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TWA302
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:39 am

Jshank83 wrote:
Air Canada also cut for at least the first 2 weeks of April, guessing that will be extended.

I'd bet 6/1 and it is just starting. Am I crazy in thinking they'll shut down all air/rail/bus for 3-4 weeks?
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:07 am

TWA302 wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:
Air Canada also cut for at least the first 2 weeks of April, guessing that will be extended.

I'd bet 6/1 and it is just starting. Am I crazy in thinking they'll shut down all air/rail/bus for 3-4 weeks?


I don’t think it gets to that point. But I wouldn’t have thought we would be here 10 days ago.
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:08 am

Heard WN cuts go thru tonight. I’ll see what it looks like tomorrow.
 
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TWA302
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:46 am

Jshank83 wrote:
Heard WN cuts go thru tonight. I’ll see what it looks like tomorrow.

*insert "hang onto your butts" gif here. *
 
stlgph
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:01 am

I'd be surprised if Southwest only cuts 20% of schedule.
I expect it to be a lot more.

It'll be interesting to see what pans out - if they just cut all around or try to do cuts to P2P routes and try to funnel traffic and planes into their bigger connection points ... which could bode well for STL not becoming an entire ghosttown but I'm sure there won't be a problem finding a plug-in for your cell phone if you happen to be flying out.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:12 am

stlgph wrote:
I'd be surprised if Southwest only cuts 20% of schedule.
I expect it to be a lot more.

It'll be interesting to see what pans out - if they just cut all around or try to do cuts to P2P routes and try to funnel traffic and planes into their bigger connection points ... which could bode well for STL not becoming an entire ghosttown but I'm sure there won't be a problem finding a plug-in for your cell phone if you happen to be flying out.


I think it will be 20% for the entire network. I know one station that is going to be about 10%.

I’m also curious if they will funnel to hubs or just do short hops like the old days. You would think they have to go more hub and spoke. But who knows.
 
stlgph
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:51 am

Well that's just the thing -- United came out and said 10-20% Then overnight it became 50%
Delta came out and said 40% Then changed it to 70%

Very interesting that as a whole Southwest has been mum's the word on their whole position in all this. Perhaps they are still seeing strong bookings thanks to low fares and bags fly free? Maybe they're not publicly forecasting doom and gloom to prevent walk outs or people calling in sick? Either way, I"m sure a lot of employees are on edge after seeing what's going on with the peers.

I'll leave you to look at STL :) but I just checked IND randomly for April 29 - 25 total departures. Will take another look tomorrow.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 2:09 pm

^I do think it will be more than 20% eventually.

What was Indy before that?

EDIT: Nevermind I see Indy is only down 3 flights.
 
stlgph
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:36 pm

Well, at one time Indianapolis was in the 35-38 flights per day range, if I recall correctly. Then went EWR, LGA, DCA, reduced BOS, the second MDW frequency went out the door.

If 3 flights is all they went down, I'd go out and buy some lotto tickets if I worked for them there.


I presume you're working on looking at STL's schedules for that time period.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:43 pm

So Mon-Fri ----- STL is down 16 flights from 116 to 100 or 13%

Saturday and Sunday numbers are messed up. Apparently after the original MAX schedule reductions WN went back in and added more flights because I had Sunday with more flights now than before this cut. Ie originally WN cut 30ish flights on sunday and now is it showing about half that cut.

So Google flights still has the old schedule so I am going to go back thru it and figure out what the real change is for weekends. Some I probably didn't notice if there wasn't a change today.

EDIT:

Saturday down 5 flights from 83 to 78
Sunday is down 9 flights from 125 to 116

Total down from original schedule to MAX grounding 849 to 788 or 7.18% (originally was between 9% and 10%)
Total down from MAX grounding to Corona: 788 to 694 or 11.93%
Total down from original schedule to now 18.26%


All changes were frequency changes. No routes were cut.
Last edited by Jshank83 on Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
stlgph
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:51 pm

Not too bad, either. Are the 1pm and 9pm hour banks looking pretty solid, still?
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:11 pm

stlgph wrote:
Not too bad, either. Are the 1pm and 9pm hour banks looking pretty solid, still?


I didn't look at time but since the west coast flights are all still in tact I would expect the 1 pm bank is mostly the same.
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 7:23 pm

Final 2019 numbers for BLV

Due to a great month of December it ended up on passengers for the year.

