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p468
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:33 pm

twicearound wrote:
p468 wrote:
NateGreat wrote:
Any idea what the leisure config will be, in comparison to the LHR based A350s?


I stand corrected, according to this article, the lesuire 350s are due to jion the fleet in 21

https://travelingformiles.com/virgin-at ... -aircraft/

If the current 747 config is anything to go by (also quoting the article) should expect 14 J 66 Y and the rest W (240+??) I should imagine


240 premium seats is a bit excessive no?


Ws and Ys wrong way around... it's Monday!
 
p468
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:42 pm

kavok wrote:

Point being, yes VS no longer flies the route, but if you look at VS/DL as one, then DTW-LHR went from 1x daily to 2x daily, and that remains today.


Hit the nail right there. There's other examples of where one of the two brands works better. Eg SEA, changed hands between VS/DL, given Virgin America's (old) presence on the west coast, the VS brand did better there. You then also have the metal available. MAN is a great example. I think it was MAN-ATL where VS operated that route on an inefficient 747 (probably only spare ac they had to throw there) 2/3 weekly. Now DL will step in from S20 and operate a daily flight, albeit on a smaller 757. Enough demand for more rotations, but not enough for a daily 747 or even smaller 332.
Now you have to think of DL/VS/AF/KL as one on the North Atlantic
 
skipness1E
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:29 pm

ATL-LHR was 2 x VS, VS104 and VS116 and 2 x DL, DL28 and DL30, VS have dropped the VS116.
DTW-LHR on VS, the VS108 was dropped
 
AEROFAN
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:00 pm

Arion640 wrote:
Capetown, Tokyo, Vancouver, Toronto or Chicago are the obvious ones that spring to mind.

Could just be more routes from MAN though.


Chicago and Toronto again? I don't think so. Would that be tenth time the charm?
“You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant.” ~Harlan Ellison~
 
727LOVER
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:04 pm

dfdubflyer wrote:
The safest add would probably be a US city with a strong DL FF base


TPA seems to fit that description
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
questions
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:01 am

Any existing or new network connectivity with LA?
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:06 am

Any reason they aren’t bigger at EWR? Last July they had a 95% LF.
 
RainerBoeing777
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:20 am

kavok wrote:
klakzky123 wrote:
Ishrion wrote:

Replacing a frequency? Complimenting Delta’s existing service? (More unlikely).

Did anyone ever say it had to expand the network? It would expand VS’ own network but not the JV as a whole.


VS tried DTW in the past and cancelled it. I think DL will continue to fly LHR routes from DL fortress hubs (excluding ATL of course). VS seems to go where there is reasonable LHR originating point of sale.


This is somewhat misleading. DL for the longest time wanted to implement 2x daily DTW-LHR service, but didn’t have the extra LHR slot to do it. Then the partnership with VS happened, and VS had some spare LHR slots, so VS added a daily LHR-DTW to compliment DL’s DTW-LHR service. DL soon realized it was operationally more efficient to fly their own metal from their Fortress Hubs, so they “traded” another destination with VS, but the DTW-LHR double daily remains.

Point being, yes VS no longer flies the route, but if you look at VS/DL as one, then DTW-LHR went from 1x daily to 2x daily, and that remains today.


in May DTW-LHR returns to double daily, if they reduced in winter to operate SCL-LHR that was once seasonal throughout the year
CX - JL - LH - KE - KL - SQ - QR - QF - TG
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:40 am

From the title, is the rumour LHR or LGW based?
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
Growing older, but not up.
 
Rossiya747
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 3:24 am

84 possible routes from London:
SVO, DME, VKO, ATQ, ADD, NBO, YUL, ORD, YYZ, YYC, YEG, YOW, YVR, SAN, DEN, CPT, MCO, SIN, NRT, HND, TAS, EZE, GIG, CDG, SCL, MEX, CUN, SWF, STL, PHX, PDX, PTY, BOG, UIO, GYE, LIM, ACC, WDH, NGO, SYD, MEL, AKL, PER, VVO, OVB, CGK, DPS, SIN, KUL, TPE, AUH, DXB, JED, RUH, PEK, DFW, AUS, ICN, PUS, BKK, HAN, SGN, MAD, AMS, BCN, AGP, DOH, TFS, TFN, MLA, CAN, URC, MNL, RDU, ALA, TSE, LED, MUC, PPT, BNE, IST, AYT, SZX, TAO, EDI, CTS

