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IdlewildJFK
Posts: 20
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2020 1:25 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 07, 2020 11:51 pm

[quote="tphuang"]

Interesting quote from Scott Laurence “For us, LAX is the new world and we’re burning [all] our chips,”

[quote]

I wonder if he meant to say “burning our ships”
 
trueblew
Posts: 166
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:16 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Thu Oct 08, 2020 12:46 am

IdlewildJFK wrote:
tphuang wrote:

Interesting quote from Scott Laurence “For us, LAX is the new world and we’re burning [all] our chips,”


I wonder if he meant to say “burning our ships”


Yes, burning our ships. Not all our chips. Historical reference. (Scott is a bit of a nerd, and I mean that in the most respectful manner possible.) Fully committed to LAX, there's no going back.

Exciting times at JetBlue for the first time in over a decade.
 
DaCubbyBearBar
Posts: 124
Joined: Sat Apr 05, 2008 12:31 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Thu Oct 08, 2020 3:22 am

jplatts wrote:
tphuang wrote:
Unlike EWR, JetBlue knows building up LAX is going to cost a lot of resources. They are ready to go all in here. How they do in LAX is really going to affect the rest of their network. A really costly LAX expansion will prevent them from expanding elsewhere. A more successful LAX where they gain more corporate contracts and bicoastal ff will make the rest of their network more profitable and give them the resources to build up in more places.


Here are the Q3 2019 PDEW's out of Greater Los Angeles to some top contiguous U.S. markets that B6 doesn't currently serve nonstop from LAX:
  • LA-CHI - 3875
  • LA-DFW/DAL - 3344
  • LA-DEN - 3262
  • LA-SMF - 2988
  • LA-WAS - 2957
  • LA-PDX - 2799
  • LA-ATL - 1931
  • LA-IAH/HOU - 1850
  • LA-PHL - 1343
  • LA-MSP - 1315
  • LA-DTW - 1126
  • LA-BNA - 889
  • LA-CLE - 566
  • LA-CLT - 509
  • LA-PIT - 448

Unlike AA, DL, WN, or UA who can offer connections to contiguous U.S. destinations that they do not serve nonstop from LAX, B6 isn't able to offer connections from LAX to of the most contiguous U.S. markets that it doesn't serve nonstop from LAX and almost all of the connecting options that B6 is offering from LAX to U.S. destinations outside of New England, Puerto Rico, or USVI require significant backtracking. B6 is limited in the amount of market share that it will be able to capture in the LA market due to the limited connectivity offered to markets that it doesn't serve nonstop from LAX.

Most of the top domestic routes that B6 doesn't currently serve nonstop from LAX also already have nonstop service out of LAX on multiple airlines.

Once demand for domestic air travel recovers, B6 does have opportunities to add nonstop service out of LAX to domestic destinations such as CLT, CLE, DTW, MSP, PHL, and PIT that do not have the amount of nonstop competition that routes such as LAX-CHI/DFW/DAL/DEN/WAS have. LAX-CLT also currently lacks any nonstop competition, unlike most of the other top nonstop routes that B6 doesn't currently serve nonstop from LAX.

FORGET ABOUT 2019 statistics!!! INCOMPARABLE TO ANYTHING TODAY!!
I am me and no one else...so my opinions are mine
 
trueblew
Posts: 166
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:16 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Thu Oct 08, 2020 3:47 am

DaCubbyBearBar wrote:
jplatts wrote:
tphuang wrote:
Unlike EWR, JetBlue knows building up LAX is going to cost a lot of resources. They are ready to go all in here. How they do in LAX is really going to affect the rest of their network. A really costly LAX expansion will prevent them from expanding elsewhere. A more successful LAX where they gain more corporate contracts and bicoastal ff will make the rest of their network more profitable and give them the resources to build up in more places.


Here are the Q3 2019 PDEW's out of Greater Los Angeles to some top contiguous U.S. markets that B6 doesn't currently serve nonstop from LAX:
  • LA-CHI - 3875
  • LA-DFW/DAL - 3344
  • LA-DEN - 3262
  • LA-SMF - 2988
  • LA-WAS - 2957
  • LA-PDX - 2799
  • LA-ATL - 1931
  • LA-IAH/HOU - 1850
  • LA-PHL - 1343
  • LA-MSP - 1315
  • LA-DTW - 1126
  • LA-BNA - 889
  • LA-CLE - 566
  • LA-CLT - 509
  • LA-PIT - 448

Unlike AA, DL, WN, or UA who can offer connections to contiguous U.S. destinations that they do not serve nonstop from LAX, B6 isn't able to offer connections from LAX to of the most contiguous U.S. markets that it doesn't serve nonstop from LAX and almost all of the connecting options that B6 is offering from LAX to U.S. destinations outside of New England, Puerto Rico, or USVI require significant backtracking. B6 is limited in the amount of market share that it will be able to capture in the LA market due to the limited connectivity offered to markets that it doesn't serve nonstop from LAX.

Most of the top domestic routes that B6 doesn't currently serve nonstop from LAX also already have nonstop service out of LAX on multiple airlines.

