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usdcaguy
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Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 8:49 pm

Interesting article. I really hope we don't see Southwest become a carrier like the rest. I fly them more now expressly because I hate basic economy, especially UA, who charges those passengers extra for bringing a standard rollaboard on their flight.

https://www.inc.com/chris-matyszczyk/so ... ngers.html
 
Rossiya747
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 8:59 pm

That will ruin their reputation.
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TTailedTiger
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 9:10 pm

If they reduced basic economy to just one checked bag they'd still be better than full fare on the legacy airlines and the others.
 
gen2stew
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 9:15 pm

A) If you find basic economy so abhorrent dont book it.
B) WN has quite a few city pairs where business pax bring nothing but a computer bag because they do a round trip the same day. If you dont need to bring 2 50lb bags,why pay for it?
C) WN has maybe 5 "good" seats on the -700. The rest are all the same.

Much ado about nothing.
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PhilMcCrackin
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 9:17 pm

I started flying WN because they *didn't* pull the Basic Economy shenanigans. I'll have no reason to fly them over AA or UA if they choose to go down this path.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 9:21 pm

A Flyertalk thread on a survey is pretty thin as evidence goes. The whole Inc./Matyszczyk shtick is to find something to complain about, as if no other possibilities can exist.

That said, non-refundable/non-changeable tickets, 1 checked bag, and boarding group C at a discount of 20% would work for some people and give WN a fare product to compete against F9/NK/Allegiant and the Basic Economy fares of AA/DL/UA.
 
Cubsrule
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 9:51 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
A Flyertalk thread on a survey is pretty thin as evidence goes. The whole Inc./Matyszczyk shtick is to find something to complain about, as if no other possibilities can exist.


The article is total clickbait and also only tells part of story. There’s also a survey out about significant changes to status tiers that suggests some added perks that seem unlikely including priority baggage handling and priority boarding numbers for companions.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
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usdcaguy
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 9:59 pm

gen2stew wrote:
A) If you find basic economy so abhorrent dont book it.
B) WN has quite a few city pairs where business pax bring nothing but a computer bag because they do a round trip the same day. If you dont need to bring 2 50lb bags,why pay for it?
C) WN has maybe 5 "good" seats on the -700. The rest are all the same.

Much ado about nothing.


I have no intention of paying more than the lowest available fare, and now that fare no longer has seat assignments, checked bags or changes available. The airlines are not trying to give passengers a discount; they’re trying to take away something they already had in the past. The reason I fly Southwest is that I no longer get checked bags and seat assignments for free on the other majors. I’d have to think twice if they did start filing more restrictive fares.
 
Jshank83
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 10:00 pm

Southwest already basically is what basic economy is for AA/DL. You don’t get to pick your seat ahead of time. Those 2 you still get an overhead bag. So Besides eliminating 2 free bags (which they keep saying they won’t do) I’m not really sure what else they could do to make it lower than the already want to get away fare. I guess adding change fees?

I like Southwest for the most part but their onboard product is what basic economy is on other airlines (beside UA). If you buy early bird then it’s what economy is on other airlines because that pretty much guarantees you the type of seat you want.
 
ncflyer
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 10:08 pm

I disagree strongly that WN's onboard product is basic economy on the other airlines. Unless I'm really boarding at the end of the line on WN (which I can control by checking in 24 hours on the nose ahead of time), I can choose who I sit next to on WN. I have zippo control over anything on other airlines with basic economy. Ironically I find my best strategy on AA and DL is to not check in until I get to the airport, because by then it is sometimes the case that the only seats available are the seats at the front of economy, which I prefer.

