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EIBPI
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EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sat Feb 01, 2020 6:29 pm

US firm Wright Electric is aiming to conduct flight tests of its electric engine concept by 2023. Aerodynamics testing will run parallel to the powerplant design with a planned service entry of 2030. The aircraft would be able to cover routes of up to 300nm.

https://www.flightglobal.com/programmes ... 56.article

Image
 
TObound
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sat Feb 01, 2020 10:26 pm

What's recharge time like? And 300nm is all but useless as more of those routes end up as high speed rail routes.
 
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NYPECO
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:03 pm

Can't we acknowledge that we're making progress instead of calling it useless like every other time an electric aircraft thread comes up?
 
EIBPI
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 12:45 am

TObound wrote:
What's recharge time like? And 300nm is all but useless as more of those routes end up as high speed rail routes.


The expansion of high speed rail in Europe is happening at a glacial pace. Existing rail infrastructure capacity (tracks, stations) could allow for a 3-4% transfer of air passengers to the railway system. Taking into account projects foreseen for completion in the next 10 years, the potential modal shift is barely above 5% at at today's demand levels. Considering air travel growth within Europe has averaged 5-7% annually, those 5% will be almost halved in a decade.

I am a big proponent in high speed rail but believing it is a solution to the carbon problem of air travel is like suggesting a small bandaid for a gunshot wound. For high speed rail to be a viable solution (in the 25+% modal shift range), Europe needs a Chinese style high speed rail projects with 1000s of kilometres new track stretching in all directions, and large stations built in the outskirts of cities. There is no money, political will, or joined up thinking for that to happen.

On the question of aircraft recharge time, I imagine that some manufacturers will propose batteries being offloaded after each flight (for example using baggage type containers). This would also allow the batteries to charged more slowly and at an optimal temperature, prolonging their life.
 
oldJoe
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 1:19 am

NYPECO wrote:
Can't we acknowledge that we're making progress instead of calling it useless like every other time an electric aircraft thread comes up?

It`s the ( far ) future, but a long way to go
 
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Aesma
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 3:25 am

How many of Easyjet flights are less than 300nm ?

I wonder if electric plane companies are not simply banking on batteries getting better and better, trying to have an airframe and engines ready when the batteries are.

What would be really interesting would be a normal ranged airplane, with an hybrid powertrain, but that's much more difficult to achieve.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
Q
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 3:33 am

A long time ago, it is a very similar engine in the wing and it was insufficient flying. They failed to stop flying. I can't recall remembering the name of the aircraft. I think that the new airplane will not able to successful flight at all.

Q
 
Insertnamehere
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 3:50 am

If they can increase the range a factor of 2 or 3 they would have an aircraft that is very competitive for regional fleets in the US and take on a lot of flights in Europe.
 
speedbird52
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 4:11 am

Q wrote:
A long time ago, it is a very similar engine in the wing and it was insufficient flying. They failed to stop flying. I can't recall remembering the name of the aircraft. I think that the new airplane will not able to successful flight at all.

Q

It failed to stop flying???? As in there is an airplane flying around somewhere that has never landed? And could come hunt me down at any given moment?
 
Rossiya747
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 6:10 am

what's up with electric planes and v-tails?
223 319 320 321 332 333 346 388 734 737 738 739 38M 744 752 753 763 764 772 773 77W 788 789 208 CRJ2 E145 E190 UA DL AA WN AC CM 4O AV 2K FI DY D8 SK LH EI FR U2 IB OS LX BA VS BT PS MS SA SW QR EY HY AI 9W TG SQ MH AK D7 QZ BR NH CA QF MI LV/IB VY AL
 
SQ317
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 11:02 am

Aesma wrote:
How many of Easyjet flights are less than 300nm ?

I wonder if electric plane companies are not simply banking on batteries getting better and better, trying to have an airframe and engines ready when the batteries are.

What would be really interesting would be a normal ranged airplane, with an hybrid powertrain, but that's much more difficult to achieve.


I think this is a really valid point - think about how far batteries have come since 2010. The lead time for an airframe is much longer than batteries; the batteries will no doubt go through many iterations between 2023 and 2030.
 
