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ctrabs0114
Posts: 1088
Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2017 8:09 am

Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 3:36 am

Ishrion wrote:
Quick question - Is anyone else’s page on this thread being weird? Half of it is cut off and you need to scroll sideways. Or is it just me?


I'm having the same issue with the first page, but page 2 is fine so far. That's happened from time to time on other topics, but it's rare.
2019: DAL, MCI, PHX, LAS, DFW, SAT, ORD, SLC, SEA, DTW, PHL, MIA, LAX; B73G (WN x3), B738 (WN, AA, DL), A20N (NK), MD83 (AA), B788 (AA x2), CS1 (DL), B739 (DL), B712 (DL), B752 (AA), B763 (AA), B77W (AA), B789 (AA)
Next: TBA
 
Ishrion
Posts: 2937
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Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 3:48 am

ctrabs0114 wrote:
Ishrion wrote:
Quick question - Is anyone else’s page on this thread being weird? Half of it is cut off and you need to scroll sideways. Or is it just me?


I'm having the same issue with the first page, but page 2 is fine so far. That's happened from time to time on other topics, but it's rare.


Looks to be the guy with a huge signature without any spaces.
 
RvA
Posts: 404
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2015 12:37 pm

Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 2:40 pm

Aisak wrote:
RvA wrote:
If you offer someone FRA-LHR-SFO or FRA-PHL-SFO at similar price it’s likely the former is often slightly faster but also seen as more comfortable as you arrive at US customs in SFO and off you go to your hotel or whatever. Doing that in PHL first to then go through security again to then have to wait around again before you have to have another few hours of flying isn’t much fun.


Well, transferring though the UK is not much fun either. You have to reclear security as well at LHR to remain “airside”. And if you have to transfer from T5B/C to AA of some BA services at T3 or vv... not that simple either.
Clear US inmigration... yes, you have to do it any way you choose. At the end of the journey, midway at the first point of entry, or at preclereance stations like DUB/SNN... that’s a just a matter of personal preference.


LHR was just an example could be any hub in Europe. LHR is one of my least favourite but personally much more attractive of an option vs connecting in PHL. (JFK and MIA are also high on my list of negative experiences Intl/Dom connections).
 
RvA
Posts: 404
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Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 2:42 pm

usflyer msp wrote:
RvA wrote:
usflyer msp wrote:

Nonsense. AA is not particularly successful in Germany because most of the traffic has German point-of-sale and they prefer to fly German carriers. This is the case in most Northern European markets. AA does well in Southern and Eastern Europe because most of the traffic has a US point-of-sale and prefers to fly a US carrier. The inflight product has little to do with it.


Partially true though product Is very relevant in Aken customer segments so shouldn’t be ignored, it is also related to the destinations AA flies/flew from in the US. Competition on price is fierce so if for the same price someone can connect within Europe to then fly on to the final destination (or of course fly there direct from origin if possible) also makes a big difference. If you offer someone FRA-LHR-SFO or FRA-PHL-SFO at similar price it’s likely the former is often slightly faster but also seen as more comfortable as you arrive at US customs in SFO and off you go to your hotel or whatever. Doing that in PHL first to then go through security again to then have to wait around again before you have to have another few hours of flying isn’t much fun.


No really, point-of-sale is like 95% of the issue. Irregardless of inflight product, the only way AA is going to attract German pax is by being cheap Otherwise, they are going to fly LH.


I disagree.
 
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flymco753
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Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 3:34 pm

Any chance of AA getting into PHL-ZAG?
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
Ishrion
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Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 3:41 pm

flymco753 wrote:
Any chance of AA getting into PHL-ZAG?


Would a 788 be too big? I’m sure the XLR could do it.

ZAG has been looking for U.S. service. Last I heard, they were in talks with 2 U.S. airlines in launching service from New York to Zagreb.
 
rbavfan
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Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 3:49 pm

Ishrion wrote:
Quick question - Is anyone else’s page on this thread being weird? Half of it is cut off and you need to scroll sideways. Or is it just me?


