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LatinPlane
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Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Fri Jan 03, 2020 9:59 pm

Effective this week and until March, you can fly scheduled air service to two of SoCal's most interesting airports. Taos Air begins flights from Taos, New Mexico to Hawthorne Airport - a private airport about a mile away from LAX and home to SpaceX, The Boring Company, and Tesla Design Studios. Hawthorne is a small private airport with a really small runway, but it is particularly interesting because it's located so close to LAX. You can see it just as you're about to land on LAX's leftmost runway.

THURSDAY & SATURDAY

HAWTHORNE (LOS ANGELES)
Flight Depart Routing Arrive
295 7:30am Hawthorne - Taos 10:30am
294 5:30pm Taos - Hawthorne


Carlsbad - Palomar Airport - San Diego's second airport is briefly getting restored scheduled service after having off and on service over the past few years.


CARLSBAD (SAN DIEGO)
Flight Depart Routing Arrive
292 9:56am Taos - Carlsbad 11:15am
293 12:00pm Carlsbad - Taos 3:00pm

https://www.skitaos.com/taos-air/fares

Great opportunity to see what's it's like flying to these unique airports!
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mga707
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Fri Jan 03, 2020 10:01 pm

Aircraft type?
 
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AVLAirlineFreq
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Fri Jan 03, 2020 10:05 pm

mga707 wrote:
Aircraft type?


30-seat Dornier 328 jets.
 
LatinPlane
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Fri Jan 03, 2020 10:15 pm



Forgot to add, that flights are operated on a 30-seat Dornier 328. In fact, I just realized, you can book yourself a Hawthorne to Dallas flight via Taos, New Mexico for a cool $290.00 one way. You can also book a Carlsbad - Austin TX for about the same price. Not bad! Because what is there to do in Taos, New Mexico anyway? I may try it just to experience Hawthorne Airport!
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sprxUSA
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Fri Jan 03, 2020 11:34 pm

Looked on Taos Air site, OW HHR-DAL was $290 on 1/23. Went to Advanced Air site (operator of flight) and exact same was $240.
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mga707
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:23 am

LatinPlane wrote:


Forgot to add, that flights are operated on a 30-seat Dornier 328. In fact, I just realized, you can book yourself a Hawthorne to Dallas flight via Taos, New Mexico for a cool $290.00 one way. You can also book a Carlsbad - Austin TX for about the same price. Not bad! Because what is there to do in Taos, New Mexico anyway? I may try it just to experience Hawthorne Airport!


Thanks for the aircraft type. A rare one in 2020. As for Taos, while it is mainly a ski resort, which is why these flights are offered, it is a neat little town. The Taos Pueblo is one of the oldest continuously-occupied places in what is now the US. Up there with a couple of the Hopi villages in my state (AZ) next door. People have lived there since 1300 or earlier. Lots of history in the Taos area. Mountain man/frontier legend Kit Carson is buried there.
 
bob75013
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:41 am

LatinPlane wrote:


Forgot to add, that flights are operated on a 30-seat Dornier 328. In fact, I just realized, you can book yourself a Hawthorne to Dallas flight via Taos, New Mexico for a cool $290.00 one way. You can also book a Carlsbad - Austin TX for about the same price. Not bad! Because what is there to do in Taos, New Mexico anyway?


During winter, snow ski at one of the 4 most difficult mountains in the US.

edit add: adding detail to the post above mine Taos has been home to a significant art colony for decades. Among the most famous: DH Lawrence and Georgia O'Keefe

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taos_art_colony
Last edited by bob75013 on Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
Okie
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:51 am

bob75013 wrote:
During winter, snow ski at one of the 4 most difficult mountains in the US.


Family has cabin in Red River NM, it is just a few miles over to Taos.
Usually spend at least a day practicing up skiing at Red River before heading to Taos.
Taos has more than the average number of difficult trails.
Don't want to blow out a knee or break a leg the first day out.

