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DLHAM
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 4:35 am

rjbesikof wrote:
DLHAM wrote:
rjbesikof wrote:

I would assume this would be when they will announce the W20 and S21 schedules. As another poster said, they still need to figure out what they will do with the 10/24 and 25th resumptions. What could be axed internationally?


I think quite a few european destinations will go. AA and DL already announced quite a few dropped destinations in Europe, I think United will do the same.
I could see Stockholm, Berlin, Prague, Oporto and Palermo and Naples getting dropped. Shannon and Glasgow in danger as well ...


Hi DLHAM,
Have they started to zero out some of the international flights past October besides the EWR flights mentioned in previous posts?


Not yet but since AA and DL already had huge rounds of cancellations in Europe I am pretty sure that United will do the same.
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sldispatcher
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 4:47 am

EssentialPowr wrote:
sldispatcher wrote:
And as a paying first class customer and as a physician who has taken care of over 400 Covid positive patients in the long term care setting, my criticism is both warranted and backed with experience and preference. I completely understand how the information and concern has been a fruit basket turnover mess.


Why not discuss it with United? It baffles me when people on a forum gripe, and then of course post their resume as if that adds credibility. If the product wasn’t what you expected (did you ask before you bought the ticket? Seems like a reasonable question from a “physician that has taken care of” blAh blah. If they’d served a hot meal you be here telling us how irresponsible it was to be serving people?

United as a Company is doing a solid job. Don’t like the product? Go somewhere else. As Gordon B once said (paraphrase) “there are some people who’s business we just don’t want.”


I actually did write to United Customer Care before posting here. I got a nice and quick response that was a good deal more mature than the ones posted here.. I am hoping that they continue to flourish going forward.
 
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 4:54 am

Is the ratio of mainline to express (76 seater/50 seater) aircraft being enforced during the last few months or has it been a "gentlemen's agreement" while the network gets rebooted?
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:19 am

Please post on topic. Personal comments will be removed.

✈️ atcsundevil
 
EssentialPowr
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 7:33 am

Most of the airlines are extremely diligent about customer complaints. With all of the changes that are designed to minimize loss, it seems reasonable to handle things at the lowest level prior to this simply being a complaint forum. Participant’s resumes are hardly germane. Let’s hold some integrity for the airline industry and its employees.
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 11:48 am

I can’t believe how little coverage this is getting on an aviation website.

16,000 plus employees gone in one month is a big deal.

You guys are talking about Customer Service?

Very sad
 
EssentialBusDC
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 1:24 pm

sldispatcher wrote:
Is the ratio of mainline to express (76 seater/50 seater) aircraft being enforced during the last few months or has it been a "gentlemen's agreement" while the network gets rebooted?

The ratio is based on a rolling 12 month look back and is tied to the number of 76 seaters. So Express can fly up to 120% of the mainline narrowbody block hours with between zero and 153 76 seaters on the property. The issue is being monitored by ALPA, and I am assuming that the closer we get to next spring, the ratio will be getting closer and closer to violating the contract.

In any Rolling Twelve-Month Period ending the first full calendar month following date of signing of this Agreement or later, the Company shall not Schedule or permit the Scheduling of aircraft block hours of United Express Flying (excluding block hours operated by 37-Seat Turboprop Aircraft) exceeding the maximum percentage of Scheduled aircraft block hours of Company Flying on single-aisle Company Aircraft (“Max. % of UAXBH to SBH”) set forth in the following chart.


4E0C7E9D-D067-4DF8-9ADC-8350B4168F9B.jpeg
 
DoctorVenkman
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 1:31 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
I can’t believe how little coverage this is getting on an aviation website.

16,000 plus employees gone in one month is a big deal.

You guys are talking about Customer Service?

Very sad


These layoffs were announced months ago, everyone knew this was coming. In fact, the number is actually better than initially anticipated (16,000 vs. 36,000).
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 1:36 pm

DoctorVenkman wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:
I can’t believe how little coverage this is getting on an aviation website.

16,000 plus employees gone in one month is a big deal.

You guys are talking about Customer Service?

Very sad


These layoffs were announced months ago, everyone knew this was coming. In fact, the number is actually better than initially anticipated (16,000 vs. 36,000).


16K people losing their jobs in 3 weeks is a big deal.
 
DoctorVenkman
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 1:47 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
DoctorVenkman wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:
I can’t believe how little coverage this is getting on an aviation website.

16,000 plus employees gone in one month is a big deal.

