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Jet-lagged
Posts: 909
Joined: Mon Mar 04, 2002 11:58 pm

Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Sun Mar 08, 2020 7:55 pm

admanager wrote:
enilria wrote:
SyracuseAvGeek wrote:

This IS very interesting. I worked for Kenmore Air last summer at BFI, they only have 3 land based Cessna Caravan’s , in the summer the flights between BFI-ESD/FRD were completely full and they operated at about 5-6 daily each plus they also operate the mountain scenic to Rainer/Helens. I wonder if they will be finally getting more aircraft or if they plan on decreasing the current route offering out of BFI. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

Also, Kenmore is not a Part121 carrier, so they do not need security checkpoint. So they might be operating out of somewhere other than the main terminal.

So perhaps these do not count under the slot formula.

Lots this week - thanks.
Is BFI-PAE now the only scheduled route within a metro area in the US?


Good point.

Years ago I flew west across the LA metro to LAX on maybe United or American, I think it was Ontario to but it could have been San Bernardino. From there I flew to NY so that saved me the bad traffic. Neither seem to be offered now.

GCMAP says PAE to BFI is 26 miles.
 
grbauc
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Sun Mar 08, 2020 7:56 pm

pmanni1 wrote:
Lemieux wrote:
AA dropping PHX-PIT?! Insanity


So no carrier is flying this at all? I don't see any flights from WN all summer.


Wow ive always been amazed at how US/AA can't or hasn't been able to keep even a focus city alive in PIT. With it history there it makes me wonder but if WN does not run on the route either then maybe its just PIT. I loved using the Hub back in the day even though it was pricey to use from LAX.
 
wedgetail737
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Sun Mar 08, 2020 8:34 pm

Jet-lagged wrote:
admanager wrote:
enilria wrote:
So perhaps these do not count under the slot formula.

Lots this week - thanks.
Is BFI-PAE now the only scheduled route within a metro area in the US?


Good point.

Years ago I flew west across the LA metro to LAX on maybe United or American, I think it was Ontario to but it could have been San Bernardino. From there I flew to NY so that saved me the bad traffic. Neither seem to be offered now.

GCMAP says PAE to BFI is 26 miles.


Kenmore Air theoretically offers pax flights between their headquarters in Kenmore, WA to Lake Union, but it's not a scheduled flight. They are repositioning flights. You call them 24 hours in advance to see if they have availability. I forgot how much it costs.

Maybe there will be an announcement tomorrow (Monday).
 
alasizon
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Sun Mar 08, 2020 8:52 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
Dotted line is average yield, so yes PIT/TPA underperform, and are hurt by a longer stage length(eats more a/c time).

Also, PIT-PHX does not routinely support a full A321, the route routinely operates a mix of A320/A319

Agreed, MAX cut is likely driving factor
Image


What is your source for the graph? ATL is plotting higher and PIT lower than I believe they should be from my knowledge.

As far as equipment type, thanks that was a typo, should have said 320.
Airport (noun) - A construction site which airplanes tend to frequent
 
rabader
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Sun Mar 08, 2020 9:41 pm

enilria wrote:
4O GDL-LAS JUN 1.0>0.4[1.0] JUL 1.0>0.5[1.0] AUG 1.0>0.4[1.0] SEP 1.0>0.4[0.9] OCT 1.0>0.4[0.9] NOV 1.0>0.4[1.0] DEC 1.0>0.4[1.0]
4O GDL-LAX JUN 1.0>0.6[2] JUL 1.0>0.6[2] AUG 1.0>0.6[2] SEP 1.0>0.6[1.5] OCT 1.0>0.5[1.6] NOV 1.0>0.6[1.0] DEC 1.0>0.5[1.0]
4O GDL-ORD JUN 1.0>0.6[1.0] JUL 1.0>0.6[1.0] AUG 1.0>0.6[1.0] SEP 1.0>0.6[1.0] OCT 1.0>0.5[1.0] NOV 1.0>0.6[1.0] DEC 1.0>0.5[1.0]
4O GDL-SAT JUN 1.0>0.4[1.0] JUL 1.0>0.4[1.1] AUG 1.0>0.4[1.1] SEP 1.0>0.4[1.0] OCT 1.0>0.5[1.0] NOV 1.0>0.4[1.0] DEC 1.0>0.5[1.0]
4O GDL-SFO JUN 1.0>0.5[1.0] JUL 1.0>0.6[1.0] AUG 1.0>0.6[1.0] SEP 1.0>0.6[1.0] OCT 1.0>0.5[1.0] NOV 1.0>0.6[1.0] DEC 1.0>0.5[1.0]
4O JFK-MEX JUN 2>1.0[3] JUL 2>1.0[3] AUG 2>1.0[3] SEP 2>1.0[3] OCT 2>1.0[2] NOV 2>1.0[2] DEC 2.0>1.0[2]


