That was a threat to the airlines to agree to hand over the data and really nothing else.

If you know who's in 8A, then you know who's in rows 7 and 9, too. Unless you're WN.

The Japanese government chartered B767-300ER, reg JA607A to salvage her nationals living or staying in Muhan. It had been done
for five times. About one percentage of the passenger tested positive. After disembarkment, they were taken to 14 days quarantine at a hotel, but one passenger rejected the quarantine, and went home.
Very unfortunately, he got fever days lster and tested positive. Further more, his little boy turned out infected.
I just wonder, ANA flew the same ship for ordinary domestic flight within only 24 hours, or even within 12 hours. Do you think it is enough time for the cabin to be sufficiently sterlized‍?

o0OOO0oChris wrote:

@jetmatt777 Are aircraft substantially desinfected in that time you quoted or is this just cleaning?
But there is a cheaper way to do this. Some hospitals use UV-C to desinfect rooms fast. With equipment like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qMsPvxS2z4
No need to wipe every surface, UV-C kills basically all bad things sticking to the surfaces. Viruses only need very low doses to kill. No expensive disinfectant, just electric power needed here. But probably the plastics arn't UV-C proof.

Yeah, I'm honestly not sure why airlines didn't already disinfect planes with UV lights before the outbreak. Seems like it'd be faster and cheaper than spending a lot of time wiping down surfaces. Should be standard practice going forward - maybe airplane cabins could even be installed with strong overhead UV lighting that's able to be turned on with a "cleaning mode" in between flights or something similar to save the hassle of rolling in big disinfecting light setups like hospitals use.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/italy-bols ... 1583756737

"Italy Virus Containment Measures Extended to Entire Country -- Prime Minister *Extension Means Only Essential Travel To, From And Within All Of Italy Is Allowed"

"The country's residents should avoid traveling unless they can prove it’s because of a medical or work emergency"

Air travel to/from Italy will likely be down to the absolute bare minimum by later this week

LNCS0930 wrote:

slider wrote:

UA has evidently suspended all new hire classes for FAs and pilots, and soliciting for voluntary leaves.

That seems somewhat suicidal and is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. Meanwhile, has AA and DL not even announced a cut to domestic capacity yet?

No, suicidal is knowing you will lose millions of dollars flying routes & you still fly them anyway....UA is being proactive, DL/AA are being reactive....

slider wrote:

UA has evidently suspended all new hire classes for FAs and pilots, and soliciting for voluntary leaves.

That seems somewhat suicidal and is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. Meanwhile, has AA and DL not even announced a cut to domestic capacity yet?

LNCS0930 wrote:

slider wrote:

UA has evidently suspended all new hire classes for FAs and pilots, and soliciting for voluntary leaves.

That seems somewhat suicidal and is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. Meanwhile, has AA and DL not even announced a cut to domestic capacity yet?

Problem might not be that temporary if a deep recession is on the horizon.

So are non Italian citizens still able to fly to Italy? Despite the ban in northern Italy, there were still flights going to/from many of the airports in the red zone.

China is reporting that one JAL crew had been confirmed as Coronavirus positive on 5th March. The said crew operated JAL flight between NRT and ORD on 25th February. It is said that when she operated the flight, she already showed symptoms of low grade fever (is this a correct term? or low temperature?). She wore masks and gloves during the flight.

The news is in Chinese and I am sure there is Japanese versions available somewhere. Maybe English version too.

LINK: http://news.carnoc.com/list/525/525969.html

https://paxex.aero/2020/03/qantas-route ... paign=3917

"Qantas cuts international 25% through September facing coronavirus-induced demand drop"

Beyond the reduced flying schedule the carrier will also halt its share buyback efforts and undertake a number of other efforts:

Annual management bonuses set to zero for FY20.
For the remainder of FY20:
Qantas Chairman will take no fees.
Group CEO will take no salary.
Qantas Board will take a 30 per cent reduction in fees.
Group Executive Management will take a 30 per cent pay cut.
Freeze of all non-essential recruitment and consultancy work.
Asking all Qantas and Jetstar employees to take paid or unpaid leave in light of reduced flying activity.

