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factsonly
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:59 pm

UA operating its 2nd B77W Cargo flight USA to AMS, this time:

- ORD-AMS-ORD UA2810/UA2811 B77W N2534U March 23rd/24th

previous was:

- EWR-AMS-EWR UA2813/UA2814 B77W N2747U March 21st/23rd

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/flights/ua2810
 
EWRamp
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Mar 23, 2020 11:36 pm

IAH-FRA-IAH UA2788/UA2789 B77W N2331U March23rd/24th

IAH-AMS-IAH UA2786/2787 B77W N2737U March 24th/25th
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 24, 2020 12:33 am

United this past weekend and also today UA operated several humanitarian flights out of Peru and Ecuador trying to help stranded Americans get home. So far I don't see any more humanitarian flights loaded in the system but that does not mean The State Department isn't working on securing more flights in the future if needed.

More cargo flights have been loaded into the system for later this week. For now it looks as though UA is resticting these flights to ORD. EWR and IAH, also for now all of these international cargo flights are operating to Europe. I'm not sure if UA will operate any cargo flights to/from Asia once our passenger operations to/from Asia is reduced to SFO-NRT early next week. But for now UA is still operating HNL/SFO/EWR/DEN/IAD/GUM - NRT and SFO-SIN. With the exception of GUM, and HNL every other flight to NRT today had a ton of cargo on it, so it will be interesting to see what happens with the cargo once the remainder of our flights except for SFO are suspended.
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 24, 2020 2:35 am

jayunited wrote:
United this past weekend and also today UA operated several humanitarian flights out of Peru and Ecuador trying to help stranded Americans get home. So far I don't see any more humanitarian flights loaded in the system but that does not mean The State Department isn't working on securing more flights in the future if needed.

More cargo flights have been loaded into the system for later this week. For now it looks as though UA is resticting these flights to ORD. EWR and IAH, also for now all of these international cargo flights are operating to Europe. I'm not sure if UA will operate any cargo flights to/from Asia once our passenger operations to/from Asia is reduced to SFO-NRT early next week. But for now UA is still operating HNL/SFO/EWR/DEN/IAD/GUM - NRT and SFO-SIN. With the exception of GUM, and HNL every other flight to NRT today had a ton of cargo on it, so it will be interesting to see what happens with the cargo once the remainder of our flights except for SFO are suspended.


I know you mention UA has no clue for the future but will the Asia service for May be updated soon?
 
ericm2031
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:42 am

Do we know if they are only loading cargo into the cargo pits or are they loading cargo into seats as we've seen some other carriers doing? Same question for the AA flights, is this something allowed by the FAA or only in some foreign countries? Is DL doing any cargo-only flights?
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 24, 2020 1:42 pm

739:
38417 exited VCV 2753/22Mar in EvoBlu livery

Storage: I have a color-coded spreadsheet that's hopefully somewhat up to date her:
https://sites.google.com/site/unitedfle ... ris-update (tabs at bottom for different fleets - Express fleet not checked yet.

Assume the following in storage: (in addition to the below, several line stations have numerous aircraft parksed of which some may be longer term and some will rotate in and out of service) 
ROW
319: N838UA, 320: N227UA, 738: N25201/N73291, 739: N72405, 752: N512UA/N595UA/N18119, 753: N77867, 772: N219UA/N220UA/N221UA/N222UA/N768UA/N799UA

IND:
763: N665UA/N675UA/N677UA

MCO: (some could be maint or will rotate in/out of service)
752: N21108/N18122/N13113/N17122/N48127, 753: N75851/N75861, 763: N664UA/N667UA/N670UA/N671UA

TPA: (some could be in maint or will rotate in/out of service)
738: N27213/N37255/N35260/N78285/N37290, 739: N75432/N78438N66903/N61881 

GYR: (could be maint, possible fleet exit storage)
320: N432UA, 752: N14115/N13138
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:20 pm

ericm2031 wrote:
Do we know if they are only loading cargo into the cargo pits or are they loading cargo into seats as we've seen some other carriers doing? Same question for the AA flights, is this something allowed by the FAA or only in some foreign countries? Is DL doing any cargo-only flights?



I don't see UA going as far as removing seats from aircraft to carry cargo. An empty passenger compartment on a 77W flying to Europe from ORD, IAH, or EWR means an airline could potentially carry around 100,000 pounds perhaps even 110,000 pounds of cargo in the belly depending on the fuel requirements. Also keep in mind UA because we are only using a small portion of our fleet as cargo charters we need to turn these aircraft in Europe fairly quickly. Loading individual boxes in the passengers cabin and having employees walk these pieces up and down stairs slows down the turn around time and there is the potential for employees to get injured since they wouldn't be able to hold on to the handrails while entering and exiting the cabin of a 77W or 789.
 
horsepowerchef
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:56 pm

jayunited wrote:
ericm2031 wrote:
Do we know if they are only loading cargo into the cargo pits or are they loading cargo into seats as we've seen some other carriers doing? Same question for the AA flights, is this something allowed by the FAA or only in some foreign countries? Is DL doing any cargo-only flights?



I don't see UA going as far as removing seats from aircraft to carry cargo. An empty passenger compartment on a 77W flying to Europe from ORD, IAH, or EWR means an airline could potentially carry around 100,000 pounds perhaps even 110,000 pounds of cargo in the belly depending on the fuel requirements. Also keep in mind UA because we are only using a small portion of our fleet as cargo charters we need to turn these aircraft in Europe fairly quickly. Loading individual boxes in the passengers cabin and having employees walk these pieces up and down stairs slows down the turn around time and there is the potential for employees to get injured since they wouldn't be able to hold on to the handrails while entering and exiting the cabin of a 77W or 789.


yea, thats completely out of the question...loading +50,000lbs of freight by hand would take ages and probably incur injuries...let alone, Im pretty sure the plane would need to have its cabin floor reinforced...
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:57 pm

The fleet changes, fleet status, and repaint status posts at the start of this thread have been updated.

