p468
Topic Author
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Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:10 am

VS are to announce new routes this week, for their W20 schedule.
With the leisure config A350s due to join their fleet this year and A330neos due in 2021. Wonder what routes they’ll announce. Would Flybe have an effect you reckon?

They launched TLV, BOM last year and GRU due to start in March…. Any thoughts on what their new routes maybe?
Given VS' baby sister Virgin Australia have stopped HKG to SYD, would VS come back to this route and fill the void, would love to see the A340-600 back at SYD, or maybe they'll re-launch this route with the A350 given the better economics
 
Ishrion
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:14 am

Likely the ones apart of their “84 route expansion”

https://www.virgin.com/news/virgin-atla ... n-heathrow
 
Boeing74741R
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:38 am

p468 wrote:
VS are to announce new routes this week, for their W20 schedule.
With the leisure config A350s due to join their fleet this year and A330neos due in 2021. Wonder what routes they’ll announce. Would Flybe have an effect you reckon?

They launched TLV, BOM last year and GRU due to start in March…. Any thoughts on what their new routes maybe?
Given VS' baby sister Virgin Australia have stopped HKG to SYD, would VS come back to this route and fill the void, would love to see the A340-600 back at SYD, or maybe they'll re-launch this route with the A350 given the better economics


Without knowing what the utilisation rate is of their aircraft in the winter months, a quick win would to be make year-round some of the seasonal routes such as MAN-LAX or launch more Caribbean routes from MAN that have been unserved since Thomas Cook's demise or now entirely in the hands of TUI.

I can't see SYD coming back. The reasons about tying up aircraft for 2-3 days away from base remain valid and I'm not sure if the route is lucrative enough for them to justify re-entering the market. If it was that fruitful they would have explored ways to keep it going in much the same way BA did when they swapped their SYD route to a 777 with Mixed Fleet crew. Time will also tell whether the Coronavirus outbreak impacts HKG - if that impacts traffic to/from HKG then it will be a challenge to use SYD traffic to make up for it.

I'm also unsure where the aircraft are going to come from to be able to launch lots of new routes. The A350's and incoming A330neo's are for fleet replacement and the numbers on firm order seen to indicate they will replace the remaining A340's and 747's (plus the A330-200/300's) like-for-like, which doesn't provide much room for growth without cutting something else or holding onto older aircraft for longer.
 
Luisvalero
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:09 am

Maybe VS could fill the gap that is pulling out Garuda on LHR-CGK. also i see as a clear candidate ACC
 
Clackers
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:21 am

Phuket was rumoured a while back wasn't it?

Anyway I would jump on a limb and say either BOG or DAR.
 
Guillaume787
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:19 am

Tokyo Narita? Tokyo is mentioned in their press release and Narita has introduced an incentive program to attract new routes. They will offer free landing fees for any new route of greater than 7,000 km distance to a destination not yet served from Narita.
 
Arion640
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:33 am

Capetown, Tokyo, Vancouver, Toronto or Chicago are the obvious ones that spring to mind.

Could just be more routes from MAN though.
1973-2020
 
A330Inter
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:01 pm

Can they grow on the UK-India market? Second daily to India from LHR and try BOM-MAN? Wasn't 9W launching the route just before collapsing?
 
skipness1E
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:08 pm

Arion640 wrote:
Capetown, Tokyo, Vancouver, Toronto or Chicago are the obvious ones that spring to mind.

Could just be more routes from MAN though.

They've just pulled LHR-CPT as they couldn't make it work for them and was adding little to the JV.
NRT was pulled and as won't be resumed until they can get into HND as BA/JL/NH hold that as a competitive advantage. YVR/YYZ as well as ORD are STAR or ONEWORLD dominant and have all failed in recent years, although YYZ is going back quite some way.
Recent new routes have been more strategic rather than going for a big London market and trying to cherry pick, the strength of feed at the other end killed that notion with BA/AA dominating ORD and AC dominating Canada.

