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Weatherwatcher1
Posts: 893
Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2019 5:14 pm

Re: UA starting ANC-FAI?!

Sun Dec 20, 2020 6:52 pm

UA is flying to ANC from SFO ORD DEN EWR and IAH next summer. Unfortunately this flight doesn’t connect to all the flights from the lower 48.
 
Varsity1
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Re: UA starting ANC-FAI?!

Sun Dec 20, 2020 7:15 pm

What equipment?
 
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cosyr
Posts: 1631
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Dec 20, 2020 8:31 pm

EssentialBusDC wrote:
strfyr51 wrote:
UA857 wrote:

I don think UA should order the 779 especially because they bought late-build 77Ws.

the real question? Will they need the 779 anytime soon? That is surely up to question as the 772's are getting kind of long in the tooth.

For replacement of the 772’s the 779 makes no sense.

Either more 787’s or the 350’s that have already been ordered as the 772 replacement.

I don't know whether the 778, 779, 359 or 35J make the most sense for United, but I think United should want a little diversity. Though not alone, UA has been directly affected by 2 groundings this decade from Boeing. I'm not saying Airbus might never make a mistake, they've had engine issues too at times, but it just underscores the risks of being too dependent on fewer airplane types.

Back in the 90's, after all the airlines had completed a couple decades of small mergers, CO was lauded for it's fleet simplicity plan, but UA is triple the size that CO was then, and I think it could easily absorb a couple more fleet groups. DL has certainly proved it possible to earn profits with a more diverse fleet. I'm not suggesting UA copy DL, but some sort of compromise might make sense. I think the 321LR is a good start, and I think with all the 787's, and 77W's UA will have, the 359 still makes sense in between for flexibility and diversity. Despite being a big Boeing fan, I think it would be a shame if UA doesn't choose something other than Boeing to eventually ease out 319/320's, whether it be A220's (wishful thinking) or 320NEO's.

We also keep talking about 789's replacing 772's, which may work on many routes, but UA will also need to replace 767's at some point, and UA has shown 330's, so 788's seem like the only viable option for those. On this path, UA will have a less diverse widebody fleet than EK.
 
32andBelow
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Re: UA starting ANC-FAI?!

Sun Dec 20, 2020 8:31 pm

Varsity1 wrote:
What equipment?

Gotta be a 737.
 
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InnsbruckFlyer
Posts: 346
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Re: UA starting ANC-FAI?!

Sun Dec 20, 2020 9:02 pm

Varsity1 wrote:
What equipment?


737-800. Gonna be the same frame that flies DEN-ANC.
 
Tristar328
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Joined: Fri Oct 04, 2019 4:51 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 21, 2020 1:12 pm

A 767-300 ,N674UA, came out of ROW this week and is on its way to HKG for maintenance. Does anyone know if it’s going in for Polaris?
 
GmoneyCO
Posts: 227
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 21, 2020 2:06 pm

763:
N671UA - Scheduled entry into HKG for maintenance on 23-Dec/2724
N674UA - Scheduled entry into HKG for maintenance on 23-Dec/2728. Outside chance of Polaris installation, depends on if they have seats purchased and available to install.

E175SC:
N85373 - Entered service on 20-Dec/6039
 
jayunited
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Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:03 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 21, 2020 2:14 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
How are the hubs looking going into the holiday season? Family at EWR this morning sent a pic, it was packed.


There are a lot more people traveling for Christmas in this country than there were for Thanksgiving.

From December 18th through December 28th (with the exception of Christmas eve and Christmas day) United is averaging over 225,000 customers daily, and there are a couple days where UA's daily passenger count topped 237,000 customers. These numbers far exceed anything we experienced over the Thanksgiving travel period. Even on Christmas Day there are 140,953 customers on the books which tops Thanksgiving. Remember just weeks before Thanksgiving United added 1400 flights spread out over a 10 day period for Thanksgiving which turned out to be a bust. For the 11 day period that covers Christmas United has not added any additional last minute flights and just decided to leave the schedule as is.

This has resulted in some pretty high load factors, this past Saturday and Sunday's load factors by hubs
DEN - 81%
IAH - 81%
ORD - 76%
EWR - 74%
IAD - 70% (what a rebound from Thanksgiving where IAD was dead last, now for Christmas it has surpassed SFO and LAX)
SFO - 67%
LAX - 62%

United hasn't seen load factors like these out of the hubs since early March and Wednesday December 23rd load factors will be even higher. These numbers again far exceed anything we saw over Thanksgiving.

I'm not sure if it is the hope these vaccines are providing, COVID fatigue, or if people saw the hypocrisy that played out over Thanksgiving with many city, state, and federal leaders TV and News personalities telling people to stay home only to find out that those same people were themselves traveling for Thanksgiving along with their families. Whatever it is customers have decided they are not canceling their Christmas travel plans.

United is expecting to see numbers like these through January 3rd after which the numbers will take a sharp nose dive downward which is why United has really gutted our January schedule.
 
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calpsafltskeds
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 21, 2020 2:30 pm

763:
As GMoneyCO posted N671UA and N674UA are headed to HKG.  Presume maint on both, but N674UA is in non-Polaris configuration and I would have thought it would remain stored.  Why would UA send it through maint in the old configuration? Maybe it will get Polaris or the pre-Covid planned High J Polaris.  N674UA is one of UA "newest" 763s.

Fleet use has stayed pretty high for the past few weeks. About 67% of the total fleet is scheduled (excluding retired 752PW and Max units), about 30% stored and about 5% parked or in maint for under 14 days. Of course, some units aren't flying all day, but I count just 16 of 329 737 units short term parked today.
Every 787s has been moving almost daily except for 2 maint units in XMN and 77W units have been really busy.
WBs seem to run more frequently on weekdays while NB have less activity on Tu/We, reflecting cargo and passenger demand.
 
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TWA772LR
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 21, 2020 2:42 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
How are the hubs looking going into the holiday season? Family at EWR this morning sent a pic, it was packed.

At 0500 yesterday in DEN, it looked kind of dead with only my flight to IAH boarding.

At 0830 in IAH, it was as if there wasn't a pandemic. Then again I arrived right before the next departure bank.
 
LAXdude1023
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 21, 2020 3:05 pm

jayunited wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
How are the hubs looking going into the holiday season? Family at EWR this morning sent a pic, it was packed.


There are a lot more people traveling for Christmas in this country than there were for Thanksgiving.

From December 18th through December 28th (with the exception of Christmas eve and Christmas day) United is averaging over 225,000 customers daily, and there are a couple days where UA's daily passenger count topped 237,000 customers. These numbers far exceed anything we experienced over the Thanksgiving travel period. Even on Christmas Day there are 140,953 customers on the books which tops Thanksgiving. Remember just weeks before Thanksgiving United added 1400 flights spread out over a 10 day period for Thanksgiving which turned out to be a bust. For the 11 day period that covers Christmas United has not added any additional last minute flights and just decided to leave the schedule as is.

