Virgin Atlantic News and Discussion Thread 2020

CarbonFibre · Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:24 pm

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Ishrion · Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:25 pm

CarbonFibre wrote:
No need for premium membership.

It’s telling me I need Silver to see past 7 days of history.

readytotaxi · Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:27 pm

When did BGI get 340 service I though it was always A330?

Revelation · Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:31 pm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbus_A3 ... r_variants suggests VS's first flight with -600 was July 2002 so the -600 fleet will have had 18 years of operation. Strangely, they are being outlived by the 744s, at least for a short while. I think they have a nice fleet plan with A339, 789 and A35K being their choices going forward. I think the partnership with DL is giving them some much needed financial stability, something quite appreciated as the airline industry deals with CV.

Kno · Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:45 pm

They were supposed to be back on Bos-lhr for a bit not sure if that’s changed in the past week or two.

redcap1962 · Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:55 pm

https://www.flightera.net/en/search
https://www.flightera.net/de/planes/G-VNAP#!
https://www.flightera.net/de/planes/G-VWIN#!
Scroll down to the very bottom to choose your language.

Danhill1905 · Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:58 pm

Having watched the departure on Big Jet TV live, members were saying they will end up at Bournemouth ahead of sale to another carrier

BWA900 · Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:13 pm

readytotaxi wrote:
When did BGI get 340 service I though it was always A330?

Along with the A346 and A330s, BGI gets the 744s regularly sometimes 2x daily.

727LOVER · Tue Mar 10, 2020 12:09 am

Seems ATL is using A333 now

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/VIR103

eamondzhang · Tue Mar 10, 2020 2:21 am

Danhill1905 wrote:
Having watched the departure on Big Jet TV live, members were saying they will end up at Bournemouth ahead of sale to another carrier

That doesnt sound right to me, as I remember Bournemouth being a place where a lot of planes were scrapped.

Michael

blueflyer · Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:48 am

eamondzhang wrote:
Danhill1905 wrote:
Having watched the departure on Big Jet TV live, members were saying they will end up at Bournemouth ahead of sale to another carrier

That doesnt sound right to me, as I remember Bournemouth being a place where a lot of planes were scrapped.

BOH is as good a place as any to park an aircraft for a short period of time while a buyer kicks the tires and checks the paperwork, but it does not have the climate or equipment to support storage.

If Virgin had buyer(s) already lined up to take delivery of the planes soon after their scheduled retirement, leaving them in BOH for a few weeks won't hurt. If there's no eager buyer, I'd say the planes are either going to a place further South than BOH, or not coming back from BOH!

Boof02671 · Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:21 am

They went to Manchester, even Jerry said so this morning on BigJetTV

CarbonFibre · Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:00 am

Boof02671 wrote:
They went to Manchester, even Jerry said so this morning on BigJetTV

What did?

Boeing74741R · Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:15 am

Kno wrote:
They were supposed to be back on Bos-lhr for a bit not sure if that’s changed in the past week or two.

As suggested earlier in the thread, it appears to be the end now for the VS A340 fleet. The recent downturn in travel due to the coronavirus along with routes being temporarily suspended means there's spare aircraft and the A340's are now surplus to requirements...

https://www.inflightwithjames.com/post/ ... 340-fleet/

The above article infers they could return to service, though I wouldn't hold your breath.

It's the end of an era as the A340's are the second longest-serving aircraft in the VS fleet in its history. It's also the end of regular VS four-engine aircraft ops out of LHR given no 747's are regularly scheduled from there anymore. Depending on the situation, one wonders if they will commemorate the occasion when the last 747 is retired given its role in the VS fleet since day one?

skipness1E · Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:45 am

Boof02671 wrote:
They went to Manchester, even Jerry said so this morning on BigJetTV

One of these days he’ll get something right.
Maybe.

giblets · Tue Mar 10, 2020 12:20 pm

With the postponement of GRU, they have newer types they can replace the A340 with I guess.

jghealey · Tue Mar 10, 2020 2:17 pm

A few weeks ago an ex-VS A346 was delivered to Azman Air in Nigeria from BOH (in an especially weird configuration), might this be what's happening to the others?

CarbonFibre · Tue Mar 10, 2020 2:41 pm

jghealey wrote:
A few weeks ago an ex-VS A346 was delivered to Azman Air in Nigeria from BOH (in an especially weird configuration), might this be what's happening to the others?

