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GmoneyCO
Posts: 163
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2017 4:42 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Apr 11, 2020 6:14 pm

jayunited wrote:
calpsafltskeds wrote:
jay, that's a great rundown of the situation with light loads on a long haul. I just wonder how other flights UA has flown in and out of Mod or maint in HKG or XMN are handled. I know UA tries to make a swap in Asia to a regular flight to minimize long ferries, but tracking the fleet for a few years, there have been lots of ferries in and out of mod that have flown to/from as far as ORD, IAH or EWR. Do these ferries have to take ballast in the back bins? Maybe the lack of any load reduces the fuel requirement? Or, maybe cargo is loaded since there's always a lot coming out of Asia, but westbounds should be more critical with longer flight times and probably little cargo demand.


UA does not operated scheduled or charter service out of XMN, there are times when ballast is necessary if that is case what UA has done in the past is send an empty pallet stack. Also for aircraft going to/from XMN for Polaris/PE modification if the aircraft is nose heavy load planners can ask the dispatcher to lower the fuel. If that doesn't work or the dispatcher says no what UA has done is fill up the potable water tanks to 100%, we are talking about 270 gallons and those tanks are located behind the wings which helps the tail weight. If after all of this we still need weight then empty pallet stacks are loaded. Since you have worked the ramp you know what pallet stacks are and depending on how many boards are stacked they can be quite heavy.

Having said that and keeping in line with the cargo theme Kirby today on a call talked about the fact that the recovery will take much longer than anyone anticipated. With that in mind UA will not need as many widebodies in passenger revenue service. So far there is still no public talk of mass retirements (although they maybe discussing it privately) what this call focused on was cargo. Right now because of reduced passengers service and the fact that cargo carriers can not keep up with demand, shipping prices are sky high and Kirby wants a bigger piece of the profits. What Kirby has tasked our engineering team and our weight and balance team with is to come up with solutions for how UA could load cargo above the wing. Now before I go further let me say this UA is not interested in permanent conversions and there are no plans at this time to launch a dedicated cargo fleet. What Kirby wants to know is how UA can carry cargo above the wing with the seats installed and/or with the seats removed. Keep in mind the floor of a passengers jet is not reinforced like a cargo jet. Also before this can go forward how to accurately account for the placement of the weight above the wing using our current weight and balance system (if our weight and balance system can be modified at all). Lastly how would cargo be 100% secured above the wing with the seats installed and without the seats installed.

Again this was just brought up today and UA is simply exploring the idea of temporarily loading cargo above the wing no final decision has been made one way or the other. In the interim what we do know is this UA will not need 190+ widebodies in passenger service once the pandemic part of this crisis is over. We also know that after 2020 UA has no additional widebody deliveries on the books until the A359 order in 2027 which presents challenges. As far as widebody retirements go I get the feeling UA might retire a small portion of the fleet, but place a larger portion of the widebody fleet into long term storage. I think Kirby is hesitant to discuss retirements publicly because if UA retires a significant portion of our widebody fleet and the recovery really starts to take off in 2022 UA could once again find itself at a real disadvantage seeing that we have no future widebody deliveries scheduled until 2027.


Jay,

This article may prove of interest on how the Lufthansa group is handling cargo in the passenger cabin: https://www.aircargonews.net/airlines/airlines-fill-passenger-seats-with-cargo-to-meet-demand/. I imagine it would be limited to pretty light things like masks, gowns, and other PPE which could be stuffed in the bins and secured in the seats with the heavy cargo below the floor.
 
codc10
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Apr 11, 2020 6:23 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
Looks like UA moved EWR - Asia flights up to resuming May 21st. Seems that Europe begins in waves starting in May.


I am not optimistic about the widespread resumption of service on 5/20. I don't think United has gotten that far along in its planning.
 
LGeneReese
Posts: 246
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Apr 11, 2020 7:22 pm

78J
N13013 Delivery UA2705 CHSIAD 11APR
 
x1234
Posts: 916
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Apr 11, 2020 7:59 pm

The GOOD news is that mods are at an accelerated pace and there will be Polaris on every 777 come summer.
 
United1
Posts: 4185
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Apr 11, 2020 9:13 pm

x1234 wrote:
The GOOD news is that mods are at an accelerated pace and there will be Polaris on every 777 come summer.


Which bodes well for keeping the 777s around...
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
friendlyskies22
Posts: 101
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2016 4:58 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Apr 11, 2020 10:22 pm

x1234..."every 777 Polaris"....except the 20 domestic birds and the yet to be converted (maybe) 3 ER birds.
.
attention UA pilots flying ferries to ROW: any chance of getting a picture of the parked aircraft
(maybe on your fly-out deadhead?) Please post...don't see any pix in the local paper... Thanks!!
 
Scarebus34
Posts: 529
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:54 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Apr 11, 2020 10:25 pm

codc10 wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
Looks like UA moved EWR - Asia flights up to resuming May 21st. Seems that Europe begins in waves starting in May.


I am not optimistic about the widespread resumption of service on 5/20. I don't think United has gotten that far along in its planning.

