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Midwestindy
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:05 am

tphuang wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
tphuang wrote:
I think the 25% is referring to system wide capacity. Makes sense for domestic to be higher than that.


The reports I've read have said that 30% is an increase from 25%, I could be wrong though


You are probably right.

If I had to guess, some of the increases here like the EWR to 115 fights, is a response to competitive pressure from LCCs. Seeing competitors aggressively taking aggressive capacity increases probably forced their hand a little bit here. Would be interesting to see how they recover over next year, I still anticipate them to be 35% smaller than pre-COVID size next summer.


2020 Peak Departures/2019 Peak Departures
IAD 124/266-46.6%
ORD 260/637-40.8%
DEN 206/504-40.9%
EWR 115/432-26.6%
SFO 116/332-34.9%
LAX 43/160-26.9%
IAH 210/533-39.4%

Using FSDan's schedule from S19
viewtopic.php?t=1420611

I believe they are also keeping the schedules low for Tuesdays & Saturdays, which would likely bring down the percentages
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United1
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:20 am

Nicknuzzii wrote:
Chicago O’Hare: 260 flights to 133 destinations

Denver: 206 flights to 120 destinations

Houston Intercontinental: 210 flights to 112 destinations

Los Angeles: 43 flights to 26 destinations

Newark: 115 flights to 61 destinations

San Francisco: 116 flights to 65 destinations

Washington Dulles: 124 flights to 74 destinations


A rough estimation of percent of "normal" flights.
ORD 45%
DEN 45%
IAH 40%
LAX 30%
EWR 30%
SFO 40%
IAD 50%
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avi8
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:22 am

So ORD, DEN and IAH are the main hubs during this crisis. Makes a lot of sense.
avi8
 
airzona11
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:28 am

jayunited wrote:
codc10 wrote:
With regard to a configuration change, I could see some of the 76L fleet going to a smaller J cabin if LHR/ZRH/GVA/FRA premium demand projects to be impaired for an extended (multiyear) period.

Scott Kirby has said they have no plans to retire any fleets at the moment, and would prefer to keep airplanes in long-term storage to provide the optionality to add capacity if demand returns. Eventually, some decisions will have to be made, but for now, it appears all but the 28J 752s (75K, one of which just hit its 31st anniversary of delivery) will remain "technically" in the fleet, albeit parked, for now.


I think you are correct UA will take a wait and see approach. I think premium demand will remain surpressed until there is an effective therapeutic and/or a vaccine. The question is can United wait that long, can we hold out long enough to get a clear picture of how the recovery, or will our financial position force UA to act sooner than what Kirby would like?


I wonder though if premium demand would not come back before Y demand? Business travel is what pays the bills and once that opens up more, those fliers are going to go. The masses are going to be more impacted by the depressed economy, unemployment etc. Add to that decreased flights and less competition, Y fares are going to be higher than normal, which makes the difference between J/PY and Y less, maybe more buy ups. Granted this is all if the economies stay open and come back up quicker, but structurally, the housing market did not crash like past recessions, financial markets did not crash, this is for the most part lockdown induced. The near term era is not going to be one of cheap fares.
 
ericm2031
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:29 am

Great to see UA increasing now. It seemed like some business was being lost to others flying more robust schedules.
 
sldispatcher
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:32 am

I think American was wise to keep all of their connectivity in place as much as possible. I'm having to fly them tomorrow instead of UAL for that very reason.

I am happy to see UAL continue to rebound. As soon as NY and CA loosen up more it should really turn things loose with filling planes.

I am hoping for a very quick rebound so none of the planned furloughs will be as severe as currently thought.
 
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janders
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:34 am

Kirby only yesterday said capacity is not the problem, its demand.

https://skift.com/2020/06/04/american-a ... ectations/

He said July system would be down 75%.
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atcsundevil
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 2:32 am

Please be respectful with other users. This thread is normally respectful and cordial, so if replies aren't in keeping with the generally positive tone of this thread, they will be removed.

