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TYWoolman
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Sun Mar 01, 2020 4:11 pm

onwFan wrote:
TYWoolman wrote:
Delta needs to be expanding in all the domestic markets excluded in AL/AA codeshares. American launching an expanded capacity/ frequency response then means competing with its new buddy for gates in Seattle eroding AL market share. Alaska unions won't be so happy with the partnerships unintended consequences.

This is exactly where AS being a member of oneworld will help. For e.g. in this case, from the customer’s point of view, they will have 3x on DL vs 18x on AA/AS to Dallas (AA/AS may even increase). It is inevitable that on such overlapping routes, DL will only be able 09to build a token presence, while AS/AA will have more flexibility in terms of schedule. Your suggestion that DL can give AS a run for their money by launching routes like SEA-DFW sounds hardly credible.


Delta already is giving them a run for their money by Alaska cementing their future on relying upon another airline to compete.
 
reltney
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Sun Mar 01, 2020 5:05 pm

Ishrion wrote:
Alright... let's try this again.

Delta Airlines will be adding two routes out of Seattle - Columbus and Dallas/Fort Worth

Both routes begin on June 8, 2020.

SEA-DFW operates 3x daily while SEA-CMH operates 1x daily. Both routes will be operated using the A220-100.

https://thepointsguy.com/news/delta-add ... ort-worth/



It’s Delta Air Lines..... not airlines..

I love doing that....
Knives don't kill people. People with knives kill people.
OUTLAW KNIVES.

I am a pilot, therefore I envy no one...
 
Ishrion
Topic Author
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Sun Mar 01, 2020 5:08 pm

reltney wrote:
Ishrion wrote:
Alright... let's try this again.

Delta Airlines will be adding two routes out of Seattle - Columbus and Dallas/Fort Worth

Both routes begin on June 8, 2020.

SEA-DFW operates 3x daily while SEA-CMH operates 1x daily. Both routes will be operated using the A220-100.

https://thepointsguy.com/news/delta-add ... ort-worth/



It’s Delta Air Lines..... not airlines..

I love doing that....


Shh... the original post before it got deleted had "Delta Air Lines"...
 
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EA CO AS
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Sun Mar 01, 2020 7:42 pm

TYWoolman wrote:
Delta already is giving them a run for their money


AS hasn't lost a single point of market share at SEA, despite DL going from around 30 flights a day to 170 a day over the past 6 years, and remains consistently profitable while DL continues to lose money there. Not sure how you define that as "a run for their money," but I'd love to hear your explanation.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
LH658
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Sun Mar 01, 2020 8:44 pm

Just waiting for SEA/BOS - IAH.
 
jbs2886
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Sun Mar 01, 2020 11:47 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
TYWoolman wrote:
Delta already is giving them a run for their money


AS hasn't lost a single point of market share at SEA, despite DL going from around 30 flights a day to 170 a day over the past 6 years, and remains consistently profitable while DL continues to lose money there. Not sure how you define that as "a run for their money," but I'd love to hear your explanation.


I'd like to see your evidence that DL is losing money in SEA. But, you have to admit, DL's strong push in AS has benefited its SEA hub because its required AS to focus on SEA rather than other markets (e.g., Northern California). The AS-DL SEA hub has pushed out everyone else - I think AS may have actually gained slightly?
 
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spinotter
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 12:31 am

EA CO AS wrote:
TYWoolman wrote:
Delta already is giving them a run for their money


AS hasn't lost a single point of market share at SEA, despite DL going from around 30 flights a day to 170 a day over the past 6 years, and remains consistently profitable while DL continues to lose money there. Not sure how you define that as "a run for their money," but I'd love to hear your explanation.


How do you know that Delta loses money there?

I admire AS as a scrappy competitor and my few flights with them have all been great. But Delta is bent on becoming the world's biggest airline, or most profitable, or whatever their goals are, and they have determined to make SEA a hub. Whatever losses in SEA right now, DL has set its sights on a Pacific Coast hub and they probably will achieve that in SEA if things like CoVid-19 don't get in the way. How long did DL lose money in NYC, and now look at them. DL has forced AS into AA's arms, and that says something, doesn't it? Interesting chess game.
 
