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QF744ER
Topic Author
Posts: 425
Joined: Mon Jun 21, 2004 7:59 am

LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 4:07 am

Did a quick search and found no reference this this being previously posted.

From this article it would appear LOT is looking at taking 3 former Singapore Airlines B772’s.

https://www.pasazer.com/news/42999/do,f ... i,777.html
 
303dk
Posts: 496
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 4:12 am

15 787s aren’t enough to cover ORD? Do they make money anywhere else?
 
Blerg
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 5:56 am

303dk wrote:
15 787s aren’t enough to cover ORD? Do they make money anywhere else?


You do realize LO has built a big hub at WAW and they fly from there to many intercontinental destinations such as Sri Lanka, China, Singapore or South Korea. To answer your quest, yes 15 B787 is enough to cover ORD but it's not enough for the rest of destinations they fly to.
 
zkncj
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 5:57 am

303dk wrote:
15 787s aren’t enough to cover ORD? Do they make money anywhere else?


More likely ex-SQ 77E’s to cover RR issues with there 787s.

NZ took an couple of ex SQ 77E for 12months to cover for there 789s, plus an 77W from EVA. The dry leased EVA 77W is still here 18months later, plus they have wet leased a350 from CX. For an simliar size fleet, would see its purely to cover RR repairs.

Allot of 787 operators have had to lease, wet lease additional aircraft to make up for 787s currently out of service.

Airlines like HiFly are doing very well out of the current 787 issues.
 
303dk
Posts: 496
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 6:40 am

Blerg wrote:
303dk wrote:
15 787s aren’t enough to cover ORD? Do they make money anywhere else?


You do realize LO has built a big hub at WAW and they fly from there to many intercontinental destinations such as Sri Lanka, China, Singapore or South Korea. To answer your quest, yes 15 B787 is enough to cover ORD but it's not enough for the rest of destinations they fly to.

Obviously I was being sarcastic, but also there are questions about the long term viability of their network. If they’re covering the 787 engine issues, that makes sense. Long term, there’s no need for this kind of capacity expansion
 
Blerg
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 6:51 am

303dk wrote:
Blerg wrote:
303dk wrote:
15 787s aren’t enough to cover ORD? Do they make money anywhere else?


You do realize LO has built a big hub at WAW and they fly from there to many intercontinental destinations such as Sri Lanka, China, Singapore or South Korea. To answer your quest, yes 15 B787 is enough to cover ORD but it's not enough for the rest of destinations they fly to.

Obviously I was being sarcastic, but also there are questions about the long term viability of their network. If they’re covering the 787 engine issues, that makes sense. Long term, there’s no need for this kind of capacity expansion


Of course they are struggling, they have been leasing all sort of extra capacity. Just the other day they extended the leases for Air Belgium's A340s. The pas summer they even had to get Euroatlantic's ancient B767 to fly out of Budapest. As for capacity expansion, well, LO has been introducing B789s so my guess is that there are routes out there that are maturing and that seen growing passenger numbers meaning those 788s are no longer enough. This is becoming a problem as WAW is full and they can't add more banks in order to improve connectivity so boost in capacity it is.
 
RainerBoeing777
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 8:17 am

Blerg wrote:
303dk wrote:
Blerg wrote:

You do realize LO has built a big hub at WAW and they fly from there to many intercontinental destinations such as Sri Lanka, China, Singapore or South Korea. To answer your quest, yes 15 B787 is enough to cover ORD but it's not enough for the rest of destinations they fly to.

Obviously I was being sarcastic, but also there are questions about the long term viability of their network. If they’re covering the 787 engine issues, that makes sense. Long term, there’s no need for this kind of capacity expansion


Of course they are struggling, they have been leasing all sort of extra capacity. Just the other day they extended the leases for Air Belgium's A340s. The pas summer they even had to get Euroatlantic's ancient B767 to fly out of Budapest. As for capacity expansion, well, LO has been introducing B789s so my guess is that there are routes out there that are maturing and that seen growing passenger numbers meaning those 788s are no longer enough. This is becoming a problem as WAW is full and they can't add more banks in order to improve connectivity so boost in capacity it is.