✈️ atcsundevil
 
codc10
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 2:34 am

AA is unsustainable at 25-30% of pre-COVID capacity. It can't possible generate enough revenue at that level for much longer and expect to meet its covenants. So, it has to go for broke. Fortunately, the market appears ready to begin the long road back...and the rising tide will lift all boats!
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 2:52 am

ericm2031 wrote:
Interesting that AA is flying 55% pre-COVID for July and UA is only going to do 25%...quite a big difference. Will be interesting to see the numbers after the fact.



The percentage of flights flown is not important the question is how much revenue will AA generate off 55% verses UA's 30% ( UA just announced July's schedule will be around 30%).

Also United is not trying to keep up with American, United is trying to find the right balance that provides the right capacity while also generating revenue. Personally I think for July UA should be flying 30% -35%. I think anything over 35% would probably be to much capacity for UA at this particular point in time.

Lastly I can't wait to see Q2 results American has operated more flights than UA during Q2. It will be interesting to see how each airline faired during Q2 with UA flying the least number of flights DL in the middle and AA had the most flights in the air.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 3:03 am

jayunited wrote:
ericm2031 wrote:
The percentage of flights flown is not important the question is how much revenue will AA generate off 55% verses UA's 30% ( UA just announced July's schedule will be around 30%).


Domestic is 30%, overall is 25%
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jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:09 pm

LAXintl wrote:
jayunited wrote:
ericm2031 wrote:
The percentage of flights flown is not important the question is how much revenue will AA generate off 55% verses UA's 30% ( UA just announced July's schedule will be around 30%).


Domestic is 30%, overall is 25%


My apologies I read the statement UA put out and my excitement got the better of me. I'm more the type to focus on good news and I should have gotten a better understanding of what UA was actually saying before I posted.

But I still believe 30% to perhaps 35% domestically is right where UA should be for July. Comparing AA, and UA's approach to DL's approach to this crisis. DL has stated they are capping capacity at 60% while both AA and UA have taken a different approach. I'm bringing up DL because they've added flights as well because of their policy but even with that policy I don't believe DL will be flying 55% of their pre-COVID schedule domestically. UA flying 30% of our pre-COVID domestic schedule is probably right where we should be seeing that we are not capping capacity at 60%.

United is focusing on getting our daily cash burn rate down and keeping it down. Not really sure what AA is doing especially seeing their daily cash burn rate continues to be much higher than UA's.
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 12:39 pm

United will not let WN pull away at DEN, our July 2020 schedule will see UA operating 206 daily departures on peak days to 120 destinations. Even though UA's focus is on revenue and not trying to be the largest carrier at DEN this has to be encouraging news for employees at DEN to see UA's committed to DEN remains just as strong as ever.

As much as I hate to do this I have to be fair. UA's July schedule will see 3 hubs operating over 200 daily flights on peak days, and 3 hubs at over 100 daily flights on peak days. However LAX's daily departures will remain incredibly low at just 43 daily departures on peak days to only 26 destinations. While I don't believe UA will de-hub LAX, it is obvious from our July schedule that at this particular point in time LAX is not a top priority for UA. While LAX's July numbers are not shocking they are a bit disappointing, but I guess SFO and DEN take priority.

https://thepointsguy.com/news/united-ai ... -schedule/
 
FSDan
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 7:11 pm

jayunited wrote:
As much as I hate to do this I have to be fair. UA's July schedule will see 3 hubs operating over 200 daily flights on peak days, and 3 hubs at over 100 daily flights on peak days. However LAX's daily departures will remain incredibly low at just 43 daily departures on peak days to only 26 destinations. While I don't believe UA will de-hub LAX, it is obvious from our July schedule that at this particular point in time LAX is not a top priority for UA. While LAX's July numbers are not shocking they are a bit disappointing, but I guess SFO and DEN take priority.


