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fun2fly
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jan 21, 2020 3:45 pm

My guess is that the customer feedback on the Polaris 763's has been extremely positive + revenue must be matching/beating UA expectations based on the 46J bet + Boeing's delays on NMA = UA made the decision to finish out the oldest units. Seems probable that they'd do these '93 units as they did the '91-92 units not long ago. To get the payback on these retrofits, figure they'd need to get 5-7 years of flying out of them? It's probably a different type of calculation on a fully depreciated unit.
 
AaronPGH
Posts: 557
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2013 9:13 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:13 pm

I am really looking forward to consistently having proper Polaris on the EWR-TXL route, which is my main route into Europe each year. Landed an equipment swap with a new Polaris 763 this past summer and it was a nice surprise.
 
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calpsafltskeds
Posts: 3226
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:29 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:21 pm

jayunited: Thanks for the update on 763s all getting Polaris. I updated the Polaris page on the fleet Website and moved stuff around to make more sense.

752:
N41140 - I noticed GYR entry, but thought it was maybe in error due departure shown out of SFO earlier than the inbound. Surprised to see a 2000 unit grounded when 1994 units still fly on. Maybe in GYR for maint or Short term storage? Anyone have more info? WFU not shown on Airline Fleet News page.

772:
N77019 entered HKG 2747/20Jan, expect Polaris/PP, ERS estimate 3/15/20 - N77006 should exit soon.
 
TrafficCop
Posts: 69
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2018 8:00 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:57 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
jayunited: Thanks for the update on 763s all getting Polaris. I updated the Polaris page on the fleet Website and moved stuff around to make more sense.

752:
N41140 - I noticed GYR entry, but thought it was maybe in error due departure shown out of SFO earlier than the inbound. Surprised to see a 2000 unit grounded when 1994 units still fly on. Maybe in GYR for maint or Short term storage? Anyone have more info? WFU not shown on Airline Fleet News page.

772:
N77019 entered HKG 2747/20Jan, expect Polaris/PP, ERS estimate 3/15/20 - N77006 should exit soon.


What is your guess on first 789 to show up with Polaris and PE. Will it be 3968 or the newest delivery 3975?
 
snuggs28
Posts: 67
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 1:29 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jan 21, 2020 8:10 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
jayunited: Thanks for the update on 763s all getting Polaris. I updated the Polaris page on the fleet Website and moved stuff around to make more sense.

752:
N41140 - I noticed GYR entry, but thought it was maybe in error due departure shown out of SFO earlier than the inbound. Surprised to see a 2000 unit grounded when 1994 units still fly on. Maybe in GYR for maint or Short term storage? Anyone have more info? WFU not shown on Airline Fleet News page.

772:
N77019 entered HKG 2747/20Jan, expect Polaris/PP, ERS estimate 3/15/20 - N77006 should exit soon.



N41140 752 is in GYR for a C Check. It is not retired. It is also one of the youngest 57 birds in the Fleet.

.
 
xxcr
Posts: 468
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 6:37 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jan 21, 2020 8:18 pm

jayunited wrote:
calpsafltskeds wrote:
The Polaris tracker is a few aircraft behind, new units: 1 77W, 2 78X, Polaris completed 1 788, 2 763.
However I believe a few 763s will not receive Polaris. Hopefully the Polaris tracker is correct and all 38 will have Polaris.


I just looked at the updated 763 Polaris installation schedule and Nose numbers 6452, 6453, 6457, and 6458 will all be converted into High-J with Polaris and PE, while nose numbers 6461, 6462, 6463 will all be converted into the standard Polaris (30J) configuration. All of these frames are 1992/93 builds but if the recently released 763 Polaris installation schedule is to be believed (it was just released 4 days ago) all 763s will have the actual Polaris seat. Judging from internal documents it would seem as if the latest update to United's Polaris tracker website is correct.

Looking at the recently update 763 Polaris schedule and comparing it to the old schedules from a few months ago what I'm noticing is the 763s were supposed to wrap up installation in August of 2020 and the 764s were supposed to begin in August. However the addition of these 7 1992/93 frames, extends the 763 Polaris installation schedule all the way through December 2020. No update yet on how this will impact the 764 schedule if it impacts it at all.

It would seem as though UA intends to fly the wings off some of our oldest 763s. I can only wonder what this development means for the NMA and Boeing could be telling UA behind the scenes. Does UA really believe they can hold out for Boeing's NMA keeping in mind it is the aircraft UA really wants. Or is UA simply delaying the inevitable which would be a order for more 788s or possibly the A330-800?



With UA starting the 764 retrofit in August or December 2020, is there a confirmed seat map for the the 764? i remember reading something about how they'll have trouble fitting 39 Polaris seats between door 1 and 2......how do you think they'll layout the seats? squeeze in as many as they can between Door 1 and 2 and put some seats behind door 2 followed by some PE seats.
 
codc10
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:06 pm

xxcr wrote:
With UA starting the 764 retrofit in August or December 2020, is there a confirmed seat map for the the 764? i remember reading something about how they'll have trouble fitting 39 Polaris seats between door 1 and 2......how do you think they'll layout the seats? squeeze in as many as they can between Door 1 and 2 and put some seats behind door 2 followed by some PE seats.