LOT is looking to order Airbus A350-900 or Boeing 787-10, possibly most of Boeing 787-8 head to Budapest (BUD)
CX - JL - LH - KE - KL - SQ - QR - QF - TG
 
oschkosch
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 8:28 am

303dk wrote:
Obviously I was being sarcastic, but also there are questions about the long term viability of their network. If they’re covering the 787 engine issues, that makes sense. Long term, there’s no need for this kind of capacity expansion




Well kindly share with us the details of LO's current capacity, current load ratios and future expansion plans then. Obviously you know more than us, maybe even more than LO themselves?
:stirthepot: :airplane: "This airplane is designed by clowns, who in turn are supervised by monkeys" :airplane: :stirthepot:
 
QF744ER
Topic Author
Posts: 425
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 9:28 am

Based on data available LOT appears to have the following B788’s out of active flying schedules: LRE and LRH. B789’s LSA appears to of been in AUH for a number of days after being ferried there and LSE and LSF also appear to be grounded.
 
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mke717spotter
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 9:59 am

Blerg wrote:

Just the other day they extended the leases for Air Belgium's A340s.

So they'll have the 777s in addition to the A340s? It will be interesting to see whether or not these planes get repainted in the LO livery.
Will you watch the Cleveland Browns and the Detroit Lions on Sunday? Only if coach Eric Mangini resigned after a loss.
 
VSMUT
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 10:11 am

mke717spotter wrote:
Blerg wrote:

Just the other day they extended the leases for Air Belgium's A340s.

So they'll have the 777s in addition to the A340s? It will be interesting to see whether or not these planes get repainted in the LO livery.


My guess is all white, like the ones that went to Air New Zealand and LATAM.
I guess they will come with the outdated cabin too.
 
ek241yyz
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 12:58 pm

mke717spotter wrote:
Blerg wrote:

Just the other day they extended the leases for Air Belgium's A340s.

So they'll have the 777s in addition to the A340s? It will be interesting to see whether or not these planes get repainted in the LO livery.


Yes, Air Belgium stays until Oct 2020.

The 777s are slated to be painted into LOT livery.

And for those wondering, yes, with their older cabins.
Travel often; getting lost will help you find yourself.
 
sabby
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 1:14 pm

I think the ex-SQ 77E have 1-2-1 flat beds so not that bad other than the smaller IFE screens. Their regional 77As had 2-2-2 angle J seats. Either way, the 3-3-3 Y seats on 777 would be welcome compared to the 3-3-3 Y seats on 787s.
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 1:37 pm

I would have to imagine that Rolls Royce would be paying the leases on these frames, probably being leased from Boeing directly and not a third-party lessor. (LATAM is also leasing B77Es ex-SQ that has no livery, and Privilege Style leases one and EuroAtlantic owns one.)
 
SteelChair
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 1:46 pm

I wonder about the price. It's been almost 10 years since Richard Anderson said the widebody market was collapsing. (He then went out and bought a used 777 for $7.7M). Since he made his comment, its been announced that A380 and B747 will cease production. 777x orders are tepid, and A330 and B787 production rates are either low or decreasing.
 
x1234
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 2:19 pm

Is it possible to CHANGE engines on the B788 B789 from RR to GE?
 
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Spacepope
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 2:42 pm

aemoreira1981 wrote:
I would have to imagine that Rolls Royce would be paying the leases on these frames, probably being leased from Boeing directly and not a third-party lessor. (LATAM is also leasing B77Es ex-SQ that has no livery, and Privilege Style leases one and EuroAtlantic owns one.)


These EX-SQ 77es are owned by Boeing Capital, correct? (Also the source for the new Suriname frame replacing the A343)
The last of the famous international playboys
 
MEA-707
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 2:48 pm

SteelChair wrote:
I wonder about the price. It's been almost 10 years since Richard Anderson said the widebody market was collapsing. (He then went out and bought a used 777 for $7.7M). Since he made his comment, its been announced that A380 and B747 will cease production. 777x orders are tepid, and A330 and B787 production rates are either low or decreasing.