Midwestindy wrote:

https://paxex.aero/2020/03/qantas-route-cuts-coronavirus-covid-19/?utm_source=TW&utm_medium=WA-TW&utm_campaign=3917

"Qantas cuts international 25% through September facing coronavirus-induced demand drop"

Beyond the reduced flying schedule the carrier will also halt its share buyback efforts and undertake a number of other efforts:

Annual management bonuses set to zero for FY20.
For the remainder of FY20:
Qantas Chairman will take no fees.
Group CEO will take no salary.
Qantas Board will take a 30 per cent reduction in fees.
Group Executive Management will take a 30 per cent pay cut.
Freeze of all non-essential recruitment and consultancy work.
Asking all Qantas and Jetstar employees to take paid or unpaid leave in light of reduced flying activity.

I understand taking a salary cut. But in the end the chairman and CEO did work in 2020 and the virus is not of their don't. Going to zero doesn't seem like a good idea and is a bad precedent. The significant, but not 100%, cuts seem like a better move that should have applied to chairman and CEO as well.

B747forever wrote:

So are non Italian citizens still able to fly to Italy? Despite the ban in northern Italy, there were still flights going to/from many of the airports in the red zone.

about hundred more death within the last 24 hours in italy
italy now has a lock down on travel for the whole country

source:
https://www.google.com/url?q=https://ww ... sbMm7yisbF

Welp guess I'm just gonna lose thousands on my Italy trip. But I have other's to think about and can't risk them getting sick even if I ~*think*~ I'll be fine. I'm sad that AZ is offering me nothing but it is what it is.

LNCS0930 wrote:

slider wrote:

UA has evidently suspended all new hire classes for FAs and pilots, and soliciting for voluntary leaves.

That seems somewhat suicidal and is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. Meanwhile, has AA and DL not even announced a cut to domestic capacity yet?

They are cutting domestic capacity, they just haven't made a big splash about it. The cuts are happening, inventory is being zero'd out. They will likely all post for April in next week's schedule update. Not to mention all the international stuff thats been pulled down.

gatibosgru wrote:

Welp guess I'm just gonna lose thousands on my Italy trip. But I have other's to think about and can't risk them getting sick even if I ~*think*~ I'll be fine. I'm sad that AZ is offering me nothing but it is what it is.

When is your trip?

EIBPI wrote:

gatibosgru wrote:

Welp guess I'm just gonna lose thousands on my Italy trip. But I have other's to think about and can't risk them getting sick even if I ~*think*~ I'll be fine. I'm sad that AZ is offering me nothing but it is what it is.

When is your trip?

Tuesday.

gatibosgru wrote:

Welp guess I'm just gonna lose thousands on my Italy trip. But I have other's to think about and can't risk them getting sick even if I ~*think*~ I'll be fine. I'm sad that AZ is offering me nothing but it is what it is.

Aren't most airlines offering future credit if you cancel?

I've been thinking - flying itself doesn't seem to pose an extraordinary risk of contracting the disease. There's quite a few members here who've flown frequently of late and none are reporting being sick themselves. There are thousands of flight attendants working in the cabins on tens of thousands of flights and if lots of them were getting sick it would certainly be big news all over the media. I understand the thought process of cancelling flights to areas where the disease is widespread so that people from those areas don't travel to other areas and bring it with them and so that people aren't taken to those areas to catch it. But seems to me at least that the environment of the aircraft itself isn't a major contributing factor

gatibosgru wrote:

EIBPI wrote:

gatibosgru wrote:

Welp guess I'm just gonna lose thousands on my Italy trip. But I have other's to think about and can't risk them getting sick even if I ~*think*~ I'll be fine. I'm sad that AZ is offering me nothing but it is what it is.

When is your trip?

Tuesday.