This has resulted in some pretty high load factors, this past Saturday and Sunday's load factors by hubs
DEN - 81%
IAH - 81%
ORD - 76%
EWR - 74%
IAD - 70% (what a rebound from Thanksgiving where IAD was dead last, now for Christmas it has surpassed SFO and LAX)
SFO - 67%
LAX - 62%

United hasn't seen load factors like these out of the hubs since early March and Wednesday December 23rd load factors will be even higher. These numbers again far exceed anything we saw over Thanksgiving.

I'm not sure if it is the hope these vaccines are providing, COVID fatigue, or if people saw the hypocrisy that played out over Thanksgiving with many city, state, and federal leaders TV and News personalities telling people to stay home only to find out that those same people were themselves traveling for Thanksgiving along with their families. Whatever it is customers have decided they are not canceling their Christmas travel plans.

United is expecting to see numbers like these through January 3rd after which the numbers will take a sharp nose dive downward which is why United has really gutted our January schedule.


Glad to see IAH keeping up with DEN.
 
ericm2031
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 21, 2020 5:35 pm

For those waiting, the February schedule will not be updated until January 6th, which is very last minute. This update will include the 1st MAX flights loaded.
 
codc10
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:03 am

TWA772LR wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
How are the hubs looking going into the holiday season? Family at EWR this morning sent a pic, it was packed.

At 0500 yesterday in DEN, it looked kind of dead with only my flight to IAH boarding.

At 0830 in IAH, it was as if there wasn't a pandemic. Then again I arrived right before the next departure bank.


0500 isn’t exactly prime time in DEN...
 
MaxTrimm
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:40 am

I think people are overstating how “packed” airports are. Flights are drastically reduced and rather now packed even tighter into less banks, which packs the airport during certain periods. While maybe 2 hours in the morning are busy, the next four hours may see one flight. No matter how packed the airports seem, passenger numbers are still well below half of last year and flights are depressed significantly also. We all want a rebound soon - but reporting full airports as a true sign of recovery isn’t useful.
 
AaronPGH
Posts: 612
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:57 am

MaxTrimm wrote:
I think people are overstating how “packed” airports are. Flights are drastically reduced and rather now packed even tighter into less banks, which packs the airport during certain periods. While maybe 2 hours in the morning are busy, the next four hours may see one flight. No matter how packed the airports seem, passenger numbers are still well below half of last year and flights are depressed significantly also. We all want a rebound soon - but reporting full airports as a true sign of recovery isn’t useful.


Also gotta say that we shouldn't be rooting for "packed" airports right now. Took my first trip since the beginning of the pandemic. I am someone trying to do things as responsibly as possible and was worried about flying. PIT-EWR-LAX-PSP made me feel safe. Wide open, room to breathe in all airports, helpful staff. My return from SFO-IAD-PIT started great at a spacious SFO. I was ready to give my endorsement to air travel until I stepped into IAD. Cramped, packed, almost nowhere to go to try to social distance. It may have been one quick, packed bank, but that's the moment when the disease is going to spread.

If I try another trip before were back to normal, I'm making sure I aim for EWR always as my connection until this crap is over. Never again IAD. Packed is bad. Spread people out when possible.
 
DEN1895
Posts: 321
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:55 am

jayunited wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
How are the hubs looking going into the holiday season? Family at EWR this morning sent a pic, it was packed.


There are a lot more people traveling for Christmas in this country than there were for Thanksgiving.

From December 18th through December 28th (with the exception of Christmas eve and Christmas day) United is averaging over 225,000 customers daily, and there are a couple days where UA's daily passenger count topped 237,000 customers. These numbers far exceed anything we experienced over the Thanksgiving travel period. Even on Christmas Day there are 140,953 customers on the books which tops Thanksgiving. Remember just weeks before Thanksgiving United added 1400 flights spread out over a 10 day period for Thanksgiving which turned out to be a bust. For the 11 day period that covers Christmas United has not added any additional last minute flights and just decided to leave the schedule as is.

This has resulted in some pretty high load factors, this past Saturday and Sunday's load factors by hubs
DEN - 81%
IAH - 81%
ORD - 76%
EWR - 74%
IAD - 70% (what a rebound from Thanksgiving where IAD was dead last, now for Christmas it has surpassed SFO and LAX)
SFO - 67%
LAX - 62%

United hasn't seen load factors like these out of the hubs since early March and Wednesday December 23rd load factors will be even higher. These numbers again far exceed anything we saw over Thanksgiving.

I'm not sure if it is the hope these vaccines are providing, COVID fatigue, or if people saw the hypocrisy that played out over Thanksgiving with many city, state, and federal leaders TV and News personalities telling people to stay home only to find out that those same people were themselves traveling for Thanksgiving along with their families. Whatever it is customers have decided they are not canceling their Christmas travel plans.

United is expecting to see numbers like these through January 3rd after which the numbers will take a sharp nose dive downward which is why United has really gutted our January schedule.


Hey Jay, thanks for the data. Are you able to pull how many flights were in each hub for those days?
 
UAinAUS
Posts: 303
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:49 am

UAX Update:

E145XR:
N17138 entered service with CommutAir

CR2:
N939SW returned to flying with Skywest

E175SC:
N85373 entered service with Mesa
 
LGeneReese
Posts: 310
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 3:36 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Dec 22, 2020 12:18 pm

73-9
N37523 Delivery UA2715 BFISEA 21DEC
N37516 C2 BFIBFI 21DEC delivery info not yet posted
 
jayunited
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Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:03 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:36 pm

DEN1895 wrote:
Hey Jay, thanks for the data. Are you able to pull how many flights were in each hub for those days?


These are passenger flight numbers only these numbers do not include any cargo only flights. Also these numbers average daily departures for the entire month of December. Keep in mind United schedules less flights on Tuesday, Wednesday, and Saturday, on Thursday's we have a moderate schedule, while Sunday, Monday, and Friday have the most flights scheduled.

DEN - 311 (major increase over November, DEN has now surpassed ORD in both total passengers and now total number of flights)
IAH - 286 (slight increase over the November schedule IAH has also surpassed ORD in total flights and passengers)
ORD - 282 (major decrease compared to the November schedule ORD was north of 320 flights, ORD's struggles continue)
EWR - 146 (slight increase compared to the November schedule)
IAD - 139 (an increase in flights compared to November)
SFO - 110 (a decrease in flights compared to November)
LAX - 62 (schedule pretty much remain the same from November)
 
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CALTECH
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:12 pm

Acey559 wrote:
CALTECH wrote:
andrew1996 wrote:
But come 2027 when the A359 are supposed to be delivered, what will replace UA's 77E fleet? Almost all 787s have already been delivered already. Granted the pandemic may have changed future passenger demands but I think many widely accepted projections is for a full recover by 2024 so that still leaves 3 years of growth between 2024 and 2027 and by then the 77E will be in need of replacement. By then, it would have been almost 8-10 years since the 77Es were retrofitted so there wouldn't really be an argument that they were just refurbished.

