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ryanflyer
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Thu Apr 16, 2020 12:25 am

One has to wonder, wouldn’t it be more cost effective to take all of the seats out the 767s since they won’t be coming back rather than having to take seats out of the A330s and putting them back in later? Though maybe he’s referring to the A333 in which case it’s the same point as the 767.
 
AA321T
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Thu Apr 16, 2020 12:55 am

American is also currently upgrading the AVOD hardware on the A332 fleet in the Main Cabin which removes the old screen and hardware and installs the new hardware in the same space. I wonder if this is something that could be completed while the seats are removed from the aircraft reducing the need for additional downtime later on.
 
Miamiairport
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Thu Apr 16, 2020 1:35 am

Boof02671 wrote:
N62NA wrote:
deltaffindfw wrote:
Parker said on CNBC today saying they are waiting on FAA approval to remove seats from some wide body planes for cargo purposes.


That's interesting. I guess it means all the seats on the plane would be removed, but would be interesting if they did a "combi" on them.

Not permissible, one it’s unsafe and two the plane was never certified in that configuration


AS had a cargo/pax 734. I remember seeing them at ANC. They were used for inter AK flights. Half of the plane had the windows covered up. I have no idea what it looked like inside or what AS did to get approval for such an a/c.
 
Boof02671
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Thu Apr 16, 2020 2:47 am

Miamiairport wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
N62NA wrote:

That's interesting. I guess it means all the seats on the plane would be removed, but would be interesting if they did a "combi" on them.

Not permissible, one it’s unsafe and two the plane was never certified in that configuration


AS had a cargo/pax 734. I remember seeing them at ANC. They were used for inter AK flights. Half of the plane had the windows covered up. I have no idea what it looked like inside or what AS did to get approval for such an a/c.

Those planes had a pressure bulkhead which separated the passenger and cargo compartments. There was no cargo in the same cabin as passengers and the plane is certified by the FAA.
 
OB1504
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Thu Apr 16, 2020 6:22 am

Detroit313 wrote:
LawAndOrder wrote:
Detroit313 wrote:
I have to say, I flew on an Oasis 321 and it was very nice.

The bins were like nothing I have ever seen on a narrowbody airplane in the US. They were enormous. Did Airbus make those bins specifically for AA? It is really shocking how big they are.

Also, power and USB ports at every seat.

The tablet holders are pretty neat too and I like how the USB port is right next to the tablet holder.

Personally, I like Delta's 321. Delta does not have tablet holders with USB ports next to them, their overhead bins as not as big and impressive as AA's and the exit rows at 2L&R and 3L&R do not have as much space as AA offers.

Not to mention that Delta's AFT lavs are tiny and squeezed INSIDE the AFT galley. You have to go through the flight attendants' work space in order to get to the lav which is not nice. I am glad AA has kept the lavs out of the AFT galley.


All these differences allowed for a more uniformed experience in coach. This why majority of Rows on delta 321s have 31 or more inches of legroom. If u want more room get comfort plus. Delta has a usb on the screen that I use for my tablet in the very rare case that I use it.

Also delta 321 have 192 I saw a previous poster say delta has 196.


That's still MORE seats than on LAA, LUS and Oasis 321.


Seat count is only part of it. Delta’s interior is more comfortable than AA’s with better amenities and they still managed to put more seats into the airplane.

PI4EVR wrote:
I would think the 332's will fly CLT/PHL-LHR routes as they offer a PE cabin versus the 333 which appears to have been retired.
As to when that service will resume will be a couple months away and once established it will be easy to get these aircraft back to flying and with crew bases currently in CLT and PHL, it would be beneficial to have the aircraft on that premium route.
It traditionally also flies to CDG from both cities so easy use of this subfleet to those two key markets.


I could also see some of the A330s finding their way to MIA for Latin American missions now that the 767 is gone.
 
chonetsao
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Thu Apr 16, 2020 1:00 pm

AA321T wrote:
American is also currently upgrading the AVOD hardware on the A332 fleet in the Main Cabin which removes the old screen and hardware and installs the new hardware in the same space. I wonder if this is something that could be completed while the seats are removed from the aircraft reducing the need for additional downtime later on.


