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ordbosewr
Posts: 612
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Feb 29, 2020 1:36 am

atcsundevil wrote:
Scarebus34 wrote:
Yes suspended until April 30th.

There was an entire thread on all these changes earlier with discussion but the trigger happy mods deleted it for no reason.

You mean this thread?

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1439961&p=22043219&hilit=United+Hong+Kong#p22043219

Sounds like perhaps you're a little trigger happy rushing to that judgement without using the search tool.


No, that is not it. He started the thread (it was titled United trasnpac cuts" or similar and I saw it this morning and posted a comment in it at 9am ET.
It basically called out all of the changes listed in this thread but was sooner. Now under the new rules, it probably should have been posted here, but then it should have merged into this thread.
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Feb 29, 2020 2:03 am

ordbosewr wrote:
atcsundevil wrote:
Scarebus34 wrote:
Yes suspended until April 30th.

There was an entire thread on all these changes earlier with discussion but the trigger happy mods deleted it for no reason.

You mean this thread?

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1439961&p=22043219&hilit=United+Hong+Kong#p22043219

Sounds like perhaps you're a little trigger happy rushing to that judgement without using the search tool.


No, that is not it. He started the thread (it was titled United trasnpac cuts" or similar and I saw it this morning and posted a comment in it at 9am ET.
It basically called out all of the changes listed in this thread but was sooner. Now under the new rules, it probably should have been posted here, but then it should have merged into this thread.

The thread I posted is where that information belongs, but things specifically affecting United can be discussed here as well. Either way, it's being discussed in two places.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Feb 29, 2020 5:56 am

772:
N74007 sked to exit HKG 2700/1Mar with Polaris/PP
N77022 sked to enter HKG 2699/1Mar for Polaris/PP
 
B764er
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Feb 29, 2020 6:56 am

N77006 was painted on the new livery. I saw her at EWR yesterday 2/28. Thankfully they also re-painted her with the Robert Six name in the new blue. Looks gorgeous!
 
UAinAUS
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Feb 29, 2020 7:47 am

UAX Update:

CR5:
N542GJ entered revenue service with GoJet
N165GJ has been re-registered as N544GJ. Entered revenue service with GoJet
26 total in service
N707EV (2002 build) ferried STL awaiting CR5 mods, will become N513GJ
 
jetmatt777
Posts: 4297
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Feb 29, 2020 7:48 am

UAinAUS wrote:
UAX Update:

CR5:
N542GJ entered revenue service with GoJet
N165GJ has been re-registered as N544GJ. Entered revenue service with GoJet
26 total in service
N707EV (2002 build) ferried STL awaiting CR5 mods, will become N513GJ


Pretty impressed with how quick they are ramping up the CR5 fleet.
 
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intotheair
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Feb 29, 2020 10:44 am

That’s too bad about the Olympic sponsorship, though at the same time, the Olympics are a scam that probably wouldn’t have been worth spending all that extra money on.

In the same vein, I wish United had some smaller but important partnerships. I don’t know why they don’t sponsor the SF Chinese New Year Parade (WN does oddly enough), Alaska sponsors the SF Giants and SF Pride, and Frontier is still the Colorado Rockies sponsor.
300 319 320 321 332 333 345 346 380 717 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 752 753 762 763 772 77W 788 789 CR2 CR7 CR9 CRK Q400 E175 DC10 MD82 MD90
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jetmatt777
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Feb 29, 2020 1:27 pm

intotheair wrote:
That’s too bad about the Olympic sponsorship, though at the same time, the Olympics are a scam that probably wouldn’t have been worth spending all that extra money on.

In the same vein, I wish United had some smaller but important partnerships. I don’t know why they don’t sponsor the SF Chinese New Year Parade (WN does oddly enough), Alaska sponsors the SF Giants and SF Pride, and Frontier is still the Colorado Rockies sponsor.


Agreed. It would be nice to see more external engagement of the United brand.
 
United1
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Feb 29, 2020 2:02 pm

jetmatt777 wrote:
intotheair wrote:
That’s too bad about the Olympic sponsorship, though at the same time, the Olympics are a scam that probably wouldn’t have been worth spending all that extra money on.

In the same vein, I wish United had some smaller but important partnerships. I don’t know why they don’t sponsor the SF Chinese New Year Parade (WN does oddly enough), Alaska sponsors the SF Giants and SF Pride, and Frontier is still the Colorado Rockies sponsor.


Agreed. It would be nice to see more external engagement of the United brand.