LHR-CGK is not a gap that needs filled by anyone, it's served by the ME3 and no one is going to pay a premium in that market to fly direct.
LHR-ACC ran from 2010S to 2013S on the A343 up to 5 weekly but not sure conditions have improved enough to warrant a return.
LHR-CPT was dropped end of 2014W and has also seen SA drop it for different reasons. BA fares are high on the B744 but do VS really want to park all day in South Africa given their lack of available aircraft?

All of their loyal business travellers to NRT will have jumped ship to NH or BA/JL hwen they closed Japan back in 2014W,and so starting again at a secondary Tokyo airport isn't going to be as profitable as we might think IMHO.
 
jfk777
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:20 pm

Arion640 wrote:
Capetown, Tokyo, Vancouver, Toronto or Chicago are the obvious ones that spring to mind.

Could just be more routes from MAN though.


Chicago has been tried several times, it's controlled by AA & UA with huge frequencies in the market. Not going to happen.

Toronto might work if Virgin could make a deal with Westjet.

Tokyo would be a great market if Haneda was the airport and an A350 flew the route.

Capetown is too seasonal, a great destination for many bu not Virgin.
 
Boeing74741R
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:23 pm

skipness1E wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
Capetown, Tokyo, Vancouver, Toronto or Chicago are the obvious ones that spring to mind.

Could just be more routes from MAN though.

They've just pulled LHR-CPT as they couldn't make it work for them and was adding little to the JV.
NRT was pulled and as won't be resumed until they can get into HND as BA/JL/NH hold that as a competitive advantage. YVR/YYZ as well as ORD are STAR or ONEWORLD dominant and have all failed in recent years, although YYZ is going back quite some way.
Recent new routes have been more strategic rather than going for a big London market and trying to cherry pick, the strength of feed at the other end killed that notion with BA/AA dominating ORD and AC dominating Canada.

LHR-CGK is not a gap that needs filled by anyone, it's served by the ME3 and no one is going to pay a premium in that market to fly direct.
LHR-ACC ran from 2010S to 2013S on the A343 up to 5 weekly but not sure conditions have improved enough to warrant a return.
LHR-CPT was dropped end of 2014W and has also seen SA drop it for different reasons. BA fares are high on the B744 but do VS really want to park all day in South Africa given their lack of available aircraft?

All of their loyal business travellers to NRT will have jumped ship to NH or BA/JL hwen they closed Japan back in 2014W,and so starting again at a secondary Tokyo airport isn't going to be as profitable as we might think IMHO.


YYZ was dropped in the aftermath of 9/11 if I'm not mistaken. The only way I can see VS returning to YYZ is if they're confident they can fill it profitably with both O&D traffic as well as connecting traffic from other VS flights into LHR plus whatever they can operate with Flybe/Virgin Connect, as it's well-served from London. I know it's since been dropped too, but I would say VS operating YVR for a while over having a second attempt at YYZ says a lot.

A330Inter wrote:
Can they grow on the UK-India market? Second daily to India from LHR and try BOM-MAN? Wasn't 9W launching the route just before collapsing?


Jet Airways launched MAN-BOM which operated for a couple of months last winter before it was pulled when their financial problems were taking root. They provided some feed to VS flights from MAN which could be filled, but then there's the question of what (if anything) feeds this flight at the BOM end if O&D traffic/onward connecting traffic at the MAN end isn't enough?
 
BOAC1966
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:30 pm

I think the wise move is do more with what you have ......too many carriers and businesses generally little myopic with their constant belief you must expand .....if what you got is viable consider staying there!
 
Arion640
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:34 pm

skipness1E wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
Capetown, Tokyo, Vancouver, Toronto or Chicago are the obvious ones that spring to mind.

Could just be more routes from MAN though.

They've just pulled LHR-CPT as they couldn't make it work for them and was adding little to the JV.
NRT was pulled and as won't be resumed until they can get into HND as BA/JL/NH hold that as a competitive advantage. YVR/YYZ as well as ORD are STAR or ONEWORLD dominant and have all failed in recent years, although YYZ is going back quite some way.
Recent new routes have been more strategic rather than going for a big London market and trying to cherry pick, the strength of feed at the other end killed that notion with BA/AA dominating ORD and AC dominating Canada.