The thing about LAX for UA is that the hub served very few unique destinations. Basically just ITO, I think (since SCK seems to be cut longer term?). The majority of UA's flights from LAX pre-COVID-19 were either to other UA hubs, to Hawai'i, or to smaller Western destinations where UA is strong (BOI, ACV, SBA, ASE, COS, etc.), likely quite reliant on O&D rather than connections. With international and Hawai'i traffic severely hampered and the LA area still more locked down than the average U.S. metro area, there's not much left that's worth flying nonstop from LAX besides the other hubs.
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FlyGuy27
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 8:44 pm

Today's UA 2374 EWR - SFO was on the 76L. Other flights on a 752, 753 and 788. Interesting times for sure.

Wouldn't mind the 76L cross-country!
 
Okcflyer
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Jun 05, 2020 11:57 pm

FlyGuy27 wrote:
Today's UA 2374 EWR - SFO was on the 76L. Other flights on a 752, 753 and 788. Interesting times for sure.

Wouldn't mind the 76L cross-country!


Increasing J demand?
 
B747forever
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Jun 06, 2020 12:34 am

jayunited wrote:
However LAX's daily departures will remain incredibly low at just 43 daily departures on peak days to only 26 destinations. While I don't believe UA will de-hub LAX, it is obvious from our July schedule that at this particular point in time LAX is not a top priority for UA. While LAX's July numbers are not shocking they are a bit disappointing, but I guess SFO and DEN take priority.

https://thepointsguy.com/news/united-ai ... -schedule/


Do you happen to have the full LAX July schedule? Interested in seeing which cities will be served.
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Midwestindy
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Jun 06, 2020 1:10 am

B747forever wrote:
jayunited wrote:
However LAX's daily departures will remain incredibly low at just 43 daily departures on peak days to only 26 destinations. While I don't believe UA will de-hub LAX, it is obvious from our July schedule that at this particular point in time LAX is not a top priority for UA. While LAX's July numbers are not shocking they are a bit disappointing, but I guess SFO and DEN take priority.

https://thepointsguy.com/news/united-ai ... -schedule/


Do you happen to have the full LAX July schedule? Interested in seeing which cities will be served.


Includes partner flights, schedule is for sale now on UA.com

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AmericanAir88
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Jun 06, 2020 2:04 am

It seems that UA has updated some schedules. Looking at some EWR routes that now have fewer flights present than a few days ago.
 
ericm2031
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Jun 06, 2020 2:17 am

AmericanAir88 wrote:
It seems that UA has updated some schedules. Looking at some EWR routes that now have fewer flights present than a few days ago.


If you’re talking about July, then yes. It was showing pre-COVID schedule previously...it now has the real schedule loaded.
 
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SumChristianus
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Jun 06, 2020 3:14 am

ericm2031 wrote:
If you’re talking about July, then yes. It was showing pre-COVID schedule previously...it now has the real schedule loaded.


It's down from the "default" or unadjusted schedule as one might call it, but in general up a bit from June in the "real" or actually now planned to be flown, schedule. Nowhere near Southwest or American yet as UA is still planning on riding this out with deeper cuts but it's an improvement over the bare than bare bones being flown now.
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redrooster3
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Jun 06, 2020 5:04 am

Okcflyer wrote:
FlyGuy27 wrote:
Today's UA 2374 EWR - SFO was on the 76L. Other flights on a 752, 753 and 788. Interesting times for sure.

Wouldn't mind the 76L cross-country!


Increasing J demand?


Definitely not, only 7 passengers booked in business with 4 being upgrades. It was probably a NOC request to "get the plane flying" to avoid storage protocols.

On the other hand, im seeing a few 772s popping up in DEN/IAH/ORD. Aircraft 13 left for polaris mods on March 18th and spent about 50 days in mods and came back and is doing hub-to-hub runs.
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ericm2031
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Jun 06, 2020 5:23 am

SumChristianus wrote:
ericm2031 wrote:
If you’re talking about July, then yes. It was showing pre-COVID schedule previously...it now has the real schedule loaded.


