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QF744ER
Posts: 474
Joined: Mon Jun 21, 2004 7:59 am

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 02, 2021 9:38 am

Believe VH-VWZ has been up there since the 3/1/2021, I’d heard it was undergoing the ‘knife’ but it could very well be stored/maintenance.

I was also under the impression they had 2-3 lines so multiple aircraft could be converted at any given time.
 
VSMUT
Posts: 5497
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2016 11:40 am

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 02, 2021 10:27 am

QF744ER wrote:
Believe VH-VWZ has been up there since the 3/1/2021, I’d heard it was undergoing the ‘knife’ but it could very well be stored/maintenance.

I was also under the impression they had 2-3 lines so multiple aircraft could be converted at any given time.


Right now there is the A320 in conversion at XSP and an A321 for Smartlynx in CAN, the first to be converted there. The second Titan only cleared the line in XSP 2 days ago, so that probably makes 3 lines.
 
a2b7
Posts: 103
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 8:17 pm

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 23, 2021 8:20 pm

https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=2 reports that the next A321 to be converted has arrived at XSP on 22 Apr 21. It is MSN 1199 VQ-BOC (lease return from Ural Airlines)
 
MD80MKE
Posts: 216
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2016 2:26 am

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 23, 2021 9:44 pm

The cargo door cutting seems to have been underway for the A320 P2F prototype according to the tweet below.
https://twitter.com/globalxairlines/sta ... 6817528832
 
a2b7
Posts: 103
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 8:17 pm

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Thu Apr 29, 2021 5:57 pm

cargofacts reports that Precision has obtained certification from the FAA for its A321 conversion, see https://cargofacts.com/allposts/aircraf ... 21-200pcf/
 
ILNFlyer
Posts: 688
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 8:34 pm

A321p2f receives FAA supplemental type certificate

Fri May 14, 2021 3:23 pm

From the ATSG investor call: "We also received word last week that the FAA has awarded a Supplemental Type Certificate for freighter conversion of Airbus A321-200 passenger aircraft under our joint venture with Precision."

https://www.atsginc.com/sites/atsg-inc/ ... -final.pdf
 
solracfunk14
Posts: 109
Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:10 am

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Thu May 20, 2021 6:04 pm

Azul it's looking to buy 2 A321F/PCF/P2F https://www.aeroin.net/azul-pretende-ut ... miami/?amp
 
a2b7
Posts: 103
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 8:17 pm

Re: A321p2f receives FAA supplemental type certificate

Thu May 20, 2021 9:10 pm

ILNFlyer wrote:
From the ATSG investor call: "We also received word last week that the FAA has awarded a Supplemental Type Certificate for freighter conversion of Airbus A321-200 passenger aircraft under our joint venture with Precision."

https://www.atsginc.com/sites/atsg-inc/ ... -final.pdf

https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=1 reports that the prototype N322WS (MSN 891) has been delivered to smartLynx Malta ("delivery 18-19may21 SFB-PSM-KEF-MPL")
 
Diverskii
Posts: 22
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 4:31 pm

Re: A321p2f receives FAA supplemental type certificate

Fri May 21, 2021 9:44 am

a2b7 wrote:
ILNFlyer wrote:
From the ATSG investor call: "We also received word last week that the FAA has awarded a Supplemental Type Certificate for freighter conversion of Airbus A321-200 passenger aircraft under our joint venture with Precision."

https://www.atsginc.com/sites/atsg-inc/ ... -final.pdf

https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=1 reports that the prototype N322WS (MSN 891) has been delivered to smartLynx Malta ("delivery 18-19may21 SFB-PSM-KEF-MPL")


Yep, the guys from JetTest delivered it

https://twitter.com/JTTsteve/status/1394857341263175685
 
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lightsaber
Moderator
Posts: 22883
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:55 pm

Re: A321p2f receives FAA supplemental type certificate

Fri May 21, 2021 12:28 pm

Diverskii wrote:
a2b7 wrote:
ILNFlyer wrote:
From the ATSG investor call: "We also received word last week that the FAA has awarded a Supplemental Type Certificate for freighter conversion of Airbus A321-200 passenger aircraft under our joint venture with Precision."

https://www.atsginc.com/sites/atsg-inc/ ... -final.pdf

https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=1 reports that the prototype N322WS (MSN 891) has been delivered to smartLynx Malta ("delivery 18-19may21 SFB-PSM-KEF-MPL")


Yep, the guys from JetTest delivered it

https://twitter.com/JTTsteve/status/1394857341263175685

That is great news! We now have two A321CEO vonversions. PCF and P2F. Now for the A320 conversions (there is more stock available).