Up for Month 18.85%
Up for Year: 0.46% or 1,992 passengers

Total Passengers: 303,801
 
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TWA302
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Mar 19, 2020 10:26 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
Final 2019 numbers for BLV

Due to a great month of December it ended up on passengers for the year.

Up for Month 18.85%
Up for Year: 0.46% or 1,992 passengers

Total Passengers: 303,801


What was their goal on pax % increase last year?
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Fri Mar 20, 2020 3:11 am

[twoid][/twoid]
TWA302 wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:
Final 2019 numbers for BLV

Due to a great month of December it ended up on passengers for the year.

Up for Month 18.85%
Up for Year: 0.46% or 1,992 passengers

Total Passengers: 303,801


What was their goal on pax % increase last year?


They kept saying they were going to be up 20% but they were negative all year until December. So I don’t know where they were getting that projection. I don’t know if they had a goal or not. 2020 was looking like it was going to be a huge jump before the cornavirus. Their spring and summer schedule had pretty big jumps in flights.
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Fri Mar 20, 2020 6:10 pm

Not that Delta was ever a real option for INTL here but if most airlines subscribe to this I would guess that lessens our chances of a flight for awhile.

On the international front, DiFiore expects a “significantly smaller… footprint.” Routes between Delta hubs and those of its partners abroad will likely remain but those to secondary cities — both in the U.S. and abroad — could be cut.

https://thepointsguy.com/news/delta-air ... ronavirus/
 
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Mar 23, 2020 12:09 am

Our airport, right now, is actually in a fantastic position as airlines retreat into hub and spoke routes due to being a WN hub. None of those "focus cities" that we were so envious of will survive.
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stlgph
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Mar 23, 2020 2:36 am

Posted in the IND thread but since it involves STL, I'll mention it here. I did a few random searches of dates on the Contour site and every flight out of IND is marked as "SOLD OUT," which I highly doubt. I would presume they've stopped bookings and are delaying the start of service. I've not seen any announcement or anything but just taking a stab in the dark guess.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Fri Mar 27, 2020 1:58 am

If we are wanting to be optimistic there are some really cheap fares right now thru June. And on some airlines into November. Booked RT to SFO at the end of June for $120 on WN. Usually is more than that one way. UA has them into Nov. both coasts have good prices. I figure if this isn’t over by then we can just cancel.
 
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Fri Mar 27, 2020 3:20 am

I think I will pass Jshank. Cancelling trips is no fun for me haha.
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Love how every "travel blogger" says they will never fly AA/Ethihad again and then says it again and again on subsequent flights.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Sat Mar 28, 2020 2:30 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
If we are wanting to be optimistic there are some really cheap fares right now thru June. And on some airlines into November. Booked RT to SFO at the end of June for $120 on WN. Usually is more than that one way. UA has them into Nov. both coasts have good prices. I figure if this isn’t over by then we can just cancel.


stl07 wrote:
I think I will pass Jshank. Cancelling trips is no fun for me haha.


I have been booking a lot for June/July recently, these might be the lowest fares I will see for the rest of my life. ORD-LAX r/t for $47 bucks on AA, and basically anywhere you want to go in the US is under $100 oneway on the US3....that's pretty hard to pass up

Worst comes to worst, the airlines have waived change fees so I can just move the trip to a different date, no need to cancel
Status for 2019/2020: AAdvantage Platinum, Delta Gold, Southwest A-List
 
evanmartinson11
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Mar 29, 2020 10:54 pm

where did twa fly to from mwa
 
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 31, 2020 1:11 am

Are any birds parked here?
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Love how every "travel blogger" says they will never fly AA/Ethihad again and then says it again and again on subsequent flights.
 
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 31, 2020 4:56 am

stl07 wrote:
Are any birds parked here?


There is an AA 737-800 that has been on the ground for a week. Another that has been on the ground a couple days. They technically get signed up for flights but they keep getting cancelled according to Flightradar24. So we will see how long they stick around.
 
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OzarkD9S
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 31, 2020 10:29 am

evanmartinson11 wrote:

where did twa fly to from mwa


TWExpress to STL.
"True, I talk of dreams,
Which are the children of an idle brain." -Mercutio
 
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TWA302
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 31, 2020 3:28 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
stl07 wrote:
Are any birds parked here?