Bostrom
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 11:27 am

TObound wrote:
What's recharge time like? And 300nm is all but useless as more of those routes end up as high speed rail routes.


While it won't replace more than a few A320s/737s, 300 nm is far from useless. I can certainly see a market for it where high speed rail is impossible or expensive due to water or mountains. Like many domestic routes in Norway, routes across the Baltic sea, GRU-GIG, DUB-Great Britain.
 
EIBPI
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 12:18 pm

Bostrom wrote:
TObound wrote:
What's recharge time like? And 300nm is all but useless as more of those routes end up as high speed rail routes.


While it won't replace more than a few A320s/737s, 300 nm is far from useless. I can certainly see a market for it where high speed rail is impossible or expensive due to water or mountains. Like many domestic routes in Norway, routes across the Baltic sea, GRU-GIG, DUB-Great Britain.


Even in cases where high speed rail is viable, there has to be infrastructure capacity to provide it. That is not the case today in most of Europe, with railway lines and stations operating far beyond design capacity and new projects advancing very slowly.
 
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Lingon
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 1:02 pm

Rossiya747 wrote:
what's up with electric planes and v-tails?


AFAIK, one reason to put in on electric planes (or any plane) is to reduce drag and thus get a little more range. But I am not an aerospace engineer... and the cynic in me can't help to think that the main purpose to have a V tail aircraft in these kind of pictures is for the futuristic look (read: marketing) ...
 
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nighthawk
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 1:06 pm

Bostrom wrote:

While it won't replace more than a few A320s/737s, 300 nm is far from useless. I can certainly see a market for it where high speed rail is impossible or expensive due to water or mountains. Like many domestic routes in Norway, routes across the Baltic sea, GRU-GIG, DUB-Great Britain.


[/quote]

The UK alone is a huge market for short range electric aircraft. Not just out of Dublin to Great Britain, but also Belfast, Isle of Man, The Channel Islands etc. Newcastle/Amsterdam isnt going to be replaced by high speed rail anytime soon, so add in flights from the regions to the continent. And HS2 isnt going to kick in properly (if at all) for at least 20-30 years, so still plenty of demand domestically too. That alone is a market for around a hundred of these aircraft. Plenty of other places in Europe where a similar aircraft could succeed too where direct high speed rail links dont exist and transfer times are lengthy.

Lets not forget this is just version 1. Once it's built and in service, it will quickly lead to refinements in the technology, boosting the range and reducing production costs. It's a good job the Wright brothers didnt have the same mentality back in the day as many on here - "no point flying just the two of us... what we need is a 440 passenger aircraft with range to cross the oceans. Lets hold off until we can build something bigger."
 
GibbonUK
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 2:22 pm

I don't mean to 'rain on the parade' here, but batteries will need to move on somewhat before this becomes viable.

Don't get me wrong, I applaud EasyJet here for actively seeking an alternative . From me very limited knowledge, it is only EasyJet that I've ever heard of that is dedicating money to this. I think Harbour Air in Canada are also chasing electric planes, but as I understand they do short bay-hops, is that right?

Anyhoo, the power and resources that go into Battery manufacture is itself a large energy consuming exercise . Then add in the electricity generation required to power not only the alleged motor car revolution, but now the aircraft revolution. It's no good parking a few old 737's and 320's in a desert if 30 coal power stations are needed to re-charge LHR!

I do believe the future of air travel relies on technology, advancement and innovation, rather than suppression of freedoms. It just requires us to have patience and innovate rather than be screamed at by the great unwashed!
 
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Dahlgardo
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 2:43 pm

Nothing more than free publicity and spin to boost "green image".

Big electric powered planes are decades away, and battery technology needs more than a quantum leap to be a credible alternative both in terms of energy density and reliability.
And good luck getting them certified with the firehazards of the current battery technology.

How many kilos of batteries did that electric DHC-2 need to drag around to support a 750hp engine.
Can't recall, but it was a lot, and the range was not very impressive.
leave your nines at home and bring your skills to the battle
 
dtw2hyd
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 3:08 pm

What is the seat capacity?

Hot swap battery packs maybe the way to go.
All posts are just opinions.
 
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Aesma
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 3:30 pm

V-tail is for drag. If there are many small engines then you don't have the problems caused by the loss of an engine in a twin, so no need for a large rudder.