One went to Plus Ultra and another is still there in full VS livery. Don't know what's happening to that one or the three at LGW.

x1234 · Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:05 pm

The one thing I don't understand about VS is that they ordered the A330neo instead of more B789's which the B789 has lower fuel burn and longer range (they can fly to PER non-stop like QF with Virgin Australia handling PER-SYD).

Caluma350 · Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:11 pm

x1234 wrote:
The one thing I don't understand about VS is that they ordered the A330neo instead of more B789's which the B789 has lower fuel burn and longer range (they can fly to PER non-stop like QF with Virgin Australia handling PER-SYD).

The B789's have been a bit of a problem child for VS. The airline pretty much always has some sat on the ground at LHR with Trent 1000 issues. Therefore they wanted to go with the A330 neo as their A330 ceo became a bit older it was the natural replacement / progression.

CWL757 · Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:15 pm

[twoid][list=][/list][/twoid]

Boof02671 wrote:
They went to Manchester, even Jerry said so this morning on BigJetTV

That completely makes your post untrustworthy. He is probably one of the most clueless people out there.

x1234 · Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:24 pm

Caluma, I didn't know the T1000 issues still persisted. I guess the A330neo is a natural evolution instead of ordering the B789 with GE engines (like ANZ did).

Polot · Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:32 pm

Caluma350 wrote:
x1234 wrote:
The one thing I don't understand about VS is that they ordered the A330neo instead of more B789's which the B789 has lower fuel burn and longer range (they can fly to PER non-stop like QF with Virgin Australia handling PER-SYD).

The B789's have been a bit of a problem child for VS. The airline pretty much always has some sat on the ground at LHR with Trent 1000 issues. Therefore they wanted to go with the A330 neo as their A330 ceo became a bit older it was the natural replacement / progression.

It came down to costs. VS got a good price for the neo as Airbus wanted more blue chip customers and they wouldn’t have to retrain all the A330 pilots.

If it was all about RR Trent 1000 issues...well the Trent 7000 powering those A330neos is based on the latest Trent 1000 so let’s hope the latest version are all fixed.

Boof02671 · Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:58 pm

CWL757 wrote:
[twoid][list=][/list][/twoid]
Boof02671 wrote:
They went to Manchester, even Jerry said so this morning on BigJetTV

That completely makes your post untrustworthy. He is probably one of the most clueless people out there.

The flight plan was to LGW

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/GVFIT

jghealey · Tue Mar 10, 2020 4:13 pm

CarbonFibre wrote:
jghealey wrote:
A few weeks ago an ex-VS A346 was delivered to Azman Air in Nigeria from BOH (in an especially weird configuration), might this be what's happening to the others?

One went to Plus Ultra and another is still there in full VS livery. Don't know what's happening to that one or the three at LGW.

The three at LGW will presumably be kept for a while as backup aircraft I'm guessing...? I didn't think the plan was for them to leave the fleet immediately, rather that they were keeping them for a bit longer just not having them actively in service. Still, I'm surprised they've managed to sell the ones they have so far.

TOGA10 · Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:36 pm

jghealey wrote:
A few weeks ago an ex-VS A346 was delivered to Azman Air in Nigeria from BOH (in an especially weird configuration), might this be what's happening to the others?

Out of curiosity, what was so weird about the configuration?

jghealey · Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:46 pm

TOGA10 wrote:
jghealey wrote:
A few weeks ago an ex-VS A346 was delivered to Azman Air in Nigeria from BOH (in an especially weird configuration), might this be what's happening to the others?

Out of curiosity, what was so weird about the configuration?

Loads of hand-me-down VS economy seats (in various different styles if I remember correctly) and just TWO business class recliner seats at the front on the aircraft, exposed to the rest of the cabin:

https://onemileatatime.com/azman-air-bu ... ass-seats/

Their slogan 'Fly Safe, Fly Azman' doesn't exactly inspire confidence, either.

