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MCTSET
Topic Author
Posts: 196
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2019 8:45 pm

Qatar random fleet assignment

Wed Jan 15, 2020 11:00 pm

When you like at QR and the way they assign fleets it looks to me that they are not very structured.

The assigned fleet for a route can change by the day, LGW has been served by 787 going upto 777, LHR gets a mix of 380, 350 and the triple.

Just seen today that Vienna flew with a 320 instead of the usual 350. Is there a method to this madness?
 
Joelatbsl
Posts: 801
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 8:51 pm

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Wed Jan 15, 2020 11:05 pm

Vienna does get both, widebodies and the A320, the latter operating the flights in the evening. Heathrow has also always had a good mix of A330s and A340s in the past and now a lot of A350s and A380s together with the odd B777. Nothing too special there, QR has always been a bit like this ...
 
MCTSET
Topic Author
Posts: 196
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Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 12:36 am

Joelatbsl wrote:
Vienna does get both, widebodies and the A320, the latter operating the flights in the evening. Heathrow has also always had a good mix of A330s and A340s in the past and now a lot of A350s and A380s together with the odd B777. Nothing too special there, QR has always been a bit like this ...


So what you are saying that this is fluid assignment of aircraft is typical of QR. Do you think this benefits them to have this system it seems rather chaotic to me?
 
alasizon
Posts: 2583
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:57 pm

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 12:45 am

MCTSET wrote:
Joelatbsl wrote:
Vienna does get both, widebodies and the A320, the latter operating the flights in the evening. Heathrow has also always had a good mix of A330s and A340s in the past and now a lot of A350s and A380s together with the odd B777. Nothing too special there, QR has always been a bit like this ...


So what you are saying that this is fluid assignment of aircraft is typical of QR. Do you think this benefits them to have this system it seems rather chaotic to me?


It's only chaotic if you look at it on a day to day basis without acknowledgement that the schedule is planned farther in advance. Look at it week over week and it looks far less chaotic.

They match the DoW equipment and frequencies based on demand (or at least attempt to) and using a variable gauge is part of that.

The above mentioned example of Vienna just shows that they use different gauges for different flights. If the AM is a widebody, there is nothing saying that the PM has to be a widebody as well.
Airport (noun) - A construction site which airplanes tend to frequent
 
MCTSET
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Posts: 196
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Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 12:53 am

alasizon wrote:
MCTSET wrote:
Joelatbsl wrote:
Vienna does get both, widebodies and the A320, the latter operating the flights in the evening. Heathrow has also always had a good mix of A330s and A340s in the past and now a lot of A350s and A380s together with the odd B777. Nothing too special there, QR has always been a bit like this ...


So what you are saying that this is fluid assignment of aircraft is typical of QR. Do you think this benefits them to have this system it seems rather chaotic to me?


It's only chaotic if you look at it on a day to day basis without acknowledgement that the schedule is planned farther in advance. Look at it week over week and it looks far less chaotic.

They match the DoW equipment and frequencies based on demand (or at least attempt to) and using a variable gauge is part of that.

The above mentioned example of Vienna just shows that they use different gauges for different flights. If the AM is a widebody, there is nothing saying that the PM has to be a widebody as well.


Makes sense, but you could also argue that this would cause a lack of product consistency (QR is generally of the best regardless of equipment). So what you are saying they almost live fire adjusting equipment based on expected demand on that day?
 
a320fan
Posts: 838
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Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:11 am

Seemingly random aircraft assignments isn’t unique to QR

Etihads MEL flight seems to change between 789 and 77W seemingly at random.
A319, A320, A321, A330-200, A350-900, A380, 737-700, 737-800, 777-200ER, 777-300, 777-300ER, 787-8, Q300, Q400
 
DeltaB717
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Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:18 am

a320fan wrote:
Seemingly random aircraft assignments isn’t unique to QR

Etihads MEL flight seems to change between 789 and 77W seemingly at random.