But only a few of these will probably happen
223 319 320 321 332 333 346 388 734 737 738 739 38M 744 752 753 763 764 772 773 77W 788 789 208 CRJ2 E145 E190 UA DL AA WN AC CM 4O AV 2K FI DY D8 SK LH EI FR U2 IB OS LX BA VS BT PS MS SA SW QR EY HY AI 9W TG SQ MH AK D7 QZ BR NH CA QF MI LV/IB VY AL
 
fedex1
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:00 am

I think someone said earlier, “best bet is to fly to a strong FF base for DL? Would IND fit that bill? On the IND thread the state has been pretty clear they would like another Europe route, not saying that would be LHR but that’s the most logical for IND.
 
jbs2886
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:32 am

fedex1 wrote:
I think someone said earlier, “best bet is to fly to a strong FF base for DL? Would IND fit that bill? On the IND thread the state has been pretty clear they would like another Europe route, not saying that would be LHR but that’s the most logical for IND.


I don't get why everyone is focused on a US destination. This is for the Winter 2020 schedule - TATL routes are almost exclusively launched in the summer(ish). The only Winter destination that would be launched in the US would be a beach destination for VS.
 
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thekorean
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:29 am

I don't think right now, we can automatically assume VS's new routes will be from LHR. Could be from MAN.
 
dfdubflyer
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 8:14 am

jbs2886 wrote:
fedex1 wrote:
I think someone said earlier, “best bet is to fly to a strong FF base for DL? Would IND fit that bill? On the IND thread the state has been pretty clear they would like another Europe route, not saying that would be LHR but that’s the most logical for IND.


I don't get why everyone is focused on a US destination. This is for the Winter 2020 schedule - TATL routes are almost exclusively launched in the summer(ish). The only Winter destination that would be launched in the US would be a beach destination for VS.


I said that, FedEx, and I think Indy could make sense. Get there before BA!

I think it will be the US because that’s the only thing they’re particularly good at unless it’s something like a seasonal island add
 
Boeing74741R
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:07 am

p468 wrote:
I think it was MAN-ATL where VS operated that route on an inefficient 747 (probably only spare ac they had to throw there) 2/3 weekly. Now DL will step in from S20 and operate a daily flight, albeit on a smaller 757. Enough demand for more rotations, but not enough for a daily 747 or even smaller 332.


You are correct in saying VS used MAN-ATL on the 747 simply because the A330's were all tied up substituting for 787's - during W18/19 the 747 was used to JFK up to 4 times per week (two MAN-JFK flights I did in Nov 2018 had just under 400 passengers on) and ATL for the remaining days - but the route you're thinking of that DL are taking over with 757's is MAN-BOS. It's a move I support as the 757 is the better fit for that route IMO and the daily frequencies will help it grow, plus it's already been proven when Thomas Cook were still around that the route cannot support 2 airlines.

As an aside, I don't think the 757 has the legs to do MAN-ATL non-stop, especially westbound.

Somebody mentioned MAN-MIA. I'd be surprised if that came to fruition as AA pulled out after one winter and Thomas Cook pulled the route after a few years in favour of elsewhere (SEA I think). If it wasn't for the fact VS don't operate it from London, I'd have suggested TPA as a more likely second Florida destination.
 
skipness1E
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:45 am

thekorean wrote:
I don't think right now, we can automatically assume VS's new routes will be from LHR. Could be from MAN.

If it's launching in winter, it's just as likely to be LGW
 
YouGeeElWhy
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:49 am

dfdubflyer wrote:
jbs2886 wrote:
fedex1 wrote:
I think someone said earlier, “best bet is to fly to a strong FF base for DL? Would IND fit that bill? On the IND thread the state has been pretty clear they would like another Europe route, not saying that would be LHR but that’s the most logical for IND.


I don't get why everyone is focused on a US destination. This is for the Winter 2020 schedule - TATL routes are almost exclusively launched in the summer(ish). The only Winter destination that would be launched in the US would be a beach destination for VS.