They will be doing the schedule changes in batches over the coming weeks as to not overwhelm the system by doing it all at once. As of now - the planned international schedule for 5/4-5/19 is as follows:

ORD-LHR daily
EWR-AMS/FRA/LHR/TLV daily
IAD-FRA daily

SFO-SYD/NRT daily

IAH-CUN/MEX 2X daily
IAH-GDL/BJX/SJD/MTY/PVR daily
SFO-MEX daily

IAH-STT saturday only
EWR-BQN/AUA/MBJ/NAS/PUJ/SDQ/SJU/ daily
EWR-STT saturday only
IAD-STT saturday only

IAH-BZE/GUA/PTY/SJO/SAL/TGU daily
EWR-PTY daily

IAH-EZE 3x weekly
IAH-GRU/GIG daily

The schedule will be extended in waves as United is trying to remain as flexible as possible.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Apr 11, 2020 10:50 pm

78X #13, N13013 is a real beauty! 
Nice video of IAD arrival on Twitter #aircraftdelivery
 
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KLMatSJC
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Apr 11, 2020 10:52 pm

friendlyskies22 wrote:
Re: N777UA, YES, it belongs in a United Museum. #1 delivered 5/1995. (Pima already has a CX 777)

That is the first 777 off the line. I don't think they'd want another.
A318/19/20/21/21N A332/3 A343/5 A388 B712 B722 B732/3/4/7/8/9/9ER B744/4M B752/3 B762ER/3/3ER/4ER B772/E/L/W B788 CRJ2/7/9 Q400 EMB-120 ERJ-135/140/145/145XR/175 DC-10-10 MD-82/83/88/90

Long Live the Tulip, Cactus, and Redwood
 
avi8
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 12:19 am

Scarebus34 wrote:
codc10 wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
Looks like UA moved EWR - Asia flights up to resuming May 21st. Seems that Europe begins in waves starting in May.


I am not optimistic about the widespread resumption of service on 5/20. I don't think United has gotten that far along in its planning.

They will be doing the schedule changes in batches over the coming weeks as to not overwhelm the system by doing it all at once. As of now - the planned international schedule for 5/4-5/19 is as follows:

ORD-LHR daily
EWR-AMS/FRA/LHR/TLV daily
IAD-FRA daily

SFO-SYD/NRT daily

IAH-CUN/MEX 2X daily
IAH-GDL/BJX/SJD/MTY/PVR daily
SFO-MEX daily

IAH-STT saturday only
EWR-BQN/AUA/MBJ/NAS/PUJ/SDQ/SJU/ daily
EWR-STT saturday only
IAD-STT saturday only

IAH-BZE/GUA/PTY/SJO/SAL/TGU daily
EWR-PTY daily

IAH-EZE 3x weekly
IAH-GRU/GIG daily

The schedule will be extended in waves as United is trying to remain as flexible as possible.


This just proves the importance of the IAH hub. It's going to be the largest hub during the initial phase. The number of Latin American destinations it serves is impressive.
avi8
 
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AVENSAB727
Posts: 1397
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 12:38 am

avi8 wrote:
Scarebus34 wrote:
codc10 wrote:

I am not optimistic about the widespread resumption of service on 5/20. I don't think United has gotten that far along in its planning.

They will be doing the schedule changes in batches over the coming weeks as to not overwhelm the system by doing it all at once. As of now - the planned international schedule for 5/4-5/19 is as follows:

ORD-LHR daily
EWR-AMS/FRA/LHR/TLV daily
IAD-FRA daily

SFO-SYD/NRT daily

IAH-CUN/MEX 2X daily
IAH-GDL/BJX/SJD/MTY/PVR daily
SFO-MEX daily

IAH-STT saturday only
EWR-BQN/AUA/MBJ/NAS/PUJ/SDQ/SJU/ daily
EWR-STT saturday only
IAD-STT saturday only

IAH-BZE/GUA/PTY/SJO/SAL/TGU daily
EWR-PTY daily

IAH-EZE 3x weekly
IAH-GRU/GIG daily

The schedule will be extended in waves as United is trying to remain as flexible as possible.


This just proves the importance of the IAH hub. It's going to be the largest hub during the initial phase. The number of Latin American destinations it serves is impressive.

Good new, this sure is a boost for IAH that is surely needed.
Always look on the bright side of Life!
 
tphuang
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:12 am

Scarebus34 wrote:
codc10 wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
Looks like UA moved EWR - Asia flights up to resuming May 21st. Seems that Europe begins in waves starting in May.


I am not optimistic about the widespread resumption of service on 5/20. I don't think United has gotten that far along in its planning.

They will be doing the schedule changes in batches over the coming weeks as to not overwhelm the system by doing it all at once. As of now - the planned international schedule for 5/4-5/19 is as follows:

ORD-LHR daily
EWR-AMS/FRA/LHR/TLV daily
IAD-FRA daily

SFO-SYD/NRT daily

IAH-CUN/MEX 2X daily
IAH-GDL/BJX/SJD/MTY/PVR daily
SFO-MEX daily

IAH-STT saturday only
EWR-BQN/AUA/MBJ/NAS/PUJ/SDQ/SJU/ daily
EWR-STT saturday only
IAD-STT saturday only

IAH-BZE/GUA/PTY/SJO/SAL/TGU daily
EWR-PTY daily

IAH-EZE 3x weekly
IAH-GRU/GIG daily

The schedule will be extended in waves as United is trying to remain as flexible as possible.

Are the European stuff supported by cargo? That seems to be insanely high amount of capacity for Latin America. Especially the stuff out of ewr.
 
United1
Posts: 4185
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 9:21 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:29 am

tphuang wrote:
Scarebus34 wrote:
codc10 wrote:

I am not optimistic about the widespread resumption of service on 5/20. I don't think United has gotten that far along in its planning.