Once demand for domestic air travel recovers, B6 does have opportunities to add nonstop service out of LAX to domestic destinations such as CLT, CLE, DTW, MSP, PHL, and PIT that do not have the amount of nonstop competition that routes such as LAX-CHI/DFW/DAL/DEN/WAS have. LAX-CLT also currently lacks any nonstop competition, unlike most of the other top nonstop routes that B6 doesn't currently serve nonstop from LAX.

FORGET ABOUT 2019 statistics!!! INCOMPARABLE TO ANYTHING TODAY!!


They still demonstrate the social and economic links between cities. Sure, the pandemic is affecting things but these links will not be fundamentally changing post-pandemic.
 
tphuang
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Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Fri Oct 09, 2020 12:51 pm

https://www.newsbreak.com/news/20786413 ... rose-stops
This is strange, Montrose press is reporting that JetBlue is also adding a weekly flight to MTJ from Boston starting mid December, but I see it nowhere on the JetBlue website. Maybe they will announce it next week.
 
BlueBaller
Posts: 76
Joined: Sun Sep 01, 2019 8:07 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Fri Oct 09, 2020 9:22 pm

Announced today via company news:

BOS-MTJ on all Saturdays and select Wednesdays
from 12/19/20 - 03/27/21

JFK-MTJ & LAX-MTJ on "select days" during December and Presidents Day peak holiday periods.
 
SurfandSnow
Posts: 1591
Joined: Sun Feb 01, 2009 7:09 am

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Fri Oct 09, 2020 11:58 pm

BlueBaller wrote:
Announced today via company news:

BOS-MTJ on all Saturdays and select Wednesdays
from 12/19/20 - 03/27/21

JFK-MTJ & LAX-MTJ on "select days" during December and Presidents Day peak holiday periods.


Wow! LAX-MTJ. Limited as this may be (for now), it's nice to see B6 exploring opportunities that it never took from LGB.
Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!
 
doulasc
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Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Sat Oct 10, 2020 12:21 am

Do you think JetBlue will return to IAD? When Indy Air went under That opened up a lot of routes JetBlue could have picked up but they want to focus at DCA.
 
hbernal1
Posts: 32
Joined: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:51 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Sat Oct 10, 2020 12:59 am

BlueBaller wrote:
Announced today via company news:

BOS-MTJ on all Saturdays and select Wednesdays
from 12/19/20 - 03/27/21

JFK-MTJ & LAX-MTJ on "select days" during December and Presidents Day peak holiday periods.


Looking like a B6 announcement is imminent then. Nice to see a new destination, even if it's seasonal. Prior to this (and over the last couple years), we've seen B6 axing a fair amount of destinations.

doulasc wrote:
Do you think JetBlue will return to IAD? When Indy Air went under That opened up a lot of routes JetBlue could have picked up but they want to focus at DCA.


B6 had a focus city there at one point, so it's a bit of a shame they left. That said, for the time being, I don't think B6 will want to go back given its resource commitment to expanding EWR/LAX and depressed business demand. Maybe once that's back, they might even be able to serve IAD-LAX/SFO with Mint, but that's years away, at least.
 
StinkyPinky
Posts: 66
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Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Sat Oct 10, 2020 1:31 am

hbernal1 wrote:
Maybe once that's back, they might even be able to serve IAD-LAX/SFO with Mint, but that's years away, at least.


I wonder if they could request for a perimeter exception to offer Mint on DCA-LAX/SFO. What is the process? Do they petition the DOT or FAA? Not sure how that works.
 
MAH4546
Posts: 26286
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Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Sat Oct 10, 2020 2:26 am

StinkyPinky wrote:
hbernal1 wrote:
Maybe once that's back, they might even be able to serve IAD-LAX/SFO with Mint, but that's years away, at least.


I wonder if they could request for a perimeter exception to offer Mint on DCA-LAX/SFO. What is the process? Do they petition the DOT or FAA? Not sure how that works.


Congress has to make them available. They cannot petition for any.
a.
 
tphuang
Posts: 5462
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Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Sat Oct 10, 2020 10:17 am

Thanks for the confirmation on MTJ. I guess they have to make an announcement on this next week after the local newspaper outed them. It's a little strange to me JFK/LAX-MTJ are only for selected days. I would've made them 1x weekly with extra on holiday weekends.

Other thing I've looked at today was VX's old network. It dawned me that JetBlue's west coast network is starting to look more and more like VX's pre-merger network. So I took a look at their flight data based on T-100 report from Q1 of 2016. This is what I found.

SFO had approximately 55 flights a day on peak days with following destinations (in terms of capacity from highest to lowest) LAX, LAS, SAN, JFK, DAL, SEA, BOS, AUS, DEN, IAD, PSP, FLL, PDX, DCA, EWR, ORD, OGG, HNL.

LAX had around 40 flights a day with following destinations SFO, JFK, LAS, DAL, FLL, EWR, SEA, BOS, ORD, IAD, MCO.

