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jplatts
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 7:58 pm

SANFan wrote:
I haven't studied the overall SAN turn schedule for AS effective Aug 1 but it appears that EWR is not starting as it was previously expected to.


One reason why AS might not be resuming SAN-EWR nonstop service is that AS no longer has to compete with WN on SAN-EWR due to WN no longer serving EWR, AS no longer serving LGA, and LGA having slot restrictions.
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 8:18 pm

jplatts wrote:
SANFan wrote:
I haven't studied the overall SAN turn schedule for AS effective Aug 1 but it appears that EWR is not starting as it was previously expected to.


One reason why AS might not be resuming SAN-EWR nonstop service is that AS no longer has to compete with WN on SAN-EWR due to WN no longer serving EWR, AS no longer serving LGA, and LGA having slot restrictions.


They have to compete with B6 and UA.
 
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hawaiian717
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jun 29, 2020 9:03 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
So if I was to go to Hawaii now with a negative test I would still have to quarantine? If that’s not dumb I’m not sure what is.


If you go now then yes, you will still have to quarantine. Beginning August 1 you will not if you have a negative COVID-19 test result no more than 72 hours prior to your flight.

HA15/16 to HNL return on July 15. Hawaiian’s website shows A321neo aircraft.
 
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itripreport
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Fri Jul 10, 2020 1:29 am

Speaking of B6, It seems as if their daily FLL turn returns August 1st, but this time with an early morning turn instead of the usual late night turn.
Flights are:
B6529 Departs [email protected]:20 arrives [email protected]:25
B6530 Departs [email protected]:15 arrives [email protected]:10
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sat Jul 11, 2020 3:48 pm

And speaking even more of B6, Aug 6 the new EWR flight begins, and the A320 used on the r/t will overnight in SAN:

Lv SAN - 8:00am ... Arr EWR - 4:27pm #1046 Dly
Lv EWR - 7:00pm.....Arr SAN - 9:36pm #1045 Dly

This new route actually drew a press release from the airport folks at SAN.org; not many new routes to shout about these days!

Nice to see Blue adding something to their SAN route map - 4 destinations now. We'll see how long this sticks around...

bb
 
friendlyskies22
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sat Jul 11, 2020 6:27 pm

re: Hawaii service and quarantines...heavy rumors that the Aug 1 pre-testing will move to at least Sept. 1
So if that's the case, the 14 day quarantine for all arrivals will remain in August. All Hawaii mayors are
pushing for the extension, and Gov. Ige will probably decide this coming week. The summer tourism is already
blown, and locals here in Maui are enjoying (not) the 35% unemployment.
Sad situation.
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sat Jul 11, 2020 8:17 pm

What would be the incentive to staying closed through August?
 
friendlyskies22
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sat Jul 11, 2020 10:31 pm

No incentive....just COVID fears...after all, there have been 19 deaths here so far....!?
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Jul 12, 2020 4:42 pm

From the OAG load last night/today, it appears that AS is still somewhat optimistic about Sept, although less than they were a month ago. AS continues to schedule service from SAN to all 4 Islands in Sept, but most is now sub-daily; SAN-OGG, for now, remains daily for Sept!

I haven't had a chance to see what HA and WN are planning for the fall.

bb
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Jul 16, 2020 5:38 pm

Speaking of AS being optimistic about SAN, in amongst the big LAX-Expansion announcement this morning by the carrier, is hidden a little something for us here in that little-known suburb of San Diego -- AS will begin flying SAN-FLL on Nov 21!

The flight will be split between us and PDX, with the City of Roses seeing 4 flights a week and we will get the other 3 days (Tu, Th & Sa.) As of now, the sked for SAN is:
Dep SAN 8:00am - Flt #480 B-738, op's Tu, Th, Sa
Arrv FLL 3:40pm

Dep FLL 4:40pm - Flt #481 B-738, op's Tu, Th, Sa
Arrv SAN 7:25pm

Here's the link to the article: https://newsroom.alaskaair.com/2020-07- ... 0-from-LAX

As was reported up-thread, B6's service will be an early morning FLL departure to SAN, with the return flight departing SAN around 11am. (At least, with 2 cx in the market all of a sudden, neither is an e/b red-eye! Nice.)

This move by AS has all the markings of a "Watch out Blue" (regarding them starting SAN-EWR) and I have a feeling the skirmish between AS & B6 may just be getting started. (IMO, SAN is a 'skirmish' while the real Battle is centered about 100 miles north of here.) In any case, I do appreciate AS including some good news for SAN this morning!

Airport update: I see on the SAN.org home page that AA and AS have moved back to their homes in T2E. I know that's not particularly welcome news to many who regularly fly the 2 cx but it does perhaps signal the start of a return to 'normal' here at SDIA. (Especially taken in conjunction with news of new routes being added!)

bb
 
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SANFan
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ueen

Fri Jul 17, 2020 12:26 am

Some apparent sad news from BA today; there's a thread on it and, although noone can produce official notification yet, the entire 747 fleet is apparently to be permanently retired and will not fly again. It appears we've seen the "Queen of the Skies" in SAN for the last time (undoubtedly on any carrier.) We were lucky for the time we did see her here, still kind of a surprise to me!

So my question is, assuming BA returns to the SAN-LHR route at some point, what will the route be flown with? The 77W I assume or might we see some flavor of 787 or even 787 service X 2/day?

bb
 
SANMAN66
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Re: ueen

Fri Jul 17, 2020 1:24 am

SANFan wrote:
Some apparent sad news from BA today; there's a thread on it and, although noone can produce official notification yet, the entire 747 fleet is apparently to be permanently retired and will not fly again. It appears we've seen the "Queen of the Skies" in SAN for the last time (undoubtedly on any carrier.)

bb


At this point, I'll be happy to see any aircraft BA decides to send our way (although I'd love to see an
A350).
PSA Gives you a lift!
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Jul 19, 2020 5:10 pm

While searching thru AS's online Flight Schedules last night (and continuing to do so today) I found some exciting new flights/routes from SAN; I thought I'd share them.