SEAflyer97
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 1:04 am

flybry wrote:
I think this is a sign Delta is serious about its Seattle hub and will soon overtake Alaska Airlines and become the largest carrier in Seattle.

LOL no. AS is doing SEA-DAL daily 4x, SEA-DFW 2x, and has AA's SEA-DFW 7x.
 
Ishrion
Topic Author
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 1:10 am

SEAflyer97 wrote:
flybry wrote:
I think this is a sign Delta is serious about its Seattle hub and will soon overtake Alaska Airlines and become the largest carrier in Seattle.

LOL no. AS is doing SEA-DAL daily 4x, SEA-DFW 2x, and has AA's SEA-DFW 7x.


Currently seeing 10x daily DFW-SEA on AA from June 8.
 
SEAflyer97
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 1:12 am

Ishrion wrote:
SEAflyer97 wrote:
flybry wrote:
I think this is a sign Delta is serious about its Seattle hub and will soon overtake Alaska Airlines and become the largest carrier in Seattle.

LOL no. AS is doing SEA-DAL daily 4x, SEA-DFW 2x, and has AA's SEA-DFW 7x.


Currently seeing 10x daily DFW-SEA on AA from June 8.

More bus gates! I like it /s
 
tphuang
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 1:17 am

I will just post a few data I have from Q3 on different types of routes out of SEA that the 2 airlines compete on to give you a sense of how well DL is doing margin wise vs AS. Keep in mind, that the fare data is taken from BTS, which is 10% sample, so the real numbers could be off. I also use my own formula for calculating domestic connection fares which I'm sure airlines have a much better formula around.

CityPair Dist Carrier % LF Dep PerFlt NSFare ConnF % NS Yield
PDXSEA 129 AS 69.44 3984 93.1 143.73 78.12 26.63 66.37
PDXSEA 129 DL 77.57 1294 99.4 133.68 67.44 13.04 59.01
First for a flight where AS dominates the other end (although DL is not exactly weak there). You will see that AS has lower connection % in this despite operating over 3 times as many flights. Similar # of passengers per flight and AS has clear lead here in yield and market share.

ATLSEA 2182 AS 87.72 357 171.6 272.17 208.33 58.55 215.54
ATLSEA 2182 DL 93.04 1647 193.8 374.94 220.96 27.66 245.20
Here is a more interesting case where DL dominates the other end. They also operate 5 times as many flights. Not a surprise DL dominates this route in market share and it uses a larger gauged aircraft. But it only has about a 15% premium in yield when you factor in how much of the traffic is connection dependent. Similar dynamics to this to DTW/MSP/JFK also. Probably the only routes I can say that they have better margins than AS on. Even with SLC, the premium over AS is small enough that I think the lower cost of AS make it more profitable.

INDSEA 1866 AS 92.87 186 176.5 258.13 199.00 70.51 223.54
INDSEA 1866 DL 93.14 166 132.4 266.56 180.34 70.68 224.72
RDUSEA 2354 AS 91.36 184 162.5 300.75 204.60 71.10 249.38
RDUSEA 2354 DL 93.25 173 159.9 313.19 223.97 68.35 265.72
Here are 2 routes that DL has decent size operation on the other end and AS has minimal operation. Again, RDU looks okay for DL. They have a 5 to 10% yield advantage using similar sized aircraft. Market share is about the same. IND is not exactly a focus city, but it has a large DL ff base. Probably the most comparable to CMHSEA. You will see the yield is the same, but AS uses much larger aircraft, which would have significantly lower CASM than what DL runs (seem to be A319 in most cases). Normally, as you upgauge and increase capacity, the yield goes down. Not a good sign for DL that it runs smaller aircraft and can't get yield premium.