My idea for an hybrid powertrain is a regular jet engine, with a motor/generator on the fan. We already have the generator part with the 787 engines. Add a battery that will allow the aircraft to take off and climb, either only on electric power, or with both electric power and jet fuel, but in both cases allowing for the jet engines to be smaller, just big enough for cruise power. And more optimised.

Then during the descent, you can generate some electricity back and store it in the battery.

This should allow significant jet fuel savings without compromise on range.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
AKL321NX
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 3:47 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Nothing more than free publicity and spin to boost "green image".

Big electric powered planes are decades away, and battery technology needs more than a quantum leap to be a credible alternative both in terms of energy density and reliability.


Your first sentence is entirely contradicted by your second
 
Dominion301
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 5:15 pm

Dahlgardo wrote:
Nothing more than free publicity and spin to boost "green image".

Big electric powered planes are decades away, and battery technology needs more than a quantum leap to be a credible alternative both in terms of energy density and reliability.
And good luck getting them certified with the firehazards of the current battery technology.

How many kilos of batteries did that electric DHC-2 need to drag around to support a 750hp engine.
Can't recall, but it was a lot, and the range was not very impressive.


Harbour air doesn’t need impressive range for their ops. Given they naysayer attitude we see here about electric propulsion in the early days of electric flight, I’d imagine are the same people that said the same thing about flying period 110 years ago.
 
argentinevol98
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 6:08 pm

Let's all remember that the Wright 1903 Flyer's longest ever flight went a whopping 852 feet and lasted 59 seconds. Pretty useless for just about any real purpose, right? The point is that it is a start and a step in the right direction. We're a long way off but we have an impetus to make progress so let's not get too caught up in the "now" of electric airliners and focus more on the future (long-term).
"He sospechado alguna vez que la única cosa sin misterio es la felicidad, porque se justifica por sí sola"-Jorge Luis Borges
 
YYZLGA
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 6:23 pm

There's an enormous amount being invested in battery technology these days, and there are considerable advances every year. It makes perfect sense to have airframe and engine designs available for when battery technology advances to the point where it is feasible.
 
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Dahlgardo
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 6:26 pm

AKL321NX wrote:
Dahlgardo wrote:
Nothing more than free publicity and spin to boost "green image".

Big electric powered planes are decades away, and battery technology needs more than a quantum leap to be a credible alternative both in terms of energy density and reliability.


Your first sentence is entirely contradicted by your second


Sorry if the sentence was unclear.
My point was that Easyjet associates themselves with this "future aircraft" only to boost their green image, not because they are ever going to fly this thing.
Secondly, I believe that battery technology is a very very long way from being practical and safe for use in large commercial aircraft.
I think it will be at least 30+ years, if ever, before that happens. A revolution in battery technology is required.

I think there would be much more gain in development and reasearch in sustainable fossil fuels.

Dominion301 wrote:
Harbour air doesn’t need impressive range for their ops. Given they naysayer attitude we see here about electric propulsion in the early days of electric flight, I’d imagine are the same people that said the same thing about flying period 110 years ago.


I'm not saying electric propulsion doesn't have a future, only that it is a very long way out from being practical/safe/meaningfull.
leave your nines at home and bring your skills to the battle
 
Breathe
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 6:32 pm

Is this a new project or a contiunation of the EcoJet concept they came up with over a decade ago?

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... y.business
 
airnorth
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 7:20 pm

Interesting video on YouTube from the Canadian press on the Harbour Air Electric Plane:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdLa0PdCB5w

They interview both the CEO from Harbour Air and Magnix, they discuss the number of worldwide flights under 500 miles, and under 100 miles. I found the info they have to be quite an eye opener!.

Regarding the batteries, if I recall correctly, somewhere there is an interview with Greg McDougall, Harbour Air CEO where he describes the batteries they used in the test flight as being similar to the ones used by NASA, very heavy, but also very fail safe, which they needed to convince Transport Canada to allow this flight testing to go ahead. Sorry I cannot find that interview or article right now.
Anyway, here are a couple of entrepreneurs, who along with their teams, are convinced that electric planes are not only possible, but commercially viable, and they are putting their own money, and possibly reputation behind it. I think it is really amazing, hoping nothing but success.
 
frmrCapCadet
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:28 pm

Battery revolutions are happening almost on a monthly basis now. The thing that saves Teslas is that their older batteries are still good. But next years will be better. Harbor Air is looking at sub 100 mile flights. Soon! Now we have someone looking at sub 300 mile flights. Sounds possible.