That's worth having another discussion with Alitalia now that the Prime Minister has extended the no-travel zone to the entire country. www.nytimes.com/2020/03/09/world/coronavirus-news.html

Trololzilla wrote:

Yeah, I'm honestly not sure why airlines didn't already disinfect planes with UV lights before the outbreak. Seems like it'd be faster and cheaper than spending a lot of time wiping down surfaces. Should be standard practice going forward - maybe airplane cabins could even be installed with strong overhead UV lighting that's able to be turned on with a "cleaning mode" in between flights or something similar to save the hassle of rolling in big disinfecting light setups like hospitals use.

Consider it is the same reason why folks want the airlines to continue flying, the amount of money in the chemical industry that makes cleaning fluids and disinfectants. The world population know about cleaning fluids, UV light cleaners are not known so......

smokeybandit wrote:

gatibosgru wrote:

Welp guess I'm just gonna lose thousands on my Italy trip. But I have other's to think about and can't risk them getting sick even if I ~*think*~ I'll be fine. I'm sad that AZ is offering me nothing but it is what it is.

Aren't most airlines offering future credit if you cancel?

Alitalia is not offering anything for those who booked before March.

indcwby wrote:

jetmatt777 wrote:

SimonDanger wrote:

SouthWest sent an email this morning with this:

We want you to feel confident when traveling with Southwest Airlines. As a result, we have enhanced some of our cleaning procedures in the interest of our Customers' and Employees' health and safety.

Aircraft Cleaning: We spend between 6-7 hours cleaning each aircraft every night, and, as of March 4, 2020, we have enhanced our overnight cleaning procedures. Typically, we use an EPA approved, hospital-grade disinfectant in the lavatories and an interior cleaner in the cabin. Now, we are expanding the use of the hospital-grade disinfectant throughout the aircraft, and it will be used in the cabin, on elements in the flight deck, and in the lavatory. This goes beyond the standard CDC guidelines.

Also, we equip each of our aircraft with a HEPA (High Efficiency Particulate Air) filter, which filters out recirculated air onboard each plane to remove airborne particles. HEPA filters are also used in hospitals to provide patients with clean air.

No airline spends 6-7 hours a night cleaning planes. That is a disingenuous statement because they may spend 6 man hours. (I would even call that a stretch) because a cleaning crew for a narrowbody is typically about 6 people and they are usually done in about 15 minutes. That's 1.5 man hours. I've never seen any airline use more than 6 people or take longer than 15-20 minutes for a RON clean.

I can attest to the cleaning part. Before my 6am flight out of FLL-HOU, I could see crews cleaning the interior. They were lifting shades up and cleaning. Is it 100% cleaned, probably not, but they were doing it.

I'm not disputing that they are cleaned. But Southwest said they spend 6-7 hours per night on every aircraft and that is 100% false.

gatibosgru wrote:

smokeybandit wrote:

gatibosgru wrote:

Welp guess I'm just gonna lose thousands on my Italy trip. But I have other's to think about and can't risk them getting sick even if I ~*think*~ I'll be fine. I'm sad that AZ is offering me nothing but it is what it is.

Aren't most airlines offering future credit if you cancel?

Alitalia is not offering anything for those who booked before March.

They must be about to change that with the new travel restrictions.

jetmatt777 wrote:

indcwby wrote:

jetmatt777 wrote:

No airline spends 6-7 hours a night cleaning planes. That is a disingenuous statement because they may spend 6 man hours. (I would even call that a stretch) because a cleaning crew for a narrowbody is typically about 6 people and they are usually done in about 15 minutes. That's 1.5 man hours. I've never seen any airline use more than 6 people or take longer than 15-20 minutes for a RON clean.

I can attest to the cleaning part. Before my 6am flight out of FLL-HOU, I could see crews cleaning the interior. They were lifting shades up and cleaning. Is it 100% cleaned, probably not, but they were doing it.

I'm not disputing that they are cleaned. But Southwest said they spend 6-7 hours per night on every aircraft and that is 100% false.

Their blog post is worded differently

"Southwest aircraft routinely undergo more than six labor hours of cleaning every night."

https://www.southwestaircommunity.com/t ... a-p/102360

It's all still kind of funny though. It just means their aircraft are clean for the first flight of the day.