PHXSEA 1107 AA 90.76 622 179.2 165.69 116.15 40.24 123.51
PHXSEA 1107 AS 91.12 1101 169.8 145.03 136.73 66.18 129.59
PHXSEA 1107 DL 88.33 662 157.5 134.48 114.11 71.23 113.61
PHXSEA 1107 WN 90.15 705 157.4 151.23 108.22 64.69 122.64
This should give good indication of how dominant AS is at SEA. PHX is a strong hub for both AA/WN, but AS actually has the highest yield here when you factor in the N/S vs connection%. Again, that's a 10 to 15% premium over DL in yield despite using slightly larger aircraft. If I had to guess, this is a good comparison of how well DL would do to DFW.

AS's margin figure is out there for everyone to see. SEA is probably above average in margins vs rest of the system. When DL isn't the largest carrier on the other end, it needs to run smaller, much higher CASM aircraft to get similar yield to AS. What is the CASM advantage of a AS B739ER vs a DL A319 or B717? What is the CASM advantage of AS 739ER vs DL 739ER?
 
jbs2886
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 1:50 am

Does anyone know the interplay of the restrictions the AA/AS relationship previously faced on codeshares (at the time of the Virgin America acquisition) with the new plan? For example, can AS and AA codeshare on the SEA-DFW flights, which, I believe, were previously required to be dropped b/c they were hub to hub?
 
evank516
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 1:53 am

DiamondFlyer wrote:
evank516 wrote:
Definitely some good adds on Delta's part, and this only proves how much of a game changer the A220 is. However I'm still surprised we haven't seen many upgauges on these long, thin RJ routes out of NY like they heavily implied at the start other than DFW and IAH that is.


Because what would they use the displaced 175/CR9 on? There has been no move to park CR2, and there isn’t going to be. It’s probably cheaper to use the 220 to open a market than a CR9/175, so why change what’s going on if it’s working


I would think, based on what Delta's strategy has been that they would use the displaced larger RJs to upaguge certain CR2 routes and then maybe open new small markets using the CR2. Sort of move things up the ranks where they can. Look at NYC-BNA, B6 just announced the resumption of JFK flights and DL isn't upgauging to compete? B6 has a product that DL can compete with if they upgauge it to mainline as long as it's not the 717. And let's not go into the idea that DL doesn't have to upgauge every route that B6 enters because they wasted no time announcing JFK-IAH when B6 announced they were leaving HOU for IAH. Not EVERY route can justify an upgauge, but you would think DL would look at its current routes out of NYC that are rather long and flown on large RJs. They have quite a few 1,000+ mile flights that are flown on CR9s and E170/175s that could probably handle an upgauge on some flights. CR9s and E-Jets can be used on high density routes under 1,000 miles, there's plenty of them.
 
DeltaRules
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:05 am

evank516 wrote:
DiamondFlyer wrote:
evank516 wrote:
Definitely some good adds on Delta's part, and this only proves how much of a game changer the A220 is. However I'm still surprised we haven't seen many upgauges on these long, thin RJ routes out of NY like they heavily implied at the start other than DFW and IAH that is.


Because what would they use the displaced 175/CR9 on? There has been no move to park CR2, and there isn’t going to be. It’s probably cheaper to use the 220 to open a market than a CR9/175, so why change what’s going on if it’s working


I would think, based on what Delta's strategy has been that they would use the displaced larger RJs to upaguge certain CR2 routes and then maybe open new small markets using the CR2. Sort of move things up the ranks where they can.


This point sticks out in my mind given DAY has BOS at the top of its wish list, which would seem to have CR2 written all over it.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
TYWoolman
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:38 am

EA CO AS wrote:
TYWoolman wrote:
Delta already is giving them a run for their money


AS hasn't lost a single point of market share at SEA, despite DL going from around 30 flights a day to 170 a day over the past 6 years, and remains consistently profitable while DL continues to lose money there. Not sure how you define that as "a run for their money," but I'd love to hear your explanation.


That quote was not mine if you read carefully. Please direct that reference to the appropriate author.
But to comment: one must give Alaska all the respect it deserves and this rivalry is at its infancy. Delta is there to stay as Seattle airport most inevitably will expand its gate footprint.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:41 am

evank516 wrote:
DiamondFlyer wrote:
evank516 wrote:
Definitely some good adds on Delta's part, and this only proves how much of a game changer the A220 is. However I'm still surprised we haven't seen many upgauges on these long, thin RJ routes out of NY like they heavily implied at the start other than DFW and IAH that is.