Lightsaber
 
Flying-Tiger
Posts: 4133
Joined: Mon Aug 23, 1999 5:35 am

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Fri May 21, 2021 1:58 pm

Global X will take up to five A321 P2F:

ST Engineering announced Thursday (19 May) the signing of a Letter of Intent by its Aviation Asset Management unit to lease up to five Airbus A321 Passenger-to-Freighter (P2F) aircraft to Global Crossing Airlines (GlobalX). As part of end-to-end Aviation Asset Management solutions, ST Engineering will also provide maintenance services to these aircraft for GlobalX over the period of the lease.

Subject to the signing of definitive agreements, ST Engineering will acquire the five Airbus A321 passenger aircraft on its own or through its joint venture companies, and finance these aircraft through a mix of equity and non-recourse debt. These aircraft will be converted and maintained at ST Engineering’s global facilities, with the first A321 aircraft to be converted in April 2022 and placed on lease in 4Q2022. The remaining four P2F aircraft will be converted and leased to GlobalX progressively.


https://asianaviation.com/st-engineering-signs-loi-to-lease-a321-conversions-to-globalx/

Anyone having an overview how many A321 P2F / PCF conversions have been ordered today, and for whom?
 
ILNFlyer
Posts: 688
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 8:34 pm

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Tue Jun 29, 2021 5:12 pm

ATSG has confirmed they have acquired their first two feedstock 321's for conversion. They will be converted at PEMCO, which they own.

https://www.atsginc.com/investors/news- ... -feedstock
Last edited by ILNFlyer on Tue Jun 29, 2021 5:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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lightsaber
Moderator
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Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Tue Jun 29, 2021 5:14 pm

Flying-Tiger wrote:
Global X will take up to five A321 P2F:

ST Engineering announced Thursday (19 May) the signing of a Letter of Intent by its Aviation Asset Management unit to lease up to five Airbus A321 Passenger-to-Freighter (P2F) aircraft to Global Crossing Airlines (GlobalX). As part of end-to-end Aviation Asset Management solutions, ST Engineering will also provide maintenance services to these aircraft for GlobalX over the period of the lease.

Subject to the signing of definitive agreements, ST Engineering will acquire the five Airbus A321 passenger aircraft on its own or through its joint venture companies, and finance these aircraft through a mix of equity and non-recourse debt. These aircraft will be converted and maintained at ST Engineering’s global facilities, with the first A321 aircraft to be converted in April 2022 and placed on lease in 4Q2022. The remaining four P2F aircraft will be converted and leased to GlobalX progressively.


https://asianaviation.com/st-engineering-signs-loi-to-lease-a321-conversions-to-globalx/

Anyone having an overview how many A321 P2F / PCF conversions have been ordered today, and for whom?

How many have been converted too? I do not know of a summary.
 
oldJoe
Posts: 643
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:04 pm

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Tue Jun 29, 2021 7:58 pm

lightsaber wrote:
Flying-Tiger wrote:
Global X will take up to five A321 P2F:

ST Engineering announced Thursday (19 May) the signing of a Letter of Intent by its Aviation Asset Management unit to lease up to five Airbus A321 Passenger-to-Freighter (P2F) aircraft to Global Crossing Airlines (GlobalX). As part of end-to-end Aviation Asset Management solutions, ST Engineering will also provide maintenance services to these aircraft for GlobalX over the period of the lease.

Subject to the signing of definitive agreements, ST Engineering will acquire the five Airbus A321 passenger aircraft on its own or through its joint venture companies, and finance these aircraft through a mix of equity and non-recourse debt. These aircraft will be converted and maintained at ST Engineering’s global facilities, with the first A321 aircraft to be converted in April 2022 and placed on lease in 4Q2022. The remaining four P2F aircraft will be converted and leased to GlobalX progressively.


https://asianaviation.com/st-engineering-signs-loi-to-lease-a321-conversions-to-globalx/

Anyone having an overview how many A321 P2F / PCF conversions have been ordered today, and for whom?

How many have been converted too? I do not know of a summary.


AFAIK four are delivered
1x P2F Qantas Freight , 2x P2F Titan Airways and 1x PCF SmartLynx Malta ( the second one for them will be a P2F )
I believe that there are seven more in conversion ( 5x P2F and 2x PCF )
plus one the prototype of Sine Draco which they call SDF

https://www.aircargonews.net/freighters-world/sine-draco-selects-ascent-aviation-for-a321-conversion-project/

India's IndiGo Airlines to add four A321(P2F)s

https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news/102897-indias-indigo-airlines-to-add-four-a321p2fs

GTLK Europe has four P2F on order

https://www.payloadasia.com/aircraft-manufacturers/st-engineering-efw-sign-a321p2f-orders-for-irish-lessor/

and more I`m sure .......
 