I said that, FedEx, and I think Indy could make sense. Get there before BA!

I think it will be the US because that’s the only thing they’re particularly good at unless it’s something like a seasonal island add

so you are saying they will fly to a place that was not even on their expansion list for a 3rd LHR runway. okey-dokey

Image
 
p468
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 11:33 am

YouGeeElWhy wrote:
dfdubflyer wrote:
jbs2886 wrote:


so you are saying they will fly to a place that was not even on their expansion list for a 3rd LHR runway. okey-dokey

Image


I think that's slightly misleading. You've snipped a map of their current network. Also, their LHR expansion plans include both westbound and eastbound routes from LHR. However, coming back to the same point time and time again, Transatlantic expansion would only be with their JV partners. I'd expect the new routes to be anywhere but Transatlantic imo. It'd have to be a route eastbound, that has good enough point to point demand, but also healthy enough feed from the US. There's plenty of viable examples given in this thread, as well as examples from the runway three expansion plans YouGeeElWhy's quoted. India another DEL, increased BOM, CCU. Further east, ICN, BKK, Tokyo would've been high up there, but we all know there's no HND slots - NRT just wont work for them.
China Eastern might have a small say in Chinese routes, they did announce a codeshare and another immunised JV late last year, so this might change some things.
 
3AWM
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:55 pm

Given this Heathrow wish list was very recently announced I'd be very surprised to see VS announce a route from Heathrow that wasn't on this list.

In respect of routes from MAN I think another US route is unlikely before the existing routes go year around daily. I also think any India routes are much more likely to go via LHR as they feed US destinations through there.

What is notable by it's absence from VS's LHR wish list is BKK. I can see they wouldn't run this as there is already quite a bit of competition from LHR there and as people often say it's low yielding.

I think MAN-BKK is however very likely as there is a lot of demand from MAN for BKK and unlikely to be any competition. It kind of suits the mixed leisure/business model VS run from MAN. It would also have the added bonus of feeding some US routes.
 
jomur
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:59 pm

YouGeeElWhy wrote:
Also, VS already said where they would expand if the 3rd runway happens at LHR, so suggesting flights not on that list does not make a lot of sense.


That's probanly as long as they get the bulk of the new slots they have demanded (that ain't going to happen either..)
 
richcandy
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 1:48 pm

3AWM wrote:
.

I think MAN-BKK is however very likely as there is a lot of demand from MAN for BKK and unlikely to be any competition. It kind of suits the mixed leisure/business model VS run from MAN. It would also have the added bonus of feeding some US routes.


You may well be right and its a few years since I worked in the industry so what do I know!

However when I was working airlines like EY, EK and QR seam to continually have specials offer fares to BKK. And I think that could kind of be the problem. Its a longish flight with lots of other airlines offering low fare. OK not direct services but many leisure passengers will fly indirect to save a few pounds.

Alex
 
x1234
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 1:54 pm

I think the only place in Asia where VS could gain traction is HND, SIN & ICN which all large competition (including A380s). But VS already flies to the 2 most populous cities in both China & India with 1 billion+ people. I think expansion will be the Americas.
 
digitalcloud
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 2:17 pm

BWA900 wrote:
GLA- BGI
LHR- ACC
MAN- MIA


Guesses or...?

Many of the ex TCX routes from MAN are likely a good shout.
 
Indy
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 2:18 pm

If this is all based on LHR getting the 3rd runway, why is it even a discussion right now? The runway is still many years out. This article states the runway is delayed and may not finish until 2028 or 2029. So much can change between now and then.

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/ne ... 54176.html
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
DobboDobbo
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 3:09 pm

richcandy wrote:
3AWM wrote:
.

I think MAN-BKK is however very likely as there is a lot of demand from MAN for BKK and unlikely to be any competition. It kind of suits the mixed leisure/business model VS run from MAN. It would also have the added bonus of feeding some US routes.


You may well be right and its a few years since I worked in the industry so what do I know!

However when I was working airlines like EY, EK and QR seam to continually have specials offer fares to BKK. And I think that could kind of be the problem. Its a longish flight with lots of other airlines offering low fare. OK not direct services but many leisure passengers will fly indirect to save a few pounds.

Alex


I think if VS wish to develop the TATL offering at MAN one way of achieving that is to drive some long haul - long haul feed.