You would think such practical ideas must be a great way to do things in AA. However, I just do not see how the current AA management be that sensible! :stirthepot:
 
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cathay747
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Thu Apr 16, 2020 3:23 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
Miamiairport wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
Not permissible, one it’s unsafe and two the plane was never certified in that configuration


AS had a cargo/pax 734. I remember seeing them at ANC. They were used for inter AK flights. Half of the plane had the windows covered up. I have no idea what it looked like inside or what AS did to get approval for such an a/c.

Those planes had a pressure bulkhead which separated the passenger and cargo compartments. There was no cargo in the same cabin as passengers and the plane is certified by the FAA.


Exactly. They were all-pax aircraft modified into combi's with a FAA STC.
Try a Little VC-10derness
 
ryby92
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Thu Apr 16, 2020 3:41 pm

OB1504 wrote:
Detroit313 wrote:
LawAndOrder wrote:

All these differences allowed for a more uniformed experience in coach. This why majority of Rows on delta 321s have 31 or more inches of legroom. If u want more room get comfort plus. Delta has a usb on the screen that I use for my tablet in the very rare case that I use it.

Also delta 321 have 192 I saw a previous poster say delta has 196.


That's still MORE seats than on LAA, LUS and Oasis 321.


Seat count is only part of it. Delta’s interior is more comfortable than AA’s with better amenities and they still managed to put more seats into the airplane.

PI4EVR wrote:
I would think the 332's will fly CLT/PHL-LHR routes as they offer a PE cabin versus the 333 which appears to have been retired.
As to when that service will resume will be a couple months away and once established it will be easy to get these aircraft back to flying and with crew bases currently in CLT and PHL, it would be beneficial to have the aircraft on that premium route.
It traditionally also flies to CDG from both cities so easy use of this subfleet to those two key markets.


I could also see some of the A330s finding their way to MIA for Latin American missions now that the 767 is gone.


They sacrificed galley and toilet space to achieve the higher seat count. So you have to go through the much smaller galley area to reach the much tinier bathroom. The same tiny bathroom on the MAX that every one complains about but Delta gets a pass. Plus they have smaller bins.
 
Runway28L
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Thu Apr 16, 2020 4:38 pm

 
anymaninfc
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Fri Apr 17, 2020 4:50 pm

Runway28L wrote:


Also treking PITS to ROW today are
N286AY on AAL9611
N282AY on AAL9612
 
OB1504
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sat Apr 18, 2020 3:41 am

ryby92 wrote:
OB1504 wrote:
Detroit313 wrote:

That's still MORE seats than on LAA, LUS and Oasis 321.


Seat count is only part of it. Delta’s interior is more comfortable than AA’s with better amenities and they still managed to put more seats into the airplane.

PI4EVR wrote:
I would think the 332's will fly CLT/PHL-LHR routes as they offer a PE cabin versus the 333 which appears to have been retired.
As to when that service will resume will be a couple months away and once established it will be easy to get these aircraft back to flying and with crew bases currently in CLT and PHL, it would be beneficial to have the aircraft on that premium route.
It traditionally also flies to CDG from both cities so easy use of this subfleet to those two key markets.


I could also see some of the A330s finding their way to MIA for Latin American missions now that the 767 is gone.


They sacrificed galley and toilet space to achieve the higher seat count. So you have to go through the much smaller galley area to reach the much tinier bathroom. The same tiny bathroom on the MAX that every one complains about but Delta gets a pass. Plus they have smaller bins.


Delta didn’t plan to deploy the A321 on long sectors. They don’t even have auxiliary fuel tanks installed. A smaller galley and lav isn’t as big of an issue on a 2 hour flight to Atlanta.

AA, on the other hand, was happily about to deploy the MAX with 30” pitch, no IFE, and Barbie sized lavs on 8 hour flights like MIA-BSB.
 
rising
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sat Apr 18, 2020 11:40 pm

Well, it sounds like they're moving ahead with Oasis whether we like it or not.... Does anyone know the work schedule on the mods? How many planes in at a time....have them been accelerated due to the downtime?
If it doesn't make sense, it's probably not true.
 
anymaninfc
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 1:48 am

AA moved A333, N270AY, from PIT to ROW today. One remaining -300, N274AY, is still in El Salvador in maintenance.
 