They will be doing the schedule changes in batches over the coming weeks as to not overwhelm the system by doing it all at once. As of now - the planned international schedule for 5/4-5/19 is as follows:

ORD-LHR daily
EWR-AMS/FRA/LHR/TLV daily
IAD-FRA daily

SFO-SYD/NRT daily

IAH-CUN/MEX 2X daily
IAH-GDL/BJX/SJD/MTY/PVR daily
SFO-MEX daily

IAH-STT saturday only
EWR-BQN/AUA/MBJ/NAS/PUJ/SDQ/SJU/ daily
EWR-STT saturday only
IAD-STT saturday only

IAH-BZE/GUA/PTY/SJO/SAL/TGU daily
EWR-PTY daily

IAH-EZE 3x weekly
IAH-GRU/GIG daily

The schedule will be extended in waves as United is trying to remain as flexible as possible.

Are the European stuff supported by cargo? That seems to be insanely high amount of capacity for Latin America. Especially the stuff out of ewr.


All of the routes, except to PTY, out of EWR are to the Caribbean and are traditionally high VFR routes. UA should be able to fill those flights fairly easily.

UA is flying 50 or so all cargo routes right now including ORD-LHR, IAD-FRA and EWR-AMS all of which will start carrying passengers as well come May.
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
tphuang
Posts: 5328
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:43 am

United1 wrote:
tphuang wrote:
Scarebus34 wrote:
They will be doing the schedule changes in batches over the coming weeks as to not overwhelm the system by doing it all at once. As of now - the planned international schedule for 5/4-5/19 is as follows:

ORD-LHR daily
EWR-AMS/FRA/LHR/TLV daily
IAD-FRA daily

SFO-SYD/NRT daily

IAH-CUN/MEX 2X daily
IAH-GDL/BJX/SJD/MTY/PVR daily
SFO-MEX daily

IAH-STT saturday only
EWR-BQN/AUA/MBJ/NAS/PUJ/SDQ/SJU/ daily
EWR-STT saturday only
IAD-STT saturday only

IAH-BZE/GUA/PTY/SJO/SAL/TGU daily
EWR-PTY daily

IAH-EZE 3x weekly
IAH-GRU/GIG daily

The schedule will be extended in waves as United is trying to remain as flexible as possible.

Are the European stuff supported by cargo? That seems to be insanely high amount of capacity for Latin America. Especially the stuff out of ewr.


All of the routes, except to PTY, out of EWR are to the Caribbean and are traditionally high VFR routes. UA should be able to fill those flights fairly easily.

UA is flying 50 or so all cargo routes right now including ORD-LHR, IAD-FRA and EWR-AMS all of which will start carrying passengers as well come May.

Yes, but a lot of these borders are still closed and it's unclear how long the closures will be extended.

At this point, Puerto Rico is still only allowing people to come into sju and none of the other airports.

And I live not far from Newark airport. It's horrible out here. Who in their right mind wants to fly here in 3 weeks. The shelter at home orders aren't going away anytime soon in new Jersey.
 
United1
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:49 am

tphuang wrote:
United1 wrote:
tphuang wrote:
Are the European stuff supported by cargo? That seems to be insanely high amount of capacity for Latin America. Especially the stuff out of ewr.


All of the routes, except to PTY, out of EWR are to the Caribbean and are traditionally high VFR routes. UA should be able to fill those flights fairly easily.

UA is flying 50 or so all cargo routes right now including ORD-LHR, IAD-FRA and EWR-AMS all of which will start carrying passengers as well come May.

Yes, but a lot of these borders are still closed and it's unclear how long the closures will be extended.

At this point, Puerto Rico is still only allowing people to come into sju and none of the other airports.

And I live not far from Newark airport. It's horrible out here. Who in their right mind wants to fly here in 3 weeks. The shelter at home orders aren't going away anytime soon in new Jersey.


You are right the shelter in place orders are not going away anytime soon in NJ (or out here in CA either.) UA must be seeing enough demand in bookings if they are willing to re-instate the flights. Except for SJU those are probably 737 flights so they can take a little cargo but not much.
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
gwrudolph
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:51 am

KLMatSJC wrote:
friendlyskies22 wrote:
Re: N777UA, YES, it belongs in a United Museum. #1 delivered 5/1995. (Pima already has a CX 777)

That is the first 777 off the line. I don't think they'd want another.


Actually, N777UA isn’t the first 777 off the line. It is the first in revenue service.
 
UAinAUS
Posts: 229
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 2:43 am

UAX Update:

Update on Parked 50-seat Fleet:

Entire AX Fleet of ERJ-145 and ERJ-145XR have been parked. The 36 XR's will transfer slowly to ExpressJet, and the remaining 10 frames (HK tails) will be stored. For all remaining fleets, the parked aircraft are listed below. All other units are either flying currently or in for routine maintenance. Of note, Air Wisconsin is using all frames and rotating them through their maintenance hubs for extended periods of "rest".

