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LAXintl
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Bahamasair 737-500 fleet prohibited from U.S., no ADS-B

Fri Jan 03, 2020 11:04 pm

Three of Bahamasair’s largest planes have been blocked from entering the United States because they lack surveillance technology demanded by the Federal Aviation Administration.

The FAA in 2010 issued a rule requiring aircraft to be equipped with ADS-B avionics by January 1, 2020. The technology improves safety and efficiency in the air and on runways through its tracking capabilities.

Bahamasair says its been difficult to secure necessary kits for the company’s 737-500 planes, an older generation of Boeing jets, according to chairman Tommy Turnquest. The company signed a contract in June for a supplier to deliver three kits in September, October and November of last year but that supplier reneged on its responsibilities, he said yesterday. The airline has paid the company $200,000 of its $600,000 contract. The supplier indicated they are unable to provide the kits before March 2020 and that is not acceptable to us,” Mr Turnquest said. “Every effort will be made to recoup the money already paid.”

https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... for-ads-b/
http://www.tribune242.com/news/2020/jan ... raft/?news

=

Waiting to the last minute obviously creates risk. It's not like they were unaware of this mandate which has been on the books since 2010.
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MKE22
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Fri Jan 03, 2020 11:49 pm

LAXintl wrote:
Three of Bahamasair’s largest planes have been blocked from entering the United States because they lack surveillance technology demanded by the Federal Aviation Administration.

The FAA in 2010 issued a rule requiring aircraft to be equipped with ADS-B avionics by January 1, 2020. The technology improves safety and efficiency in the air and on runways through its tracking capabilities.

Bahamasair says its been difficult to secure necessary kits for the company’s 737-500 planes, an older generation of Boeing jets, according to chairman Tommy Turnquest. The company signed a contract in June for a supplier to deliver three kits in September, October and November of last year but that supplier reneged on its responsibilities, he said yesterday. The airline has paid the company $200,000 of its $600,000 contract. The supplier indicated they are unable to provide the kits before March 2020 and that is not acceptable to us,” Mr Turnquest said. “Every effort will be made to recoup the money already paid.”

https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... for-ads-b/
http://www.tribune242.com/news/2020/jan ... raft/?news

=

Waiting to the last minute obviously creates risk. It's not like they were unaware of this mandate which has been on the books since 2010.


Yikes.. Any chance that Bahamasair and the FAA work out a temporary agreement on this? I blame the airline of course, but it doesn't seem like the supplier is 100% free of blame either, since they are 5-7 months late on delivery per Turnquest.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Jan 04, 2020 12:03 am

This is a bummer. ADS-B is now the rule. As the OP post noted, the equipment was required in 2010, waiting until late 2019 wasn't wise. The low bid is usually a poor choice.

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Thunderbolt500
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Jan 04, 2020 12:05 am

Why do they need this?
 
travelhound
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Jan 04, 2020 12:08 am

The airline is flying a type of aircraft largely not supported by aftermarket providers. Considering they are only a small airline there were always going to be difficulties.

If the airline can obtain a temporary relaxation from the FAA that would be the best outcome for all parties.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Jan 04, 2020 12:20 am

Thunderbolt500 wrote:
Why do they need this?

ADS-B will allow narrowing of lateral seperation. This will open up slots in New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Miami, and other busy airspace. In particular as the airports will be able to more precisely stack incoming aircraft.

For search and rescue of downed aircraft, this is a game changer.

FAA reasons: https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/c ... /benefits/


What is unspoken, is in a hijacking, the F-16s will know their target with certainty. There could not be another 9/11 as if ADS-B off, there is the problem. If on, alerts to odd traffic.

As a small operator, a small waiver, say through June, is appropriate. But someone else makes the decision.

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nomorerjs
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 12:45 am

They had 10 years to prepare! I have no sympathy for them.
 
dstblj52
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:02 am

The problem is that if you give someone a waiver everyone is going to want a waiver, especially in general aviation where a lot of people are scrambling after pushing this off again and again.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:04 am

dstblj52,

You make a good point, if any waiver is given, the huge block of general aviation who held off for chesper ADS-B will demand a waiver and that defeats the purpose of the upgrade. It also prevents timely introduction of all future upgrades.

