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NTSB: State of Alaska’s high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Fri Feb 21, 2020 4:14 am

The NTSB issued a safety recommendation to the Federal Aviation Administration calling for the formation of a group focused on safety to better review, rank and integrate Alaska's unique aviation needs into the FAA safety enhancement process.


https://www.adn.com/alaska-news/aviation/2020/02/20/alaska-needs-broad-review-of-aviation-safety-ntsb-says/

With an accident rate more then twice the national average, it's well past time.
Last edited by qf789 on Fri Feb 21, 2020 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Updated title for clarity
 
dstblj52
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Re: NTSB: Alaska's high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Fri Feb 21, 2020 4:39 am

NameOmitted wrote:
The NTSB issued a safety recommendation to the Federal Aviation Administration calling for the formation of a group focused on safety to better review, rank and integrate Alaska's unique aviation needs into the FAA safety enhancement process.


https://www.adn.com/alaska-news/aviation/2020/02/20/alaska-needs-broad-review-of-aviation-safety-ntsb-says/

With an accident rate more then twice the national average, it's well past time.

not shocking its got a lot of 135 ops with that a lot of time builder pilots, mixing those in challenging conditions like Alaska is going to be an absolute killer especially with the rumored quality of maintenance at some of these operations.
 
TTailedTiger
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Re: NTSB: Alaska's high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Fri Feb 21, 2020 4:44 am

I think a better title would be State of Alaska. It makes it sound like the NTSB is referring to Alaska Airlines. And AS has had a flawless safety record for over 20 years.
 
Newark727
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Re: NTSB: Alaska's high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Fri Feb 21, 2020 4:46 am

At least don't ground the DC-6s until I've made my trip up to ANC, please
 
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stl07
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Re: NTSB: Alaska's high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Fri Feb 21, 2020 5:00 am

TTailedTiger wrote:
I think a better title would be State of Alaska. It makes it sound like the NTSB is referring to Alaska Airlines. And AS has had a flawless safety record for over 20 years.

Good point, AS has done very well in terms of safety
Instead of typing in "mods", consider using the report function.
Love how every "travel blogger" says they will never fly AA/Ethihad again and then says it again and again on subsequent flights.
 
dstblj52
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Re: NTSB: Alaska's high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Fri Feb 21, 2020 5:04 am

stl07 wrote:
TTailedTiger wrote:
I think a better title would be State of Alaska. It makes it sound like the NTSB is referring to Alaska Airlines. And AS has had a flawless safety record for over 20 years.

Good point, AS has done very well in terms of safety

Yeah especially as its the 135 ops that create most of the issues
 
LCDFlight
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Re: NTSB: State of Alaska’s high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Fri Feb 21, 2020 7:58 pm

Alaska is completely different from the other 49 states or territories in that general aviation is a lifeblood to access probably MOST locations in Alaska. This different level of need drives a different type of aviation. It's not a luxury, it is normal necessity, like the activity of driving cars, which kills a huge number of people every year.

As others stated, Alaska also has almost unique dangerous terrain and weather compared to other 49 states. So, we would expect the accident rate to be higher and that is not necessarily an indication they are doing anything poorly. They may be doing a better job than the other 49 after adjusting for these factors.
 
ericm2031
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Re: NTSB: State of Alaska’s high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Fri Feb 21, 2020 8:36 pm

LCDFlight wrote:
Alaska is completely different from the other 49 states or territories in that general aviation is a lifeblood to access probably MOST locations in Alaska. This different level of need drives a different type of aviation. It's not a luxury, it is normal necessity, like the activity of driving cars, which kills a huge number of people every year.

As others stated, Alaska also has almost unique dangerous terrain and weather compared to other 49 states. So, we would expect the accident rate to be higher and that is not necessarily an indication they are doing anything poorly. They may be doing a better job than the other 49 after adjusting for these factors.


I agree. A lot of unique conditions in Alaska that require a lot of unique aircraft types. Not at all surprised that there’s a higher accident rate.
 
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Re: NTSB: State of Alaska’s high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Fri Feb 21, 2020 9:17 pm

ericm2031 wrote:
I agree. A lot of unique conditions in Alaska that require a lot of unique aircraft types. Not at all surprised that there’s a higher accident rate.

There's higher accident rate, and there's double accident rate. We have the latter.

Look, aviation is huge in Alaska. We talk about Bush pilots like other states talk about sports heroes. We idolize the ones whose daring paid off, and frankly, many of us have friends who are only alive because of that daring.