That said, I can see UA placing more 787/777 orders instead of the a359 and by 2027 the A359 will be a 15 year old technology but it also does not look like there will be any new airplanes by then absent of NEOs etc.

Could there be a chance that UA will seize on the opportunity to acquire the 77X instead? I am sure Boeing will offer a great deal, especially considering that many current orders of it are being put in question (e.g., EK, CX, EY) If travel does return to pre-COVID pattern I can see the 77X still being a great fit for UA's SFO hub for TPAC routes ( and FRA/LHR) where high capacity is needed and where these are routes that are not served multiple times daily either.


787-9/-10 are already in the fleet, great 77E replacement. Things can change, but for now, there is no A-350 Simulator at DEN UTC. Walked through the whole building, 31 simulators with 2 more coming(?), but not the A-350 as someone stated here. There is some slack in 787 proiduction, it can be ramped up.

Image


Looked through all the filings and reports, and no mention of 2 A-350 simulators that can be found.....
There were 2 A-350 simulators sent to a Airbus Training facility in Miami(?) relatively recently.....


Unless something has changed, the A350 sims are sitting in Montreal currently. They were ordered and built some time ago but pending delivery based on what happens with the aircraft order. It appears there is plenty of room in the G building but I don’t know if there are already plans for those open bays.
 
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TWA772LR
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:21 pm

codc10 wrote:
TWA772LR wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
How are the hubs looking going into the holiday season? Family at EWR this morning sent a pic, it was packed.

At 0500 yesterday in DEN, it looked kind of dead with only my flight to IAH boarding.

At 0830 in IAH, it was as if there wasn't a pandemic. Then again I arrived right before the next departure bank.


0500 isn’t exactly prime time in DEN...

Nor anywhere else lol. But I did fly out last week too during prime time and was visiting friend on C con when a WN bank rolled in. It was nowhere near how busy I'd seen it before working as a WN CSA in 2018.
 
GmoneyCO
Posts: 227
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Dec 23, 2020 6:49 pm

320:
N1913U - Delivered to UA and currently stored at GYR as of 17-Dec.  Flights from OSR were completed under the old registration information (EC-LQN).  Unsure whether this aircraft will be stored and inducted as its a 2004 build or whether it will be parted out and scrapped similar to the other ex-Vueling 320s.  

737-MAX9:
N37522 - Repositioned to BFI from RNT in preparation for delivery to UA

763:
N671UA - Confirmed entry into HKG for maintenance
 
jayunited
Posts: 3589
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:03 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Wed Dec 23, 2020 10:10 pm

GmoneyCO wrote:
320:
N1913U - Delivered to UA and currently stored at GYR as of 17-Dec.  Flights from OSR were completed under the old registration information (EC-LQN).  Unsure whether this aircraft will be stored and inducted as its a 2004 build or whether it will be parted out and scrapped similar to the other ex-Vueling 320s.  


From what I can see in the system it appears as though the ex-Vueling jets will be parted out, while many of the ex-EasyJet jets will eventually be placed into service.
 
audidudi
Posts: 2951
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Dec 24, 2020 5:14 am

GmoneyCO wrote:
320:
N1913U - Delivered to UA and currently stored at GYR as of 17-Dec.  Flights from OSR were completed under the old registration information (EC-LQN).  Unsure whether this aircraft will be stored and inducted as its a 2004 build or whether it will be parted out and scrapped similar to the other ex-Vueling 320s.


Info on N1913U (courtesy of skyliner-aviation.de):

Airbus A320-232 2168 N1913U United Airlines regd 22 Dec 2020 at GYR, prior part-out & scrap, ex EC-LQN
 
gwrudolph
Posts: 568
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2008 3:46 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Dec 24, 2020 2:23 pm

audidudi wrote:
GmoneyCO wrote:
320:
N1913U - Delivered to UA and currently stored at GYR as of 17-Dec.  Flights from OSR were completed under the old registration information (EC-LQN).  Unsure whether this aircraft will be stored and inducted as its a 2004 build or whether it will be parted out and scrapped similar to the other ex-Vueling 320s.


Info on N1913U (courtesy of skyliner-aviation.de):

Airbus A320-232 2168 N1913U United Airlines regd 22 Dec 2020 at GYR, prior part-out & scrap, ex EC-LQN


Out of curiosity, why does UA re-register if it is going to be parted-out?
 
GmoneyCO
Posts: 227
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2017 4:42 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Thu Dec 24, 2020 3:01 pm

gwrudolph wrote:
audidudi wrote:
GmoneyCO wrote:
320:
N1913U - Delivered to UA and currently stored at GYR as of 17-Dec.  Flights from OSR were completed under the old registration information (EC-LQN).  Unsure whether this aircraft will be stored and inducted as its a 2004 build or whether it will be parted out and scrapped similar to the other ex-Vueling 320s.


Info on N1913U (courtesy of skyliner-aviation.de):

Airbus A320-232 2168 N1913U United Airlines regd 22 Dec 2020 at GYR, prior part-out & scrap, ex EC-LQN


Out of curiosity, why does UA re-register if it is going to be parted-out?


Prior to UA acquiring this aircraft, it was registered in Spain. With transfer of ownership to a US entity, it needed to be registered with the FAA.
 
dcajet
Posts: 5035
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Dec 25, 2020 2:09 am

jayunited wrote:
GmoneyCO wrote:
320:
N1913U - Delivered to UA and currently stored at GYR as of 17-Dec.  Flights from OSR were completed under the old registration information (EC-LQN).  Unsure whether this aircraft will be stored and inducted as its a 2004 build or whether it will be parted out and scrapped similar to the other ex-Vueling 320s.  


From what I can see in the system it appears as though the ex-Vueling jets will be parted out, while many of the ex-EasyJet jets will eventually be placed into service.


Do you know how many ex-Vueling jets were supposed to join the United fleet? Thanks.
 
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SumChristianus
Posts: 699
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Dec 25, 2020 2:20 am

dcajet wrote:
jayunited wrote:
GmoneyCO wrote:
320:
N1913U - Delivered to UA and currently stored at GYR as of 17-Dec.  Flights from OSR were completed under the old registration information (EC-LQN).  Unsure whether this aircraft will be stored and inducted as its a 2004 build or whether it will be parted out and scrapped similar to the other ex-Vueling 320s.  


From what I can see in the system it appears as though the ex-Vueling jets will be parted out, while many of the ex-EasyJet jets will eventually be placed into service.


Do you know how many ex-Vueling jets were supposed to join the United fleet? Thanks.