LHR-CGK is not a gap that needs filled by anyone, it's served by the ME3 and no one is going to pay a premium in that market to fly direct.
LHR-ACC ran from 2010S to 2013S on the A343 up to 5 weekly but not sure conditions have improved enough to warrant a return.
LHR-CPT was dropped end of 2014W and has also seen SA drop it for different reasons. BA fares are high on the B744 but do VS really want to park all day in South Africa given their lack of available aircraft?

All of their loyal business travellers to NRT will have jumped ship to NH or BA/JL hwen they closed Japan back in 2014W,and so starting again at a secondary Tokyo airport isn't going to be as profitable as we might think IMHO.


I really can’t see any other routes they might pick up from LHR to be honest unless it’s to the US somewhere. Something new from MAN to a current London destination is always possible.

Just because a route was dropped 6-7 years ago, it doesn’t mean it can’t be picked up again now. BA have just returned to pakistan, so stranger things have happened.
1973-2020
 
Galwayman
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:54 pm

If GRU is a success ( they’ve already cancelled some of the flights ),GIG must be on the cards to tie into Delta’s LATAM strategy . And Mexico City ( again driven by Delta) ... all good grown up destinations and less bucket and spade stuff hopefully
 
dfdubflyer
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:58 pm

The safest add would probably be a US city with a strong DL FF bade where they would only be competing with BA RDU for instance
 
jfk777
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 1:08 pm

dfdubflyer wrote:
The safest add would probably be a US city with a strong DL FF bade where they would only be competing with BA RDU for instance


RDU is already flown by AA with a 777 daily from Heathrow. Can't see a second flight in such a niche market, even a 767 would be too much capacity.
 
Clackers
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 3:04 pm

Routes that would almost certainly work for VS with the right aircraft (A350), especially for their leisure travellers:

Africa: DAR, SEZ, CPT, HRE
Middle East: MCT
Subcontinent: BLR, MAA, HYD, CCU, KTM
SE Asia: BKK, HKT, SGN, DAD
Far East: HND, CTS, ICN
 
FLYKTPA
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 3:08 pm

They have slots laying around to make considerable additions at LHR?

Maybe this will be more of a MAN expansion?
Huge fan of Tampa International Airport
 
NZ321
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:02 pm

Clackers wrote:
Routes that would almost certainly work for VS with the right aircraft (A350), especially for their leisure travellers:

Africa: DAR, SEZ, CPT, HRE
Middle East: MCT
Subcontinent: BLR, MAA, HYD, CCU, KTM
SE Asia: BKK, HKT, SGN, DAD
Far East: HND, CTS, ICN


I would suggest that for VS, the A350-1000 is too much metal on these routes with the possible exception of CPT, BLR, BKK and HND.There's no way it would fill enough seats and yields to DAR, SEZ, HRE, MAA, CCU, KTM, HKT, SGN, DAD, CTS or ICN to make it worthwhile. 333 maybe on some of these routes.
Plane mad!
 
dfdubflyer
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:27 pm

jfk777 wrote:
dfdubflyer wrote:
The safest add would probably be a US city with a strong DL FF bade where they would only be competing with BA RDU for instance


RDU is already flown by AA with a 777 daily from Heathrow. Can't see a second flight in such a niche market, even a 767 would be too much capacity.


Well I think they would want to avoid creating three-way bloodbaths with OW/Star if possible, so where else could they go in America and only face one competitor where DL is also strong? They have a 'boutique' presence in the UK to put it nicely with their limited network.
 
Ishrion
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:36 pm

dfdubflyer wrote:
jfk777 wrote:
dfdubflyer wrote:
The safest add would probably be a US city with a strong DL FF bade where they would only be competing with BA RDU for instance


RDU is already flown by AA with a 777 daily from Heathrow. Can't see a second flight in such a niche market, even a 767 would be too much capacity.


Well I think they would want to avoid creating three-way bloodbaths with OW/Star if possible, so where else could they go in America and only face one competitor where DL is also strong? They have a 'boutique' presence in the UK to put it nicely with their limited network.


SLC/DTW have no competition to LON.
 
x1234
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:40 pm

Maybe a return to Mexico from LHR/LGW? There is definetly demand for CUN & MEX with MEX currently being served by AeroMexico in SkyTeam.
 