There is also a new post dedicated to keeping track of stored aircraft.

✈️ atcsundevil
 
dc10co
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 24, 2020 5:47 pm

The stored aircraft list should be updated to show N403UA, N452UA, N459UA, N806UA, and N819UA stored at MSY. We expect to have up to 30 aircraft stored here but that’s the first 5
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jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 24, 2020 7:02 pm

Was on a conference call today it just ended few minutes ago. United is looking to expand the use of cargo charters to Asia do to rising demand to move cargo between nations. Right now United Cargo is in negociations with several companies to commence cargo flights beginning either late next week or the following week to/from cities in Asia. Should United Cargo be successful in our bid we could begin seeing cargo flights to/from the U.S. to places like HKG, PVG, PEK, and NRT. This is in addition to cargo flight to places in Europe which already include FRA, LHR, AMS and soon BRU will be added to the list of places UA operates cargo charters.

Again the caveat for United Airlines is the flight has to be profitable, we will not operate any cargo charter if said flight will cost UA money. In this environment operating a cargo flight at a loss is a nonstarter for UA. UA would rather park the aircraft than lose money operating a cargo charter.
 
EssentialBusDC
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 24, 2020 7:08 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
739:
38417 exited VCV 2753/22Mar in EvoBlu livery

Storage: I have a color-coded spreadsheet that's hopefully somewhat up to date her:
https://sites.google.com/site/unitedfle ... ris-update (tabs at bottom for different fleets - Express fleet not checked yet.

Assume the following in storage: (in addition to the below, several line stations have numerous aircraft parksed of which some may be longer term and some will rotate in and out of service) 
ROW
319: N838UA, 320: N227UA, 738: N25201/N73291, 739: N72405, 752: N512UA/N595UA/N18119, 753: N77867, 772: N219UA/N220UA/N221UA/N222UA/N768UA/N799UA

IND:
763: N665UA/N675UA/N677UA

MCO: (some could be maint or will rotate in/out of service)
752: N21108/N18122/N13113/N17122/N48127, 753: N75851/N75861, 763: N664UA/N667UA/N670UA/N671UA

TPA: (some could be in maint or will rotate in/out of service)
738: N27213/N37255/N35260/N78285/N37290, 739: N75432/N78438N66903/N61881 

GYR: (could be maint, possible fleet exit storage)
320: N432UA, 752: N14115/N13138


not correct a N number for the 320 fleet. N227UA is a 777
 
Beanbag
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 25, 2020 2:48 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
739:
38417 exited VCV 2753/22Mar in EvoBlu livery

Storage: I have a color-coded spreadsheet that's hopefully somewhat up to date her:
https://sites.google.com/site/unitedfle ... ris-update (tabs at bottom for different fleets - Express fleet not checked yet.

Assume the following in storage: (in addition to the below, several line stations have numerous aircraft parksed of which some may be longer term and some will rotate in and out of service) 
ROW
319: N838UA, 320: N227UA, 738: N25201/N73291, 739: N72405, 752: N512UA/N595UA/N18119, 753: N77867, 772: N219UA/N220UA/N221UA/N222UA/N768UA/N799UA

IND:
763: N665UA/N675UA/N677UA

MCO: (some could be maint or will rotate in/out of service)
752: N21108/N18122/N13113/N17122/N48127, 753: N75851/N75861, 763: N664UA/N667UA/N670UA/N671UA

TPA: (some could be in maint or will rotate in/out of service)
738: N27213/N37255/N35260/N78285/N37290, 739: N75432/N78438N66903/N61881 

GYR: (could be maint, possible fleet exit storage)
320: N432UA, 752: N14115/N13138

For N432UA, I see trouble.. for the 752s, not so much.. not yet at least.
 
BigPlaneGuy13
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 25, 2020 2:52 pm

In case anyone was wondering what the parked fleet looked like at ORD. Lots of widebodies are parked on a pad at the north end of the airfield. More 175s and CRJs are parked off to the west, but I couldn't snap it from my side of the plane. These photos were taken Sunday, March 22nd in the morning.

https://imgur.com/GAsXFX8
https://imgur.com/CZWxCby
https://imgur.com/P8Z5tUJ
 
redrooster3
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 25, 2020 3:36 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
Are you talking only mainline or Express as well and is the 43 UA only? I assume that includes aircraft on gates.
Looking at DEN, there are 4 788s on the ground and all the rest are narrowbodies that aren't departing today.

Interesting that about 10 of the 16 or 17 narrowbodies have upcoming flights scheduled after about 2 days on the ground. I only see 6 319/320s that do not have a flight scheduled. FR24 only allows me to go back a week without upgrading from Silver.

Maybe more cancellations are on the way or UA wants to keep aircraft moving every couple of days at this point.


Seems UA is approaching this situation differently than DL/AA and am rotating aircraft every few days to keep them current rather than long term parking. I know ROW/IND/MCO has some planes that will probably be more long term parking situations. But the planes in the hubs are being rotated frequently.
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 25, 2020 5:14 pm

752:
N14106 sked to exit MIA 1791/25mar in 16/160 configuration

772:
N206UA sked to exit FTW 2587/25Mar in EvoBlu livery
N78005 exited AMA 2745/24Mar in EvoBlu livery

I just went through the widebodies and have the spreadsheet updated here on the widebody tab at bottom. I did see numerous aircraft coming out of what I previously shown as stored while other went into storage. Narrowbodies are somewhat updated to reflect parked aircraft at TPA, PDX and MSY. If anyone knows of different parking locations, please post it.

https://sites.google.com/site/unitedfle ... ris-update

The 77W, 78X and 772A fleet are moving the most, 788 and 763 moving the least and 764/772ERs in between with use.