And by the way, for regular economy, what's with the baloney that there's now commonly a charge for non-extra-leg-room-seats at the front of coach, that is the ultimate insult. WN doesn't do that, when I board late, I take the first middle seat I find and usually can get very close to the front.
 
dbo861
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 10:26 pm

I wouldn't be terribly upset if they added a basic economy, as long as they kept Wanna Get Away fare class. They could add a discount fare class getting rid of no change fees and free checked bags, and maybe add a D boarding group for this basic economy. My fear is if they added the basic economy, it'll replace Wanna Get Away. I also almost exclusively fly Southwest for my personal travel, not because I particularly enjoy flying on Southwest, but because of the no change fees and I'll pay for Early Bird boarding.
 
alggag
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 10:34 pm

There have been surveys suggesting a basic economy is at least under consideration. Given their insistence that they will never charge for bags I would assume that it would probably be something like one bag and boarding group D sort of deal.
 
jplatts
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 10:38 pm

Most of WN's nonstop routes to major leisure destinations in the contiguous U.S. such as DEN, FLL, RSW, LAS, MCO, and TPA have some of the highest load factors in WN's network. There is no need for WN to introduce basic economy fares as WN is still able to fill most of the nonstop flights to major leisure destinations in the U.S. without having to introduce basic economy fares.

Most of the WN domestic nonstop routes that have lower load factors also currently do not have nonstop competition on any ULCC's.

There are also some routes where WN Wanna Get Away fares with less restrictions are similarly priced to more restrictive AA, DL, or UA basic economy fares. Three big differences between WN and US3 carriers on routes where WN Wanna Get Away fares are similar in price to US3 basic economy fares include:
(a) changes are allowed on WN Wanna Get Away fares without having to pay change fees, whereas US3 basic economy fares do not allow itinerary changes,
(b) those traveling on US3 basic economy fares are normally in the last boarding group whereas passengers traveling on WN Wanna Get Away fares are assigned the next available boarding position (which might be in the A, B, or C group depending on time of check-in), and
(c) there are no fees for carry-on baggage or the 1st or 2nd checked bags on WN Wanna Get Away fares whereas US3 carriers normally charge fees for checked baggage on basic economy fares and regular economy fares.
 
Gulfstream500
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 10:43 pm

Honestly, wanna getaway on WN is basically basic economy (no pun intended)... you’re last to board, don’t have a seat assignment, and will likely be separated from the other members of your party. Currently, the only difference between basic economy on the legacies and WN is the baggage fees.

In short, if they want to make basic economy, they should just charge for bags.
So... when will the Northwest DC-9s be retired?
 
Jshank83
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 10:44 pm

jplatts wrote:
Most of WN's nonstop routes to major leisure destinations in the contiguous U.S. such as DEN, FLL, RSW, LAS, MCO, and TPA have some of the highest load factors in WN's network. There is no need for WN to introduce basic economy fares as WN is still able to fill most of the nonstop flights to major leisure destinations in the U.S. without having to introduce basic economy fares.
.


The added fare class would have nothing to do with filling more flights. It would be to make more money. If you already have a full flight but add another far class higher than the lowest price you are going to add more revenue for each person that buys up. Same reason they added early bird. It wasn’t to make more money reguardless of how full it is.
 
Cointrin330
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 10:45 pm

Because flying Southwest can't get any worse?
 
rising
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 10:48 pm

The onboard offering is pretty close to Basic Economy. But the fare conditions are not even close. 2 free bags, no change fees, can still cancel and retain a fare credit with Wanna Get Away....that's not Basic Economy.

But the onboard offering... sure you get typically a pleasant group of singing FAs, but still there is no in-seat power, the only food is a bag of pretzels. Not sure what the frills are that someone would think it is more than Basic Econ. You get live TV on AA/UA too in BE.

Sure, we on this forum value things like seat selection and other goodies so maybe we think everyone else does too. But a lot of people could simply care less and just want to get to where they are going for the least expensive fare.

So why make LUV shareholders and customers continue to pay for things that some other customers are not?
If it doesn't make sense, it's probably not true.
 
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OzarkD9S
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 10:50 pm

TTailedTiger wrote:

If they reduced basic economy to just one checked bag they'd still be better than full fare on the legacy airlines and the others.


My thoughts exactly. Plus a guaranteed C group boarding and maybe a 25% reduction in RR points. They could do a WN style Basic and still be ahead of the rest.
"True, I talk of dreams,
Which are the children of an idle brain." -Mercutio
 
smokeybandit
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 10:54 pm

So the whole article is based on a feeler survey that went out.