Basically, they ran a strategy of transcon, leisure and some major west coast destinations. Aside from ORD and DAL, nothing to the middle of the country. They also didn't try any of the smaller markets in west coast. The average stage length of their flights were 1400 miles. Even with that type of network, they were able to attract a small but very vocal and passionate following. It seemed to me that they did not have a problem gaining revenue. They had a problem keeping cost down since their small single fleet left them operating large FC seating on west coast routes and flights out of DAL.

The type of network that VX ran should be very similar to what JetBlue eventually operates out of LAX/SFO. If they can get the necessary gates at SFO, they can have the west coast network that they envisioned when bidding for VX. It would be interesting to see if they can attract a good chunk of the old VX ff base. If VX could attract that group without serving middle of the country or smaller west coast market, I don't see why JetBlue would not be able to attract ff from a larger pool of customers. They will probably need to get into LAX-SFO shuttle and offer some token presence to some tough markets like ORD, DEN, PHX and SMF from LAX. Out of SFO, they can get to 75% of VX's old network by adding LAS, HNL, SEA, SAN and AUS. They don't need to do anything crazy like trying mini focus city in Dallas or routes to legacy fortress hubs out of SFO.

I think their product will stand out and have good economics. Mint is obviously well suited for premium markets and Hawaii. A220 is good for high frequency business markets and long thin transcon. Reconfigured A320 or all-core A321s for leisure/Central American markets and other non-premium transcon.
 
maverick4002
Posts: 312
Joined: Sun Jul 12, 2015 2:14 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Sat Oct 10, 2020 5:56 pm

tphuang wrote:
https://www.newsbreak.com/news/2078641396203/southwest-airlines-jetblue-adding-montrose-stops
This is strange, Montrose press is reporting that JetBlue is also adding a weekly flight to MTJ from Boston starting mid December, but I see it nowhere on the JetBlue website. Maybe they will announce it next week.


Do you have Google alerts set up for B6?
 
tphuang
Posts: 5462
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Sat Oct 10, 2020 7:00 pm

maverick4002 wrote:
tphuang wrote:
https://www.newsbreak.com/news/2078641396203/southwest-airlines-jetblue-adding-montrose-stops
This is strange, Montrose press is reporting that JetBlue is also adding a weekly flight to MTJ from Boston starting mid December, but I see it nowhere on the JetBlue website. Maybe they will announce it next week.


Do you have Google alerts set up for B6?

no, just a middle age dude who apparently has too much time on his hand.
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Mon Oct 12, 2020 7:31 pm

Speaking of BOS and TATL, I have to wonder, once B6 gets ETOPS approval, if they would consider PDL or LIS from either BOS or EWR on the A21N, along with upgrading the 200-seat A21N fleet to ETOPS? (JFK to me is on the wrong side of the Hudson to capture a significant VFR market; the strongest VFR market would be eastern MA followed by New Jersey in the Ironbound.) PDL would make good sense on a 200-seat A21N in the summer season...maybe 3x weekly from EWR and daily from BOS.

The only issue at EWR is that Terminal B space would be needed, but there are narrow-body gates available that wide-bodies cannot use, and then the plane could be towed to Terminal A or 1 to do a flight to LAX (if a Mint A21N is used EWR-PDL) or FLL (non-Mint).

DL did do JFK-PDL in S19, using a former NW B752 (the former NW B752s are ETOPS-equipped), but even without COVID-19, that route was not coming back for S20.

As for LAX, the Airbus A220-300 (BCS3) could work well on some other regional routes, like winter seasonal routes EGE and COS (EGE also from JFK and BOS). Also, I wonder if LAX-DEN might be considered on an A320 (DEN-JFK is an A321/A21N mix), as well as intra-state service service to SMF from LAX (where the BCS3 could work).

How many flights a day is B6 running out of LAX now, and how many gates does B6 have?
 
tphuang
Posts: 5462
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Tue Oct 13, 2020 1:56 am

They have 23 departures out of LAX today. That's about their peak for October so far. Next month, they peak at 29 departures I think. They've picked up another gate,. Now they have 55A, 58 and 59. There are a couple of shared gates that are basically not being used right now. AA is doing about 1 to 2 turns a day on their gates in T-5 right now. Only F9 and NK seem to also be at or close to their pre-pandemic # of flights. Adding those 6 flights should be no problem. Once ULCCs start to move out, there will be plenty of space at LAX for them to expand. If T-5 is down to just B6 and AA, B6 should pour some money into improving terminal experience there. Maybe once they become a little larger in LAX, they can spend some money for LAX to expand the terminal space a little bit.

I'd expect there to be quite a few A220 based on in LAX. It seems like A220-300 would be pretty ideal for SFO shuttle and to places like SEA/SMF/PHX/SLC. I'd try ORD before DEN.
 