Hopefully the transcons have good cargo loads as the seat maps are awful... I don't understand why UA doesn't cancel the narrowbodies in these markets unless they are bulked out as well - hopefully they are.

Looking at the ORD photos, some of those aircraft look "trapped" between other aircraft. However, I don't see any cowling covers that might indicate longer term storage. I would guess if the aircraft has been sitting more than a week, it would be in longer storage.
 
factsonly
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 25, 2020 5:38 pm

Today - March 25, 2020 - UA launches dedicated 2x/weekly cargo service on SFO-AMS with B787-10:

- 25 Mar 2020 dep. 16.00 SFO - arr. 10.15 AMS UA2769 B78X N12010 Scheduled
- 26 Mar 2020 dep. 14.00 AMS - arr. 16.05 SFO UA2771 B78X N12010 Scheduled

This seasonal route was to be flown daily by B788 during S20.

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/flights/ua2768
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 25, 2020 5:51 pm

The 78X carries 40 LD3 positions, 8 more than the 772 while burning less fuel. The 77W holds 4 more than the 78X, but also burns more fuel.
With no passengers and a relatively short haul to AMS, the 78X would be the best way to move cargo, unless floor limits in certain positions preclude heavy pallets vs. the 77W.
 
N649DL
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:18 pm

KVH68 wrote:
jetmatt777 wrote:
Anything that isn't headed to the desert (for right now) will be rotated around the schedule to spread around hours to keep maintenance items low. (Cycles and hours). I'm sure as the schedule continues to deteriorate this will change but that is what we have heard right now.


That sounds like a good plan. When you fly the planes on a rotation, you don't have to use resources to put them into short-term storage. Besides, planes like to fly. When they sit on the ground too long, the seals relax and they develop hydraulic and fuel leaks.


Very true but if UA can do what AA did and switch out to have all cargo flights (maybe using those HD domestic 777s) that could be a win. The 763s are older and the ex-3 class variants always had lower cycles so those should be temporarily stored for future use as many have brand new interior configurations.
 
United1
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:32 pm

N649DL wrote:
KVH68 wrote:
jetmatt777 wrote:
Anything that isn't headed to the desert (for right now) will be rotated around the schedule to spread around hours to keep maintenance items low. (Cycles and hours). I'm sure as the schedule continues to deteriorate this will change but that is what we have heard right now.


That sounds like a good plan. When you fly the planes on a rotation, you don't have to use resources to put them into short-term storage. Besides, planes like to fly. When they sit on the ground too long, the seals relax and they develop hydraulic and fuel leaks.


Very true but if UA can do what AA did and switch out to have all cargo flights (maybe using those HD domestic 777s) that could be a win. The 763s are older and the ex-3 class variants always had lower cycles so those should be temporarily stored for future use as many have brand new interior configurations.


UA has been operating a number of all cargo flights and is looking at adding more of them if they can fly the route profitably. Most 763s are already parked...I think there are only about 10 that are currently in service.
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KVH68
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 25, 2020 7:45 pm

Got a Company email today:

"Due to a continued drop in travel demand as a result of this outbreak, today we announced a further reduction in our domestic schedule for April. The changes will result in a 52 percent overall domestic reduction from a previous 42 percent, and our overall capacity will now be down 68 percent."
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Mar 25, 2020 8:14 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
752:
Hopefully the transcons have good cargo loads as the seat maps are awful... I don't understand why UA doesn't cancel the narrowbodies in these markets unless they are bulked out as well - hopefully they are.


Quick question are you looking at the scheduled flights or the actual flights flown?

Take today for example March 25th on UA's SFO-EWR route UA on the schedule has 12 flights but in reality we will only operate 6 the other 6 flights have been canceled. Come April you should see more stability in the schedule but for now until the end of March you will see what I call a rolling schedule, take for example ORD-IAH UA has 10 flights on the schedule today but will only operate 7 flights today the other 3 have been canceled. A lot of these cancelations are taking place 24-48 hours out. Now on a daily basis as a result of COVID-19 UA and UAX is operating around 1100 - 1200 daily flights this is down from around 3,000 daily flights. Come April that number should drop to around 900 total daily passenger flights tops. I wouldn't be suprised to see that actual number of flights flown in April drop to around 700 - 800 daily flights.

UA's competition factor yesterday March 24th was 58% the rest of our daily scheduled flights were canceled. This is why I'm stressing look at the flights flown not what is on the schedule because we are not flying a full schedule not by a long shot
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 26, 2020 12:08 am

Jay, I've been looking at a combination or United.com and the UA app for the schedule, type flown and seat map before and after departure. Of course I can't see what's in the bins, but it looks like the flight schedule should be 3 or 4 a day evenly timed out and probably all wide bodies, assuming the bins are full with freight.
For example, last night EWR-LAX had a 752 and a 772A run 30 mins apart in the dinner hour with 13 & 26 seats taken. On the return UA ran 3 redeyes LAX-EWR 1 wide and 2 narrows with 50, 30 and 15 passengers.
Pretty close to the same on EWR-SFO-EWR, with 2 redeyes east and 2 light trips westbound at 6pm and 8pm.
I can't see why one narrowbody RT wasn't cxld in each market.

The loads are totally unbelievably sad,but I'm sure UA can't do anything about it except reduce service as a reaction. The 700-800 total daily flights is shocking when wasn't DEN going close to that level with new gates.