It does that a lot due to the adds on each side that block the text. Omly work around is fullscreen 1920 x 1080 so the dds don't block. Sucks for us that joined for life and the takeover cut off our purchase of that feature.
 
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flymco753
Posts: 3387
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Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 3:49 pm

Ishrion wrote:
flymco753 wrote:
Any chance of AA getting into PHL-ZAG?


Would a 788 be too big? I’m sure the XLR could do it.

ZAG has been looking for U.S. service. Last I heard, they were in talks with 2 U.S. airlines in launching service from New York to Zagreb.
Back in the day JAT Yugoslav could make ZAG-US work. I would assume UA takes EWR while AA takes PHL. Wonder where that puts DL. Midwest? How can DL connect Western PA, Northern OH, SE MI, and the Chicago area?
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
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Polot
Posts: 10712
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Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 3:54 pm

flymco753 wrote:
Ishrion wrote:
flymco753 wrote:
Any chance of AA getting into PHL-ZAG?


Would a 788 be too big? I’m sure the XLR could do it.

ZAG has been looking for U.S. service. Last I heard, they were in talks with 2 U.S. airlines in launching service from New York to Zagreb.
Back in the day JAT Yugoslav could make ZAG-US work. I would assume UA takes EWR while AA takes PHL. Wonder where that puts DL. Midwest? How can DL connect Western PA, Northern OH, SE MI, and the Chicago area?

Don’t use the existence of service by a government owned carrier, especially one like JAT, as evidence that a route worked.
 
rbavfan
Posts: 3627
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:53 am

Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 4:12 pm

PW100 wrote:
flflyguy wrote:
Ishrion wrote:
Quick question - Is anyone else’s page on this thread being weird? Half of it is cut off and you need to scroll sideways. Or is it just me?


Happening to me too.


It is because of the signature by poster Delta777Jet. The forum database software can't break up the long string in the signature.


Delta777Jet wrote:
American flew ORD - DUS - TXL in 1992 with B-767-200’s !

Delta777Jet, please break up your signature into two or three blocks by adding a space or comma. Thanks!


Why have the moderators not notified him of that and made him conform to a simple change? After all it's been an extreemly issue for those of us that have limited screen space when we have to see the pages at work & noted by people for a long time now. And yes I am allowed to work & cruise the web at the same time. Great bosses.
 
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flymco753
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Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 4:14 pm

Polot wrote:
flymco753 wrote:
Ishrion wrote:

Would a 788 be too big? I’m sure the XLR could do it.

ZAG has been looking for U.S. service. Last I heard, they were in talks with 2 U.S. airlines in launching service from New York to Zagreb.
Back in the day JAT Yugoslav could make ZAG-US work. I would assume UA takes EWR while AA takes PHL. Wonder where that puts DL. Midwest? How can DL connect Western PA, Northern OH, SE MI, and the Chicago area?

Don’t use the existence of service by a government owned carrier, especially one like JAT, as evidence that a route worked.
Cool, didn't know that was a thing with JAT until now, thanks. :thumbsup:
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
rbavfan
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Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Fri Jan 03, 2020 10:18 pm

PHXWRLD wrote:
PHL is lucky to have the intercontinental service it does. PHX, a similarly sized AA hub sees service to just LHR. We would happily take what you have.


I wonder does PHX have more flights south of our boarder or to Hawaii than PHL? That would be a better comparison than with PHX-TATL. After all PHX-TATL is to far west to compare to PHL.
 
PHXWRLD
Posts: 70
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Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Sat Jan 04, 2020 4:45 am

rbavfan wrote:
PHXWRLD wrote:
PHL is lucky to have the intercontinental service it does. PHX, a similarly sized AA hub sees service to just LHR. We would happily take what you have.


I wonder does PHX have more flights south of our boarder or to Hawaii than PHL? That would be a better comparison than with PHX-TATL. After all PHX-TATL is to far west to compare to PHL.