B757capt
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 2:59 am

rising wrote:
Well, it sounds like they're moving ahead with Oasis whether we like it or not.... Does anyone know the work schedule on the mods? How many planes in at a time....have them been accelerated due to the downtime?

It’s shocking to me that so many arm chair CEOs think this MOD will stop. It’s been in every investor presentation and makes complete sense for the airline to have a common configuration. Hate the seat map or not, it’s happening.
The views written by this user are in no manner the views of my employer and should not be thought as such.
 
Runway28L
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 3:02 am

anymaninfc wrote:
AA moved A333, N270AY, from PIT to ROW today. One remaining -300, N274AY, is still in El Salvador in maintenance.

270 still at PIT. Ferry flight this morning was cancelled.

Edit: My bad, looks like it did leave this morning.
 
anymaninfc
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 4:01 am

Runway28L wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:
AA moved A333, N270AY, from PIT to ROW today. One remaining -300, N274AY, is still in El Salvador in maintenance.

270 still at PIT. Ferry flight this morning was cancelled.

Edit: My bad, looks like it did leave this morning.


That was A332, N281AY which was supposed to go to ROW, but did not. Don't know the reason.
 
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FLALEFTY
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 4:28 am

anymaninfc wrote:
Runway28L wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:
AA moved A333, N270AY, from PIT to ROW today. One remaining -300, N274AY, is still in El Salvador in maintenance.

270 still at PIT. Ferry flight this morning was cancelled.

Edit: My bad, looks like it did leave this morning.


That was A332, N281AY which was supposed to go to ROW, but did not. Don't know the reason.


https://www.planespotters.net/airline/American-Airlines

It appears that most of the A332's & A333's have made the one-way trip to ROW. I imagine these will join the 767's, which are now officially retired. I also think the 757's are done, too.

When the dust settles, it looks like AA will have their fleet down to A319/320/321CEO's, A321NEO's, B738's (but not as many), B738MAX's, B777's, and B787's going forward.
 
anymaninfc
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 8:05 am

FLALEFTY wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:
Runway28L wrote:
270 still at PIT. Ferry flight this morning was cancelled.

Edit: My bad, looks like it did leave this morning.


That was A332, N281AY which was supposed to go to ROW, but did not. Don't know the reason.


https://www.planespotters.net/airline/American-Airlines

It appears that most of the A332's & A333's have made the one-way trip to ROW. I imagine these will join the 767's, which are now officially retired. I also think the 757's are done, too.

When the dust settles, it looks like AA will have their fleet down to A319/320/321CEO's, A321NEO's, B738's (but not as many), B738MAX's, B777's, and B787's going forward.


A333 N274AY - El Salvador in maint.
A332 N281AY, N285AY - PIT
A332 N284AY, N291AY - El Salvador in maint. So far, AA hasn't announced the retirement of A332s, so will probably depend of economy bounceback
 
Lootess
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 10:56 am

anymaninfc wrote:
FLALEFTY wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:

That was A332, N281AY which was supposed to go to ROW, but did not. Don't know the reason.


https://www.planespotters.net/airline/American-Airlines

It appears that most of the A332's & A333's have made the one-way trip to ROW. I imagine these will join the 767's, which are now officially retired. I also think the 757's are done, too.

When the dust settles, it looks like AA will have their fleet down to A319/320/321CEO's, A321NEO's, B738's (but not as many), B738MAX's, B777's, and B787's going forward.


A333 N274AY - El Salvador in maint.
A332 N281AY, N285AY - PIT
A332 N284AY, N291AY - El Salvador in maint. So far, AA hasn't announced the retirement of A332s, so will probably depend of economy bounceback


DL parked all their A332s, be interesting to see if AA returns those LUS A332 aircraft, or will the 767s be enough to retire.
 
JohanTally
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 11:18 am

FLALEFTY wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:
Runway28L wrote:
270 still at PIT. Ferry flight this morning was cancelled.

Edit: My bad, looks like it did leave this morning.


That was A332, N281AY which was supposed to go to ROW, but did not. Don't know the reason.


https://www.planespotters.net/airline/American-Airlines

It appears that most of the A332's & A333's have made the one-way trip to ROW. I imagine these will join the 767's, which are now officially retired. I also think the 757's are done, too.