Seems a whole lot of nothing
 
remymartin11
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 10:58 pm

They should add two rows of Business Class, 2x2, 8 seats
Total like Spirit does. I refuse to fly Southwest because 3x3. With their Business Select fares and demand this seems like no brainer. Race to the top instead of the bottom.
 
questions
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 11:03 pm

Southwest needs to figure out what it wants to be. Right now it’s a mess, living off the cherished legacy of its past and founder. They have experienced a lot of growth over the last 20 years but are wallowing with where to take it now.
 
arfbool
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 11:04 pm

If they’re serious about basic economy and competing straight away on price then it’s about time they start listing on the meta fare search engines.
 
CriticalPoint
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 11:09 pm

PhilMcCrackin wrote:
I started flying WN because they *didn't* pull the Basic Economy shenanigans. I'll have no reason to fly them over AA or UA if they choose to go down this path.


How is it shenanigans? If you don’t want basic economy don’t book it? What am I missing here?
 
DualQual
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 11:14 pm

CriticalPoint wrote:
PhilMcCrackin wrote:
I started flying WN because they *didn't* pull the Basic Economy shenanigans. I'll have no reason to fly them over AA or UA if they choose to go down this path.


How is it shenanigans? If you don’t want basic economy don’t book it? What am I missing here?


Absolutely nothing.
There's no known cure for stupid
 
toltommy
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Sun Jan 05, 2020 11:50 pm

usdcaguy wrote:
I have no intention of paying more than the lowest available fare, and now that fare no longer has seat assignments, checked bags or changes available. The airlines are not trying to give passengers a discount; they’re trying to take away something they already had in the past. The reason I fly Southwest is that I no longer get checked bags and seat assignments for free on the other majors. I’d have to think twice if they did start filing more restrictive fares.


1. You do realize that when factored for inflation, on average air travel is cheaper than it was 20 years ago? And that includes bag fees? (source: DOT fare survey) So while the airlines may have removed a perk from the past, it was a perk that the average airfare no longer supported.
2. Do you always check 2 bags on every WN flight you take? If not, you are paying for something you don't use.
3. You still don't get a seat assignment on WN, so thats a wash at best.

Hey vote with your wallet, do what you want. But I bet that in many cases, you are buying products on your WN flight that you don't even use.
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usflyguy
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 12:51 am

Gulfstream500 wrote:
Honestly, wanna getaway on WN is basically basic economy (no pun intended)... you’re last to board, don’t have a seat assignment, and will likely be separated from the other members of your party. Currently, the only difference between basic economy on the legacies and WN is the baggage fees.

In short, if they want to make basic economy, they should just charge for bags.


So, honestly, you don’t know much about Southwest and their fare products? Wanna Get Away fares do not mean you board last, boarding is based on when you check in online, beginning 24 hours prior to departure. Passengers that book Anytime fares and Wanna Get Away fares check in at 24 hours prior to departure and they are assigned a boarding position at that time. A-list and A-list preferred passengers are checked in 36 hours prior to flight along with those that purchased “Early Bird”... “Early Bird” passengers may be on either Anytime or Wanna Get Away fares.
My post is my ideas and my opinions only, I do not represent the ideas or opinions of anyone else or company.
 
usflyguy
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 12:52 am

questions wrote:
Southwest needs to figure out what it wants to be. Right now it’s a mess, living off the cherished legacy of its past and founder. They have experienced a lot of growth over the last 20 years but are wallowing with where to take it now.


Please define “right now it’s a mess” and “are wallowing with where to take it now.” What’s changed from boarding based upon when you checked in and open seating? How is WN wallowing?
My post is my ideas and my opinions only, I do not represent the ideas or opinions of anyone else or company.
 