As 3AWM says, BKK is a good example. MAN-BKK is one of the largest unserved routes on earth by passenger volume, as is BKK-JFK/LAX/SFO. The downside is that much of it (not all) is likely to be low yielding.

There would be a lot of competition on these passenger flows, not least from the MEB3, but the numbers they can attract might help VS to establish the likes of MAN-SFO, get MAN-LAX year round and add frequencies to MAN-JFK.
 
Clackers
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 3:34 pm

Rossiya747 wrote:
84 possible routes from London:
SVO, DME, VKO, ATQ, ADD, NBO, YUL, ORD, YYZ, YYC, YEG, YOW, YVR, SAN, DEN, CPT, MCO, SIN, NRT, HND, TAS, EZE, GIG, CDG, SCL, MEX, CUN, SWF, STL, PHX, PDX, PTY, BOG, UIO, GYE, LIM, ACC, WDH, NGO, SYD, MEL, AKL, PER, VVO, OVB, CGK, DPS, SIN, KUL, TPE, AUH, DXB, JED, RUH, PEK, DFW, AUS, ICN, PUS, BKK, HAN, SGN, MAD, AMS, BCN, AGP, DOH, TFS, TFN, MLA, CAN, URC, MNL, RDU, ALA, TSE, LED, MUC, PPT, BNE, IST, AYT, SZX, TAO, EDI, CTS

But only a few of these will probably happen


PPT? Polynesia? How can that possibly be served from London?
 
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dabpit
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:17 pm

If it is from LHR then it will be MCO, AUS, MEX, or YYZ. They already put out their LHR wish list for expansion. MCO is a high probability since there has been a strong push from the airport for the route and supposed interest from DL/VS for the route. Again this is only if the new route is from LHR. It would be nice to see MAN get some more love.
Carpe Diem
 
YouGeeElWhy
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:26 pm

YouGeeElWhy wrote:
I don't think Daddy Delta is going to let them expand westward (so no Americas... AUS/DEN/MEX would be an excellent VS type add otherwise) nor at MAN. If they grow from LHR, it would need to be Asia or Africa. NBO/SIN/BLR would be decent adds that complement VS/DL LHR flights. Tokyo seems like a pretty big gap, too, right now for VS.

Also, VS already said where they would expand if the 3rd runway happens at LHR, so suggesting flights not on that list does not make a lot of sense.

I said this like 20 posts ago.

p468 wrote:
YouGeeElWhy wrote:
dfdubflyer wrote:
so you are saying they will fly to a place that was not even on their expansion list for a 3rd LHR runway. okey-dokey

Image


I think that's slightly misleading. You've snipped a map of their current network... I'd expect the new routes to be anywhere but Transatlantic imo. It'd have to be a route eastbound, that has good enough point to point demand, but also healthy enough feed from the US.
see above. Pretty obvious they would not be TATL. The map was snipped because people are talking about IND and it is not even on this hypothetical long term expansion so why in the world would it come up for any short term expansion.

jomur wrote:
YouGeeElWhy wrote:
Also, VS already said where they would expand if the 3rd runway happens at LHR, so suggesting flights not on that list does not make a lot of sense.


That's probanly as long as they get the bulk of the new slots they have demanded (that ain't going to happen either..)
did not say it did. See above.
 
TC957
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:27 pm

I can see LGW - ATL as another possibility. Also increased frequency LHR- BGI compared to this winter.
 
twicearound
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:32 pm

dabpit wrote:
If it is from LHR then it will be MCO, AUS, MEX, or YYZ. They already put out their LHR wish list for expansion. MCO is a high probability since there has been a strong push from the airport for the route and supposed interest from DL/VS for the route. Again this is only if the new route is from LHR. It would be nice to see MAN get some more love.


Isn't MCO already served from LGW?
 
Indy
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:16 pm

YouGeeElWhy wrote:
see above. Pretty obvious they would not be TATL. The map was snipped because people are talking about IND and it is not even on this hypothetical long term expansion so why in the world would it come up for any short term expansion.