EY's MEL flight is double daily and is currently scheduled as 1x 789 and 1x 77W - I don't believe there has been any more randomness about it than that. The 77W flight (the later of the two, at least at the MEL end) was previously scheduled as a 789 but changed to a 77W quite some time ago.
 
alasizon
Posts: 2583
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:57 pm

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 2:05 am

MCTSET wrote:
alasizon wrote:
MCTSET wrote:

So what you are saying that this is fluid assignment of aircraft is typical of QR. Do you think this benefits them to have this system it seems rather chaotic to me?


It's only chaotic if you look at it on a day to day basis without acknowledgement that the schedule is planned farther in advance. Look at it week over week and it looks far less chaotic.

They match the DoW equipment and frequencies based on demand (or at least attempt to) and using a variable gauge is part of that.

The above mentioned example of Vienna just shows that they use different gauges for different flights. If the AM is a widebody, there is nothing saying that the PM has to be a widebody as well.


Makes sense, but you could also argue that this would cause a lack of product consistency (QR is generally of the best regardless of equipment). So what you are saying they almost live fire adjusting equipment based on expected demand on that day?


They aren't live adjusting; it is adjusted well in advance. Smart airlines adjust their capacity on different days of the week to maximize profit and minimize losses.

Flying an A380 when there is only demand for 130 pax doesn't make sense; but flying a 320 does.
Airport (noun) - A construction site which airplanes tend to frequent
 
AEROFAN
Posts: 1849
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2004 9:47 am

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 2:24 am

MCTSET wrote:
When you like at QR and the way they assign fleets it looks to me that they are not very structured.

The assigned fleet for a route can change by the day, LGW has been served by 787 going upto 777, LHR gets a mix of 380, 350 and the triple.

Just seen today that Vienna flew with a 320 instead of the usual 350. Is there a method to this madness?


Heard about this sudden change of craft that sometimes occur. I booked with QR to fly the B787 and A350 last October. Happy to state that there were no changes for the two flights and both legs were excellent.
“You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant.” ~Harlan Ellison~
 
dstblj52
Posts: 411
Joined: Tue Nov 19, 2019 8:38 pm

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 4:14 am

MCTSET wrote:
Joelatbsl wrote:
Vienna does get both, widebodies and the A320, the latter operating the flights in the evening. Heathrow has also always had a good mix of A330s and A340s in the past and now a lot of A350s and A380s together with the odd B777. Nothing too special there, QR has always been a bit like this ...


So what you are saying that this is fluid assignment of aircraft is typical of QR. Do you think this benefits them to have this system it seems rather chaotic to me?

A lot of airlines do it, DL is fairly famous for it but it's about matching capacity to demand, sometimes you will see fairly close in changes
 
sabby
Posts: 438
Joined: Fri Jun 01, 2018 5:11 pm

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 5:47 am

Actually, if you observe, the main daily flights which originate from Doha in the morning connecting wave will always be the large wide body aircraft, typically 777/A350 and the afternoon flights will be smaller planes 788 or A320 unless it is a high O&D / slot restricted airport. It makes good sense. Now whether they adjust the prices accordingly is a different question.
 
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PM
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Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 6:00 am

I'm flying QR to FRA in July. A 77W on the way in and an A380 on the way out. Makes sense. I'm just annoyed that neither flight will be on an A350.

Oh, and the WDH rotation is always a 788.
 
a320fan
Posts: 838
Joined: Fri May 01, 2009 5:04 am

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 6:58 am

DeltaB717 wrote:
a320fan wrote:
Seemingly random aircraft assignments isn’t unique to QR

Etihads MEL flight seems to change between 789 and 77W seemingly at random.


EY's MEL flight is double daily and is currently scheduled as 1x 789 and 1x 77W - I don't believe there has been any more randomness about it than that. The 77W flight (the later of the two, at least at the MEL end) was previously scheduled as a 789 but changed to a 77W quite some time ago.