LH658
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:42 pm

ISB, LHE, BLR, CMB, MLE, SEZ, EZE, PTY, and KHI.
 
Caluma350
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:48 pm

x1234 wrote:
Maybe a return to Mexico from LHR/LGW? There is definetly demand for CUN & MEX with MEX currently being served by AeroMexico in SkyTeam.


They only just stopped flying to CUN last year so its unlikely they would go back so soon.
 
GSP psgr
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:51 pm

skipness1E wrote:

LHR-CGK is not a gap that needs filled by anyone, it's served by the ME3 and no one is going to pay a premium in that market to fly direct.
LHR-ACC ran from 2010S to 2013S on the A343 up to 5 weekly but not sure conditions have improved enough to warrant a return.
LHR-CPT was dropped end of 2014W and has also seen SA drop it for different reasons. BA fares are high on the B744 but do VS really want to park all day in South Africa given their lack of available aircraft?

All of their loyal business travellers to NRT will have jumped ship to NH or BA/JL hwen they closed Japan back in 2014W,and so starting again at a secondary Tokyo airport isn't going to be as profitable as we might think IMHO.


They could try LHR-CPT using the same schedule that KL use for their AMS-CPT/JNB rotations-a morning departure that almost immediately turns around as a redeye back from South Africa which is much better aircraft utilization.

As far as South Africa, I also wonder if there's something of a market for MAN-JNB?
 
BigOrange
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:51 pm

MAN-SEA?
 
TC957
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:09 pm

MAN - MIA is surely in the pot here. Plus a summer seasonal LHR - YVR and winter seasonal return to LHR - CPT to break BA's sky-high fares on these routes. MAN - DEL has merits too, given it was announced by Jet Airways last year. A winter seasonal MAN - JNB could work too. Much as I would love to VS see back in Tokyo, as mentioned already they've lost the business traveller on this route to rivals and with the Olympics over by the time VS could restart the route, they should have restarted Tokyo a year ago.
 
Whiteguy
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:12 pm

jfk777 wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
Capetown, Tokyo, Vancouver, Toronto or Chicago are the obvious ones that spring to mind.

Could just be more routes from MAN though.


Chicago has been tried several times, it's controlled by AA & UA with huge frequencies in the market. Not going to happen.

Toronto might work if Virgin could make a deal with Westjet.

Tokyo would be a great market if Haneda was the airport and an A350 flew the route.

Capetown is too seasonal, a great destination for many bu not Virgin.


Virgin already made a deal with WS back in Nov to codeshare on many flights in Canada through YYZ, YYC, YHZ & YVR.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:12 pm

Ishrion wrote:
dfdubflyer wrote:
jfk777 wrote:

RDU is already flown by AA with a 777 daily from Heathrow. Can't see a second flight in such a niche market, even a 767 would be too much capacity.


Well I think they would want to avoid creating three-way bloodbaths with OW/Star if possible, so where else could they go in America and only face one competitor where DL is also strong? They have a 'boutique' presence in the UK to put it nicely with their limited network.


SLC/DTW have no competition to LON.


And VS already has the JV with Delta, so what's the point of SLC or DTW? It doesn't expand the network.
 
by738
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:21 pm

anything from GLA. Slow steady MCO expansion and some Caribbean was previously rumoured.
 
Ishrion
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:27 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
Ishrion wrote:
dfdubflyer wrote:

Well I think they would want to avoid creating three-way bloodbaths with OW/Star if possible, so where else could they go in America and only face one competitor where DL is also strong? They have a 'boutique' presence in the UK to put it nicely with their limited network.


SLC/DTW have no competition to LON.


And VS already has the JV with Delta, so what's the point of SLC or DTW? It doesn't expand the network.


Replacing a frequency? Complimenting Delta’s existing service? (More unlikely).

Did anyone ever say it had to expand the network? It would expand VS’ own network but not the JV as a whole.
 