Not to mention the cost for timely implimentation will have airlines howl. DL has a few flyable MD-80s ready...

Late edit:I realized I proposed a waiver for most of the remaining DL MD-80 operating timeframe. A waiver opens a huge issue...
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zkojq
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:05 am

nomorerjs wrote:
They had 10 years to prepare! I have no sympathy for them.

:checkmark: Exactly. Whenever you put something off as long as you possibly can of course it will put on a lot of pressure if a supplier can't deliver.
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DiamondFlyer
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:14 am

Sensationalist post, as they could operate to the US, they would just have to be below 10,000 feet, and not operate in/above/below Class B and C airspace
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SuseJ772
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:22 am

DiamondFlyer wrote:
Sensationalist post, as they could operate to the US, they would just have to be below 10,000 feet, and not operate in/above/below Class B and C airspace


Sooooooooo... pretty much not fly to any airport they would want to. What class D airport would they want to fly to that wasn’t apart of Class B airspace?

Also, not to mention how inefficient flying a 735 at 10k or below would be.

This is very much not a sensationalist post. (Maybe I am missing your sarcasm)
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WN732
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:37 am

travelhound wrote:
The airline is flying a type of aircraft largely not supported by aftermarket providers. Considering they are only a small airline there were always going to be difficulties.

If the airline can obtain a temporary relaxation from the FAA that would be the best outcome for all parties.


There are still enough Classic 737's out there that would make it viable to have them retrofitted. There are still 732's out in Hawaii that are ADS-B compliant. WN had their -300's compliant years ago. There's no reason why Bahamas Air couldn't do the same.
 
DiamondFlyer
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:39 am

SuseJ772 wrote:
DiamondFlyer wrote:
Sensationalist post, as they could operate to the US, they would just have to be below 10,000 feet, and not operate in/above/below Class B and C airspace


Sooooooooo... pretty much not fly to any airport they would want to. What class D airport would they want to fly to that wasn’t apart of Class B airspace?

Also, not to mention how inefficient flying a 735 at 10k or below would be.

This is very much not a sensationalist post. (Maybe I am missing your sarcasm)


Quite simply, they're not banned. The title is factually wrong. Just in Florida, they could fly to MLB. There are dozens of airports in the US that have air carrier service that aren't in class B/C airspace.
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usxguy
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 4:02 am

Yeah, this is on UP. Even little Air North, based in Canada's Yukon, has 4 737-500s and a 737-400 with ADS-B....
xx
 
rbavfan
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Jan 04, 2020 4:17 am

travelhound wrote:
The airline is flying a type of aircraft largely not supported by aftermarket providers. Considering they are only a small airline there were always going to be difficulties.

If the airline can obtain a temporary relaxation from the FAA that would be the best outcome for all parties.


It would use the same on as the all the other 737's. So there should be plenty of supply.
 
smartplane
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 4:27 am

DiamondFlyer wrote:
SuseJ772 wrote:
DiamondFlyer wrote:
Sensationalist post, as they could operate to the US, they would just have to be below 10,000 feet, and not operate in/above/below Class B and C airspace


Sooooooooo... pretty much not fly to any airport they would want to. What class D airport would they want to fly to that wasn’t apart of Class B airspace?

Also, not to mention how inefficient flying a 735 at 10k or below would be.

This is very much not a sensationalist post. (Maybe I am missing your sarcasm)


Quite simply, they're not banned. The title is factually wrong. Just in Florida, they could fly to MLB. There are dozens of airports in the US that have air carrier service that aren't in class B/C airspace.

They will also get another little reminder in the form of increased insurance premiums from 1 Jan, irrespective of where the fleet operates.

Most insurers (and financiers too) have identified outstanding AD's and other non-compliance as risk factors to be actively managed in premiums, with some lobbying by airworthiness authorities and IATA.
 