FSDan · Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:50 pm

jghealey wrote:
just TWO business class recliner seats at the front on the aircraft, exposed to the rest of the cabin:

https://onemileatatime.com/azman-air-bu ... ass-seats/

LOL! They might as well bestow crowns on the people sitting there and declare them the king and queen of the flight.

jghealey · Tue Mar 10, 2020 7:53 pm

FSDan wrote:
jghealey wrote:
just TWO business class recliner seats at the front on the aircraft, exposed to the rest of the cabin:

https://onemileatatime.com/azman-air-bu ... ass-seats/

LOL! They might as well bestow crowns on the people sitting there and declare them the king and queen of the flight.

Indeed... it does seem completely ridiculous!! I wonder how much they'll charge, it doesn't look like the aircraft has entered service yet.

CarbonFibre · Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:37 pm

[/quote] it doesn't look like the aircraft has entered service yet.[/quote]

And probably never will.

330lover · Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:42 pm

jghealey wrote:
TOGA10 wrote:
jghealey wrote:
A few weeks ago an ex-VS A346 was delivered to Azman Air in Nigeria from BOH (in an especially weird configuration), might this be what's happening to the others?

Out of curiosity, what was so weird about the configuration?

Loads of hand-me-down VS economy seats (in various different styles if I remember correctly) and just TWO business class recliner seats at the front on the aircraft, exposed to the rest of the cabin:

https://onemileatatime.com/azman-air-bu ... ass-seats/

Their slogan 'Fly Safe, Fly Azman' doesn't exactly inspire confidence, either.

Maybe they intend to sell only economy, but installed those 2 business seats as 'crew rest' seats. Although, these seats will be in the middle of the spotlights to the other pax on board...

jwhite9185 · Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:44 pm

Boeing74741R wrote:
Kno wrote:
They were supposed to be back on Bos-lhr for a bit not sure if that’s changed in the past week or two.

As suggested earlier in the thread, it appears to be the end now for the VS A340 fleet. The recent downturn in travel due to the coronavirus along with routes being temporarily suspended means there's spare aircraft and the A340's are now surplus to requirements...

https://www.inflightwithjames.com/post/ ... 340-fleet/

The above article infers they could return to service, though I wouldn't hold your breath.

It's the end of an era as the A340's are the second longest-serving aircraft in the VS fleet in its history. It's also the end of regular VS four-engine aircraft ops out of LHR given no 747's are regularly scheduled from there anymore. Depending on the situation, one wonders if they will commemorate the occasion when the last 747 is retired given its role in the VS fleet since day one?

Hi there,

Saw that my initial article was mentioned above and I have received a couple of updates this evening.

The three retired aircraft are currently at Gatwick undergoing end of lease maintenance
They will NOT be returning to service.
They will fly to Tarbes in the coming days for scrap
As of yesterday (9th March), all A340 simulator licence checks have been terminated.
The remaining A340 flight crew will undergo A350 conversion courses imminently.

JannEejit · Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:53 pm

Caluma350 wrote:
x1234 wrote:
The one thing I don't understand about VS is that they ordered the A330neo instead of more B789's which the B789 has lower fuel burn and longer range (they can fly to PER non-stop like QF with Virgin Australia handling PER-SYD).

The B789's have been a bit of a problem child for VS. The airline pretty much always has some sat on the ground at LHR with Trent 1000 issues. Therefore they wanted to go with the A330 neo as their A330 ceo became a bit older it was the natural replacement / progression.

And that's a kind of low fuel burn nobody wants. I sense Virgin are developing a better relationship with Airbus product than Boeing these days. Yes I know the engine issues are Rolls Royce related.

JannEejit · Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:56 pm

jwhite9185 wrote:

Hi there,

Saw that my initial article was mentioned above and I have received a couple of updates this evening.

The three retired aircraft are currently at Gatwick undergoing end of lease maintenance
They will NOT be returning to service.
They will fly to Tarbes in the coming days for scrap
As of yesterday (9th March), all A340 simulator licence checks have been terminated.
The remaining A340 flight crew will undergo A350 conversion courses imminently.

Can I ask what level of 'end of lease maintenance' is required for aircraft destined for scrapping ?

skipness1E · Tue Mar 10, 2020 10:34 pm

Like the freshly repainted pristine F-HPJB I saw in Knock last week. The aircraft is returned in an agreed state (in this case freshly painted white). Being scrapped is outside the bounds of the contract between AF and the leasor.