I had thought UA might want to cancel some Non-hub to hub trancons (like SAN-EWR, SFO-CLE, etc.) and connect traffic thru mid-continent hubs. Then possibly reduce banks by 2 or 3 a day a IAH and ORD to allow UA to feed cross country travel by time of days. Something like East Coast to ORD at 7am and 3pm, East Coast to IAH at 10am and 5pm to give passengers a spread of connection opportunities. But, the loads look so bad, it may not be worthwhile to try and make something like that work.
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 26, 2020 1:57 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
Jay, I've been looking at a combination or United.com and the UA app for the schedule, type flown and seat map before and after departure. Of course I can't see what's in the bins, but it looks like the flight schedule should be 3 or 4 a day evenly timed out and probably all wide bodies, assuming the bins are full with freight.
For example, last night EWR-LAX had a 752 and a 772A run 30 mins apart in the dinner hour with 13 & 26 seats taken. On the return UA ran 3 redeyes LAX-EWR 1 wide and 2 narrows with 50, 30 and 15 passengers.
Pretty close to the same on EWR-SFO-EWR, with 2 redeyes east and 2 light trips westbound at 6pm and 8pm.
I can't see why one narrowbody RT wasn't cxld in each market.


I get what you are saying canceling a narrowbody roundtrip and put those people on a widebody. United could do that but one thing we are hearing from flight attendants and customer service agents is social distance adherence guidelines on aircraft. While there are no official guidelines UA is saying if a customer request to be moved into a different seat the customer service agents comply. We do have gate agents asking if they have a narrowbody with only 25 people on board can they just move people themselves in SHARES into different seats to keep that social distance. So far UA's position has been for the agents to use their best judgement and if a customer asks to be place back into their original seat just move them back. We also a few days ago on UA2 SIN-SFO had a situation arise where there were only 28 seats booked in business class and over 120 people booked in coach. Originally there were no upgrades so SIN C.S. spaced out the passengers in business class and did the best they could to space customers out in coach. However that all changed once the flight opened to check-in at the airport 15 passengers wanted to either use their miles or pay cash for the upgrade into business class. The question was can we sell those seats? United position was do not give the seats away for free people know the risk if they want to pay to sit in close proximity to someone for 15 hours then sell the seat.

In conversations with my bosses yesterday they fully expect the industry to change as a result of COVID-19, just like the industry changed as a result of 9/11. Right now the government is saying social distance but are airline to enforce that policy, so far I'm being told we can't get an answer to that question from the FAA, DOT, or Trump Administration. My bosses are telling me that UA already has teams putting together scenarios that will cover any policy changes that come about as a result of COVID-19. From best case scenarios to worse case scenarios. Some experts on Trumps coronavirus task force are now saying COVID-19 might become a seasonal thing where we see cases drop but then rise again in November and December. United has teams looking at how this will impact the airline, will we need to remove rows of seats from aircraft? Will we need to block middle seats and only have passengers seated in window and aisle seats? Airlines know the cabin filtration system can remove COVID-19 from the air as the air is recycled. But how does an airline protect a passengers from the passenger seated next to them. For example a passenger seated in row 7A and 7C, that air hasn't had a chance to be recycled, how do protect passengers onboard? Will airlines be required to protect passengers onboard, will we in the very near future be required to take every passengers temperature before they board a flight? It was such an incredible conversation I had with with my boss yesterday just to get an insight into what UA is thinking the future of this industry will be and the changes COVID-19 will have going forward.

DL stated they will be a much smaller airline coming out of this I think a lot people took that to mean less flights, but what if in addition to less flights it also means less people on each airplane? UA like I said has teams of people (working remotely) working on this because we know (or at the very least we expect) there will be changes once the pandemic portion of this virus is over. COVID-19 is here and even with a vaccine my bosses are saying they are being told COVID-19 is probably here to stay even once a vaccine is widely available. So how do you protect customers and employees on an aircraft in the future?


If part of the solution to protect passengers is to remove seats or block seats on aircraft what impact will that have the ticket prices?
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 26, 2020 4:33 pm

I totally agree and posted something a week ago stating if the load was under something like 40% that seating should be adjusted. In many cases on the flights that concerned me, a widebody would allow socially distancing. UA could even consider using E+ seating for Y passenger, but not taking adjacent empty seats away from real E+ customers. Hopefully this will be a temporary situation once the situation is "resolved". Maybe when N95 masks are available, UA could buy them in bulk and give to passengers.
Let's hope this thing doesn't resurface every year. If it does, maybe it will be like the Africanized Bee scare where the impact pretty much went away over time.

Jay, you speak of potentially fewer passengers per flight. If that is due to lower demand, it would mean fares would be lowered to attract passenger and a disaster for revenue totals. I find it hard to believe that fares would be increased to fly empty seats to spread out passengers. This would decrease demand for the Big 3, which would leave a real opportunity for the budget carriers to grab a huge portion of the flying public. Do we want people thinking they could get coronavirus by being packed in Basic economy or on a low cost carrier?

As to a smaller airline, UA could be better positioned to overtaking DL and AA in total aircraft as UA has needed more lift recently and purchased used aircraft. DL and AA have older units to retire. However, demand and cash flow might make it impossible for UA to expand. I wonder if WN could short-term lease at least some of their 73Gs sold to UA. That could help both airlines once the coronavirus thing is "over", especially if the MAX continues to have issues and potentially cheaper used Airbus aircraft become available. UA has used 319s in the pipeline, which would allow narrowbody expansion with or w/o the 73G and MAXes. I'm sure UA has the ability to long term store some older Airbus units for future use. Pick the ones due for Heavy maint checks and when needed, UA could spend the cash to bring them back.

Could there be further consolidation that could end up with Alaska (334 units) going with AA and maybe Jet Blue (270 units) joining UA? Could that leave Hawaiian (61 units) with DL (similar aircraft) and these being approved under the Trump Adminstration? That could result in total aircraft currently operated to: AA 1300 units, UA 1156 units and DL 987 units. Will the low cost carriers combine with each other and/or some be merged into WN?