Ishrion
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Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 2:07 pm

 
User avatar
jfklganyc
Posts: 6076
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Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:16 pm

tphuang wrote:
They have 23 departures out of LAX today. That's about their peak for October so far. Next month, they peak at 29 departures I think. They've picked up another gate,. Now they have 55A, 58 and 59. There are a couple of shared gates that are basically not being used right now. AA is doing about 1 to 2 turns a day on their gates in T-5 right now. Only F9 and NK seem to also be at or close to their pre-pandemic # of flights. Adding those 6 flights should be no problem. Once ULCCs start to move out, there will be plenty of space at LAX for them to expand. If T-5 is down to just B6 and AA, B6 should pour some money into improving terminal experience there. Maybe once they become a little larger in LAX, they can spend some money for LAX to expand the terminal space a little bit.

I'd expect there to be quite a few A220 based on in LAX. It seems like A220-300 would be pretty ideal for SFO shuttle and to places like SEA/SMF/PHX/SLC. I'd try ORD before DEN.



I must say it is disheartening to see how few resources are in place for this new focus city.

Gates, crewroom, maintenance infrastructure, signage...Almost none of it is in place.

This is a big departure from the Jetblue of the past
 
DLASFlyer
Posts: 182
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 4:06 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:30 pm

Ishrion wrote:


JAC must be on the list for future leisure service.
 
Ishrion
Posts: 3052
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:17 am

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:33 pm

DLASFlyer wrote:
Ishrion wrote:


JAC must be on the list for future leisure service.


Wouldn't be surprised to see them add BOS-JAC.

AA was supposed to launch it in December but dropped it a few weeks ago, almost like they're planning to "hand it" over to JetBlue.
 
tphuang
Posts: 5462
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:38 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
tphuang wrote:
They have 23 departures out of LAX today. That's about their peak for October so far. Next month, they peak at 29 departures I think. They've picked up another gate,. Now they have 55A, 58 and 59. There are a couple of shared gates that are basically not being used right now. AA is doing about 1 to 2 turns a day on their gates in T-5 right now. Only F9 and NK seem to also be at or close to their pre-pandemic # of flights. Adding those 6 flights should be no problem. Once ULCCs start to move out, there will be plenty of space at LAX for them to expand. If T-5 is down to just B6 and AA, B6 should pour some money into improving terminal experience there. Maybe once they become a little larger in LAX, they can spend some money for LAX to expand the terminal space a little bit.

I'd expect there to be quite a few A220 based on in LAX. It seems like A220-300 would be pretty ideal for SFO shuttle and to places like SEA/SMF/PHX/SLC. I'd try ORD before DEN.



I must say it is disheartening to see how few resources are in place for this new focus city.

Gates, crewroom, maintenance infrastructure, signage...Almost none of it is in place.

This is a big departure from the Jetblue of the past


Are they going to get the crew room and maintenance infrastructure in a few months? I think the gates will become available once ULCC moves out. It's hard for them to put resources into T-5 while all the ULCCs are still in there. Their gates right now are next to the NK gates. It must be a madhouse at times.
 
Nicknuzzii
Posts: 1306
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2018 5:57 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 3:51 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
tphuang wrote:
They have 23 departures out of LAX today. That's about their peak for October so far. Next month, they peak at 29 departures I think. They've picked up another gate,. Now they have 55A, 58 and 59. There are a couple of shared gates that are basically not being used right now. AA is doing about 1 to 2 turns a day on their gates in T-5 right now. Only F9 and NK seem to also be at or close to their pre-pandemic # of flights. Adding those 6 flights should be no problem. Once ULCCs start to move out, there will be plenty of space at LAX for them to expand. If T-5 is down to just B6 and AA, B6 should pour some money into improving terminal experience there. Maybe once they become a little larger in LAX, they can spend some money for LAX to expand the terminal space a little bit.

I'd expect there to be quite a few A220 based on in LAX. It seems like A220-300 would be pretty ideal for SFO shuttle and to places like SEA/SMF/PHX/SLC. I'd try ORD before DEN.



I must say it is disheartening to see how few resources are in place for this new focus city.

Gates, crewroom, maintenance infrastructure, signage...Almost none of it is in place.

This is a big departure from the Jetblue of the past


How is the set up for EWR?
 
User avatar
jfklganyc
Posts: 6076
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 2:31 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:17 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:
tphuang wrote:
They have 23 departures out of LAX today. That's about their peak for October so far. Next month, they peak at 29 departures I think. They've picked up another gate,. Now they have 55A, 58 and 59. There are a couple of shared gates that are basically not being used right now. AA is doing about 1 to 2 turns a day on their gates in T-5 right now. Only F9 and NK seem to also be at or close to their pre-pandemic # of flights. Adding those 6 flights should be no problem. Once ULCCs start to move out, there will be plenty of space at LAX for them to expand. If T-5 is down to just B6 and AA, B6 should pour some money into improving terminal experience there. Maybe once they become a little larger in LAX, they can spend some money for LAX to expand the terminal space a little bit.

I'd expect there to be quite a few A220 based on in LAX. It seems like A220-300 would be pretty ideal for SFO shuttle and to places like SEA/SMF/PHX/SLC. I'd try ORD before DEN.



I must say it is disheartening to see how few resources are in place for this new focus city.

Gates, crewroom, maintenance infrastructure, signage...Almost none of it is in place.