It's not (yet) announced that the B747 will cease production. Yes it might happen any time when there are no further orders, and all future builts will be cargo. Maybe they wait til the 737 Max is back in the air before they announce it. But it's still possible they can stretch it a few more years if they can make CI, SQ, Atlas, CV, UPS and so order more 748Fs.
nobody has ever died from hard work, but why take the risk?
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:23 pm

Spacepope wrote:
aemoreira1981 wrote:
I would have to imagine that Rolls Royce would be paying the leases on these frames, probably being leased from Boeing directly and not a third-party lessor. (LATAM is also leasing B77Es ex-SQ that has no livery, and Privilege Style leases one and EuroAtlantic owns one.)


These EX-SQ 77es are owned by Boeing Capital, correct? (Also the source for the new Suriname frame replacing the A343)


Almost certainly the case. About time that Surinam Airways finally graduated to ETOPS qualification.

x1234 wrote:
Is it possible to CHANGE engines on the B788 B789 from RR to GE?


Conceivably it is, if the pylon is also changed, but it isn't cheap.
 
dcajet
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 3:40 pm

QF744ER wrote:
Did a quick search and found no reference this this being previously posted.

From this article it would appear LOT is looking at taking 3 former Singapore Airlines B772’s.

https://www.pasazer.com/news/42999/do,f ... i,777.html


It was discussed last week on the LOT thread: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1437965
Keep calm and wash your hands.
 
zkncj
Posts: 3868
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 5:00 pm

VSMUT wrote:
mke717spotter wrote:
Blerg wrote:

Just the other day they extended the leases for Air Belgium's A340s.

So they'll have the 777s in addition to the A340s? It will be interesting to see whether or not these planes get repainted in the LO livery.


My guess is all white, like the ones that went to Air New Zealand and LATAM.
I guess they will come with the outdated cabin too.


The two 77E from SQ that NZ operated still had the SQ livery on them, just with the SQ titles and logo painted out. Although they were only around for 6-9 months so probably not worth repainting.

Then again don’t think they really cared to much about the paint job, the 77W they have from EVA is still fully painted as EVA including titles and logo.

Hopefully these are 77E aren’t hangar queens for LO, NZ had allot of issues with MX on the ex-SQ 77Es due to there age.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 5:23 pm

MEA-707 wrote:
SteelChair wrote:
I wonder about the price. It's been almost 10 years since Richard Anderson said the widebody market was collapsing. (He then went out and bought a used 777 for $7.7M). Since he made his comment, its been announced that A380 and B747 will cease production. 777x orders are tepid, and A330 and B787 production rates are either low or decreasing.

It's not (yet) announced that the B747 will cease production. Yes it might happen any time when there are no further orders, and all future builts will be cargo. Maybe they wait til the 737 Max is back in the air before they announce it. But it's still possible they can stretch it a few more years if they can make CI, SQ, Atlas, CV, UPS and so order more 748Fs.

Due to vendors shutting down, the cost will be higher to continue. The fusalage vendor couldn't economically produce at today's low production rate, so they built ahead. That factory completed its run and is now auctioning off equipment:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... ed-factory

These old SQ 77Es have small cargo doors which reduces demand (inhibits freight revenue). So good news that several were placed.

Lightsaber
Flu+Covid19 is bad. Consider a flu vaccine, if not for yourself, to protect someone you care about.
 
konrad
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Re: LOT to take some ex SQ772’s

Sun Jan 12, 2020 6:27 pm

303dk wrote:
Obviously I was being sarcastic, but also there are questions about the long term viability of their network.


Actually, some of the "new" destinations outside of US and Canada are very successful. NRT (daily) and ICN (5/7) is flying with full C and Y+ cabins. A lot of connections from CEE, secondary cities in Germany, Israel. On my last trip to NRT I had to pay a premium to fly LOT (shorter trip time) over OS or LH. In my experience these new destinations have a better level of service as compared to their "old" network, ORD and the likes.

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