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User avatar
NeBaNi
Posts: 477
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Tue Jun 23, 2020 9:57 pm

Ishrion wrote:
The E175 aircraft compliments the current Boeing 737 mainline flying in, to and from the state of Alaska and is perfect for many communities where larger jets are not the best option.


Nice.

Also the start date is some time in October 2020

You'd think they would spell check/ have another pair of eyes look over the article before publishing it :lol:
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4973
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Tue Jun 23, 2020 10:45 pm

chrisair wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
No passengers. No TSA. Not a part 139 airport.


Does the TSA still fly agents in to some airports in Alaska to do passenger screenings?

Yes. But you wouldn’t do that at say ENA. You’d need real TSA. Also year round TSA at AKN ans DLG will be all awesome for those communities
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5184
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:33 am

CMHtraveler wrote:
CLJFlyer wrote:
CMHtraveler wrote:

Unknown. It appeared on a list of requested CARES act exemption drops from AS about three weeks ago and has been operating as a tag-on to SEA-MSP during the pandemic. However, since that time the OAG threads here have indicated that rather than disappearing it is returning to a daily direct flight (rather than tag-on, which would seem good news?) in July and there has been no further news on a drop. Your guess is as good as mine, maybe someone on this thread has more info?


I have flown the CMH-SEA through MSP 4 times this month. I hate the tag on, but better to have this service than none. Hopefully it sticks.


It did so well last summer (load factors above 95%) that pre-pandemic it was slated to go from 1x 319/320 to 2x 738 this year. DL added a competing a220 segment too. If air traffic returns to anything quasi-normal I see no reason it would be discontinued.


I don't know how much to read into it, but the fact it's a non-stop again as opposed to continuing with the MSP tag seems encouraging, especially since they're still running tags (as is the case with SEA-PIT-CHS, though I get that SEA-CHS is dependent on Boeing traffic).
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
deltaSEAalsaka
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:45 am

DeltaRules wrote:
CMHtraveler wrote:
CLJFlyer wrote:

I have flown the CMH-SEA through MSP 4 times this month. I hate the tag on, but better to have this service than none. Hopefully it sticks.


It did so well last summer (load factors above 95%) that pre-pandemic it was slated to go from 1x 319/320 to 2x 738 this year. DL added a competing a220 segment too. If air traffic returns to anything quasi-normal I see no reason it would be discontinued.


I don't know how much to read into it, but the fact it's a non-stop again as opposed to continuing with the MSP tag seems encouraging, especially since they're still running tags (as is the case with SEA-PIT-CHS, though I get that SEA-CHS is dependent on Boeing traffic).


The stopped running that on June 14 and now operate a non-stop SEA-CHS again. The PIT tag to CHS was also only around for a week.
There is no such thing as a stupid question, just stupid people asking questions.
 
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NameOmitted
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:19 am

32andBelow wrote:
chrisair wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
No passengers. No TSA. Not a part 139 airport.


Does the TSA still fly agents in to some airports in Alaska to do passenger screenings?

Yes. But you wouldn’t do that at say ENA. You’d need real TSA. Also year round TSA at AKN ans DLG will be all awesome for those communities

Or fly 50 seat Q-400 combis and not use the TSA. ANC has the gate space in the non-sterile part of the airport.

I know, the ship had sailed on the Q in Alaska, but in guessing they could pick up the Combi very quickly.
 
roadrunner165
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:49 am

32andBelow seems to think only towns on the road system can support E175s. ;) :white:
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4973
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Wed Jun 24, 2020 2:33 am

roadrunner165 wrote:
32andBelow seems to think only towns on the road system can support E175s. ;) :white:

These towns people are talking about have PDEW under 50.
 
n7371f
Posts: 1830
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:49 am

AS pilots can't do anything about it. They allowed company unlimited regional growth in last contract. If management hypothetically wanted to put E195's at QX, they could and add as many ships as they wanted.

UA735WL wrote:
I can't imagine that the AS mainline pilots are particularly happy about this. SEA-ANC/FAI on an E75? There is *nothing* regional about such a route. Those are AS's trunk routes to Alaska. Sure it says it "complements" the mainline service, but you'd be naive to think that if it does well you won't see more frequencies go to the Embraer post COVID. I expect some sort of stink.
 
tiptoe42
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:32 am

n7371f wrote:
AS pilots can't do anything about it. They allowed company unlimited regional growth in last contract. If management hypothetically wanted to put E195's at QX, they could and add as many ships as they wanted.