This is a big departure from the Jetblue of the past


How is the set up for EWR?


EWR isnt a focus city or base so it is not a straight comparison.

EWR is much larger with a wider array of destinations and will remain that way

Also, EWR is a hometown airport with a known Airport Authority. So advantage EWR for B6 even if it isnt a base

Furthermore, A new terminal with ample gate space is coming
 
CobaltScar
Posts: 763
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 2:30 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 5:49 pm

I'm sure EWR will be made a co terminal of JFK soon enough. I'm sure LAX has a crew lounge.
 
IdlewildJFK
Posts: 20
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2020 1:25 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:02 pm

CobaltScar wrote:
I'm sure EWR will be made a co terminal of JFK soon enough.


Pilot CBA says otherwise.
 
FlyingHonu001
Posts: 221
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2020 2:33 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:02 pm

I have been reading reports that B6 will be going TATL to LHR/AMS somewhere in 2021 or at least after the delivery of their A321LR. Will this be from JFK or EWR??
 
CobaltScar
Posts: 763
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 2:30 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:05 pm

IdlewildJFK wrote:
CobaltScar wrote:
I'm sure EWR will be made a co terminal of JFK soon enough.


Pilot CBA says otherwise.


lack of FA CBA says yes
 
IdlewildJFK
Posts: 20
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2020 1:25 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:42 pm

CobaltScar wrote:
IdlewildJFK wrote:
CobaltScar wrote:
I'm sure EWR will be made a co terminal of JFK soon enough.


Pilot CBA says otherwise.


lack of FA CBA says yes


Fair enough. I’ll rephrase it:

EWR/JFK pilot co-base - not currently possible

EWR/JFK inflight co-base - possible
 
StinkyPinky
Posts: 66
Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:03 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:46 pm

CobaltScar wrote:
I'm sure EWR will be made a co terminal of JFK soon enough. I'm sure LAX has a crew lounge.


Apparently no crew lounge. The crew lounge has always been just the back office space behind the ticket counter, a few computers shared with AO in the common break room- FAs always felt like they were intruding. With the move to T5, this office space is now located in an area only accessible with a SIDA badge. So, no formal crew lounge for pilots or FAs.
 
JoseSalazar
Posts: 278
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2019 3:18 am

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 6:57 pm

IdlewildJFK wrote:
CobaltScar wrote:
IdlewildJFK wrote:

Pilot CBA says otherwise.


lack of FA CBA says yes


Fair enough. I’ll rephrase it:

EWR/JFK pilot co-base - not currently possible

EWR/JFK inflight co-base - possible


I think if they made EWR its own base (not prohibited) it could work. All the PA/NJ guys would bid it. There are (or will be) enough flights to support it imo. They should just throw in a new EWR 320 base on the 220 and LR supplemental bid for some real excitement.
 
CobaltScar
Posts: 763
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 2:30 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 7:39 pm

StinkyPinky wrote:
CobaltScar wrote:
I'm sure EWR will be made a co terminal of JFK soon enough. I'm sure LAX has a crew lounge.


Apparently no crew lounge. The crew lounge has always been just the back office space behind the ticket counter, a few computers shared with AO in the common break room- FAs always felt like they were intruding. With the move to T5, this office space is now located in an area only accessible with a SIDA badge. So, no formal crew lounge for pilots or FAs.


In LAX?? I thought the Pilots had contract language that spelled out crew lounge requirements in base with things like a required quiet room and what not. LGB will be missed for the peaceful creature comforts. I bet they do another horrible open romper room lounge ala FLL in LAX.
 
tphuang
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Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:10 pm

They are also probably delaying some of this work to save money. After all, they are still burn a lot of cash everyday.

I think they are seeing too many opportunities right now that they want to go after, but are still too tight on cash. They are trying to be everywhere without the resources to do so. If they add another focus city somewhere (as I suspect), it will just stretch things further.

I'm waiting for their AA partnership to get finalized. Maybe they will get some of the problems resolved after that. If not, we might have to wait until after they become cash neutral.
 
eng3lt
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Oct 14, 2020 5:44 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:13 pm

StinkyPinky wrote:
CobaltScar wrote:
I'm sure EWR will be made a co terminal of JFK soon enough. I'm sure LAX has a crew lounge.


Apparently no crew lounge. The crew lounge has always been just the back office space behind the ticket counter, a few computers shared with AO in the common break room- FAs always felt like they were intruding. With the move to T5, this office space is now located in an area only accessible with a SIDA badge. So, no formal crew lounge for pilots or FAs.


There is a crew lounge for pilots and FA’s located by a the market area accessible by elevator
 
stevemat11
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2012 1:20 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 8:23 pm

StinkyPinky wrote:
CobaltScar wrote:
I'm sure EWR will be made a co terminal of JFK soon enough. I'm sure LAX has a crew lounge.


Apparently no crew lounge. The crew lounge has always been just the back office space behind the ticket counter, a few computers shared with AO in the common break room- FAs always felt like they were intruding. With the move to T5, this office space is now located in an area only accessible with a SIDA badge. So, no formal crew lounge for pilots or FAs.