You guys are talking about Customer Service?

Very sad


These layoffs were announced months ago, everyone knew this was coming. In fact, the number is actually better than initially anticipated (16,000 vs. 36,000).


16K people losing their jobs in 3 weeks is a big deal.


Of course it's a big deal. What I'm saying is:

1) Everyone knew about these layoffs months ago
2) The size of the layoffs is actually less than expected

I'm just explaining why people aren't discussing this as much as you'd like them to.
 
codc10
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 1:54 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
DoctorVenkman wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:
I can’t believe how little coverage this is getting on an aviation website.

16,000 plus employees gone in one month is a big deal.

You guys are talking about Customer Service?

Very sad


These layoffs were announced months ago, everyone knew this was coming. In fact, the number is actually better than initially anticipated (16,000 vs. 36,000).


16K people losing their jobs in 3 weeks is a big deal.


Not to mention the ~7,400 leaving the company (or already left) through buy-outs and voluntary separation. Sad times.
 
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 2:45 pm

sldispatcher wrote:
Is the ratio of mainline to express (76 seater/50 seater) aircraft being enforced during the last few months or has it been a "gentlemen's agreement" while the network gets rebooted?


I believe a OO E175 is already in the process of being converted to 70 seats and a seat map has been added to United.com showing the existing configuration with a few rows missing in the back. So it appears they are already working on fixing the balance.
 
guppyflyer
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 2:53 pm

ericm2031 wrote:
sldispatcher wrote:
Is the ratio of mainline to express (76 seater/50 seater) aircraft being enforced during the last few months or has it been a "gentlemen's agreement" while the network gets rebooted?


I believe a OO E175 is already in the process of being converted to 70 seats and a seat map has been added to United.com showing the existing configuration with a few rows missing in the back. So it appears they are already working on fixing the balance.


Seat removal isn't related to block hour limits, but rather mainline pilot furloughs. There are two issues at play, the ratio of flying limits occur on a rolling 12 month timeline. To date, that limit hasn't been exceeded.....however it's possible it will be if things continue on the current path.
 
sldispatcher
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 3:20 pm

So the October schedule update will include effects of layoffs, regional flying changes, and future bookings. Purely anecdotal, but it seems like load factors are spitting and sputtering from nearly full to ghost town. But that's better than all ghost town. It also seems upgrade lists are growing in length. I'm curious if October will look almost identical to September or if there are signals that certain regions of the country are rebounding in terms of demand?
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 5:30 pm

sldispatcher wrote:
So the October schedule update will include effects of layoffs, regional flying changes, and future bookings. Purely anecdotal, but it seems like load factors are spitting and sputtering from nearly full to ghost town. But that's better than all ghost town. It also seems upgrade lists are growing in length. I'm curious if October will look almost identical to September or if there are signals that certain regions of the country are rebounding in terms of demand?



I think you are correct the October schedule will pretty much mimic the September schedule both domestically and internationally, with a few exceptions.

Internationally: ORD-TLV 3x weekly begins this month and next month IAD-TLV 3x weekly resumes. I think IAD-TLV will be the only additional international long haul flight added in October.
Domestically: The big question mark in our domestic schedule for October is Hawaii. If Hawaii remains closed expect to see the same level of service we're flying in September. However if Hawaii is open (I don't think the state will be) expect to see additional service from SFO, and LAX to HNL/OGG/KOA/LIH/ and look for additional weekly flights between ORD/IAH-HNL.
 
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cosyr
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 8:22 pm

guppyflyer wrote:
ericm2031 wrote:
sldispatcher wrote:
Is the ratio of mainline to express (76 seater/50 seater) aircraft being enforced during the last few months or has it been a "gentlemen's agreement" while the network gets rebooted?


I believe a OO E175 is already in the process of being converted to 70 seats and a seat map has been added to United.com showing the existing configuration with a few rows missing in the back. So it appears they are already working on fixing the balance.


Seat removal isn't related to block hour limits, but rather mainline pilot furloughs. There are two issues at play, the ratio of flying limits occur on a rolling 12 month timeline. To date, that limit hasn't been exceeded.....however it's possible it will be if things continue on the current path.