ER757 wrote:

I've been thinking - flying itself doesn't seem to pose an extraordinary risk of contracting the disease. There's quite a few members here who've flown frequently of late and none are reporting being sick themselves. There are thousands of flight attendants working in the cabins on tens of thousands of flights and if lots of them were getting sick it would certainly be big news all over the media. I understand the thought process of cancelling flights to areas where the disease is widespread so that people from those areas don't travel to other areas and bring it with them and so that people aren't taken to those areas to catch it. But seems to me at least that the environment of the aircraft itself isn't a major contributing factor

Look at the recent cases in Vietnam. There were no new cases for 22 days, then 1 infected person flew to Hanoi, and 11 nearby passengers contracted the disease (none showed any symptoms, but the Vietnamese government tracked down all on the flight, quarantined and tested them all).

Korean Air survival at stake, may go out of business.

https://skift.com/2020/03/09/korean-air ... -business/

My AF66 flight from CDG-LAX today was about 40% full in J, and looked to me about 60% full in Y(judging by line outside and baggage claim). LAX looks like business as usual, nothing out of the ordinary, except for being a little sparse, but still quite a few people.

Even if there are 100 people who are infected per 1 reported, people are taking this way too far. If you are not elderly or have preexisting conditions(or come into contact with those), I would go about your business. If My parents live in Florida while I live in LA, I won't be visiting them until this is done. But myself? I'm not in the least bit worried other than missing some work if I get sick. I have a wedding in Cabo in 10 days I cant wait to attend.

Korea Air could collapse if the situation continues

https://www.aerotime.aero/aerotime.team ... oronavirus

The airlines aren't the only industry that is going to need help. A lot of over leveraged organizations (companies) and municipalities who issued a ton of debt (i.e airport and stadiums )could be in a world of hurt. Think of Las Vegas/Chicago or NYC.

A more general stimulus plan - e.g.tax payer rebates makes more sense. And then hope a vaccine is discovered soon.

knope2001 wrote:

More anecdotal loads, this time on select Delta (mostly) large RJ departures out of LGA on Monday 3/9. These are from seat maps less than 24 hours before departure so know that actual loads will likely vary a bit. But they give an idea of what a Monday out of LGA looks like

53.7%.....average for these 21 markets

70.6% ….. jax
68.4% ….. grr
64.9% ….. chs
60.8% ….. mke
60.5% ….. mem
60.0% ….. cle
59.6% ….. msn
58.8% ….. sdf
58.2% ….. mci
56.7% ….. rdu
56.1% ….. bhm
54.4% ….. gsp
52.5% ….. cmh
52.3% ….. buf
51.4% ….. bna
49.3% ….. gso
47.5% ….. ind
46.1% ….. stl
45.9% ….. pit
45.3% ….. ric
44.7% ….. clt

LF based on seatmaps for Tuesday 3/10 on those same departing Delta LGA large-RJ routes are more what I feared. About 1/4 of all departures look to be booked to about 25% or less. Again, these are seat maps under 24 hours before departure so there will likey be a little "play" between what I see today and tomorrow's actual loads. But in general it looks like planes are averaging not much better than 2/3 empty tomorrow, Tuesday 3/10.

34.9%.....average for these 21 markets (raw load, not weighted by distance)

72.8% ….. jax --- probably benefits from spring break demand this time of year
49.6% ….. chs
43.4% ….. sdf
42.5% ….. grr
41.3% ….. mci
39.5% ….. gsp
38.4% ….. stl
35.8% ….. mke
34.7% ….. bna
34.3% ….. cmh
34.2% ….. msn
33.9% ….. rdu
33.8% ….. mem
33.2% ….. gso
29.9% ….. buf
29.2% ….. ind
28.9% ….. cle
28.3% ….. bhm
28.1% ….. clt
26.6% ….. pit
26.4% ….. ric

gatibosgru wrote:

smokeybandit wrote:

gatibosgru wrote:

Welp guess I'm just gonna lose thousands on my Italy trip. But I have other's to think about and can't risk them getting sick even if I ~*think*~ I'll be fine. I'm sad that AZ is offering me nothing but it is what it is.