No the better comparison is PHX TPAC to PHL TATL. PHX has NO TPAC service which is indicative of how neglected and underserved we are.
 
acentauri
Posts: 308
Joined: Wed Jun 22, 2016 12:35 am

Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Mon Jan 13, 2020 5:08 am

PHLspecial wrote:
.....................
I would challenge your words and say that AA is using it's assets to its strengths. PHL is a great location for European flights we know that. We also know that AA has roughly 70% of the flights out of PHL. We also know that Philadelphia is the poorest major U.S. city of course the O&D numbers will be weak...

O&D is based on Airport Catchment not individual city limits. The PHL Airport Catchment (and most big city airport catchment areas) is significantly larger than the City Limits. It is more equivalent to the METRO area. This is a much more accurate representation of the PHL Metro area Poverty Rate - as well as many other large Hub Metros. https://www.usnews.com/news/cities/arti ... etro-areas. It's pretty obvious that poverty rates have had little, if anything to do with the establishment/maintenance of large airline hubs, else LA, MIA, DTW, IAH and NYC would not be airline Hubs.
 
notconcerned
Posts: 189
Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2016 3:39 pm

Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Mon Jan 13, 2020 5:47 am

NYCVIE wrote:
MAH4546 wrote:

How does AA not compete with United out of O’Hare to Europe? It certainly does and has a very impressive, although very seasonal, Chicago-Europe presence.

Milan is a market AA has been serving out of JFK well for a long time and I think it’s been happy keeping it there. Plus PHL’s single biggest feeder for its EU flights is MIA, which is also served year-round on AA metal from Milan. A third daily AA flight in the market is probably overkill.


I think its clear what he meant... UA is flying to 5, soon 6 year round European destinations from ORD and AA is flying to 1.


Actually UA flies to 6, soon to be 7 European destinations from ORD: AMS, BRU, FRA, LHR, MUC, CDG, and soon ZRH.
AA flies to 1 (LHR), its one and only year round intercontinental route from ORD.
 
LCDFlight
Posts: 621
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:22 pm

Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Mon Jan 13, 2020 6:00 am

PHXWRLD wrote:
rbavfan wrote:
PHXWRLD wrote:
PHL is lucky to have the intercontinental service it does. PHX, a similarly sized AA hub sees service to just LHR. We would happily take what you have.


I wonder does PHX have more flights south of our boarder or to Hawaii than PHL? That would be a better comparison than with PHX-TATL. After all PHX-TATL is to far west to compare to PHL.


No the better comparison is PHX TPAC to PHL TATL. PHX has NO TPAC service which is indicative of how neglected and underserved we are.


You do realize the exact same team makes both those decisions? And until recently, they lived in Phoenix. Now, they would live in DFW.

If you are accusing them of using different standards, you're not correct. They will do whatever makes money for the business. An airline is not a toy for fanboys or little kids, it is a very expensive business. AA has studied this question and you have your answer in front of you.
 
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PacoMartin
Posts: 901
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Re: PHL’s Transatlantic Routes - Why?

Mon Jan 13, 2020 9:05 am

notconcerned wrote:
Actually UA flies to 6, soon to be 7 European destinations from ORD: AMS, BRU, FRA, LHR, MUC, CDG, and soon ZRH.
AA flies to 1 (LHR), its one and only year round intercontinental route from ORD.


Even seasonally AA trails the other two airlines from all US airports

Data for June 2019 count of the average number of TransAtlantic international fllights per day (origin in US).
67.4 American Airlines Inc.
79.5 United Air Lines Inc.
90.6 Delta Air Lines Inc.
-----
237.5

Destination of TATL flights in June 2019 via US airlines
47.5 LHR
27.7 AMS
24.9 CDG
14.0 FRA
11.9 FCO
9.8 DUB
9.8 MAD
8.8 BCN
8.8 MUC
6.0 EDI
6.0 ZRH
5.0 MXP
5.0 BRU
5.0 ATH
5.0 LIS
5.0 VCE
4.9 TLV
32.4 other
---------
237.5

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