You would think UA would dump more or all 757PW units, even though some WiFi upgrades were recently made on some of this fleet. All but 2 are currently temporarily parked or stored, including 2 gogo units stored in ROW, (except N598UA, which may have an error in Flight Amenities as it was possibly upgraded from gogo in MIA in Feb). If demand is lower overall, more widebodies will be available to cover the 752PWs on transcon flights.

As for the 763s, most of the oldest units received Polaris as part of a change to retain the entire fleet. I would guess UA may be assessing the need for so many 46J aircraft if business demand will be depressed for potentially years to come. It could be with reduced demand, 321XLRs could replace the older 763s at a hugely reduced operating cost as new routes may also be pushed back for years. I would expect the 6 remaining non-Polaris 763 will now to be stored with 2000 build N674UA in limbo. It's too bad N674UA (last of newest batch of 763s, already in EvoBlu) didn't go into mod before of 8 year older N652UA, which probably is too far down the mod line to pull.

UA could fleet exit the 6 or 7 non-Polaris 1992/93 763s or move them to transcons. And, unless seat sets are already purchase for the 764, you'd think UA could exit some or all of the 15 1991/93 2 Class Polaris aircraft and reuse those Polaris seats on the 764 fleet. Or the 764 fleet could be moved to transon services for the time being.
 
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jetblastdubai
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 26, 2020 6:42 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
I wonder if WN could short-term lease at least some of their 73Gs sold to UA.


With projected demand down for the coming months, UA could probably use more of their smallest mainline fleet type in the air instead of the larger ones.

Additionally, throwing WN a short-term lifeline isn't something I would think UA would ever want to do after the cut-throat way WN went after UA in years past when UA was having issues.
 
asuflyer
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 26, 2020 8:03 pm

Today and tomorrow UA is performing two rescue flights from IAH to LIM with 772's to repatriate Americans from Peru. A 737s is repatriating Americans from UIO.
 
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CALTECH
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 26, 2020 8:22 pm

Had a Ramper pass away in Newark, supposedly from complications of COVID-19 on the 24th. Some being sent home as they came back from overseas/other countries. The 767s in MCO are to/did go to Houston. Saw load factors just above 10 %. 777s were cancelled or de-committed the other day. Some flights had more Flight Attendants/Crew than Passengers.
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CALTECH
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 26, 2020 8:26 pm

jetblastdubai wrote:
calpsafltskeds wrote:
I wonder if WN could short-term lease at least some of their 73Gs sold to UA.


With projected demand down for the coming months, UA could probably use more of their smallest mainline fleet type in the air instead of the larger ones.

Additionally, throwing WN a short-term lifeline isn't something I would think UA would ever want to do after the cut-throat way WN went after UA in years past when UA was having issues.


There is no demand for MORE aircraft. Many will get parked, maybe for good.
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jetblastdubai
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 26, 2020 11:11 pm

CALTECH wrote:

There is no demand for MORE aircraft. Many will get parked, maybe for good.


I understand that but since UA already bought these 73Gs, wouldn't it be better to utilize them instead of the larger narrowbodies in the fleet? If they're going to park A/C anyway, it might as well be A/C that they'd have a harder time filling as well having slightly higher operating costs.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Mar 27, 2020 12:25 am

JetBlast, my thought was instead of parking either 73G or larger narrowbodies, just lease them to WN. The expense to operate a 738 or 739 isn't much more than a 73G. It would park fewer aircraft and bring in revenue.
You'd rather have UA park more aircraft than bring in revenue from any source? Doesn't make sense.
 
Okcflyer
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Mar 27, 2020 1:12 am

calpsafltskeds wrote:
JetBlast, my thought was instead of parking either 73G or larger narrowbodies, just lease them to WN. The expense to operate a 738 or 739 isn't much more than a 73G. It would park fewer aircraft and bring in revenue.
You'd rather have UA park more aircraft than bring in revenue from any source? Doesn't make sense.


But why would WN want them back? They have their own parked fleets. And the problem is even worse once Max deliveries start
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Mar 27, 2020 1:33 am

Anyone shocked by the njumber of the flights currently in the air by operator? 3/26/20 at 2131 EDT
UA roughly 1/6th of WN and a 13rd of both AA and DL. It could be UA's aircraft are at hub airports?,

307 SWA Southwest "Southwest" (Dallas, TX)
169 DAL Delta "Delta"
161 AAL American Airlines "American"
131 SKW SkyWest "SkyWest" (St. George, UT)
126 CSN China Southern Airlines "China Southern" (China)
107 ASA Alaska Airlines "Alaska"
89 CCA Air China "Air China" (China)
79 CES China Eastern "China Eastern" (China)
70 JAL Japan Airlines "Japanair" (Japan)
67 NKS Spirit "Spirit Wings" (Miramar, FL)
61 JBU JetBlue "JetBlue"
56 UAL United "United"
 
codc10
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Mar 27, 2020 1:42 am

calpsafltskeds wrote:
Anyone shocked by the njumber of the flights currently in the air by operator? 3/26/20 at 2131 EDT
UA roughly 1/6th of WN and a 13rd of both AA and DL. It could be UA's aircraft are at hub airports?,

307 SWA Southwest "Southwest" (Dallas, TX)
169 DAL Delta "Delta"
161 AAL American Airlines "American"
131 SKW SkyWest "SkyWest" (St. George, UT)
126 CSN China Southern Airlines "China Southern" (China)
107 ASA Alaska Airlines "Alaska"
89 CCA Air China "Air China" (China)
79 CES China Eastern "China Eastern" (China)
70 JAL Japan Airlines "Japanair" (Japan)
67 NKS Spirit "Spirit Wings" (Miramar, FL)
61 JBU JetBlue "JetBlue"
56 UAL United "United"


United had fewer daily flights than AA/DL/WN to begin with, and more international. UA also was very aggressive in cutting its March schedule. Not terribly surprising.
 