Okie
 
blacksoviet
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 2:05 am

Does the Dornier 328 have lower fuel burn than the ERJ-135?
 
nine4nine
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:40 am

Hawthorne and Carlsbad??? I give it 3 months max. CLD could never sustain any service from anyone and Hawthorne is just plain stupid podunk general av air field that probably 90% of the LA basin population has no idea exists. SNA, SAN, BUR, or even VNY would be the most logical.
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 4:43 am

nine4nine wrote:
Hawthorne and Carlsbad??? I give it 3 months max.


Well, the flights are only being flown through March, so you're prediction is already correct. :D

Taos Air is actually owned by the same company that owns Taos ski resort, so it is likely heavily subsidized.

In addition to the aforementioned other things to do in the area, in the summer the High Road between Taos and Santa Fe is a remarkable drive.
 
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jmw99ttu
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 5:23 am

The DAL to Taos segment is operated out of the Signature FBO at love field. My neighbor is the manager of the FBO and said the flights have been pretty full. Flights to Taos include lift tickets and transfers, as the purpose of the flights is to get people in for skiing.
 
Carfield
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 7:21 am

Thanks for the tips!

I looked at the schedule and fare, and actually got a $190 one-way fare for next Saturday from Hawthorne to Dallas Love Field via Taos.
I flew the Dornier 328 Jet a few times before and could not pass out on another opportunity.

I will definitely report back!

Carfield
 
HVNandrew
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:53 pm

It's mind-boggling to me that Carlsbad isn't served by a major carrier anymore. I realize the runway is short, but you would think somebody would find some aircraft to link CLD to a western hub (PHX? SLC?).
 
sprxUSA
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:56 pm

HVNandrew wrote:
It's mind-boggling to me that Carlsbad isn't served by a major carrier anymore. I realize the runway is short, but you would think somebody would find some aircraft to link CLD to a western hub (PHX? SLC?).


No need to. The major serves any airport the Carlsbad crowd uses so why waterdown traffic while adding the additional costs of flying to CLD? That would be my assumption as a reason the major codes don't serve there.
Gem State Airlines..."we have a gem of an airline"
 
SyracuseAvGeek
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 4:25 pm

I just wrote an article about Taos air, check it out!

https://airlinegeeks.com/2019/12/23/the ... or-skiers/
"I haven't been everywhere yet, but it's on my list."
 
bob75013
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 4:59 pm

AVLAirlineFreq wrote:
nine4nine wrote:
Hawthorne and Carlsbad??? I give it 3 months max.


Well, the flights are only being flown through March, so you're prediction is already correct. :D

Taos Air is actually owned by the same company that owns Taos ski resort, so it is likely heavily subsidized.

In addition to the aforementioned other things to do in the area, in the summer the High Road between Taos and Santa Fe is a remarkable drive.


Actually a hedge fund manager owns both Taos Ski Area and Taos Air -- hedge fund manager and billionaire Louis Bacon. He bought the ski area 4-5 years ago and has been pumping money into it.
 
LatinPlane
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 6:19 pm

Looks like Taos Air ran a relatively successful operation out of Texas last year; its first season of operation. It was popular with the hip crowds of Dallas and Austin. They own their Dornier 328 and the airline's primary goal is to promote and bring people to Taos, NM. A lot of investment has taken place recently including a $26 million new runway for the airport. Found a news report of their inaugural operations last year.

https://www.kob.com/new-mexico-news/taos-air-celebrates-first-flights/5186232/

Mind you, the reporter substituted the Dornier for a small private jet. That small plane is certainly not capable of carrying 30 people.

The owners of the sky resort are trying to turn Taos, NM into the next Mammoth Lakes, CA/ Aspen, CO. They are trying to replicate the recent success they've had with the Texas crowds in Southern California. This may not be as easy here, as we already have closer well established options.

I just bought my ticket for end of February. I can't pass up the opportunity of flying out of Hawthorne airport on this rare bird, but also to give a vote of confidence to this new operation. One hopes they succeed, and the best way to do so is by supporting it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYOJBto4ngw

Here's their Dornier at Hawthorne airport. https://www.facebook.com/Advancedairlines/videos/483108068983374/
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MO11
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 7:15 pm

Actually, it has two Dorniers: the one that was flown last season, plus another that was acquired in September.
 