EY460 seems to have officially changed to the 77W late last year but the 789 has still being operating the rotation once or twice a week.
A319, A320, A321, A330-200, A350-900, A380, 737-700, 737-800, 777-200ER, 777-300, 777-300ER, 787-8, Q300, Q400
 
Jomar777
Posts: 554
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 8:45 am

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 10:01 am

QR operates a pretty fair and consistent fleet most (if not all...) of the time. UK for example: LGW is always a B788. LHR, the first departure on the day (from LHR) will be a B77W followed by an A380 one hour later. Then is most B77W and an extra A380 plus one A35k per day. (I do not know the schedule on top of my head since I only use the morning ones to go and the mid afternoon ones to come back - B788s from LGW/B77W from LHR, return likewise...).
Usually a thin route is a B788 and main established routes with high yield are served by their B77Ws.
Their A350s (359s and 35ks) tend to bob around sometimes. UK-wise, we had until not long ago a A35k on QR1/2 but now is on QR7/8. I guess they move one or another depending o some route launch or similar (I know they recently launched a route to Asia with a A350 (do not know if a 9 or 10 since I saw the advert briefly...) so some movement on their program might be expected.
The A359s on lease from LATAM do not tend to come to Europe also (I ahve never seen one and neitehr saw one in Hamad departing to Europe) but stay within Middle East mainly.
Their A332s and A333s are mianly flying around middle East and Asia but I got one recently to LGW (probably because the B788 on the line went tech or similar...).
Apart from this, there's the fact that they are refurbishing their B77Ws so that they have their Q-Suite Business Class (which is great) so you may see the odd movement there.
 
Joelatbsl
Posts: 801
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 8:51 pm

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:01 pm

The big units going to LHR can also change around to match their rotations together with longer flights. Generally, the mix of aircraft of QR at LHR is rather fluid, but there can be clusters within one day where you see three A380s arriving from Doha within three hours.

With QR you also have to think about the fact that DOH is a hub with several waves of inbound and outbound flights. Adding a second daily flight as QR has done to destinations like VIE or WAW, where they use their A320s for the evening flights, allows them to offer access to these departure waves, even if there is no need for a huge widebody.
 
dredgy
Posts: 488
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Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:08 pm

MCTSET wrote:
Makes sense, but you could also argue that this would cause a lack of product consistency


Yes, that’s very much the opinion of a lot of Business travellers! And generally why Emirates is often seen as the preferred airline - Etihad and Qatar both have the chance you’ll end up on a narrow body with substandard product whereas EK you’ll always have a wide body with a bed as the bare minimum. QR may have the worlds best business class, but it’s of no use if you’re stuck on a 6 hour flight on their A320! Emirates protects their brand by having FlyDubai do the narrow body routes.
 
Mullion
Posts: 69
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Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 1:11 pm

Manchester gets B788, B773 and A350 and different class layouts as well and do change fairly often, today for instance is A350, then B773 and then B788
 
sabby
Posts: 438
Joined: Fri Jun 01, 2018 5:11 pm

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 4:54 pm

Jomar777 wrote:
The A359s on lease from LATAM do not tend to come to Europe also (I ahve never seen one and neitehr saw one in Hamad departing to Europe) but stay within Middle East mainly.


One of those leased LATAM A359s used to do the MUC route a couple years back.
 
MCTSET
Topic Author
Posts: 196
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2019 8:45 pm

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 5:46 pm

QR has also announced 8 new routes to new destinations. In surprised that they have announced Luanda and Accra with the blockade, I thought these deep African flights would be tough with no access to through SA. but I guess the close Africa would be hit hardest in Sudan and that region.

https://www.businesstraveller.com/busin ... s-in-2020/
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Thu Jan 16, 2020 7:38 pm

dredgy wrote:
MCTSET wrote:
Makes sense, but you could also argue that this would cause a lack of product consistency


Yes, that’s very much the opinion of a lot of Business travellers! And generally why Emirates is often seen as the preferred airline - Etihad and Qatar both have the chance you’ll end up on a narrow body with substandard product whereas EK you’ll always have a wide body with a bed as the bare minimum. QR may have the worlds best business class, but it’s of no use if you’re stuck on a 6 hour flight on their A320! Emirates protects their brand by having FlyDubai do the narrow body routes.


Have you ever been on a Qatar A320? It's a much more comfortable ride in Business Class than an Emirates 777 with their cramped seats that recline on an angle.