Beginning 11/20, AS will start flying SAN-CUN, nonstop 4 days/week! Here's the schedule as it appears today:
Dep SAN: 9:00am - Arr CUN: 4:15pm Flt 380 op's on 1-3-5-7 w a 738;
Dep CUN: 5:20pm - Arr SAN: 7:35pm Flt 381
[It just dawned on me that this a/c will be split with the new FLL service I posted up-thread, using a daily 738 split 4/3 with the Lauderdale flights. SAN timing for both routes is very similar.]

Last year there was a discussion about the SAN-CUN market and some source showed it as one of the largest unserved CUN markets from the US. Of course like all Mexican air service from SAN, it's complicated because of TIJ service. Apparently AS has decided, as they did with MEX, to try it and see if it can work; I sure hope it does this time. As of now, the service appears to operate only thru 4/12/21.

More good news: starting 3/11/21, AS will also begin nonstop service to MSO! A daily EMJ will operate as follows:
Dep SAN: 2:30pm - Arr MSO: 6:00pm Flt 2382
Dep MSO: 1:00pm - Arr SAN: 2:48pm Flt 2675 (As scheduling addicts may notice, this is not a simple turn in MSO; AS is also beginning service from SJC and the 2 EMJs will turn with each other in MT.)

As far as I know, this will be the first daily, 'real' service between SAN and Montana (G4 not withstanding) and I hope it does well. AAG certainly has the perfect aircraft for such a market. It may be seasonal -- summer only -- but I don't see why; I would think lots of people might want to get away from Western Montana's winter by heading for SAN... In the summer, I expect there will be lots of traffic in both directions.

Very nice moves Alaska! Thank you and I'll continue to search for any more surprises you may have in store for us here at your Southern California Focus City!

bb
 
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Coronado990
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Jul 19, 2020 7:42 pm

Wow! Just when you think AS is done with Mexico, here come CUN non-stops. It's about time. I thought that PDX/SAN to FLL sked looked a little strange and something was missing. This explains it!

Now, I wonder if they could make a weekly to LIR work?
Cornucopia
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Jul 19, 2020 9:18 pm

Coronado990 wrote:
Wow! Just when you think AS is done with Mexico, here come CUN non-stops. It's about time. I thought that PDX/SAN to FLL sked looked a little strange and something was missing. This explains it!

You and me both D. (And they're doing the same "split" at PDX which gets the same 2 new routes.)

RE: CUN service, it's been a long time since F9 -- in 2007 (the John Happ days) -- tried the route with dismal results; of course it was once a week and a red-eye! And then there's the whole TIJ aspect. AS is certainly offering a much better level of service and timing so maybe it will work very well. Obviously MEX did not work recently but I'm happy to see AS keep trying!

Coronado990 wrote:
Now, I wonder if they could make a weekly to LIR work?

Hey, do you know something?! Yes, why not? I've heard chatter from some at AS that the carrier is not done with SAN and has plans for us! Until COVID is in the rear view mirror it's hard to say how things will play out, or when but I certainly would suspect that more int'l travel could happen as time goes on!

bb
 
williaminsd
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Jul 19, 2020 9:21 pm

Pretty incredible news re CUN. I've never thought of CUN as a real money-maker from the west coast. Charters sure, but regularly scheduled service? From San Diego (with TIJ just across boarder)? Just never saw it. Good luck to Alaska.

Btw - I've posted this elsewhere, but here are the Flightradar24 seven-day flight totals for various California and Nevada airports.

Today's count is in the first column and the count for 6/14 in parenthesis. All of the counts show solid growth with some being spectacular, and San Diego's month-to-month growth being among the leaders.

San Diego's Number 1 market next week remains SFO with 85 flights scheduled in next seven days. SAN-SFO has been SAN's number one market for weeks now, but total flights have steadily creeped-up.

LAX - 2712 (1831)
LAS - 2096 (1224)
SFO - 1715 (1073)
SAN - 1011 (583)
SMF - 670 (502)
OAK - 644 (412)
SJC - 675 (507)
ONT - 311 (271)
SNA - 499 (339)
BUR - 295 (194)
RNO - 238 (158)
FAT - 145 (106)
LGB - 128 (77)
SBA - 67 (48)
MRY - 46 (42)
BFL - 42 (28)
 
SanBdlFly
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Jul 19, 2020 10:37 pm

Exciting news for SAN! 4 new routes in just over a month wow. I did a dummy booking on Alaska for SAN to SLC on March 21, 2020 and it shows two daily flights. The first departing at 6:15 am and the second 9:30 am both on an E175. Guess Alaska will return to this market!
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jul 20, 2020 12:08 am

williaminsd wrote:
Pretty incredible news re CUN. I've never thought of CUN as a real money-maker from the west coast. Charters sure, but regularly scheduled service? From San Diego (with TIJ just across boarder)? Just never saw it. Good luck to Alaska.

Btw - I've posted this elsewhere, but here are the Flightradar24 seven-day flight totals for various California and Nevada airports.

Today's count is in the first column and the count for 6/14 in parenthesis. All of the counts show solid growth with some being spectacular, and San Diego's month-to-month growth being among the leaders.

San Diego's Number 1 market next week remains SFO with 85 flights scheduled in next seven days. SAN-SFO has been SAN's number one market for weeks now, but total flights have steadily creeped-up.