They do a fair amount of smaller partnerships in addition to the national ones:

https://www.united.com/ual/en/us/fly/co ... ships.html

This isn't a complete list as I've seen UA sponsoring the SF Gay Mens Chorus and the Rock and Roll Marathon here in the Bay.
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Feb 29, 2020 3:42 pm

320:
N492UA exited AMA 2719/28Feb in EvoBlu livery

739:
N64844 exited INT 2749/27Feb with ViaSat WiFi.
Other units confirmed with ViaSat WFi at INT: 1/c 3839 through 3845 & 3883 thru 3886.
Units unconfirmed: 3887

772:
N222UA sked to exit HKG 2703/1Mar in Domestic config. On UA App shows 32BF seats, but E+/Y split doesn't match what was expected
N74007 sked to exit HKG 2700/1Mar with Polaris/PP

789:
N26966 entered VCV 2736/29Feb, touch up, but probably full EvoBlu repaint . Last paint 2016 at delivery
N26967 sked to exit VCV 2737/29Feb, touch up, but probably full EvoBlu repaint. Last paint 2016 at delivery
 
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antoniemey
Posts: 1419
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Feb 29, 2020 4:31 pm

LGeneReese wrote:
UAinAUS wrote:
UAX Update:

CR5:
N542GJ exited AMA in EvoBlu livery, at STL awaiting service entry

E175SC:
All 25 ExpressJet 175SCs will transfer to Skywest over the next 15 months

E145XR:
TransStates Airlines will dissolve by the end of 2020. All 36 XRs will be transferred to ExpressJet

I think that’s where most, if not all, of the 145XRs came from... All those EV pilots who just moved to the 175 now have to go back.... :hissyfit: :hissyfit: :banghead:


It is. Prior to UA shifting XRs to TransStates, EV was the only operator of the subtype.
Make something Idiot-proof, and the Universe will make a more inept idiot.
 
SonomaFlyer
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Feb 29, 2020 5:28 pm

drerx7 wrote:
1989worstyear wrote:
UA444 wrote:
I wish they had gotten a full refit in Y and it was disappointing they didn’t, but part of the reason why the 763 and 744 didn’t get an overhaul to redo the Y section was because they didn’t intend on flying them this long. And yes, they had to be picky at the time on where they spent some capital. Thats why the 777’s got nose to tail refits, since they were part of the long term plan and quite young at the time. The 25 788’s they ordered in 2009 were to replace the 21 international 763’s and the 25 A350s was to replace the 744. They weren’t interested in the 773 and wanted the next gen engine tech beyond that. Nobody could’ve seen them operating the older 767s today. I’m glad they’re still going but that wasn’t the intent back in 2009 when they ordered new aircraft.


Covid-19 will clean out the 763's shortly.

How when no UA 763s go tpac...


Covid-19 is not limited to TPAC/Asia anymore. This virus is world-wide so the challenge for UA and other carriers is to boost capacity where demand dictates with the wide bodies now idled by decreasing long haul demand. The Cancun and Phoenix adds are an example. I'd expect to see some adds for California, Florida and possibly larger gauge to Hawaii depending on logistics at the outstation.
 
VC10er
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Mar 01, 2020 2:13 am

I understand why UA would walk away from their Olympic’s “official airline” program, that is a ton of money that can be spent on a good number of other under funded good organizations. I have friends who work tirelessly for nonprofit organizations that do wonderful things, but are limited due to lack of capital.
It would be great to see UA help veterans in big way. Doctors Without Borders, and create special liveries!
Since I live in NYC, and live 3 blocks from The Stonewall, I see what UA has done there that is meaningful and much appreciated in the community. I'm unsure what would the BEST other ”good deed/give back” community initiatives they could do here? But, although NYC is so dominated by the rich today (compared to my childhood) I don't know which organization would give them the best ”do good” and be visible.
United’s massive advertising in Manhattan, is unavoidable...and I don't know if there is anything significant in the way of future, fast mass transit in the works?
I've always wondered if a United ferry boat could get close enough to EWR?
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
VC10er
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Mar 01, 2020 4:26 am

Quick United EWR TC report: This past week I went into one of the brand new refurbished men’s rooms. Everything has been redesigned from floor to ceiling. I must say, who ever UA hired to re-do the concourse restrooms has fabulous taste. The new tiles, floors, sinks and mirrors and even the toilet stalls are really upscale and beautiful. I suspect the blue and taupe glass tiles that have waves of different colored curved lines must have been expensive. Aside from the United Club conundrum, the public restrooms were the final frontier for TC and the designer is welcome to refurb my bathroom at home! (however UA has yet to realize they have HVAC issues worldwide...1 person can turn a whole section into a gas chamber!)
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Mar 01, 2020 2:36 pm

752:
N19141 exited MIA 2760/29Feb in 16/160 config.