Because what would they use the displaced 175/CR9 on? There has been no move to park CR2, and there isn’t going to be. It’s probably cheaper to use the 220 to open a market than a CR9/175, so why change what’s going on if it’s working


I would think, based on what Delta's strategy has been that they would use the displaced larger RJs to upaguge certain CR2 routes and then maybe open new small markets using the CR2. Sort of move things up the ranks where they can. Look at NYC-BNA, B6 just announced the resumption of JFK flights and DL isn't upgauging to compete? B6 has a product that DL can compete with if they upgauge it to mainline as long as it's not the 717. And let's not go into the idea that DL doesn't have to upgauge every route that B6 enters because they wasted no time announcing JFK-IAH when B6 announced they were leaving HOU for IAH. Not EVERY route can justify an upgauge, but you would think DL would look at its current routes out of NYC that are rather long and flown on large RJs. They have quite a few 1,000+ mile flights that are flown on CR9s and E170/175s that could probably handle an upgauge on some flights. CR9s and E-Jets can be used on high density routes under 1,000 miles, there's plenty of them.


DL is adding the A220 to BNA-LGA in September.....
Status for 2019/2020: AAdvantage Platinum, Delta Gold, Southwest A-List
 
BNAMealer
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:54 am

Midwestindy wrote:
evank516 wrote:
DiamondFlyer wrote:

Because what would they use the displaced 175/CR9 on? There has been no move to park CR2, and there isn’t going to be. It’s probably cheaper to use the 220 to open a market than a CR9/175, so why change what’s going on if it’s working


I would think, based on what Delta's strategy has been that they would use the displaced larger RJs to upaguge certain CR2 routes and then maybe open new small markets using the CR2. Sort of move things up the ranks where they can. Look at NYC-BNA, B6 just announced the resumption of JFK flights and DL isn't upgauging to compete? B6 has a product that DL can compete with if they upgauge it to mainline as long as it's not the 717. And let's not go into the idea that DL doesn't have to upgauge every route that B6 enters because they wasted no time announcing JFK-IAH when B6 announced they were leaving HOU for IAH. Not EVERY route can justify an upgauge, but you would think DL would look at its current routes out of NYC that are rather long and flown on large RJs. They have quite a few 1,000+ mile flights that are flown on CR9s and E170/175s that could probably handle an upgauge on some flights. CR9s and E-Jets can be used on high density routes under 1,000 miles, there's plenty of them.


DL is adding the A220 to BNA-LGA in September.....


But we’re not sure yet if that is simply a filler or if that will stick, and if it does stick, will it last longer than September?
 
deltal1011man
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 4:12 am

EA CO AS wrote:
TYWoolman wrote:
Delta already is giving them a run for their money


AS hasn't lost a single point of market share at SEA, despite DL going from around 30 flights a day to 170 a day over the past 6 years, and remains consistently profitable while DL continues to lose money there. Not sure how you define that as "a run for their money," but I'd love to hear your explanation.

Same deal with you, Post the P&Ls

because I think you are talking out of your rear end.

spinotter wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:
TYWoolman wrote:
Delta already is giving them a run for their money


AS hasn't lost a single point of market share at SEA, despite DL going from around 30 flights a day to 170 a day over the past 6 years, and remains consistently profitable while DL continues to lose money there. Not sure how you define that as "a run for their money," but I'd love to hear your explanation.


How do you know that Delta loses money there?

I admire AS as a scrappy competitor and my few flights with them have all been great. But Delta is bent on becoming the world's biggest airline, or most profitable, or whatever their goals are, and they have determined to make SEA a hub. Whatever losses in SEA right now, DL has set its sights on a Pacific Coast hub and they probably will achieve that in SEA if things like CoVid-19 don't get in the way. How long did DL lose money in NYC, and now look at them. DL has forced AS into AA's arms, and that says something, doesn't it? Interesting chess game.

He nor tphuang have any idea what they are talking about.