It's down from the "default" or unadjusted schedule as one might call it, but in general up a bit from June in the "real" or actually now planned to be flown, schedule. Nowhere near Southwest or American yet as UA is still planning on riding this out with deeper cuts but it's an improvement over the bare than bare bones being flown now.


I know that...I’m not sure why you’re clarifying that...
 
Okcflyer
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Jun 06, 2020 12:05 pm

redrooster3 wrote:
Okcflyer wrote:
FlyGuy27 wrote:
Today's UA 2374 EWR - SFO was on the 76L. Other flights on a 752, 753 and 788. Interesting times for sure.

Wouldn't mind the 76L cross-country!


Increasing J demand?


Definitely not, only 7 passengers booked in business with 4 being upgrades. It was probably a NOC request to "get the plane flying" to avoid storage protocols.

On the other hand, im seeing a few 772s popping up in DEN/IAH/ORD. Aircraft 13 left for polaris mods on March 18th and spent about 50 days in mods and came back and is doing hub-to-hub runs.


Bummer. Thanks for the info though!
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Jun 06, 2020 3:26 pm

The 76L fleet has stored units sitting since about 3/30 except a few ferried in early April to long term storage at ROW.
N652UA was the last out of Polaris mod on 4/11, so it must be in a different storage mode and UA has kept it "active". If cargo demand needs a 763 it doesn't matter what the seat configuration is with poor passenger demand.
It seems interesting that UA chose to fire up 2 of 7 non-Polaris 763s, N657UA and N658UA after 6 weeks or more in storage for occasional hub-to-hub and transcon flights.
7 of 14 763A units are occasionally operating as well.

All 772ER appear in storage except:
The last 2 772GE Polaris mods, N76010 and N78013 (exited HKG 5/10-11) are both doing occasional ORD-IAH/IAD/DEN turns to stay active.
772ER/PW N798UA was last out of XMN maint 5/11 is doing occasional IAD-SJU turns and N210UA is doing occasional hub-to-hub services after several military charter legs in late May.

UA is definitely keeping specific aircraft, specific groups of aircraft and aircraft types in specific locations. Aircraft in and out of short term parking seem to return to the same airport for a day or more of being parked. The newer 738s plus many Airbuses are being flown for up to several days, then usually returned to the same location to swap out with another parked aircraft of the same type. 739s are being used infrequently at this point.
 
AmericanAir88
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Jun 06, 2020 3:44 pm

Does anyone have the schedule for EWR in July? Are they planning on using a 787-10 for one of the EWR-LAX routes? Also, I am curious how EWR operations will look.
 
UALifer
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Jun 06, 2020 3:57 pm

AmericanAir88 wrote:
Does anyone have the schedule for EWR in July? Are they planning on using a 787-10 for one of the EWR-LAX routes? Also, I am curious how EWR operations will look.


Domestic schedules were updated last night, so whatever is selling should be mostly accurate now.
 
hollywoodcory
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Jun 06, 2020 9:04 pm

Haven't had a chance to review the full month's schedule, but looks like UA is resuming ops to Canada but only to YYZ/YUL & YVR in July?
 
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Amwest2United
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Jun 06, 2020 10:21 pm

AmericanAir88 wrote:
Does anyone have the schedule for EWR in July? Are they planning on using a 787-10 for one of the EWR-LAX routes? Also, I am curious how EWR operations will look.


2 - 752- CO Birds
1 - 767-300 30 BC
1 787-10
per day in July
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AmericanAir88
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Jun 07, 2020 3:18 am

Amwest2United wrote:
AmericanAir88 wrote:
Does anyone have the schedule for EWR in July? Are they planning on using a 787-10 for one of the EWR-LAX routes? Also, I am curious how EWR operations will look.


2 - 752- CO Birds
1 - 767-300 30 BC
1 787-10
per day in July


Just booked last night with a very friendly representative. I am on the 787-10. Its flight 410 that leaves at 8:30. It is weird that today, the flight was operated by a 738. The other days are a 787 though.

Thank you for this.
 