JannEejit · Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:09 pm

skipness1E wrote:
Like the freshly repainted pristine F-HPJB I saw in Knock last week. The aircraft is returned in an agreed state (in this case freshly painted white). Being scrapped is outside the bounds of the contract between AF and the leasor.

Indeed so, but still...why bother ?

skipness1E · Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:58 pm

It’s a legal obligation of the contract signed.
The fact that the owner may or may not be scrapping the aircraft does not release the airline from returning the aircraft in the agreed and contractual state.

p468 · Wed Mar 11, 2020 8:27 am

skipness1E wrote:
It’s a legal obligation of the contract signed.
The fact that the owner may or may not be scrapping the aircraft does not release the airline from returning the aircraft in the agreed and contractual state.

Correct, when a lease is agreed, the lessor would want the ac back in a re-saleable / re-lease-able state. Now the 346 have most definitely come to the end of their life as some could argue prematurely, 10-15 years is a far cry from their originally planned lifetime (let's not get into why that is!). But the terms of the lease still stand, a decade ago when the lease was agreed, the lessor might have anticipated that there is a market for them when the VS lease ends.
Now that there isn't a secondary market for the 346' the lessor would still want the ac back on the same terms they agreed originally, why? Because there's still a 0.001% chance that they find another market for these aircraft and whilst this possibility still stands, the lessor would not want to lose this potential by giving VS a free ride.

Boeing74741R · Wed Mar 11, 2020 9:47 am

p468 wrote:
skipness1E wrote:
It’s a legal obligation of the contract signed.
The fact that the owner may or may not be scrapping the aircraft does not release the airline from returning the aircraft in the agreed and contractual state.

Correct, when a lease is agreed, the lessor would want the ac back in a re-saleable / re-lease-able state. Now the 346 have most definitely come to the end of their life as some could argue prematurely, 10-15 years is a far cry from their originally planned lifetime (let's not get into why that is!). But the terms of the lease still stand, a decade ago when the lease was agreed, the lessor might have anticipated that there is a market for them when the VS lease ends.
Now that there isn't a secondary market for the 346' the lessor would still want the ac back on the same terms they agreed originally, why? Because there's still a 0.001% chance that they find another market for these aircraft and whilst this possibility still stands, the lessor would not want to lose this potential by giving VS a free ride.

Yep. Who would have thought that VS ended up reinstating one of these A340's after several years in storage just a couple of years ago? Never say never to the possibility of these being reused by somebody, even if the chances are slim.

jwhite9185 wrote:
Hi there,

Saw that my initial article was mentioned above and I have received a couple of updates this evening.

The three retired aircraft are currently at Gatwick undergoing end of lease maintenance
They will NOT be returning to service.
They will fly to Tarbes in the coming days for scrap
As of yesterday (9th March), all A340 simulator licence checks have been terminated.
The remaining A340 flight crew will undergo A350 conversion courses imminently.

Thanks for the update. That's that then for VS and the A340.

JannEejit · Wed Mar 11, 2020 9:52 am

p468 wrote:
skipness1E wrote:
It’s a legal obligation of the contract signed.
The fact that the owner may or may not be scrapping the aircraft does not release the airline from returning the aircraft in the agreed and contractual state.

Correct, when a lease is agreed, the lessor would want the ac back in a re-saleable / re-lease-able state. Now the 346 have most definitely come to the end of their life as some could argue prematurely, 10-15 years is a far cry from their originally planned lifetime (let's not get into why that is!). But the terms of the lease still stand, a decade ago when the lease was agreed, the lessor might have anticipated that there is a market for them when the VS lease ends.
Now that there isn't a secondary market for the 346' the lessor would still want the ac back on the same terms they agreed originally, why? Because there's still a 0.001% chance that they find another market for these aircraft and whilst this possibility still stands, the lessor would not want to lose this potential by giving VS a free ride.

Sure, I get all that, but it's like buying a wedding dress for a corpse. Especially at a 0.001% chance of reactivation. I suppose the white paint vendors are happy enough though.

Caluma350 · Wed Mar 11, 2020 10:01 am

JannEejit wrote:
Caluma350 wrote:
x1234 wrote:
The one thing I don't understand about VS is that they ordered the A330neo instead of more B789's which the B789 has lower fuel burn and longer range (they can fly to PER non-stop like QF with Virgin Australia handling PER-SYD).