LAX - 2712 (1831)
LAS - 2096 (1224)
SFO - 1715 (1073)
SAN - 1011 (583)
SMF - 670 (502)
OAK - 644 (412)
SJC - 675 (507)
ONT - 311 (271)
SNA - 499 (339)
BUR - 295 (194)
RNO - 238 (158)
FAT - 145 (106)
LGB - 128 (77)
SBA - 67 (48)
MRY - 46 (42)
BFL - 42 (28)

I did some mental calcs when I first saw the figures posted by you this morning and was impressed with our little airport. I just now used my calculator and it looks like SAN might be the leader with - if my arithmetic is correct -- a 74% increase m-o-m in flights! Very impressive I now think.

It's interesting to see new routes and flights being added by mainly, so far, Blue and Alaska. I never thought this would be happening. Apparently the cx are chasing the leisure travelers while waiting for the corporate folks to get back on planes. Seems like a decent strategy and I hope it works.

SAN has now seen new flights 'announced' to EWR, FLL, CUN and MSO in just the last couple of weeks or less and I'm thrilled. Above all else, I'm happy to see SAN's status as an Alaska focus city seemingly not only on solid footing, but growing!

I expect the June pax numbers for SDIA will be out soon and I'm anxious to see how they look.

Thanks for sharing those numbers with us William'. Stay healthy and keep flying! (And btw, let's keep working on getting those SAN-SMF flights back on AS!)



bb
 
williaminsd
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jul 20, 2020 1:15 am

SANFan wrote:
williaminsd wrote:
Pretty incredible news re CUN. I've never thought of CUN as a real money-maker from the west coast. Charters sure, but regularly scheduled service? From San Diego (with TIJ just across boarder)? Just never saw it. Good luck to Alaska.

Btw - I've posted this elsewhere, but here are the Flightradar24 seven-day flight totals for various California and Nevada airports.

Today's count is in the first column and the count for 6/14 in parenthesis. All of the counts show solid growth with some being spectacular, and San Diego's month-to-month growth being among the leaders.

San Diego's Number 1 market next week remains SFO with 85 flights scheduled in next seven days. SAN-SFO has been SAN's number one market for weeks now, but total flights have steadily creeped-up.

LAX - 2712 (1831)
LAS - 2096 (1224)
SFO - 1715 (1073)
SAN - 1011 (583)
SMF - 670 (502)
OAK - 644 (412)
SJC - 675 (507)
ONT - 311 (271)
SNA - 499 (339)
BUR - 295 (194)
RNO - 238 (158)
FAT - 145 (106)
LGB - 128 (77)
SBA - 67 (48)
MRY - 46 (42)
BFL - 42 (28)

I did some mental calcs when I first saw the figures posted by you this morning and was impressed with our little airport. I just now used my calculator and it looks like SAN might be the leader with - if my arithmetic is correct -- a 74% increase m-o-m in flights! Very impressive I now think.

It's interesting to see new routes and flights being added by mainly, so far, Blue and Alaska. I never thought this would be happening. Apparently the cx are chasing the leisure travelers while waiting for the corporate folks to get back on planes. Seems like a decent strategy and I hope it works.

SAN has now seen new flights 'announced' to EWR, FLL, CUN and MSO in just the last couple of weeks or less and I'm thrilled. Above all else, I'm happy to see SAN's status as an Alaska focus city seemingly not only on solid footing, but growing!

I expect the June pax numbers for SDIA will be out soon and I'm anxious to see how they look.

Thanks for sharing those numbers with us William'. Stay healthy and keep flying! (And btw, let's keep working on getting those SAN-SMF flights back on AS!)



bb


It IS impressive... both in the overall increase in departures, and the expansion by Alaska, which seems committed to replacing the previously cut SAN flights under this new strategy. I'll be on board Alaska this Wednesday to SJC, which thankfully survived the purge (Although they can't be too happy at present, only nine seats booked so far on morning flight out. The upgrade's looking GOOD!). As far as SAN-SMF, that still doesn't make any sense. If you want to fly San Diego to Missoula, Alaska's got you covered daily starting in March. If you want to fly a city segment that carried over 600,000 total pax last year (#1 SMF market, #5 for SAN) and for which Alaska planned 4x/day this summer, can't help ya bro...
Last edited by williaminsd on Mon Jul 20, 2020 1:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
ibthebigd
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jul 20, 2020 1:32 am

I wish Alaska would get the A220 with the long range and fly IND-SAN maybe RDU-SAN.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
 
Ishrion
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jul 20, 2020 1:49 am

ibthebigd wrote:
I wish Alaska would get the A220 with the long range and fly IND-SAN maybe RDU-SAN.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


They could do IND-SAN with the E-175. It’s just 10 miles longer than SFO-MSN.
 
flyfresno
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jul 20, 2020 1:27 pm

Ishrion wrote:
ibthebigd wrote:
I wish Alaska would get the A220 with the long range and fly IND-SAN maybe RDU-SAN.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


They could do IND-SAN with the E-175. It’s just 10 miles longer than SFO-MSN.


I would think WN would fly SAN-IND year-round if there was enough demand for it. Perhaps the E175 is the right size for that route, but the combination of possible weight restrictions when the weather is bad in SAN and WN probably going year-round to compete would not make the route easy for AS.

Agreed though that the A220 would open up a lot of routes out of the West Coast for AS.
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:56 pm

ibthebigd wrote:
I wish Alaska would get the A220 with the long range and fly IND-SAN maybe RDU-SAN.