UAinAUS
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:48 am

UAX Update:

E175SC:
N607UX entered service with Skywest
N611UX entered service with Skywest
N622UX entered service with Skywest

E170:
N652RW has returned to flying

E145XR:
N12142 has been transferred to ExpressJet, back in service
N11106 has been transferred to ExpressJet, back in service
N11107 now parked at TYS
N17115 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N14180 exited fleet, stored at IGM

E145:
N15910 is now back in service
N11539 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N12569 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N26545 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N13553 exited fleet, stored at IGM
 
VC10er
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Jun 07, 2020 4:17 pm

I have to admit that I have not really been on a.net for a couple of months...it was just too sad for me. I missed 20 pages!

So, perhaps this was fully discussed; what are UNITED’s plans for the newly refurbished CRJ-550’s?

Thanks!
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atrude777
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Jun 07, 2020 4:49 pm

UAinAUS wrote:

E145XR:
N12142 has been transferred to ExpressJet, back in service
N11106 has been transferred to ExpressJet, back in service
N11107 now parked at TYS
N17115 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N14180 exited fleet, stored at IGM

E145:
N15910 is now back in service
N11539 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N12569 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N26545 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N13553 exited fleet, stored at IGM


Are these E145's the ones at Trans States or what?

As I thought they were all going to Express Jet?

So are these pre COVID19 planned retirements, or COVID19 "Retirement" for 50 Seaters as Kirby had mentioned?

Alex
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77H
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Jun 07, 2020 6:45 pm

atrude777 wrote:
UAinAUS wrote:

E145XR:
N12142 has been transferred to ExpressJet, back in service
N11106 has been transferred to ExpressJet, back in service
N11107 now parked at TYS
N17115 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N14180 exited fleet, stored at IGM

E145:
N15910 is now back in service
N11539 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N12569 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N26545 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N13553 exited fleet, stored at IGM


Are these E145's the ones at Trans States or what?

As I thought they were all going to Express Jet?

So are these pre COVID19 planned retirements, or COVID19 "Retirement" for 50 Seaters as Kirby had mentioned?

Alex


It’s really a shame that UA has consistently drawn down ER4 frames over CR2 frames every time the fleet plan strategy calls for a reduction in 50 seaters. In the last few years UA has even gone as far as to reduce ER4 frames while adding CR2 frames.

I have no insight on the variance between operating costs between the 2 types, but from a pax comfort perspective, the ER4 is far superior to the CR2.

77H
 
sldispatcher
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Jun 07, 2020 11:45 pm

I could not agree more. The CR2 love at United needs to end sooner rather than later.
 
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cosyr
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:50 am

77H wrote:
atrude777 wrote:
UAinAUS wrote:

E145XR:
N12142 has been transferred to ExpressJet, back in service
N11106 has been transferred to ExpressJet, back in service
N11107 now parked at TYS
N17115 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N14180 exited fleet, stored at IGM

E145:
N15910 is now back in service
N11539 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N12569 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N26545 exited fleet, stored at IGM
N13553 exited fleet, stored at IGM


Are these E145's the ones at Trans States or what?

As I thought they were all going to Express Jet?

So are these pre COVID19 planned retirements, or COVID19 "Retirement" for 50 Seaters as Kirby had mentioned?

Alex


It’s really a shame that UA has consistently drawn down ER4 frames over CR2 frames every time the fleet plan strategy calls for a reduction in 50 seaters. In the last few years UA has even gone as far as to reduce ER4 frames while adding CR2 frames.

I have no insight on the variance between operating costs between the 2 types, but from a pax comfort perspective, the ER4 is far superior to the CR2.

77H

My guess would be lease terminations and amazing deals on the CR2's. I believe that ERJ's are more cost effective to operate, but if the price to acquire or lease is low enough, the price of oil shouldn't be enough of a factor.
 
jetmatt777
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:07 am

Classic example of United being cheap to a fault. The CR2 is horrible from a passenger experience.
 