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 4:36 am

They have a 737-700 and ATRs that are ADS-B compliant at the moment. Maybe this would be an incentive to replace the 735s with more 73Gs?
 
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zkojq
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 4:55 am

DiamondFlyer wrote:
SuseJ772 wrote:
DiamondFlyer wrote:
Sensationalist post, as they could operate to the US, they would just have to be below 10,000 feet, and not operate in/above/below Class B and C airspace


Sooooooooo... pretty much not fly to any airport they would want to. What class D airport would they want to fly to that wasn’t apart of Class B airspace?

Also, not to mention how inefficient flying a 735 at 10k or below would be.

This is very much not a sensationalist post. (Maybe I am missing your sarcasm)


Quite simply, they're not banned. The title is factually wrong. Just in Florida, they could fly to MLB. There are dozens of airports in the US that have air carrier service that aren't in class B/C airspace.


Do they fly to MLB? How many of their US destinations are they able to operate to with their non-compliant aircraft.
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 5:14 am

DohwanKim747 wrote:
They have a 737-700 and ATRs that are ADS-B compliant at the moment. Maybe this would be an incentive to replace the 735s with more 73Gs?


I bet any 737NG are hard to get while the MAX is grounded globally. The 737-500 isn't a bad aircraft to fly if you don't need the capacity of a 737-700. They are lighter than the NG.
 
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par13del
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 5:28 am

What is interesting is that UP did not get the 737-500 with the equipment installed. However, from the article, they probably went lowest bidder. The ATR's were updated in time, but not the jets, issue now is how much it will cost.

"“This first came up in 2010 but very few aircraft took advantage because within ten years you’re not sure what your fleet would be. In 2018 efforts began to outfit these various aircraft. When Bahamasair purchased five ATRs back in 2016 navigational kits were not put in place but were accessed over the past two years.”"
 
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Jan 04, 2020 5:58 am

Thunderbolt500 wrote:
Why do they need this?

Because it's the law.
 
alpine1989
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Jan 04, 2020 6:06 am

WN732 wrote:
travelhound wrote:
The airline is flying a type of aircraft largely not supported by aftermarket providers. Considering they are only a small airline there were always going to be difficulties.

If the airline can obtain a temporary relaxation from the FAA that would be the best outcome for all parties.


There are still enough Classic 737's out there that would make it viable to have them retrofitted. There are still 732's out in Hawaii that are ADS-B compliant. WN had their -300's compliant years ago. There's no reason why Bahamas Air couldn't do the same.


I don’t believe Southwest had ADS-B out on the -300s. They just completed the -700 upgrades in late December.
 
luv2cattlecall
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 6:29 am

What makes the kits cost $200,000 per aircraft?
 
n797mx
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 6:29 am

zkojq wrote:
Do they fly to MLB? How many of their US destinations are they able to operate to with their non-compliant aircraft.


Zero. While you CAN get relief from ADS-B (i.e. transmitter on MEL), the relief doesn't allow you to fly over the oceans at all. Especially repeat commercial flights.

From the FAA guidance:
"In addition, the rule requires that aircraft meet ADS–B Out performance requirements to operate in Class E airspace over the Gulf of Mexico at and above 3,000 feet MSL within 12 NM of the coastline of the United States."
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 7:50 am

luv2cattlecall wrote:
What makes the kits cost $200,000 per aircraft?


If the airline can't pay the $200,000 for a long term part. Why would you fly them?
 
devron
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 8:17 am

Their 737 700 seems to have to do a lot of flying with short turn arround times. I do not see the 500 used on flight radar is this affecting a lot of passengers?
 
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 9:15 am

rbavfan wrote:
luv2cattlecall wrote:
What makes the kits cost $200,000 per aircraft?


If the airline can't pay the $200,000 for a long term part. Why would you fly them?


There could be quite a few airlines with non compliant aircraft. We just haven’t heard about it yet.