No map has been leaked yet, but I heard there will be a small reduction of seats to fit the entire Polaris cabin in A-zone on the 764, and potentially relocating at least 1 lavatory back to the 1L/R area. The forward-most lavs (for business class and especially pilots) situated just aft of 2L/R has been a consistent source of complaints since the layout first entered service.

If I had to guess, I would expect something like 34J/18W/180Y, which actually gets the 764 a little closer to its original capacity when it first came to Continental (35J/200Y).
 
xxcr
Posts: 468
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 6:37 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:38 pm

codc10 wrote:
xxcr wrote:
With UA starting the 764 retrofit in August or December 2020, is there a confirmed seat map for the the 764? i remember reading something about how they'll have trouble fitting 39 Polaris seats between door 1 and 2......how do you think they'll layout the seats? squeeze in as many as they can between Door 1 and 2 and put some seats behind door 2 followed by some PE seats.


No map has been leaked yet, but I heard there will be a small reduction of seats to fit the entire Polaris cabin in A-zone on the 764, and potentially relocating at least 1 lavatory back to the 1L/R area. The forward-most lavs (for business class and especially pilots) situated just aft of 2L/R has been a consistent source of complaints since the layout first entered service.

If I had to guess, I would expect something like 34J/18W/180Y, which actually gets the 764 a little closer to its original capacity when it first came to Continental (35J/200Y).



Im looking foward to the 764 with the Polaris seats!!
yeah, the lavatory locations of the 764 are terrible and poorly designed. only 5 lavs for the whole plane........
 
Beanbag
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:49 pm

I see N771UA scheduled to VCV tomorrow. Should we be worried about her?
 
codc10
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jan 21, 2020 9:56 pm

Beanbag wrote:
I see N771UA scheduled to VCV tomorrow. Should we be worried about her?


Paint...
 
United1
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jan 21, 2020 10:46 pm

Fleet plan is out....nothing all that unexpected so far that I can see. Sorry for the formatting but I grabbed it from the SEC filing.

Fleet Plan: As of January 21, 2020, the Company's fleet plan was as follows:
1Q 2020 2Q 2020 3Q 2020 YE 2020
B777-200/300 96 96 96 96
B787-8/9/10 53 59 63 63
B767-300/400 54 54 54 54
B757-200/300 74 74 74 74
B737 MAX1 14 14 14 14
B737-700/800/900 333 336 338 338
A319/A320 183 183 184 189
Total Mainline Aircraft 807 816 823 828
50-seat (ERJ-145, CRJ-200, CRJ-550) 345 356 355 345
70-seat (CRJ-700, EMB-170, EMB-175LL) 102 102 102 102
76-seat (EMB-175) 153 153 153 153
Total Regional Aircraft 600 611 610 600

The Company planned to take delivery of 16 Boeing B737 MAX 9 aircraft in 2019 that were not delivered due to the Federal Aviation Administration's emergency order prohibiting the operation of the Boeing 737 MAX series airplanes by U.S. certificated operators (the "FAA Order") and Boeing's suspension of deliveries of new Boeing 737 MAX series aircraft. In 2020, the Company planned to take delivery of 28 Boeing B737 MAX 8/10. The actual timing of delivery of the MAX aircraft is dependent on the length of time the FAA Order remains in place, Boeing's production rate and the pace at which Boeing can deliver aircraft following the lifting of the FAA Order, among other factors.
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
SonomaFlyer
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jan 21, 2020 11:04 pm

fun2fly wrote:
My guess is that the customer feedback on the Polaris 763's has been extremely positive + revenue must be matching/beating UA expectations based on the 46J bet + Boeing's delays on NMA = UA made the decision to finish out the oldest units. Seems probable that they'd do these '93 units as they did the '91-92 units not long ago. To get the payback on these retrofits, figure they'd need to get 5-7 years of flying out of them? It's probably a different type of calculation on a fully depreciated unit.


The last ones to get Polaris may have been initially off the list due to talks with Boeing about the NMA and the fact those planes would be due for a very expensive Heavy Check. Now they'll get the heavy check likely with the Polaris refit. I'd agree that those aircraft would be flying another five years or so after the refit/check in order to amortize out the costs.
 
GmoneyCO
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:31 am

The fleet plan can be found on page 2 of the investor update here http://ir.united.com/static-files/9fe44953-1477-41dc-a6c5-bef670354e67

What surprised me when I read it was the small size of the 'net adds' of used Airbus and 737 entering the fleet this year. 6 Airbus and 5 737NGs in 2020. For reference, there are 4 China Southern A319s still to come this year, 20 easyJet A319s scheduled to come in 2020 and 2021, and 3 or 4 Vueling A320s that are expected this year. For 737s, there are still 19 Southwest 73Gs still to come with my original understanding being that the bulk would come in 2020.

I was expecting the bulk to hit in 2020 vs 2021 unless there are a lot more retirements planned for 2020 than I realize.

Other updates:
N872UA - Listed as former China Southern B-6019 --- This aircraft looks to have left service with China Southern on 3-Dec 2019. It flew a test flight on 10-Jan 2020. If past timing holds true, UA will pick up the aircraft sometime the week of 10-Feb 2020.
N873UA - Listed as former China Southern B-6020

Future N882UA - Currently B-6205 at China Southern. Looks to have exited service on 17-Jan and is now at CAN which has done several of the other fleet exits for China Southern. Typically they go to CAN or SHE for ~6-10 weeks of maintenance work before UA picks them up.