The perpetual problem with rail transit is capital and maintenance costs. Tracks, switching, signaling, as well as operating equipment. And safety for those on the train and those who have to cross the tracks. Planes and autonomous vehicles on grade separated highways present formidable alternatives. And I am a rail fan.
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
spacecookie
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:49 pm

Balearic island and canary island have very short hops, even some hops to the mainland in the Balearic Islands would be in the range
 
SQ317
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:46 pm

GibbonUK wrote:
I don't mean to 'rain on the parade' here, but batteries will need to move on somewhat before this becomes viable.

Don't get me wrong, I applaud EasyJet here for actively seeking an alternative . From me very limited knowledge, it is only EasyJet that I've ever heard of that is dedicating money to this. I think Harbour Air in Canada are also chasing electric planes, but as I understand they do short bay-hops, is that right?

Anyhoo, the power and resources that go into Battery manufacture is itself a large energy consuming exercise . Then add in the electricity generation required to power not only the alleged motor car revolution, but now the aircraft revolution. It's no good parking a few old 737's and 320's in a desert if 30 coal power stations are needed to re-charge LHR!

I do believe the future of air travel relies on technology, advancement and innovation, rather than suppression of freedoms. It just requires us to have patience and innovate rather than be screamed at by the great unwashed!


Sorry but the whole 30 coal power stations needed for EVs myth is just that.. a myth.. as mentioned up thread the batteries will likely be swappable and charged at a low power to maintain battery health and minimise peak usage utility charges. And most short haul planes won't be flying overnight, and so charging, when grid demand is lowest.
 
ewt340
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:01 pm

300 nm range is pretty small BUT it's realistic.

Also, the fact that they could get 186 seats aircraft flying using electric is extremely impressive.

It means that A320 size aircraft goes electric. If they created a smaller one, like 80-90 seats version, they could get the range to 600nm-700nm. Which is the similar to ATR72.
 
peterinlisbon
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:52 pm

Where this is going to have a big impact is in areas where it makes sense to fly short distances - for example island nations like Maldives and mountainous countries like Nepal or Costa Rica. It will make it much cheaper and easier to fly in 30 minutes rather than take a 10 hour bus/boat ride because the economics of these aircraft are much better.

I just got back from Myanmar and this country has terrible roads - it took 12 hours by bus (15$) to go from Inle to Yangon, which is a distance of about 300 miles, which would take less than an hour by plane (100$). This small and relatively unknown country has something about 10 different airlines, all flying multiple turboprop aircraft all over the country. So there would be demand in many parts of the world for a cheaper and quieter regional aircraft that can fly what we consider short distances.
 
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Aesma
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 11:09 pm

For the first years of aviation many people didn't believe it was real, then didn't believe it had any future. Then it was only marginally useful. It took decades to come on its own.

But that's not a good comparison with electric planes, because now we're not talking about a revolution, just using existing or expectable technology to do something not really new, just different.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
Palop
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Sun Feb 02, 2020 11:13 pm

300 nm range would be impressive and useful. The big question is what is the recharge time after this hop. If it is hours and no swapping of batteries, then it will be a no go as utilization will be too low. Get the turnaround time down to 1 hour, and no we’re talking.
 
ewt340
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Mon Feb 03, 2020 1:02 am

I mean, in terms of distance. There are many major routes with such short range.

London to Amsterdam, Brussels, Dublin, Manchester, Paris.
Seoul to Busan, Jeju.
NYC to Boston, Baltimore, DC, Philadelphia.
Dallas to Austin, Houston, San Antonio.

And many domestic flights across hundreds of countries.
 
Dominion301
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Mon Feb 03, 2020 1:54 am

Dahlgardo wrote:
AKL321NX wrote:
Dahlgardo wrote:
Nothing more than free publicity and spin to boost "green image".