I don't think anyone has talked about VS coming to IND. The route would likely be served by BA or AA. IND isn't the type of market that VS typically serves.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
Clackers
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:31 pm

Anyone think VS would try to trump QF and do a non stop flight to Australia? Maybe DRW or CNS? Then a tag on to SYD/MEL?
 
airbazar
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:57 pm

jfk777 wrote:
dfdubflyer wrote:
The safest add would probably be a US city with a strong DL FF bade where they would only be competing with BA RDU for instance


RDU is already flown by AA with a 777 daily from Heathrow. Can't see a second flight in such a niche market, even a 767 would be too much capacity.


You're assuming the fares out of RDU are cheap which they're not. There's much more of a bloodbath out of BOS for example and that hasn't stopped VS from adding a morning flight of all things.

The thing is, I feel like RDU would do a lot better if they also added BLR.
 
sand26391
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 6:20 pm

Ive heard recently about VS launching to BLR, I dont think they will launch anytime soon, hearing from the rumours at BLR.
 
Bhoy
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 6:29 pm

Clackers wrote:
Anyone think VS would try to trump QF and do a non stop flight to Australia? Maybe DRW or CNS? Then a tag on to SYD/MEL?

How would a non-stop to Darwin or Cairns trump Qantas?

Given that Qantas already have a non-stop to Australia, Perth being a city with considerably bigger O&D than either Darwin or Cairns, that seems like a way to lose money big time. They wouldn’t have cabotage rights for the domestic tag, so what demand is there to fill a Plane to the North Coast of Australia from London? If it’s just as a tech stop en route to SYD/MEL, then there are numerous intermediary stops in Asia that would allow them fifth freedoms for Australia, as well as actual O&D to London.

QF, on the other hand, can sell connections to any domestic destination via PER on QF9/10, for whatever premium they want to charge.
 
dmanonice
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 6:38 pm

jfk777 wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
Capetown, Tokyo, Vancouver, Toronto or Chicago are the obvious ones that spring to mind.

Could just be more routes from MAN though.


Chicago has been tried several times, it's controlled by AA & UA with huge frequencies in the market. Not going to happen.

Toronto might work if Virgin could make a deal with Westjet.

Tokyo would be a great market if Haneda was the airport and an A350 flew the route.

Capetown is too seasonal, a great destination for many bu not Virgin.



WS and VS already have a codeshare deal in place, so YYZ may become viable with that in place.....
Mike
 
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dabpit
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Tue Feb 11, 2020 6:58 pm

twicearound wrote:
dabpit wrote:
If it is from LHR then it will be MCO, AUS, MEX, or YYZ. They already put out their LHR wish list for expansion. MCO is a high probability since there has been a strong push from the airport for the route and supposed interest from DL/VS for the route. Again this is only if the new route is from LHR. It would be nice to see MAN get some more love.


Isn't MCO already served from LGW?

Yes, they serve LGW from MCO. VS serves both LGW and LHR from LAS. If I recall correctly they also fly from JFK to both LHR and LGW.
Carpe Diem
 
Kato79
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:59 am

It’s CPT. Seasonally on the B789.
 
8herveg
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Wed Feb 12, 2020 10:55 am

dabpit wrote:
twicearound wrote:
dabpit wrote:
If it is from LHR then it will be MCO, AUS, MEX, or YYZ. They already put out their LHR wish list for expansion. MCO is a high probability since there has been a strong push from the airport for the route and supposed interest from DL/VS for the route. Again this is only if the new route is from LHR. It would be nice to see MAN get some more love.


Isn't MCO already served from LGW?

Yes, they serve LGW from MCO. VS serves both LGW and LHR from LAS. If I recall correctly they also fly from JFK to both LHR and LGW.


VS moved their LGW-LAS flight to LHR last year, so it doesn't operate from both. You may be getting confused with BA who operate to LAS from both LHR and LGW. VS's LGW-JFK flight starts in May.
 
grjplanes
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Wed Feb 12, 2020 11:12 am

Jip, CPT it is...just announced on their Facebook page. To start 25 Oct'20, bookings open 18 Feb
 
Williamsb747
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Wed Feb 12, 2020 11:21 am

https://www.virgin.com/news/virgin-atla ... -cape-town

Daily seasonal flights to CPT B789 operating.