This gives us the final clarity on what numbers will be assigned to what China Southern units
 
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intotheair
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:43 am

Crazy to think that the mainline fleet will be 828 by the end of the year (and possibly more pending the return of the MAX). For the first years post-merger, UA's mainline fleet always stayed around 700 frames. I still think capacity needs to grow even more for UA to keep up its competitive edge. DL's fleet is ~900 and AA is close to 1,000 (though AA isn't really growing anymore).
300 319 320 321 332 333 345 346 380 717 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 752 753 762 763 772 77W 788 789 CR2 CR7 CR9 CRK Q400 E175 DC10 MD82 MD90
AA AF AS AY AZ B6 BA BR DL F9 FI GA HA KF LH MI QX SK SN SQ UA US VY WN
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 6:28 am

OK ,looking at the data, it shows the following additions vs. toady:
319/320 - 168 today, growing to 189 at EOY +21
787 current 48, growing to 63 at EOY +15
757 is showing 74, there are only 73 units after N546UA retire and N26123 write-off -1 is result
737 current 329, growing to 338 by EOY, +9
777 & 767 no change
It's maybe not clear when UA stats counting the aircraft, somewhere between delivery and first revenue flight.

772:
N210UA sked to exit AMA paint 2740/21Jan with EvoBlu livery
 
fun2fly
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 12:20 pm

United1 wrote:
Fleet plan is out....nothing all that unexpected so far that I can see. Sorry for the formatting but I grabbed it from the SEC filing.

Fleet Plan: As of January 21, 2020, the Company's fleet plan was as follows:
1Q 2020 2Q 2020 3Q 2020 YE 2020
B777-200/300 96 96 96 96
B787-8/9/10 53 59 63 63
B767-300/400 54 54 54 54
B757-200/300 74 74 74 74
B737 MAX1 14 14 14 14
B737-700/800/900 333 336 338 338
A319/A320 183 183 184 189
Total Mainline Aircraft 807 816 823 828
50-seat (ERJ-145, CRJ-200, CRJ-550) 345 356 355 345
70-seat (CRJ-700, EMB-170, EMB-175LL) 102 102 102 102
76-seat (EMB-175) 153 153 153 153
Total Regional Aircraft 600 611 610 600

The Company planned to take delivery of 16 Boeing B737 MAX 9 aircraft in 2019 that were not delivered due to the Federal Aviation Administration's emergency order prohibiting the operation of the Boeing 737 MAX series airplanes by U.S. certificated operators (the "FAA Order") and Boeing's suspension of deliveries of new Boeing 737 MAX series aircraft. In 2020, the Company planned to take delivery of 28 Boeing B737 MAX 8/10. The actual timing of delivery of the MAX aircraft is dependent on the length of time the FAA Order remains in place, Boeing's production rate and the pace at which Boeing can deliver aircraft following the lifting of the FAA Order, among other factors.


At the end of 2020, UA will not have any widebody aircraft on order. It was an impressive expansion for sure. 96x777, 63x787 and 54 767's total: 213 Units.
 
mmahpeel
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 1:10 pm

fun2fly wrote:

At the end of 2020, UA will not have any widebody aircraft on order.



A350 ?
 
codc10
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 1:29 pm

fun2fly wrote:
United1 wrote:
Fleet plan is out....nothing all that unexpected so far that I can see. Sorry for the formatting but I grabbed it from the SEC filing.

Fleet Plan: As of January 21, 2020, the Company's fleet plan was as follows:
1Q 2020 2Q 2020 3Q 2020 YE 2020
B777-200/300 96 96 96 96
B787-8/9/10 53 59 63 63
B767-300/400 54 54 54 54
B757-200/300 74 74 74 74
B737 MAX1 14 14 14 14
B737-700/800/900 333 336 338 338
A319/A320 183 183 184 189
Total Mainline Aircraft 807 816 823 828
50-seat (ERJ-145, CRJ-200, CRJ-550) 345 356 355 345
70-seat (CRJ-700, EMB-170, EMB-175LL) 102 102 102 102
76-seat (EMB-175) 153 153 153 153
Total Regional Aircraft 600 611 610 600

The Company planned to take delivery of 16 Boeing B737 MAX 9 aircraft in 2019 that were not delivered due to the Federal Aviation Administration's emergency order prohibiting the operation of the Boeing 737 MAX series airplanes by U.S. certificated operators (the "FAA Order") and Boeing's suspension of deliveries of new Boeing 737 MAX series aircraft. In 2020, the Company planned to take delivery of 28 Boeing B737 MAX 8/10. The actual timing of delivery of the MAX aircraft is dependent on the length of time the FAA Order remains in place, Boeing's production rate and the pace at which Boeing can deliver aircraft following the lifting of the FAA Order, among other factors.


At the end of 2020, UA will not have any widebody aircraft on order. It was an impressive expansion for sure. 96x777, 63x787 and 54 767's total: 213 Units.


I would anticipate some additional incremental 787-9/10 orders. United's 77W fleet is about as large as it needs to be with the current weakness in HKG, HND/NRT fragmentation, and ongoing China issues (overcapacity, trade issues, coronavirus, etc.). I would expect more 77W to be deployed to South America as that sector rebounds. I'd love to see the United 777 fleet hit the century mark (only 4 away) but I don't think that'll happen before some of the early 77As begin retirement.

