, in general, prefer and are far more familiar with Singapore and Hong Kong than what they are with the Middle Eastern Cities as a shopping and layover destination.


In other words, we find that SIN and HKG are more interesting places for us than DXB?
 
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CraigAnderson
Posts: 540
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Tue Dec 17, 2019 2:42 am

The IASC has revoked, at Virgin's request, approval for "1,925 seats per week in each direction on the China route."

https://iasc.govcms.gov.au/determinatio ... 019iasc209
 
tullamarine
Posts: 2485
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 1999 1:14 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Tue Dec 17, 2019 3:07 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
The IASC has revoked, at Virgin's request, approval for "1,925 seats per week in each direction on the China route."

https://iasc.govcms.gov.au/determinatio ... 019iasc209

Not really surprising. Chinese carriers have largely flooded the market and with most of the traffic originating in China it is not hard to see why VA (and QF) are reducing their invovement in China for the time being.
717, 721/2, 732/3/4/5/7/8/9, 742/3/4, 752/3, 762/3, 772/E/W, 788/9, 300,310, 319,320/1, 332/3, 359, 388, DC9, DC10, F28, F100, 142,143, E75/90, CR2, D82/3/4, SF3, ATR
 
Ishrion
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Tue Dec 17, 2019 3:19 am

Interesting not much press is covering this 3rd research flight? I guess everyone forgot about it. Sort of makes sense considering it’s a repeat.
 
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Goodbye
Posts: 940
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - December 2019

Tue Dec 17, 2019 3:27 am

Ishrion wrote:
Interesting not much press is covering this 3rd research flight? I guess everyone forgot about it. Sort of makes sense considering it’s a repeat.


Perhaps everyone has realised that 19-hour flights aren't that big a deal and not really worth talking about.
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