Big electric powered planes are decades away, and battery technology needs more than a quantum leap to be a credible alternative both in terms of energy density and reliability.


Your first sentence is entirely contradicted by your second


Sorry if the sentence was unclear.
My point was that Easyjet associates themselves with this "future aircraft" only to boost their green image, not because they are ever going to fly this thing.
Secondly, I believe that battery technology is a very very long way from being practical and safe for use in large commercial aircraft.
I think it will be at least 30+ years, if ever, before that happens. A revolution in battery technology is required.

I think there would be much more gain in development and reasearch in sustainable fossil fuels.

Dominion301 wrote:
Harbour air doesn’t need impressive range for their ops. Given they naysayer attitude we see here about electric propulsion in the early days of electric flight, I’d imagine are the same people that said the same thing about flying period 110 years ago.


I'm not saying electric propulsion doesn't have a future, only that it is a very long way out from being practical/safe/meaningfull.


Which is why Harbour Air is the perfect airline to take this on/lead the “charge”. Most of their routes are under 200 km and they’re on floats, so your landing options are plentiful in an emergency. The thing is an electric engine, even as a new technology, likely has a far lower risk of failure given how few parts it takes for the thing to work...electric cars being a case in point vs ICEs.
 
airzona11
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Mon Feb 03, 2020 4:39 am

TObound wrote:
What's recharge time like? And 300nm is all but useless as more of those routes end up as high speed rail routes.


Should we place bets on what comes first?

But in all seriousness, this type of flying isn’t a 1for1 replacement. This can open up some many regional markets. That’ll be the game change.
 
pune
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 1:31 am

I had to figure out that 300nm meant nautical miles instead of nanometers ;)

Onto more serious matters though, as far as safety and density is concerned, how does graphene sound. Just search for 'Real Graphene powerbank' and you shall see how quick the density is going up. Also read up stories such as these on wired https://www.wired.com/story/welcome-to- ... batteries/ . Li-on tesla are shaking up energy markets worldwide whereever they are entering https://www.solarquotes.com.au/blog/aem ... ty-prices/ .

If off-shore wind-farming were to be a reality in India, we would be a world producer. https://electrek.co/2020/02/17/egeb-bri ... -illinois/ . 3 of 4 parts of India have sea as a frontier. My simple point is this, lots of things are happening and moving. Also tesla is investing in prismatic batteries which are cobalt-free . With even forbes coming around to the tune that this is going to transform industries https://www.forbes.com/sites/robday/201 ... ndustries/ it would take somebody who has an ostrich attitude to see that things are not going to remain the same.

Just to put salt on wounds, there was also the news of Airbus E Fan X although even it will be a limited plane.

To add to this, I'm sure somebody is inventing/engineering the next lithium, graphene 'designer material' in his/her lab right now as we need it and they stand to profit by it.
 
Ziyulu
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 1:38 am

Be perfect for AA's AUS to DFW.
 
speedbird52
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 1:42 am

TObound wrote:
What's recharge time like? And 300nm is all but useless as more of those routes end up as high speed rail routes.

High speed rail is unheard of in most of the US, and there are quite a few 300nm routes that could be usable in the short term. Long term the technology will obviously be improving. This is a really good development for aviation and our planet.
 
speedbird52
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 1:46 am

SQ317 wrote:
GibbonUK wrote:
I don't mean to 'rain on the parade' here, but batteries will need to move on somewhat before this becomes viable.

Don't get me wrong, I applaud EasyJet here for actively seeking an alternative . From me very limited knowledge, it is only EasyJet that I've ever heard of that is dedicating money to this. I think Harbour Air in Canada are also chasing electric planes, but as I understand they do short bay-hops, is that right?

Anyhoo, the power and resources that go into Battery manufacture is itself a large energy consuming exercise . Then add in the electricity generation required to power not only the alleged motor car revolution, but now the aircraft revolution. It's no good parking a few old 737's and 320's in a desert if 30 coal power stations are needed to re-charge LHR!

I do believe the future of air travel relies on technology, advancement and innovation, rather than suppression of freedoms. It just requires us to have patience and innovate rather than be screamed at by the great unwashed!