Future United WB orders will likely be for fleet renewal as a primary objective.
 
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cosyr
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 1:43 pm

codc10 wrote:
fun2fly wrote:
United1 wrote:
Fleet plan is out....nothing all that unexpected so far that I can see. Sorry for the formatting but I grabbed it from the SEC filing.

Fleet Plan: As of January 21, 2020, the Company's fleet plan was as follows:
1Q 2020 2Q 2020 3Q 2020 YE 2020
B777-200/300 96 96 96 96
B787-8/9/10 53 59 63 63
B767-300/400 54 54 54 54
B757-200/300 74 74 74 74
B737 MAX1 14 14 14 14
B737-700/800/900 333 336 338 338
A319/A320 183 183 184 189
Total Mainline Aircraft 807 816 823 828
50-seat (ERJ-145, CRJ-200, CRJ-550) 345 356 355 345
70-seat (CRJ-700, EMB-170, EMB-175LL) 102 102 102 102
76-seat (EMB-175) 153 153 153 153
Total Regional Aircraft 600 611 610 600

The Company planned to take delivery of 16 Boeing B737 MAX 9 aircraft in 2019 that were not delivered due to the Federal Aviation Administration's emergency order prohibiting the operation of the Boeing 737 MAX series airplanes by U.S. certificated operators (the "FAA Order") and Boeing's suspension of deliveries of new Boeing 737 MAX series aircraft. In 2020, the Company planned to take delivery of 28 Boeing B737 MAX 8/10. The actual timing of delivery of the MAX aircraft is dependent on the length of time the FAA Order remains in place, Boeing's production rate and the pace at which Boeing can deliver aircraft following the lifting of the FAA Order, among other factors.


At the end of 2020, UA will not have any widebody aircraft on order. It was an impressive expansion for sure. 96x777, 63x787 and 54 767's total: 213 Units.


I would anticipate some additional incremental 787-9/10 orders. United's 77W fleet is about as large as it needs to be with the current weakness in HKG, HND/NRT fragmentation, and ongoing China issues (overcapacity, trade issues, coronavirus, etc.). I would expect more 77W to be deployed to South America as that sector rebounds. I'd love to see the United 777 fleet hit the century mark (only 4 away) but I don't think that'll happen before some of the early 77As begin retirement.

Future United WB orders will likely be for fleet renewal as a primary objective.

Something doesn't make sense with this chart in a number of ways. People have already pointed out the discrepancies in number of 757's, unless they are still counting the written off one (maybe for parts?). Also, the numbers say they will be adding 10 787's, but the notes below the chart say they are adding 15 787-9/10's. I was also surprised to see how little growth there will be in the 737NG and 319/20 categories. Maybe they will all be entering service Q1-2021
 
jayunited
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Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:03 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 1:49 pm

[
fun2fly wrote:
At the end of 2020, UA will not have any widebody aircraft on order. It was an impressive expansion for sure. 96x777, 63x787 and 54 767's total: 213 Units.


UA still has the A350 order.

Judging from how quickly Boeing was able to accommodate UA's top off order for the additional 789s I think if UA sees a need for more 789s, 788, or 78Xs Boeing would find a way to make it happen.

Having said that I believe outside of a replacement for the 763s, I think UA has to turn their attention to our narrowbody fleet and we've already seen this with the A321XLR order. We have quite a few Airbus and Boeing narrowbodies that are getting up in age and will need to be replace. Even with our current outstanding MAX8/9/10 orders by 2025-2026 UA will need a lot more narrowbodies to start replacing some of our oldest narrowbody aircraft ranging from our 126 seaters all the way up to our 179 seat aircraft.

Will we see UA go all in on the MAX (before the grounding I probably would have said yes, now I'm not so sure), or will their be a a A320/19NEO order, or could the A220-100/300 find its way into our fleet? Perhaps UA might decided to mix and match ordering a combination of both Boeing (MAX7/8s) and Airbus (A220, A320/19s).
 
Tristar328
Posts: 2
Joined: Fri Oct 04, 2019 4:51 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 1:50 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
Hi there, Nick. We're starting construction on a new club at EWR next month and it'll take about two years to complete. It will be located in Concourse C3. ^AN

From UA’s Twitter team ^


Where in C3 will the new United Club be?
 
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STT757
Posts: 14146
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 1:14 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 1:58 pm

jayunited wrote:
[
fun2fly wrote:
At the end of 2020, UA will not have any widebody aircraft on order. It was an impressive expansion for sure. 96x777, 63x787 and 54 767's total: 213 Units.


UA still has the A350 order.

Judging from how quickly Boeing was able to accommodate UA's top off order for the additional 789s I think if UA sees a need for more 789s, 788, or 78Xs Boeing would find a way to make it happen.

Having said that I believe outside of a replacement for the 763s, I think UA has to turn their attention to our narrowbody fleet and we've already seen this with the A321XLR order. We have quite a few Airbus and Boeing narrowbodies that are getting up in age and will need to be replace. Even with our current outstanding MAX8/9/10 orders by 2025-2026 UA will need a lot more narrowbodies to start replacing some of our oldest narrowbody aircraft ranging from our 126 seaters all the way up to our 179 seat aircraft.

Will we see UA go all in on the MAX (before the grounding I probably would have said yes, now I'm not so sure), or will their be a a A320/19NEO order, or could the A220-100/300 find its way into our fleet? Perhaps UA might decided to mix and match ordering a combination of both Boeing (MAX7/8s) and Airbus (A220, A320/19s).