When the dust settles, it looks like AA will have their fleet down to A319/320/321CEO's, A321NEO's, B738's (but not as many), B738MAX's, B777's, and B787's going forward.


CLT is a 330 only widebody base which will eventually return flying to LHR FRA and probably MUC. This will most likely be on the 332 which has a decent interior with PE. Unless they find someone to buy the 332s which is unlikely, they will be around for quite some time.
 
chonetsao
Posts: 592
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 11:54 am

JohanTally wrote:
FLALEFTY wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:

That was A332, N281AY which was supposed to go to ROW, but did not. Don't know the reason.


https://www.planespotters.net/airline/American-Airlines

It appears that most of the A332's & A333's have made the one-way trip to ROW. I imagine these will join the 767's, which are now officially retired. I also think the 757's are done, too.

When the dust settles, it looks like AA will have their fleet down to A319/320/321CEO's, A321NEO's, B738's (but not as many), B738MAX's, B777's, and B787's going forward.


CLT is a 330 only widebody base which will eventually return flying to LHR FRA and probably MUC. This will most likely be on the 332 which has a decent interior with PE. Unless they find someone to buy the 332s which is unlikely, they will be around for quite some time.


Yes I agree. AA's A332 is relatively young. Its capacity is great for secondary international routes and summer only seasonal route. I doubt AA is to retire the A332 yet.
 
NYCAAer
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 3:30 pm

FLALEFTY wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:
Runway28L wrote:
270 still at PIT. Ferry flight this morning was cancelled.

Edit: My bad, looks like it did leave this morning.


That was A332, N281AY which was supposed to go to ROW, but did not. Don't know the reason.


https://www.planespotters.net/airline/American-Airlines

It appears that most of the A332's & A333's have made the one-way trip to ROW. I imagine these will join the 767's, which are now officially retired. I also think the 757's are done, too.

When the dust settles, it looks like AA will have their fleet down to A319/320/321CEO's, A321NEO's, B738's (but not as many), B738MAX's, B777's, and B787's going forward.


The 15 A332s are staying for the PHL and CLT hubs.
 
anymaninfc
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 4:00 pm

AA's E190, N963UW is enroute PIT to ROW today, 4-19. Three still at PIT awaiting movement to ROW.
 
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FLALEFTY
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 4:22 pm

NYCAAer wrote:
FLALEFTY wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:

That was A332, N281AY which was supposed to go to ROW, but did not. Don't know the reason.


https://www.planespotters.net/airline/American-Airlines

It appears that most of the A332's & A333's have made the one-way trip to ROW. I imagine these will join the 767's, which are now officially retired. I also think the 757's are done, too.

When the dust settles, it looks like AA will have their fleet down to A319/320/321CEO's, A321NEO's, B738's (but not as many), B738MAX's, B777's, and B787's going forward.


The 15 A332s are staying for the PHL and CLT hubs.


Before COVID-19 struck, AA was planning to convert the Trans-Atlantic flying from PHL to 787's and A321XLR's. But it is true that the A330's have been the Trans-Atlantic planes of choice from CLT and there didn't seem to be an immediate pre-COVID plan to change that. AA did have plans (pre-COVID-19) to retire the A333 fleet in a few years (2022-23ish). Perhaps they will take advantage of this downswing to accelerate the A333's retirements? Just speculating...

Not sure what they plan for the A332's, but with most of them now stored in ROW (AA's favorite "rest home"), you have to wonder about their future. If they were stored in TUL (home of AA's largest maintenance base), or BFM (home to one of their favorite maintenance contractors) then the prospect for a quick return to service for the A332's would seem to be greater.
 
miaami
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 4:54 pm

2 additional widebodies back in service. A 777-300 and a 789
7LM N728AN https://flightaware.com/live/flight/AAL9651
8LV N838AA https://flightaware.com/live/flight/AAL9654
Last edited by miaami on Sun Apr 19, 2020 5:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Ishrion
Topic Author
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 5:00 pm

miaami wrote:
2 additional widebodies back in service. A 777-300 and a 789
7LM N728AN https://flightaware.com/live/flight/AAL965
8LV N838AA https://flightaware.com/live/flight/AAL9654


Nice to see a 789 back and operating the LAX-ICN cargo flight.
 