Williams-
B747>A340>A350>B777>MD11>B767>B757>MD88/90>B787>A380>A330>A220>A320>B737.
CPT JNB
 
AAMDanny
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Wed Feb 12, 2020 11:28 am

'The VS478 service will operate as a night flight departing Heathrow at 16:20 arriving into Cape Town at 05:55 whereas the inbound, the VS479, will depart at 08:00 landing later that day at 18:00'

So they have gone for a schedule that's better for aircraft utilisation, which is probably a wise move. When they last operated it was a airframe heavy route with both legs being night flights meaning a A340-600 was sat idle on the ground all day at CPT. With this new service leaving LHR 1620 it slots onto the back end of many other services inbound to LHR late morning, early afternoon. And landing back into LHR at 1800 next day means the aircraft can be re-deployed that evening on one of the many evening rotations.
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Wed Feb 12, 2020 12:13 pm

What drives the market at Cape Town, is it tourism mostly?
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grjplanes
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Wed Feb 12, 2020 12:44 pm

readytotaxi wrote:
What drives the market at Cape Town, is it tourism mostly?


Yes, mostly tourism. But a lot more high-end tourism at that.

Over the last few years there might also have been a better increase in business travel, as several companies moved headquarters (be it national, regional or continental) to Cape Town. With that again also is a growing outbound market that can afford to travel, and prefer to by-pass JNB.
 
Williamsb747
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Wed Feb 12, 2020 1:09 pm

readytotaxi wrote:
What drives the market at Cape Town, is it tourism mostly?


Year round there is definitely a higher ratio of business travellers but it is still the tourists making the bulk of pax. During NW, however, its almost exclusively high end tourism driving seasonal routes and seasonal expansions to pre-existing routes.

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PANAMsterdam
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Wed Feb 12, 2020 1:39 pm

CPT is booming at the moment, hence BA sending 2 747's and a 777 every day. I flew with BA last year to CPT and their 747 cabin was ridiculously outdated. So if VA sends its 789, BA will face quite the competition product wise!
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Wed Feb 12, 2020 1:41 pm

readytotaxi wrote:
What drives the market at Cape Town, is it tourism mostly?

I always thought in addition to tourism it had a bit of VFR as well. When I flew to/from CPT on BA they were loads of people returning home to visit their families in CPT and vice versa.
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x1234
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Wed Feb 12, 2020 2:15 pm

CPT makes sense. I heard the UA EWR-CPT flights are packed.
 
Arion640
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Wed Feb 12, 2020 2:19 pm

skipness1E wrote:
Arion640 wrote:
Capetown, Tokyo, Vancouver, Toronto or Chicago are the obvious ones that spring to mind.

Could just be more routes from MAN though.

They've just pulled LHR-CPT as they couldn't make it work for them and was adding little to the JV.
NRT was pulled and as won't be resumed until they can get into HND as BA/JL/NH hold that as a competitive advantage. YVR/YYZ as well as ORD are STAR or ONEWORLD dominant and have all failed in recent years, although YYZ is going back quite some way.
Recent new routes have been more strategic rather than going for a big London market and trying to cherry pick, the strength of feed at the other end killed that notion with BA/AA dominating ORD and AC dominating Canada.

LHR-CGK is not a gap that needs filled by anyone, it's served by the ME3 and no one is going to pay a premium in that market to fly direct.
LHR-ACC ran from 2010S to 2013S on the A343 up to 5 weekly but not sure conditions have improved enough to warrant a return.
LHR-CPT was dropped end of 2014W and has also seen SA drop it for different reasons. BA fares are high on the B744 but do VS really want to park all day in South Africa given their lack of available aircraft?

All of their loyal business travellers to NRT will have jumped ship to NH or BA/JL hwen they closed Japan back in 2014W,and so starting again at a secondary Tokyo airport isn't going to be as profitable as we might think IMHO.


Looks like Virgin do want to operate to CPT.
 
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Re: Rumour: Virgin Atlantic to announce W20 schedule with new routes

Wed Feb 12, 2020 2:25 pm

It's not surprising. BA has cleaned up on this route lately with the seasonal LGW add on top of the LHR-CPT capacity and yields have remained solid, helped by Thomas Cook no longer being on the LGW-CPT route. This is certainly a market that could handle the extra capacity of a 787.

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