If and or when the Max grounding is over There’s an opportunity for United and Boeing to work out a large order that will replace their oldest A320s and 737NGs. Kirby has discussed recently opportunity with picking up any Deferred Max aircraft.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
strfyr51
Posts: 5030
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:04 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 2:47 pm

FlyHossD wrote:
jayunited wrote:
...Another thing no one is talking about is IAD is now UA second most profitable hub right behind DEN. At one point MWAA thought their CPE would exceed $31 dollars, but some how they have gotten their cost under control and today their CPE is under $17 dollars. If MWAA can keep their CPE cost under control I can see UA hitting 450 daily departures in 2 or perhaps 3 years.


Please correct me if my memory is flawed, but weren't DEN and IAD the two hubs the two consultant groups (hired by Smisek) recommended closing?

Well? even if he did? He was obviously WRONG. which is probably one of the reasons he is no longer CEO. His actions were short sighted and lacking. especially with personnel. He got rid of seasoned people and put Twinkies in their places. They sent a VP of Maintenance out to SFO with the mandate to sell off or close the turbine shop.
Once he got there>]? He saw the business they were doing on Customer Engines and decided against it. That was the first chink in the wall. The rest came Later.
It was no wonder WHAT was done the reason that very few senior managers from CO are still at United Some of them were good but NOW? They're Better as they had to adjust their thinking to stay in the new regime as many ideas came from Northwest and American via their jettisoned Managers who came to United and are managing with a vengeance.
 
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calpsafltskeds
Posts: 3226
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 2:55 pm

738:
N26210 sked to enter VCV 2745/22Jan for EvoBlu livery

772:
N771UA sked to enter VCV 2741/22Jan for EvoBlu livery
N788UA sked to exit XMN 2745/23Jan, maint only visit
 
BNAMealer
Posts: 915
Joined: Sat Jul 27, 2019 8:03 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 3:14 pm

jayunited wrote:
[
fun2fly wrote:
At the end of 2020, UA will not have any widebody aircraft on order. It was an impressive expansion for sure. 96x777, 63x787 and 54 767's total: 213 Units.


UA still has the A350 order.

Judging from how quickly Boeing was able to accommodate UA's top off order for the additional 789s I think if UA sees a need for more 789s, 788, or 78Xs Boeing would find a way to make it happen.

Having said that I believe outside of a replacement for the 763s, I think UA has to turn their attention to our narrowbody fleet and we've already seen this with the A321XLR order. We have quite a few Airbus and Boeing narrowbodies that are getting up in age and will need to be replace. Even with our current outstanding MAX8/9/10 orders by 2025-2026 UA will need a lot more narrowbodies to start replacing some of our oldest narrowbody aircraft ranging from our 126 seaters all the way up to our 179 seat aircraft.

Will we see UA go all in on the MAX (before the grounding I probably would have said yes, now I'm not so sure), or will their be a a A320/19NEO order, or could the A220-100/300 find its way into our fleet? Perhaps UA might decided to mix and match ordering a combination of both Boeing (MAX7/8s) and Airbus (A220, A320/19s).


IMHO, UA should ditch the 73Gs and go all in on the used A319/new A223 for their small narrowbody needs.
 
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BWIAirport
Posts: 922
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 3:57 pm

N210UA is out of paint in AMA this morning
SWA, UAL, DAL, AWE, ASA, TRS, DLH, CLH, AFR, BAW, EIN, AAL | E190 DC94 CRJ2 B712 B733 B737 B738 B739 B744 B752 B753 B762 B77W A319 A320 A20N A321 A333 A343 A388 MD88
 
TrafficCop
Posts: 69
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2018 8:00 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:44 pm

cosyr wrote:
codc10 wrote:
fun2fly wrote:

At the end of 2020, UA will not have any widebody aircraft on order. It was an impressive expansion for sure. 96x777, 63x787 and 54 767's total: 213 Units.


I would anticipate some additional incremental 787-9/10 orders. United's 77W fleet is about as large as it needs to be with the current weakness in HKG, HND/NRT fragmentation, and ongoing China issues (overcapacity, trade issues, coronavirus, etc.). I would expect more 77W to be deployed to South America as that sector rebounds. I'd love to see the United 777 fleet hit the century mark (only 4 away) but I don't think that'll happen before some of the early 77As begin retirement.

Future United WB orders will likely be for fleet renewal as a primary objective.

Something doesn't make sense with this chart in a number of ways. People have already pointed out the discrepancies in number of 757's, unless they are still counting the written off one (maybe for parts?). Also, the numbers say they will be adding 10 787's, but the notes below the chart say they are adding 15 787-9/10's. I was also surprised to see how little growth there will be in the 737NG and 319/20 categories. Maybe they will all be entering service Q1-2021


The difference you see between 10 and 15 787's is because chart is by quarter. UA started year with 48 787's. 12-8/25-9/and 11-10's. UA will take 15 total 787's this year. 5 in Q1(2-10's and 3-9's). Then in Q2 will take 6 789's and in Q3 4 more 789's. Also the last 787-10 will delivered in 2021 Ibelieve.
 