There is an AA 737-800 that has been on the ground for a week. Another that has been on the ground a couple days. They technically get signed up for flights but they keep getting cancelled according to Flightradar24. So we will see how long they stick around.


If AA runs out of room at TUL, we have a nice runway that isn't getting much use now for planes to park. :stirthepot:
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 31, 2020 4:15 pm

Airport commission meeting for tomorrow has been canceled.

At the Board of Public Service meeting today there is a note - discuss canceled projects at the airport due to the virus downturn.

I’m going to dial in and see what is said.
 
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 31, 2020 6:02 pm

Not that I see this giving us some large increase in traffic but Viking is starting their Mississippi River cruises in 2022. STL is a start point for 1 of the 4 options. It would be nice to have people come a couple days early and spend some money in town.

https://thepointsguy.com/news/one-of-th ... -big-deal/
 
stlgph
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 31, 2020 6:18 pm

A benefit, for sure, but the real benefit will come when they bring their MS River fleet up to scale and the arrivals and departures become more frequent from STL airport. I have two friends in Europe who are cruise directors and they say people keep asking them about U.S. river cruises, which is a good thing, and they also say people usually come into the host port 1-2 days ahead of their cruise departure and do their own thing before joining the boat which usually spends an additional day in port with escorted tours the next day before heading out.

Right off hand, I can see the Zoo, the Arch, wine country, and Grant's Farm benefitting from the escorted tours.

I can only hope for those who come in on their own a few days out they have good experiences on the MetroLink and it's "cleaned up" by then.
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atrude777
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 31, 2020 6:19 pm

https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... fc277.html

"ST. LOUIS — Southwest Airlines Co. said Tuesday it will cut more than 40% of flights from May 3 through June 5 amid a sharp decline in travel demand from the coronavirus pandemic.

The U.S. airline, the dominant passenger carrier at St. Louis Lambert International Airport, said will fly 2,000 flights a day, down 1,700 over normal levels. The airline previously said it was canceling 1,500 flights a day in April.

In St. Louis, that means less than 60 daily departures starting on May 1 — a drop of more than 50% since the coronavirus pandemic caused global air travel to implode."

Really a bummer, but expected from the largest airline in STL. What a huge drop.

Passenger traffic down 90% in STL too. Glad they are staying at home!

Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
atrude777
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Mar 31, 2020 6:24 pm

evanmartinson11 wrote:
where did twa fly to from mwa



OzarkD9S wrote:
TWExpress to STL.



Originally yes, MWA-STL was flown by the J31 aircraft by Trans States, then Corporate.

However for awhile, MWA saw flights flown by TWE to CGI and PAH as well!

Source: http://www.departedflights.com/TW013787.html

Alex
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OzarkD9S
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Wed Apr 01, 2020 1:40 am

Add-ons but yep atrude
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Which are the children of an idle brain." -Mercutio
 
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Wed Apr 01, 2020 2:41 am

stlgph wrote:
A benefit, for sure, but the real benefit will come when they bring their MS River fleet up to scale and the arrivals and departures become more frequent from STL airport. I have two friends in Europe who are cruise directors and they say people keep asking them about U.S. river cruises, which is a good thing, and they also say people usually come into the host port 1-2 days ahead of their cruise departure and do their own thing before joining the boat which usually spends an additional day in port with escorted tours the next day before heading out.

Right off hand, I can see the Zoo, the Arch, wine country, and Grant's Farm benefitting from the escorted tours.

I can only hope for those who come in on their own a few days out they have good experiences on the MetroLink and it's "cleaned up" by then.

This is not a Metrolink consumer I would think. According to the Viking, the cruises start at $3,000. To put that into perspective, the high-end American cruise line Celebrity has voyages of similar length that start at 600-800.

I think one benefit of these cruises will be the ability to fill the forward cabin of a TATL 2x a week. Say these boats have 380 passengers, undoubtedly many of those will wish to fly in Business or First considering the price of the cruise. Also, many suite cabins include F/J flights. Viking said their aim is to get passengers from Europe, so we should be able to book full a TATL front cabin on the flight leading up to the cruise. Now we go to BA's office (or Condor, LH, AF, ect) and say we can guarantee the front cabin will be full on 2 of the 4 flights a week, and once the ships ramp up like you said, all 4 flights would be full in the forward cabin, we are playing a completely different ball game than ever before.