First, I would be surprised to see AS add another a/c type to their fleet. They seem to be having a tough enough time trying to figure out whether or not certain of their current AirBus fleet is going to stay or go. And I think they're quite committed to the EMJ and that does give them lots of choices and meets most of their demand. Sure it might be nice to have a third option for size and range for those relatively few in-between destinations they might want to serve but I think they can make due with what they have now.

That being said, I certainly want to see both IND and RDU served by a "real" airline - 1st choice would be AS - and I feel certain that both could be served year-round and daily by full-sized a/c. I've posted DOT numbers for PDEW traffic in both markets in the past and both had sufficient levels to support full time flights. (Perhaps one quarter of the year might need to see sub-daily frequency in the markets in the beginning but that's about it.) I've gotten behind in my DOT numbers so I can't provide them for 2019. Once we get past the current environment of COVID and corporate travelers begin flying again in large numbers, I feel certain these 2 routes (and I would like to throw TPA in the mix too) will hopefully see regular service by some carrier!

flyfresno wrote:
I would think WN would fly SAN-IND year-round if there was enough demand for it. Perhaps the E175 is the right size for that route, but the combination of possible weight restrictions when the weather is bad in SAN and WN probably going year-round to compete would not make the route easy for AS.

Not sure what WN's plans are for SAN-IND; it was not on the list of definite drops for this Nov/Dec since they have never flown the route in the winter but it's too early to tell what they plan next summer. I will add however that it appears to me that WN has changed their attitude toward SAN and seem to be getting away from lots of p-2-p flying from here that has been their trademark over the last many years of service from SAN. The numbers speak for themselves: WN has dropped 1/3 of their destinations and about 1/4 of their total flights effective this November. Whether these will return in 2021 is anyone's guess.

That all being said, your points are valid and well-taken. And who knows?

bb
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jul 20, 2020 11:37 pm

Something interesting in the media world of the airline industry in this weird year.

Here's a link to a very nice press release put out today by the SDIA at SAN.org:
https://www.san.org/news/news-detail/sa ... a-airlines

What's interesting to me is that AS has yet to make any sort of announcement regarding these new routes, or other new ones that have shown up in their own schedules this past weekend..

But, there was a recent route announcement issued July 12 in a Press Release by AS that was huge and titled, "AS adds 12 destinations in 2020 from LAX".

I just wonder what criteria AS uses to decide what route announcements get a PR? Apparently LAX does while SAN doesn't. Not a huge deal but it's always a bit of a tender spot for me when LA gets the publicity that SAN and other cities don't, especially when it's similar news.

I'm sorry to see that apparently AS figures '3 New Routes from SAN' doesn't deserve the coverage that 12 New Routes from LAX! does... What's the cutoff? Four new routes gets a company issued PR? Or is it Eight? Apparently 3 is insignificant to today's Alaska.

This is about airline news. What's one of the most important things to an airline? Growth and expansion! Whether it's one new route or more, shouldn't the airlines' media department be tasked with getting the word out in a timely fashion? I guess not always. In some cases it's, "Shhhhhh. Quiet, don't let anybody know yet... I sure hope nobody over at A.net leaks the word!" Sorry Alaska.

bb
 
gmcc
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Jul 21, 2020 2:07 am

SANFan wrote:
Something interesting in the media world of the airline industry in this weird year.

Here's a link to a very nice press release put out today by the SDIA at SAN.org:
https://www.san.org/news/news-detail/sa ... a-airlines

What's interesting to me is that AS has yet to make any sort of announcement regarding these new routes, or other new ones that have shown up in their own schedules this past weekend..

But, there was a recent route announcement issued July 12 in a Press Release by AS that was huge and titled, "AS adds 12 destinations in 2020 from LAX".

I just wonder what criteria AS uses to decide what route announcements get a PR? Apparently LAX does while SAN doesn't. Not a huge deal but it's always a bit of a tender spot for me when LA gets the publicity that SAN and other cities don't, especially when it's similar news.

I'm sorry to see that apparently AS figures '3 New Routes from SAN' doesn't deserve the coverage that 12 New Routes from LAX! does... What's the cutoff? Four new routes gets a company issued PR? Or is it Eight? Apparently 3 is insignificant to today's Alaska.

This is about airline news. What's one of the most important things to an airline? Growth and expansion! Whether it's one new route or more, shouldn't the airlines' media department be tasked with getting the word out in a timely fashion? I guess not always. In some cases it's, "Shhhhhh. Quiet, don't let anybody know yet... I sure hope nobody over at A.net leaks the word!" Sorry Alaska.

bb


Looking at it from a glass half full perspective, maybe the 3 routes did not get a press release because AS has more up their sleeve. 2 nd quarter conference call is on Thursday. Maybe they are saving up more good news for SAN for Thursday.
 
ajlombardi2
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Re: ueen

Tue Jul 21, 2020 4:13 am

SANMAN66 wrote:
SANFan wrote:
Some apparent sad news from BA today; there's a thread on it and, although noone can produce official notification yet, the entire 747 fleet is apparently to be permanently retired and will not fly again. It appears we've seen the "Queen of the Skies" in SAN for the last time (undoubtedly on any carrier.)

bb


At this point, I'll be happy to see any aircraft BA decides to send our way (although I'd love to see an
A350).


same... a350/B789/B77W.... any of them lol
 
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hawaiian717
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Jul 21, 2020 5:08 am

SANFan wrote:
But, there was a recent route announcement issued July 12 in a Press Release by AS that was huge and titled, "AS adds 12 destinations in 2020 from LAX".

I just wonder what criteria AS uses to decide what route announcements get a PR? Apparently LAX does while SAN doesn't. Not a huge deal but it's always a bit of a tender spot for me when LA gets the publicity that SAN and other cities don't, especially when it's similar news.