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EA CO AS
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 1:05 am

So, usflyguy, can you help me understand why I routinely get either the very end of the B or beginning of the C group whenever I check in right at the 24 hour mark on my purchased WN tickets?
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
Cubsrule
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 1:13 am

EA CO AS wrote:
So, usflyguy, can you help me understand why I routinely get either the very end of the B or beginning of the C group whenever I check in right at the 24 hour mark on my purchased WN tickets?


Depends on the route. Sometimes there are 80 status passengers and that plus Early Bird will do it comfortably.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 1:18 am

EA CO AS wrote:
So, usflyguy, can you help me understand why I routinely get either the very end of the B or beginning of the C group whenever I check in right at the 24 hour mark on my purchased WN tickets?


At the 24-hr mark (within seconds, not an hour later) I routinely get something between A45 and B30. I can live with that. I will set my Google calendar appointment to 1 minute before 24 hours and check in from a smart phone rather than paying for Early Bird. Discipline.
 
SEAflyer97
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 1:28 am

MIflyer12 wrote:
A Flyertalk thread on a survey is pretty thin as evidence goes. The whole Inc./Matyszczyk shtick is to find something to complain about, as if no other possibilities can exist.

That said, non-refundable/non-changeable tickets, 1 checked bag, and boarding group C at a discount of 20% would work for some people and give WN a fare product to compete against F9/NK/Allegiant and the Basic Economy fares of AA/DL/UA.


More likely there won't be a discount. Instead, a 20% increase in the current fares(for regular economy).
 
OB1504
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 1:37 am

Cubsrule wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:
So, usflyguy, can you help me understand why I routinely get either the very end of the B or beginning of the C group whenever I check in right at the 24 hour mark on my purchased WN tickets?


Depends on the route. Sometimes there are 80 status passengers and that plus Early Bird will do it comfortably.


Plus WN holds back some A boarding positions to upsell later.

Another explanation is passengers connecting to the flight taking the earlier boarding positions since they can effectively check in earlier than 24 hours before departure.
 
Gulfstream500
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 1:44 am

usflyguy wrote:
Gulfstream500 wrote:
Honestly, wanna getaway on WN is basically basic economy (no pun intended)... you’re last to board, don’t have a seat assignment, and will likely be separated from the other members of your party. Currently, the only difference between basic economy on the legacies and WN is the baggage fees.

In short, if they want to make basic economy, they should just charge for bags.


So, honestly, you don’t know much about Southwest and their fare products? Wanna Get Away fares do not mean you board last, boarding is based on when you check in online, beginning 24 hours prior to departure. Passengers that book Anytime fares and Wanna Get Away fares check in at 24 hours prior to departure and they are assigned a boarding position at that time. A-list and A-list preferred passengers are checked in 36 hours prior to flight along with those that purchased “Early Bird”... “Early Bird” passengers may be on either Anytime or Wanna Get Away fares.


So, honestly, you did not read my post. I never said that you are going to 100% be the last person to board, just that there's a decent chance that you will board in the last group (Key word: no seat assignment). So be it if there are only two sections separated by fare. But hey, if bashing every poster who does not agree with your ideology makes you happy...
So... when will the Northwest DC-9s be retired?
 
lat41
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 2:12 am

Gulfstream500 wrote:
Honestly, wanna getaway on WN is basically basic economy (no pun intended)... you’re last to board, don’t have a seat assignment, and will likely be separated from the other members of your party. Currently, the only difference between basic economy on the legacies and WN is the baggage fees.

In short, if they want to make basic economy, they should just charge for bags.

I book Wanna Get Away almost all the time. 24 hours on the dot I check in on my computer or tablet and get at least a high # A or low B boarding number. I am never last to board, nor do I get split up from my party. Don't even need Early Bird. Being a little saavy helps.
Last edited by lat41 on Mon Jan 06, 2020 2:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
Jshank83
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 2:13 am

OB1504 wrote:
Cubsrule wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:
So, usflyguy, can you help me understand why I routinely get either the very end of the B or beginning of the C group whenever I check in right at the 24 hour mark on my purchased WN tickets?


Depends on the route. Sometimes there are 80 status passengers and that plus Early Bird will do it comfortably.