Also, you were right on the money about tours.
https://www.vikingrivercruises.com/crui ... 5474331634
$299 to see the art museum and a hotel stay. LOL
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stlgph
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:14 pm

You'd be surprised - of the work I've done with Viking and Vantage, most just fly coach since it's all included in the price already. The add-ons are quite high and that was a push/priority for Vantage back in 2012-2014 - get people to buy the upgrades. It paid off - kind of sort - what the end result wound up being is Vantage found is since some of these people do cruises more than once a year, they split pricing on a majority of cruises... say a 13 day cruise to Moscow costs $5099 for the cruise ... 14 days (where you come in the night before and overnight on the ship) with coach airfare is $5699. So for $500 you get airfare from their "Zone 1" (northeast/Mid Atlantic states) , Zone 2 (southwest/Midwest) was $50 more on each package, etc. etc. For Zone 1, the upgrade to business class is $3,900. Not saying it's not possible that some people do it, but for that price, hell you can suffer in coach for a few hours and then take that money and spend it on another cruise later in the year!

So they had the option of doing their own thing with their airfare in response to people wanting to use their reward points for upgrades, etc. If you went with the Vantage package, you couldn't upgrade because of the group/block pricing structure where Vantage bought a number of tickets from carriers in advance.

It also appears that travelers, at least from the states, don't mind connections either. Both of my cruise director pals are stationed in Budapest, which they say is the busiest port/hub for Viking in Europe. Nonstops from the states are limited. It's kind of funny and annoying at the same time because if you're out and about in Budapest and you're less than say a half mile to a mile from the river and you're looking to ask someone for directions or a local for a good restaurant or part of town to visit - everyone is from the states on one of the damn cruises! :)
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
stlgph
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Wed Apr 01, 2020 7:37 pm

A quick look at the Southwest schedule - picking Friday, May 15 as a totally random date.

Atlanta
725p

Austin
925a
525p

Baltimore
740a
1215p
735p

Boston
1210p
635p

Chicago Midway
735a
1130a
555p

Dallas Love
735a
1155a
505p

Denver
700a
145p
555p

Des Moines
1205p
350p
735p

Ft Lauderdale
225p

Ft Myers
905a

Houston
530p

Kansas City
700a
740p

Las Vegas
920a
440p

Little Rock
145p
730p

Los Angeles
925a

Milwaukee
1205p

Nashville
425p

New York LaGuardia
1105a
735p

Oakland
930a

Omaha
740p

Orlando
805a
240p
625p

Panama City
1050a
710p

Phoenix
715a
335p

Portland
345p

Sacramento
915a

Salt Lake City
935a

San Diego
925a

San Jose
925a

Seattle
920a

Tampa
710p

Tulsa
735a
745p

Washington National
910a
300p
755p

Wichita
1030a
230p
730p

Nothing for:
Cleveland
Columbus
Detroit
Hartford
Minneapolis St Paul
New Orleans
Oklahoma City
Philadelphia
Pittsburgh
Raleigh Durham
San Antonio
San Francisco
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Wed Apr 01, 2020 10:39 pm

^ I saw they were picking up extra flights to some spokes ICT/DSM. Found it interesting. I think I saw they were cutting some of their other routes and focusing them here.

Also, not surprised they cut to other airlines hubs MSP/DTW/PHL. Might as well let the lecacy airlines handle those.

Schedule must change the following week because OKC/CLE/PIT/more are back the next Monday.
 
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T18
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Thu Apr 02, 2020 10:21 am

stl07 wrote:
Are any birds parked here?


Bunch of G7 and AX metal at the Hangers on the North side. Pretty sure I've seen some stuff stilling on the C-pad the last week too.
“Racing's important to men who do it well. When you're racing, it's life. Anything that happens before or after is just waiting.” ― Steve McQueen (Le Mans) 1971
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Sat Apr 11, 2020 4:19 am

February stats, which will be the last positive ones for awhile.

Up 3.3% on the month
Up 3.6% on the year

Cargo up 20%

https://www.flystl.com/uploads/document ... b-ATAR.pdf
 
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TWA302
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Sat Apr 11, 2020 3:02 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
February stats, which will be the last positive ones for awhile.

Up 3.3% on the month
Up 3.6% on the year

Cargo up 20%

https://www.flystl.com/uploads/document ... b-ATAR.pdf


And then the shit hit the fan........
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 5:23 pm

Domestic Load Factors for all of 2019 are out. I finished up my spreadsheets. INTL lags by 3 months.