763:
N659UA exited ILN maint 2764/1Mar

789:
N15969 confirmed into XMN 2690/28Feb for Polaris/PP
 
SJPBR
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Mar 01, 2020 7:31 pm

789 has been in GRU from IAH a few times this week
 
jetmatt777
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Mar 02, 2020 6:20 am

Flew in a CRJ today for the first time in a while. Man, what a lousy experience. Its embarrassing.

They are fine for short hops but pretty subpar for anything over 45 mins. I hope UA can put the CR5 to work on hops such as OKC-DEN. United has really given up in that market. Pretty much all 50 seaters now. I remember when it was 2-3 mainline plus 2-3 CR7's. I even remember a 757 in the summer months. This wasnt that long ago.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:39 pm

763:
N647UA entered ILN maint 2734/2Mar
N670UA sked to exit LCQ 2749/3Mar in EvoBlu livery
N671UA sked to enter LCQ 2736/3Mar for EvoBlu livery
8 of 38 763s in EvoBlu and 1 in paint

772:
Understand 772ER Domestic config is named 77O. Verification or correction appricieated.
Also looking for 789 code for Polaris units.
 
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Amwest2United
Posts: 280
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:04 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
763:
N647UA entered ILN maint 2734/2Mar
N670UA sked to exit LCQ 2749/3Mar in EvoBlu livery
N671UA sked to enter LCQ 2736/3Mar for EvoBlu livery
8 of 38 763s in EvoBlu and 1 in paint

772:
Understand 772ER Domestic config is named 77O. Verification or correction appricieated.
Also looking for 789 code for Polaris units.



77O is the correct sub-fleet

UA
77O
/
Boeing 777-222B
/
32 - First
/
124 - Economy Plus
/
206 - Economy
=
362
High-Density


78P is the sub-fleet for the 787-9 Polaris
UA
78P
Boeing 787-9
/
48 - Business
/
21 - Premium Economy
/
39 - Economy Plus
/
149 - Economy
=
257
789 Polaris/UPP


78H is the sub-fleet for the 787-8 Polaris
UAL
78H
Boeing 787-8
/
28 - Business
/
21 - Premium Economy
/
36 - Economy Plus
/
158 - Economy
=
243
788 Polaris/UPP
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UAinAUS
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Mar 02, 2020 8:12 pm

CR5:
N511GJ still awaiting service entry
N155GJ has been reregistered as N534GJ, mod complete, at STL awaiting service entry
N378CA exited AMA in EvoBlu livery, at MLB for interior mod

752:
N17139 appears to still be in old configuration

319:
N875UA enters VCV 2756/2Mar for EvoBlu paint

77E:
N219UA scheduled GUM 2732/2Mar. Another domestic conversion mod line?
 
codc10
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Mar 02, 2020 9:53 pm

UAinAUS wrote:

77E:
N219UA scheduled GUM 2732/2Mar. Another domestic conversion mod line?


Any test hops for N797UA? This one should be ready to come home.
 
x1234
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Mar 02, 2020 10:36 pm

Any chance of service to JNB? I read that it is rumored ATL-JNB is Delta's most profitable route in the entire long haul network due to lack of non-stop competition (only SAA from JFK). It would be EWR-JNB and I think the JNB market can take 2 carriers. SAA has the new A350 with the old Hainan seats 2-2-2 on JFK-JNB. If UA launches with Polaris it will be a game changer. BTW I heard the flights to CPT are packed too.
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Mar 02, 2020 11:09 pm

UAinAUS wrote:
77E:
N219UA scheduled GUM 2732/2Mar. Another domestic conversion mod line?


No there is no domestic conversion mod line at XMN all domestic mods are being handled at HKG.

So try to follow me here because it can get a bit confusing.

N219UA is leaving ORD today going to GUM with an extra crew onboard. N219UA will fly ORD-GUM Feburary 2nd, that same plane (N219UA) will then on Feburary 6th or 7th fly GUM-XMN-GUM all in one day. Once at XMN the extra crew will disembark (N219UA) and they should be picking up N797UA where that crew will then ferry it back to GUM (keep in mind N219UA is also coming back to GUM the same day).