United1
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Mar 27, 2020 2:00 am

codc10 wrote:
calpsafltskeds wrote:
Anyone shocked by the njumber of the flights currently in the air by operator? 3/26/20 at 2131 EDT
UA roughly 1/6th of WN and a 13rd of both AA and DL. It could be UA's aircraft are at hub airports?,

307 SWA Southwest "Southwest" (Dallas, TX)
169 DAL Delta "Delta"
161 AAL American Airlines "American"
131 SKW SkyWest "SkyWest" (St. George, UT)
126 CSN China Southern Airlines "China Southern" (China)
107 ASA Alaska Airlines "Alaska"
89 CCA Air China "Air China" (China)
79 CES China Eastern "China Eastern" (China)
70 JAL Japan Airlines "Japanair" (Japan)
67 NKS Spirit "Spirit Wings" (Miramar, FL)
61 JBU JetBlue "JetBlue"
56 UAL United "United"


United had fewer daily flights than AA/DL/WN to begin with, and more international. UA also was very aggressive in cutting its March schedule. Not terribly surprising.


Sad but not surprising with everything that is going on.

ORD-SFO tomorrow normally would have 10 daily flights. Eight of them are canceled and the two remaining flights are barely a third full.
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UAinAUS
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Mar 27, 2020 7:43 am

UAX Update:

The following aircraft are in temporary storage related to the Covid-19 situation in the designated locations:

E175:
DEN: 117
BNA: 135, 141
ORD: 148
MKE: 153
CLT: 203
OKC: 302, 343
IAH: 304, 305, 315, 342, 347, 349, 350, 352, 354, 357, 358, 359, 360
CMH: 721, 723, 749
IND: 722, 723, 749
SDF: 724
PIT: 729, 744, 748
MCI: 751

E70:
SDF: 632, 644
MCI: 636
CMH: 637, 638, 639, 649, 653, 859
PIT: 648, 650, 856, 863
IND: 652, 654, 861

CR7:
IAD: 501, 507
OKC: 502
DEN: 787, 795, 797
SLC: 788
COS: 789

CR5:
ORD: 501
STL: 504, 508, 519, 536, 542

E45:
TYS: 535, 569, 570, 905, 978
CLE: 537, 548, 903, 910 911, 913, 980, 991
IAH: 546, 551, 555, 557, 558, 574, 575, 900, 901, 909
EWR: 915, 916
STL: 832, 835, 836, 842, 847

E45X:
TYS: 101, 112, 131, 138, 108, 110, 164, 180, 189, 196
STL: 106, 142
CLE: 117, 137, 145, 105
SDF: 125
ALB: 139, 147, 152, 157, 173, 174, 193, 194, 197, 204
EWR: 195
IAH: 103, 135, 158, 159, 170, 185, 188

CR2:
DAY: 405, 414, 454
CAE: 419, 424, 438, 471
MCO: 421, 432
MKE: 426, 440, 455, 463, 973
ATW: 449, 465
IAD: 469
TUS: 652, 877, 903EV, 952, 980, 983, 986
FAT: 932EV
OKC: 932SW
COS: 937EV
SLC: 961
 
fun2fly
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Mar 27, 2020 1:28 pm

Polaris 763 N673UA looks like it will depart HKG 30 Mar.
 
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CALTECH
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Mar 27, 2020 9:58 pm

jetblastdubai wrote:
CALTECH wrote:

There is no demand for MORE aircraft. Many will get parked, maybe for good.


I understand that but since UA already bought these 73Gs, wouldn't it be better to utilize them instead of the larger narrowbodies in the fleet? If they're going to park A/C anyway, it might as well be A/C that they'd have a harder time filling as well having slightly higher operating costs.


There was talk of using bigger jets to grab cargo business.
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jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Mar 27, 2020 10:29 pm

CALTECH wrote:
jetblastdubai wrote:
CALTECH wrote:

There is no demand for MORE aircraft. Many will get parked, maybe for good.


I understand that but since UA already bought these 73Gs, wouldn't it be better to utilize them instead of the larger narrowbodies in the fleet? If they're going to park A/C anyway, it might as well be A/C that they'd have a harder time filling as well having slightly higher operating costs.


There was talk of using bigger jets to grab cargo business.


It is no longer talk for the next few weeks UA will be operating up to 40 cargo flights per week. Most cargo flight are being operated on either 77Ws, 78Xs, and 789s, from time to time we are using 77Es, however UA will not be using any 767s for cargo flights.


Also just happened to check and today March 27, 2020 at 22:31 zulu time UA only has 75 flights in the air at different phases of their flight. It is hard to imagine that on a Friday evening generally one of the busiest travel days UA only has 75 mainline flights in the air.
 
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kordcj
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Mar 28, 2020 12:32 am

jayunited wrote:
CALTECH wrote:
jetblastdubai wrote:

I understand that but since UA already bought these 73Gs, wouldn't it be better to utilize them instead of the larger narrowbodies in the fleet? If they're going to park A/C anyway, it might as well be A/C that they'd have a harder time filling as well having slightly higher operating costs.


There was talk of using bigger jets to grab cargo business.


It is no longer talk for the next few weeks UA will be operating up to 40 cargo flights per week. Most cargo flight are being operated on either 77Ws, 78Xs, and 789s, from time to time we are using 77Es, however UA will not be using any 767s for cargo flights.