LAX getting a press release has nothing to do with the number of new routes and everything to do with JetBlue announcing that it’s moving the remains of its Long Beach focus city into a new LAX hub.
 
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BA744PHX
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Jul 21, 2020 11:59 am

SANFan wrote:
I'm sorry to see that apparently AS figures '3 New Routes from SAN' doesn't deserve the coverage that 12 New Routes from LAX does... What's the cutoff? Four new routes gets a company issued PR? Or is it Eight? Apparently 3 is insignificant to today's Alaska.

This is about airline news. What's one of the most important things to an airline? Growth and expansion! Whether it's one new route or more, shouldn't the airlines' media department be tasked with getting the word out in a timely fashion? I guess not always. In some cases it's, "Shhhhhh. Quiet, don't let anybody know yet... I sure hope nobody over at A.net leaks the word!" Sorry Alaska.

bb


Outside of your rant, its very insignificant, they are not unique destinations. Can you imagine if every airline had media coverage for every SINGLE route, its ridiculous. The only route that would be significant enough is MSO (small/unique destination), otherwise FLL & CUN (STOP THE PRESS!!!!) another airline adding routes/destinations from these 2 cities... earth shattering. :spin:
 
vedatil4
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Jul 21, 2020 1:29 pm

SANFan wrote:
While searching thru AS's online Flight Schedules last night (and continuing to do so today) I found some exciting new flights/routes from SAN; I thought I'd share them.

Beginning 11/20, AS will start flying SAN-CUN, nonstop 4 days/week! Here's the schedule as it appears today:
Dep SAN: 9:00am - Arr CUN: 4:15pm Flt 380 op's on 1-3-5-7 w a 738;
Dep CUN: 5:20pm - Arr SAN: 7:35pm Flt 381
[It just dawned on me that this a/c will be split with the new FLL service I posted up-thread, using a daily 738 split 4/3 with the Lauderdale flights. SAN timing for both routes is very similar.]

Last year there was a discussion about the SAN-CUN market and some source showed it as one of the largest unserved CUN markets from the US. Of course like all Mexican air service from SAN, it's complicated because of TIJ service. Apparently AS has decided, as they did with MEX, to try it and see if it can work; I sure hope it does this time. As of now, the service appears to operate only thru 4/12/21.

More good news: starting 3/11/21, AS will also begin nonstop service to MSO! A daily EMJ will operate as follows:
Dep SAN: 2:30pm - Arr MSO: 6:00pm Flt 2382
Dep MSO: 1:00pm - Arr SAN: 2:48pm Flt 2675 (As scheduling addicts may notice, this is not a simple turn in MSO; AS is also beginning service from SJC and the 2 EMJs will turn with each other in MT.)

As far as I know, this will be the first daily, 'real' service between SAN and Montana (G4 not withstanding) and I hope it does well. AAG certainly has the perfect aircraft for such a market. It may be seasonal -- summer only -- but I don't see why; I would think lots of people might want to get away from Western Montana's winter by heading for SAN... In the summer, I expect there will be lots of traffic in both directions.

Very nice moves Alaska! Thank you and I'll continue to search for any more surprises you may have in store for us here at your Southern California Focus City!

bb


This is great news for people who want to travel to Cancun! Volaris flights out of TIJ were usually either at dreadful times or with a connection at MEX. VivaAerobus had a Saturday direct flight at a reasonable time on the way down but they're plain scary (especially now). I've been burned by them twice. Both carriers have too much emphasis on VFR flights instead of pleasing tourists.

On the positive side for TIJ, the international in-transit terminal under construction there has about half of the steel frame up now. It'll be interesting to see which carriers show up next year.
 
ajlombardi2
Posts: 37
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Wed Jul 22, 2020 3:19 am

i also love that alaska has kept flying the SAN-STS route throughout covid. i have family in santa rosa and that route has been really nice for us, especially now that its E175. hope it stays!
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Wed Jul 22, 2020 3:41 am

ajlombardi2 wrote:
i also love that alaska has kept flying the SAN-STS route throughout covid. i have family in santa rosa and that route has been really nice for us, especially now that its E175. hope it stays!

AS has been flirting with going double-daily on the route but with COVID I don't know how things will look when the dust settles. I've no doubt the route isn't going anywhere but it could be a little while longer than expected to see multiple daily frequencies. AFAIK, that route has does well since it began, steadily gaining pax traffic.

BA744PHX wrote:
Outside of your rant, its very insignificant, they are not unique destinations. Can you imagine if every airline had media coverage for every SINGLE route, its ridiculous. The only route that would be significant enough is MSO (small/unique destination), otherwise FLL & CUN (STOP THE PRESS!!!!) another airline adding routes/destinations from these 2 cities... earth shattering.

I'm delighted to read that you feel my rant was significant. That's what I was going for.

I will also add that to our community, SAN-CUN is quite 'unique' as it has not seen service since about 2007 and it will be competing with TIJ-CUN flights; I really hope the SAN departure does well!

bb
 
ajlombardi2
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Wed Jul 22, 2020 4:27 am

SANFan wrote:
ajlombardi2 wrote:
i also love that alaska has kept flying the SAN-STS route throughout covid. i have family in santa rosa and that route has been really nice for us, especially now that its E175. hope it stays!