United1
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:53 pm

TrafficCop wrote:
cosyr wrote:
codc10 wrote:

I would anticipate some additional incremental 787-9/10 orders. United's 77W fleet is about as large as it needs to be with the current weakness in HKG, HND/NRT fragmentation, and ongoing China issues (overcapacity, trade issues, coronavirus, etc.). I would expect more 77W to be deployed to South America as that sector rebounds. I'd love to see the United 777 fleet hit the century mark (only 4 away) but I don't think that'll happen before some of the early 77As begin retirement.

Future United WB orders will likely be for fleet renewal as a primary objective.

Something doesn't make sense with this chart in a number of ways. People have already pointed out the discrepancies in number of 757's, unless they are still counting the written off one (maybe for parts?). Also, the numbers say they will be adding 10 787's, but the notes below the chart say they are adding 15 787-9/10's. I was also surprised to see how little growth there will be in the 737NG and 319/20 categories. Maybe they will all be entering service Q1-2021


The difference you see between 10 and 15 787's is because chart is by quarter. UA started year with 48 787's. 12-8/25-9/and 11-10's. UA will take 15 total 787's this year. 5 in Q1(2-10's and 3-9's). Then in Q2 will take 6 789's and in Q3 4 more 789's. Also the last 787-10 will delivered in 2021 Ibelieve.


Exactly...the first row of the chart shows the totals at the end of Q1.
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
georgiabill
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:57 pm

Is UA happy with their 787-10'S? Do you think UA will grow that fleet in the future or just more 789'S?
 
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Polot
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 6:01 pm

BNAMealer wrote:
jayunited wrote:
[
fun2fly wrote:
At the end of 2020, UA will not have any widebody aircraft on order. It was an impressive expansion for sure. 96x777, 63x787 and 54 767's total: 213 Units.


UA still has the A350 order.

Judging from how quickly Boeing was able to accommodate UA's top off order for the additional 789s I think if UA sees a need for more 789s, 788, or 78Xs Boeing would find a way to make it happen.

Having said that I believe outside of a replacement for the 763s, I think UA has to turn their attention to our narrowbody fleet and we've already seen this with the A321XLR order. We have quite a few Airbus and Boeing narrowbodies that are getting up in age and will need to be replace. Even with our current outstanding MAX8/9/10 orders by 2025-2026 UA will need a lot more narrowbodies to start replacing some of our oldest narrowbody aircraft ranging from our 126 seaters all the way up to our 179 seat aircraft.

Will we see UA go all in on the MAX (before the grounding I probably would have said yes, now I'm not so sure), or will their be a a A320/19NEO order, or could the A220-100/300 find its way into our fleet? Perhaps UA might decided to mix and match ordering a combination of both Boeing (MAX7/8s) and Airbus (A220, A320/19s).


IMHO, UA should ditch the 73Gs and go all in on the used A319/new A223 for their small narrowbody needs.

Why should UA ditch their 73Gs (that they are also growing) just to buy more used A319s?

I can understand wanting to order A223s, but there is no need to ditch the current 73G fleet until they are ready to replace the entire 73G/A319 fleet with something.
 
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tjwgrr
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 6:13 pm

BNAMealer wrote:

IMHO, UA should ditch the 73Gs and go all in on the used A319/new A223 for their small narrowbody needs.


Is UA still getting 20 additional used 73G's? planespotters shows 20, but airfleets shows only 2. These look like they will be currently leased Southwest (ex AirTran) aircraft.
Direct KNOBS, maintain 2700' until established on the localizer, cleared ILS runway 26 left approach.
 
Runway28L
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Jan 22, 2020 7:11 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
738:
N26210 sked to enter VCV 2745/22Jan for EvoBlu livery

FR24 and Flightaware say it entered INT late last night.
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/UAL2 ... /KIAH/KINT
https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/N26210

Btw this is one of the two Star Alliance -800s.
 
 
BNAMealer
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Jan 23, 2020 12:05 am

Polot wrote:
BNAMealer wrote:
jayunited wrote:
[

UA still has the A350 order.

Judging from how quickly Boeing was able to accommodate UA's top off order for the additional 789s I think if UA sees a need for more 789s, 788, or 78Xs Boeing would find a way to make it happen.

Having said that I believe outside of a replacement for the 763s, I think UA has to turn their attention to our narrowbody fleet and we've already seen this with the A321XLR order. We have quite a few Airbus and Boeing narrowbodies that are getting up in age and will need to be replace. Even with our current outstanding MAX8/9/10 orders by 2025-2026 UA will need a lot more narrowbodies to start replacing some of our oldest narrowbody aircraft ranging from our 126 seaters all the way up to our 179 seat aircraft.

Will we see UA go all in on the MAX (before the grounding I probably would have said yes, now I'm not so sure), or will their be a a A320/19NEO order, or could the A220-100/300 find its way into our fleet? Perhaps UA might decided to mix and match ordering a combination of both Boeing (MAX7/8s) and Airbus (A220, A320/19s).


IMHO, UA should ditch the 73Gs and go all in on the used A319/new A223 for their small narrowbody needs.

Why should UA ditch their 73Gs (that they are also growing) just to buy more used A319s?

I can understand wanting to order A223s, but there is no need to ditch the current 73G fleet until they are ready to replace the entire 73G/A319 fleet with something.


For fleet simplification purposes.

Someday, UA will probably have to do what AA and DL are doing and simplify their fleet down to a few types for both narrow and widebody.