The take T100 data that doesn't come close to painting a clear picture and make up who makes money and who doesn't based off data that shows 1/4th of the picture.
specifically they have no earthly idea about the international side of the house or how revenue/profits are allocated.
Not to mention value of Seattle to the overall network ie does Delta Seattle hub drive high revenues and corporate fares out of the other hubs in the system. Just an example, what does having a LAX-SEA-PEK option do for the Delta network out of LA?



edit to add, the worst part is these threads always bring those two out of the wood work to talk about profitability of Seattle that literally has NOTHING to do with the topic. Same thing happens anytime Delta adds something out of New York or Boston.
and nothing is ever done about it.
 
evank516
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 4:28 am

Midwestindy wrote:
evank516 wrote:
DiamondFlyer wrote:

Because what would they use the displaced 175/CR9 on? There has been no move to park CR2, and there isn’t going to be. It’s probably cheaper to use the 220 to open a market than a CR9/175, so why change what’s going on if it’s working


I would think, based on what Delta's strategy has been that they would use the displaced larger RJs to upaguge certain CR2 routes and then maybe open new small markets using the CR2. Sort of move things up the ranks where they can. Look at NYC-BNA, B6 just announced the resumption of JFK flights and DL isn't upgauging to compete? B6 has a product that DL can compete with if they upgauge it to mainline as long as it's not the 717. And let's not go into the idea that DL doesn't have to upgauge every route that B6 enters because they wasted no time announcing JFK-IAH when B6 announced they were leaving HOU for IAH. Not EVERY route can justify an upgauge, but you would think DL would look at its current routes out of NYC that are rather long and flown on large RJs. They have quite a few 1,000+ mile flights that are flown on CR9s and E170/175s that could probably handle an upgauge on some flights. CR9s and E-Jets can be used on high density routes under 1,000 miles, there's plenty of them.


DL is adding the A220 to BNA-LGA in September.....


Oh! This is good news!
 
ctrabs0114
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 4:32 am

DL747400 wrote:
About time that DELTA added SEA-DFW. Good for them. I wish DELTA much success and think the route will do well once it settles in.

Perfect timing for DELTA to act after NK recently dropped their service in that market. With DELTA being a much stronger competitor than NK, there is significant potential for DELTA to also pull traffic away from WN's DAL-SEA service.

It will also be interesting to see whether DELTA tiptoes into offering a couple of connections via DFW to/from the new SEA flights at some point down the road.


Agreed. DL jumping into DFW-SEA was long overdue. It beats having to change planes at SLC to get to SEA, as I did last year.
2019: DAL, MCI, PHX, LAS, DFW, SAT, ORD, SLC, SEA, DTW, PHL, MIA, LAX; B73G (WN x3), B738 (WN, AA, DL), A20N (NK), MD83 (AA), B788 (AA x2), CS1 (DL), B739 (DL), B712 (DL), B752 (AA), B763 (AA), B77W (AA), B789 (AA)
Next: TBA
 
hiflyeras
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 4:59 am

Any airline that would announce new routes in the same week that the entire industry is in potential danger of total collapse are absolute idiots.
This couldn’t wait a couple of weeks to get a bigger picture of the Coronavirus fallout? I have a feeling that bookings both domestic and international have completely collapsed for every airline.
 
CLJFlyer
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 1:30 pm

hiflyeras wrote:
Any airline that would announce new routes in the same week that the entire industry is in potential danger of total collapse are absolute idiots.
This couldn’t wait a couple of weeks to get a bigger picture of the Coronavirus fallout? I have a feeling that bookings both domestic and international have completely collapsed for every airline.



Check out Delta's latest financial statement...they absolutely know what they're doing. You must be new here.
 
tphuang
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 1:39 pm

CLJFlyer wrote:
hiflyeras wrote:
Any airline that would announce new routes in the same week that the entire industry is in potential danger of total collapse are absolute idiots.
This couldn’t wait a couple of weeks to get a bigger picture of the Coronavirus fallout? I have a feeling that bookings both domestic and international have completely collapsed for every airline.