Seems like the rolling 12 month average could cause UA and any other airline that has a similar contract issues, when they start to recall employees after the pandemic. I may make sense to have 50-76 seaters flying empty routes now, but later on, they may have to hold off returning regional routes if they don't scale back all operations proportionately.
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 8:55 pm

jayunited wrote:
sldispatcher wrote:
So the October schedule update will include effects of layoffs, regional flying changes, and future bookings. Purely anecdotal, but it seems like load factors are spitting and sputtering from nearly full to ghost town. But that's better than all ghost town. It also seems upgrade lists are growing in length. I'm curious if October will look almost identical to September or if there are signals that certain regions of the country are rebounding in terms of demand?



I think you are correct the October schedule will pretty much mimic the September schedule both domestically and internationally, with a few exceptions.

Internationally: ORD-TLV 3x weekly begins this month and next month IAD-TLV 3x weekly resumes. I think IAD-TLV will be the only additional international long haul flight added in October.
Domestically: The big question mark in our domestic schedule for October is Hawaii. If Hawaii remains closed expect to see the same level of service we're flying in September. However if Hawaii is open (I don't think the state will be) expect to see additional service from SFO, and LAX to HNL/OGG/KOA/LIH/ and look for additional weekly flights between ORD/IAH-HNL.


What about LHR slots?
 
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Sep 03, 2020 9:37 pm

Delete
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 12:03 am

Nicknuzzii wrote:
What about LHR slots?


What about LHR slots....

I forget UA either has 18 or 19 slots at LHR. Even with UA still operating cargo only flights along side passenger service flight I don't see UA operating anything close to 18/19 flights into LHR, for the remainder of 2020, and if I'm to be honest probably not in 2021 either. LHR was (pre-COVID) a huge business destination for United there was also a nice spike in leisure travel from April through the first half of October. However without the support of business travelers I don't see why UA would need 18/19 slots at LHR for at least the next 4-5 years. If I'm going to be realistic I think post-COVID with with the lack of business traffic I think UA could make LHR work with 3x or 4X daily EWR, 2x daily ORD, 2x daily IAD, 2x daily SFO, 1x daily IAH, 1x daily LAX, 1x daily DEN for a total of either 12 or 13 (depending on EWR) LHR slots.

What will happen to any unused slots is anyone's guess, this isn't simply a UA problem this is a industry problem. While some carriers may choose to operate empty flights into LHR to try and preserve their slots, I don't see UA doing anything remotely close to that.
 
sldispatcher
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 4:12 am

Is route planning divided into domestic and international departments? I seem to a recall a "big bird" episode where there are two guys in charge of route planning, but can't recall. I know our local airport tax supported air service alliance has tried to use incentives to restart DEN service to no avail. Hopefully that will return soon. So many different priorities the route planners have to take into account.
 
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 4:24 am

IAHWorldflyer wrote:
codc10 wrote:
IAHWorldflyer wrote:
Does anyone who works at UA know if the October schedules are now firm? I'm looking at booking an October ticket, and it seems like there is more capacity on some routes in October than there is in September. Given that the funding dries up the end of this month, I'm a bit hesitant to think that UA really intends to fly what is loaded in right now.


I'd wait and see for the schedule release this weekend. Seems that UA is holding off on finalizing domestic schedules to 30 days from the start of the month. Right now, in most markets, it is the pre-COVID schedule, and, as we know, UA will not be able to staff this level of flying. I would expect significant changes to the negative.

As an example, ExpressJet is ceasing all operations on 30SEP, but the schedule for October still has a full slate of XJT flying out of both IAH and ORD. XJT has actually been out of ORD since August and is flying a relatively limited IAH schedule this month as it winds down, transferring aircraft to C5 and storage at IGM.



Thank you for letting me know the schedule updates this weekend. Specifically, I'm looking at IAH-EWR flights, and for October they are practically hourly, which I just don't see as realistic. I would prefer not to book something that gets canceled out and moved.


It appears United has started a new program last month where even if the schedule is set they could cancel flights based on load projections with a new algorithm.
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 9:13 am

sldispatcher wrote:
So the October schedule update will include effects of layoffs, regional flying changes, and future bookings. Purely anecdotal, but it seems like load factors are spitting and sputtering from nearly full to ghost town. But that's better than all ghost town. It also seems upgrade lists are growing in length. I'm curious if October will look almost identical to September or if there are signals that certain regions of the country are rebounding in terms of demand?


Let's not forget that October is a slow month - usually, the slowest month of all - anyway. And the slowness in the US generally continues until we close to Thanksgiving.
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MIflyer12
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 11:35 am

FlyHossD wrote:
Let's not forget that October is a slow month - usually, the slowest month of all - anyway.