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Jan 04, 2020 8:00 pm

SyracuseAvGeek wrote:
I just wrote an article about Taos air, check it out!

https://airlinegeeks.com/2019/12/23/the ... or-skiers/

Good article!

After reading SyracuseAvGeek's article, it seems like Taos Air is a proxy to stimulate demand for the Taos market to attract traditional carriers. DEN on UA, DFW or PHX on AA, and maybe SLC or MSP on DL seem most likely if my theory is true. Similar to Cayman Air.
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TX2DC
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sun Jan 05, 2020 12:33 am

I flew Taos Air Dec 29 TSM-DAL after a holiday ski trip to New Mexico with the family. It was a real treat - no TSA screening, free beer/wine, 2 free bags, ice cream, snack service, arrival in private terminal, and friendly employees. Plus, it was a rare chance to fly the Dornier 328 Jet. I plan to submit a trip report with photos soon. I highly recommend Taos Air if you're headed to northern New Mexico.
 
TX2DC
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sun Jan 05, 2020 4:43 am

LatinPlane wrote:


Forgot to add, that flights are operated on a 30-seat Dornier 328. In fact, I just realized, you can book yourself a Hawthorne to Dallas flight via Taos, New Mexico for a cool $290.00 one way. You can also book a Carlsbad - Austin TX for about the same price. Not bad! Because what is there to do in Taos, New Mexico anyway? I may try it just to experience Hawthorne Airport!


Taos is a hub for arts, many celebrities and wealthy individuals have homes there. The skiing is top notch too. There is plenty to do in Taos.
 
Biscayne738
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sun Jan 05, 2020 5:01 am

It’s seasonal service. They will adjust according for the time of season.
 
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hawaiian717
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Mon Jan 06, 2020 4:24 pm

sprxUSA wrote:
No need to. The major serves any airport the Carlsbad crowd uses so why waterdown traffic while adding the additional costs of flying to CLD? That would be my assumption as a reason the major codes don't serve there.


CLD was served by Skywest/United Express with flight to LAX up until the retirement of the EMB-120. They don't have a suitable aircraft for the route anymore; the CRJ-200's performance there is questionable and the larger RJ's I think are too big for CLD-LAX's level of demand.

CLD was also served by Mesa/America West Express (and for a while as US Airways Express) from PHX with the Dash 8.
 
LatinPlane
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Thu Mar 05, 2020 6:44 am

Just to report that I flew Taos Air From Hawthorne municipal airport to Taos and then on to Dallas last Thursday. It was my birthday gift to myself. :) The flight is excellent, a great experience to fly scheduled private, and everyone from the pilots, FA, and ground crew were super nice. There's still chance to fly them. I highly recommend it!

On take off from Hawthorne.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rt55N7bi_B0

-

flight from Taos to Carlsbad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoncTv80ToY

I got the same FA on the video shown above. She was super friendly and gave me several rounds of snacks.
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N1120A
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Thu Mar 05, 2020 9:19 am

Another weird niche project. Too bad it means the stupid badge access to CRQ will stick around. Good that I'm not based there.

nine4nine wrote:
Hawthorne and Carlsbad??? I give it 3 months max. CLD could never sustain any service from anyone and Hawthorne is just plain stupid podunk general av air field that probably 90% of the LA basin population has no idea exists. SNA, SAN, BUR, or even VNY would be the most logical.


Podunk. LMAO. That "podunk" airport sees tons of very expensive business jets and is so close to LAX that there are special separation procedures for controllers at both airports.

Also, CRQ (I refuse to use the IATA code for Palomar) sustained service on real airlines, as opposed to garbage model money burns, for decades. The issue is that the runway length is marginal for RJs and OO retired the Brasilia. That place is a madhouse of business jets. If the runway extension does happen, I wouldn't be surprised to see one, if not even all three, of the big 3 come back there.
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:10 pm

LatinPlane wrote:
Just to report that I flew Taos Air From Hawthorne municipal airport to Taos and then on to Dallas last Thursday. It was my birthday gift to myself. :) The flight is excellent, a great experience to fly scheduled private, and everyone from the pilots, FA, and ground crew were super nice. There's still chance to fly them. I highly recommend it!