That being said, the a air ambulance that went down recently in bad weather was the second called. The first declined to fly. The Saab that went off the runway last fall was probably due to inexperience flying into known bad weather.

We cant continue to waive this off because things are different up here.
 
Lootess
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Re: NTSB: State of Alaska’s high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Fri Feb 21, 2020 9:28 pm

Just like the Alaska air accident show on Smithsonian network says, aviation isn't just a commodity in Alaska, it's a way of life. More smaller and personal aircraft.

The Dutch Harbor Saab incident was basically inexperience and an ill-advised landing. Actually made the town to declare an emergency since it cut off their only mode of transportation off the island when Penair dropped it. Ravn's DH8s being slow and low capacity is a severe under-gauge.
 
Frostbite
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Re: NTSB: State of Alaska’s high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Fri Feb 21, 2020 11:35 pm

NameOmitted wrote:

We cant continue to waive this off because things are different up here.


Hear, hear. As a frequent user of Part 135 operations in Alaska, I couldn't agree more. 2019 was a bad year but I don't think we can pass it off as an outlier. Some really poor decisionmaking associated with some of the recent accidents, several against a backdrop of management shakeups that didn't set anybody up for success.
 
ikramerica
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Re: NTSB: State of Alaska’s high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Sat Feb 22, 2020 12:10 am

You have Rust’s advertising how safe they are on their website despite 2 fatal crashes in the last 18 months.

Is that good for Alaska?
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
alaskan9974
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Re: NTSB: State of Alaska’s high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Sat Feb 22, 2020 12:25 am

I know of several employers that now forbid travel with Ravn, and have switched to solely Alaska, or Bering Air, or recently chartering Ryan Air's or Security Aviation to avoid Ravn. They put on a decent PR spin on improvements, but behind the doors its the same old cluster.
 
Sancho99504
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Re: NTSB: State of Alaska’s high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Sat Feb 22, 2020 12:54 am

Alaska is such a difficult place to fly, mainly because of weather and the territory. There is so much desolate space and terrain, that it's easy to get disoriented. The weather is a pain as it can go from 55° and sunny to 11° and snow in the blink of an eye. People who come up from the lower 48 to build hours, I don't think respect the environment.

I would have thought that with technological advances since 2002, the last time I piloted a plane in the state, that the accident rates would go, especially with respect to accidents that involve bad weather. Hopefully some positives will come about here, as aviation is probably the most important industry to the survivability in a large part of the state.
kill 'em all and let God sort 'em out-USMC
 
strfyr51
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Re: NTSB: State of Alaska’s high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Sat Feb 22, 2020 1:54 am

NameOmitted wrote:
The NTSB issued a safety recommendation to the Federal Aviation Administration calling for the formation of a group focused on safety to better review, rank and integrate Alaska's unique aviation needs into the FAA safety enhancement process.

and even fewer runways
https://www.adn.com/alaska-news/aviation/2020/02/20/alaska-needs-broad-review-of-aviation-safety-ntsb-says/

With an accident rate more then twice the national average, it's well past time.

well? Lok at the flying in Alaska! That's bush flying at it's best! For damn sure there's going to be accidents! it's not like the Lower 48. there are few Nav aids and even fewer runways.
So what is the FAA going to mandate?
 
alaskan9974
Posts: 136
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 9:06 pm

Re: NTSB: State of Alaska’s high rate of aviation crashes warrants review.

Sat Feb 22, 2020 2:19 am

strfyr51 wrote:
NameOmitted wrote:
The NTSB issued a safety recommendation to the Federal Aviation Administration calling for the formation of a group focused on safety to better review, rank and integrate Alaska's unique aviation needs into the FAA safety enhancement process.

and even fewer runways
https://www.adn.com/alaska-news/aviation/2020/02/20/alaska-needs-broad-review-of-aviation-safety-ntsb-says/

With an accident rate more then twice the national average, it's well past time.

well? Lok at the flying in Alaska! That's bush flying at it's best! For damn sure there's going to be accidents! it's not like the Lower 48. there are few Nav aids and even fewer runways.
So what is the FAA going to mandate?

Bush flying is not to blame when flying off of 5k+ foot asphalt strips with full RNAV approaches, or CAT I/II/III ILS approaches, and having aircraft go off the ends of said runways when landing with tailwinds, or making bad decisions involving weather and passengers etc, most runways in Alaska are state maintained gravel or Asphalt.

Bush flying to most Alaska Pilots is off of gravel bars or rivers or other unimproved surfaces, and there is certainly an inherent risk to that.

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