BWA900
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:40 pm

GLA- BGI
LHR- ACC
MAN- MIA
Flown: A300 A319 A320 A321 A333 A343 A359 A388 AT72 AT76 B712 B735 B736 B737 B738 B739 B38M B744 B752 B753 B763 B772ER B772LR B77W B788 B789 CRJ2 CRJ7 CRJ9 DH8A DH8B DH8D E145 E170 E190
 
klakzky123
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:46 pm

Ishrion wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
Ishrion wrote:

SLC/DTW have no competition to LON.


And VS already has the JV with Delta, so what's the point of SLC or DTW? It doesn't expand the network.


Replacing a frequency? Complimenting Delta’s existing service? (More unlikely).

Did anyone ever say it had to expand the network? It would expand VS’ own network but not the JV as a whole.


VS tried DTW in the past and cancelled it. I think DL will continue to fly LHR routes from DL fortress hubs (excluding ATL of course). VS seems to go where there is reasonable LHR originating point of sale.
 
BrianDromey
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:53 pm

VS have tried and failed on most of the routes mentioned, YYZ, ORD, DTW, CUN, BGI, etc. I see BKK mentioned, with remembering that BA only serve that once a day with a 3 class 777. It’s a low-yield route.
 
BWA900
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:55 pm

BrianDromey wrote:
VS have tried and failed on most of the routes mentioned, YYZ, ORD, DTW, CUN, BGI, etc. I see BKK mentioned, with remembering that BA only serve that once a day with a 3 class 777. It’s a low-yield route.


You might want to research that "BGI" part. VS had 4 a/c in BGI this past Saturday. UVF may be what you might be referring to.
Flown: A300 A319 A320 A321 A333 A343 A359 A388 AT72 AT76 B712 B735 B736 B737 B738 B739 B38M B744 B752 B753 B763 B772ER B772LR B77W B788 B789 CRJ2 CRJ7 CRJ9 DH8A DH8B DH8D E145 E170 E190
 
shankly
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:59 pm

Would love to see VS back at CPT if only to stir up the BA monopoly. A shiny A350 would be lovely! However, VS is run less emotively these days, so my head says no to CPT, when adding to the existing JNB set up (perhaps, as noted, from MAN), plus local feed can probably do the trick.
L1011 - P F M
 
NateGreat
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:07 pm

p468 wrote:
VS are to announce new routes this week, for their W20 schedule.
With the leisure config A350s due to join their fleet this year and A330neos due in 2021. Wonder what routes they’ll announce. Would Flybe have an effect you reckon?

They launched TLV, BOM last year and GRU due to start in March…. Any thoughts on what their new routes maybe?
Given VS' baby sister Virgin Australia have stopped HKG to SYD, would VS come back to this route and fill the void, would love to see the A340-600 back at SYD, or maybe they'll re-launch this route with the A350 given the better economics

Any idea what the leisure config will be, in comparison to the LHR based A350s?
 
CaliguyNYC
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:29 pm

Would like to see MAN-BOM (to replace the Jet flight that operated) and LHR-BOM double daily (Jet flew the route 3X per day). Btw VS moved their LHR-BOM flight from a morning departure to a night departure xLHR for the summer season. For winter 2020, the flight still shows with the old morning LHR departure. What gives with that? Are they moving the flight back to the morning or with this update, the flight time will change to night departure?
 
YouGeeElWhy
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:57 pm

I don't think Daddy Delta is going to let them expand westward (so no Americas... AUS/DEN/MEX would be an excellent VS type add otherwise) nor at MAN. If they grow from LHR, it would need to be Asia or Africa. NBO/SIN/BLR would be decent adds that complement VS/DL LHR flights. Tokyo seems like a pretty big gap, too, right now for VS.

Also, VS already said where they would expand if the 3rd runway happens at LHR, so suggesting flights not on that list does not make a lot of sense.
 
anstar
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 7:06 pm

Surely CPT could work if they flew it night one way and day the next to increase utilisation - KL do this and seem to do ok. The flights were always chockers and prices sky high.
 
TC957
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 7:07 pm

At the end of the day, VS will expand to wherever DL tell them to, and what's beneficial to DL.
 