On take off from Hawthorne.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rt55N7bi_B0

-

flight from Taos to Carlsbad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoncTv80ToY

I got the same FA on the video shown above. She was super friendly and gave me several rounds of snacks.


OMG...I loved this! What a great birthday gift to yourself. It’s a real shame that Dornier Aircraft Company ended up going defunct. The 328 Jet seemed like a well-engineered aircraft for serving niche markets. It may have been an ideal aircraft for serving smaller suburban airports throughout California.

As somebody who grew up in CA, I’ve long believed there is a need for commercial air service at unserved and underserved suburban airports throughout the state...and more so now as traffic has proliferated and high-speed rail has stalled. Pacific Southwest Airlines had caught onto this idea back in the mid-1980’s by bringing the first commercial airline jet service to Concord (CCR) back in the day. I went to work for PSA in ‘87 and the company had other suburban California airports on its radar until the USAir acquisition thwarted that vision. At the time though, LAX-STS was very much on PSA’s radar. This was at a time when the only commercial service STS saw was commuter service to SFO by Westair/United Express. As PSA disappeared, Westair ended up acquiring a small fleet of BAe-146’s and jumped into the LAX-STS market for a time. Then UA gave up STS entirely and the airport was all but abandoned until Alaska/Horizon saw the market potential and as history has shown us, AS put STS on the map in a big way. As for CCR, the thinking by PSA management at the time was that whatever traffic was diluted from nearby OAK, it was all of PSA’s to capture...away from competitors like Air Cal and the other carriers that served the Bay Area-LA corridor.

I believe Carlsbad has similar potential, Alaska/Horizon is probably the best suited to make that market work utilizing the Q400’s. Since AS has made SAN a focus city, I would argue any traffic that gets bled from CLD would be all of Alaska’s to capture...away from WN and UA as well. I think JSX has found success in its CCR-BUR service and I would argue that there is very much a market for CCR-LAX and CCR-SNA as well.

Thank you for your post and for sharing your Taos Air travel journey with us!
Come fly the sun.
 
Okie
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Thu Mar 05, 2020 1:19 pm

LatinPlane wrote:

Thanks for the video.
The 328 gobbled up some runway on take off from KSKX at 7098ft of elevation.

The ski area over at Angle Fire KAXX 8382ft really kills performance as well.

Okie
 
KCaviator
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Thu Mar 05, 2020 2:54 pm

The pilots wear button-downs with a vest. Where do I sign up for this shit?
 
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FiscAutTecGarte
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Thu Mar 05, 2020 4:32 pm

blacksoviet wrote:
Does the Dornier 328 have lower fuel burn than the ERJ-135?

No, the 328 has a significantly higher fuel burn. But if it's an outright owned plane, the owners can stomach the higher consumption.

Taos is a really cool place. Driving through the Cimmaron mountains to get there is a real treat with all of the Elk. (of course you won't enjoy that flying) Spent a July there about 12 years ago and just froze. Very windy with cold nights. Good restaurants.
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Chuska
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Thu Mar 05, 2020 8:01 pm

Taos Air has extended the service this year from TSM to HHR and CLD through to April 12 (was planned to end Mar 29). The DAL and AUS flights still end Mar 29, I would have thought those would do better.
I drove up there last Saturday and got some photos of both Taos Air aircraft on the ground together at the very tiny terminal, very impressive and very busy!
 
blacksoviet
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Thu Mar 05, 2020 8:40 pm

Why did Skywest retire the EMB-120 when they knew that that was the only aircraft they could possibly operate at CLD?
 
DesertAir
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Thu Mar 05, 2020 8:52 pm

As somebody who grew up in CA, I’ve long believed there is a need for commercial air service at unserved and underserved suburban airports throughout the state.

I agree completely with this statement. The difficulty is high fares...the UX service to Stockton is very expensive. This does not generate traffic. Allegiant with reasonable fares is making a killing there. They should expand to daily LAX service.

Go Taos Air!
 
alasizon
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Thu Mar 05, 2020 9:06 pm

blacksoviet wrote:
Why did Skywest retire the EMB-120 when they knew that that was the only aircraft they could possibly operate at CLD?