There is a B6 crew lounge in LAX T5. Its been there for at least 3 years.

With CUN starting next month will that inbound use a TBIT gate or will one of the T5 gates accept it?
 
StinkyPinky
Posts: 66
Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:03 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:41 pm

CobaltScar wrote:
In LAX?? I thought the Pilots had contract language that spelled out crew lounge requirements in base with things like a required quiet room and what not. LGB will be missed for the peaceful creature comforts. I bet they do another horrible open romper room lounge ala FLL in LAX.


Correct and why this is soon to become a problem.

stevemat11 wrote:
There is a B6 crew lounge in LAX T5. Its been there for at least 3 years.

With CUN starting next month will that inbound use a TBIT gate or will one of the T5 gates accept it?


That is simply a breakroom for AO, accessible by badged LAX employees, hence Supervisors will be meeting and briefing FAs at the gate because their offices are "inaccessible." There is currently no crew lounge nor space at LAX.
 
Brianpr3
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2018 7:34 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Wed Oct 14, 2020 11:54 pm

A223 going to bos
"JetBlue plans 140 seats, Boston base for A220 launch – PaxEx.Aero" https://paxex.aero/2019/04/jetblue-a220 ... or-layout/
Brian
 
unusualattitude
Posts: 32
Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2016 5:49 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Thu Oct 15, 2020 1:22 am

Brianpr3 wrote:
A223 going to bos
"JetBlue plans 140 seats, Boston base for A220 launch – PaxEx.Aero" https://paxex.aero/2019/04/jetblue-a220 ... or-layout/


Not thinking that a year and a half old article has much relevance right now.
 
stevemat11
Posts: 20
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2012 1:20 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Thu Oct 15, 2020 7:11 am

StinkyPinky wrote:
CobaltScar wrote:
In LAX?? I thought the Pilots had contract language that spelled out crew lounge requirements in base with things like a required quiet room and what not. LGB will be missed for the peaceful creature comforts. I bet they do another horrible open romper room lounge ala FLL in LAX.


Correct and why this is soon to become a problem.

stevemat11 wrote:
There is a B6 crew lounge in LAX T5. Its been there for at least 3 years.

With CUN starting next month will that inbound use a TBIT gate or will one of the T5 gates accept it?


That is simply a breakroom for AO, accessible by badged LAX employees, hence Supervisors will be meeting and briefing FAs at the gate because their offices are "inaccessible." There is currently no crew lounge nor space at LAX.


Unless it changed I was down there last month. It’s small but accessible by non LAX SIDA holders as I’m not one and I was able to access it by elevator. It meets the requirements of the CBA. An email last week stated they are negotiating with LAWA for additional space. I believe the AO break room is near the ticket counter. I’ve never seen it.
 
trueblew
Posts: 166
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:16 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Thu Oct 15, 2020 2:37 pm

Not to be rude but does anyone come to a.net to discuss the location and level of comfort of pilot lounges? Or is this a network thread? From what I've seen the pilots have their own little rumor forums for these matters.
 
CobaltScar
Posts: 763
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 2:30 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Thu Oct 15, 2020 6:03 pm

trueblew wrote:
Not to be rude but does anyone come to a.net to discuss the location and level of comfort of pilot lounges? Or is this a network thread? From what I've seen the pilots have their own little rumor forums for these matters.


I'm positive that airline enthusiasts on the outside appreciate glimpses and color of the nuts and bolts from the inside.
 
User avatar
VS4ever
Posts: 2580
Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2004 10:03 am

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Thu Oct 15, 2020 8:57 pm

CobaltScar wrote:
trueblew wrote:
Not to be rude but does anyone come to a.net to discuss the location and level of comfort of pilot lounges? Or is this a network thread? From what I've seen the pilots have their own little rumor forums for these matters.


I'm positive that airline enthusiasts on the outside appreciate glimpses and color of the nuts and bolts from the inside.


^————^ this... some of us who will never get to work on the front lines, even though we love the industry (one of my regrets in life) very much appreciate the insight and willingness to share information
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
arfbool
Posts: 100
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2010 2:02 am

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Thu Oct 15, 2020 10:43 pm

As far as threads gone off-the-rails go, this one ain't so bad, by anet standards.
 
doulasc
Posts: 872
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 5:12 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Fri Oct 16, 2020 12:01 am

I wish JetBlue would return to CMH with flights to BOS,JFK and why did JetBlue leave DAB.
 
B752OS
Posts: 1260
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 4:05 am

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Fri Oct 16, 2020 12:06 pm

doulasc wrote:
I wish JetBlue would return to CMH with flights to BOS,JFK and why did JetBlue leave DAB.


I think it's only a matter of time before JetBlue returns to CMH.
 
USAirALB
Posts: 2342
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 4:46 am

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Fri Oct 16, 2020 2:12 pm

How does B6 perform on DCA-SJU?

I wonder if they would ever cancel the flight and use the slot for LAX.