Sorry but the whole 30 coal power stations needed for EVs myth is just that.. a myth.. as mentioned up thread the batteries will likely be swappable and charged at a low power to maintain battery health and minimise peak usage utility charges. And most short haul planes won't be flying overnight, and so charging, when grid demand is lowest.

My state of Washington currently has a grand total of one coal power plant, and its set for closure very soon. Really nobody needs coal power plants.
 
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ER757
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 2:11 am

300 nm is certainly a useful range, as has been stated above, there are many existing routes of this length or less. But.....the majority of those flights are the realm of the turboprop or small regional jet these days. Not sure how many need the capacity of this plane (186 seats). Perhaps they should think smaller and that would also increase range. For an aircraft this size, useful range would need to be in the 500-1000 nm range at least to be a viable alternative to 737/A320 type markets
 
planecane
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 3:15 am

SQ317 wrote:
Aesma wrote:
How many of Easyjet flights are less than 300nm ?

I wonder if electric plane companies are not simply banking on batteries getting better and better, trying to have an airframe and engines ready when the batteries are.

What would be really interesting would be a normal ranged airplane, with an hybrid powertrain, but that's much more difficult to achieve.


I think this is a really valid point - think about how far batteries have come since 2010. The lead time for an airframe is much longer than batteries; the batteries will no doubt go through many iterations between 2023 and 2030.

They've gotten a lot cheaper but I don't think there's been any great leap in energy density.

Research seems to be in looking at lithium air batteries to reduce weight. However, those are nowhere near ready.
 
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JetBuddy
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 3:32 am

Graphene batteries are becoming available now, some are in production and available to the public.
 
uta999
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 3:39 am

A hybrid would be far better in terms of safety, at least initially. Think about the bad weather, go-arounds and diversions recently in the UK and EU. Some flights ended up returning to their departure airport. That would cut the useful range down to 150 miles!
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f4f3a
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 6:25 am

This is just PR rubbish just like their eco jet proposal a few years ago!
 
Boeing74741R
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 8:52 am

TObound wrote:
What's recharge time like? And 300nm is all but useless as more of those routes end up as high speed rail routes.


BFS, IOM and JER are three places that come to mind on the easyJet network that are out of the question for high speed rail anytime soon for obvious reasons. From these three airports at least, there are a number of sub-300nm routes served by easyJet that would be ideal routes to trial this aircraft on.
 
columba
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 11:20 am

Looks like the De Haviland Comet 2.0..............
It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
 
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SomebodyInTLS
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 12:43 pm

uta999 wrote:
A hybrid would be far better in terms of safety, at least initially. Think about the bad weather, go-arounds and diversions recently in the UK and EU. Some flights ended up returning to their departure airport. That would cut the useful range down to 150 miles!


A hybrid would have all the disadvantages of complexity and lugging around extra equipment (weight and space). This is bad enough on ground vehicles, let alone aircraft - look at Toyota who should once have been applauded for kicking-off consumer-level electrification, but their flip to the obnoxious "self-charging hybrid" marketing strategy is new management desperately trying to keep engine manufacturing going... they deliberately fool the public to keep paying more than necessary in fuel costs, maintenance costs and heavier cars. My point is that as EVs are already the best option for ground vehicles, pure electric will obviously hold the most benefit for aviation too.
"As with most things related to aircraft design, it's all about the trade-offs and much more nuanced than A.net likes to make out."
 
ewt340
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 2:42 pm

I mean, it's a start. Their goal would probably increased the range to at least 500nmi. Then they could start big with 1000nmi.
 
frmrCapCadet
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Re: EasyJet Electric Aircraft: Engine Test by 2023, Aircraft in Service 2030

Wed Mar 04, 2020 3:15 pm

A 300 mile range would connect most of the small towns in 'flyover' country to a major/regional airport. I see 20-50 passenger, one pilot electric planes changing the economics of living in more isolated areas. Likely they would operate like our Washington State ferries - if a medical passenger needs immediate service the hell with schedule. And no one complains. They also do most of the marine emergencies in the central Puget Sound. Even stop for quicky burial services (cremains only!). Travel, normal medical, emergency ambulance, package cargo, tourism, AirBnB all fit well as a package.
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