YYZORD
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 7:29 pm

LHR-YYZ/YYC is most likely as WS serves LGW and not LHR and they codeshare now.
 
trexel94
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 7:47 pm

Is there a reason why VS is planning DEN service and not MSP? DEN is a Star fortress and already has three airlines to London. We don’t need another carrier on the route. Meanwhile MSP is a DL hub which already has a partnership with VS and MSP has no other airline serving LHR. I would think it would be a no brainer.
 
LondonXtreme
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 7:59 pm

I've heard the rumor that VS is interested in SAN and AUS, BA is doing quite well on these two routes and I believe there's a room for VS to step in.
 
Ishrion
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 8:12 pm

LondonXtreme wrote:
I've heard the rumor that VS is interested in SAN and AUS, BA is doing quite well on these two routes and I believe there's a room for VS to step in.


If it’s Austin, that’ll be pretty insane.

KLM to Amsterdam, Norwegian adding an addition LGW frequency and starting CDG...

Can they sustain a third carrier to London?
 
p468
Topic Author
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 8:44 pm

NateGreat wrote:
p468 wrote:
VS are to announce new routes this week, for their W20 schedule.
With the leisure config A350s due to join their fleet this year and A330neos due in 2021. Wonder what routes they’ll announce. Would Flybe have an effect you reckon?

They launched TLV, BOM last year and GRU due to start in March…. Any thoughts on what their new routes maybe?
Given VS' baby sister Virgin Australia have stopped HKG to SYD, would VS come back to this route and fill the void, would love to see the A340-600 back at SYD, or maybe they'll re-launch this route with the A350 given the better economics

Any idea what the leisure config will be, in comparison to the LHR based A350s?


I stand corrected, according to this article, the lesuire 350s are due to jion the fleet in 21

https://travelingformiles.com/virgin-at ... -aircraft/

If the current 747 config is anything to go by (also quoting the article) should expect 14 J 66 Y and the rest W (240+??) I should imagine
 
rajincajun01
Posts: 725
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2010 2:16 am

Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 8:57 pm

Ishrion wrote:
LondonXtreme wrote:
I've heard the rumor that VS is interested in SAN and AUS, BA is doing quite well on these two routes and I believe there's a room for VS to step in.


If it’s Austin, that’ll be pretty insane.

KLM to Amsterdam, Norwegian adding an addition LGW frequency and starting CDG...

Can they sustain a third carrier to London?


Don’t forget LH to FRA. I think AUS-Europe already has too much capacity.
A319 A320 A321 A332 B1900 B717 B727 B737 B757 B767 B777 B787 CR2 CR7 CRJ9 E120 ERJ135 ERJ145 L1011 MD80 SF340 AvGeek Superstore
 
twicearound
Posts: 160
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2017 2:56 pm

Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:07 pm

p468 wrote:
NateGreat wrote:
p468 wrote:
VS are to announce new routes this week, for their W20 schedule.
With the leisure config A350s due to join their fleet this year and A330neos due in 2021. Wonder what routes they’ll announce. Would Flybe have an effect you reckon?

They launched TLV, BOM last year and GRU due to start in March…. Any thoughts on what their new routes maybe?
Given VS' baby sister Virgin Australia have stopped HKG to SYD, would VS come back to this route and fill the void, would love to see the A340-600 back at SYD, or maybe they'll re-launch this route with the A350 given the better economics

Any idea what the leisure config will be, in comparison to the LHR based A350s?


I stand corrected, according to this article, the lesuire 350s are due to jion the fleet in 21

https://travelingformiles.com/virgin-at ... -aircraft/

If the current 747 config is anything to go by (also quoting the article) should expect 14 J 66 Y and the rest W (240+??) I should imagine


240 premium seats is a bit excessive no?
 
p468
Topic Author
Posts: 12
Joined: Thu Jun 27, 2019 3:08 pm

Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:22 pm

YYZORD wrote:
LHR-YYZ/YYC is most likely as WS serves LGW and not LHR and they codeshare now.


A fair amount of Canadian (and North American) routes mentioned here. YYZ / YYC / YVR... VS as mentioned used to operate to Canada and pulled out 15/20 odd years ago. Code sharing is often a soft-launch to a new route, but if they don't see or get the demand through the codeshare, then I doubt they would launch it.