The best public/legal source I have says 4 to 5 more: calpsafltskeds's United Fleet Site: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/ ... o/htmlview

Most of the new used planes coming are apparently EasyJet as well as a few China Southern and Shaheen
 
dcajet
Posts: 5035
Joined: Sun Aug 01, 2004 9:31 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Dec 25, 2020 2:32 am

SumChristianus wrote:
dcajet wrote:
jayunited wrote:

From what I can see in the system it appears as though the ex-Vueling jets will be parted out, while many of the ex-EasyJet jets will eventually be placed into service.


Do you know how many ex-Vueling jets were supposed to join the United fleet? Thanks.


The best public/legal source I have says 4 to 5 more: calpsafltskeds's United Fleet Site: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/ ... o/htmlview

Most of the new used planes coming are apparently EasyJet as well as a few China Southern and Shaheen


Thanks!
 
VC10er
Posts: 4323
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:25 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Dec 25, 2020 9:09 am

rising wrote:
Just watched Scott Kirby on tv for an interview and just have to wonder if he could find a better venue for his virtual interviews and announcements. Has anyone else seen these from I believe his home office? This is not the interview from today but same angle....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9hQEupYGQM&t=531s

I thought he was at Buckingham Palace. Just not a good image for those on furlough.

Ed Bastian I saw the other day from the Delta Museum, and Doug Parker usually talks from the lobby at HQ or from a spartan room with just a poster of a AA jet in the back.

I know everyone is broadcasting from home... but it's a little tone deaf. Kirby seems like a nice fellow, but come on. Don't have a better spot in the basement? Not trying to be petty... but just had to vent!


I must say I was prepared for worse, but, it was still not a great idea to be in his “rich looking” home (unless that was a studio apartment! This is the fault of the PR team. Building out a collapsible back drop (executed well) would have been very fast to do and or create a mock office with a large model of a 77W and a modern desk lamp, EITHER SHOULD HAVE BEEN THE WAY TO GO. I’d fire the PR Account Manager!

Although given the job responsibilities Kirby has, I do not begrudge him a big beautiful house!
 
VC10er
Posts: 4323
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:25 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Dec 25, 2020 9:42 am

Opus99 wrote:
Okcflyer wrote:
Fleet wise any combination of 789/78J/A359/A35K/779 can work effectively. The decision is almost entirely dependent on commercial terms, both existing and future negotiations, with the airframe and engine suppliers.

UA may decide that operationally it’s a bit better to grow the 787 fleet rather than bringing the A350 series onboard. However, the cancellation/termination costs are likely way larger than those small savings. In that case, a new fleet type may be inducted.

Similarly, depending on oil costs and cost of capital, they may defer to 2030 or after. Either to wait on neo/pip’s models, or because of financing needs.

Ultimately, very little technical difference to argue fleet wide. There are a handful of routes A359 or A35K would be better on and there are routes the 787 solutions are. They appear to wash out technically, hence it will be almost entirely commercial reasons.

Btw, these situations give the buyer (UA) good leverage.

I think a 779 fleet is the biggest long shot (least likely). For a large network carrier, it’s better to divide the loads and open more pt-pt options (nonstops) which offer better yield. (Many may not realize it but passengers traveling non stop have the lowest seat cost per mile and handling costs, and the also yield the highest revenue per mile, significantly increasing margin).

779 are for single hub networks (most foreign carriers) that need higher capacity to feed hub banks off a large number of routes.

I get very confused at what exactly point to point is. So would it be something like LHR-BNA ? Or LHR-BWI so a hub to a second tier or more so second tier cities to second tier cities to like EDI TO PHL etc because if it’s second tier to second tier that market is just not as serviced as people think. the a350 and Dreamliners haven’t really opened that up at all, that’s what the A321XLR is going to do. They’ve just opened up hubs to smaller city routes as well as made hub to hub more efficient in some cases. Sorry for the digression I just want to find out exactly what point to point refers to


Point to Point would be if United started EWR to GIG (Rio) where the aircraft makes no stops or plane changes. Equally if United started flying nonstop from CTL (Charlotte) to GIG that to would be P to P.
As of today, and for decades, there are “direct flights” to GIG from EWR. They stop at IAH and pac must change planes, but it still considered a direct flight “notated as 1 stop)

I think people presumed that the 787 would spur P2P flying, more obscure routes such as BMI (Baltimore) to PEK (Beijing) but that has not happened yet, someone from Rockville MD will still have to get their nonstop from a hub.
BUT we have seen a number of routes go from 1 stop flight to nonstop flight: SFO-TLV, SFO-SIN, EWR-CPT (Cape Town) and many many more where transferring to another airline for the last leg, and often a long wait between flights.

Naturally there must be a demand to start an EWR-GIG to fill a 787 (or even a 767!)

I am hoping for a long distance nonstop on an A321XLR that would surprise us, Eg: EWR-GIG!
 
VC10er
Posts: 4323
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:25 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Fri Dec 25, 2020 10:48 am

When the 737MAX’s (not the tanscon max 10, configured with lie-flats) start arriving in significant numbers, which aircraft will they initially replace?
The oldest 737-8/9?
The oldest A319/20?

I cannot imagine them replacing the new but used Airbuses as clearly so much was invested on their 100% overhauls (or perhaps I’m being swayed by how perfect the new interiors were done? The new but used Airbuses are gorgeous inside. Where as the abundance of 737-800’s are the oldest looking by design and a horrible First Class seat. (Which signaled to me “not worth updating them)

There will come a tipping point where MORE aircraft have factory fresh and attractive, branded atmospheres with out number “yesteryears” interiors will become more apparent.

How much life is left in the massive 737-8 fleet.

Last: what fate awaits the 737-700? (Aren’t they the “just right” size ac for many domestic routes?)
 
TWA902fly
Posts: 3168
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 1999 5:47 am

Re: UA starting ANC-FAI?!

Fri Dec 25, 2020 8:46 pm

Last summer they operated 14x/week, 7x ORD-FAI, 4x DEN-FAI and 3x SFO-FAI. the SFO-FAI service was part of a government grant.

ORD-FAI and DEN-FAI seemed to do alright on their own, and I think the ANC-FAI tag may be a placeholder, if they get enough bookings on it, they might just put in a nonstop flight, better for customers than going the other way and switching their nonstop to a one-stop.

Or, they just don't anticipate enough traffic, but acknowledge there is a market. The flight connects with both DEN and ORD flights at ANC, as well as the SFO inbound and IAH outbound (see below). However, this puts them at a disadvantage to DL, AS, and AA in FAI. DL flies year round SEA-FAI, AS flies FAI-SEA, and their FAI-ANC connects to many more destinations. AA has announced DFW and ORD nonstop from FAI.

Here are the connecting flights: I chose the random date of 8/1/2021 for the schedules.