The perceived "inconsistency" is just as big a deal at Emirates. How many aisles the plane has is a lot less relevant than the hard product on board.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
Jomar777
Posts: 554
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 8:45 am

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Fri Jan 17, 2020 9:23 am

sabby wrote:
Jomar777 wrote:
The A359s on lease from LATAM do not tend to come to Europe also (I ahve never seen one and neitehr saw one in Hamad departing to Europe) but stay within Middle East mainly.


One of those leased LATAM A359s used to do the MUC route a couple years back.


Yes... but it seems that it no longer comes round Europe any longer. I myself never seen it...
 
dredgy
Posts: 488
Joined: Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:13 am

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Fri Jan 17, 2020 11:23 am

RyanairGuru wrote:
dredgy wrote:
MCTSET wrote:
Makes sense, but you could also argue that this would cause a lack of product consistency


Yes, that’s very much the opinion of a lot of Business travellers! And generally why Emirates is often seen as the preferred airline - Etihad and Qatar both have the chance you’ll end up on a narrow body with substandard product whereas EK you’ll always have a wide body with a bed as the bare minimum. QR may have the worlds best business class, but it’s of no use if you’re stuck on a 6 hour flight on their A320! Emirates protects their brand by having FlyDubai do the narrow body routes.


Have you ever been on a Qatar A320? It's a much more comfortable ride in Business Class than an Emirates 777 with their cramped seats that recline on an angle.

The perceived "inconsistency" is just as big a deal at Emirates. How many aisles the plane has is a lot less relevant than the hard product on board.


Yes I've been on both - stuck on the Qatar A320s to both Zagreb and Uganda - couldn't even recline the seats on one without my feet getting stuck - it's a really bad hard product. Soft product is excellent still though.

The inconvenience of 2-3-2 is also blown way out of proportion, the comfiest flight I've ever had was on a Turkish 777, and the uncomfiest I've ever had was an an Air New Zealand 1-2-1.
The angled beds on Emirates are not bad at all (I'm a special case since even on a flat bed I always angle it a bit) though people definitely go out of their way to avoid them, but general consensus I've heard is overwhelmingly "better an angled bed then no bed".
 
stefanJ
Posts: 17
Joined: Wed Jun 22, 2016 12:48 pm

Re: Qatar random fleet assignment

Fri Jan 17, 2020 12:51 pm

dredgy wrote:
RyanairGuru wrote:
dredgy wrote:

Yes, that’s very much the opinion of a lot of Business travellers! And generally why Emirates is often seen as the preferred airline - Etihad and Qatar both have the chance you’ll end up on a narrow body with substandard product whereas EK you’ll always have a wide body with a bed as the bare minimum. QR may have the worlds best business class, but it’s of no use if you’re stuck on a 6 hour flight on their A320! Emirates protects their brand by having FlyDubai do the narrow body routes.


Have you ever been on a Qatar A320? It's a much more comfortable ride in Business Class than an Emirates 777 with their cramped seats that recline on an angle.

The perceived "inconsistency" is just as big a deal at Emirates. How many aisles the plane has is a lot less relevant than the hard product on board.


Yes I've been on both - stuck on the Qatar A320s to both Zagreb and Uganda - couldn't even recline the seats on one without my feet getting stuck - it's a really bad hard product. Soft product is excellent still though.

The inconvenience of 2-3-2 is also blown way out of proportion, the comfiest flight I've ever had was on a Turkish 777, and the uncomfiest I've ever had was an an Air New Zealand 1-2-1.
The angled beds on Emirates are not bad at all (I'm a special case since even on a flat bed I always angle it a bit) though people definitely go out of their way to avoid them, but general consensus I've heard is overwhelmingly "better an angled bed then no bed".


+1 on your comment. I flew QR J on the A320 from BEG-DOH, soft product great, hard product = no way. EK 777 is in a different league.

In regards to the comment above, EK J is much more consistent than QR and EY. Now you've essentially got the A380 and 777 product. Before, when EK operated A330's, A340-300's, A340-500's and still had the recliner J in some 777's along with the current product, consistency was non-existent. Now with only two products, much better.

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