EV E45:
TYS: 535, 555, 560, 569, 570, 902, 905, 976, 977, 988
CLE: 537, 538, 540, 542, 545, 546, 548, 553, 556, 558, 564, 568, 573, 904, 908, 909, 910, 911, 915, 916, 980, 991
IAH: 574, 575, 901, 986

EV E45XR:
TYS: 105, 108, 109, 110, 180
IAH: 135, 159
CLE: 167, 170

C5 E45XR:
ALB: 139, 143, 147, 152, 154, 157, 160, 161, 162, 172, 173, 174, 175, 178, 181, 182, 186, 187, 190, 191, 193, 194, 197, 199, 202, 204

OO CR2:
TUS: 464, 472, 479, 652, 881, 941, 955, 980, 983, 987
FWA: 431, 701, 856, 857, 929EV, 951
FAT: 435, 862, 868, 877, 903EV, 903SW, 909EV, 909SW, 918, 930, 970

ZW CR2: all flying
 
Scarebus34
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 4:51 am

UAinAUS wrote:
UAX Update:

Update on Parked 50-seat Fleet:

Entire AX Fleet of ERJ-145 and ERJ-145XR have been parked. The 36 XR's will transfer slowly to ExpressJet, and the remaining 10 frames (HK tails) will be stored. For all remaining fleets, the parked aircraft are listed below. All other units are either flying currently or in for routine maintenance. Of note, Air Wisconsin is using all frames and rotating them through their maintenance hubs for extended periods of "rest".

EV E45:
TYS: 535, 555, 560, 569, 570, 902, 905, 976, 977, 988
CLE: 537, 538, 540, 542, 545, 546, 548, 553, 556, 558, 564, 568, 573, 904, 908, 909, 910, 911, 915, 916, 980, 991
IAH: 574, 575, 901, 986

EV E45XR:
TYS: 105, 108, 109, 110, 180
IAH: 135, 159
CLE: 167, 170

C5 E45XR:
ALB: 139, 143, 147, 152, 154, 157, 160, 161, 162, 172, 173, 174, 175, 178, 181, 182, 186, 187, 190, 191, 193, 194, 197, 199, 202, 204

OO CR2:
TUS: 464, 472, 479, 652, 881, 941, 955, 980, 983, 987
FWA: 431, 701, 856, 857, 929EV, 951
FAT: 435, 862, 868, 877, 903EV, 903SW, 909EV, 909SW, 918, 930, 970

ZW CR2: all flying


With the 50 seaters more than likely going away - I assume all that we'll be left with in the interim are the E45XRs... I would suspect all the parked CR2s and non XRs won't be brought back into service. I would also suspect that as the 50-seaters are removed, ZW will slowly wind down operations.
 
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KLMatSJC
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 10:04 am

gwrudolph wrote:
KLMatSJC wrote:
friendlyskies22 wrote:
Re: N777UA, YES, it belongs in a United Museum. #1 delivered 5/1995. (Pima already has a CX 777)

That is the first 777 off the line. I don't think they'd want another.


Actually, N777UA isn’t the first 777 off the line. It is the first in revenue service.

Yeah, sorry. I was referring to the CX bird. That one was the first off the line.
A318/19/20/21/21N A332/3 A343/5 A388 B712 B722 B732/3/4/7/8/9/9ER B744/4M B752/3 B762ER/3/3ER/4ER B772/E/L/W B788 CRJ2/7/9 Q400 EMB-120 ERJ-135/140/145/145XR/175 DC-10-10 MD-82/83/88/90

Long Live the Tulip, Cactus, and Redwood
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 3:04 pm

x1234 wrote:
The GOOD news is that mods are at an accelerated pace and there will be Polaris on every 777 come summer.


They are not taking place at an accelerated pace the 77Es Polaris/PE modifications are on the same schedule they were on before COVID-19. Prior to COVID-19 all 77Es minus the 4 being converted to domestic HD were schedule to be completed by June. The reason the 77E line continues is because (and Kirby stated this in the first town hall on COVID-19 back in February) UA has already spent the money. Everything from the seats to our labor cost at both XMN and HKG had already been paid for hence Polaris/PE installations continues. I believe this is also true for the 763 fleet.

I know UA had a really aggressive schedule planned for our 788 fleet that fleet was supposed to be completed by early summer. Right now only one 788 is in modification while the remainder of the fleet is stored. If UA has already paid to have the remaining 8 frames go through mods then when N29907 is ready perhaps another 788 will take its place.

In my opinion Polaris/PE installation will continue until UA has to write the next check covering everything from the seats, to labor cost. In my opinion depending on how long the recovery takes I think the 764s, and a majority of the 789s will keep their diamond seats for much of 2021. The only way I see the 764s going into modification early is if UA decided to retire some of our oldest 763s. Those Polaris seats can be taken off those 763s and installed on the 764 fleet.
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 3:47 pm

13 TATL routes cut from EWR and plenty more from the other hubs. How many can we expect to return in 2021?
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 4:38 pm

Thanks, Jay,
HKG has dropped from a total at one point of 7 total mod lines to 3 772GE mod lines when N76021 departs in under 24 hours. I wonder if that means the 3 remaining in mod will be finished quicker, understanding that usually heavy maint is done at the same time - not that they are needed at this time.
The last remaining 772 to receive Polaris mod, N77014, parked in IAH, has not made its way to HKG, so to that extent program completion has been delayed. Of course there are plenty of Polaris 772s to re-start service, so no big deal.
UA has an obviously different take on the mostly older 763 fleet, as N674UA, one of the newest 763s was pulled out of HKG 6 or 7 days after arriving for High J Polaris. N652UA was undoubtedly too far into the Polaris process to shut that conversion down.

XMN at one point had 5 total mod lines with currently only 3 in use with 1 each of 772PW, 788 and 789. If UA has pre-paid for 788 or 789 mods shouldn't these 2 mod lines be filled so that when things get back to near normal, UA would have more Polaris units available? Of course there may be more issues in China due to the coronavirus or maybe UA will keep the 788 fleet stored for a while after re-start.
 