Once back at GUM N797UA is schedule to ferry position back to the U.S.. However N219UA is schedule to enter HKG for conversion to HD domestic configuration on 03/15/2020. So the question becomes will UA allow N219UA to sit on the ground at GUM from 03/07/2020 till 03/15/2020 or will UA ferry N219UA back to the U.S. only to turn around and ferry it back U.S.-GUM-HKG a few days later.

Right now after the GUM-XMN-GUM ferry N219UA is showing unrouted I don't know when the routing will be updated but will try to keep you posted.
 
friendlyskies22
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Mar 02, 2020 11:10 pm

atcsundevil:
any idea why some posts just after #788 regarding UA and the USOPC (Olympics) got deleted?
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:35 am

jayunited, thanks but why not just deadhead the pilots through HNL and RT a 738/G GUM-XMN to pick up the Polaris 772? Is there equipment going to XMN that requires a widebody? Union issue?
I would expect the aircraft stays in GUM unless there's something more creative like taking it to NRT to pick up a revenue trip and cancel the inbound. If it stays in GUM, then that crew would deadhead, I presume.

If you ask me the 3/15/20 Domestic mod entry would bump a GE772 Polaris mod back. Looks like N77019 should be ready 3/15 and I assumed another GE772 would replace it. Is the domestic mod being prioritized ahead of the GE772s?

Regarding 752 N17139, UA's Flight Status has issues. I assumed the unit was completed as the amenities line shows it as 16/160, while the map is the old config and thought it would get updated. Interestingly enough it seems those complete have the new map and non-updated amenties. It looks like SAT sis some 16/160 mods, but maybe not this one.
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:02 am

calpsafltskeds wrote:
jayunited, thanks but why not just deadhead the pilots through HNL and RT a 738/G GUM-XMN to pick up the Polaris 772? Is there equipment going to XMN that requires a widebody? Union issue?
I would expect the aircraft stays in GUM unless there's something more creative like taking it to NRT to pick up a revenue trip and cancel the inbound. If it stays in GUM, then that crew would deadhead, I presume.

If you ask me the 3/15/20 Domestic mod entry would bump a GE772 Polaris mod back. Looks like N77019 should be ready 3/15 and I assumed another GE772 would replace it. Is the domestic mod being prioritized ahead of the GE772s?


N77019 should be getting close to to exiting HKG, if the schedule holds N76010 should be taking its place HKG. UA continues to maintain 4 Polaris/PE mod lines at HKG for the 77Es.

As far as your other question why not deadhead the crew through HNL. UA has no way of getting the crew from HNL to XMN. Every since UA suspended operations in China no crews are laying over in China. These crews that are bringing these aircraft into either HKG or XMN fly in and fly out the very same day. The crew flying N219UA shows schedule ORD-GUM, (schedule crew rest), GUM-XMN-GUM (all in the same day (then schedule crew rest)). Afterward I'm not sure if that crew with deadhead on N797UA when it makes it way back to the U.S. from GUM or if they will deadhead GUM-HNL-ORD. So while N219UA remains un-routed for now the crew is not staying with the aircraft after the GUM-XMN-GUM flight.

If I had to assume I would say UA would deadhead another extra crew on N76010 over to GUM where they would pick up N219UA and both N76010 and N219UA would maintenance ferry to HKG on 03/15/2020 (which is when N219UA is supposed to enter HKG) and both crews would return to GUM on N77019.
 
kunta67
Posts: 85
Joined: Sat Jul 17, 2004 5:20 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 3:18 am

Are the new 77O’s First seats the BF diamond seats?
 
wn676
Posts: 1747
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 5:20 am

kunta67 wrote:
Are the new 77O’s First seats the BF diamond seats?


No, they’re using the IPTE seats.
Tiny, unreadable text leaves ample room for interpretation.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 5:29 am

77O F seats are older ITPE 8 across Business seats like 772A aircraft.

jayunited, I'm still confused. First of all, the quicker the better and extra mod lines would be great.

1.) I don't see why UA can't deadhead the crew from the US through LAX/SFO-HNL-GUM, then after a layover, ferry a single day 73G/8 GUM-XMN-GUM and drop the 772 crew in XMN to pick up the 772 aircraft? There is some slack in the 737 GUM fleet. It looks like the block to block RT GUM-XMN-GUM would be a bit over 8, is that an issue with GUM pilots? I assume a third pilot could be scheduled.

It doesn't matter that UA doesn't fly to China right now, they have to ferry either a 737 or a 772 in any case.

2.) Unless they are incredibly fast (which would be fantastic), N221UA won't be ready in 14 days for N219UA to take it's mod position. Maintenance is usually bundled with the mod work and according to my info, N221UA hasn't had a long maint visit since 2018 in XMN.