On a personal note, in my perfect world (post Metro opening the Silver Line at Dulles) I really wish B6 would return to IAD and resume some of their transcon routes, but I know that is wishful thinking.
RJ85, F70, E135, E140, E145, E70, E75, E90, CR2, CR7, CR9, 717, 732, 733, 734, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 744ER, 752, 753, 762, 772, 77E, 77W, 789, 319, 320, 321, 332, 333, 343, 359, 388
 
IdlewildJFK
Posts: 20
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2020 1:25 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Fri Oct 16, 2020 2:55 pm

USAirALB wrote:
How does B6 perform on DCA-SJU?

I wonder if they would ever cancel the flight and use the slot for LAX.

On a personal note, in my perfect world (post Metro opening the Silver Line at Dulles) I really wish B6 would return to IAD and resume some of their transcon routes, but I know that is wishful thinking.


I believe the perimeter rule would preclude that.

Edit - LAX that is
 
CobaltScar
Posts: 763
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 2:30 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Fri Oct 16, 2020 3:12 pm

USAirALB wrote:
How does B6 perform on DCA-SJU?

I wonder if they would ever cancel the flight and use the slot for LAX.

On a personal note, in my perfect world (post Metro opening the Silver Line at Dulles) I really wish B6 would return to IAD and resume some of their transcon routes, but I know that is wishful thinking.


Id rather see them do a complete takeover at Richmond for a mini fortress hub than compete with others at IAD , not to mention competing with their own routes down the road at DCA.
 
tphuang
Posts: 5462
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Fri Oct 16, 2020 3:37 pm

USAirALB wrote:
How does B6 perform on DCA-SJU?

I wonder if they would ever cancel the flight and use the slot for LAX.

On a personal note, in my perfect world (post Metro opening the Silver Line at Dulles) I really wish B6 would return to IAD and resume some of their transcon routes, but I know that is wishful thinking.


DCA-SJU is a really solid performer. Not a surprise given that demand and lack of alternative direction options. I also don't think they are allowed to move it to LAX.

The sag in demand out of NYC has been discussed at length, but not as much has been said about the drop in demand out of DCA. For me, that's been pretty dramatic also.

For example:
JetBlue normally schedules 30 flights out of DCA and they are down to 5 today.
Southwest normally schedules around 45 flights out of DCA and they are down to 10
UA is down to 11 from 38
AA is down to 51 from 176

It would be interesting to see if JetBlue can get some additional DCA slots somewhere. Actually, I don't even know if they will know how to use it if they had more. I guess they could always squat on slots with JFK/LGA-DCA E90 flights. If they manage to get a few more DCA slot pairs, it could make sense to create a DCA/IAD split focus city down the road. Although, that's unlikely.

More likely, I see a reopening of IAD to service focus cities with 3 flights to BOS, 2 to LAX, 1 to SFO, 1 to SJU and 1 to FLL.

As I said earlier, I'd like to see JetBlue open a second focus city in the west coast with SFO since they moved to T1 which is adding a lot of gates. But setting up a larger operation in DC area wouldn't be a bad choice either.

What does everyone else think? If JetBlue create a new focus city, where would the best place be?
 
JoseSalazar
Posts: 278
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2019 3:18 am

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Fri Oct 16, 2020 4:07 pm

tphuang wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
How does B6 perform on DCA-SJU?

I wonder if they would ever cancel the flight and use the slot for LAX.

On a personal note, in my perfect world (post Metro opening the Silver Line at Dulles) I really wish B6 would return to IAD and resume some of their transcon routes, but I know that is wishful thinking.


DCA-SJU is a really solid performer. Not a surprise given that demand and lack of alternative direction options. I also don't think they are allowed to move it to LAX.

The sag in demand out of NYC has been discussed at length, but not as much has been said about the drop in demand out of DCA. For me, that's been pretty dramatic also.

For example:
JetBlue normally schedules 30 flights out of DCA and they are down to 5 today.
Southwest normally schedules around 45 flights out of DCA and they are down to 10
UA is down to 11 from 38
AA is down to 51 from 176

It would be interesting to see if JetBlue can get some additional DCA slots somewhere. Actually, I don't even know if they will know how to use it if they had more. I guess they could always squat on slots with JFK/LGA-DCA E90 flights. If they manage to get a few more DCA slot pairs, it could make sense to create a DCA/IAD split focus city down the road. Although, that's unlikely.

More likely, I see a reopening of IAD to service focus cities with 3 flights to BOS, 2 to LAX, 1 to SFO, 1 to SJU and 1 to FLL.

As I said earlier, I'd like to see JetBlue open a second focus city in the west coast with SFO since they moved to T1 which is adding a lot of gates. But setting up a larger operation in DC area wouldn't be a bad choice either.

What does everyone else think? If JetBlue create a new focus city, where would the best place be?