The B789's have been a bit of a problem child for VS. The airline pretty much always has some sat on the ground at LHR with Trent 1000 issues. Therefore they wanted to go with the A330 neo as their A330 ceo became a bit older it was the natural replacement / progression.

And that's a kind of low fuel burn nobody wants. I sense Virgin are developing a better relationship with Airbus product than Boeing these days. Yes I know the engine issues are Rolls Royce related.

Looks likely, VS has been very impressed with the A35K and there is a rumor once the full fleet have been delivered VS may get some more in.

jghealey · Wed Mar 11, 2020 5:29 pm

Caluma350 wrote:
JannEejit wrote:
Caluma350 wrote:

The B789's have been a bit of a problem child for VS. The airline pretty much always has some sat on the ground at LHR with Trent 1000 issues. Therefore they wanted to go with the A330 neo as their A330 ceo became a bit older it was the natural replacement / progression.

And that's a kind of low fuel burn nobody wants. I sense Virgin are developing a better relationship with Airbus product than Boeing these days. Yes I know the engine issues are Rolls Royce related.

Looks likely, VS has been very impressed with the A35K and there is a rumor once the full fleet have been delivered VS may get some more in.

Do you have any idea of how many more? They have 7 747s to replace, and 8 A35Ks on order... does this also mean that the A350s will start getting the high-density leisure config very soon? Assuming this is the case, after this, the rumoured added A350s would clearly be for expansion...

mooseofspruce · Wed Mar 11, 2020 10:49 pm

jghealey wrote:
Caluma350 wrote:
JannEejit wrote:

And that's a kind of low fuel burn nobody wants. I sense Virgin are developing a better relationship with Airbus product than Boeing these days. Yes I know the engine issues are Rolls Royce related.

Looks likely, VS has been very impressed with the A35K and there is a rumor once the full fleet have been delivered VS may get some more in.

Do you have any idea of how many more? They have 7 747s to replace, and 8 A35Ks on order... does this also mean that the A350s will start getting the high-density leisure config very soon? Assuming this is the case, after this, the rumoured added A350s would clearly be for expansion...

Based on past announcements from the company, the last five of the twelve A350s will be densely configured for the current 747 markets and those are scheduled to arrive in 2021.

Caluma350 · Thu Mar 12, 2020 10:36 am

mooseofspruce wrote:
jghealey wrote:
Caluma350 wrote:

Looks likely, VS has been very impressed with the A35K and there is a rumor once the full fleet have been delivered VS may get some more in.

Do you have any idea of how many more? They have 7 747s to replace, and 8 A35Ks on order... does this also mean that the A350s will start getting the high-density leisure config very soon? Assuming this is the case, after this, the rumoured added A350s would clearly be for expansion...

Based on past announcements from the company, the last five of the twelve A350s will be densely configured for the current 747 markets and those are scheduled to arrive in 2021.

Thats what I heard as well about the config. For any additional A350s its all just rumor and speculation for now, no point predicting any additional aircraft orders for now especially with global markets going nuts because of coronavirus!

TC957 · Thu Mar 12, 2020 4:03 pm

According to Skyliner, VS's former G-VFIZ is currently on it's way to SZB Kuala Lumpur from LDE. Reason ?
Would this flight have VS crew drafted in to operate it ?

CarbonFibre · Thu Mar 12, 2020 4:54 pm

VNAP at LGW today going nowhere.

Photo: Chris Doggett.

FLALEFTY · Thu Mar 12, 2020 5:19 pm

CarbonFibre wrote:
VNAP at LGW today going nowhere.

Photo: Chris Doggett.

I'm going to miss these beautiful, elegant planes. We used to see these here in MCO on occasion as temporary substitutes for the usual B744's.

Now the coundown starts to the eventual retirement of the B744's. It has been great seeing these big, old planes coming to our town every day. Does anyone have any insight when these Y-heavy 744's will be retired for the A350-1000's?

CarbonFibre · Thu Mar 12, 2020 5:43 pm

I remember having a look around VSHY when it first arrived. The cabin seemed to go on forever.

blacksoviet · Thu Mar 12, 2020 5:47 pm

When was the last plane in the four engines for long haul livery repainted?

CarbonFibre · Thu Mar 12, 2020 5:50 pm

VFIT is still like it. It just had the slogans removed.

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