UA 0533 SFO ANC 1045-1440 738
UA 0280 DEN ANC 1135-1506 738
UA 1850 ORD ANC 1400-1742 739

>>> CONNECT TO

UA 0280 ANC FAI 1822-1926 738

UA 1959 FAI ANC 2017-2125 738

>>> CONNECTS TO

UA 2003 ANC ORD 2205-0705 739
UA 1883 ANC IAH 2240-0810 739
UA 1959 ANC DEN 2355-0700 738

Given how far out this is, how volatile airline scheduling has been, I doubt any of this is anywhere close to finite, but it is fun to speculate.

'902
 
Sevensixtyseven
Posts: 267
Joined: Mon May 30, 2011 3:33 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:40 am

VC10er wrote:
When the 737MAX’s (not the tanscon max 10, configured with lie-flats) start arriving in significant numbers, which aircraft will they initially replace?
The oldest 737-8/9?
The oldest A319/20?

I cannot imagine them replacing the new but used Airbuses as clearly so much was invested on their 100% overhauls (or perhaps I’m being swayed by how perfect the new interiors were done? The new but used Airbuses are gorgeous inside. Where as the abundance of 737-800’s are the oldest looking by design and a horrible First Class seat. (Which signaled to me “not worth updating them)

There will come a tipping point where MORE aircraft have factory fresh and attractive, branded atmospheres with out number “yesteryears” interiors will become more apparent.

How much life is left in the massive 737-8 fleet.

Last: what fate awaits the 737-700? (Aren’t they the “just right” size ac for many domestic routes?)


The -700s are in mostly decent shape. Most of them are IAH or EWR based, and they're usually doing some of the trickier Central/South American runs from IAH (BOG and TGU come to mind), as well as EWR-SXM and EWR-BOG, and EWR-SNA. I expect they'll stay around a while, because the A319 fleet isn't ETOPS. The -700s have ETOPS (as does the entire 737 fleet) and I believe (correct me if I'm wrong) slightly uprated engines over the baseline -700 config, to help with the shortest runways.

The interiors are refreshed, and don't look as ragged as most of the 32XX 738s in the fleet. Those things are long overdue for an interior refresh. I'm just glad the 737-900s are gone, albeit temporarily, they were some of the worst in the fleet as far as interior condition.
 
andrew1996
Posts: 154
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2020 6:41 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Dec 26, 2020 6:05 am

VC10er wrote:
rising wrote:
Just watched Scott Kirby on tv for an interview and just have to wonder if he could find a better venue for his virtual interviews and announcements. Has anyone else seen these from I believe his home office? This is not the interview from today but same angle....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9hQEupYGQM&t=531s

I thought he was at Buckingham Palace. Just not a good image for those on furlough.

Ed Bastian I saw the other day from the Delta Museum, and Doug Parker usually talks from the lobby at HQ or from a spartan room with just a poster of a AA jet in the back.

I know everyone is broadcasting from home... but it's a little tone deaf. Kirby seems like a nice fellow, but come on. Don't have a better spot in the basement? Not trying to be petty... but just had to vent!


I must say I was prepared for worse, but, it was still not a great idea to be in his “rich looking” home (unless that was a studio apartment! This is the fault of the PR team. Building out a collapsible back drop (executed well) would have been very fast to do and or create a mock office with a large model of a 77W and a modern desk lamp, EITHER SHOULD HAVE BEEN THE WAY TO GO. I’d fire the PR Account Manager!

Although given the job responsibilities Kirby has, I do not begrudge him a big beautiful house!


Could have used some of the official United Zoom wallpapers! I actually installed them on my Zoom. But I was expecting for the background to be more aviation themed with like some model airplanes at the min to at least give it some branding. I know if I worked for an airline one day I would for sure have model airplanes all over my office.

The Air Canada CEO Yotuube video background were always with Air Canada model airplanes in the backdrop.
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 6430
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Dec 26, 2020 3:22 pm

VC10er wrote:
Opus99 wrote:
Okcflyer wrote:
Fleet wise any combination of 789/78J/A359/A35K/779 can work effectively. The decision is almost entirely dependent on commercial terms, both existing and future negotiations, with the airframe and engine suppliers.

UA may decide that operationally it’s a bit better to grow the 787 fleet rather than bringing the A350 series onboard. However, the cancellation/termination costs are likely way larger than those small savings. In that case, a new fleet type may be inducted.

Similarly, depending on oil costs and cost of capital, they may defer to 2030 or after. Either to wait on neo/pip’s models, or because of financing needs.

Ultimately, very little technical difference to argue fleet wide. There are a handful of routes A359 or A35K would be better on and there are routes the 787 solutions are. They appear to wash out technically, hence it will be almost entirely commercial reasons.

Btw, these situations give the buyer (UA) good leverage.

I think a 779 fleet is the biggest long shot (least likely). For a large network carrier, it’s better to divide the loads and open more pt-pt options (nonstops) which offer better yield. (Many may not realize it but passengers traveling non stop have the lowest seat cost per mile and handling costs, and the also yield the highest revenue per mile, significantly increasing margin).

779 are for single hub networks (most foreign carriers) that need higher capacity to feed hub banks off a large number of routes.

I get very confused at what exactly point to point is. So would it be something like LHR-BNA ? Or LHR-BWI so a hub to a second tier or more so second tier cities to second tier cities to like EDI TO PHL etc because if it’s second tier to second tier that market is just not as serviced as people think. the a350 and Dreamliners haven’t really opened that up at all, that’s what the A321XLR is going to do. They’ve just opened up hubs to smaller city routes as well as made hub to hub more efficient in some cases. Sorry for the digression I just want to find out exactly what point to point refers to


Point to Point would be if United started EWR to GIG (Rio) where the aircraft makes no stops or plane changes. Equally if United started flying nonstop from CTL (Charlotte) to GIG that to would be P to P.
As of today, and for decades, there are “direct flights” to GIG from EWR. They stop at IAH and pac must change planes, but it still considered a direct flight “notated as 1 stop)

I think people presumed that the 787 would spur P2P flying, more obscure routes such as BMI (Baltimore) to PEK (Beijing) but that has not happened yet, someone from Rockville MD will still have to get their nonstop from a hub.
BUT we have seen a number of routes go from 1 stop flight to nonstop flight: SFO-TLV, SFO-SIN, EWR-CPT (Cape Town) and many many more where transferring to another airline for the last leg, and often a long wait between flights.

Naturally there must be a demand to start an EWR-GIG to fill a 787 (or even a 767!)

I am hoping for a long distance nonstop on an A321XLR that would surprise us, Eg: EWR-GIG!