EWR, DCA+IAD, BNA, AUS, PHX, LAS, and SFO (and I wish ORD and IAH but that’s never gonna happen). All in the next 6 months / before S21. EWR SFO PHX LAS would be 320/321 crew bases, DCA, AUS and maybe BNA (maybe PHX?) could be small 190 crew bases. 190s would be used to run low daily utilization out and backs as well as connect more dots on the B6 map. All before Breeze gets off the ground. That said, while Scott L is fairly bold, he’s not that bold, and I doubt B6 could bankroll that kind of expansion right now. One can dream though.

But if B6 wants to really gain marketshare, getting in somewhere and making it an almost overnight focus city, kind of like what WN did with Hawaii, seems like a fun idea. After all, he wants to burn all his ships. Plant some seeds that can grow and capture marketshare in the recovery and make the network a viable one for more than just those in NY/BOS/FL. And it would get the 190s and their crews back to work.
 
hbernal1
Posts: 32
Joined: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:51 pm

Re: JetBlue Network Thread - 2020

Fri Oct 16, 2020 5:34 pm

JoseSalazar wrote:
tphuang wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
How does B6 perform on DCA-SJU?

I wonder if they would ever cancel the flight and use the slot for LAX.

On a personal note, in my perfect world (post Metro opening the Silver Line at Dulles) I really wish B6 would return to IAD and resume some of their transcon routes, but I know that is wishful thinking.


DCA-SJU is a really solid performer. Not a surprise given that demand and lack of alternative direction options. I also don't think they are allowed to move it to LAX.

The sag in demand out of NYC has been discussed at length, but not as much has been said about the drop in demand out of DCA. For me, that's been pretty dramatic also.

For example:
JetBlue normally schedules 30 flights out of DCA and they are down to 5 today.
Southwest normally schedules around 45 flights out of DCA and they are down to 10
UA is down to 11 from 38
AA is down to 51 from 176

It would be interesting to see if JetBlue can get some additional DCA slots somewhere. Actually, I don't even know if they will know how to use it if they had more. I guess they could always squat on slots with JFK/LGA-DCA E90 flights. If they manage to get a few more DCA slot pairs, it could make sense to create a DCA/IAD split focus city down the road. Although, that's unlikely.

More likely, I see a reopening of IAD to service focus cities with 3 flights to BOS, 2 to LAX, 1 to SFO, 1 to SJU and 1 to FLL.

As I said earlier, I'd like to see JetBlue open a second focus city in the west coast with SFO since they moved to T1 which is adding a lot of gates. But setting up a larger operation in DC area wouldn't be a bad choice either.

What does everyone else think? If JetBlue create a new focus city, where would the best place be?


EWR, DCA+IAD, BNA, AUS, PHX, LAS, and SFO (and I wish ORD and IAH but that’s never gonna happen). All in the next 6 months / before S21. EWR SFO PHX LAS would be 320/321 crew bases, DCA, AUS and maybe BNA (maybe PHX?) could be small 190 crew bases. 190s would be used to run low daily utilization out and backs as well as connect more dots on the B6 map. All before Breeze gets off the ground. That said, while Scott L is fairly bold, he’s not that bold, and I doubt B6 could bankroll that kind of expansion right now. One can dream though.

But if B6 wants to really gain marketshare, getting in somewhere and making it an almost overnight focus city, kind of like what WN did with Hawaii, seems like a fun idea. After all, he wants to burn all his ships. Plant some seeds that can grow and capture marketshare in the recovery and make the network a viable one for more than just those in NY/BOS/FL. And it would get the 190s and their crews back to work.


I'd rather see B6 expand at SAN (adding SAN-LAS/SFO/MCO) than to try to build a focus at PHX (I think adding PHX-LAX is good though). The others could be good alternatives, but I think the strongest (and most realistic focus) will be SFO given that B6 has been adding SFO routes with every new route annoucement, the possibility of getting new gates at T1, and is the best platform for Mint. I think B6 can certainly add SFO-AUS/IAD/LAS/PVR/RDU/SAN/SEA/SJD and once HI flying starts, add SFO-HNL/OGG. They can also have seasonal SFO-BZN/PSP routes, and I think that'll be a decent focus city with around 55-60 flights. I think (controversially) that B6's west coast strategy should also include adding BUR-LAS/SFO, LAX-SJC/SMF (as well as adding SNA to the map) to strengthen its intra-California network and be an option in the LAS-LA area market.

Similar to tphuang's comment, I think that if B6 comes back to IAD, I think they can have stuff like IAD-BOS/FLL/JFK/LAX/SFO/SJU and maybe IAD-BDL/MCO which would be a nice complement to their DCA operation. One thing I think B6 needs to start doing is connecting more dots in the middle of the country (they don't need a focus city), because without that, I worry that B6 will be severely limited in its growth down the road.

Out of LAX, I think they'll begin to add short haul routes like LAX-PDX/PHX/SJC/SMF. As far as TCON is concerned, I can see them adding LAX-JAX/PVD and Mint on routes such as LAX-IAD/PHL. Once HI flying starts, add LAX-HNL/OGG. I'd also be bullish on B6 adding LAX-PVR/SJD. Add a token presence on routes like ORD/DEN to keep the FF base happy and there's a 70-75 flight LAX focus.

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