Also just happened to check and today March 27, 2020 at 22:31 zulu time UA only has 75 flights in the air at different phases of their flight. It is hard to imagine that on a Friday evening generally one of the busiest travel days UA only has 75 mainline flights in the air.

Is that including express too or just mainline?
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airplanedriver6
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Mar 28, 2020 3:25 am

jayunited wrote:
...however UA will not be using any 767s for cargo flights.

Interesting. Everything must be in containers or on smaller pallets, no?

Doesn't the 767 have the largest cargo door in UA's passenger fleet?
 
jetmatt777
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Mar 28, 2020 3:30 am

The 767 does not have a full width lower cargo floor. It cannot accommodate LD3s or full size cookie sheets side by side. It's not very efficient for freight only operations in a pax config (not talking about UPS or FedEx which have the main deck to use). One LD3 takes up 2 spots in a 767. Whereas in a 777 or 787 an LD3 takes up only 1 spot.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Mar 28, 2020 4:15 am

319:
N837UA exited LCQ 2714/25Mar, direct to ROW, storage, can't see if 12F mod complete

752:
N14106 sked to exit MI771/29Mar with 16/160 config and upgrades

772:
N206UA exited FTW 2587/25Mar in EvoBlu, now in IAH
N785UA sked to exit XMN 2691/29Mar with Polaris/PP

77W:
N2639U exited XMN manit 2692/28Mar
N2748U sked to operate in/out of HKG 2774/26Mar, then 2773/28Mar, non-stop to/from LAX, possibly a freight charter, but has ferry numbers.

It's hard to keep up with parked aircraft at UA hubs that rotate in and out of service.
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Mar 28, 2020 12:57 pm

airplanedriver6 wrote:
jayunited wrote:
...however UA will not be using any 767s for cargo flights.

Interesting. Everything must be in containers or on smaller pallets, no?

Doesn't the 767 have the largest cargo door in UA's passenger fleet?



UA's 767's do have the largest forward cargo door in UA's fleet and the rear cargo door is the smallest in UA's fleet. Having said that a 763 can only accommodate 4 PMC's and a 764 can only take 5 PMC's. Compare that to a 77E it can accommodate 10 PMC's, 789 can hold 11 PMC's, a 78X can take 13 PMC's and a 77W can accommodate 14 PMC's.

Also do to floor weight limitation UA's 763s and a 764s can only accommodate one 10,000 pound PMC every other PMC must weigh substantially less and the PMC located behind the nose gear on a 763 and 764 can not weight more than 4,000 pounds give or take a few pounds. Compare that to the 77E, 789, 78X and 77W all of these frames in both the forward and aft cargo hold can accommodate numerous 10,000 pound PMC's and the pallet position right behind the nose gear the floor weight loading limit is in the 9,000 pound range.

Even if we get rid off all the pallets and load LD containers for lets say a USPS mail charter, 767s have something called lateral imbalance. The Post Office likes to use LD3s and with the lateral imbalance a 763 can only take 11 LD3 while the stretch 764 can only take 7 LD3s. The lateral imbalance is because the 767 does not have a full width floor so LD3s can not be paired, and since LD3s are not full with containers loading more than 11 or 7 or the varying fleet types results in to much weight on left side on the aircraft verses the right side of the aircraft.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Mar 28, 2020 3:52 pm

Jay, that makes perfect sense. The 767 floor issues and lack of taking normal pallets or LD3s width-wise is the problem. However, if using narrower LD2 containers (25% less space than an LD3), the 767 can pair those units for decent cubic footage, but isn't standard for many shippers.
For what it takes, here's the volume of total LD2 and LD3 spaces on below aircraft. Does not include bulk bins or floor weight issues:
763 30 LD2s 3,720 CF
788 28 LD3s 4,452 CF
764 38 LD2s 4,712 CF
772 32 LD3s 5,088 CF
789 36 LD3s 5,724 CF
78X 40 LD3s 5,360 CF
77W 44 LD3s 6,996 CF
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Mar 29, 2020 5:03 pm

More stored aircraft.
All 764s appear are parked or stored. 9 in ROW.
Many 763s in IAH, plus 4 in ROW storage
10 772s in ROW storage
9 of 10 752PWs in ROW storage. N596UA been in SFO since 3/21
Parking locations: SFO, ORD, DEN, IAH, IAD, EWR, MCO, GUM, HNL, MSY, MIA, TPA, SAT, CLE, AUS, BOX, FLL, LAS, LGA, PDX
Storage/maint: ROW, GYR, INT, DLH, LCQ, ILN, HKG, XMN, VCV
 
77H
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Mar 29, 2020 7:21 pm

jayunited wrote:
calpsafltskeds wrote:
Jay, I've been looking at a combination or United.com and the UA app for the schedule, type flown and seat map before and after departure. Of course I can't see what's in the bins, but it looks like the flight schedule should be 3 or 4 a day evenly timed out and probably all wide bodies, assuming the bins are full with freight.
For example, last night EWR-LAX had a 752 and a 772A run 30 mins apart in the dinner hour with 13 & 26 seats taken. On the return UA ran 3 redeyes LAX-EWR 1 wide and 2 narrows with 50, 30 and 15 passengers.
Pretty close to the same on EWR-SFO-EWR, with 2 redeyes east and 2 light trips westbound at 6pm and 8pm.
I can't see why one narrowbody RT wasn't cxld in each market.