The trend for some time will be to rely on JV partners as opposed to flying to a ton of secondary destinations.
 
splitterz
Posts: 200
Joined: Sat Apr 09, 2011 2:40 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Dec 26, 2020 9:51 pm

LAXdude1023 wrote:
VC10er wrote:
Opus99 wrote:
I get very confused at what exactly point to point is. So would it be something like LHR-BNA ? Or LHR-BWI so a hub to a second tier or more so second tier cities to second tier cities to like EDI TO PHL etc because if it’s second tier to second tier that market is just not as serviced as people think. the a350 and Dreamliners haven’t really opened that up at all, that’s what the A321XLR is going to do. They’ve just opened up hubs to smaller city routes as well as made hub to hub more efficient in some cases. Sorry for the digression I just want to find out exactly what point to point refers to


Point to Point would be if United started EWR to GIG (Rio) where the aircraft makes no stops or plane changes. Equally if United started flying nonstop from CTL (Charlotte) to GIG that to would be P to P.
As of today, and for decades, there are “direct flights” to GIG from EWR. They stop at IAH and pac must change planes, but it still considered a direct flight “notated as 1 stop)

I think people presumed that the 787 would spur P2P flying, more obscure routes such as BMI (Baltimore) to PEK (Beijing) but that has not happened yet, someone from Rockville MD will still have to get their nonstop from a hub.
BUT we have seen a number of routes go from 1 stop flight to nonstop flight: SFO-TLV, SFO-SIN, EWR-CPT (Cape Town) and many many more where transferring to another airline for the last leg, and often a long wait between flights.

Naturally there must be a demand to start an EWR-GIG to fill a 787 (or even a 767!)

I am hoping for a long distance nonstop on an A321XLR that would surprise us, Eg: EWR-GIG!


The trend for some time will be to rely on JV partners as opposed to flying to a ton of secondary destinations.


If the demand and yields can justify a secondary market, I’d expect United to launch flights to bypass JV hubs. I wouldn’t be surprised to see premium leisure destinations appear next summer in a vaccinated world. Similar to what United has done in PPT.
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 6430
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sat Dec 26, 2020 9:57 pm

splitterz wrote:
LAXdude1023 wrote:
VC10er wrote:

Point to Point would be if United started EWR to GIG (Rio) where the aircraft makes no stops or plane changes. Equally if United started flying nonstop from CTL (Charlotte) to GIG that to would be P to P.
As of today, and for decades, there are “direct flights” to GIG from EWR. They stop at IAH and pac must change planes, but it still considered a direct flight “notated as 1 stop)

I think people presumed that the 787 would spur P2P flying, more obscure routes such as BMI (Baltimore) to PEK (Beijing) but that has not happened yet, someone from Rockville MD will still have to get their nonstop from a hub.
BUT we have seen a number of routes go from 1 stop flight to nonstop flight: SFO-TLV, SFO-SIN, EWR-CPT (Cape Town) and many many more where transferring to another airline for the last leg, and often a long wait between flights.

Naturally there must be a demand to start an EWR-GIG to fill a 787 (or even a 767!)

I am hoping for a long distance nonstop on an A321XLR that would surprise us, Eg: EWR-GIG!


The trend for some time will be to rely on JV partners as opposed to flying to a ton of secondary destinations.


If the demand and yields can justify a secondary market, I’d expect United to launch flights to bypass JV hubs. I wouldn’t be surprised to see premium leisure destinations appear next summer in a vaccinated world. Similar to what United has done in PPT.


The number of them that would be justified is much smaller in 2020 vs 2019.
 
jayunited
Posts: 3589
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:03 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Dec 27, 2020 5:36 pm

What are the chances of Vistara joining STAR with United Airlines as their sponsor?

It seem like ever since United launched the codeshare with Vistara our passenger loads to/from DEL are up. I'm not suggesting high load factors translates into higher revenue or profitable flights that isn't the reason for the question. However looking at the data Vistara has extended United's reach across India and is proving themselves to be a much more successful partner than Air India. In addition to local passengers we are seeing a lot more connecting passengers, connecting to/from UA's flights at DEL in particular.

UA's BOM-EWR flight is more of an O&D flight with very few connections coming out of BOM.
 
Ishrion
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Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:17 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Dec 27, 2020 5:44 pm

jayunited wrote:
What are the chances of Vistara joining STAR with United Airlines as their sponsor?

It seem like ever since United launched the codeshare with Vistara our passenger loads to/from DEL are up. I'm not suggesting high load factors translates into higher revenue or profitable flights that isn't the reason for the question. However looking at the data Vistara has extended United's reach across India and is proving themselves to be a much more successful partner than Air India. In addition to local passengers we are seeing a lot more connecting passengers, connecting to/from UA's flights at DEL in particular.

UA's BOM-EWR flight is more of an O&D flight with very few connections coming out of BOM.


Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if that happened. However, would that affect Air India in any way?

Or, with the Tata Group potentially buying Air India, that could pave the way for them to join Star Alliance.
 
User avatar
LAXintl
Posts: 25484
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Dec 27, 2020 6:08 pm

jayunited wrote:
What are the chances of Vistara joining STAR with United Airlines as their sponsor?


First, if anyone would sponsor them it would be SIA which owns 49% of Vistara.

But even more importantly that won't happen, because, under Star rules, membership must be by unanimous agreement, and you already have Air India as a member who would not look kindly.
 
jayunited
Posts: 3589
Joined: Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:03 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Sun Dec 27, 2020 9:20 pm

LAXintl wrote:
jayunited wrote:
What are the chances of Vistara joining STAR with United Airlines as their sponsor?


First, if anyone would sponsor them it would be SIA which owns 49% of Vistara.

But even more importantly that won't happen, because, under Star rules, membership must be by unanimous agreement, and you already have Air India as a member who would not look kindly.



It is amazing United doesn't have a close partnership with SQ who is a STAR member but they have a great partnership with Vistara which SIA owns 49%.

What if STAR wanted to swap Air India for Vistara is there any loophole would all that type of scenario to play out?

I'm not sure how the partnership between AI and other members of STAR is going but UA and AI don't have much of a partnership whereas our codeshare with Vistara is paying off at least in terms of passengers, I don't know if it is paying off revenue wise.

From what I'm hearing (and this is strictly rumor), I'm hearing UA is looking at perhaps adding another India flight in 2022 either out of EWR or IAD. I can't help but wonder how much of UA's current and perhaps future plans in India are hinge on a successful codeshare with Vistara an airline that from an outsiders perspective seems to have a strong domestic network in India, and what would happen to UA in India if Vistara were to join OneWorld or Sky.
 
rjbesikof
Posts: 289
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2020 4:21 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:18 am

jayunited wrote:
LAXintl wrote:
jayunited wrote:
What are the chances of Vistara joining STAR with United Airlines as their sponsor?


First, if anyone would sponsor them it would be SIA which owns 49% of Vistara.

But even more importantly that won't happen, because, under Star rules, membership must be by unanimous agreement, and you already have Air India as a member who would not look kindly.