Check out Delta's latest financial statement...they absolutely know what they're doing. You must be new here.

He has been here for a long time. And we will see what happens now that corporate travel is falling off the ledgers. Q1 and q2 earnings call are going to be fun.
 
izbtmnhd
Posts: 933
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:11 pm

hiflyeras wrote:
Any airline that would announce new routes in the same week that the entire industry is in potential danger of total collapse are absolute idiots.
This couldn’t wait a couple of weeks to get a bigger picture of the Coronavirus fallout? I have a feeling that bookings both domestic and international have completely collapsed for every airline.


I'm not going to call anyone at DL "idiots" but I think 3x daily CMH-SEA between AS/DL with a definite slowdown in domestic travel for the foreseeable future is going to be "interesting". I can't see this being a high-yielding route at this volume without some sort of lockdown contract from a tech company. Even then, many of these companies are telling their employees to do video conferencing and not to travel unless it's essential.

This feels a little like FI/WW going head-to-head in CLE-KEF. Not saying the route will be abandoned, just don't see how 3x daily is viable when no-one was flying this route 18 months ago without the coronavirus headwinds.
 
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flymco753
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:20 pm

So much for the growth at interior hubs. :lol:
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
hiflyeras
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:29 pm

Thanks for watching my back, gang. In my opinion all these SEA adds (now add SEA-LHR on DL metal) are retaliation for the AS-AA tieup. These additions were likely signed off on a couple of weeks ago. Two weeks ago we lived in a different world. At least the LHR flight is pushed out to 2021. Yes, DL makes money...they also apparently know how to burn it. It's clearly all about the SEA gate allocation.
 
DeltaRules
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 4:36 pm

izbtmnhd wrote:
hiflyeras wrote:
Any airline that would announce new routes in the same week that the entire industry is in potential danger of total collapse are absolute idiots.
This couldn’t wait a couple of weeks to get a bigger picture of the Coronavirus fallout? I have a feeling that bookings both domestic and international have completely collapsed for every airline.


I'm not going to call anyone at DL "idiots" but I think 3x daily CMH-SEA between AS/DL with a definite slowdown in domestic travel for the foreseeable future is going to be "interesting". I can't see this being a high-yielding route at this volume without some sort of lockdown contract from a tech company. Even then, many of these companies are telling their employees to do video conferencing and not to travel unless it's essential.

This feels a little like FI/WW going head-to-head in CLE-KEF. Not saying the route will be abandoned, just don't see how 3x daily is viable when no-one was flying this route 18 months ago without the coronavirus headwinds.


To be fair, AS' second daily only runs for a couple months in the Summer. Obviously, Coronavirus is an issue, but CMH-LAX has run 2x daily (one each on AA and DL) since the early 2010s.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
dc10lover
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 4:44 pm

The Former Delta Hub :-( DFW
Why endure the nightmare and congestion of LAX when BUR, LGB, ONT & SNA is so much easier to fly in and out of. Same with OAK & SJC when it comes to SFO.
 
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spinotter
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Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 4:54 pm

hiflyeras wrote:
Any airline that would announce new routes in the same week that the entire industry is in potential danger of total collapse are absolute idiots.
This couldn’t wait a couple of weeks to get a bigger picture of the Coronavirus fallout? I have a feeling that bookings both domestic and international have completely collapsed for every airline.


Absolute idiots with a profit margin double their two main competitors on the world scene, right? Nobody knows what the CoVid-19 saga will bring. DL has obviously thought about the coronavirus in relation to these new route announcements. Be brave when all the others are faltering, and snatch victory! Go Delta!
 
HPRamper
Posts: 5019
Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 4:22 am

Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 6:24 pm

cledaybuck wrote:
ncflyer wrote:
Any theories why Delta would add Columbus over Pittsburgh, or for that matter Cleveland, which doesn't have any daily service to SEA?

Because AS flies CMH. But yeah, CLE-SEA is going to be 4x weekly this summer while SEA-CMH will be 3x daily. Something seems out of wack.