Vctony
Posts: 663
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 6:48 pm

NYCAAer wrote:
FLALEFTY wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:

That was A332, N281AY which was supposed to go to ROW, but did not. Don't know the reason.


https://www.planespotters.net/airline/American-Airlines

It appears that most of the A332's & A333's have made the one-way trip to ROW. I imagine these will join the 767's, which are now officially retired. I also think the 757's are done, too.

When the dust settles, it looks like AA will have their fleet down to A319/320/321CEO's, A321NEO's, B738's (but not as many), B738MAX's, B777's, and B787's going forward.


The 15 A332s are staying for the PHL and CLT hubs.


Curious if DL would want the A332s to finish off their 763 fleet.
 
CriticalPoint
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 7:21 pm

Vctony wrote:
NYCAAer wrote:
FLALEFTY wrote:

https://www.planespotters.net/airline/American-Airlines

It appears that most of the A332's & A333's have made the one-way trip to ROW. I imagine these will join the 767's, which are now officially retired. I also think the 757's are done, too.

When the dust settles, it looks like AA will have their fleet down to A319/320/321CEO's, A321NEO's, B738's (but not as many), B738MAX's, B777's, and B787's going forward.


The 15 A332s are staying for the PHL and CLT hubs.


Curious if DL would want the A332s to finish off their 763 fleet.


Sure......because DL needs more airplanes....they are killing it right now.
 
SXDFC
Posts: 2028
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 7:30 pm

Are there some 738s that wont be coming back?
 
anymaninfc
Posts: 273
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 7:51 pm

SXDFC wrote:
Are there some 738s that wont be coming back?


Probably those that joined the fleet in 1999-2000.
 
OB1504
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 8:47 pm

AA sent a 777 to CLT for familiarization purposes a few days ago. They’re also sending a 787 to MIA tomorrow for the same reason.

The A330-200s may not be sticking around either.
 
JohanTally
Posts: 130
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 9:56 pm

FLALEFTY wrote:
NYCAAer wrote:
FLALEFTY wrote:

https://www.planespotters.net/airline/American-Airlines

It appears that most of the A332's & A333's have made the one-way trip to ROW. I imagine these will join the 767's, which are now officially retired. I also think the 757's are done, too.

When the dust settles, it looks like AA will have their fleet down to A319/320/321CEO's, A321NEO's, B738's (but not as many), B738MAX's, B777's, and B787's going forward.


The 15 A332s are staying for the PHL and CLT hubs.


Before COVID-19 struck, AA was planning to convert the Trans-Atlantic flying from PHL to 787's and A321XLR's. But it is true that the A330's have been the Trans-Atlantic planes of choice from CLT and there didn't seem to be an immediate pre-COVID plan to change that. AA did have plans (pre-COVID-19) to retire the A333 fleet in a few years (2022-23ish). Perhaps they will take advantage of this downswing to accelerate the A333's retirements? Just speculating...

Not sure what they plan for the A332's, but with most of them now stored in ROW (AA's favorite "rest home"), you have to wonder about their future. If they were stored in TUL (home of AA's largest maintenance base), or BFM (home to one of their favorite maintenance contractors) then the prospect for a quick return to service for the A332's would seem to be greater.


I think that all though most aspects of the merger have been integrated, in-house maintenance on the A330s appears to stay between PIT PHL and CLT therefore TUL doesn't make much sense. Clearly the storage and maintenance costs favor ROW since AA has stated that some of the aircraft stored there will come back to service if the market rebounds quicker than expected.
 
Wingtips56
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Sun Apr 19, 2020 10:22 pm

And, as someone pointed out, ROW doesn't have TUL's hail storm and tornado risk.
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines (Retired). Flight Memory: 181 airports, 92 airlines, 78 a/c types, 403 routes, 58 countries (by air), 6 continents. 1,119,414 passenger miles.

Home airport : CEC
 
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FLALEFTY
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 1:18 am

JohanTally wrote:
FLALEFTY wrote:
NYCAAer wrote:

The 15 A332s are staying for the PHL and CLT hubs.