UA735WL wrote:
I can't imagine that the AS mainline pilots are particularly happy about this. SEA-ANC/FAI on an E75? There is *nothing* regional about such a route. Those are AS's trunk routes to Alaska. Sure it says it "complements" the mainline service, but you'd be naive to think that if it does well you won't see more frequencies go to the Embraer post COVID. I expect some sort of stink.


They could put anything at Horizon, Airbus, 737 etc. the pilot contract at Alaska is a joke.
 
Chugach
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Thu Jun 25, 2020 10:48 pm

The first AS E175 flight in Alaska is loaded. AS2020, ANC-AKN-DLG-ANC. Starts 10/1.
 
32andBelow
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Thu Jun 25, 2020 10:50 pm

If I were AS I would just take the opportunity to put ravn 2.0 in its grave and take ena and hom immediately. Expand service to cdb, and get a real codeshare with grant.
 
Chugach
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:58 am

32andBelow wrote:
If I were AS I would just take the opportunity to put ravn 2.0 in its grave and take ena and hom immediately. Expand service to cdb, and get a real codeshare with grant.


I’ll be interested to see if AS is one of the bidders to buy parts of Ravn out of bankruptcy. Couldn’t agree more on ENA and HOM. Heck they could even cherry pick VDZ and stick it on the 61/66 milk run.
 
32andBelow
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Fri Jun 26, 2020 3:01 am

Chugach wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
If I were AS I would just take the opportunity to put ravn 2.0 in its grave and take ena and hom immediately. Expand service to cdb, and get a real codeshare with grant.


I’ll be interested to see if AS is one of the bidders to buy parts of Ravn out of bankruptcy. Couldn’t agree more on ENA and HOM. Heck they could even cherry pick VDZ and stick it on the 61/66 milk run.

VDZ is a tough airport. It would need an RNP approach and be flown on the 737. Doesn’t have nearly as much passengers as HOM and ENA. In the past AS had a good buddy buddy relationship with the old penair owners. Since they are out of the picture time to put the pedal to the metal and be Alaska real regional airline. If they got a good relationship with the 135 guys they could just increase flying to OME and OTZ and other village hubs for connections.

I suppose they could buy 7H and throw some older q400s there as e175s come on.
 
panam330
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Fri Jun 26, 2020 4:39 am

tiptoe42 wrote:
They could put anything at Horizon, Airbus, 737 etc. the pilot contract at Alaska is a joke.

Agreed. Something tells me scope’s going to be a big to-do in the next round, and rightfully so. The next couple of years aren’t going to be pretty at AS if QX is allowed further down this path.
 
32andBelow
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:01 am

panam330 wrote:
tiptoe42 wrote:
They could put anything at Horizon, Airbus, 737 etc. the pilot contract at Alaska is a joke.

Agreed. Something tells me scope’s going to be a big to-do in the next round, and rightfully so. The next couple of years aren’t going to be pretty at AS if QX is allowed further down this path.

To be fair 76 seats is the right size for these markets. They were flown by 30 seats before.
 
panam330
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:07 am

32andBelow wrote:
panam330 wrote:
tiptoe42 wrote:
They could put anything at Horizon, Airbus, 737 etc. the pilot contract at Alaska is a joke.

Agreed. Something tells me scope’s going to be a big to-do in the next round, and rightfully so. The next couple of years aren’t going to be pretty at AS if QX is allowed further down this path.

To be fair 76 seats is the right size for these markets. They were flown by 30 seats before.

Oh, I’m not disagreeing with regard to the smaller markets you’re referring to. What I’m meaning to say is that a 175 doesn’t belong on SEA-ANC/FAI or other major markets.
Last edited by panam330 on Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
32andBelow
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:10 am

panam330 wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
panam330 wrote:
Agreed. Something tells me scope’s going to be a big to-do in the next round, and rightfully so. The next couple of years aren’t going to be pretty at AS if QX is allowed further down this path.

To be fair 76 seats is the right size for these markets. They were flown by 30 seats before.

Oh, I’m not disagreeing with regard to the smaller markets you’re referring to. What I am saying is that a 175 doesn’t belong on SEA-ANC/FAI or other major markets.

It absolutely should be on ANC/FAI. I think they could have found a better way to Rotate it to the lower 48. Like ANC-PAE or FAI-PDX. Something new and thinner.
 
panam330
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:14 am

32andBelow wrote:
panam330 wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
To be fair 76 seats is the right size for these markets. They were flown by 30 seats before.