GmoneyCO
Posts: 163
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 4:46 pm

319:
N872UA - Delivered to UA on 11-Mar. The aircraft is currently in XMN, it was flown there by China Southern pilots instead of UA pilots due to COVID.

739:
N61887 - Confirmed with ViaSat wifi system
N69888 - Confirmed with ViaSat wifi system

752:
N13110 - Looks to have completed the mod work due to test flight on 11-Apr. Unknown if it will actually exit soon or if it will be parked at SAT until normal operations begin to pick back up

753:
N75854 - Confirmed with Thales KA band wifi. (Currently listed as a question on the Fleet site)

772:
N76021 - Scheduled to exit HKG on 13-Apr/2796
 
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LAXintl
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 3:09 pm

United seeks exemptions under CARES Act to drop service to following markets.

Fairbanks (FAI)
Hilton Head (HHH)
Myrtle Beach (MYR)
Sun Valley (SUN)
San Juan (SJU)
Aguadilla (BQN)
Saint Thomas (STT)
Hilo (ITO)
Kona (KOA)
Lihue (LIH)
Kahului (OGG)
Saipan (SPN)
Green Bay(GRB)
Gunnison(GUC)
Ithaca (ITH)
Kalamazoo (AZO)
Santa Fe (SAF)
Valparaiso (VPS)
Nantucket(ACK)

OST-2020-0037
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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chepos
Posts: 7273
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 3:18 pm

LAXintl wrote:
United seeks exemptions under CARES Act to drop service to following markets.

Fairbanks (FAI)
Hilton Head (HHH)
Myrtle Beach (MYR)
Sun Valley (SUN)
San Juan (SJU)
Aguadilla (BQN)
Saint Thomas (STT)
Hilo (ITO)
Kona (KOA)
Lihue (LIH)
Kahului (OGG)
Saipan (SPN)
Green Bay(GRB)
Gunnison(GUC)
Ithaca (ITH)
Kalamazoo (AZO)
Santa Fe (SAF)
Valparaiso (VPS)
Nantucket(ACK)

OST-2020-0037

SJU????? UA said this was going to resume in early May. BQN is understandable, airport is not accepting passenger arrivals from the mainland, but SJU?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Fly the Flag!!!!
 
tphuang
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 4:05 pm

If UA is requesting to exempt SJU, why are they still scheduling in to all these other non-domestic Caribbean VFR markets? It makes no sense to me.
 
United1
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 4:12 pm

chepos wrote:
LAXintl wrote:
United seeks exemptions under CARES Act to drop service to following markets.

Fairbanks (FAI)
Hilton Head (HHH)
Myrtle Beach (MYR)
Sun Valley (SUN)
San Juan (SJU)
Aguadilla (BQN)
Saint Thomas (STT)
Hilo (ITO)
Kona (KOA)
Lihue (LIH)
Kahului (OGG)
Saipan (SPN)
Green Bay(GRB)
Gunnison(GUC)
Ithaca (ITH)
Kalamazoo (AZO)
Santa Fe (SAF)
Valparaiso (VPS)
Nantucket(ACK)

OST-2020-0037

SJU????? UA said this was going to resume in early May. BQN is understandable, airport is not accepting passenger arrivals from the mainland, but SJU?


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From the show cause order:

"Nonetheless, United plans to resume service to San Juan on May 6 and to Aguadilla and Saint Thomas on July 6, and requests relief from the
Department only to the extent necessary to temporarily suspend service until those dates."
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
United1
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 4:24 pm

Some of the exemptions UA asked for are temporary....ie we need to stop service now but will either restart or look at restarting in a few weeks/months.

Fairbanks (FAI) - Resumes July 6th
Hilton Head (HHH) - Resumes July 6th
Myrtle Beach (MYR) - Resumes July 6th
Sun Valley (SUN) - Resumes July 6th
San Juan (SJU) - Resumes May 6th
Aguadilla (BQN) - Resumes July 6th
Saint Thomas (STT) - Resumes July 6th
Hilo (ITO) - Suspended - Passengers will be reaccommodated on intra-Hawaii flights
Kona (KOA) - Suspended - Passengers will be reaccommodated on intra-Hawaii flights
Lihue (LIH) - Suspended - Passengers will be reaccommodated on intra-Hawaii flights
Kahului (OGG) - Suspended - Passengers will be reaccommodated on intra-Hawaii flights
Saipan (SPN) - Will look at resuming service after May 2nd
Green Bay(GRB) - Will look at resuming service after July 6th
Gunnison(GUC) - Will look at resuming service after July 6th
Ithaca (ITH) - Will look at resuming service after July 6th
Kalamazoo (AZO) - Will look at resuming service after July 6th
Santa Fe (SAF) - Will look at resuming service after July 6th
Valparaiso (VPS) - Will look at resuming service after July 6th
Nantucket(ACK) - Suspended for this season
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
codc10
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 4:36 pm

The Hawaii service suspensions are through 9/30, which is pretty remarkable. It's going to be a brutal summer for United, with essentially the entire leisure components of EU and Hawaii up in smoke.
 
FlyPNS1
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 5:28 pm

Interesting they want to can VPS temporarily, though I guess the traffic is almost all leisure and they could still carry passengers from PNS/ECP.
 
sdh9
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 5:51 pm

tphuang wrote:
If UA is requesting to exempt SJU, why are they still scheduling in to all these other non-domestic Caribbean VFR markets? It makes no sense to me.