Before COVID-19 struck, AA was planning to convert the Trans-Atlantic flying from PHL to 787's and A321XLR's. But it is true that the A330's have been the Trans-Atlantic planes of choice from CLT and there didn't seem to be an immediate pre-COVID plan to change that. AA did have plans (pre-COVID-19) to retire the A333 fleet in a few years (2022-23ish). Perhaps they will take advantage of this downswing to accelerate the A333's retirements? Just speculating...

Not sure what they plan for the A332's, but with most of them now stored in ROW (AA's favorite "rest home"), you have to wonder about their future. If they were stored in TUL (home of AA's largest maintenance base), or BFM (home to one of their favorite maintenance contractors) then the prospect for a quick return to service for the A332's would seem to be greater.


I think that all though most aspects of the merger have been integrated, in-house maintenance on the A330s appears to stay between PIT PHL and CLT therefore TUL doesn't make much sense. Clearly the storage and maintenance costs favor ROW since AA has stated that some of the aircraft stored there will come back to service if the market rebounds quicker than expected.


As of today AA has parked their entire A332 & A333 fleets. There are 3 (listed just as "stored") presumably parked at CLT and/or PHL and 1 at PIT. The rest have been sent to ROW. Had they planned to return the A330 fleet to service in the near term, I would have expected that AA would have kept most of them at the maintenance/hub locations you mentioned in your post.

https://www.planespotters.net/airline/American-Airlines
 
anymaninfc
Posts: 273
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 1:42 am

Without knowing all the factors that go into AA's decision to park aircraft at ROW, I think it's presumptuous for any of us to assume the A332s have finished their service with AA. I envision AA watching the marketplace and calculating how they can employ those assets (aircraft, spare parts, trained flight crews and maintenance technicians, etc. ) to rebuild their business. Acquiring aircraft and getting them into service is far more complex than returning aircraft removed from storage. Just my 2 cents.
 
Ishrion
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 2:00 am

Honestly, I'd be sincerely surprised if the A330-200 is over for American.

They recently finished installing the Premium Economy cabin on all aircraft and were planning to overhaul the IFE system in Economy. I believe one aircraft has been finished but the rest were put on hold due to COVID-19.
 
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chepos
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AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 2:03 am

anymaninfc wrote:
Without knowing all the factors that go into AA's decision to park aircraft at ROW, I think it's presumptuous for any of us to assume the A332s have finished their service with AA. I envision AA watching the marketplace and calculating how they can employ those assets (aircraft, spare parts, trained flight crews and maintenance technicians, etc. ) to rebuild their business. Acquiring aircraft and getting them into service is far more complex than returning aircraft removed from storage. Just my 2 cents.


Yeah, the airline has said some aircraft will be in storage and the future of some fleets will be re-evaluated as/if demand improves. People saw planes flying to Roswell and they ran with it. Mind you at no point has anyone at AA said the 332 was leaving (they mentioned a high possibility of the 333/190 fleet leaving in addition to the 767/757). Note, a large chunk of the UAl 764 fleet, some 77E and 763 are also at RSW, are we assuming those are leaving the UA fleet?


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B757capt
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 2:13 am

Wingtips56 wrote:
And, as someone pointed out, ROW doesn't have TUL's hail storm and tornado risk.


Because ROW has never seen hail?

https://www.kob.com/albuquerque-news/st ... o/5374991/
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USAirALB
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 2:25 am

AA321T wrote:
American is also currently upgrading the AVOD hardware on the A332 fleet in the Main Cabin which removes the old screen and hardware and installs the new hardware in the same space. I wonder if this is something that could be completed while the seats are removed from the aircraft reducing the need for additional downtime later on.

Is there a reason they are doing this rather than just putting new seats in? The A332 seats at this point are rather old and lack adjustable headrests that have since become standard. Seems odd to not just replace the seats.
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Nicknuzzii
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 2:30 am

chepos wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:
Without knowing all the factors that go into AA's decision to park aircraft at ROW, I think it's presumptuous for any of us to assume the A332s have finished their service with AA. I envision AA watching the marketplace and calculating how they can employ those assets (aircraft, spare parts, trained flight crews and maintenance technicians, etc. ) to rebuild their business. Acquiring aircraft and getting them into service is far more complex than returning aircraft removed from storage. Just my 2 cents.