I suspect this could be a supplier base issue. With airlines like south west scrambling to modify all of their aircraft, some of the smaller airlines could have been squeezed out.
 
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bgm
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 9:17 am

DiamondFlyer wrote:
Sensationalist post, as they could operate to the US, they would just have to be below 10,000 feet, and not operate in/above/below Class B and C airspace


Tell us which airports they fly to which aren't Class Bravo or Charlie? Not to mention flying a 737 below 10k feet is hardly practical.
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32andBelow
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 12:15 pm

LAXintl wrote:
Three of Bahamasair’s largest planes have been blocked from entering the United States because they lack surveillance technology demanded by the Federal Aviation Administration.

The FAA in 2010 issued a rule requiring aircraft to be equipped with ADS-B avionics by January 1, 2020. The technology improves safety and efficiency in the air and on runways through its tracking capabilities.

Bahamasair says its been difficult to secure necessary kits for the company’s 737-500 planes, an older generation of Boeing jets, according to chairman Tommy Turnquest. The company signed a contract in June for a supplier to deliver three kits in September, October and November of last year but that supplier reneged on its responsibilities, he said yesterday. The airline has paid the company $200,000 of its $600,000 contract. The supplier indicated they are unable to provide the kits before March 2020 and that is not acceptable to us,” Mr Turnquest said. “Every effort will be made to recoup the money already paid.”

https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... for-ads-b/
http://www.tribune242.com/news/2020/jan ... raft/?news

=

Waiting to the last minute obviously creates risk. It's not like they were unaware of this mandate which has been on the books since 2010.

An airline in Alaska already has a temporary exception.
 
32andBelow
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Jan 04, 2020 12:18 pm

lightsaber wrote:
Thunderbolt500 wrote:
Why do they need this?

ADS-B will allow narrowing of lateral seperation. This will open up slots in New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Miami, and other busy airspace. In particular as the airports will be able to more precisely stack incoming aircraft.

For search and rescue of downed aircraft, this is a game changer.

FAA reasons: https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/c ... /benefits/


What is unspoken, is in a hijacking, the F-16s will know their target with certainty. There could not be another 9/11 as if ADS-B off, there is the problem. If on, alerts to odd traffic.

As a small operator, a small waiver, say through June, is appropriate. But someone else makes the decision.

Lightsaber

ADS-B has the exact same separation requirements as current radar system and is used in conjunction with radar. The controller has idea if the target they are working is hitting ADSB or radar unless they look it up with an entry.
 
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gdg9
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:43 pm

LAXintl wrote:
Waiting to the last minute obviously creates risk. It's not like they were unaware of this mandate which has been on the books since 2010.


Not unlike the several U.S. states that waited until the last minute, asked for extensions, etc for Real ID requirements.
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Weatherwatcher1
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Jan 04, 2020 1:47 pm

WN732 wrote:
travelhound wrote:
The airline is flying a type of aircraft largely not supported by aftermarket providers. Considering they are only a small airline there were always going to be difficulties.

If the airline can obtain a temporary relaxation from the FAA that would be the best outcome for all parties.


There are still enough Classic 737's out there that would make it viable to have them retrofitted. There are still 732's out in Hawaii that are ADS-B compliant. WN had their -300's compliant years ago. There's no reason why Bahamas Air couldn't do the same.


There are also many 737 Classic Freighters in operation as well.
 
mjoelnir
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Jan 04, 2020 2:45 pm

32andBelow wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
Thunderbolt500 wrote:
Why do they need this?

ADS-B will allow narrowing of lateral seperation. This will open up slots in New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Miami, and other busy airspace. In particular as the airports will be able to more precisely stack incoming aircraft.

For search and rescue of downed aircraft, this is a game changer.

FAA reasons: https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/c ... /benefits/


What is unspoken, is in a hijacking, the F-16s will know their target with certainty. There could not be another 9/11 as if ADS-B off, there is the problem. If on, alerts to odd traffic.

As a small operator, a small waiver, say through June, is appropriate. But someone else makes the decision.