Pretty sure the government only cares about US markets.
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 8:13 pm

The fleet changes, fleet status, and repaint status posts at the start of this thread have been updated.

There is also a post dedicated to keeping track of stored mainline aircraft.

✈️ atcsundevil
 
FSDan
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 8:39 pm

FlyPNS1 wrote:
Interesting they want to can VPS temporarily, though I guess the traffic is almost all leisure and they could still carry passengers from PNS/ECP.


I suspect it's the proximity of the other two airports that is the primary factor (similar to how they want to drop GRB, with ATW nearby). FWIW, I believe VPS has a decent amount of military and defense-related traffic due to Elgin AFB. I'd be a little surprised if VPS had a higher proportion of leisure traffic than ECP...
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
United1
Posts: 4185
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 9:21 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 8:45 pm

sdh9 wrote:
tphuang wrote:
If UA is requesting to exempt SJU, why are they still scheduling in to all these other non-domestic Caribbean VFR markets? It makes no sense to me.


Pretty sure the government only cares about US markets.


The service requirements only apply to US States and Territories.

Regarding SJU the exemption is only until May 6th when UA planned on restarting service. Otherwise UA would have to restart service prior to that date (whenever it accepted the terms of the grant from the US Government.) May 6th is in line with the rest of the Caribbean service they announced.

SPN service was shut down due to a specific and direct request from the Governor of that US Commonwealth. UA plans on restoring service on May 2nd barring another request. Again without making the request UA would have to restart service immediately..something the island and UA do not want.

Service to Hawaii outside of HNL is being suspended for a couple of reasons. One is holiday traffic has follow off a cliff edge and the flights would be mostly empty. Second is the Governor of Hawaii is actively suppressing tourism right now until the Pandemic is over or at least under control. The suspension of service is supported by him and the state until the 14 day quarantine period imposed on anyone coming to or traveling around the islands has been removed. UA could restart service prior to September but like everything right now flexibility is key.
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 8:46 pm

FSDan wrote:
FlyPNS1 wrote:
Interesting they want to can VPS temporarily, though I guess the traffic is almost all leisure and they could still carry passengers from PNS/ECP.


I suspect it's the proximity of the other two airports that is the primary factor (similar to how they want to drop GRB, with ATW nearby). FWIW, I believe VPS has a decent amount of military and defense-related traffic due to Elgin AFB. I'd be a little surprised if VPS had a higher proportion of leisure traffic than ECP...

VPS is an Allegiant focus city. I don't have numbers, but I'm willing to bet that the amount of leisure traffic is at least comparable to ECP. UA has just never had much of a presence at VPS. In the off season, there are at best two daily E145s to IAH. In the summer it's maybe 3-4x daily. The seasonal flights to ORD/DEN are pretty new. Delta has always been the dominant carrier at VPS going back to the Northwest days, then American/US Airways. That pretty much leaves UA as the weakest carrier at VPS, and it's always been that way.

A good chunk of the traffic comes from Eglin AFB and Hurlburt Field (AFSOC headquarters), but most of it is leisure traffic for Destin.
 
jayunited
Posts: 2961
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:03 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 8:46 pm

codc10 wrote:
The Hawaii service suspensions are through 9/30, which is pretty remarkable. It's going to be a brutal summer for United, with essentially the entire leisure components of EU and Hawaii up in smoke.



I think the Hawaii service exemptions because of the required 14 day quarantine imposed on all passengers arriving in Hawaii. In fact just a few days ago the State of Hawaii put out a press release asking all tourist to reschedule their vacations for a later date. Since we don't know when the mandatory 14 day quarantine for all arriving passengers will end its just better to suspend everything except HNL, and even HNL is down to just SFO.

The constitution gives governors a tremendous amount of power over their own individual states. Even if the President wants to "open" things up in May the governor of Hawaii can keep the state essentially shut down and maintain the quarantine until the experts and data for the state of Hawaii deem it's safe to lift the quarantine. Perhaps UA has come across some information or been given information from Hawaii officials that have led them to believe Hawaii's mandatory 14 day quarantine will remain in place for some time to come. It is better to apply for the exemption and resume the service earlier than expected than to not apply and then be forced to fly what would amount to empty airplanes.
 
tphuang
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 9:25 pm

United1 wrote:
sdh9 wrote:
tphuang wrote:
If UA is requesting to exempt SJU, why are they still scheduling in to all these other non-domestic Caribbean VFR markets? It makes no sense to me.


Pretty sure the government only cares about US markets.


The service requirements only apply to US States and Territories.

Regarding SJU the exemption is only until May 6th when UA planned on restarting service. Otherwise UA would have to restart service prior to that date (whenever it accepted the terms of the grant from the US Government.) May 6th is in line with the rest of the Caribbean service they announced.

SPN service was shut down due to a specific and direct request from the Governor of that US Commonwealth. UA plans on restoring service on May 2nd barring another request. Again without making the request UA would have to restart service immediately..something the island and UA do not want.

Service to Hawaii outside of HNL is being suspended for a couple of reasons. One is holiday traffic has follow off a cliff edge and the flights would be mostly empty. Second is the Governor of Hawaii is actively suppressing tourism right now until the Pandemic is over or at least under control. The suspension of service is supported by him and the state until the 14 day quarantine period imposed on anyone coming to or traveling around the islands has been removed. UA could restart service prior to September but like everything right now flexibility is key.