AS has been flirting with going double-daily on the route but with COVID I don't know how things will look when the dust settles. I've no doubt the route isn't going anywhere but it could be a little while longer than expected to see multiple daily frequencies. AFAIK, that route has does well since it began, steadily gaining pax traffic.

bb


excellent! i either do the AS direct flight or SAN-OAK on WN and drive... flying into STS saves about 2.5+ hours if you are traveling to santa rosa, healdsburg, etc when factoring traffic getting up there on 101. Either way, I am glad it is doing well. Fares were 80 each way in July / August as of a few weeks ago and i snagged a few :).
 
mentaisupa
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Jul 26, 2020 5:41 pm

It looks like AA has removed SAN-LAX entirely except for the month of September (maybe they missed it?) with the latest schedule update.
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Jul 26, 2020 7:03 pm

mentaisupa wrote:
It looks like AA has removed SAN-LAX entirely except for the month of September (maybe they missed it?) with the latest schedule update.

I think both DL and UA have also cut that route back too haven't they? I would think it's a market that local traffic would rather drive these days and connecting traffic over LA -- especially int'l -- is pretty much non-existent?

My other thought is I wonder if this is a route that AA may turn over to AS? Like LA-FAT I believe. I've heard nothing from AS indicating this may be so but it seems to be a bit of a trend lately -- AA perhaps handing off some of these short intra-CA routes to AS. AAG could easily fly 4 or 5 daily EMJ r/t in the market, possibly using just 1+ a/c. And AS seems to be expanding at both SAN and LA lately. Just a thought.

In any case, thanks for the heads-up.

bb
 
gmcc
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Jul 26, 2020 7:28 pm

SANFan wrote:
mentaisupa wrote:
It looks like AA has removed SAN-LAX entirely except for the month of September (maybe they missed it?) with the latest schedule update.

I think both DL and UA have also cut that route back too haven't they? I would think it's a market that local traffic would rather drive these days and connecting traffic over LA -- especially int'l -- is pretty much non-existent?

My other thought is I wonder if this is a route that AA may turn over to AS? Like LA-FAT I believe. I've heard nothing from AS indicating this may be so but it seems to be a bit of a trend lately -- AA perhaps handing off some of these short intra-CA routes to AS. AAG could easily fly 4 or 5 daily EMJ r/t in the market, possibly using just 1+ a/c. And AS seems to be expanding at both SAN and LA lately. Just a thought.

In any case, thanks for the heads-up.

bb


Except that AA couldn't legally just turn them over AS without both carriers getting a visit from the DOJ. Now AS might do it on their own as AS has a pretty good history on short higher frequency routes a la SEA-PDX or SEA-GEG. It all depends on if the demand is there for the right price. Being a one world member might also drive a few seats upon the flight as well.
 
757SanCam
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jul 27, 2020 4:42 pm

Current UA flights between SAN and LAX is 2 roundtrips, morning and afternoon on a CRJ 200. Thankfully, it's only a 20-25 minute flight on a very uncomfortable plane. With international and Hawaii flights greatly reduced, flights to LAX have followed suit. Prior to COVID-19, most flights to LAX were 170/175's with 1st flight to LAX a 737, and an evening 737 back to SAN.
 
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Coronado990
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jul 27, 2020 6:14 pm

In a way I hope LAX flights don't come back as it would force international airlines to look at SAN a little more closely with direct non-stop service instead of making potential costumers hoof it to L.A. Then again, Alaska could offer a shuttle to LAX on their own metal much like SEA-PDX. I wouldn't even mind seeing a few Q-400's in town again which seem like the perfect aircraft for the short trip. However, it could jeopardize all these great little non-stops AS has been throwing our way where we would have to then connect at LAX anytime we want to go to SBP, FAT, MRY, STS, RDM, HDN, or MSO which is going backwards in my mind. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.
Cornucopia
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jul 27, 2020 8:09 pm

Coronado990 wrote:
In a way I hope LAX flights don't come back as it would force international airlines to look at SAN a little more closely with direct non-stop service instead of making potential costumers hoof it to L.A. Then again, Alaska could offer a shuttle to LAX on their own metal much like SEA-PDX. I wouldn't even mind seeing a few Q-400's in town again which seem like the perfect aircraft for the short trip. However, it could jeopardize all these great little non-stops AS has been throwing our way where we would have to then connect at LAX anytime we want to go to SBP, FAT, MRY, STS, RDM, HDN, or MSO which is going backwards in my mind. I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

All true, especially about foreign flags perhaps serving SAN directly, but it seems to me there are still lots of connections over LA for San Diegans such as DCA, BZN, JFK,LRI & SJO, ANC, TPA, RSW, ZLO, MZT, ZIH, etc.. Certainly we might see our own nonstops to at least some of those cities but I expect there will always be some cities with nonstops from LAX that SAN won't get, plus a bit of local traffic, and of course the interline connections, both domestic and, yes, there will always be some int'l ones. Of course most of these, and almost all other AS destinations can be reached via SEA but other than aviation nerds like us, who wants to do that!

Especially if AA leaves the market, I think there should be some sort of OW service, right? Yeah, I'd love to see a couple of Qs around and who knows, maybe CLB-LA could eventually become part of the equation?

bb
 
757SanCam
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Jul 27, 2020 8:37 pm

While Alaska might want a piece of the LAX market and it would help OW members, I don't see it working for those of us that have status with Star* here in San Diego. I've taken a few international flights through LAX, including Air New Zealand prior to COVID. A OW carrier will not see my business and I would imagine the same could be said for other Premier members of UA that call SAN home. International flights I've taken would very unlikely have NS service to SAN, traffic doesn't warrant such flights. That is the reason long ago that I put my marbles in the UA bucket, better choices for international travel that I can redeem my UA miles with. But sure, Alaska can join the party to LAX, more competition to drive prices down.
 