In 2017, 18 and 19, September was slower than October, if not consistently the slowest month of each year, according to BTS data.

https://www.bts.gov/figure-2-monthly-pa ... justed-dec
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 12:03 pm

A lot of cuts last night but still a lot of regional routes I the system that are yet to be cut.
 
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 12:47 pm

RE Hawaii is a wildcard with lockdowns - on the WN thread their load factor in May was the lowest for their system. I know they have interisland, but unsure of the mix or routes and frequency
LIH - 2.64% - 559 pax 18/day
KOA - 3.19% - 1005 pax 32/day
OGG - 4.76% - 1532 pax 49/day
ITO - 5.59% - 1213 pax 39/day
HNL - 7.13% - not listed buy more than 5819
 
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 1:46 pm

jayunited wrote:

What will happen to any unused slots is anyone's guess, this isn't simply a UA problem this is a industry problem. While some carriers may choose to operate empty flights into LHR to try and preserve their slots, I don't see UA doing anything remotely close to that.


Flying mostly empty frames across the Atlantic would be very costly to say the least.

I couldn't find any useful information online after a short search but does anyone know if the intra-Europe route authorities UA acquired from Pan Am in the 1990 are still valid? I recall UA flying LHR-AMS/CDG/HAM/BRU/TXL in 727s for a short period after the acquisition. If these routes authorities are still on the books, would saving the LHR slots be worth flying a couple intra-Europe trips on a 757/767?

We're probably many months away from the slotted airports needing to enforce their "use or lose" rule anyway. Seeing these highly lucrative slots at risk of being forfeited by the carriers that have fought so hard to obtain in the first place would be a real setback.
 
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atcsundevil
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 1:51 pm

jetblastdubai wrote:
We're probably many months away from the slotted airports needing to enforce their "use or lose" rule anyway. Seeing these highly lucrative slots at risk of being forfeited by the carriers that have fought so hard to obtain in the first place would be a real setback.

Apparently Heathrow is planning on enforcing slot rules starting with the winter schedule. Presumably there will be pressure from airlines and political pressure to delay this.

https://onemileatatime.com/heathrow-slot-requirements/
 
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 2:57 pm

atcsundevil wrote:
jetblastdubai wrote:
We're probably many months away from the slotted airports needing to enforce their "use or lose" rule anyway. Seeing these highly lucrative slots at risk of being forfeited by the carriers that have fought so hard to obtain in the first place would be a real setback.

Apparently Heathrow is planning on enforcing slot rules starting with the winter schedule. Presumably there will be pressure from airlines and political pressure to delay this.

https://onemileatatime.com/heathrow-slot-requirements/


I think this proposal has been walked back, at least for W20/21. I'm not sure exactly how much the 80% rule will be relaxed, but I don't expect ACL to demand strict compliance given the political pressure against it.
 
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 3:45 pm

https://hub.united.com/2020-09-04-unite ... 62326.html

"United Airlines today announced it plans to fly 40% of its full schedule in October 2020 compared to October of last year. In September, United expects to fly 34% of its full schedule."

"Domestically, United plans to fly 46% of its full schedule in October 2020 compared to October of last year, compared to the 38% schedule it plans to fly domestically in September 2020. The airline also plans to resume eight routes to Hawaii, pending approval of the state's pre-arrival COVID testing program.

"Internationally, United expects to fly 33% of its schedule compared to October of 2019, which is up compared to the 29% schedule it plans to fly in September. United continues to respond to the growth in leisure travel demand by adding flights to cities in Mexico, Central America and South America."

United is even realigning its schedule patterns with the customer in mind to match the current demand for leisure travel. In October, the airline plans to add more flights on days popular with leisure travelers looking to get a head start on long weekend getaways and will schedule fewer flights on days where demand is traditionally lower.

Domestic

Resuming or starting new service on nearly 50 routes, including 37 routes from United's Chicago, Denver and Houston hubs.
Resuming additional service to Florida including Washington-Dulles to Sarasota and Miami, and Denver to Fort Myers.
Resuming service between Los Angeles and Eugene, Medford and Redmond/Bend in Oregon.