MD80MKE
Posts: 216
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2016 2:26 am

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Wed Jun 30, 2021 1:05 am

lightsaber wrote:
Flying-Tiger wrote:
Global X will take up to five A321 P2F:

ST Engineering announced Thursday (19 May) the signing of a Letter of Intent by its Aviation Asset Management unit to lease up to five Airbus A321 Passenger-to-Freighter (P2F) aircraft to Global Crossing Airlines (GlobalX). As part of end-to-end Aviation Asset Management solutions, ST Engineering will also provide maintenance services to these aircraft for GlobalX over the period of the lease.

Subject to the signing of definitive agreements, ST Engineering will acquire the five Airbus A321 passenger aircraft on its own or through its joint venture companies, and finance these aircraft through a mix of equity and non-recourse debt. These aircraft will be converted and maintained at ST Engineering’s global facilities, with the first A321 aircraft to be converted in April 2022 and placed on lease in 4Q2022. The remaining four P2F aircraft will be converted and leased to GlobalX progressively.


https://asianaviation.com/st-engineering-signs-loi-to-lease-a321-conversions-to-globalx/

Anyone having an overview how many A321 P2F / PCF conversions have been ordered today, and for whom?

How many have been converted too? I do not know of a summary.


Here's a list I'd personally refer to sometimes. Although they seem just to record what skyliner/ps.net says.
https://a380.boards.net/thread/1179/a320-family-p2f
 
oldJoe
Posts: 643
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:04 pm

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Wed Jun 30, 2021 1:49 am

MD80MKE wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
Flying-Tiger wrote:
Global X will take up to five A321 P2F:



https://asianaviation.com/st-engineering-signs-loi-to-lease-a321-conversions-to-globalx/

Anyone having an overview how many A321 P2F / PCF conversions have been ordered today, and for whom?

How many have been converted too? I do not know of a summary.


Here's a list I'd personally refer to sometimes. Although they seem just to record what skyliner/ps.net says.
https://a380.boards.net/thread/1179/a320-family-p2f


I also go to this site a lot and believe that they are very trustworthy even though I am not a member. We airplane crazy all just want to know the latest news, be it A or B or whoever
 
Okcflyer
Posts: 847
Joined: Sat May 23, 2015 11:10 pm

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Wed Jun 30, 2021 3:01 am

Could someone post payload range and pallet position counts?

Early A321’s
Later A321’s
B738P2F
B752P2F
B767P2F

Do the A321’s being converted today have the newer/improved V2500’s and the other pips which unlocked its full potential?
 
RoyalBrunei757
Posts: 602
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 6:18 am

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Fri Jul 02, 2021 11:43 am

More A321 conversion coming.

ATSG to add A321P2Fs
https://www.scramble.nl/civil-news/atsg ... OZNLFp0SBo

Latvia's SmartLynx to add four more A321 freighters
http://airsoc.com/articles/view/id/60dd ... freighters
 
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lightsaber
Moderator
Posts: 22883
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Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Fri Jul 02, 2021 4:32 pm

MD80MKE wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
Flying-Tiger wrote:
Global X will take up to five A321 P2F:



https://asianaviation.com/st-engineering-signs-loi-to-lease-a321-conversions-to-globalx/

Anyone having an overview how many A321 P2F / PCF conversions have been ordered today, and for whom?

How many have been converted too? I do not know of a summary.


Here's a list I'd personally refer to sometimes. Although they seem just to record what skyliner/ps.net says.
https://a380.boards.net/thread/1179/a320-family-p2f

That'd a great list! Thank you. I shall follow, perhaps quarterly.

Lightsaber
 
whiplash
Posts: 97
Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2011 12:47 am

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:04 am

Do we know all MSNs that are undergoing or are going to go under the knife to start their new lives as freighters?
 
T4thH
Posts: 1274
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2019 11:17 pm

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Tue Jul 13, 2021 11:05 am

I am a little bit surprised, it got missed:

Lufthansa Cargo deploys two Airbus A321s permanently converted into freighters


Will be operated by Lufthansa CityLine on behalf of Lufthansa Cargo. Service to be started in 2022.

https://www.lufthansagroup.com/en/newsroom/releases/lufthansa-cargo-deploys-two-airbus-a321s-permanently-converted-into-freighters.html
 
MO11
Posts: 1868
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2017 5:07 pm

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Tue Jul 13, 2021 1:21 pm

Cargo Aircraft Management bought VP-CCH (ex G-TCDV) from Aviation Capital Group yesterday.
 
oldJoe
Posts: 643
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2020 11:04 pm

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:17 am

T4thH wrote:
I am a little bit surprised, it got missed:

Lufthansa Cargo deploys two Airbus A321s permanently converted into freighters


Will be operated by Lufthansa CityLine on behalf of Lufthansa Cargo. Service to be started in 2022.

https://www.lufthansagroup.com/en/newsroom/releases/lufthansa-cargo-deploys-two-airbus-a321s-permanently-converted-into-freighters.html


The first is MSN 3504 from Eurowings already in XSP and to my surprise the youngest to be converted so far ( 13.2 years old )

https://www.planespotters.net/airframe/airbus-a321-200-d-aeuc-eurowings/3xw15l?refresh=1
 
RoyalBrunei757
Posts: 602
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 6:18 am

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Wed Jul 14, 2021 1:53 am

whiplash wrote:
Do we know all MSNs that are undergoing or are going to go under the knife to start their new lives as freighters?