Plus WN holds back some A boarding positions to upsell later.

Another explanation is passengers connecting to the flight taking the earlier boarding positions since they can effectively check in earlier than 24 hours before departure.


To add to this, If you fly out of a WN “hub” you probably are going to be down the line a lot further than spokes. Being in STL, I rarely get A anymore unless the plane isn’t that full. All the connectors check in before me and there are a fair amount of people with status at larger stations. I check in right at 24 hours before and on a full flight I’m usually B20-40 range.
 
arfbool
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 2:29 am

Addressing some earlier comments about Southwest check-in, if your itinerary originates with a flight that gets significant feed from other sources, you will have been pre-empted by everyone who checked in on time for their first segment plus all the early birds and A listers. For example, if you are flying DEN-BOS, anyone who is connecting on to that DEN flight may be ahead of you by several hours because they checkin in for all their segments at the 24 hour mark of the first segment. (afaik)
 
airzona11
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 3:34 am

1 less checked bag and most restricted changes seems pretty easy to do, they will be thoughtful, they’ve waited it out this long. I really hope WN doesn’t touch the flexibility of their fares and flights.
 
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flyingclrs727
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 4:07 am

toltommy wrote:
usdcaguy wrote:
I have no intention of paying more than the lowest available fare, and now that fare no longer has seat assignments, checked bags or changes available. The airlines are not trying to give passengers a discount; they’re trying to take away something they already had in the past. The reason I fly Southwest is that I no longer get checked bags and seat assignments for free on the other majors. I’d have to think twice if they did start filing more restrictive fares.


1. You do realize that when factored for inflation, on average air travel is cheaper than it was 20 years ago? And that includes bag fees? (source: DOT fare survey) So while the airlines may have removed a perk from the past, it was a perk that the average airfare no longer supported.
2. Do you always check 2 bags on every WN flight you take? If not, you are paying for something you don't use.
3. You still don't get a seat assignment on WN, so thats a wash at best.

Hey vote with your wallet, do what you want. But I bet that in many cases, you are buying products on your WN flight that you don't even use.


Actually I do check as many bags as qualify. If I only have one 50 pound bag, I normally check my roll aboard. That way I don't have to lug a bunch of carry-on luggage through the airport. It's especially convenient if I am going to have connections.
 
freakyrat
Posts: 1959
Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:04 pm

Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 4:12 am

gen2stew wrote:
A) If you find basic economy so abhorrent dont book it.
B) WN has quite a few city pairs where business pax bring nothing but a computer bag because they do a round trip the same day. If you dont need to bring 2 50lb bags,why pay for it?
C) WN has maybe 5 "good" seats on the -700. The rest are all the same.

Much ado about nothing.


(B) HOU-DAL. Both cities exchange lawyers on Monday. Serious.
 
l87e
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Joined: Fri Sep 15, 2017 4:21 am

Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 4:22 am

Does anyone have an estimate for how much it would cost (setup+ongoing) to appear with prices in the/those databases search engines use?

I hope they go for opportunities to sell to more people before trying to change any big part of their appeal (Bags fly free, Fees don’t fly).
Try changing the sales model before bigger things?
 
AWACSooner
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Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:35 am

Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:44 am

gen2stew wrote:
A) If you find basic economy so abhorrent dont book it.
l

Except Basic Economy was nothing but a SCAM by the airlines to increase their fares! You are paying the same fare for less!
WN ever pulls this, and they’ve lost the last delineator between them and the rest of the pack.
 
sprxUSA
Posts: 397
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:52 am

Wasn't this survey done months ago and yakked about then?
Gem State Airlines..."we have a gem of an airline"
 
AWACSooner
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:54 am

SEAflyer97 wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
A Flyertalk thread on a survey is pretty thin as evidence goes. The whole Inc./Matyszczyk shtick is to find something to complain about, as if no other possibilities can exist.

That said, non-refundable/non-changeable tickets, 1 checked bag, and boarding group C at a discount of 20% would work for some people and give WN a fare product to compete against F9/NK/Allegiant and the Basic Economy fares of AA/DL/UA.