Aren't most airlines offering future credit if you cancel?

Alitalia is not offering anything for those who booked before March.

I don't understand this. Why only if you booked in March? It's idiotic and a slap in the face as far as I'm concerned to everyone who booked prior. At this point, airlines should allow full refunds to and from affected areas, at least the primary zones.

Have a trip to MUC in May, booked back in November. Planned to drive into Italy for a portion of the trip which was a big part of the vacation. Now, I'm just hoping DL will eventually allow me credit without fees... I know it hasn't affected Germany, yet, but it's a matter of time. If anything, I'm out $600 so it could be worse I suppose...

How is domestic air travel any worse than using mass-transit or being in any space with a gathering of people?

A lot of irrational fear out there.....

Tankdiver wrote:

Korea Air could collapse if the situation continues

https://www.aerotime.aero/aerotime.team ... oronavirus

The good news for them is cases continue to slow in Korea with only 100 something more today. They might be good there in a few weeks but they really need the other Asian countries to come back on board too

LTCM wrote:

I understand taking a salary cut. But in the end the chairman and CEO did work in 2020 and the virus is not of their don't. Going to zero doesn't seem like a good idea and is a bad precedent. The significant, but not 100%, cuts seem like a better move that should have applied to chairman and CEO as well.

The point is that they are asking staff to take unpaid leave so leading by example by foregoing their own wage for a few months. The cuts to executive wages will allow them to keep paying dozens of frontline staff week-to-week.

Anyone hear how Emirates is holding up to this crisis? They have a global hub at DXB with lots of Asian and European connectivity. They fly nothing but wide bodies, of which 115 are A380's. How are their bookings - Are they flying near-empty A380's and B77W's? Are they parking planes and furloughing staff yet?

Very slow start to the usual busy Spring Break travel season with my airline at BNA. Non-Rev galore.

Was supposed to fly PHL-ATL on DL on Saturday but cancelled that and got credit and am now flying out of EWR on Friday on United. Flight was ridiculously cheap for this close in advance. UA and AA still not offering no change fee for flights booked before March so am glad I had DL for the first one since I booked in Feb.

qf002 wrote:

LTCM wrote:

I understand taking a salary cut. But in the end the chairman and CEO did work in 2020 and the virus is not of their don't. Going to zero doesn't seem like a good idea and is a bad precedent. The significant, but not 100%, cuts seem like a better move that should have applied to chairman and CEO as well.

The point is that they are asking staff to take unpaid leave so leading by example by foregoing their own wage for a few months. The cuts to executive wages will allow them to keep paying dozens of frontline staff week-to-week.

Also, you will find that Alan Joyce is not foregoing his entire FY2020 remuneration, but "only" for the remainder of the FY (until 30 June). I think it is a great precedent and leading by example. He has been the highest-paid CEO in Australia last year (deservedly in my view), so clearly can afford it unlike many frontline staff that earn a much more modest salary and have mortgages etc. to pay.

LNCS0930 wrote:

Tankdiver wrote:

Korea Air could collapse if the situation continues

https://www.aerotime.aero/aerotime.team ... oronavirus

The good news for them is cases continue to slow in Korea with only 100 something more today. They might be good there in a few weeks but they really need the other Asian countries to come back on board too

If KE starts discussing survival odds I bet other airlines in Korea would be discussing their bankruptcy date... Asiana Airlines was already in financial trouble before Corona Virus outbreak already. If the buyer (Hyundai construction) cancels the Asiana buy-out deal it's end of the life for Asiana Airlines.
Not to mention independent LCCs who lost entire international routes - in a country where domestic flying hardly makes any money...

smokeybandit wrote:

jetmatt777 wrote:

indcwby wrote:

I can attest to the cleaning part. Before my 6am flight out of FLL-HOU, I could see crews cleaning the interior. They were lifting shades up and cleaning. Is it 100% cleaned, probably not, but they were doing it.

I'm not disputing that they are cleaned. But Southwest said they spend 6-7 hours per night on every aircraft and that is 100% false.

Their blog post is worded differently

"Southwest aircraft routinely undergo more than six labor hours of cleaning every night."

https://www.southwestaircommunity.com/t ... a-p/102360

It's all still kind of funny though. It just means their aircraft are clean for the first flight of the day.

I just can't see that still. I never see more than 6 or 7 people on a cleaning team for a narrowbody. And they knock them out pretty quick. A half hour at the absolute most.

That's about 3-4 man hours at the most, still way under what they are putting out there.

I agree with your point though

FLALEFTY wrote:

Anyone hear how Emirates is holding up to this crisis? They have a global hub at DXB with lots of Asian and European connectivity. They fly nothing but wide bodies, of which 115 are A380's. How are their bookings - Are they flying near-empty A380's and B77W's? Are they parking planes and furloughing staff yet?

I wouldn't imagine too good, but going to presume (based on ZERO evidence) so that the India/Pakistan-DXB sectors would still be doing alright.

As you have mentioned, their smallest aircraft is a 777. Leaving aside who can and cannot enter country X if coming from country Y, at least GF, QR, EY, WY do have narrow bodies so can park some wide bodies if need be and fly the smaller aircraft where possible. EK has 400+ seats to fill on the short hops around the Persian Gulf, and with Saudi currently shot, I would imagine CGK (and to a lesser extent, KUL) would be heaven for those in Economy with a row or two each.

Midwestindy wrote:

https://paxex.aero/2020/03/qantas-route-cuts-coronavirus-covid-19/?utm_source=TW&utm_medium=WA-TW&utm_campaign=3917

"Qantas cuts international 25% through September facing coronavirus-induced demand drop"

Beyond the reduced flying schedule the carrier will also halt its share buyback efforts and undertake a number of other efforts:

Annual management bonuses set to zero for FY20.
For the remainder of FY20:
Qantas Chairman will take no fees.
Group CEO will take no salary.
Qantas Board will take a 30 per cent reduction in fees.
Group Executive Management will take a 30 per cent pay cut.
Freeze of all non-essential recruitment and consultancy work.
Asking all Qantas and Jetstar employees to take paid or unpaid leave in light of reduced flying activity.

And:

Qantas is not taking the cuts lightly. Facing a significant drop in forecasted revenue the carrier will ground all but two of its A380s, generally swapping the planes for smaller 787s where routes remain in service. This includes the flagship Sydney-Singapore-London QF1/2 trip. As of 20 April 2020 that route will swap to a 787 operating via Perth. This makes the Perth-London service double daily, albeit on a plane with 250 fewer seats than the A380. With the A380 removed from Singapore service the Qantas First Class Lounge will also close at Singapore until an aircraft with first class seats returns to the market.

It's always the big birds that get parked first. LH is considering parking its entire A380 fleet.

Greek CAA suspends traffic between Greece and northern Italy until 23-Mar-2020 due to coronavirus. Notice effective till 23/03 so far.

https://centreforaviation.com/news/gree ... rus-982036

MartijnNL wrote:

KLM has cancelled all flights to Milan and Venice on Monday.

KLM has now cancelled all flights to Rome as well.

FLALEFTY wrote:

Anyone hear how Emirates is holding up to this crisis? They have a global hub at DXB with lots of Asian and European connectivity. They fly nothing but wide bodies, of which 115 are A380's. How are their bookings - Are they flying near-empty A380's and B77W's? Are they parking planes and furloughing staff yet?

Reportedly less than 150 passengers on 644 seat configured A380 headed to BKK on March 8



https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ESlKSqNWAAI ... ame=medium



https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ESlKSqHWkAE ... ame=medium

Israel closes all international travel. All arrivals to Israel 14 days isolated.


https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-or ... uarantine/

At least not 40 days as the original quarantine

Will we see airports in Italy close? I don’t understand why there are still flights operating if the country is in lockdown?

AF KLM Group to cancel 3600 flights in March as per Nasdaq:

https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/air-fra ... 2020-03-10