Plus, the UA 73Gs I’ve flown on are old, cramped and dirty.
 
xxcr
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Jan 23, 2020 12:33 am

georgiabill wrote:
Is UA happy with their 787-10'S? Do you think UA will grow that fleet in the future or just more 789'S?



I think UA loves them. They already purchased the tail numbers for the next 12 78J's which means they'll eventually exercise the rights to the 78J options.

As a passenger, i love the 78J....so quiet and comfortable.
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:52 am

BNAMealer wrote:
Polot wrote:
BNAMealer wrote:

IMHO, UA should ditch the 73Gs and go all in on the used A319/new A223 for their small narrowbody needs.

Why should UA ditch their 73Gs (that they are also growing) just to buy more used A319s?

I can understand wanting to order A223s, but there is no need to ditch the current 73G fleet until they are ready to replace the entire 73G/A319 fleet with something.


For fleet simplification purposes.

Someday, UA will probably have to do what AA and DL are doing and simplify their fleet down to a few types for both narrow and widebody.

Plus, the UA 73Gs I’ve flown on are old, cramped and dirty.


That doesn't make much sense. There is minimal difference between a 73G/73H/73J, both in terms of maintenance or crew training. There really is no benefit to paying for new frames, even second hand, when the cost saving would be minimal. In fact it would probably cost more since the Legacy Continental 73Gs are probably fully paid for.

Both Delta and American will continue to operate both 737 and A320 family in multiple gauges, United won't be any different.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
VC10er
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Jan 23, 2020 4:31 am

BNAMealer wrote:
Polot wrote:
BNAMealer wrote:

IMHO, UA should ditch the 73Gs and go all in on the used A319/new A223 for their small narrowbody needs.

Why should UA ditch their 73Gs (that they are also growing) just to buy more used A319s?

I can understand wanting to order A223s, but there is no need to ditch the current 73G fleet until they are ready to replace the entire 73G/A319 fleet with something.


For fleet simplification purposes.

Someday, UA will probably have to do what AA and DL are doing and simplify their fleet down to a few types for both narrow and widebody.

Plus, the UA 73Gs I’ve flown on are old, cramped and dirty.


REALLY! Ive just done a bunch (6-7 legs) on the 73G and thought she looked rather nice? I was in First though! And they have the new better First seats, carpeting etc.

To me: it’s still the F cabins on the 752’s that look the worst. Really BAD! (Unless it’s a spruced up First cabin) which is not very impressive, but at least “newer and fresher)

How fast are the 752 First Class interior modifications going?
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Jan 23, 2020 5:25 am

319:
N822UA entered SFO 1873/18Jan, 12F mod?
N825UA entered LCQ 2746/22Jan, 12F mod?

772:
N791UA entered XMN maint 2746/23Jan

78X:
N12012 in PDX for EvoBlu paint, undelivered
 
LGeneReese
Posts: 246
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:36 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Jan 23, 2020 5:28 am

78J
N12012 B2 CHSPDX 22Jan for paint
77W
N2251U B1 22Jan PAEPAE... More a B.25 really... took off, looped back and landed 11min later... Oops...
 
77H
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Jan 23, 2020 8:29 am

Just saw a picture of the first 772 in EvoBlue. I don’t know how to post pictures but you can find it by searching UA1722 SFO-OGG on January 22nd in FlightRadar24.

Looks stunning.

77H
 
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cosyr
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:19 pm

BNAMealer wrote:
Polot wrote:
BNAMealer wrote:

IMHO, UA should ditch the 73Gs and go all in on the used A319/new A223 for their small narrowbody needs.

Why should UA ditch their 73Gs (that they are also growing) just to buy more used A319s?

I can understand wanting to order A223s, but there is no need to ditch the current 73G fleet until they are ready to replace the entire 73G/A319 fleet with something.


For fleet simplification purposes.

Someday, UA will probably have to do what AA and DL are doing and simplify their fleet down to a few types for both narrow and widebody.


I don't quite understand what you are referencing. Both AA and DL have far more fleet types than UA, and UA has fewer fleet types than they had before retiring the 747. Unless you are referring to versions of the same plane, but it is far more simple for an airline to have the 737-700/800/900ER/MAX than to have different versions of the A320/737/717/A220/MD8/MD9. The only unnecessary complication that UA has taken on recently is A319's with two different engine types, but AA has that as well. UA probably has a simpler parts networks, and definitely has fewer pilot type ratings.
 
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cosyr
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:22 pm

77H wrote:
Just saw a picture of the first 772 in EvoBlue. I don’t know how to post pictures but you can find it by searching UA1722 SFO-OGG on January 22nd in FlightRadar24.

Looks stunning.

77H

Interesting that the first 772 to be repainted would be a Hawaii version. I guess that means it will get seen domestically more often than others.
 
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Polot
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Jan 23, 2020 1:43 pm

BNAMealer wrote:
Polot wrote:
BNAMealer wrote:

IMHO, UA should ditch the 73Gs and go all in on the used A319/new A223 for their small narrowbody needs.

Why should UA ditch their 73Gs (that they are also growing) just to buy more used A319s?

I can understand wanting to order A223s, but there is no need to ditch the current 73G fleet until they are ready to replace the entire 73G/A319 fleet with something.


For fleet simplification purposes.

Someday, UA will probably have to do what AA and DL are doing and simplify their fleet down to a few types for both narrow and widebody.

Plus, the UA 73Gs I’ve flown on are old, cramped and dirty.

As someone already mentioned there is no fleet simplification in that. UA has almost 300 737-800/900s that are going nowhere anytime soon. Operating 40+ 73Gs on top of that presents no additional complications or costs, since maintenance and pilots are shared across the entire 737 fleet. It’s the same reason why DL still operates a mere 10 73Gs with no plans to retire them despite the large exNW A319 fleet they inherited and the A220s coming in.

The UA 73Gs are all roughly the same age as the original UA A319s (the used ones they have been bringing in are generally younger). They are not particularly old compared to the rest of the fleet, although they may look older/dirtier if you are comparing to a used A319 that recently entered the fleet with a brand new interior.
 
VC10er
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jan 24, 2020 12:56 am

Polot wrote:
BNAMealer wrote:
Polot wrote:
Why should UA ditch their 73Gs (that they are also growing) just to buy more used A319s?

I can understand wanting to order A223s, but there is no need to ditch the current 73G fleet until they are ready to replace the entire 73G/A319 fleet with something.


For fleet simplification purposes.

Someday, UA will probably have to do what AA and DL are doing and simplify their fleet down to a few types for both narrow and widebody.

Plus, the UA 73Gs I’ve flown on are old, cramped and dirty.

As someone already mentioned there is no fleet simplification in that. UA has almost 300 737-800/900s that are going nowhere anytime soon. Operating 40+ 73Gs on top of that presents no additional complications or costs, since maintenance and pilots are shared across the entire 737 fleet. It’s the same reason why DL still operates a mere 10 73Gs with no plans to retire them despite the large exNW A319 fleet they inherited and the A220s coming in.

The UA 73Gs are all roughly the same age as the original UA A319s (the used ones they have been bringing in are generally younger). They are not particularly old compared to the rest of the fleet, although they may look older/dirtier if you are comparing to a used A319 that recently entered the fleet with a brand new interior.


FRANKLY, while it is rare to find oneself on a totally refurbished (used) A319, but once you have, everything “narrow body” on United doesn’t compare! The FULL EFFECT of the NEW interior design overall provides an new amazing atmosphere. I know the wide body Polaris mods come first, but the 737-8 (etc) is a sad looking airplane inside even when clean.
I feel bad for UA, the 737MAX’s interiors must look like the new (but used) A329’s. If the MAX’s were flying UA would have many more hot **** looking aircraft! Then perhaps they would be able to refurbish the 737-8/9’s!
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
AaronPGH
Posts: 557
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jan 24, 2020 1:05 am

VC10er wrote:

FRANKLY, while it is rare to find oneself on a totally refurbished (used) A319, but once you have, everything “narrow body” on United doesn’t compare! The FULL EFFECT of the NEW interior design overall provides an new amazing atmosphere. I know the wide body Polaris mods come first, but the 737-8 (etc) is a sad looking airplane inside even when clean.
I feel bad for UA, the 737MAX’s interiors must look like the new (but used) A329’s. If the MAX’s were flying UA would have many more hot **** looking aircraft! Then perhaps they would be able to refurbish the 737-8/9’s!


What's special on these? Are there photos out there anywhere?
 
SXDFC
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jan 24, 2020 1:06 am

Are there any pictures of the 739ER out there in the new paint, I believe it rolled out of the paint hangar not too long ago.
 
Runway28L
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jan 24, 2020 1:55 am

cosyr wrote:
77H wrote:
Just saw a picture of the first 772 in EvoBlue. I don’t know how to post pictures but you can find it by searching UA1722 SFO-OGG on January 22nd in FlightRadar24.

Looks stunning.

77H

Interesting that the first 772 to be repainted would be a Hawaii version. I guess that means it will get seen domestically more often than others.

N210UA was probably the worst-looking aircraft in the whole fleet. No wonder it was likely high on priority.

https://twitter.com/skull_gold/status/1 ... 92609?s=21

SXDFC wrote:
Are there any pictures of the 739ER out there in the new paint, I believe it rolled out of the paint hangar not too long ago.

It only had the Special Olympics decal removed. No new paint.
 
LGeneReese
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jan 24, 2020 2:01 am

SXDFC wrote:
Are there any pictures of the 739ER out there in the new paint, I believe it rolled out of the paint hangar not too long ago.

Unfortunately that was a false alarm. The aircraft was only having the Special Olympics decals removed. It’s still the old livery.
The first EvoBlu 772 is flying though. I haven’t seen any images yet.
 
LGeneReese
Posts: 246
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:36 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jan 24, 2020 2:07 am

LGeneReese wrote:
SXDFC wrote:
Are there any pictures of the 739ER out there in the new paint, I believe it rolled out of the paint hangar not too long ago.

Unfortunately that was a false alarm. The aircraft was only having the Special Olympics decals removed. It’s still the old livery.
The first EvoBlu 772 is flying though. I haven’t seen any images yet.

... Three minutes after posting.....
Have seen the first image..... Me Like
 
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calpsafltskeds
Posts: 3226
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jan 24, 2020 5:35 am

319:
N822UA sked to exit SFO 2426/25Jan with 12F mod completed
N848UA exited AMA 2733/23Jan in Evo Blu livery

752:
N14102 sked to exit MIA 2015/24Jan in 16/160 configuration

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