Lightsaber

ADS-B has the exact same separation requirements as current radar system and is used in conjunction with radar. The controller has idea if the target they are working is hitting ADSB or radar unless they look it up with an entry.


As it is.

But ADS-B is the prerequisite for applying planed changes and changes can hardly be done when you still have frames flying around without ADS-B.
 
AeroplaneFreak
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:28 pm

WN732 wrote:
There are still enough Classic 737's out there that would make it viable to have them retrofitted. There are still 732's out in Hawaii that are ADS-B compliant. WN had their -300's compliant years ago. There's no reason why Bahamas Air couldn't do the same.


travelhound wrote:
The airline is flying a type of aircraft largely not supported by aftermarket providers. Considering they are only a small airline there were always going to be difficulties.

If the airline can obtain a temporary relaxation from the FAA that would be the best outcome for all parties.


Here in Australia ADS-B was mandated for all aircraft above 10,000ft in 2016 but even most heritage aircraft got retrofitted. The HARS Super Constellation has ADS-B fitted as does most of the DC-3 fleet here in Australia along with thousands of 40+ year old GA aircraft.

There is simply no excuse for an airline to not have ADS-B fitted in 2020.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:47 pm

mjoelnir wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
ADS-B will allow narrowing of lateral seperation. This will open up slots in New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Miami, and other busy airspace. In particular as the airports will be able to more precisely stack incoming aircraft.

For search and rescue of downed aircraft, this is a game changer.

FAA reasons: https://www.faa.gov/nextgen/equipadsb/c ... /benefits/


What is unspoken, is in a hijacking, the F-16s will know their target with certainty. There could not be another 9/11 as if ADS-B off, there is the problem. If on, alerts to odd traffic.

As a small operator, a small waiver, say through June, is appropriate. But someone else makes the decision.

Lightsaber

ADS-B has the exact same separation requirements as current radar system and is used in conjunction with radar. The controller has idea if the target they are working is hitting ADSB or radar unless they look it up with an entry.


As it is.

But ADS-B is the prerequisite for applying planed changes and changes can hardly be done when you still have frames flying around without ADS-B.

Agreed. ADS-B is an enabling technology. It only works if every aircraft in controlled commercial airspace has the technology.

If there wasn't an advantage, the airlines would have pushed back on the implimentation.

It is a shame this small airline didn't plan ahead The more I find out about ADS-B, the bigger the deal a waiver seems.

Is there any update from the vendor?

Lightsaber
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Jan 04, 2020 3:50 pm

usxguy wrote:
Yeah, this is on UP. Even little Air North, based in Canada's Yukon, has 4 737-500s and a 737-400 with ADS-B....

Interesting. Do you know when they implimented?

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OB1504
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet prohibited from U.S., no ADS-B

Sun Jan 05, 2020 2:02 am

This explains why Bahamasair’s equipment on their NAS-MIA route abruptly changed to a mix of ATRs and the lone 737-700.

I hated not being able to track the 737-500s on apps like Flightradar24.
 
Lukas757
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sun Jan 05, 2020 2:34 am

devron wrote:
Their 737 700 seems to have to do a lot of flying with short turn arround times. I do not see the 500 used on flight radar is this affecting a lot of passengers?


You do not see the -500 on FlightRadar because FR uses ADS-B data.
 
devron
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sun Jan 05, 2020 12:04 pm

Lukas757 wrote:
devron wrote:
Their 737 700 seems to have to do a lot of flying with short turn arround times. I do not see the 500 used on flight radar is this affecting a lot of passengers?


You do not see the -500 on FlightRadar because FR uses ADS-B data.


I looked at departures / arrivals in Nassau /Freeport :-)
 
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airkas1
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet prohibited from U.S., no ADS-B

Sun Jan 05, 2020 1:05 pm

Meh, I was looking forward to flying their -500's next week. Hopefully the schedule disruptions/delays will have flattened out by then.
 