A) The E120s were getting a bit long in the tooth
B) The drive towards upgauging makes it not worth it to fly a 30-seat prop around now
C) The American public has a general avoidance to props
D) You don't keep a fleet type around for a single marginal (read: not printing money) route that the demand can mostly be satisfied through SAN
E) The 1500 hour rule did the 120 no favors
F) Ramp space has better use now
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crjflyboy
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Thu Mar 05, 2020 11:04 pm

LatinPlane wrote:
Just to report that I flew Taos Air From Hawthorne municipal airport to Taos and then on to Dallas last Thursday. It was my birthday gift to myself. :) The flight is excellent, a great experience to fly scheduled private, and everyone from the pilots, FA, and ground crew were super nice. There's still chance to fly them. I highly recommend it!

On take off from Hawthorne.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rt55N7bi_B0

-

flight from Taos to Carlsbad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoncTv80ToY

I got the same FA on the video shown above. She was super friendly and gave me several rounds of snacks.


Just watched your video ... appears the cabin of the 328 is wider and brighter than the ERJ birds even though they are both 1 x 2 seating
 
LatinPlane
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Thu Mar 05, 2020 11:28 pm

crjflyboy wrote:
LatinPlane wrote:
Just to report that I flew Taos Air From Hawthorne municipal airport to Taos and then on to Dallas last Thursday. It was my birthday gift to myself. :) The flight is excellent, a great experience to fly scheduled private, and everyone from the pilots, FA, and ground crew were super nice. There's still chance to fly them. I highly recommend it!

On take off from Hawthorne.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rt55N7bi_B0

-

flight from Taos to Carlsbad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoncTv80ToY

I got the same FA on the video shown above. She was super friendly and gave me several rounds of snacks.


Just watched your video ... appears the cabin of the 328 is wider and brighter than the ERJ birds even though they are both 1 x 2 seating


Just to clarify, these are not videos taken by me. I just found these two videos online to demonstrate the experience of Taos Air's service.

I don't know the difference of the width of the cabin between the ERJ's and the Dornier 328s. This is my second flight on a Dornier 328, having also flown Ultimate Air Shuttle in the east coast. The Dornier 328 are great birds to fly on.

Image
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wedgetail737
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:01 am

How long was the connection time at Taos?
 
wedgetail737
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Fri Mar 06, 2020 4:02 am

blacksoviet wrote:
Why did Skywest retire the EMB-120 when they knew that that was the only aircraft they could possibly operate at CLD?


Maybe for SkyWest. I flew on very-short-lived CA Pacific between CLD and SJC on an EMB-145.
 
SyracuseAvGeek
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Fri Mar 06, 2020 5:05 am

LatinPlane wrote:
Just to report that I flew Taos Air From Hawthorne municipal airport to Taos and then on to Dallas last Thursday. It was my birthday gift to myself. :) The flight is excellent, a great experience to fly scheduled private, and everyone from the pilots, FA, and ground crew were super nice. There's still chance to fly them. I highly recommend it!

On take off from Hawthorne.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rt55N7bi_B0

-

flight from Taos to Carlsbad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoncTv80ToY

I got the same FA on the video shown above. She was super friendly and gave me several rounds of snacks.


Nice! I was just at Carlsbad taking pictures of the Taos Air arrival. I hope to fly them someday but I don’t see my self doing it in the near future.

https://www.instagram.com/p/B9X-lm6Bxty ... iz67rpgrcr
"I haven't been everywhere yet, but it's on my list."
 
LatinPlane
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Mar 07, 2020 7:01 am

wedgetail737 wrote:
How long was the connection time at Taos?


1-hour or so. It's a really small private air terminal, but adequate for the number of people on each flight. I just read that the state gave the city funds to build a real airport facility.
Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
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Frontier14
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Mar 07, 2020 5:41 pm

Glad to see that Taos Air has been successful so far. The DO-328 is a nice plane to fly in.

Frontier 14
 
SEU
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Re: Taos Air to Hawthorne Airport & Carlsbad Airport, CA

Sat Mar 07, 2020 10:52 pm

Everytime I read the title of this thread my dyslexia changes Hawthrone to Heathrow

Only one letter difference

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Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos