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Aesma
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:20 am

LNCS0930 wrote:
T4thH wrote:
LNCS0930 wrote:
it’s not like 911 when people are afraid of someone doing something on a plane. People will get over this fast once the cases stop or dramatically slow


...but if the global economy has been harmed enough and we will be in the next global downturn for, let us say, 4 or 5 years, than the airlines will be again for prolonged time harmed. As the global economy was already weak with the trade war and Brexit as example, the Coronavirus just came to the wrong time and the on-going hysteric, we can see now, is even more worse. With the over capacities and many already weak airlines, not earning money....


I can’t see how this would impact the economy for 5 years. The only way that happens is if a vaccine never comes


Plenty of countries haven't even recovered from the last crisis. It was only a "virtual" crisis, created entirely on financial markets, yet it had widespread consequences. Here the impact is to the real economy, and to people, families. I hope we can recover fast, but it's just hope, not a prediction.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
LNCS0930
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:21 am

awhorto1 wrote:
DL just suspended ATL-FCO until Apr 1 and delayed the start of DTW-FCO. Would have loved to be a fly on the wall at those high-level discussions.


https://news.delta.com/delta-suspends-a ... -continues


Wouldn’t it have made more sense for them to drop JFK-FCO considering NYC has a hot spot of cases and Atlanta has like 4 total in the metro
 
Ishrion
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:26 am

LNCS0930 wrote:
awhorto1 wrote:
DL just suspended ATL-FCO until Apr 1 and delayed the start of DTW-FCO. Would have loved to be a fly on the wall at those high-level discussions.


https://news.delta.com/delta-suspends-a ... -continues


Wouldn’t it have made more sense for them to drop JFK-FCO considering NYC has a hot spot of cases and Atlanta has like 4 total in the metro


Is it about cases though? Or is it about declining demand...
 
timpdx
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:55 am

Well, in a bit of good news for the airlines, oil prices are TANKING, down 30% in one shot. This is more Saudi pissed off at Russia for not agreeing to cuts in production as well as Coronavirus fears. We are talking oil at $30. Astonishing drop.
Flown 2018: LAX, ARN, DXB, ALA, TAS, UCG, ASB, MYP, GYD, TBS, KUT, BER, TLS, SVO, CCF, DUB, LGW, MEX, BUR, PDX, ORD, SLC, SNA
Upcoming 2018: STL, MIA, BZE, IAH, BHM, LHR, DFW, PHX
 
MartijnNL
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:57 am

KLM has cancelled all flights to Milan and Venice on Monday.
 
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Jouhou
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:58 am

timpdx wrote:
Well, in a bit of good news for the airlines, oil prices are TANKING, down 30% in one shot. This is more Saudi pissed off at Russia for not agreeing to cuts in production as well as Coronavirus fears. We are talking oil at $30. Astonishing drop.


It won't save the industry, but this might make airlines better able to survive poor loads.
情報
 
smokeybandit
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 1:35 am

Someone intentionally coughed on a flight attendant as a protest for a long arrival delay waiting for a gate due to Coronavirus screening procedures

https://www.the-sun.com/news/507275/cab ... r-off-jet/
 
frmrCapCadet
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:13 am

https://oilprice.com/Energy/Energy-Gene ... egins.html

This blog has some of its own writers as well as reports from other media. I have found it useful. (but I really miss The Oil Drum)
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
Max Q
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Government aid to offset C Virus effect

Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:39 am

After 9-11 the US Govt provided direct subsidies to American Airlines that had to deal with huge traffic downturns



Maybe it’s time to consider this again ?
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


GGg
 
prebennorholm
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 3:09 am

FlyingJhawk wrote:
This has the potential of having an even bigger impact on travel that the great recession 2009-2011 - at least in the short term.

When will travel get back to normal?

Neither airlines nor airports seem to be very vocal about development of travel volumes. But today the CEO of CPH (Copenhagen Airport) Mr. Thomas Woldbye told that CPH has lately experienced a 33% reduction of passengers. And constantly reducing, so he is afraid that it can soon be cut to half.

33% reduction i unprecedented. The GFC, 9/11, SARS never caused so dramatic reductions. Here in Denmark it hasn't been seen since the outbreak of WWII.

CPH is a quite ordinary mid sized regional hub, serving southern Sweden and eastern Denmark. So I'm afraid that this 33% reduction is fairly typical for other ordinary airports as well.

(Denmark is one of the least Covid-19 affected countries so far, 35 people tested positive, no casualties, practically all skiing holiday makers in northern Italy).
Always keep your number of landings equal to your number of take-offs
 
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knope2001
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 3:56 am

More anecdotal loads, this time on select Delta (mostly) large RJ departures out of LGA on Monday 3/9. These are from seat maps less than 24 hours before departure so know that actual loads will likely vary a bit. But they give an idea of what a Monday out of LGA looks like

53.7%.....average for these 21 markets

70.6% ….. jax
68.4% ….. grr
64.9% ….. chs
60.8% ….. mke
60.5% ….. mem
60.0% ….. cle
59.6% ….. msn
58.8% ….. sdf
58.2% ….. mci
56.7% ….. rdu
56.1% ….. bhm
54.4% ….. gsp
52.5% ….. cmh
52.3% ….. buf
51.4% ….. bna
49.3% ….. gso
47.5% ….. ind
46.1% ….. stl
45.9% ….. pit
45.3% ….. ric
44.7% ….. clt

Just one day, of course, but I'd guess a few weeks ago these markets posted significantly higher loads on a Monday. For what it's worth in many markets the first flight of the day out of LGA was among the weakest, suggesting maybe some of the seats occupied mid-day were VFR visitors returning home while the business-heavy first-of-the-morning flights were light. Honestly I feared the numbers would be uglier but I'm guessing they won't be much better than this any time soon when it comes to business-heavy routes.
 
hoons90
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:50 am

bennett123 wrote:
Have flights between the USA and China/South Korea/Japan and Italy stopped yet?.


For March, DL will still have 15x weekly to Korea (5x each SEA, ATL, DTW) and UA will have 3x weekly SFO.
DL's regular schedule is 28x weekly (7x each from SEA, ATL, DTW, MSP). UA is 7x weekly from SFO (12x weekly from April)
AA and HA have suspended service until the end of April at the earliest.

KE will have daily to LAX and JFK, and less than daily service to SFO, ORD, ATL, IAD, HNL. No SEA, LAS, DFW, BOS.
Interestingly, OZ will still keep 2x daily to both LAX and JFK. HNL (except a few dates) and SEA are suspended. SFO was supposed to be suspended anyways before COVID-19 due to a court ruling related to the crash in 2013.
Flown: 2L 7C 9E 9L AA AB AC AF AY AZ BA BR BX B6 CA CO CP CX DL EK EY JL KE KL LA LH LX MQ NW OZ PD RW SQ TG TP TR TS US WG WN WS XE XJ
 
TSA125
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:58 am

hoons90 wrote:
bennett123 wrote:
Have flights between the USA and China/South Korea/Japan and Italy stopped yet?.


For March, DL will still have 15x weekly to Korea (5x each SEA, ATL, DTW) and UA will have 3x weekly SFO.
DL's regular schedule is 28x weekly (7x each from SEA, ATL, DTW, MSP). UA is 7x weekly from SFO (12x weekly from April)
AA and HA have suspended service until the end of April at the earliest.

KE will have daily to LAX and JFK, and less than daily service to SFO, ORD, ATL, IAD, HNL. No SEA, LAS, DFW, BOS.
Interestingly, OZ will still keep 2x daily to both LAX and JFK. HNL (except a few dates) and SEA are suspended. SFO was supposed to be suspended anyways before COVID-19 due to a court ruling related to the crash in 2013.


It'd be interesting to see whether KE will carry on with the upgrade of ORD from 77W to 748i in April. I highly doubt it at this point.
No not that TSA.
 
SCQ83
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:35 am

Reading this thread is so annoying with all those people giving their opinions about this should end ASAP because (obviously) they fear losing their aviation job!

radone wrote:
Romania suspended flights to/from Italy, all airports, between March 9th (starting at noon) and March 23rd. Moreover, all airlines operating in Romania are not allowed to transport passengers to Romania from Italy, China, South Korea, Iran via connecting flights

https://www.hotnews.ro/stiri-esential-2 ... stache.htm


I wonder what would be the impact on Blue Air? They are heavily dependent on Italy-Romania VFR routes and in addition they have quite a few routes out of Italy (including a base in TRN). No idea about their finances, but for a minor carrier this must be a blow up.
 
32andBelow
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Re: Government aid to offset C Virus effect

Mon Mar 09, 2020 7:01 am

Max Q wrote:
After 9-11 the US Govt provided direct subsidies to American Airlines that had to deal with huge traffic downturns



Maybe it’s time to consider this again ?

The airlines have made record profits for a decade. Can they really not handle 1 down quarter?
 
reply1984
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 7:05 am

Cathay could fly freight-only services on passenger jets after Japan curbs
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-heal ... SKBN20W0IG

Cathay now flies two daily flights to Beijing, and one flight is only for freight service on a passenger jet.
 
RvA
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Re: Government aid to offset C Virus effect

Mon Mar 09, 2020 7:05 am

32andBelow wrote:
Max Q wrote:
After 9-11 the US Govt provided direct subsidies to American Airlines that had to deal with huge traffic downturns



Maybe it’s time to consider this again ?

The airlines have made record profits for a decade. Can they really not handle 1 down quarter?


I think not all have had record profits and it also depends just how down that 1 quarter (More like year, don’t forget forward bookings are trashed) is.
 
KlimaBXsst
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 8:03 am

Guess the pilot shortage is over.
Aesthetically the A 340 got it right!
 
mcogator
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 8:08 am

My AF BOM-CDG flight was about 95%-99% full based on my guesstimate. I'm about to head to the gate for my CDG-LAX flight. Will report then.
“Traveling – it leaves you speechless, then turns you into a storyteller.” – Ibn Battuta
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 8:13 am

This is the aviation thread. To discuss the virus, please go to non-aviation thread: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=1438989
Winter is coming.
 
Mortyman
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 11:02 am

Lufthansa has decided to ground all Airbus 380 due to the virus til mid June:

https://www.aerotelegraph.com/lufthansa ... oronavirus
 
smolt
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 11:56 am

Japan Airlines anounced one of their cabin crew who was in charge of the flight Chicago-Tokyo at the end of last Feb has tested positive. S/he shows no symprom and is staying at home. And 14 co-workers on the same flight are also off duty, confined at home for days to come.
 
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MrBren
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:07 pm

Head of French airports group ADP tests positive for coronavirus.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-france-adp-idUSKBN20W1KY
 
mxaxai
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:17 pm

LH, Austrian, Swiss and Eurowings as well as SAS have published short term cuts until end of march:
LH: https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-06mar20/
OS: https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-06mar20/
LX: https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-06mar20/
EW: https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-06mar20/
SK: https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-06mar20/
Approximately 20% less for all of them, except only minor reductions at SAS.
 
1989worstyear
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Re: Government aid to offset C Virus effect

Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:35 pm

RvA wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
Max Q wrote:
After 9-11 the US Govt provided direct subsidies to American Airlines that had to deal with huge traffic downturns



Maybe it’s time to consider this again ?

The airlines have made record profits for a decade. Can they really not handle 1 down quarter?


I think not all have had record profits and it also depends just how down that 1 quarter (More like year, don’t forget forward bookings are trashed) is.


Are bookings really significantly down past May? Have any non-APAC airlines admitted this?
Stuck at age 15 thanks to the certification date of the A320-200 and my parents' decision to postpone having a kid by 3 years. At least there's Dignitas...
 
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hvusslax
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 1:45 pm

Waterbomber2 wrote:
-Cabin cleaning. Someone posted a video of how seriously Qatar Airways is taking cabin cleaning. However, if you look well, they are using a cabin cleaner that is not a disinfectant but a detergent. So instead of disinfecting the cabin, they might actually be spreading germs all over the place. Not cleaning is better than cleaning the wrong way.


Regular detergent actually is a powerful disinfectant against this type of virus and the use of harsher chemicals like chlorine doesn't necessarily add anything beyond just thorough cleaning with soap and water. This Coronavirus has a lipid bilayer envelope that dissolves in regular soap so that the virus disintegrates. This is also the reason why washing hands with soap is the number one recommendation everywhere for slowing the virus down. Alcohol-based hand sanitizers are also useful but are no replacement for washing hands with soap.
 
slider
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 1:52 pm

UA has evidently suspended all new hire classes for FAs and pilots, and soliciting for voluntary leaves.
 
o0OOO0oChris
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:06 pm

Oil is down 20%, Dow -7%.
On the positive side: Cheap oil will help while ticket prices are down.
 
SimonDanger
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:23 pm

smolt wrote:
Japan Airlines anounced one of their cabin crew who was in charge of the flight Chicago-Tokyo at the end of last Feb has tested positive. S/he shows no symprom and is staying at home. And 14 co-workers on the same flight are also off duty, confined at home for days to come.


By now it is appearing that flight crew are a likely vector for how COVID-19 has spread so quickly across the globe. But not to just single out flight crew, cruise operations staff and crew have also played a significant role in the spread, as one would guess hotel and ride-sharing employees have as well.

Having said the above, is anyone else wondering if we are going to see any new airport security (theater) protocols being implemented going forward? I know that some airports (China if not mistaken) have thermal cameras that scan crowds of people at a time. What other options are worthwhile?
 
SeoulIncheon
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:30 pm

TSA125 wrote:
hoons90 wrote:
bennett123 wrote:
Have flights between the USA and China/South Korea/Japan and Italy stopped yet?.


For March, DL will still have 15x weekly to Korea (5x each SEA, ATL, DTW) and UA will have 3x weekly SFO.
DL's regular schedule is 28x weekly (7x each from SEA, ATL, DTW, MSP). UA is 7x weekly from SFO (12x weekly from April)
AA and HA have suspended service until the end of April at the earliest.

KE will have daily to LAX and JFK, and less than daily service to SFO, ORD, ATL, IAD, HNL. No SEA, LAS, DFW, BOS.
Interestingly, OZ will still keep 2x daily to both LAX and JFK. HNL (except a few dates) and SEA are suspended. SFO was supposed to be suspended anyways before COVID-19 due to a court ruling related to the crash in 2013.


It'd be interesting to see whether KE will carry on with the upgrade of ORD from 77W to 748i in April. I highly doubt it at this point.


Interestingly no indication of KE001 ICN-NRT-HNL reduced or cut despite Japan entry ban on Koreans. This flight seems to be the last flight of KE between Korea and Japan.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:44 pm

o0OOO0oChris wrote:
Oil is down 20%, Dow -7%.
On the positive side: Cheap oil will help while ticket prices are down.


Keep in mind United Airlines is uniquely exposed to a downturn in the oil industry, because of their large hub in IAH (Arguably the World Capital of Energy).
Status for 2019/2020: AAdvantage Platinum, Delta Gold, Southwest A-List
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:50 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
o0OOO0oChris wrote:
Oil is down 20%, Dow -7%.
On the positive side: Cheap oil will help while ticket prices are down.


Keep in mind United Airlines is uniquely exposed to a downturn in the oil industry, because of their large hub in IAH (Arguably the World Capital of Energy).


Uh huh, and what percentage of UA's total traffic does Houston-originating traffic represent? It's really not material across a carrier with 5,000 daily departures and 162 million passengers a year.
 
SimonDanger
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:51 pm

SouthWest sent an email this morning with this:

We want you to feel confident when traveling with Southwest Airlines. As a result, we have enhanced some of our cleaning procedures in the interest of our Customers' and Employees' health and safety.

Aircraft Cleaning: We spend between 6-7 hours cleaning each aircraft every night, and, as of March 4, 2020, we have enhanced our overnight cleaning procedures. Typically, we use an EPA approved, hospital-grade disinfectant in the lavatories and an interior cleaner in the cabin. Now, we are expanding the use of the hospital-grade disinfectant throughout the aircraft, and it will be used in the cabin, on elements in the flight deck, and in the lavatory. This goes beyond the standard CDC guidelines.

Also, we equip each of our aircraft with a HEPA (High Efficiency Particulate Air) filter, which filters out recirculated air onboard each plane to remove airborne particles. HEPA filters are also used in hospitals to provide patients with clean air.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 3:03 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
o0OOO0oChris wrote:
Oil is down 20%, Dow -7%.
On the positive side: Cheap oil will help while ticket prices are down.


Keep in mind United Airlines is uniquely exposed to a downturn in the oil industry, because of their large hub in IAH (Arguably the World Capital of Energy).


Uh huh, and what percentage of UA's total traffic does Houston-originating traffic represent? It's really not material across a carrier with 5,000 daily departures and 162 million passengers a year.


Go back and read UA's Q3 2015 earnings call, IAH and the Energy sector is very important to their bottom line.

"The energy business is the one that we are watching really, really closely."

"We continue to see degradation from our corporate energy customers. With revenue down approximately 35% year-over-year representing roughly one point of PRASM decline"
Status for 2019/2020: AAdvantage Platinum, Delta Gold, Southwest A-List
 
Western727
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 3:04 pm

After EK finally made its change fee waiver apply across the board yesterday, we postponed our IAH-DXB roundtrip for Friday 13 March/Sun 22 March to late November. The fare difference (for four of us) was a surprisingly-small US$602.

While we're bummed to not be able to see my expat sister and her family of 6 who live in the Emirates, there's a silver lining: 1) it won't be as hot in late November as it will be next week; 2) Expo 2020 will be happening then; and 3) the return flight (EK211) will likely be a polar flight with the strong tradewinds at the time of the year.
Jack @ AUS
 
oschkosch
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 3:32 pm

[quote="Western727"]

While we're bummed to not be able to see my expat sister and her family of 6 who live in the Emirates, there's a silver lining: ..............2) Expo 2020 will be happening then; and 3) the return flight (EK211) will likely be a polar flight with the strong tradewinds at the time of the year./quote]

Inshallah is the best Arabic language term for that: it means "if God wills it". In general all kind of public events in the coming months have been cancelled. Ok, November is still far away. Hope it works out for you!
:stirthepot: :airplane: "This airplane is designed by clowns, who in turn are supervised by monkeys" :airplane: :stirthepot:
 
jetmatt777
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 3:34 pm

SimonDanger wrote:
SouthWest sent an email this morning with this:

We want you to feel confident when traveling with Southwest Airlines. As a result, we have enhanced some of our cleaning procedures in the interest of our Customers' and Employees' health and safety.

Aircraft Cleaning: We spend between 6-7 hours cleaning each aircraft every night, and, as of March 4, 2020, we have enhanced our overnight cleaning procedures. Typically, we use an EPA approved, hospital-grade disinfectant in the lavatories and an interior cleaner in the cabin. Now, we are expanding the use of the hospital-grade disinfectant throughout the aircraft, and it will be used in the cabin, on elements in the flight deck, and in the lavatory. This goes beyond the standard CDC guidelines.

Also, we equip each of our aircraft with a HEPA (High Efficiency Particulate Air) filter, which filters out recirculated air onboard each plane to remove airborne particles. HEPA filters are also used in hospitals to provide patients with clean air.


No airline spends 6-7 hours a night cleaning planes. That is a disingenuous statement because they may spend 6 man hours. (I would even call that a stretch) because a cleaning crew for a narrowbody is typically about 6 people and they are usually done in about 15 minutes. That's 1.5 man hours. I've never seen any airline use more than 6 people or take longer than 15-20 minutes for a RON clean.
 
o0OOO0oChris
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:17 pm

jetmatt777 wrote:
SimonDanger wrote:
SouthWest sent an email this morning with this:

We want you to feel confident when traveling with Southwest Airlines. As a result, we have enhanced some of our cleaning procedures in the interest of our Customers' and Employees' health and safety.

Aircraft Cleaning: We spend between 6-7 hours cleaning each aircraft every night, and, as of March 4, 2020, we have enhanced our overnight cleaning procedures. Typically, we use an EPA approved, hospital-grade disinfectant in the lavatories and an interior cleaner in the cabin. Now, we are expanding the use of the hospital-grade disinfectant throughout the aircraft, and it will be used in the cabin, on elements in the flight deck, and in the lavatory. This goes beyond the standard CDC guidelines.

Also, we equip each of our aircraft with a HEPA (High Efficiency Particulate Air) filter, which filters out recirculated air onboard each plane to remove airborne particles. HEPA filters are also used in hospitals to provide patients with clean air.


No airline spends 6-7 hours a night cleaning planes. That is a disingenuous statement because they may spend 6 man hours. (I would even call that a stretch) because a cleaning crew for a narrowbody is typically about 6 people and they are usually done in about 15 minutes. That's 1.5 man hours. I've never seen any airline use more than 6 people or take longer than 15-20 minutes for a RON clean.


Very smart people at SW. Already creating added situational value to their product compared to their competitors. I like that a lot. When life gives you lemons, make juice out of it. Well played!

@jetmatt777 Are aircraft substantially desinfected in that time you quoted or is this just cleaning?
But there is a cheaper way to do this. Some hospitals use UV-C to desinfect rooms fast. With equipment like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qMsPvxS2z4
No need to wipe every surface, UV-C kills basically all bad things sticking to the surfaces. Viruses only need very low doses to kill. No expensive disinfectant, just electric power needed here. But probably the plastics arn't UV-C proof.
 
indcwby
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Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:53 pm

jetmatt777 wrote:
SimonDanger wrote:
SouthWest sent an email this morning with this:

We want you to feel confident when traveling with Southwest Airlines. As a result, we have enhanced some of our cleaning procedures in the interest of our Customers' and Employees' health and safety.

Aircraft Cleaning: We spend between 6-7 hours cleaning each aircraft every night, and, as of March 4, 2020, we have enhanced our overnight cleaning procedures. Typically, we use an EPA approved, hospital-grade disinfectant in the lavatories and an interior cleaner in the cabin. Now, we are expanding the use of the hospital-grade disinfectant throughout the aircraft, and it will be used in the cabin, on elements in the flight deck, and in the lavatory. This goes beyond the standard CDC guidelines.

Also, we equip each of our aircraft with a HEPA (High Efficiency Particulate Air) filter, which filters out recirculated air onboard each plane to remove airborne particles. HEPA filters are also used in hospitals to provide patients with clean air.


No airline spends 6-7 hours a night cleaning planes. That is a disingenuous statement because they may spend 6 man hours. (I would even call that a stretch) because a cleaning crew for a narrowbody is typically about 6 people and they are usually done in about 15 minutes. That's 1.5 man hours. I've never seen any airline use more than 6 people or take longer than 15-20 minutes for a RON clean.


I can attest to the cleaning part. Before my 6am flight out of FLL-HOU, I could see crews cleaning the interior. They were lifting shades up and cleaning. Is it 100% cleaned, probably not, but they were doing it.
A319, A320, A330, A340, B717, B727, B737, B747, B757, B767, B777, CRJ7, DC10, MD88, MD11, E145, E175
"Always remember that you fly an airplane with your head, not your hands."
 
hollywoodcory
Posts: 173
Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2016 3:29 am

Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:53 pm

AC appears to have delayed the seasonal resumption of YYZ-MXP until May, previously planned for March 29. YYC-NRT season resumption is delayed until July.
 
indcwby
Posts: 332
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2010 7:32 pm

Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:55 pm

What amazed me on my trip from HOU - MCO, we were stuck at ATL for a few hours overnight for a maintenance issue. They had cleaning crews walking up and down empty gate areas spraying disinfectant on any surface in front of them (i.e. Carpet, seating, table tops, counters, etc). Delta's aircraft towards the end of the day, for my 3 planes I had to get on, 2 of them were still dirty, tissues tucked in seat backs etc.
A319, A320, A330, A340, B717, B727, B737, B747, B757, B767, B777, CRJ7, DC10, MD88, MD11, E145, E175
"Always remember that you fly an airplane with your head, not your hands."
 
Adipocere
Posts: 323
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2015 9:35 am

Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:13 pm

After the recommendation against taking cruises will the government next turn its gaze towards commercial aviation and put in a similar recommendation or even order a nationwide ground stop for the entire spring and summer until the coronavirus season is gone or has a cure?
 
User avatar
ojjunior
Posts: 969
Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:31 am

Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:16 pm

Meanwhile

DL is sending the 77L to GRU once a week from ATL (At least last 3 weeks it has happened)
UA upgauged IAD-GRU from 763 to 772 since Mar,7th
UA swapping between 789, 763 and 764 on IAH-GRU service

Widebodies previously assigned to Asia routes now reassigned?
 
flyCMH
Posts: 2320
Joined: Fri Jul 09, 1999 12:15 pm

Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:22 pm

MrBren wrote:
Head of French airports group ADP tests positive for coronavirus.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-france-adp-idUSKBN20W1KY


Another airport head has contracted the virus, this time in NYC:

https://www.nydailynews.com/news/politi ... story.html
 
User avatar
Aesma
Posts: 13219
Joined: Sat Nov 14, 2009 6:14 am

Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:34 pm

Well Elon has almost ended his career in a tweet, so having a secondary account to say things that would not go well on the primary one, and calling it a "parody" is just another layer of defense against a repeat.

SimonDanger wrote:
SouthWest sent an email this morning with this:

We want you to feel confident when traveling with Southwest Airlines. As a result, we have enhanced some of our cleaning procedures in the interest of our Customers' and Employees' health and safety.

Aircraft Cleaning: We spend between 6-7 hours cleaning each aircraft every night, and, as of March 4, 2020, we have enhanced our overnight cleaning procedures. Typically, we use an EPA approved, hospital-grade disinfectant in the lavatories and an interior cleaner in the cabin. Now, we are expanding the use of the hospital-grade disinfectant throughout the aircraft, and it will be used in the cabin, on elements in the flight deck, and in the lavatory. This goes beyond the standard CDC guidelines.

Also, we equip each of our aircraft with a HEPA (High Efficiency Particulate Air) filter, which filters out recirculated air onboard each plane to remove airborne particles. HEPA filters are also used in hospitals to provide patients with clean air.


Basically they're telling us to take the first flight of the day, right ?
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
bennett123
Posts: 9788
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:48 pm

18:33
Breaking
Israel to quarantine all arrivals
Israel is to require all people arriving in the country from abroad to self-quarantine for 14 days as a precaution against the spread of coronavirus, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has said.

Source BBC Website

For anyone who is not returning home to Israel, why would you visit.

I imagine that flights will largely dry up.

Also what about flight crews?. You operate a flight to Tel Aviv and are quarantined for 14 days.
 
bennett123
Posts: 9788
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 7:16 pm

18:57
Quarantine effective immediately for Israelis, minister says
Israel's Interior Minister Aryeh Deri has clarified what the country's newly announced quarantine policy will mean for Israeli and foreign citizens.
He said all Israelis arriving in the country must enter a 14-day quarantine as of Monday night.
For foreign citizens arriving in the country, the policy will come into effect on Thursday.

Why the difference?.
 
FCAFLYBOY
Posts: 686
Joined: Sun Nov 05, 2006 5:03 am

Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 7:20 pm

bennett123 wrote:
18:57
Quarantine effective immediately for Israelis, minister says
Israel's Interior Minister Aryeh Deri has clarified what the country's newly announced quarantine policy will mean for Israeli and foreign citizens.
He said all Israelis arriving in the country must enter a 14-day quarantine as of Monday night.
For foreign citizens arriving in the country, the policy will come into effect on Thursday.

Why the difference?.


I suspect to allow foreign nationals/expats who may wish to leave to do so, and also for aircrew on layover time leave also, without the restrictions. Sensible really. It gives 72 hours for non-Israelis and airline to make adjustments.
 
 
SimonDanger
Posts: 83
Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2014 5:51 pm

Re: Coronavirus Aviation Related News & Discussion Thread - March 2020

Mon Mar 09, 2020 8:06 pm

Aesma wrote:

Basically they're telling us to take the first flight of the day, right ?


That would be excellent advice for anyone just a little nervous about flying right now but I'm still concerned about the transmissibility of the crew doing the cleaning. If your job is to clean dozens of aircraft each night, it would seem you are at the greatest risk of contracting and then spreading the virus...unless these crews are decked out in full hazmat suits, which I have no knowledge of.

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