For N219UA to enter mod on 3/15/20: 1.) N221UA has a 14 day mod duration, 2.) there's an additional mod line starting 3/15, 3.) the aircraft will wait for an opening, or 4.) the aircraft will use N77012's mod line on 3/15, then slipping 2 more GE772s until N221UA should exit about 4/25.

3.) If N219UA will stay in GUM until 3/15, the ferries you mention makes some sense as the aircraft has to head to GUM in any case. Why not pre-position N219UA by extending the ferry to GUM-XMN-HKG, drop the aircraft and ferry a GUM-HKG-GUM 737 to pick the crew up in HKG.
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 11:44 am

The fleet changes, fleet status, and repaint status posts at the start of this thread have been updated.

✈️ atcsundevil
 
jayunited
Posts: 2866
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:14 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
77O F seats are older ITPE 8 across Business seats like 772A aircraft.

jayunited, I'm still confused. First of all, the quicker the better and extra mod lines would be great.

1.) I don't see why UA can't deadhead the crew from the US through LAX/SFO-HNL-GUM, then after a layover, ferry a single day 73G/8 GUM-XMN-GUM and drop the 772 crew in XMN to pick up the 772 aircraft? There is some slack in the 737 GUM fleet. It looks like the block to block RT GUM-XMN-GUM would be a bit over 8, is that an issue with GUM pilots? I assume a third pilot could be scheduled.

It doesn't matter that UA doesn't fly to China right now, they have to ferry either a 737 or a 772 in any case.

2.) Unless they are incredibly fast (which would be fantastic), N221UA won't be ready in 14 days for N219UA to take it's mod position. Maintenance is usually bundled with the mod work and according to my info, N221UA hasn't had a long maint visit since 2018 in XMN.

For N219UA to enter mod on 3/15/20: 1.) N221UA has a 14 day mod duration, 2.) there's an additional mod line starting 3/15, 3.) the aircraft will wait for an opening, or 4.) the aircraft will use N77012's mod line on 3/15, then slipping 2 more GE772s until N221UA should exit about 4/25.

3.) If N219UA will stay in GUM until 3/15, the ferries you mention makes some sense as the aircraft has to head to GUM in any case. Why not pre-position N219UA by extending the ferry to GUM-XMN-HKG, drop the aircraft and ferry a GUM-HKG-GUM 737 to pick the crew up in HKG.


Your estimated block time for GUM-XMN-GUM is correct but the one thing you are not accounting for is time on the ground at XMN. Also UA is scheduling these XMN and HKG positioning flights with either 3 or in some cases 4 pilots. I'm going to assume that UA in order to appease the pilots feels like it is better to utilize a widebody with lie flat seats than a 737 without lie flat seats because the block time alone not including ground time is a little over 8 hours.

Also N221UA is only at HKG for conversion whereas the schedule is showing N219UA will go in for a C-check and conversion. Perhaps UA will just let N219UA sit on the ground at HKG until a line opens up, I'm not sure if maintenance can start the C-check while N221UA is still in conversio. But for now the maintenance schedule still shows N219UA going to HKG before N221UA is scheduled to leave HKG.

Just when you thought things could not get anymore crazier they just did. N771UA is now being ferried today as UA2757-03 GUM-SFO, maintenance at SFO will perform some work on this frame tonight and it will return to service tomorrow 03/04. The frame that was to temporarily replace N771UA flying routes like GUM-NRT and GUM-HNL was N74007 however after flight UA2700-01 that frame was taken out of service in GUM and now will not return to service until 03/06 where it is scheduled to fly UA200-06 GUM-HNL, then UA396-05 HNL-SFO. As a result of these two frames being out of service N219UA will get quite the work out over the next few days.
N219UA will now fly
UA200-04 GUM-HNL
UA396-03 HNL-SFO
UA1175-04 SFO-HNL
UA201-04 HNL-GUM
UAxxxx-06 GUM-XMN-GUM
 
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jetblastdubai
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 2:42 pm

jayunited wrote:

Just when you thought things could not get anymore crazier they just did.


The amount of money and time UA is spending on moving planes back and forth to Asia to do retrofit and/or routing maintenance is staggering. Is there no place in the the US that can do this work? Is the labor savings in Asia the big reason this work is outsourced?

It seems like this type of upgrade work will go on for years and I would think that there a huge opportunity for a company to set up shop on US soil and perform this service. Keeping the talent and $ in the US would have benefits as well.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 4:36 pm

Interesting and I guess I understand the widebody on the trip for flat seats as a gesture.

However, pilots picking up the 772 will only have 4 hours of block time and well under the 16 hours of duty time requirement. Kind of like flying an ORD-LAX roundtrip while sitting in a F class seat one -way instead of flying the aircraft both ways. Surely, there could be an inspection or delay in departure with the converted aircraft. I thought GUM aircraft block F seats for crew rest on some flights.

The 737 pilots would have about 8 hours of block time, simply land/drop crew, refuel and takeoff back to GUM and be well under 16 hour duty time. Would the aircraft wait unil the mod aircraft is sure to depart? A relief pilot could be on board if the block time is expected to exceed 8 hours.

With N221UA just in for mod work, we'll see how much time that takes as I think all mods have included C checks and take 45-60 days total.
The other stuff regarding aircraft ferries back to SFO is wild as you state and helps out with the N219UA ferrying situation.

The potential of N219UA getting to HKG and starting the C Check is a great idea. If this works, UA should consider pre-positioning mods during this time of excess aircraft due China situation.
 
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Amwest2United
Posts: 280
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 5:06 pm

jetblastdubai wrote:
jayunited wrote:

Just when you thought things could not get anymore crazier they just did.


The amount of money and time UA is spending on moving planes back and forth to Asia to do retrofit and/or routing maintenance is staggering. Is there no place in the the US that can do this work? Is the labor savings in Asia the big reason this work is outsourced?

It seems like this type of upgrade work will go on for years and I would think that there a huge opportunity for a company to set up shop on US soil and perform this service. Keeping the talent and $ in the US would have benefits as well.


When United is running a normal schedule to HKG, this all works great... 4 Cites to HKG to get planes in MX there in addition, the flight to XMN is just a short hop away. Not sure about cost savings using HKG and XMN, but I would have to trust the bean counters that they are doing what is best for United as we have seen in the past few years.
Life is what happens to you while you making plans to live it!
 
codc10
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 5:10 pm

jetblastdubai wrote:
jayunited wrote:

Just when you thought things could not get anymore crazier they just did.


The amount of money and time UA is spending on moving planes back and forth to Asia to do retrofit and/or routing maintenance is staggering. Is there no place in the the US that can do this work? Is the labor savings in Asia the big reason this work is outsourced?

It seems like this type of upgrade work will go on for years and I would think that there a huge opportunity for a company to set up shop on US soil and perform this service. Keeping the talent and $ in the US would have benefits as well.


I think this tells you how much cheaper labor is overseas. Heavy checks and interior mods on widebodies are extremely labor-intensive tasks, requiring tens of thousands of man-hours. Even Delta, the leader among the US3 in maintenance 'insourcing', is doing its D1 mods in Asia (764s in CAN, 777s in SIN).

The fuel and crew expense to ferry aircraft to/from Asia is a drop in the proverbial bucket compared to the labor savings. We're also in a time of low fuel prices, so the cost to gas up an empty 777 to fly to GUM, XMN, HKG or elsewhere isn't a tremendous consideration.
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 8:14 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
Interesting and I guess I understand the widebody on the trip for flat seats as a gesture.

However, pilots picking up the 772 will only have 4 hours of block time and well under the 16 hours of duty time requirement. Kind of like flying an ORD-LAX roundtrip while sitting in a F class seat one -way instead of flying the aircraft both ways. Surely, there could be an inspection or delay in departure with the converted aircraft. I thought GUM aircraft block F seats for crew rest on some flights.

The 737 pilots would have about 8 hours of block time, simply land/drop crew, refuel and takeoff back to GUM and be well under 16 hour duty time. Would the aircraft wait unil the mod aircraft is sure to depart? A relief pilot could be on board if the block time is expected to exceed 8 hours.


I don't know if UA 777 pilot or a UA pilot in general can chime in here and clear this up because you do make a great point about using 737s to ferry the crew to HKG or XMN instead of a 777. If we use the island hopper as an example GUM-TKK-PNI-KWA-MAJ-HNL (or vice versa) this entire route is on a 737 staffed with 4 pilots and the hopper is an extremely long day from beginning to end. So I'm not sure why UA is utilizing empty widebodies to shuttle the crews around between GUM and either HKG or XMN perhaps there is something in their contract that we don't know about.
 
UA444
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 8:45 pm

jetblastdubai wrote:
jayunited wrote:

Just when you thought things could not get anymore crazier they just did.


The amount of money and time UA is spending on moving planes back and forth to Asia to do retrofit and/or routing maintenance is staggering. Is there no place in the the US that can do this work? Is the labor savings in Asia the big reason this work is outsourced?