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cosyr
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:37 am

jetmatt777 wrote:
Classic example of United being cheap to a fault. The CR2 is horrible from a passenger experience.

It is a bit confusing, when they spend the money to make CR5's. But I think they think the ER4's and CR2's are similar experience, as neither has F or true Y+. It is frustrating, as I've spoken to people who don't know anything about planes, but they particularly hated their CR2 experiences.
 
sldispatcher
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:23 am

It’s all about the windows and the window seat shoulder room.

I am encouraged that Kirby is headed towards getting rid of 50 seaters altogether but will be interesting to see the actual timetable.
 
77H
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 4:17 am

cosyr wrote:
jetmatt777 wrote:
Classic example of United being cheap to a fault. The CR2 is horrible from a passenger experience.

It is a bit confusing, when they spend the money to make CR5's. But I think they think the ER4's and CR2's are similar experience, as neither has F or true Y+. It is frustrating, as I've spoken to people who don't know anything about planes, but they particularly hated their CR2 experiences.


I personally find the 1-2 layout of the ER4 superior to the 2-2 layout of the CR2. Seems like many passengers familiar with both types have a similar opinion. Moreover, the cabin ceiling seems a little bit higher in the ER4 than the CR2 and in my experience, found cabin interiors of the ER4s to be in better shape than the CR2s, AW’a newly refurbished ones that are quite nice.

And last but not least, as an aviation enthusiast who grabs a window whenever possible, the ER4 has windows positioned in such a way that an adult can readily look out the window without inducing rapid onset scoliosis. The same cannot be said for the CR2.

77H
 
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LAXintl
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:21 am

A bit more insight as to why UA is growing its schedule so slow.

Per Inflight townhall last week:

While travel demand is slowly increasing, we’re still only operating a small fraction of our original schedule. Many of you have asked about why we aren’t increasing flying faster to locations that are opening up (like Florida and Texas). While we’re eager to add flying to the schedule, we also need to be able to operate the route profitably, or atleast not lose even more money doing it. We have a highly skilled team in revenue management and network planning who are closely watching bookings, travel demand and customers willingness to travel. As soon as it’s clear that there is enough demand to justify operating a route, we’ll be quick to add flying. On the international side, you’ll see we are currently focused on hubs that have historically strong international flying demand, which are our coastal hubs versus a mid-continent hub. For our mid-continent hubs, we’ll continue focusing on domestic connectivity that is required to support further restoration of our flying.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
tphuang
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 11:38 am

LAXintl wrote:
A bit more insight as to why UA is growing its schedule so slow.

Per Inflight townhall last week:

While travel demand is slowly increasing, we’re still only operating a small fraction of our original schedule. Many of you have asked about why we aren’t increasing flying faster to locations that are opening up (like Florida and Texas). While we’re eager to add flying to the schedule, we also need to be able to operate the route profitably, or atleast not lose even more money doing it. We have a highly skilled team in revenue management and network planning who are closely watching bookings, travel demand and customers willingness to travel. As soon as it’s clear that there is enough demand to justify operating a route, we’ll be quick to add flying. On the international side, you’ll see we are currently focused on hubs that have historically strong international flying demand, which are our coastal hubs versus a mid-continent hub. For our mid-continent hubs, we’ll continue focusing on domestic connectivity that is required to support further restoration of our flying.


This seems like the difference between AA and UA. UA is making capacity decisions based on the forward bookings/demands they see. AA is making capacity decisions based on demand they hope to see. And in June, it worked out well for AA in that bookings came back faster in Texas/Florida. Now that every ULCC is adding back capacity, that means a bigger portion of bookings will go to them. Unless demand really jumps, I don't see how this leap in capacity will work out again for AA.
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:32 pm

tphuang wrote:
LAXintl wrote:
A bit more insight as to why UA is growing its schedule so slow.

Per Inflight townhall last week:

While travel demand is slowly increasing, we’re still only operating a small fraction of our original schedule. Many of you have asked about why we aren’t increasing flying faster to locations that are opening up (like Florida and Texas). While we’re eager to add flying to the schedule, we also need to be able to operate the route profitably, or atleast not lose even more money doing it. We have a highly skilled team in revenue management and network planning who are closely watching bookings, travel demand and customers willingness to travel. As soon as it’s clear that there is enough demand to justify operating a route, we’ll be quick to add flying. On the international side, you’ll see we are currently focused on hubs that have historically strong international flying demand, which are our coastal hubs versus a mid-continent hub. For our mid-continent hubs, we’ll continue focusing on domestic connectivity that is required to support further restoration of our flying.


This seems like the difference between AA and UA. UA is making capacity decisions based on the forward bookings/demands they see. AA is making capacity decisions based on demand they hope to see. And in June, it worked out well for AA in that bookings came back faster in Texas/Florida. Now that every ULCC is adding back capacity, that means a bigger portion of bookings will go to them. Unless demand really jumps, I don't see how this leap in capacity will work out again for AA.



I absolutely agree with you tphuang, I could care less that AA will fly 55% of there pre-COVID schedule in July if they are loosing money doing it. The recovery can not be about keeping up with the Joneses it has to be about stemming the tide and survival. United has to stay on top if its finances, and I like the approach UA's revenue management team is taking. United has to continue to work to keep our daily cash burn rate heading in the right direction. Delta's hopes to reach zero cash burn by years end, hopefully UA can reach zero by the end of January or February 2021. If United simply focused on the short term (leisure travelers) it could end up costing us overall. I would rather UA loose a few leisure customers and focus on preserving cash and reducing our losses instead of taking on every ULCC/LCC and UA ends up in bankruptcy. This is recovery is going to take time and right now the LCCs and ULCCs have the advantage because the recovery for now is mostly in the domestic leisure market. United's time will come, we as employees just need to be patience, the last thing United needs to do is try and rush this recovery.
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 7:22 pm

The fleet changes, fleet status, and repaint status posts at the start of this thread have been updated.

There is also a post dedicated to keeping track of stored mainline aircraft.

✈️ atcsundevil
 
FSDan
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:07 pm

77H wrote:
cosyr wrote:
jetmatt777 wrote:
Classic example of United being cheap to a fault. The CR2 is horrible from a passenger experience.

It is a bit confusing, when they spend the money to make CR5's. But I think they think the ER4's and CR2's are similar experience, as neither has F or true Y+. It is frustrating, as I've spoken to people who don't know anything about planes, but they particularly hated their CR2 experiences.


I personally find the 1-2 layout of the ER4 superior to the 2-2 layout of the CR2. Seems like many passengers familiar with both types have a similar opinion. Moreover, the cabin ceiling seems a little bit higher in the ER4 than the CR2 and in my experience, found cabin interiors of the ER4s to be in better shape than the CR2s, AW’a newly refurbished ones that are quite nice.

And last but not least, as an aviation enthusiast who grabs a window whenever possible, the ER4 has windows positioned in such a way that an adult can readily look out the window without inducing rapid onset scoliosis. The same cannot be said for the CR2.

77H


:checkmark: +1

I was sad when DL consolidated 50-seaters down to just CR2s rather than ER4s as well. It's all about the windows for me.
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
joeblow10
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:24 pm

tphuang wrote:
LAXintl wrote:
A bit more insight as to why UA is growing its schedule so slow.

Per Inflight townhall last week:

While travel demand is slowly increasing, we’re still only operating a small fraction of our original schedule. Many of you have asked about why we aren’t increasing flying faster to locations that are opening up (like Florida and Texas). While we’re eager to add flying to the schedule, we also need to be able to operate the route profitably, or atleast not lose even more money doing it. We have a highly skilled team in revenue management and network planning who are closely watching bookings, travel demand and customers willingness to travel. As soon as it’s clear that there is enough demand to justify operating a route, we’ll be quick to add flying. On the international side, you’ll see we are currently focused on hubs that have historically strong international flying demand, which are our coastal hubs versus a mid-continent hub. For our mid-continent hubs, we’ll continue focusing on domestic connectivity that is required to support further restoration of our flying.


This seems like the difference between AA and UA. UA is making capacity decisions based on the forward bookings/demands they see. AA is making capacity decisions based on demand they hope to see. And in June, it worked out well for AA in that bookings came back faster in Texas/Florida. Now that every ULCC is adding back capacity, that means a bigger portion of bookings will go to them. Unless demand really jumps, I don't see how this leap in capacity will work out again for AA.


I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: it’s a chicken and the egg problem. UA and DL run the risk of cutting so deep, that they won’t see the demand come in. Conversely, as you said, AA and the ULCC run the risk of having too much capacity and running even more unprofitably, until they subtract demand.

So far - I would argue the latter is paying off. Maybe not for AA, but anecdotally from data points from myself and friends, the NKs and WNs of the world are running “full” capped planes and adding flights. There was a point in May and early this month I couldn’t even build an MCO-SEA itinerary on UA and even on DL because of seat caps. At least now there are 1-2 options, but that is nothing in comparison to what others are offering.
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:00 am

joeblow10 wrote:
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: it’s a chicken and the egg problem. UA and DL run the risk of cutting so deep, that they won’t see the demand come in. Conversely, as you said, AA and the ULCC run the risk of having too much capacity and running even more unprofitably, until they subtract demand.

So far - I would argue the latter is paying off. Maybe not for AA, but anecdotally from data points from myself and friends, the NKs and WNs of the world are running “full” capped planes and adding flights. There was a point in May and early this month I couldn’t even build an MCO-SEA itinerary on UA and even on DL because of seat caps. At least now there are 1-2 options, but that is nothing in comparison to what others are offering.



Airlines like DL and UA are playing it smartly they know they can't take on LCCs and ULCCs head on and win, not in this COVID environment. Right now domestically leisure traffic is slowly coming back but more aggressively than business traffic and international traffic. I think the 1-2 domestic options both DL and UA offer is better than no options at all. However trying and take on NK, F9, and/or WN head on in this environment would be suicided. Again like you and others have pointed out I'm not sure what AA is doing but both DL and UA are taking the right approach. Heading into summer 2020 they will capture some leisure traffic but just enough where they are not loosing money. Whereas AA flying 55% will probably do more harm to their bottom line than good.
 
jetmatt777
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 2:08 am

Too early to say who's approach is the right one. The question is, can United add capacity back fast enough if needed? I'm hearing of the company requesting voluntary furloughs (COLA) to return ahead of the scheduled date. Just the other day, for the first time in months, I received a work email advertising overtime. If demand does "snap" back United's aggressive cuts will be too deep to ramp up quick enough. That's where AA and WN will have a large advantage, they can absorb demand and convert it into operating income instantly. American is operating double the flights and carrying double the traffic.

There are two distinct strategies and I think you are calling United the winner way too early.
 
tphuang
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 2:29 am

You can't compare UA to WN. UA does not have that much cash. And also, UA is far more exposed to the reduction in LH international travel than any other airlines. And it also has most hubs on coastal areas where demand is coming back the slowest.

July isn't going to be a repeat of second half of May to first half of June for AA. ULCCs are really ramping up capacity to take advantage of price sensitive customers coming back. Is this really an area UA should aggressively compete in? Out of EWR in July, I see UA offering more flights to most leisure destinations than its competitions. That's not like June where UA I think really did cut too much and didn't have enough capacity to capture the demand.
 
jetmatt777
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 2:34 am

Sure they have different models - but they also have incredible amounts of overlap in the domestic market, one which WN is salivating to capture more of UA's share. If UA can't adapt then they will suffer on the domestic front to what WN is putting out there. We aren't talking about G4 flying old folks to vegas and college kids to south beach. This is an airline with significant capacity in some of UA's largest markets. Losing to WN will be a serious blow to UA's attempt to shore up domestic flying over the past few years.

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