Yeah, the airline has said some aircraft will be in storage and the future of some fleets will be re-evaluated as/if demand improves. People saw planes flying to Roswell and they ran with it. Mind you at no point has anyone at AA said the 332 was leaving (they mentioned a high possibility of the 333/190 fleet leaving in addition to the 767/757). Note, a large chunk of the UAl 764 fleet, some 77E and 763 are also at RSW, are we assuming those are leaving the UA fleet?


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There is plenty of articles saying that the A333s, 757s, 767s, and E190s are all leaving...
 
JohanTally
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 2:44 am

B757capt wrote:
Wingtips56 wrote:
And, as someone pointed out, ROW doesn't have TUL's hail storm and tornado risk.


Because ROW has never seen hail?

https://www.kob.com/albuquerque-news/st ... o/5374991/


Roswell is a desert climate that gets three times less rain annually than TUL CLT PHL PIT DFW. There's a lower chance of severe weather in ROW vs TUL which is in the heart of Tornado alley. By parking planes at ROW the aging of the aircraft is slowed which ultimately will buy AA time on making long-term fleet plans.
 
Wingtips56
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 4:24 am

B757capt wrote:
Wingtips56 wrote:
And, as someone pointed out, ROW doesn't have TUL's hail storm and tornado risk.


Because ROW has never seen hail?

https://www.kob.com/albuquerque-news/st ... o/5374991/

OK. Well if ROW gets golf ball to soft ball sized hail too, then I stand corrected. Where I live, we may see hail the size of half your pinky fingernail, but I did seen quarter-size hail in DFW once. Had friends with their skylights broken in, 600 cars of the 800 on one dealer's collection of lots damaged (he had "One hail of a sale" the following week...mostly chipped paint), and of course damage to multiple AA/Eagle aircraft at DFW. No thank you!
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines (Retired). Flight Memory: 181 airports, 92 airlines, 78 a/c types, 403 routes, 58 countries (by air), 6 continents. 1,119,414 passenger miles.

Home airport : CEC
 
NYCAAer
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 6:11 am

SXDFC wrote:
Are there some 738s that wont be coming back?


76 older 738s are being retired, presumably some will be replaced by the 24 737 Max 8s that are grounded, whenever they are fixed and ready to fly.
 
anymaninfc
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 6:58 am

NYCAAer wrote:
SXDFC wrote:
Are there some 738s that wont be coming back?


76 older 738s are being retired, presumably some will be replaced by the 24 737 Max 8s that are grounded, whenever they are fixed and ready to fly.


Plus, Boeing has 13 737 Max 8s ready, or nearly ready, for delivery once the grounding is lifted.
 
AA321T
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 12:26 pm

USAirALB wrote:
AA321T wrote:
American is also currently upgrading the AVOD hardware on the A332 fleet in the Main Cabin which removes the old screen and hardware and installs the new hardware in the same space. I wonder if this is something that could be completed while the seats are removed from the aircraft reducing the need for additional downtime later on.

Is there a reason they are doing this rather than just putting new seats in? The A332 seats at this point are rather old and lack adjustable headrests that have since become standard. Seems odd to not just replace the seats.

My understanding is that a complete retrofit of the A332 fleet is (was?) being planned; however, they knew they couldn’t operate another summer with the extremely poor reliability of the IFE system that was currently on board.
 
lowfareair
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 12:48 pm

For those saying the A332s aren't getting retired, the question is, if int'l travel doesn't spring back much by summer 2021, which widebodies would you park? The A333s and 763s are already parked, the choice is either park the A332s, which is the next-smallest widebody sub-fleet and whose capabilities/capacity are duplicated by the 788, or park part of the 787 or 777 fleets and have 3 main widebody types. The 77Ws could be an alternative, but that will likely require reconfiguring one of their other fleet types to a high-J config.

B757capt wrote:
Wingtips56 wrote:
And, as someone pointed out, ROW doesn't have TUL's hail storm and tornado risk.


Because ROW has never seen hail?

https://www.kob.com/albuquerque-news/st ... o/5374991/


There have also been tornadoes in downtown Miami, but I don't think people will argue it has the same risk of tornadoes as Tulsa does
 
MIflyer12
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 12:59 pm

Vctony wrote:
Curious if DL would want the A332s to finish off their 763 fleet.