More likely there won't be a discount. Instead, a 20% increase in the current fares(for regular economy).

BINGO! And that is the SCAM they’re selling the public with E-...
 
CriticalPoint
Posts: 1038
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2017 5:01 pm

Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 7:12 am

AWACSooner wrote:
SEAflyer97 wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
A Flyertalk thread on a survey is pretty thin as evidence goes. The whole Inc./Matyszczyk shtick is to find something to complain about, as if no other possibilities can exist.

That said, non-refundable/non-changeable tickets, 1 checked bag, and boarding group C at a discount of 20% would work for some people and give WN a fare product to compete against F9/NK/Allegiant and the Basic Economy fares of AA/DL/UA.


More likely there won't be a discount. Instead, a 20% increase in the current fares(for regular economy).

BINGO! And that is the SCAM they’re selling the public with E-...


So it’s a scam for airlines to raise fares?
 
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EA CO AS
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 7:47 am

WN won't mess with the free bags in a Basic Economy scenario; they'd just make the "Wanna Get Away" fares the new BE fare, then price the new "Wanna Get Away" fares around $10-30 higher each way. The difference is, the BE fares would be valid for that flight, that day only, and no changes would be allowed.
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usdcaguy
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 8:15 am

toltommy wrote:
usdcaguy wrote:
I have no intention of paying more than the lowest available fare, and now that fare no longer has seat assignments, checked bags or changes available. The airlines are not trying to give passengers a discount; they’re trying to take away something they already had in the past. The reason I fly Southwest is that I no longer get checked bags and seat assignments for free on the other majors. I’d have to think twice if they did start filing more restrictive fares.


1. You do realize that when factored for inflation, on average air travel is cheaper than it was 20 years ago? And that includes bag fees? (source: DOT fare survey) So while the airlines may have removed a perk from the past, it was a perk that the average airfare no longer supported.
2. Do you always check 2 bags on every WN flight you take? If not, you are paying for something you don't use.
3. You still don't get a seat assignment on WN, so thats a wash at best.

Hey vote with your wallet, do what you want. But I bet that in many cases, you are buying products on your WN flight that you don't even use.


Quite frankly, I don’t care how the airlines justify charging for things that used to be included in the fare. I want my cheap ticket, and I want it to include free bags and changes. I rarely pay more to fly Southwest, but when I do, I at least know that I can make free changes, as I’ve done in the past. I also usually check a bag. Over multiple trips, waived bag fees are great savings. And I usually get an aisle seat, even when I’m B31. Southwest takes care of me without complications, and their People are generally top-notch. Enough said.
 
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usdcaguy
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 8:28 am

l87e wrote:
Does anyone have an estimate for how much it would cost (setup+ongoing) to appear with prices in the/those databases search engines use?

I hope they go for opportunities to sell to more people before trying to change any big part of their appeal (Bags fly free, Fees don’t fly).
Try changing the sales model before bigger things?


A good rule of thumb is anywhere from $2.50 to $6.00 a click-through. Setup is minimal as usually a switch just has to be flipped. Seems like Kayak used to list WN fares, but that went away several years ago. Times are available, but then the link just takes you to southwest.com without any data being prepopulated. Southwest has traditionally not participated in the GDSs (except for basic selling in Sabre) and has not been available in search engines. They want their sales process to concern them and them only.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:14 am

What is so bad about basic economy? I booked 2 round trips (6 legs) in the last 30 days basic economy and had good experiences. Now, my credit card allowed me to check one free bag.
Perhaps WN wants the credit card revenue? I had no trouble. In fact, the airline checked, for free, my carryon (goes under the seat) 5 of the 6 legs so I could travel light.

What WN needs to do is be like JetBlue where it is very clear what fare bucket you buy into. While other airlines tell you, it isn't as obvious as JetBlue and I had to learn to watch out for one airline (that I still fly) when I made a mistake.


alggag wrote:
There have been surveys suggesting a basic economy is at least under consideration. Given their insistence that they will never charge for bags I would assume that it would probably be something like one bag and boarding group D sort of deal.