It seems like this type of upgrade work will go on for years and I would think that there a huge opportunity for a company to set up shop on US soil and perform this service. Keeping the talent and $ in the US would have benefits as well.

Many of those same 777s when they were retrofitted to have IPTE seats were done at SFO. Guess they didn’t want to do it this time around.

Maybe the coronavirus will finally wake up companies to not be so dependent on China or foreign labor. Probably wishful thinking.
 
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jetblastdubai
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:56 pm

codc10 wrote:

I think this tells you how much cheaper labor is overseas. Heavy checks and interior mods on widebodies are extremely labor-intensive tasks, requiring tens of thousands of man-hours. Even Delta, the leader among the US3 in maintenance 'insourcing', is doing its D1 mods in Asia (764s in CAN, 777s in SIN).

The fuel and crew expense to ferry aircraft to/from Asia is a drop in the proverbial bucket compared to the labor savings. We're also in a time of low fuel prices, so the cost to gas up an empty 777 to fly to GUM, XMN, HKG or elsewhere isn't a tremendous consideration.


Those "tens of thousands of man-hours" would be nice to keep in the US if even they were in the ballpark of competitive wages.

Is this retrofit work all done my licenses AP mechanics or is some/most of the manual work done by general laborers? I realize there's a lot of certification/supervision responsibility but I can't imagine that unbolting old seats and bolting in new seats requires a diploma etc.
 
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STT757
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 03, 2020 11:04 pm

Does United pay the same salaries to employees no matter where they work / live? The Federal Government for instance has locality pay, meaning your pay is based on where you work. A federal employee in NYC or San Francisco makes many times more than a Federal employee in Arkansas or Louisiana for the same position and grade.




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UA444
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 04, 2020 1:22 am

STT757 wrote:
Does United pay the same salaries to employees no matter where they work / live? The Federal Government for instance has locality pay, meaning your pay is based on where you work. A federal employee in NYC or San Francisco makes many times more than a Federal employee in Arkansas or Louisiana for the same position and grade.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Most companies adjust base salaries (or hourly pay) based on the locale they’re operating out of.
 
Max Q
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 04, 2020 2:07 am

STT757 wrote:
Does United pay the same salaries to employees no matter where they work / live? The Federal Government for instance has locality pay, meaning your pay is based on where you work. A federal employee in NYC or San Francisco makes many times more than a Federal employee in Arkansas or Louisiana for the same position and grade.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro



Not sure now but in the Continental days there was a cost of living supplement for GUM based pilots in the Micronesia operation


It was and I’m sure still is a very expensive place to live
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


GGg
 
GSOtoIND
Posts: 76
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 04, 2020 2:29 am

flight152 wrote:
UA444 wrote:
STT757 wrote:
Does United pay the same salaries to employees no matter where they work / live? The Federal Government for instance has locality pay, meaning your pay is based on where you work. A federal employee in NYC or San Francisco makes many times more than a Federal employee in Arkansas or Louisiana for the same position and grade.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Most companies adjust base salaries (or hourly pay) based on the locale they’re operating out of.

Airlines don’t do this.

Hence why EWR/LGA/JFK are usually junior bases for most airlines.
IND. 2018: BOS/AUA/MIA/DEN Next: LAS/SLC/DEN
 
jetmatt777
Posts: 4297
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 04, 2020 2:38 am

UA doesn't offer locality pay, at least with ramp, CS, and mechanics. Not sure of other work groups.
 
Pinto
Posts: 54
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 04, 2020 3:02 am

jayunited wrote:
calpsafltskeds wrote:
Interesting and I guess I understand the widebody on the trip for flat seats as a gesture.

However, pilots picking up the 772 will only have 4 hours of block time and well under the 16 hours of duty time requirement. Kind of like flying an ORD-LAX roundtrip while sitting in a F class seat one -way instead of flying the aircraft both ways. Surely, there could be an inspection or delay in departure with the converted aircraft. I thought GUM aircraft block F seats for crew rest on some flights.

The 737 pilots would have about 8 hours of block time, simply land/drop crew, refuel and takeoff back to GUM and be well under 16 hour duty time. Would the aircraft wait unil the mod aircraft is sure to depart? A relief pilot could be on board if the block time is expected to exceed 8 hours.


I don't know if UA 777 pilot or a UA pilot in general can chime in here and clear this up because you do make a great point about using 737s to ferry the crew to HKG or XMN instead of a 777. If we use the island hopper as an example GUM-TKK-PNI-KWA-MAJ-HNL (or vice versa) this entire route is on a 737 staffed with 4 pilots and the hopper is an extremely long day from beginning to end. So I'm not sure why UA is utilizing empty widebodies to shuttle the crews around between GUM and either HKG or XMN perhaps there is something in their contract that we don't know about.


From my limited time looking at UA Giam schedules they seem pretty tight. I would imagine that they don't have any spare time to do a GUM-HKG-GUM run.
 
30west
Posts: 40
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 04, 2020 4:01 am

Pinto wrote:
jayunited wrote:
calpsafltskeds wrote:
Interesting and I guess I understand the widebody on the trip for flat seats as a gesture.

However, pilots picking up the 772 will only have 4 hours of block time and well under the 16 hours of duty time requirement. Kind of like flying an ORD-LAX roundtrip while sitting in a F class seat one -way instead of flying the aircraft both ways. Surely, there could be an inspection or delay in departure with the converted aircraft. I thought GUM aircraft block F seats for crew rest on some flights.

The 737 pilots would have about 8 hours of block time, simply land/drop crew, refuel and takeoff back to GUM and be well under 16 hour duty time. Would the aircraft wait unil the mod aircraft is sure to depart? A relief pilot could be on board if the block time is expected to exceed 8 hours.


I don't know if UA 777 pilot or a UA pilot in general can chime in here and clear this up because you do make a great point about using 737s to ferry the crew to HKG or XMN instead of a 777. If we use the island hopper as an example GUM-TKK-PNI-KWA-MAJ-HNL (or vice versa) this entire route is on a 737 staffed with 4 pilots and the hopper is an extremely long day from beginning to end. So I'm not sure why UA is utilizing empty widebodies to shuttle the crews around between GUM and either HKG or XMN perhaps there is something in their contract that we don't know about.


From my limited time looking at UA Giam schedules they seem pretty tight. I would imagine that they don't have any spare time to do a GUM-HKG-GUM run.



The Island hopper is operated as an FRMS route that is exempted from FAR 117 and has its own special rules. It also operates with 2 complete pilot crews- 2 Capts and 2 F/os to operate it. Takes a long time to get an FRMS exemption.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 04, 2020 6:00 am

752:
N41140 sked to exit GYR maint 2699/4Mar, no indications of 16/160 config.

763:
N647UA entered ILN maint 2734/2Mar
N670UA exited LCQ paint 2749/3Mar in EvoBlu livery
N671UA entered LCQ paint 2t36/3Mar

764:
N69059 sked to enter HKG 2696/5Mar
N76062 sked to exit HKG 2695/5Mar

Pinto, I think that depends on the day of week as many GUM ops are not daily. Currently there';s a 738 that's been on the ground that will have a total ground time of 2.5 days between flights. It could be that to match up, UA would have to pick a day when a 737 is sitting during the daytime.
 
UAinAUS
Posts: 215
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2016 8:11 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 04, 2020 9:55 am

UAX Update:

CR5:
N171GJ has been re-registered as N521GJ, ferried AMA for EvoBlu livery paint

CR7:
N153GJ exited service, at STL awaiting CR5 mod, will become N532GJ
N158GJ exited service, at STL awaiting CR5 mod, will become N537GJ
GoJet CR7 program has ended

E75SC:
N624UA enters revenue service with ExpressJet 5Mar
N625UA enters revenue service with ExpressJet 5Mar
 
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calpsafltskeds
Posts: 3223
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 1:29 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 04, 2020 2:19 pm

319:
N895UA entered SFO 2055/28Feb, exited 685/3Mar in 16F config
N897UA exited LCQ 2759/11Feb in 16F config.
N898UA exited LCQ 2750/17Feb in 16F config

789:
N29977 sked first revenue flight 1981/6Mar ORD-SFO
 
VC10er
Posts: 4265
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:25 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 04, 2020 2:44 pm

When all is completed, how many CRJ550’s will UA have?
I could probably think of many short routes from EWR she would be perfect for - destinations that are horrible 6-8 hour drives, reduced to an hour or so for the CRJ550!
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
DC8FanJet
Posts: 214
Joined: Sun Aug 27, 2006 9:25 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 04, 2020 4:58 pm

VC10er wrote:
When all is completed, how many CRJ550’s will UA have?
I could probably think of many short routes from EWR she would be perfect for - destinations that are horrible 6-8 hour drives, reduced to an hour or so for the CRJ550!


Last PR release from GoJet stated there will be 74 aircraft converted.

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