Let's not forget VS/AF/KL/DL have just announced a cross-Atlantic JV. Revenue from UK + Europe to/from North America (Mexico, USA, Canada) is shared amongst these airlines.

YYZ - VS can serve one stop via JFK / BOS or any other NE DL hub. Or one stop via CDG using their (new) JV partner in crime AF, using either Virgin Connect/BE or AF LHR-CDG-YYZ.
WS operate 8 weekly to LGW.
TS operate 7 weekly to LGW
TS also have a 1 weekly to GLA and twice weekly to MAN. This probably provides low yield capacity - not a good sign for a route.

YYC - again can be served one stop via the USA using DL. Or via AMS using KL, who by the way have a 6/7 weekly service, looks to be a 789 and sometimes a A333 - so you can decipher from that the demand from/to Europe.
WS only have a 3 weekly service to LGW, if the demand is there, they would have operated more frequencies, again already a codeshare partner
AC have a 7 weekly into LHR, mainly on a 767 with a couple 777 rotations. (Broken record) if there's enough demand, doubt AC would only have the 777 on a few odd rotations.
Can't see VS on this route, it feels like something that would work for them on a good old 757 / 767. Their smallest ac is A332 based at LGW/MAN. I'd think their A333 is too much for this thin(er) route... so would doubt it.

YVR - A bit more chunky (in terms of demand) than YYC, but maybe too close to SEA for VS' and DL's liking. Again - could be served via a quick hop from SEA with DL, or any other US hub. Or one stop via Europe using their partners in crime (AF/KL)
KL operate a 3 weekly on a A330-2/3 (AMS)
AF operate 3 weekly on a 777 (CDG) - (surprise here on the days KL don't operate)
Then from the competition you have:
BA daily 744 to LHR
AC daily 777 to LHR
I'd say YVR would be the most likely Canadian candidate if the direct frequencies and ac types of AC and BA are anything to go by. But the question remains, would there be enough demand to sustain a 3rd direct carrier. WS don't operate YVR to LGW, so it could also be the last piece in the puzzle for the VS/WS codeshare. I wont be surprised if the codeshare expands to be something much bigger, such as an even extended JV. Imagine, you'll have VS in the UK and AF/KL further south from them on the continent. WS in Canada and DL in USA on the other side of the pond and throw DL's other baby AM in Mexico and the current AF/KL/DL/VS JV expands even more. Few years after that LATAM join the immunised JV club and it becomes not only Europe to North America, but Europe to both Americas (South/North). A fully North/South Atlantic immunised JV!!!

So with the current JV in mind any North Atlantic route would have to meet 2 criteria:
A) Under / not served by AF/KL/DL/VS
B) Able to connect / feed from(via) one of DL/AF/KL/VS hubs.
Don't forget that DL/AF/KL/VS can now share commercially sensitive info and are (legally) allowed to share and co-ordinate scheduling. So any new North Atlantic route, would have to be agreed by all 3 members of the club
 
kavok
Posts: 664
Joined: Wed May 11, 2016 10:12 pm

Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:32 pm

klakzky123 wrote:
Ishrion wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:

And VS already has the JV with Delta, so what's the point of SLC or DTW? It doesn't expand the network.


Replacing a frequency? Complimenting Delta’s existing service? (More unlikely).

Did anyone ever say it had to expand the network? It would expand VS’ own network but not the JV as a whole.


VS tried DTW in the past and cancelled it. I think DL will continue to fly LHR routes from DL fortress hubs (excluding ATL of course). VS seems to go where there is reasonable LHR originating point of sale.


This is somewhat misleading. DL for the longest time wanted to implement 2x daily DTW-LHR service, but didn’t have the extra LHR slot to do it. Then the partnership with VS happened, and VS had some spare LHR slots, so VS added a daily LHR-DTW to compliment DL’s DTW-LHR service. DL soon realized it was operationally more efficient to fly their own metal from their Fortress Hubs, so they “traded” another destination with VS, but the DTW-LHR double daily remains.

Point being, yes VS no longer flies the route, but if you look at VS/DL as one, then DTW-LHR went from 1x daily to 2x daily, and that remains today.

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