It is amazing United doesn't have a close partnership with SQ who is a STAR member but they have a great partnership with Vistara which SIA owns 49%.

What if STAR wanted to swap Air India for Vistara is there any loophole would all that type of scenario to play out?

I'm not sure how the partnership between AI and other members of STAR is going but UA and AI don't have much of a partnership whereas our codeshare with Vistara is paying off at least in terms of passengers, I don't know if it is paying off revenue wise.

From what I'm hearing (and this is strictly rumor), I'm hearing UA is looking at perhaps adding another India flight in 2022 either out of EWR or IAD. I can't help but wonder how much of UA's current and perhaps future plans in India are hinge on a successful codeshare with Vistara an airline that from an outsiders perspective seems to have a strong domestic network in India, and what would happen to UA in India if Vistara were to join OneWorld or Sky.


Is ORD-DEL doing well right now? If so, that could bode well for another India flight.
 
atal17
Posts: 461
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2014 5:56 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:04 am

rjbesikof wrote:
jayunited wrote:
LAXintl wrote:

First, if anyone would sponsor them it would be SIA which owns 49% of Vistara.

But even more importantly that won't happen, because, under Star rules, membership must be by unanimous agreement, and you already have Air India as a member who would not look kindly.



It is amazing United doesn't have a close partnership with SQ who is a STAR member but they have a great partnership with Vistara which SIA owns 49%.

What if STAR wanted to swap Air India for Vistara is there any loophole would all that type of scenario to play out?

I'm not sure how the partnership between AI and other members of STAR is going but UA and AI don't have much of a partnership whereas our codeshare with Vistara is paying off at least in terms of passengers, I don't know if it is paying off revenue wise.

From what I'm hearing (and this is strictly rumor), I'm hearing UA is looking at perhaps adding another India flight in 2022 either out of EWR or IAD. I can't help but wonder how much of UA's current and perhaps future plans in India are hinge on a successful codeshare with Vistara an airline that from an outsiders perspective seems to have a strong domestic network in India, and what would happen to UA in India if Vistara were to join OneWorld or Sky.


Is ORD-DEL doing well right now? If so, that could bode well for another India flight.


IMHO, it’s too early to speculate on how UA is doing on any India-US routes, considering that the ME3 is locked out of transfer traffic at this stage. Once that resumes, it’ll give a better picture if UA still holds dominance in that region.
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 6430
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 28, 2020 3:42 pm

jayunited wrote:
LAXintl wrote:
jayunited wrote:
What are the chances of Vistara joining STAR with United Airlines as their sponsor?


First, if anyone would sponsor them it would be SIA which owns 49% of Vistara.

But even more importantly that won't happen, because, under Star rules, membership must be by unanimous agreement, and you already have Air India as a member who would not look kindly.



It is amazing United doesn't have a close partnership with SQ who is a STAR member but they have a great partnership with Vistara which SIA owns 49%.

What if STAR wanted to swap Air India for Vistara is there any loophole would all that type of scenario to play out?

I'm not sure how the partnership between AI and other members of STAR is going but UA and AI don't have much of a partnership whereas our codeshare with Vistara is paying off at least in terms of passengers, I don't know if it is paying off revenue wise.

From what I'm hearing (and this is strictly rumor), I'm hearing UA is looking at perhaps adding another India flight in 2022 either out of EWR or IAD. I can't help but wonder how much of UA's current and perhaps future plans in India are hinge on a successful codeshare with Vistara an airline that from an outsiders perspective seems to have a strong domestic network in India, and what would happen to UA in India if Vistara were to join OneWorld or Sky.


From what I recall, SQ doesnt want a closer relationship with UA. They are one of the most distant members of Star Alliance.
 
andrew1996
Posts: 154
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2020 6:41 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 28, 2020 4:39 pm

jayunited wrote:
LAXintl wrote:
jayunited wrote:
What are the chances of Vistara joining STAR with United Airlines as their sponsor?


First, if anyone would sponsor them it would be SIA which owns 49% of Vistara.

But even more importantly that won't happen, because, under Star rules, membership must be by unanimous agreement, and you already have Air India as a member who would not look kindly.



It is amazing United doesn't have a close partnership with SQ who is a STAR member but they have a great partnership with Vistara which SIA owns 49%.

What if STAR wanted to swap Air India for Vistara is there any loophole would all that type of scenario to play out?

I'm not sure how the partnership between AI and other members of STAR is going but UA and AI don't have much of a partnership whereas our codeshare with Vistara is paying off at least in terms of passengers, I don't know if it is paying off revenue wise.

From what I'm hearing (and this is strictly rumor), I'm hearing UA is looking at perhaps adding another India flight in 2022 either out of EWR or IAD. I can't help but wonder how much of UA's current and perhaps future plans in India are hinge on a successful codeshare with Vistara an airline that from an outsiders perspective seems to have a strong domestic network in India, and what would happen to UA in India if Vistara were to join OneWorld or Sky.



I remember getting off UA's direct SIN service once and a nontrivial amount of people were asking at the luggage hall where the AIr India transit desk is, albeit I believe they bought the Air India segment on a separate ticket and hence why they were clearing immigration etc to begin with as opposed to air side transit. I wonder if SIN will also be used to help funnel transit passengers on Vistara in the future? I believe the vast majority of UA29/1 pax have SIN as their final destination currently as if SIN is not they likely would have transited elsewhere (e.g., NRT to use NH to reach other points in South East ASia). It is a geographical detour but it may be more efficient in allowing for secondary destinations in India. SQ traditionally was. a major player in the USA-SIN market histrocially because it served the secondary Indian cities too. I still remember a few years ago I flew SQ1 and the economy class menu had an "International Selection" with a Western or Chinese main course and an "Indian Selection" where there was an indian option; however, the flight attendants only offered the International Selection to passengers.

Did SQ have a say in the Vistara/UA partnership? I also recall a few years ago that SQ was hoping to use Vistara to help SQ better compete with the likes of EK/QR and I think partnership with Vistara to USA was considered too. In any event, this partnership is probably crucial to fulfill Vistara's international ambitions and in allowing Vistara to seriously compete with the likes of EK and QR.
 
User avatar
Acey559
Posts: 1468
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 28, 2020 5:13 pm

rjbesikof wrote:
jayunited wrote:
LAXintl wrote:

First, if anyone would sponsor them it would be SIA which owns 49% of Vistara.

But even more importantly that won't happen, because, under Star rules, membership must be by unanimous agreement, and you already have Air India as a member who would not look kindly.



It is amazing United doesn't have a close partnership with SQ who is a STAR member but they have a great partnership with Vistara which SIA owns 49%.

What if STAR wanted to swap Air India for Vistara is there any loophole would all that type of scenario to play out?