Alaska
San Diego - 82% (route cut November)
Seattle - 81%

American
Charlotte - 82%
Chicago - 72% - could be a bit off due to regionals
Dallas - 78%
Los Angeles - 78.5%
Miami - 81.5
LGA - 76.5% - partial year due to regional overlaps makes this not exact
Philly -78%
Phoenix - 82%
DCA - 77%

Delta
Atlanta - 84%
Cincy - 57.5%
Detroit - 81%
Minny - 75.5%
LGA - 68% (incomplete because Republic is a shared regional)
Orlando - 87% (Sat only Mar/Jun/July)
Salt Lake City - 84%

Frontier
Denver - 87.5%
Jacksonville - 77%( Cut Apr)
Las Vegas - 90%
Orlando - 91%
West Palm Beach - 82% (Cut Apr)

Sun Country
Fort Myers - 77.5% (Jan-Apr/Dec)
Las Vegas - 81% (Started Sept)
Portland - 77.5% (June-Sept)
Min - 65% (Started June)
Tampa - 82% (Jan-Apr/Dec)

United
Chicago - 80.5% (Could be off a bit due to regionals)
Denver - 86.5%
Houston - 84%
Newark - 84.5% (Over 90% in Dec after Southwest left)
San Francisco - 80.5%
DC - 86.5%

Southwest
ATL - 79%
Austin - 86%
Baltimore - 78%
Boston - 75.5%
Charleston - 86.5% (Mar-Aug)
Chicago - 74%
CLE - 84%
Columbus - 82%
DAL - 75%
DEN - 85%
Des Moines - 80%
Detroit - 78%
Fort Lauderdale - 82%
Fort Myers - 86%
Hartford - 88.5%
HOU - 74%
KC - 80%
Vegas - 86%
Little Rock - 73%
LA - 83%
Milwaukee - 82%
Minny -73%
Nashville - 84%
New Orleans - 75%
LGA - 83%
EWR - 80% (ended Nov)
Oakland - 90.5%
OKC - 81%
Omaha - 86.5%
Orlando - 88%
Panama City - 84% (Mar-Nov)
Pensacola - 84.5% (Jun-Sept)
Philly - 82.5%
Pitt - 85%
Phoenix - 85.5%
Portland - 91.5%
Raleigh - 83.5%
Sacramento - 93%
Salt Lake - 80.5% (started Oct)
San Antonio - 81%
San Diego - 90%
SFO - 89%
San Jose - 90%
Seattle - 90.5%
Tampa - 85%
Tulsa - 78%
DC - 83%
West Palm Beach - 85.5% (March - Sat only)
Wichita - 79.5%

Allegiant (BLV)
Destin - 80.5%
Fort Lauderdale - 87.5% (Feb-Sept)
Jacksonville - 82% (Feb-Sept)
Vegas - 89% (Jan-Sept)
Myrtle Beach - 85% (May-Aug)
Sanford/Orlando - 89.5%
Mesa/Phx - 87% (Jan-Apr/Dec)
Punta Gorda - 89%
Sarasota - 71% (started Nov)
St. Pete - 90.5%

Full Spreadsheet
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Sun Apr 12, 2020 5:30 pm

Looks like Apple Vacations canceled all their charters with Viva Aerobus for the rest of the year.

Frontiers Cancun and Punta Cana flights have been extended thru 2021.
 
pmanni1
Posts: 242
Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:17 am

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 1:39 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
Domestic Load Factors for all of 2019 are out. I finished up my spreadsheets. INTL lags by 3 months.

Alaska
San Diego - 82% (route cut November)
Seattle - 81%

American
Charlotte - 82%
Chicago - 72% - could be a bit off due to regionals
Dallas - 78%
Los Angeles - 78.5%
Miami - 81.5
LGA - 76.5% - partial year due to regional overlaps makes this not exact
Philly -78%
Phoenix - 82%
DCA - 77%

Delta
Atlanta - 84%
Cincy - 57.5%
Detroit - 81%
Minny - 75.5%
LGA - 68% (incomplete because Republic is a shared regional)
Orlando - 87% (Sat only Mar/Jun/July)
Salt Lake City - 84%

Frontier
Denver - 87.5%
Jacksonville - 77%( Cut Apr)
Las Vegas - 90%
Orlando - 91%
West Palm Beach - 82% (Cut Apr)