Planespotters.net shows that DL has parked 10 of 11 of its own 332s; 21 of 21 764s; 52 of 56 763s. And 61 of 62 A320s.

I'd wonder what the AA to DL transaction price would need to be, at what fuel prices, to make used 332s look good against new 339s.
 
chonetsao
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 2:38 pm

lowfareair wrote:
For those saying the A332s aren't getting retired, the question is, if int'l travel doesn't spring back much by summer 2021, which widebodies would you park? The A333s and 763s are already parked, the choice is either park the A332s, which is the next-smallest widebody sub-fleet and whose capabilities/capacity are duplicated by the 788, or park part of the 787 or 777 fleets and have 3 main widebody types. The 77Ws could be an alternative, but that will likely require reconfiguring one of their other fleet types to a high-J config.

B757capt wrote:
Wingtips56 wrote:
And, as someone pointed out, ROW doesn't have TUL's hail storm and tornado risk.


Because ROW has never seen hail?

https://www.kob.com/albuquerque-news/st ... o/5374991/


There have also been tornadoes in downtown Miami, but I don't think people will argue it has the same risk of tornadoes as Tulsa does


It will be B777-200s. Some of the B777 is approaching retirement age, that is why additional B789s were ordered to replace older B777-200ER.

If the market does not go back to what it used to be, AA just need to put forward the B777-200ER retirement plan. A332 is great in managing capacity lower.

If the market eventually go back what it used to be, B777-200ER and A332 are both needed.

In any given market situation, AA will keep B777-300ER. It is a great aircraft and AA knows which market can take it.
 
NYCAAer
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 7:43 pm

chonetsao wrote:
lowfareair wrote:
For those saying the A332s aren't getting retired, the question is, if int'l travel doesn't spring back much by summer 2021, which widebodies would you park? The A333s and 763s are already parked, the choice is either park the A332s, which is the next-smallest widebody sub-fleet and whose capabilities/capacity are duplicated by the 788, or park part of the 787 or 777 fleets and have 3 main widebody types. The 77Ws could be an alternative, but that will likely require reconfiguring one of their other fleet types to a high-J config.

B757capt wrote:


There have also been tornadoes in downtown Miami, but I don't think people will argue it has the same risk of tornadoes as Tulsa does


It will be B777-200s. Some of the B777 is approaching retirement age, that is why additional B789s were ordered to replace older B777-200ER.

If the market does not go back to what it used to be, AA just need to put forward the B777-200ER retirement plan. A332 is great in managing capacity lower.

If the market eventually go back what it used to be, B777-200ER and A332 are both needed.

In any given market situation, AA will keep B777-300ER. It is a great aircraft and AA knows which market can take it.


Correct, the oldest 772s in the fleet are 21 years old, there are about a dozen of them. They were due to be replaced by 789s in 2023, but if demand is low, they could potentially be retired a little sooner, even without the 789 deliveries. I don’t see the 332s going out to pasture yet, they serve a very specific market need, in markets where fewer seats are sold in premium cabins.

The 77Ws are used in those few markets where a high number of premium seats are sold and where capacity is needed for coach and cargo. The 77W works perfectly for LHR in particular, where the vast majority of 77W routes are flown. AA has been very happy with them, and they’re still quite efficient. A captain I was flying with on LHR-JFK told me that the fuel burn of the 300 is barely more than the 200, with a lot more capacity.
 
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FLALEFTY
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Re: AA Fleet Updates - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 7:48 pm

anymaninfc wrote:
NYCAAer wrote:
SXDFC wrote:
Are there some 738s that wont be coming back?


76 older 738s are being retired, presumably some will be replaced by the 24 737 Max 8s that are grounded, whenever they are fixed and ready to fly.


Plus, Boeing has 13 737 Max 8s ready, or nearly ready, for delivery once the grounding is lifted.


Doug Parker says American is still planning on taking all of their 737MAX's on order. He then vaguely mentions their plans to "retire older aircraft", with only the 757 & 767 types directly mentioned.

https://simpleflying.com/american-airli ... ommitment/

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