Yahnih
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Jul 28, 2020 3:14 am

I just wish they built up for SkyTeam presence internationally too, just ONE flight! I hope when the COVID-19 situation resolves, SAN is on the radar for at least one INTL SkyTeam carrier. We mainly have OW (JL, BA) and STAR (LH, Edelweiss *but who knows if they'll survive)
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Jul 28, 2020 5:43 pm

As a continuation of our discussion of AS perhaps entering the SAN-LAX market, per several sources, including today's OAG thread,
AA is dropping LAX-SAN/FAT/EUG/MFR/RDM this fall (or sooner).

Coincidentally, AS is starting LAX-FAT/EUG/MFR +RDM which is already on their route map.

I see a wall with some handwriting on it. The only change I'm expecting is for maybe SAN-LAX on AS to begin sooner rather than later....

Just my latest thoughts on the subject...

bb
 
ajlombardi2
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Jul 28, 2020 6:09 pm

i just looked out a few months to see if BA has modified or cancelled future SAN-LHR flights.. they still have a 747 scheduled in 2021 on BA272 (so obviously hasn't been modified). I wonder when the next time that route will fly and what aircraft it will be.
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Jul 28, 2020 11:43 pm

ajlombardi2 wrote:
i just looked out a few months to see if BA has modified or cancelled future SAN-LHR flights.. they still have a 747 scheduled in 2021 on BA272 (so obviously hasn't been modified). I wonder when the next time that route will fly and what aircraft it will be.

Yeah, I noticed on today's OAG thread that a couple of "smaller" BA cities are supposed to see Speedbird again in August, such as BWI, DEN and PHX; there are still many cities that will not -- mostly their more recent US adds + SAN -- but I certainly hope we will see her back here (unfortunately not as a 747) sometime in the early part of 2021, and maybe even earlier, like during the coming holiday season...

The int'l travel needs of SAN are certainly not returning quickly and for the next few months, it looks like our foreign flags are relying on service to/from LAX to take care of the few int'l travelers we do have now. Also, for fall and winter, I think a lot of our int'l-bound travelers are prolly corporate and that aspect of travel is still pretty weak around here. (AS has kind of reinforced that idea with their 3 new route additions being strictly leisure in nature.

But, despite COVID, and politics, and all the other crap in the world today, at least San Diego still has our great weather which may attract its share of Brits (and maybe Japanese & Germans?) As soon as BA, JL & LH see the numbers heading to and from SAN rise, I have no doubt all the flights will resume!

bb
 
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Coronado990
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:14 pm

As for BA, I can see why PHX service will return before SAN simply because PHX is more of a Winter destination and can absorb SAN traffic with AA One World connecting flights. I don't think LAX flights to LHR are an option unless you want to drive there since OW flights have been discontinued to that connection potential. I think JL would be the first to return with BA and LH coming back next Spring. Meanwhile we'll have to be happy with "Backwater Domestic Airport" statues. (oh yeah...we have SJD).
Cornucopia
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Aug 02, 2020 9:39 am

Another 'non-announcement' of another new route for SAN from our friends at AS! I discovered this just tonight by manually searching in AS's flights schedules.

Beginning November 20 of this year, along with new service to FLL and CUN, AS will begin flying nonstop to SBA. Here's the schedule that's currently listed:
Depart SAN: 3:05pm - Arrive SBA: 4:05pm #2186 Daily QX EMJ
Depart SBA: 4:45pm - Arrive SAN: 5:40pm #2187 Daily

This is a route I've been expecting as AS continues to grow their Intra-CA markets from SAN. Once AS announced SAN-SBP earlier this year, I figured SBA wasn't too far behind. SBA would continue the expansion that AS seems to be very fond of now, Intra-West and especially that without competition! (I also continue to hope to see OAK eventually.)

Back in the old days, I spent many hours in the car driving between San Diego and Santa Barbara, when it was about right around 4 hours each way and before Hwy 101 was even a true freeway for some of the way -- including through the city of SBA! Nowadays, well, I think a 1-hour nonstop will attract plenty of travelers!

For those interested, I have yet to create a valid turn schedule to see where this EMJ comes from (to feed the SBA departure) or where it heads after the return from SBA. I've looked pretty carefully thru the AS flight schedules and couldn't find anything else new but we'll have to wait and see what else happens.

Also, I thought I'd mention that AS still shows HNL and OGG flights on their August 1 schedule! And judging by the seat maps, there seem to people booking both flights! That is great to see. (LIH and KOA are due to return next month.)

bb
 
vedatil4
Posts: 127
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Aug 02, 2020 5:14 pm

SANFan wrote:
Another 'non-announcement' of another new route for SAN from our friends at AS! I discovered this just tonight by manually searching in AS's flights schedules.

Beginning November 20 of this year, along with new service to FLL and CUN, AS will begin flying nonstop to SBA. Here's the schedule that's currently listed:
Depart SAN: 3:05pm - Arrive SBA: 4:05pm #2186 Daily QX EMJ
Depart SBA: 4:45pm - Arrive SAN: 5:40pm #2187 Daily

This is a route I've been expecting as AS continues to grow their Intra-CA markets from SAN. Once AS announced SAN-SBP earlier this year, I figured SBA wasn't too far behind. SBA would continue the expansion that AS seems to be very fond of now, Intra-West and especially that without competition! (I also continue to hope to see OAK eventually.)

Back in the old days, I spent many hours in the car driving between San Diego and Santa Barbara, when it was about right around 4 hours each way and before Hwy 101 was even a true freeway for some of the way -- including through the city of SBA! Nowadays, well, I think a 1-hour nonstop will attract plenty of travelers!

For those interested, I have yet to create a valid turn schedule to see where this EMJ comes from (to feed the SBA departure) or where it heads after the return from SBA. I've looked pretty carefully thru the AS flight schedules and couldn't find anything else new but we'll have to wait and see what else happens.