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par13del
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sun Jan 05, 2020 1:52 pm

lightsaber wrote:
It is a shame this small airline didn't plan ahead The more I find out about ADS-B, the bigger the deal a waiver seems.
Lightsaber

...they did they just went with a low ball vendor who is now saying they can get them by Mar-2020 which the airline is saying is unacceptable, I expect court action since it is most likely a US based vendor.
lightsaber wrote:
Is there any update from the vendor?
Lightsaber

They may have already found a new vendor, no details as yet, I assume the jet that is going to Costa Rica will get updated there during the checks, in the interim, US flights with the sole 700 and the ATR's which were all updated AFTER they were purchased.
Might be a good time for them to look at some prices on a couple MAX jet's, Cayman got a couple so it is not outside the capabilities of the Bahamian government, however, with the effects of Dorian still being addressed, the airports in Grand Bahama and Abaco will probably get priority in all things aviation, in addition they have started work on airports in Eleuthera, Exuma and Long Island.
 
OB1504
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet prohibited from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Feb 01, 2020 8:22 pm

737-500 C6-BFC flew into MIA today. Did Bahamasair get an exception or did they finally install ADS-B?
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:44 am

Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Feb 01, 2020 8:35 pm

luv2cattlecall wrote:
What makes the kits cost $200,000 per aircraft?


Especially when a Part 23 plane can be compliant for about 2,500 bucks!
 
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2nd2none
Posts: 68
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Feb 01, 2020 9:01 pm

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
luv2cattlecall wrote:
What makes the kits cost $200,000 per aircraft?


Especially when a Part 23 plane can be compliant for about 2,500 bucks!


Kickbacks?
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:44 am

Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet prohibited from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Feb 01, 2020 9:16 pm

No, huge barriers by regulators
 
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spinkid
Posts: 1893
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2001 5:59 am

Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S.

Sat Feb 01, 2020 9:58 pm

Dated Jan. 13. This article helps explain the issue more fully.

Apparently they thought they had a Waiver until 2024, but didn't realize they would have to make a special request each DAY to operate flights with any of those planes. Apparently they found another supplier who could get them fixed by Jan. 31st.

“After Fokker didn’t fulfil its obligation, we got a waiver from the FAA, which allows us to fly the planes into the US until 2024. The problem was it requires us to request special permission each and every time we are about to fly that plane into the United States.

“We thought that that was too restrictive"

While he did not disclose who the airline’s new supplier is, Mr Turnquest said the company has already completed engineering for the navigational kits.

“They are going to provide it for us this week and we’ve made provisions starting on Monday of next week to put the first one in. We will finish that one by Friday (January) the 24 and then we’ll start the second one, which we’ll finish by the 31st of January.”

The third kit will be put in at a facility where the third jet is undergoing heavy maintenance. This process will take about 70 days, Mr Turnquest said."

Full link here

http://www.tribune242.com/news/2020/jan ... ry-flying/
 
N766UA
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Joined: Thu Jul 29, 1999 3:50 am

Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet prohibited from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:19 pm

Cape Air’s C402’s all have ADS-B. “Our 737’s are too old to find a kit” is total BS.
 
rojo
Posts: 2308
Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2000 6:08 am

Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet prohibited from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:29 pm

I saw an UP 735 land in FLL on Wednesday which got me thinking... after reading the last post, now I understand why.
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: Bahamasair 737-500 fleet banned from U.S., no ADS-B

Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:34 pm

flyingclrs727 wrote:
DohwanKim747 wrote:
They have a 737-700 and ATRs that are ADS-B compliant at the moment. Maybe this would be an incentive to replace the 735s with more 73Gs?


I bet any 737NG are hard to get while the MAX is grounded globally. The 737-500 isn't a bad aircraft to fly if you don't need the capacity of a 737-700. They are lighter than the NG.


The 73G shouldn’t be too hard if WN hasn’t snapped up all good frames. It would be the 73H whose prices have increased, while the 73J is mostly with operators wanting them for 25-30 years. That said, Bahamasair waited too long. I suspect even N5 has compliant B732s

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