Oh, I’m not disagreeing with regard to the smaller markets you’re referring to. What I am saying is that a 175 doesn’t belong on SEA-ANC/FAI or other major markets.

It absolutely should be on ANC/FAI. I think they could have found a better way to Rotate it to the lower 48. Like ANC-PAE or FAI-PDX. Something new and thinner.

Right now? Sure, if it ensures the airline survives. During normal times, I guess we’ll agree to disagree here. I would’ve loved to see newer, thinner routes to rotate them up, but right now it’s clear they’re not ready to play a game of risk with something like PAE-FAI (which I selfishly would love to see).
 
32andBelow
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:16 am

panam330 wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
panam330 wrote:
Oh, I’m not disagreeing with regard to the smaller markets you’re referring to. What I am saying is that a 175 doesn’t belong on SEA-ANC/FAI or other major markets.

It absolutely should be on ANC/FAI. I think they could have found a better way to Rotate it to the lower 48. Like ANC-PAE or FAI-PDX. Something new and thinner.

Right now? Sure, if it ensures the airline survives. During normal times, I guess we’ll agree to disagree here. I would’ve loved to see newer, thinner routes to rotate them up, but right now it’s clear they’re not ready to play a game of risk with something like PAE-FAI (which I selfishly would love to see).

I wonder if ADQ-SEA would work 5X
 
roadrunner165
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Fri Jun 26, 2020 7:35 am

32andBelow wrote:
roadrunner165 wrote:
32andBelow seems to think only towns on the road system can support E175s. ;) :white:

These towns people are talking about have PDEW under 50.


You’re probably right, Unalakleet isnt on their radar and probably wont be for the distant future. Im just wishful thinking. But I will just add that Norton Sound Economic Development Corporation is headquarterd in both Unalakleet and Anchorage – they have $30 million cash and equilvents on hand and $200 million in investments. They also operate the cannery in Unalakleet during the summer. The Bering Straits Schools district operates 13 schools in the Norton Sound Region and is headquartered in Unalakleet – you can imagine that equates to a fair number of students and teachers flying in and out during the year. And the Norton Sound Health Corporation regional sub-clinic routintely sends patients to Anchroage for care from Unalakleet, Stebbins, St. Michael, Koyuk and Shaktoolik – the meidcaid rate is $445 one way between Anchorage and Unalakleet. So you can continue to talk about the low PDEW or whatever excuse you want to justify your belief that service will never happen. But Unalakleet could in theory support 3 flights a week. Unalakleet to Anchorage is about the same as Seattle to Boise, which you can find on sale for $85 one way main fare – it doesn’t take too many medicaid patients to suddenly make a half full flight from UNK-ANC more profitable then a full flight from SEA-BOI. With Ravns demise, Alaska has an opportunity to seek out new markets, and I’m sure they're taking a look at everything right now.
 
32andBelow
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:11 pm

roadrunner165 wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
roadrunner165 wrote:
32andBelow seems to think only towns on the road system can support E175s. ;) :white:

These towns people are talking about have PDEW under 50.


You’re probably right, Unalakleet isnt on their radar and probably wont be for the distant future. Im just wishful thinking. But I will just add that Norton Sound Economic Development Corporation is headquarterd in both Unalakleet and Anchorage – they have $30 million cash and equilvents on hand and $200 million in investments. They also operate the cannery in Unalakleet during the summer. The Bering Straits Schools district operates 13 schools in the Norton Sound Region and is headquartered in Unalakleet – you can imagine that equates to a fair number of students and teachers flying in and out during the year. And the Norton Sound Health Corporation regional sub-clinic routintely sends patients to Anchroage for care from Unalakleet, Stebbins, St. Michael, Koyuk and Shaktoolik – the meidcaid rate is $445 one way between Anchorage and Unalakleet. So you can continue to talk about the low PDEW or whatever excuse you want to justify your belief that service will never happen. But Unalakleet could in theory support 3 flights a week. Unalakleet to Anchorage is about the same as Seattle to Boise, which you can find on sale for $85 one way main fare – it doesn’t take too many medicaid patients to suddenly make a half full flight from UNK-ANC more profitable then a full flight from SEA-BOI. With Ravns demise, Alaska has an opportunity to seek out new markets, and I’m sure they're taking a look at everything right now.

Have you been to Alaska or are you just googling things? These markets are stable and they don’t exactly grow. They were served by 30 seat airplanes that didn’t have very high load factors. Every village has a regional corporation. They don’t exactly employ thousands. The teachers and students you listed already made up a high percentage of the passengers that didn’t fill the 30 seat airplane.

UNK comes no where close to AKN/DLG/HOM/ENA which have large seafood operations and get a lot of tourism. Maybe 3x would “work” but these communities need daily connections places as it’s how you get to the doctor.
 
roadrunner165
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Fri Jun 26, 2020 9:50 pm

NSEDC is a CDQ - one of six non-profit corporations represent 65 communities with the purpose of economic development in western Alaska and goals to alleviate poverty, provide economic and social benefits to residents, and achieve sustainable local economies. (These are NOT native corporations as you imply.) Their authority is authorized under the Magnuson-Stevens Fishery Conservation and Management Act of 1992. And for the record, I’ve been an Alaska resident since 2005. Began coming to Alaska in 1997 when I was 12 years old. :bigthumbsup: And I think I’m done with this conversation.
 
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usxguy
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Fri Jun 26, 2020 10:20 pm

Well Ravn did get 30 bidders.... so who knows.
xx
 
32andBelow
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Fri Jun 26, 2020 10:46 pm

roadrunner165 wrote:
NSEDC is a CDQ - one of six non-profit corporations represent 65 communities with the purpose of economic development in western Alaska and goals to alleviate poverty, provide economic and social benefits to residents, and achieve sustainable local economies. (These are NOT native corporations as you imply.) Their authority is authorized under the Magnuson-Stevens Fishery Conservation and Management Act of 1992. And for the record, I’ve been an Alaska resident since 2005. Began coming to Alaska in 1997 when I was 12 years old. :bigthumbsup: And I think I’m done with this conversation.

I just don’t understand where your getting your UNK traffic data. Because it’s not reality.
 
roadrunner165
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Re: AS officially sending the E175 to Alaska

Sat Jun 27, 2020 12:27 am

This thread is about Alaska introducing E-175 operations within the state of Alaska. I made a blanket statement that AS should look at opening up new thinner routes as well to better serve local markets. Unalakleet is just an example of a location in my region that could potentially be of interests to AS down the road. They seem to think they can make money sending 737 freighters there multiple times a week. And all you've done is piss on that idea -- all while continually moving your goal post and demonstrating you have little understanding of rural Alaska or how it works. Just for kicks, the UNK airport had 16,208 emplanements in 2018. How many of those had an eventual destination of Anchorage either directly our via Nome? And exactly zero of them have the option of hopping in their car and driving. I'll see myself out the door.
 
RWRCAS
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Sat Jun 27, 2020 3:02 pm

sunking737 wrote:
Did anyone catch that AS is going to cut even more Airbus jets next year?? I saw it posted in Aviator newsletter.I get emailed daily. " Alaska Airlines (US) plans to retire more A320s, including seven of its 49 remaining A320s in 2021. The carrier will retire one B737-800 and hopes to take delivery of 15 B737 MAX 8s in 2021."


As it has been said, those A320s leases are expiring and were always planned to be returned next year. Alaska does not have any MAX 8s coming. They have MAX 9s on order.
 
PHLspecial
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Sat Jun 27, 2020 6:44 pm

RWRCAS wrote:
sunking737 wrote:
Did anyone catch that AS is going to cut even more Airbus jets next year?? I saw it posted in Aviator newsletter.I get emailed daily. " Alaska Airlines (US) plans to retire more A320s, including seven of its 49 remaining A320s in 2021. The carrier will retire one B737-800 and hopes to take delivery of 15 B737 MAX 8s in 2021."


As it has been said, those A320s leases are expiring and were always planned to be returned next year. Alaska does not have any MAX 8s coming. They have MAX 9s on order.

Are they doing to dump the neos as well?
 
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EA CO AS
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Sat Jun 27, 2020 7:32 pm

PHLspecial wrote:
Are they doing to dump the neos as well?


Nothing has been decided on the A321NEOs just yet, but AS really, really, REALLY likes them.

The plan is to call back 19 airframes from storage in July and another 17-19ish in August, with the intention of operating at 60% of pre-COVID levels by then, gradually increasing from there.

Regarding the recent B6 adds, they definitely received attention and expect to see a response.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Sat Jun 27, 2020 8:31 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
PHLspecial wrote:
Are they doing to dump the neos as well?


Nothing has been decided on the A321NEOs just yet, but AS really, really, REALLY likes them.

The plan is to call back 19 airframes from storage in July and another 17-19ish in August, with the intention of operating at 60% of pre-COVID levels by then, gradually increasing from there.

Regarding the recent B6 adds, they definitely received attention and expect to see a response.


By response are you hinting more at a retreat or additional capacity?
 
PHLspecial
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Sat Jun 27, 2020 9:01 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
PHLspecial wrote:
Are they doing to dump the neos as well?


Nothing has been decided on the A321NEOs just yet, but AS really, really, REALLY likes them.

The plan is to call back 19 airframes from storage in July and another 17-19ish in August, with the intention of operating at 60% of pre-COVID levels by then, gradually increasing from there.

Regarding the recent B6 adds, they definitely received attention and expect to see a response.

Thank you for the info!
 
hiflyeras
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Sat Jun 27, 2020 9:41 pm

Would love to see an aggressive response targeted at B6...it could involve BOS, JFK, EWR...who knows? Grab a bunch of LGB slots? That’d be fun to watch and maybe cheaper than adding transcons. ;)
 
wedgetail737
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Sun Jun 28, 2020 3:18 am

EA CO AS wrote:
PHLspecial wrote:
Are they doing to dump the neos as well?


Nothing has been decided on the A321NEOs just yet, but AS really, really, REALLY likes them.

The plan is to call back 19 airframes from storage in July and another 17-19ish in August, with the intention of operating at 60% of pre-COVID levels by then, gradually increasing from there.

Regarding the recent B6 adds, they definitely received attention and expect to see a response.


I think the passengers really like the A321-NEO's...I like them. But all the A319's are history.
 
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gunsontheroof
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:47 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
PHLspecial wrote:
Are they doing to dump the neos as well?


Nothing has been decided on the A321NEOs just yet, but AS really, really, REALLY likes them.

The plan is to call back 19 airframes from storage in July and another 17-19ish in August, with the intention of operating at 60% of pre-COVID levels by then, gradually increasing from there.

Regarding the recent B6 adds, they definitely received attention and expect to see a response.


I'll be quite surprised if AS doesn't ultimately hang on to the A321 fleet. There doesn't seem to be a more viable competitor available in that class, AS already has a large pool of Airbus pilots and the aircraft gives them a nice platform to explore advancing their transcon offerings post-covid. They've also grown/diversified their network enough where operating a single type might not be their wisest option.
Picked a hell of a week to quit sniffing glue.
 
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SANFan
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Sun Jun 28, 2020 9:53 pm

A question came up on the OAG thread this morning and maybe some here can clarify.

AS is showing that starting Aug 1, they will operate 1 daily flight from PAE to LAS and 1 to PHX. All other Paine Field routes are non-existent.

Huh?

Is the airport open or closed as of 8/1? If closed, how is AS handling 2 daily flights (and why is one to PHX, in August, in the midst of a huge COVID presence?) If open, what about all the other destinations? I realize this all could (and very well might) change but it seems that AAG should have some idea about and a handle on what's going on in August, even for a preliminary schedule release.

Thanks in advance for any help in figuring this out.

bb
 
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gunsontheroof
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Sun Jun 28, 2020 11:22 pm

SANFan wrote:
A question came up on the OAG thread this morning and maybe some here can clarify.

AS is showing that starting Aug 1, they will operate 1 daily flight from PAE to LAS and 1 to PHX. All other Paine Field routes are non-existent.

Huh?

Is the airport open or closed as of 8/1? If closed, how is AS handling 2 daily flights (and why is one to PHX, in August, in the midst of a huge COVID presence?) If open, what about all the other destinations? I realize this all could (and very well might) change but it seems that AAG should have some idea about and a handle on what's going on in August, even for a preliminary schedule release.

Thanks in advance for any help in figuring this out.

bb


I think PAE-PHX is the only route currently in play, but I'd be surprised if AS and UA didn't come back when things return to normal. PAE hit 1,000,000 pax in their first year, not a bad start.

https://www.heraldnet.com/business/alas ... e-per-day/
Picked a hell of a week to quit sniffing glue.
 
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EA CO AS
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 1:04 am

PAEPHX has been huge for AS.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
wnflyguy
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 1:35 am

gunsontheroof wrote:
SANFan wrote:
A question came up on the OAG thread this morning and maybe some here can clarify.

AS is showing that starting Aug 1, they will operate 1 daily flight from PAE to LAS and 1 to PHX. All other Paine Field routes are non-existent.

Huh?

Is the airport open or closed as of 8/1? If closed, how is AS handling 2 daily flights (and why is one to PHX, in August, in the midst of a huge COVID presence?) If open, what about all the other destinations? I realize this all could (and very well might) change but it seems that AAG should have some idea about and a handle on what's going on in August, even for a preliminary schedule release.

Thanks in advance for any help in figuring this out.

bb


I think PAE-PHX is the only route currently in play, but I'd be surprised if AS and UA didn't come back when things return to normal. PAE hit 1,000,000 pax in their first year, not a bad start.

https://www.heraldnet.com/business/alas ... e-per-day/


Well PAE also stated they have a business to run. The covid impact will force them to take back all unused slots from United and AlaskaAir. And seek out other airlines to service the airport.
They need the revenue to pay the bills and can't gamble on United or AlaskaAir maybe coming back some day.

Spirit, Frontier ,Southwest and JetBlue are all in prime position to jump in and gain marketshare.

AlaskaAir I think is going to be forced into defending it's turf in this pandemic should a strong player takes PAE up on getting slots.

Flyguy
My Wings are clipped just another Retired Airline person. The Ultimate Armchair out of the loop airline industry geek. Aloha Mr Hand!
 
CaptainObvious1
Posts: 50
Joined: Sat Apr 11, 2020 11:22 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 1:45 am

wnflyguy wrote:
gunsontheroof wrote:
SANFan wrote:
A question came up on the OAG thread this morning and maybe some here can clarify.

AS is showing that starting Aug 1, they will operate 1 daily flight from PAE to LAS and 1 to PHX. All other Paine Field routes are non-existent.

Huh?

Is the airport open or closed as of 8/1? If closed, how is AS handling 2 daily flights (and why is one to PHX, in August, in the midst of a huge COVID presence?) If open, what about all the other destinations? I realize this all could (and very well might) change but it seems that AAG should have some idea about and a handle on what's going on in August, even for a preliminary schedule release.

Thanks in advance for any help in figuring this out.

bb


I think PAE-PHX is the only route currently in play, but I'd be surprised if AS and UA didn't come back when things return to normal. PAE hit 1,000,000 pax in their first year, not a bad start.

https://www.heraldnet.com/business/alas ... e-per-day/


Well PAE also stated they have a business to run. The covid impact will force them to take back all unused slots from United and AlaskaAir. And seek out other airlines to service the airport.
They need the revenue to pay the bills and can't gamble on United or AlaskaAir maybe coming back some day.

Spirit, Frontier ,Southwest and JetBlue are all in prime position to jump in and gain marketshare.

AlaskaAir I think is going to be forced into defending it's turf in this pandemic should a strong player takes PAE up on getting slots.

Flyguy


What routes do you see the above mentioned airlines wanting to jump in and serve based on the market?
 
Nicknuzzii
Posts: 1159
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2018 5:57 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 1:52 am

A little embarrassing for AS to retreat again in August from EWR considering the B6 expansion. I would have thought AS would have at least matched the frequencies. The routes are legacy VX routes and were amongst the most profitable, what happened?
 
wnflyguy
Posts: 1962
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 7:58 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 1:52 am

CaptainObvious1 wrote:
wnflyguy wrote:
gunsontheroof wrote:

I think PAE-PHX is the only route currently in play, but I'd be surprised if AS and UA didn't come back when things return to normal. PAE hit 1,000,000 pax in their first year, not a bad start.

https://www.heraldnet.com/business/alas ... e-per-day/


Well PAE also stated they have a business to run. The covid impact will force them to take back all unused slots from United and AlaskaAir. And seek out other airlines to service the airport.
They need the revenue to pay the bills and can't gamble on United or AlaskaAir maybe coming back some day.

Spirit, Frontier ,Southwest and JetBlue are all in prime position to jump in and gain marketshare.

AlaskaAir I think is going to be forced into defending it's turf in this pandemic should a strong player takes PAE up on getting slots.

Flyguy


What routes do you see the above mentioned airlines wanting to jump in and serve based on the market?


Well Frontier is the King for throwing darts.
They love to jump in and try a bunch of different things.
Spirit would probably add a lot of west coast dots to fill the AS and UA void like PHX,LAS,LAX,OAK,DEN and SAN.

And

If Southwest jumped back in the game I see
DEN,LAS,OAK and PHX.

Flyguy
My Wings are clipped just another Retired Airline person. The Ultimate Armchair out of the loop airline industry geek. Aloha Mr Hand!
 
n7371f
Posts: 1830
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:54 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 4:09 am

Huge would mean 2 737's a day.

EA CO AS wrote:
PAEPHX has been huge for AS.
 
d8s
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 6:45 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 4:56 am

sunking737 wrote:
Did anyone catch that AS is going to cut even more Airbus jets next year?? I saw it posted in Aviator newsletter.I get emailed daily. " Alaska Airlines (US) plans to retire more A320s, including seven of its 49 remaining A320s in 2021. The carrier will retire one B737-800 and hopes to take delivery of 15 B737 MAX 8s in 2021."


I read they were doing the same with the A319, parking them all. Here is the article:

https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news ... -its-a319s
 
wedgetail737
Posts: 5253
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 5:53 am

wnflyguy wrote:
CaptainObvious1 wrote:
wnflyguy wrote:

Well PAE also stated they have a business to run. The covid impact will force them to take back all unused slots from United and AlaskaAir. And seek out other airlines to service the airport.
They need the revenue to pay the bills and can't gamble on United or AlaskaAir maybe coming back some day.

Spirit, Frontier ,Southwest and JetBlue are all in prime position to jump in and gain marketshare.

AlaskaAir I think is going to be forced into defending it's turf in this pandemic should a strong player takes PAE up on getting slots.

Flyguy


What routes do you see the above mentioned airlines wanting to jump in and serve based on the market?


Well Frontier is the King for throwing darts.
They love to jump in and try a bunch of different things.
Spirit would probably add a lot of west coast dots to fill the AS and UA void like PHX,LAS,LAX,OAK,DEN and SAN.

And

If Southwest jumped back in the game I see
DEN,LAS,OAK and PHX.

Flyguy


It will also depend on if the construction will be completed on time.
 
User avatar
SANFan
Posts: 5411
Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2006 10:10 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 8:21 am

Back to the PAE situation. Hold on a second here. First, there is NO service on AS from PAE to anywhere (including PHX) right now; PHX & LAS begin Aug 1 yet no other routes return.

The article linked above was written in mid-May, at the height of the COVID effects on AS and other cx. There was no mention of the airport construction coming up which would close the terminal and temporarily drop all service to Paine Field. The article made it sound like AS was perhaps just going to give up on PAE service.

I don't know what network planning in SEA is planning for PAE but I really can't foresee them cancelling all but 2 routes from PAE.

Now all of a sudden people here are trying to figure out which airlines are going to swoop in and replace AS (and UA?) ! I think we need to take a step back, take a deep breath and chill for a few weeks. I really doubt that AS is going anywhere and will bring their service at PAE back as soon as (a) the airport apron work is finished, and (b) the traffic at the airport reaches levels that support that service. (I assume UA will do the same.) The COVID recovery is really just starting and PAE is, after all, a pretty small airport near a very big airport!

The question I asked up-thread was why only a single flight to PHX and to LAS on August 1 by AS. (And again I say, PHX? In August?) Maybe AS is "trying the new apron out" at PAE with just a couple of flights? They can't even operate a single flight to SAN or LA or SJC? (I believe these markets all saw 2 daily flights pre-COVID.) Can all the CA markets have failed miserably from PAE for AAG?

bb
 
User avatar
SANFan
Posts: 5411
Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2006 10:10 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 8:28 am

BTW, I just checked AS's online schedules and Sept 1 shows 2 daily flights from PAE to SAN, LAX and SJC! (Those are the only markets I checked.) I realize these schedules could change but a lot of work has already been done on the Sept 1 release by AS and the PAE flights are there!

bb
 
User avatar
jfklganyc
Posts: 5958
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 2:31 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 11:53 am

[quote="Nicknuzzii"]A little embarrassing for AS to retreat again in August from EWR considering the B6 expansion. I would have thought AS would have at least matched the frequencies. The routes are legacy VX routes and were amongst the most profitable, what happened?[/


I think that’s why Jetblue made the move.

This isn’t the time for an aggressive response between three airlines on long haul flights.

Obviously these routes don’t make that much money for Alaska...They basically pulled Kennedy and Newark down to nothing thru Sept.