Sun Country
Fort Myers - 77.5% (Jan-Apr/Dec)
Las Vegas - 81% (Started Sept)
Portland - 77.5% (June-Sept)
Min - 65% (Started June)
Tampa - 82% (Jan-Apr/Dec)

United
Chicago - 80.5% (Could be off a bit due to regionals)
Denver - 86.5%
Houston - 84%
Newark - 84.5% (Over 90% in Dec after Southwest left)
San Francisco - 80.5%
DC - 86.5%

Southwest
ATL - 79%
Austin - 86%
Baltimore - 78%
Boston - 75.5%
Charleston - 86.5% (Mar-Aug)
Chicago - 74%
CLE - 84%
Columbus - 82%
DAL - 75%
DEN - 85%
Des Moines - 80%
Detroit - 78%
Fort Lauderdale - 82%
Fort Myers - 86%
Hartford - 88.5%
HOU - 74%
KC - 80%
Vegas - 86%
Little Rock - 73%
LA - 83%
Milwaukee - 82%
Minny -73%
Nashville - 84%
New Orleans - 75%
LGA - 83%
EWR - 80% (ended Nov)
Oakland - 90.5%
OKC - 81%
Omaha - 86.5%
Orlando - 88%
Panama City - 84% (Mar-Nov)
Pensacola - 84.5% (Jun-Sept)
Philly - 82.5%
Pitt - 85%
Phoenix - 85.5%
Portland - 91.5%
Raleigh - 83.5%
Sacramento - 93%
Salt Lake - 80.5% (started Oct)
San Antonio - 81%
San Diego - 90%
SFO - 89%
San Jose - 90%
Seattle - 90.5%
Tampa - 85%
Tulsa - 78%
DC - 83%
West Palm Beach - 85.5% (March - Sat only)
Wichita - 79.5%

Allegiant (BLV)
Destin - 80.5%
Fort Lauderdale - 87.5% (Feb-Sept)
Jacksonville - 82% (Feb-Sept)
Vegas - 89% (Jan-Sept)
Myrtle Beach - 85% (May-Aug)
Sanford/Orlando - 89.5%
Mesa/Phx - 87% (Jan-Apr/Dec)
Punta Gorda - 89%
Sarasota - 71% (started Nov)
St. Pete - 90.5%

Full Spreadsheet
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing


The winner is Sacramento! Seems so random to have the highest loads of any destination.
 
atrude777
Posts: 4380
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 11:23 pm

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:14 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
Domestic Load Factors for all of 2019 are out. I finished up my spreadsheets. INTL lags by 3 months.



Jshank83-Thanks so much for getting this done!

Mind blowing in my opinion to see even legacy carriers, AA, UA, DL hold their own against Southwest out of STL. The market really was there before COVID19 took effect. How sad!

Any chance Cape Air, and Air Choice One reports too or no?

I am curious how EAS is doing with Cape Air. Especially now after the Virus.

CGI/PAH right now are averaging 3 passengers per flight on a 50 seater.

Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
Jshank83
Posts: 3447
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 2:23 pm

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:41 pm

pmanni1 wrote:

The winner is Sacramento! Seems so random to have the highest loads of any destination.


It’s been above 90% I think every month except one since it started. Been high pretty consistently. A lot of east coast flights feed into that outbound bank (mostly west coast out bounds). So I’m sure that helps. One of our highest O&D spots that only has 1 flight a day. 106 on average fly STL-SMF a day.
Last edited by Jshank83 on Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Jshank83
Posts: 3447
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 2:23 pm

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:44 pm

atrude777 wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:
Domestic Load Factors for all of 2019 are out. I finished up my spreadsheets. INTL lags by 3 months.



Jshank83-Thanks so much for getting this done!

Mind blowing in my opinion to see even legacy carriers, AA, UA, DL hold their own against Southwest out of STL. The market really was there before COVID19 took effect. How sad!

Any chance Cape Air, and Air Choice One reports too or no?

I am curious how EAS is doing with Cape Air. Especially now after the Virus.

CGI/PAH right now are averaging 3 passengers per flight on a 50 seater.

Alex


EAS numbers are available. I just don’t go thru them. If you want to know specific ones I can look them up later today. Everything is a 3 month lag though so only thru Dec 2019 is out. January comes out on Thursday.
 
atrude777
Posts: 4380
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 11:23 pm

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 4:10 pm

Jshank83 wrote:

EAS numbers are available. I just don’t go thru them. If you want to know specific ones I can look them up later today. Everything is a 3 month lag though so only thru Dec 2019 is out. January comes out on Thursday.