Have there been info that a lot of these travel restrictions to the islands are going to get completely lifted? I'm not sure what is special about May 6th? There will still be a lot of coronavirus cases in NY/NJ area at that time.
 
United1
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 13, 2020 11:57 pm

tphuang wrote:
United1 wrote:
sdh9 wrote:

Pretty sure the government only cares about US markets.


The service requirements only apply to US States and Territories.

Regarding SJU the exemption is only until May 6th when UA planned on restarting service. Otherwise UA would have to restart service prior to that date (whenever it accepted the terms of the grant from the US Government.) May 6th is in line with the rest of the Caribbean service they announced.

SPN service was shut down due to a specific and direct request from the Governor of that US Commonwealth. UA plans on restoring service on May 2nd barring another request. Again without making the request UA would have to restart service immediately..something the island and UA do not want.

Service to Hawaii outside of HNL is being suspended for a couple of reasons. One is holiday traffic has follow off a cliff edge and the flights would be mostly empty. Second is the Governor of Hawaii is actively suppressing tourism right now until the Pandemic is over or at least under control. The suspension of service is supported by him and the state until the 14 day quarantine period imposed on anyone coming to or traveling around the islands has been removed. UA could restart service prior to September but like everything right now flexibility is key.


Have there been info that a lot of these travel restrictions to the islands are going to get completely lifted? I'm not sure what is special about May 6th? There will still be a lot of coronavirus cases in NY/NJ area at that time.


Perhaps UA knows something we don't know but I haven't heard anything. NY/NJ and four of the other NE states started discussing a gradual re-opening and what hinted at what that would look like but I didn't hear dates. Same on the west coast, CA/OR/WA are coordinating a gradual re-opening and Gov Newson is supposed to outline that to us in CA tomorrow but I doubt if dates are going to be involved. More likely gatekeepers and milestones that will cause X to happen or Y to occur.
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
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chepos
Posts: 7273
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 12:14 am

tphuang wrote:
United1 wrote:
sdh9 wrote:

Pretty sure the government only cares about US markets.


The service requirements only apply to US States and Territories.

Regarding SJU the exemption is only until May 6th when UA planned on restarting service. Otherwise UA would have to restart service prior to that date (whenever it accepted the terms of the grant from the US Government.) May 6th is in line with the rest of the Caribbean service they announced.

SPN service was shut down due to a specific and direct request from the Governor of that US Commonwealth. UA plans on restoring service on May 2nd barring another request. Again without making the request UA would have to restart service immediately..something the island and UA do not want.

Service to Hawaii outside of HNL is being suspended for a couple of reasons. One is holiday traffic has follow off a cliff edge and the flights would be mostly empty. Second is the Governor of Hawaii is actively suppressing tourism right now until the Pandemic is over or at least under control. The suspension of service is supported by him and the state until the 14 day quarantine period imposed on anyone coming to or traveling around the islands has been removed. UA could restart service prior to September but like everything right now flexibility is key.


Have there been info that a lot of these travel restrictions to the islands are going to get completely lifted? I'm not sure what is special about May 6th? There will still be a lot of coronavirus cases in NY/NJ area at that time.

PR quarantine/curfew orders have been extended until early MAY (at the earliest). Arrivals into the island need to fill paper work and temperatures are taken upon arrival. The governor wants to start testing all arriving pax into the island with the quick test. Our cases on the island are going up and fast, I don’t see PR easing too much until we can grasp the situation as the infrastructure can’t support mass breakout like whats going on in the DR.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Fly the Flag!!!!
 
Scarebus34
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 12:23 am

United to add new charter cargo flights to PEK, TPE, and CTU.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... 51464d1121
 
wn676
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:00 am

Scarebus34 wrote:
United to add new charter cargo flights to PEK, TPE, and CTU.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... 51464d1121


The end of the article gives more detail into why the NRT stopovers have been required. This has always been a crew issue. There have been rumors of the screening and quarantine requirements being eased soon, but until that happens you’ll continue to see the 1-stops.
Tiny, unreadable text leaves ample room for interpretation.
 
codc10
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:11 am

[twoid][/twoid]
wn676 wrote:
Scarebus34 wrote:
United to add new charter cargo flights to PEK, TPE, and CTU.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... 51464d1121


The end of the article gives more detail into why the NRT stopovers have been required. This has always been a crew issue. There have been rumors of the screening and quarantine requirements being eased soon, but until that happens you’ll continue to see the 1-stops.


Jayunited gave us some awesome insight on the real reason UAL is using NRT has a Pacific cargo hub. It has at least as much to do with load planning, if not more, than any other factor.
 
xxcr
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 5:04 am

whats this story i hear about UA retiring some 763s? im assuming the non-polaris birds??
 
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calpsafltskeds
Posts: 3226
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 5:08 am

FAA put out an AD on the IAE V2500 engines that requires replacement of the HPT 1st stage disk at a cost of about $350k per engine. I don't know if UA would have to pick up the whole total, but its about $120 million for UA 319 and 320 units.
https://samchui.com/2020/04/13/faa-rais ... pVDDMhKiUk

789:
N19959 sked to exit XMN 2799/15Apr with Polaris/PP.
788 N29907 also showed exiting, but flight now shows cancelled.
There is no inbound 787 to XMN according to FR24.
 