As shared previously, I use this website for latest information: https://a380.boards.net/thread/1179/a320-family-p2f

For those interested, here are some corporate borchures for A320P2F/A321P2F:
Airbus/ EFW/ ST Aerospace: https://www.elbeflugzeugwerke.com/filea ... Screen.pdf
Precision Aircraft Solution: https://www.precisionaircraft.com/a321-200pcf-freighter

Here is some quick analysis of current A321P2F market, dated from May 2021: https://www.freightwaves.com/news/trans ... -freighter
 
whiplash
Posts: 97
Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2011 12:47 am

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Wed Jul 14, 2021 6:28 am

RoyalBrunei757 wrote:
whiplash wrote:
Do we know all MSNs that are undergoing or are going to go under the knife to start their new lives as freighters?

As shared previously, I use this website for latest information: https://a380.boards.net/thread/1179/a320-family-p2f

For those interested, here are some corporate borchures for A320P2F/A321P2F:
Airbus/ EFW/ ST Aerospace: https://www.elbeflugzeugwerke.com/filea ... Screen.pdf
Precision Aircraft Solution: https://www.precisionaircraft.com/a321-200pcf-freighter

Here is some quick analysis of current A321P2F market, dated from May 2021: https://www.freightwaves.com/news/trans ... -freighter


Thanks for the link.
 
a2b7
Posts: 103
Joined: Fri Aug 30, 2019 8:17 pm

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Tue Aug 17, 2021 7:46 am

skyliner-aviation.de reports that the first A321P2F converted at CAN (MSN 1017), which goes to smartLynx Airlines Malta, was delivered 15-16 Aug 21 CAN-DMK-DWC-MLA-MPL. I wonder whether it will be painted at MPL.
 
RoyalBrunei757
Posts: 602
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 6:18 am

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Tue Aug 17, 2021 11:21 am

News Update: BBAM adds another 18 A321P2F from its pax fleet portfolio

https://www.scramble.nl/civil-news/bbam ... CyOGGhxXxw

All to be converted by end of 2025. With this latest order, EFW has now also sold-out its conversion capacity for the A320/A321 until the end of that year. Very solid demand for A321P2F!
 
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alberchico
Posts: 3360
Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2004 5:52 am

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Thu Oct 14, 2021 4:45 pm

Considering that this aircraft is already short legged compared with the 757, why haven't any of these cargo conversions been retrofitted with the modern winglets that are available ? It seems like it would make sense to squeeze every last drop of range from the A321.
 
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Polot
Posts: 12168
Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2011 3:01 pm

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Thu Oct 14, 2021 4:49 pm

alberchico wrote:
Considering that this aircraft is already short legged compared with the 757, why haven't any of these cargo conversions been retrofitted with the modern winglets that are available ? It seems like it would make sense to squeeze every last drop of range from the A321.

All the ones converted so far either can’t accept sharklets (less than ~MSN1200) or need extensive retrofit (MSN1200-MSN4500ish, above that it is plug and play). Not sure if P2F with sharklets modifications is certified.

Doing the extensive retrofit is probably not worth it if the cargo airline is planning on just doing short hops or have low utilization with the frame. Even many pax airlines have found the extensive retrofit difficult to justify.
 
User avatar
Revelation
Posts: 26681
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 9:37 pm

Re: A321 P2F News and Discussion Thread

Thu Oct 14, 2021 6:13 pm

alberchico wrote:
Considering that this aircraft is already short legged compared with the 757, why haven't any of these cargo conversions been retrofitted with the modern winglets that are available ? It seems like it would make sense to squeeze every last drop of range from the A321.

Do we know if a trade study has been made?

The winglets can cost anywhere in the range $0.5M - $2M from what google results I could find. $1M seems like a reasonable ball park figure. They add on-going maintenance costs and concerns. They add weight so reduce payload, and payload is very important for the freighter market. As mentioned above, early A320 family aircraft need a lot of reinforcement to be able to accept winglets. So, the operator would have to pay a lot for them up front, ad hope they fly enough hours per day to earn back their cost through reduced fuel burn, after factoring in any reduction in payload due to the winglets or the wing reinforcement needed to support the winglets. Another factor is does the frame have enough hours/cycles left on it to hope to earn back the money spent on winglets. I honestly don't know the answer.

FX never did put winglets on 757s AFAIK, and IIRC they even removed some off airplanes they acquired that had them, as the STC did not support that configuration.

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