If you don't mind!

MWA-BNA wouldn't have started yet, so MWA-STL is the only one flying in the date you're mentioning.

Always curious to see how Cape Air and the others do!

Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
Jshank83
Posts: 3447
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 2:23 pm

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 5:12 pm

atrude777 wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:

EAS numbers are available. I just don’t go thru them. If you want to know specific ones I can look them up later today. Everything is a 3 month lag though so only thru Dec 2019 is out. January comes out on Thursday.


If you don't mind!

MWA-BNA wouldn't have started yet, so MWA-STL is the only one flying in the date you're mentioning.

Always curious to see how Cape Air and the others do!

Alex


2019
STL LF/Passenger numbers (if service to multiple airports the total is listed at end of line)
Cape Air
DEC - 50% - 6,100 passengers (also had ORD service) - 16,650 passengers total
IRK - 56% - 10,261 passengers
MWA - 59% - 19,751 passengers
OWB - 53% - 10,156 passengers

Air Choice One
BRL - 55% - 4,671 passengers (also had service to ORD and MCW) - Total 12,860 passengers
FOD - 71% - 9,414 passengers (also had service to MSP and MCW) - Total 12,720 passengers
JBR - 71% - 8,275 passengers
MKL - 64% - 4,483 passengers (also had service to ATL and VPS) - Total 6,030 passengers


Fort Leonard Wood
Cape Air - 43% - 1,112
Contour - 27% - 7,504 (Cleaned up the data a bit so might not be exact but it close enough)
Total Passengers - 8,616
Fort Leonard Wood was down from 14,250 in 2018. I wouldn't be surprised if they move back to someone else after Contours contract is up. We see how they do now that they have an interline with AA. That "should" help.
 
atrude777
Posts: 4380
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 11:23 pm

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 5:46 pm

Jshank83 wrote:

2019
STL LF/Passenger numbers (if service to multiple airports the total is listed at end of line)
Cape Air
DEC - 50% - 6,100 passengers (also had ORD service) - 16,650 passengers total
IRK - 56% - 10,261 passengers
MWA - 59% - 19,751 passengers
OWB - 53% - 10,156 passengers

Air Choice One
BRL - 55% - 4,671 passengers (also had service to ORD and MCW) - Total 12,860 passengers
FOD - 71% - 9,414 passengers (also had service to MSP and MCW) - Total 12,720 passengers
JBR - 71% - 8,275 passengers
MKL - 64% - 4,483 passengers (also had service to ATL and VPS) - Total 6,030 passengers


Fort Leonard Wood
Cape Air - 43% - 1,112
Contour - 27% - 7,504 (Cleaned up the data a bit so might not be exact but it close enough)
Total Passengers - 8,616
Fort Leonard Wood was down from 14,250 in 2018. I wouldn't be surprised if they move back to someone else after Contours contract is up. We see how they do now that they have an interline with AA. That "should" help.


JShanks-This is absolutely fascinating!

MWA has the highest load factor for Cape Air, we have heard this over and over down here. The MWA folks had been begging Cape Air to add more flights to meet the load factor.

It tells me that SkyWest maybe could have worked out, but ironically, MWA not choosing SkyWest, and the COVID19 happening could very well have been a blessing in disguise for MWA.

I am curious to see how 2020 will look, with MWA splitting BNA too and STL.

Is the 19K "round trip"? Meaning it's a hair over 9K each direction? (For MWA)

Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
Jshank83
Posts: 3447
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 2:23 pm

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Tue Apr 14, 2020 6:35 pm

atrude777 wrote:

Is the 19K "round trip"? Meaning it's a hair over 9K each direction? (For MWA)

Alex


Correct. All are both ways combined.
 
User avatar
TWA302
Posts: 711
Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 12:17 am

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2020

Mon Apr 20, 2020 9:12 pm

Since we don't have much to talk about right now, reported a few days ago that Lambert will benefit from a $60 million grant to can be used to pay employee salaries, utilities or airport development.

https://www.kmov.com/news/lambert-airport-to-receive-nearly-60-million-in-federal-grant-money/article_9464b994-7fe3-11ea-b54f-8b97823c21fb.html

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