They have a product in J that isnt competitive on that route. They should’ve left a subfleet of Airbuses for the transcons with lie flat J
 
cledaybuck
Posts: 1712
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2016 6:07 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 12:19 pm

wnflyguy wrote:
gunsontheroof wrote:
SANFan wrote:
A question came up on the OAG thread this morning and maybe some here can clarify.

AS is showing that starting Aug 1, they will operate 1 daily flight from PAE to LAS and 1 to PHX. All other Paine Field routes are non-existent.

Huh?

Is the airport open or closed as of 8/1? If closed, how is AS handling 2 daily flights (and why is one to PHX, in August, in the midst of a huge COVID presence?) If open, what about all the other destinations? I realize this all could (and very well might) change but it seems that AAG should have some idea about and a handle on what's going on in August, even for a preliminary schedule release.

Thanks in advance for any help in figuring this out.

bb


I think PAE-PHX is the only route currently in play, but I'd be surprised if AS and UA didn't come back when things return to normal. PAE hit 1,000,000 pax in their first year, not a bad start.

https://www.heraldnet.com/business/alas ... e-per-day/


Well PAE also stated they have a business to run. The covid impact will force them to take back all unused slots from United and AlaskaAir. And seek out other airlines to service the airport.
They need the revenue to pay the bills and can't gamble on United or AlaskaAir maybe coming back some day.

Spirit, Frontier ,Southwest and JetBlue are all in prime position to jump in and gain marketshare.

AlaskaAir I think is going to be forced into defending it's turf in this pandemic should a strong player takes PAE up on getting slots.

Flyguy
This is some pretty fanciful thinking. These slots weren't a hot commodity before COVID.
As we celebrate mediocrity, all the boys upstairs want to see, how much you'll pay for what you used to get for free.
 
LAXBUR
Posts: 412
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2018 1:05 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 4:58 pm

cledaybuck wrote:
wnflyguy wrote:
gunsontheroof wrote:

I think PAE-PHX is the only route currently in play, but I'd be surprised if AS and UA didn't come back when things return to normal. PAE hit 1,000,000 pax in their first year, not a bad start.

https://www.heraldnet.com/business/alas ... e-per-day/


Well PAE also stated they have a business to run. The covid impact will force them to take back all unused slots from United and AlaskaAir. And seek out other airlines to service the airport.
They need the revenue to pay the bills and can't gamble on United or AlaskaAir maybe coming back some day.

Spirit, Frontier ,Southwest and JetBlue are all in prime position to jump in and gain marketshare.

AlaskaAir I think is going to be forced into defending it's turf in this pandemic should a strong player takes PAE up on getting slots.

Flyguy
This is some pretty fanciful thinking. These slots weren't a hot commodity before COVID.


Yeah, I don’t see how in the best of times when few were interested equates to more interest during the worst of times.

PAE will likely stay a small niche airport for AS frequent flyers at most. WN still isn’t very strong in the Northwest so operating out of another airport in Seattle doesn’t make much sense. JetBlue is likely mostly serving folks originating in the Northeast who won’t be familiar with “Everett”. I agree. This is “fanciful thinking”.
 
LAXBUR
Posts: 412
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2018 1:05 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 5:05 pm

SANFan wrote:
BTW, I just checked AS's online schedules and Sept 1 shows 2 daily flights from PAE to SAN, LAX and SJC! (Those are the only markets I checked.) I realize these schedules could change but a lot of work has already been done on the Sept 1 release by AS and the PAE flights are there!

bb


BOI, PDX, and GEG appear too. The Boise Airport said BOI-PAE is “delayed indefinitely” a few weeks ago in local media. I’d be surprised if this route sticks. I can’t speak for the others.
 
USAirALB
Posts: 2305
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 4:46 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 5:27 pm

LAXBUR wrote:
WN still isn’t very strong in the Northwest so operating out of another airport in Seattle doesn’t make much sense.

WN is actually very strong in the PNW from a brand recognition standpoint.

From a market perspective, they used to be incredibly strong, however retreated after suspending their intra-PNW routes.

They used to do:
GEG-PDX/SEA/SLC
SLC-BOI/RNO/SEA/PDX
PDX-BOI/RNO
BOI-SEA/RNO
RNO-SEA

Recall that they originally had planned to serve PAE with flights to both OAK and LAS. I wouldn't be surprised if they eventually serve PAE one day.
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