International

Resuming service to 14 international destinations including Bogota, Colombia; Buenos Aires, Argentina; Lima, Peru and Panama City, Panama.
Increasing to twice daily service between New York/Newark and Tel Aviv and resuming three-times weekly service between Washington, D.C. and Tel Aviv on October 25.
Resuming or increasing service to Cancun, Mexico City and Puerto Vallarta in Mexico from its hubs in Chicago, Denver, Houston, New York/Newark and Washington, D.C.
Last edited by Midwestindy on Fri Sep 04, 2020 3:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 3:49 pm

codc10 wrote:
atcsundevil wrote:
jetblastdubai wrote:
We're probably many months away from the slotted airports needing to enforce their "use or lose" rule anyway. Seeing these highly lucrative slots at risk of being forfeited by the carriers that have fought so hard to obtain in the first place would be a real setback.

Apparently Heathrow is planning on enforcing slot rules starting with the winter schedule. Presumably there will be pressure from airlines and political pressure to delay this.

https://onemileatatime.com/heathrow-slot-requirements/


I think this proposal has been walked back, at least for W20/21. I'm not sure exactly how much the 80% rule will be relaxed, but I don't expect ACL to demand strict compliance given the political pressure against it.

Hopefully it has. I can only imagine the ridiculous slot-filler flights that would result. This winter is definitely too early.
 
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DLHAM
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 3:57 pm

jetblastdubai wrote:
I couldn't find any useful information online after a short search but does anyone know if the intra-Europe route authorities UA acquired from Pan Am in the 1990 are still valid? I recall UA flying LHR-AMS/CDG/HAM/BRU/TXL in 727s for a short period after the acquisition. If these routes authorities are still on the books, would saving the LHR slots be worth flying a couple intra-Europe trips on a 757/767?

We're probably many months away from the slotted airports needing to enforce their "use or lose" rule anyway. Seeing these highly lucrative slots at risk of being forfeited by the carriers that have fought so hard to obtain in the first place would be a real setback.


Thats a great idea. I dont know if they still have these authorities, but when Delta served JFK-HAM they had 5 weekly nonstops and two weekly flights via Amsterdam. In the first winter after taking the route over from Pan Am they operated a triangular flight JFK-HAM-AMS-JFK and the other direction, 3 and 4 weekly so combined a daily flight.
In I think 1993 there was a period where they only had the nonstops and these few months made them loose their local traffic rights between AMS and HAM after that. So I think the same applies for United.
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Ishrion
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 4:03 pm

United announces its October schedule: https://hub.united.com/2020-09-04-unite ... 62326.html

- 40% compared to October 2019
- Domestic capacity 46% compared to October 2019, up from 38% in September 2020
- International capacity 33% compared to October 2019, up from 29% in September 2020

Domestic:

- Resuming or starting new service on nearly 50 routes, including 37 routes from ORD/DEN/IAH
- Resuming additional service to Florida including IAD-SRQ/MIA and DEN-RSW
- Resuming Los Angeles to EUG/MFR/RDM

International:

- Resuming service to 14 international destinations including BOG, EZE, LIM, PTY
- Increasing EWR-TLV to 2x daily and resuming IAD-TLV on October 25
- Resuming or increasing flights to CUN, MEX, PVR from ORD/DEN/IAH/EWR/IAD
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 4:57 pm

Pretty impressive schedule considering middle seats will not be blocked. If I’m surprised about anything it’s that we still do not have a plan for TATL/TPAC flights for this Winter and summer!
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 5:24 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
Pretty impressive schedule considering middle seats will not be blocked. If I’m surprised about anything it’s that we still do not have a plan for TATL/TPAC flights for this Winter and summer!



Why are you so anxious to see United's international plan for next summer?

Why do you feel like United should announce their International plans for summer 2021 while we are still in summer 2020?

I'm only asking because every week multiple times a week you either ask the question or make a statement about United's lack of any announcement about our future plans and I'm just trying to understand what the big deal is with summer 2021?

I hope you don't feel like I'm personally attacking you because that is not my intention. I just want to understand what the fascination is with summer 2021 and why you feel like since UA hasn't made any public announcement UA must not have a plan?
 
rjbesikof
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 5:25 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
Pretty impressive schedule considering middle seats will not be blocked. If I’m surprised about anything it’s that we still do not have a plan for TATL/TPAC flights for this Winter and summer!


I think they will take this on a month by month basis. Why is Tel Aviv such a strong market for them?
 
jayunited
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 5:29 pm

jetblastdubai wrote:

Flying mostly empty frames across the Atlantic would be very costly to say the least.

I couldn't find any useful information online after a short search but does anyone know if the intra-Europe route authorities UA acquired from Pan Am in the 1990 are still valid? I recall UA flying LHR-AMS/CDG/HAM/BRU/TXL in 727s for a short period after the acquisition. If these routes authorities are still on the books, would saving the LHR slots be worth flying a couple intra-Europe trips on a 757/767?

We're probably many months away from the slotted airports needing to enforce their "use or lose" rule anyway. Seeing these highly lucrative slots at risk of being forfeited by the carriers that have fought so hard to obtain in the first place would be a real setback.



You may be on to something here, I don't exactly remember when but I vaguely remember at some point between 2002-2010 for most of the winter season UA operated intra-Europe routes from LHR to sever airports you mentioned. At the time UA gave some b.s. excuse about moving mail but now that you mentioned it UA was clearly flying these routes to protect their slots because there were almost no passengers on any of UA's intra-Europe flights.
 
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itripreport
Posts: 124
Joined: Fri Oct 28, 2016 6:36 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 5:46 pm

Ishrion wrote:
United announces its October schedule: https://hub.united.com/2020-09-04-unite ... 62326.html

- 40% compared to October 2019
- Domestic capacity 46% compared to October 2019, up from 38% in September 2020
- International capacity 33% compared to October 2019, up from 29% in September 2020

Domestic:

- Resuming or starting new service on nearly 50 routes, including 37 routes from ORD/DEN/IAH
- Resuming additional service to Florida including IAD-SRQ/MIA and DEN-RSW
- Resuming Los Angeles to EUG/MFR/RDM

International:

- Resuming service to 14 international destinations including BOG, EZE, LIM, PTY
- Increasing EWR-TLV to 2x daily and resuming IAD-TLV on October 25
- Resuming or increasing flights to CUN, MEX, PVR from ORD/DEN/IAH/EWR/IAD



I'm just happy my trascon 787-10 I booked back with the 360 dollar fares stayed... I was beginning to worry they'd switch to a 757...
 
Nicknuzzii
Posts: 1237
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2018 5:57 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 5:51 pm

jayunited wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
Pretty impressive schedule considering middle seats will not be blocked. If I’m surprised about anything it’s that we still do not have a plan for TATL/TPAC flights for this Winter and summer!



Why are you so anxious to see United's international plan for next summer?

Why do you feel like United should announce their International plans for summer 2021 while we are still in summer 2020?

I'm only asking because every week multiple times a week you either ask the question or make a statement about United's lack of any announcement about our future plans and I'm just trying to understand what the big deal is with summer 2021?

I hope you don't feel like I'm personally attacking you because that is not my intention. I just want to understand what the fascination is with summer 2021 and why you feel like since UA hasn't made any public announcement UA must not have a plan?


I intend on flying UA from EWR next year to a few European destinations and prior to booking I would like to have complete confidence in the flight. But aside from my own personal reasons both AA and DL have released their International schedules and yet we have heard nothing from UA. European airlines such as LH are announcing their International schedules prior to the upcoming season.

With the October schedule update it appears that most of the routes that were cut for this summer are now rolling cuts into the winter. Will be interesting to see what comes back and what doesn’t..
 
codc10
Posts: 2897
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 5:58 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
jayunited wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
Pretty impressive schedule considering middle seats will not be blocked. If I’m surprised about anything it’s that we still do not have a plan for TATL/TPAC flights for this Winter and summer!



Why are you so anxious to see United's international plan for next summer?

Why do you feel like United should announce their International plans for summer 2021 while we are still in summer 2020?

I'm only asking because every week multiple times a week you either ask the question or make a statement about United's lack of any announcement about our future plans and I'm just trying to understand what the big deal is with summer 2021?

I hope you don't feel like I'm personally attacking you because that is not my intention. I just want to understand what the fascination is with summer 2021 and why you feel like since UA hasn't made any public announcement UA must not have a plan?


I intend on flying UA from EWR next year to a few European destinations and prior to booking I would like to have complete confidence in the flight. But aside from my own personal reasons both AA and DL have released their International schedules and yet we have heard nothing from UA. European airlines such as LH are announcing their International schedules prior to the upcoming season.

With the October schedule update it appears that most of the routes that were cut for this summer are now rolling cuts into the winter. Will be interesting to see what comes back and what doesn’t..


I wouldn’t expect any clarity on S21 until next year, probably March or so. During COVID, we have seen the leisure booking window compressed from 6-8+ weeks to much closer-in. So there really isn’t much of an incentive to release long-range schedules when there are virtually no advance bookings.
 
Nicknuzzii
Posts: 1237
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2018 5:57 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 6:34 pm

Anyone have any clue what’s going with UA schedule? EWR-LAX was showing 4x this morning now it’s up to 7? EWR-LHR was showing 1x this morning now show 3x.
 
Ishrion
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 6:42 pm

Not sure if this was posted before - SkyWest (United) proposes to launch 12x weekly services from Houston to both El Dorado and Hot Springs, Arkansas as part of EAS bids: https://www.regulations.gov/document?D= ... -2935-0405
 
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DLHAM
Posts: 528
Joined: Sat Dec 31, 2016 1:10 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 7:21 pm

jayunited wrote:
You may be on to something here, I don't exactly remember when but I vaguely remember at some point between 2002-2010 for most of the winter season UA operated intra-Europe routes from LHR to sever airports you mentioned. At the time UA gave some b.s. excuse about moving mail but now that you mentioned it UA was clearly flying these routes to protect their slots because there were almost no passengers on any of UA's intra-Europe flights.


Thats way longer ago, they purchased the Heathrow operations from Pan Am in 1991. This included intra-europe flying with 727s to those places mentioned. These operations lasted until 1994 or 1995.
And regarding TATL Summer 2021 I think its just interesting to see what changes. And considering that American and Delta both announced their S21 TATL changes some people may wait for news from United now.
My Instagram Account: Instagram
 
Judge1310
Posts: 414
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 7:59 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
Pretty impressive schedule considering middle seats will not be blocked. If I’m surprised about anything it’s that we still do not have a plan for TATL/TPAC flights for this Winter and summer!


Dude, give it up on summer planning already...it's too far away to develop and publicise such plans! We're (airlines) are literally taking planning month by month and considering quarter by quarter. Q4 2020 is the major focus, Q1 2021 is slightly on the radar.
 
sldispatcher
Posts: 410
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 3:55 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:37 pm

Will be interesting to see the holiday ramp ups as that is heavy VFR time. Hopefully a bright spot for UAL and the crews who need job security. I know I am booking two more RTs in the coming weeks for W20/21. Trying to do my part!
 
jayunited
Posts: 2965
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:03 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 8:40 pm

DLHAM wrote:
jayunited wrote:
You may be on to something here, I don't exactly remember when but I vaguely remember at some point between 2002-2010 for most of the winter season UA operated intra-Europe routes from LHR to sever airports you mentioned. At the time UA gave some b.s. excuse about moving mail but now that you mentioned it UA was clearly flying these routes to protect their slots because there were almost no passengers on any of UA's intra-Europe flights.


Thats way longer ago, they purchased the Heathrow operations from Pan Am in 1991. This included intra-europe flying with 727s to those places mentioned. These operations lasted until 1994 or 1995.
And regarding TATL Summer 2021 I think its just interesting to see what changes. And considering that American and Delta both announced their S21 TATL changes some people may wait for news from United now.



No it wasn't that long ago that UA did intra-Europe. UA resurrected intra-Europe for a singular winter season, I think it was at some point during bankruptcy or right after to preserve our LHR slots. WE operated a handful of intra-European flights using 772s. I don't remember the exact year but I remember UA flying operating for example ORD-LHR-BRU (overnighting the aircraft at BRU or AMS for example) then the next day BRU-LHR-ORD. UA did run this type of operation at some point for a single entire winter season. I just don't remember the exact year but it was at some point between 2002-2010.
 
codc10
Posts: 2897
Joined: Sat Jul 08, 2000 7:18 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 9:24 pm

jayunited wrote:
DLHAM wrote:
jayunited wrote:
You may be on to something here, I don't exactly remember when but I vaguely remember at some point between 2002-2010 for most of the winter season UA operated intra-Europe routes from LHR to sever airports you mentioned. At the time UA gave some b.s. excuse about moving mail but now that you mentioned it UA was clearly flying these routes to protect their slots because there were almost no passengers on any of UA's intra-Europe flights.


Thats way longer ago, they purchased the Heathrow operations from Pan Am in 1991. This included intra-europe flying with 727s to those places mentioned. These operations lasted until 1994 or 1995.
And regarding TATL Summer 2021 I think its just interesting to see what changes. And considering that American and Delta both announced their S21 TATL changes some people may wait for news from United now.



No it wasn't that long ago that UA did intra-Europe. UA resurrected intra-Europe for a singular winter season, I think it was at some point during bankruptcy or right after to preserve our LHR slots. WE operated a handful of intra-European flights using 772s. I don't remember the exact year but I remember UA flying operating for example ORD-LHR-BRU (overnighting the aircraft at BRU or AMS for example) then the next day BRU-LHR-ORD. UA did run this type of operation at some point for a single entire winter season. I just don't remember the exact year but it was at some point between 2002-2010.


Not long before the merger, I want to say W09/10. Around the time of the WFC and associated decline in international business travel. LHR-BRU/AMS immediately come to mind.
 
EssentialBusDC
Posts: 116
Joined: Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:06 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 9:45 pm

jayunited wrote:
DLHAM wrote:
jayunited wrote:
You may be on to something here, I don't exactly remember when but I vaguely remember at some point between 2002-2010 for most of the winter season UA operated intra-Europe routes from LHR to sever airports you mentioned. At the time UA gave some b.s. excuse about moving mail but now that you mentioned it UA was clearly flying these routes to protect their slots because there were almost no passengers on any of UA's intra-Europe flights.


Thats way longer ago, they purchased the Heathrow operations from Pan Am in 1991. This included intra-europe flying with 727s to those places mentioned. These operations lasted until 1994 or 1995.
And regarding TATL Summer 2021 I think its just interesting to see what changes. And considering that American and Delta both announced their S21 TATL changes some people may wait for news from United now.



No it wasn't that long ago that UA did intra-Europe. UA resurrected intra-Europe for a singular winter season, I think it was at some point during bankruptcy or right after to preserve our LHR slots. WE operated a handful of intra-European flights using 772s. I don't remember the exact year but I remember UA flying operating for example ORD-LHR-BRU (overnighting the aircraft at BRU or AMS for example) then the next day BRU-LHR-ORD. UA did run this type of operation at some point for a single entire winter season. I just don't remember the exact year but it was at some point between 2002-2010.


It was also on the 767. We did it as a round robin, IAD-BRU-LHR-IAD and yes the loads from BRU-LHR were very light, like 30-50 passengers.
 
andrew1996
Posts: 58
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2020 6:41 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Sep 04, 2020 11:15 pm

Looks like Singapore got dropped again. Any idea when Singapore is coming back? It was a lucrative route pre pandemic
 
jayunited
Posts: 2965
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:03 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Sep 05, 2020 12:42 am

andrew1996 wrote:
Looks like Singapore got dropped again. Any idea when Singapore is coming back? It was a lucrative route pre pandemic


For UA (I can't speak for any other airline) Singapore was probably 75% to 85% all business traffic. It was not uncommon to see multiple GS and 1K passengers seated in regular coach on a daily basis because E+ and business class were completely full.

You are correct SFO-SIN was a lucrative route but with demand from business travelers still virtually nonexistent, and with airport authorities in HKG still requiring a highly invasive COVID test for all arrivals including crew members, I don't think SIN will return either as a a nonstop (SFO-SIN) or as a one stop (SFO-HKG-SIN) any time soon. If I were to place a wager I would say not to expect passenger service on UA to resume until March 2021 at the earliest and even then I don't see UA operating a nonstop, I think it will be a one stop.
 
Galore
Posts: 29
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2020 12:43 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Sep 05, 2020 1:03 am

jayunited wrote:
DLHAM wrote:
jayunited wrote:
You may be on to something here, I don't exactly remember when but I vaguely remember at some point between 2002-2010 for most of the winter season UA operated intra-Europe routes from LHR to sever airports you mentioned. At the time UA gave some b.s. excuse about moving mail but now that you mentioned it UA was clearly flying these routes to protect their slots because there were almost no passengers on any of UA's intra-Europe flights.


Thats way longer ago, they purchased the Heathrow operations from Pan Am in 1991. This included intra-europe flying with 727s to those places mentioned. These operations lasted until 1994 or 1995.
And regarding TATL Summer 2021 I think its just interesting to see what changes. And considering that American and Delta both announced their S21 TATL changes some people may wait for news from United now.



No it wasn't that long ago that UA did intra-Europe. UA resurrected intra-Europe for a singular winter season, I think it was at some point during bankruptcy or right after to preserve our LHR slots. WE operated a handful of intra-European flights using 772s. I don't remember the exact year but I remember UA flying operating for example ORD-LHR-BRU (overnighting the aircraft at BRU or AMS for example) then the next day BRU-LHR-ORD. UA did run this type of operation at some point for a single entire winter season. I just don't remember the exact year but it was at some point between 2002-2010.


How did they compete inter Europe? Where $30 round trip fares are typical.

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