Also, I thought I'd mention that AS still shows HNL and OGG flights on their August 1 schedule! And judging by the seat maps, there seem to people booking both flights! That is great to see. (LIH and KOA are due to return next month.)

bb


This is great news. Santa Barbara and San Luis Obispo are great weekend getaway destinations.

Question: Have there ever been any direct flights from San Diego to towns north of Sacramento? I hope Alaska adds a flight to someplace up there. I'm thinking Redding, Crescent City, or Eureka.
 
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Coronado990
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:31 pm

vedatil4 wrote:
This is great news. Santa Barbara and San Luis Obispo are great weekend getaway destinations.

Question: Have there ever been any direct flights from San Diego to towns north of Sacramento? I hope Alaska adds a flight to someplace up there. I'm thinking Redding, Crescent City, or Eureka.


Nope, no and no. Never seen those non-stops in the history of Lindbergh Field.

Great news about SBA. I wonder if MFR and EUG could be in the mix. Also, I'm surprised AS doesn't try PHX & TUS considering how popular San Diego beaches are for our neighbors next door.
Cornucopia
 
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SANFan
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Aug 02, 2020 11:52 pm

Coronado990 wrote:
vedatil4 wrote:
This is great news. Santa Barbara and San Luis Obispo are great weekend getaway destinations.

Question: Have there ever been any direct flights from San Diego to towns north of Sacramento? I hope Alaska adds a flight to someplace up there. I'm thinking Redding, Crescent City, or Eureka.


Nope, no and no. Never seen those non-stops in the history of Lindbergh Field.

Great news about SBA. I wonder if MFR and EUG could be in the mix. Also, I'm surprised AS doesn't try PHX & TUS considering how popular San Diego beaches are for our neighbors next door.

I could certainly see MFR & EUG in our future on AS; both see seasonal service on Allegiant which may further help stimulate air traffic between SAN and those smaller markets in Oregon. And remember, AS jumped on SAN-RDM without, as far as we know, any nudging from anyone else!

I'm afraid those cities in Northern CA such as ACV & RDD just don't have the traffic yet although I know there is some. I remember a few years back when AS did try circle trips routed LAX-ACV-RDD-LAX and LAX-RDD-ACV-LAX; if I recall correctly, they didn't last very long. I'd have to say, if they couldn't make those cities work from LA, I doubt it would be possible from SAN. Maybe a few more years... From SJC? Who knows.

My guess as to why we haven't seen SAN-PHX yet is because it's a market that would need multiple flights (read: require significant a/c time) and AS seems more intent on adding a lot of lower frequency markets where they can perhaps serve a market completely with only 1 or 2 frequencies. E.G., SAN-RDM/MSO/SBP/SBA/STS/BOI/GEG/PAE/MRY/BOS/EWR/FLL, etc. (And they're doing similar growth at LAX.) If the number of available frames becomes "excessive", I'm sure we'll see SAN-PHX added quickly. (Plus, as of recently, with all the AS-joining-OW chatter, maybe AS seems letting AA serve the SAN-PHX for the time being is better than competing with them.) Like OAK, I consider PHX a must-have-market from SAN for AAG and it's growing frequent flyer base.

TUS is of course a much smaller market but I would sure love to see some competition for WN. Since SAN is a growing focus city for AS, it wouldn't shock me to see them enter this second AZ market at some point. I place RNO in a similar situation -- very similar in fact -- as TUS but I wonder if its proximity to the skiing of Lake Tahoe does not raise the appeal of it as a possible target of AS? AS seems to be generating some seasonal business between here and ski areas, such as HDN & SLC and I could see a daily year-round flight to RNO as part of that strategy.

bb
 
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Coronado990
Posts: 1497
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Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Aug 03, 2020 12:52 am

You're right SANFan, the PHX flights are fine with AA taking care of the OW offerings. Hopefully the smaller adds by AS equates to more future international flights making SAN a viable connecting option to the surrounding west. QF comes to mind. How is the 787-9 performance out of SAN on a lengthy trip such as BNE or SYD?
Cornucopia
 
Ishrion
Posts: 2812
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:17 am

Re: San Diego Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Aug 04, 2020 4:27 pm

SANFan wrote:
Another 'non-announcement' of another new route for SAN from our friends at AS! I discovered this just tonight by manually searching in AS's flights schedules.

Beginning November 20 of this year, along with new service to FLL and CUN, AS will begin flying nonstop to SBA. Here's the schedule that's currently listed:
Depart SAN: 3:05pm - Arrive SBA: 4:05pm #2186 Daily QX EMJ
Depart SBA: 4:45pm - Arrive SAN: 5:40pm #2187 Daily

This is a route I've been expecting as AS continues to grow their Intra-CA markets from SAN. Once AS announced SAN-SBP earlier this year, I figured SBA wasn't too far behind. SBA would continue the expansion that AS seems to be very fond of now, Intra-West and especially that without competition! (I also continue to hope to see OAK eventually.)

Back in the old days, I spent many hours in the car driving between San Diego and Santa Barbara, when it was about right around 4 hours each way and before Hwy 101 was even a true freeway for some of the way -- including through the city of SBA! Nowadays, well, I think a 1-hour nonstop will attract plenty of travelers!

For those interested, I have yet to create a valid turn schedule to see where this EMJ comes from (to feed the SBA departure) or where it heads after the return from SBA. I've looked pretty carefully thru the AS flight schedules and couldn't find anything else new but we'll have to wait and see what else happens.

Also, I thought I'd mention that AS still shows HNL and OGG flights on their August 1 schedule! And judging by the seat maps, there seem to people booking both flights! That is great to see. (LIH and KOA are due to return next month.)

bb


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