United1
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 11:27 am

calpsafltskeds wrote:
FAA put out an AD on the IAE V2500 engines that requires replacement of the HPT 1st stage disk at a cost of about $350k per engine. I don't know if UA would have to pick up the whole total, but its about $120 million for UA 319 and 320 units.
https://samchui.com/2020/04/13/faa-rais ... pVDDMhKiUk


If the blogger who wrote that article for Sam Chui had read the AD she would have discovered that it only applies to a specific batch of engines. Of which only two of those engines are registered in the US....not even sure if its UA.

https://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guid ... -07-51.pdf

More Sam Chui reporting at its best :)
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jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 1:41 pm

wn676 wrote:
Scarebus34 wrote:
United to add new charter cargo flights to PEK, TPE, and CTU.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... 51464d1121


The end of the article gives more detail into why the NRT stopovers have been required. This has always been a crew issue. There have been rumors of the screening and quarantine requirements being eased soon, but until that happens you’ll continue to see the 1-stops.


The end of the article does have some truth but also the authors assumptions. Take for instance these statements where the author asserted their opinion which is based on facts but not all the facts.
"Carriers may give cargo capacity in tonnage, but this is less relevant since most in-demand cargo is volumetric and exceeds volume capacity before weight capacity."
https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... 6b24b61121

For cargo charter flights it is absolutely true you will run out of space before you run out of weight.

The author then proceeds to make these next few statements;
"Unlike passengers, cargo is less discerning about making stops en route. Trans-Pacific cargo flights often stop in Anchorage for re-fuelling in order to maximize cargo payload and minimize weight allocated for fuel.

But layover conditions, and not payload restrictions, may be driving United’s stopover routings.

Pilots are concerned about layovers in certain cities, where rules are strict and often changing. Quarantine regulations for international arrivals may mean pilots are not allowed to leave their hotel room until they depart the country."
https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... 6b24b61121

The above statement the author is mixing facts with their opinion. United didn't just start operating cargo flights from China via NRT, the first batch of charter flights UA operated from China did in fact operate nonstop but as I stated earlier our load planners were forced to leave cargo behind to balance the aircraft. The statement that weight capacity is not an issue is correct, no cargo charter comes close to approaching MZFW or MTOG what the author fails to take into account is balance. So when the they state layover conditions are being driven by layover restrictions and not payload they are only focusing on one part which is the weight the second and equally as important is the balance. One does not work without the other you can't be under MZFW or MTOG and be out of balance. Weight and balance are twins, one can't function without the other.

Also China isn't the only country with strict rules on crews flying into their country. In fact in Japan (NRT) requires all crew members to remain in their hotel rooms until their departure, they are required to eat all meals in their hotel room (they can not leave their hotel room at all during their layover), and they are not to use any type of public transportation to/from the airport. The author has mixed facts with assumptions instead of doing real journalism and seeing if China is alone in their restrictions. China is not the only country with some type of strict strict guidelines and restrictions on airline flight crew members other countries include but are not limited to Australia, Hong Kong, Israel, Taiwan, Switzerland, Singapore, Argentina, and many others. If the author would have taken the time to read both China and Japans restrictions on flight crew member layovers they will see Japan's restriction is just as strict as China's on all inbound crew members. The main reason for these layovers has to do with the ability to balance the aircraft by reducing the amount of fuel required to fly nonstop from China to the U.S. Remember China shut down their entire country they just reopened many of their factories so a lot of the heavy cargo UA was shipping pre-COVID-19 is not there because factories were closed and I'm not sure how strong demand is in the U.S. for a lot of the electronics, clothes or other Chinese made products because our economy is still closed. Again medical supplies make up a lot of what we are shipping out of China they take up a lot of volume but don't have the weight needed to produce the necessary tail weight needed balance the aircraft when there is a high fuel load.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 3:11 pm

Regrading parked and stored aircraft.
The Parked/Stored aircraft spreadsheet has been updated to reflect aircraft in storage locations and those parked/stored at UA stations for 14 days or longer. They are shown with white text - it might be a bit hard to read some of the text if the shading for which airport they are located is lighter, but you can always hover over the aircraft for the N number on the link or click on the link for a display in FlightAware. I show 111 widebodies parked/stored for 14 days or more and 167 narrowbodies. (aircraft in ROW shown as stored regardless of arrival date)
https://sites.google.com/site/unitedfle ... ris-update

Good news on the AD on Airbus engines. Too bad the alarming article didn't go into detail as it appears to show only 11 total engines worldwide.

788:
N29907 exited XMN 2736/14Apr with Polaris and PP - now in HKG

789:
N15969 exited XMN 2735/14Apr with Polaris/PP - now in HKG
 
airplanedriver6
Posts: 44
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 11:18 pm

xxcr wrote:
whats this story i hear about UA retiring some 763s? im assuming the non-polaris birds??

Nothing official, yet.

It would be sad, but not totally shocking since most of the remaining non-Polaris airplanes are from the oldest delivery set.

But ironically one of the newest 763s (674) had not been converted when the spam hit the fan.
 
xxcr
Posts: 468
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 6:37 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Apr 15, 2020 5:36 am

airplanedriver6 wrote:
xxcr wrote:
whats this story i hear about UA retiring some 763s? im assuming the non-polaris birds??

Nothing official, yet.

It would be sad, but not totally shocking since most of the remaining non-Polaris airplanes are from the oldest delivery set.

But ironically one of the newest 763s (674) had not been converted when the spam hit the fan.


i guess if UA does retire some 763's including the ones with Polaris, they could just transfer the seats to the 764.....
 
xxcr
Posts: 468
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Apr 15, 2020 5:42 am

does anyone have a picture of N222UA? would like to see the difference in interiors compared to the older domestic layout.

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