Last boarding and no bag unless you have a credit card would be fair.

WN needs to do someone to place a fare on search engines to match Spirit. As much as we all like something for nothing, costs must be reduced to be competitive.

Will SouthWest implement basic economy? Not quickly. I think they have to do so. Boarding late will be a given (as they do not assign seats). Fewer bags and higher fees for bags.

Lightsaber
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usflyguy
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:37 am

Gulfstream500 wrote:
usflyguy wrote:
Gulfstream500 wrote:
Honestly, wanna getaway on WN is basically basic economy (no pun intended)... you’re last to board, don’t have a seat assignment, and will likely be separated from the other members of your party. Currently, the only difference between basic economy on the legacies and WN is the baggage fees.

In short, if they want to make basic economy, they should just charge for bags.


So, honestly, you don’t know much about Southwest and their fare products? Wanna Get Away fares do not mean you board last, boarding is based on when you check in online, beginning 24 hours prior to departure. Passengers that book Anytime fares and Wanna Get Away fares check in at 24 hours prior to departure and they are assigned a boarding position at that time. A-list and A-list preferred passengers are checked in 36 hours prior to flight along with those that purchased “Early Bird”... “Early Bird” passengers may be on either Anytime or Wanna Get Away fares.


So, honestly, you did not read my post. I never said that you are going to 100% be the last person to board, just that there's a decent chance that you will board in the last group (Key word: no seat assignment). So be it if there are only two sections separated by fare. But hey, if bashing every poster who does not agree with your ideology makes you happy...


Actually, you said “ you’re last to board”... there is no “may”, “might”, “could be”, or any other qualifiers in your original post. So, yes, I did read your post and I responded accordingly. If you buy “Business Select” you are assigned a boarding position between A1-A15; everything else is up for grabs. If an A-list Preferred member buys a wanna get away fare, they could end up with A16. So, no, Wanna Get Away fares do not mean that you are going to be in the last group. I pointed out that you didn’t know about what you were posting about; that’s not “bashing”.
My post is my ideas and my opinions only, I do not represent the ideas or opinions of anyone else or company.
 
planecane
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Re: Southwest May Be Considering Basic Economy

Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:46 am

lightsaber wrote:
What is so bad about basic economy? I booked 2 round trips (6 legs) in the last 30 days basic economy and had good experiences. Now, my credit card allowed me to check one free bag.
Perhaps WN wants the credit card revenue? I had no trouble. In fact, the airline checked, for free, my carryon (goes under the seat) 5 of the 6 legs so I could travel light.

What WN needs to do is be like JetBlue where it is very clear what fare bucket you buy into. While other airlines tell you, it isn't as obvious as JetBlue and I had to learn to watch out for one airline (that I still fly) when I made a mistake.


alggag wrote:
There have been surveys suggesting a basic economy is at least under consideration. Given their insistence that they will never charge for bags I would assume that it would probably be something like one bag and boarding group D sort of deal.

Last boarding and no bag unless you have a credit card would be fair.

WN needs to do someone to place a fare on search engines to match Spirit. As much as we all like something for nothing, costs must be reduced to be competitive.

Will SouthWest implement basic economy? Not quickly. I think they have to do so. Boarding late will be a given (as they do not assign seats). Fewer bags and higher fees for bags.

Lightsaber


The other airlines did it to compete with spirit on fare search engines. Since WN doesn't publish on those sites, it only makes sense if they increase the other fares so that it overall increases revenue.

I don't have a problem with that.

If they made it a "D" boarding group they'd have to make it unavailable to families with children. It wouldn't be fair to let families book a basic fare but then board before "B" so they can sit together. They'd create a mess if they tried to make it so basic economy families couldn't board with other families.

Honestly, if WN wants to increase ARPU, I'd prefer if they just charged a fee if you want an assigned seat although there would be logistical issues like what happens if a leg is delayed and you can't get to your connection before boarding starts. I'm assuming people that don't pay for assignments would still board open seating style.

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