I get what you are saying canceling a narrowbody roundtrip and put those people on a widebody. United could do that but one thing we are hearing from flight attendants and customer service agents is social distance adherence guidelines on aircraft. While there are no official guidelines UA is saying if a customer request to be moved into a different seat the customer service agents comply. We do have gate agents asking if they have a narrowbody with only 25 people on board can they just move people themselves in SHARES into different seats to keep that social distance. So far UA's position has been for the agents to use their best judgement and if a customer asks to be place back into their original seat just move them back. We also a few days ago on UA2 SIN-SFO had a situation arise where there were only 28 seats booked in business class and over 120 people booked in coach. Originally there were no upgrades so SIN C.S. spaced out the passengers in business class and did the best they could to space customers out in coach. However that all changed once the flight opened to check-in at the airport 15 passengers wanted to either use their miles or pay cash for the upgrade into business class. The question was can we sell those seats? United position was do not give the seats away for free people know the risk if they want to pay to sit in close proximity to someone for 15 hours then sell the seat.

In conversations with my bosses yesterday they fully expect the industry to change as a result of COVID-19, just like the industry changed as a result of 9/11. Right now the government is saying social distance but are airline to enforce that policy, so far I'm being told we can't get an answer to that question from the FAA, DOT, or Trump Administration. My bosses are telling me that UA already has teams putting together scenarios that will cover any policy changes that come about as a result of COVID-19. From best case scenarios to worse case scenarios. Some experts on Trumps coronavirus task force are now saying COVID-19 might become a seasonal thing where we see cases drop but then rise again in November and December. United has teams looking at how this will impact the airline, will we need to remove rows of seats from aircraft? Will we need to block middle seats and only have passengers seated in window and aisle seats? Airlines know the cabin filtration system can remove COVID-19 from the air as the air is recycled. But how does an airline protect a passengers from the passenger seated next to them. For example a passenger seated in row 7A and 7C, that air hasn't had a chance to be recycled, how do protect passengers onboard? Will airlines be required to protect passengers onboard, will we in the very near future be required to take every passengers temperature before they board a flight? It was such an incredible conversation I had with with my boss yesterday just to get an insight into what UA is thinking the future of this industry will be and the changes COVID-19 will have going forward.

DL stated they will be a much smaller airline coming out of this I think a lot people took that to mean less flights, but what if in addition to less flights it also means less people on each airplane? UA like I said has teams of people (working remotely) working on this because we know (or at the very least we expect) there will be changes once the pandemic portion of this virus is over. COVID-19 is here and even with a vaccine my bosses are saying they are being told COVID-19 is probably here to stay even once a vaccine is widely available. So how do you protect customers and employees on an aircraft in the future?


If part of the solution to protect passengers is to remove seats or block seats on aircraft what impact will that have the ticket prices?


I was talking to a good friend of mine who is a nurse at a large University Research hospital this past Friday. She told me that so far, there has been no reports indicating that the approximately 8 COVID-19 strains of CoronaVirus have mutated thus far. After doing some independent research, it appears that COVID-19 is “mutating” so slowly that all 8 strains are still nearly identical.

If this remains the case, while seemingly unlikely, this could be a one-and-done event. As the infected population recovers, their bodies will produce antibodies to fight the strains of the virus they’ve come in contact with. Because the different strains are still so similar the antibodies may be effective against all known strains.

Moreover, it seems like if the virus strains don’t drastically mutate prior to a vaccine becoming available, the immunity provided by it may be lasting, unlike the influenza virus which mutates pretty rabidly.

77H
 
77H
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Mar 29, 2020 7:37 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
Jay, that makes perfect sense. The 767 floor issues and lack of taking normal pallets or LD3s width-wise is the problem. However, if using narrower LD2 containers (25% less space than an LD3), the 767 can pair those units for decent cubic footage, but isn't standard for many shippers.
For what it takes, here's the volume of total LD2 and LD3 spaces on below aircraft. Does not include bulk bins or floor weight issues:
763 30 LD2s 3,720 CF
788 28 LD3s 4,452 CF
764 38 LD2s 4,712 CF
772 32 LD3s 5,088 CF
789 36 LD3s 5,724 CF
78X 40 LD3s 5,360 CF
77W 44 LD3s 6,996 CF


At the risk of sounding pedantic, about ~18 or so of the PW 77E’s only have 28 positions. The 77U subfleet according to your UA Fleet page.

Excellent work on that by the way.

77H
 
CriticalPoint
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Mar 29, 2020 8:16 pm

calpsafltskeds wrote:
More stored aircraft.
All 764s appear are parked or stored. 9 in ROW.
Many 763s in IAH, plus 4 in ROW storage
10 772s in ROW storage
9 of 10 752PWs in ROW storage. N596UA been in SFO since 3/21
Parking locations: SFO, ORD, DEN, IAH, IAD, EWR, MCO, GUM, HNL, MSY, MIA, TPA, SAT, CLE, AUS, BOX, FLL, LAS, LGA, PDX
Storage/maint: ROW, GYR, INT, DLH, LCQ, ILN, HKG, XMN, VCV


Looking through the pilot pairings there are ZERO scheduled 764 flights in The month of April.
 
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Amwest2United
Posts: 283
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Mar 29, 2020 9:39 pm

77H wrote:
calpsafltskeds wrote:
Jay, that makes perfect sense. The 767 floor issues and lack of taking normal pallets or LD3s width-wise is the problem. However, if using narrower LD2 containers (25% less space than an LD3), the 767 can pair those units for decent cubic footage, but isn't standard for many shippers.
For what it takes, here's the volume of total LD2 and LD3 spaces on below aircraft. Does not include bulk bins or floor weight issues:
763 30 LD2s 3,720 CF
788 28 LD3s 4,452 CF
764 38 LD2s 4,712 CF
772 32 LD3s 5,088 CF
789 36 LD3s 5,724 CF
78X 40 LD3s 5,360 CF
77W 44 LD3s 6,996 CF


At the risk of sounding pedantic, about ~18 or so of the PW 77E’s only have 28 positions. The 77U subfleet according to your UA Fleet page.

Excellent work on that by the way.

77H


Lower Bunk Crew Rest takes up the additional positions
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