I'm not sure how the partnership between AI and other members of STAR is going but UA and AI don't have much of a partnership whereas our codeshare with Vistara is paying off at least in terms of passengers, I don't know if it is paying off revenue wise.

From what I'm hearing (and this is strictly rumor), I'm hearing UA is looking at perhaps adding another India flight in 2022 either out of EWR or IAD. I can't help but wonder how much of UA's current and perhaps future plans in India are hinge on a successful codeshare with Vistara an airline that from an outsiders perspective seems to have a strong domestic network in India, and what would happen to UA in India if Vistara were to join OneWorld or Sky.


Is ORD-DEL doing well right now? If so, that could bode well for another India flight.


I have no idea if the flight is actually doing well financially, but I was checking loads on ORD-DEL all last week and the flight was full or nearly so (except in Polaris, it was about 1/2-3/4 full) every day. Obviously this doesn’t mean much, but on the face of it I was surprised how full the flights were, especially being only a couple weeks after launch.
 
CHIMAA
Posts: 12
Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 9:41 pm

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 28, 2020 10:52 pm

Why these bad timings where you are stuck in Delhi overnight for any connection to hyd,blr,maa or any place in india. so obviously you have to sell these for flights in economy at $600 per round trip to fill your seats.

They should move the flights by 3 hours starting from ORD at 3.25 pm to arrive in delhi by 5.10 pm to get connections to all of india. Again returns can be moved by 2 hours to start at 11.55 pm to arrive at 3.50 am to ORD so that people connect seamlessly and also good start times.

existing times

6:25 pm Chicago, IL, US (ORD)Arriving8:10 pm Delhi, IN (DEL)
1:55 am Delhi, IN (DEL)Arriving5:50 am Chicago, IL, US (ORD)


change times needed

3:25 pm Chicago, IL, US (ORD)Arriving 5:10 pm Delhi, IN (DEL)
11:55 pm Delhi, IN (DEL)Arriving 3:50 am Chicago, IL, US (ORD)


Similarly they should tweak EWR to DEL & BOM flights to arrive by 5 pm to delhi and bom.

rjbesikof wrote:
jayunited wrote:
LAXintl wrote:

First, if anyone would sponsor them it would be SIA which owns 49% of Vistara.

But even more importantly that won't happen, because, under Star rules, membership must be by unanimous agreement, and you already have Air India as a member who would not look kindly.



It is amazing United doesn't have a close partnership with SQ who is a STAR member but they have a great partnership with Vistara which SIA owns 49%.

What if STAR wanted to swap Air India for Vistara is there any loophole would all that type of scenario to play out?

I'm not sure how the partnership between AI and other members of STAR is going but UA and AI don't have much of a partnership whereas our codeshare with Vistara is paying off at least in terms of passengers, I don't know if it is paying off revenue wise.

From what I'm hearing (and this is strictly rumor), I'm hearing UA is looking at perhaps adding another India flight in 2022 either out of EWR or IAD. I can't help but wonder how much of UA's current and perhaps future plans in India are hinge on a successful codeshare with Vistara an airline that from an outsiders perspective seems to have a strong domestic network in India, and what would happen to UA in India if Vistara were to join OneWorld or Sky.


Is ORD-DEL doing well right now? If so, that could bode well for another India flight.
 
ual4life
Posts: 49
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2010 8:10 am

Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Mon Dec 28, 2020 11:28 pm

LAXdude1023 wrote:
jayunited wrote:
LAXintl wrote:

First, if anyone would sponsor them it would be SIA which owns 49% of Vistara.

But even more importantly that won't happen, because, under Star rules, membership must be by unanimous agreement, and you already have Air India as a member who would not look kindly.



It is amazing United doesn't have a close partnership with SQ who is a STAR member but they have a great partnership with Vistara which SIA owns 49%.

What if STAR wanted to swap Air India for Vistara is there any loophole would all that type of scenario to play out?

I'm not sure how the partnership between AI and other members of STAR is going but UA and AI don't have much of a partnership whereas our codeshare with Vistara is paying off at least in terms of passengers, I don't know if it is paying off revenue wise.

From what I'm hearing (and this is strictly rumor), I'm hearing UA is looking at perhaps adding another India flight in 2022 either out of EWR or IAD. I can't help but wonder how much of UA's current and perhaps future plans in India are hinge on a successful codeshare with Vistara an airline that from an outsiders perspective seems to have a strong domestic network in India, and what would happen to UA in India if Vistara were to join OneWorld or Sky.


From what I recall, SQ doesnt want a closer relationship with UA. They are one of the most distant members of Star Alliance.


This. It’s more amazing that SQ is still in *A than anything.
 
Pinto
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Re: United Fleet, Network, & Livery Thread - 2020

Tue Dec 29, 2020 2:58 am

CHIMAA wrote:
Why these bad timings where you are stuck in Delhi overnight for any connection to hyd,blr,maa or any place in india. so obviously you have to sell these for flights in economy at $600 per round trip to fill your seats.

They should move the flights by 3 hours starting from ORD at 3.25 pm to arrive in delhi by 5.10 pm to get connections to all of india. Again returns can be moved by 2 hours to start at 11.55 pm to arrive at 3.50 am to ORD so that people connect seamlessly and also good start times.

existing times

6:25 pm Chicago, IL, US (ORD)Arriving8:10 pm Delhi, IN (DEL)
1:55 am Delhi, IN (DEL)Arriving5:50 am Chicago, IL, US (ORD)


change times needed

3:25 pm Chicago, IL, US (ORD)Arriving 5:10 pm Delhi, IN (DEL)
11:55 pm Delhi, IN (DEL)Arriving 3:50 am Chicago, IL, US (ORD)


Similarly they should tweak EWR to DEL & BOM flights to arrive by 5 pm to delhi and bom.

rjbesikof wrote:
jayunited wrote:


It is amazing United doesn't have a close partnership with SQ who is a STAR member but they have a great partnership with Vistara which SIA owns 49%.

What if STAR wanted to swap Air India for Vistara is there any loophole would all that type of scenario to play out?

I'm not sure how the partnership between AI and other members of STAR is going but UA and AI don't have much of a partnership whereas our codeshare with Vistara is paying off at least in terms of passengers, I don't know if it is paying off revenue wise.

From what I'm hearing (and this is strictly rumor), I'm hearing UA is looking at perhaps adding another India flight in 2022 either out of EWR or IAD. I can't help but wonder how much of UA's current and perhaps future plans in India are hinge on a successful codeshare with Vistara an airline that from an outsiders perspective seems to have a strong domestic network in India, and what would happen to UA in India if Vistara were to join OneWorld or Sky.


Is ORD-DEL doing well right now? If so, that could bode well for another India flight.


First off 3:50 is terrible arrival time into ORD, also CBP wouldn't be open then. UA is catering to the USA travelers not the Indian travelers

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