What's out of wack? The Columbus metro is now more populous than the Cleveland metro, and growing. Cleveland is still losing population year over year. 4/3 seems proper.
 
cledaybuck
Posts: 1690
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2016 6:07 pm

Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 6:37 pm

HPRamper wrote:
cledaybuck wrote:
ncflyer wrote:
Any theories why Delta would add Columbus over Pittsburgh, or for that matter Cleveland, which doesn't have any daily service to SEA?

Because AS flies CMH. But yeah, CLE-SEA is going to be 4x weekly this summer while SEA-CMH will be 3x daily. Something seems out of wack.

What's out of wack? The Columbus metro is now more populous than the Cleveland metro, and growing. Cleveland is still losing population year over year. 4/3 seems proper.

CLE is 4 weekly vs. CMH which is 21 weekly (3 daily).
As we celebrate mediocrity, all the boys upstairs want to see, how much you'll pay for what you used to get for free.
 
EADSYABSOB73857
Posts: 80
Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2019 11:35 pm

Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 6:58 pm

hiflyeras wrote:
Any airline that would announce new routes in the same week that the entire industry is in potential danger of total collapse are absolute idiots.
This couldn’t wait a couple of weeks to get a bigger picture of the Coronavirus fallout? I have a feeling that bookings both domestic and international have completely collapsed for every airline.


The things that people say/believe on this forum are absolutely astounding... Ignorance is bliss is a complete understatement here. All of these people declaring the complete demise of the global economy, the airline industry collapsing, airline stocks going to zero... I wish there was a deterrent on this page for emotion and ignorance- too many people saying things that they just have absolute 0 knowledge of, and don’t know at all what they are talking about.

The market has been red hot for far too long- there hasn’t been a dip since last summer, and that was only an 8% pullback- not even a full correction. The market has run up too much and valuations have achieved unsustainable levels for a lot of companies/stocks. The market has been looking for a catalyst to pull back, and it clearly found it. With Coronavirus, lots of fear selling (given how much the market has sold off in 6 trading sessions) coupled with institutional managers taking a lot of money off the table. Airline industry/stocks have flown high for a while, needed a pullback... Also, in a pullback (especially one where a virus is a catalyst) tourism sector will be one of the hardest and most aggressive hit due to their exposure (harder hit than any other sector). On a macroeconomic level, fundamentals and data are still good, leading indicators are positive; sure growth is taking a hit from dealing with the virus, but as of now, it is not viewed as a long-term economic problem.
 
N649DL
Posts: 924
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2018 10:21 pm

Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 7:12 pm

ncflyer wrote:
Any theories why Delta would add Columbus over Pittsburgh, or for that matter Cleveland, which doesn't have any daily service to SEA?


Historically DL has been much stronger at CMH than PIT or CLE. Lot's of high tier Medallion members out there. Plus DL has been flying CMH-LAX for years.

ctrabs0114 wrote:
DL747400 wrote:
About time that DELTA added SEA-DFW. Good for them. I wish DELTA much success and think the route will do well once it settles in.

Perfect timing for DELTA to act after NK recently dropped their service in that market. With DELTA being a much stronger competitor than NK, there is significant potential for DELTA to also pull traffic away from WN's DAL-SEA service.

It will also be interesting to see whether DELTA tiptoes into offering a couple of connections via DFW to/from the new SEA flights at some point down the road.


Agreed. DL jumping into DFW-SEA was long overdue. It beats having to change planes at SLC to get to SEA, as I did last year.


You mean re-launching DFW-SEA? DL used to have hub in DFW and flew it into the early 2000s ;-)
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 5165
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

Re: Delta Adds SEA-CMH/DFW

Mon Mar 02, 2020 7:32 pm

N649DL wrote:
ncflyer wrote:
Any theories why Delta would add Columbus over Pittsburgh, or for that matter Cleveland, which doesn't have any daily service to SEA?


Historically DL has been much stronger at CMH than PIT or CLE. Lot's of high tier Medallion members out there. Plus DL has been flying CMH-LAX for years.


DL had a CMH focus city in the mid-2000s which was bolstered by a bunch of former HP Chautauqua ERJ flying, which probably helped grow that FF base.
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