Interjet slashing peak season services, the future doesn't look good for therm
 
tphuang
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Sun Mar 08, 2020 9:47 pm

stealth777 wrote:
MIAFLLPBIFlyer wrote:
UA SFO-FLL cut unfortunate - no more UA flights from south Florida to SFO. Maybe this flight returns for the winter season? We will see.


Doesn't UA still fly SFO-MIA? I know they were doing that last winter for a short period. That only leaves Jetblue for SFO-FLL and AA for SFO-MIA for nonstop flights.

I think SFO-MIA is either seasonal or they cut it. Not sure which.

MAH4546 wrote:
stealth777 wrote:
MIAFLLPBIFlyer wrote:
UA SFO-FLL cut unfortunate - no more UA flights from south Florida to SFO. Maybe this flight returns for the winter season? We will see.


Doesn't UA still fly SFO-MIA? I know they were doing that last winter for a short period. That only leaves Jetblue for SFO-FLL and AA for SFO-MIA for nonstop flights.


Yes, UA flies MIASFO. UA is also not discontinuing FLLSFO, it is a seasonal suspension. In addition, Alaska still flies FLLSFO and Spirit is soon starting FLLOAK.

Outside of a couple of weeks around holiday, AS does not fly FLL-SFO anymore, but please do keep up your hope for AS on a route they simply are not competitive one. UA is making this seasonal because their numbers here are terrible in summer time, which is the off season. It's easily one of their worst performing routes out of SFO in summer time.

it really depends on how much further B6 grows here. But the reality is that as B6 has added here, other airlines have cut back. UA would be better off just going with MIA-SFO. Their yields were always higher out of there.

alasizon wrote:
tphuang wrote:
Is it just me or looks like aa is leasing some slots to JetBlue from the look of this? Aa is cutting over 30 flights and JetBlue is adding at least 15 flights a day here.


As I recall a few weeks ago, B6 made some cuts and never re-upped their numbers to get back to their own slot portfolio.


Not out of JFK, they've been continually adding to JFK recently. The last major change to JFK, they added 7 to 8 flights and have been continually adding more flights since in an attempt to use slots. With these adds, they are going to be around 195 departures a day in the peak months, about 20 to 25 flights more than last summer. And they've retimed flights to use more slots. They were supposedly sitting on a bunch of slots that they were not using. But even so, it's hard to imagine for me they had another 15 on top of what they already added for peak summer time. It's hard to imagine they were sitting on 50 slots for most of the year.

Outside of AA leasing them some slots and AA is cutting a lot of these flights in June to August period when B6 are making the adds, I don't have any other explanation for this.

What do you think enilria? It seems like straight shifting of slots from one carrier to another for June to August.
 
iflykpdx
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Sun Mar 08, 2020 9:52 pm

Looking like the new daytime BOS-SJC flight is nixed?
Airport Management - UND
 
Pi7472000
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Sun Mar 08, 2020 10:39 pm

Sad to see United shrink so much! Are they more impacted than AA or Delta? They do not seem to be as impacted or taking such drastic measures as United. I guess UA also has an oil based hub in IAH which will continue to be impacted by low oil prices. The SFO hub seems to be struggling as well. Amazing that just a few months ago United seemed to be turning around and expanding its network!
 
dfwjim1
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:05 pm

MAH4546 wrote:
stealth777 wrote:
MIAFLLPBIFlyer wrote:
UA SFO-FLL cut unfortunate - no more UA flights from south Florida to SFO. Maybe this flight returns for the winter season? We will see.


Doesn't UA still fly SFO-MIA? I know they were doing that last winter for a short period. That only leaves Jetblue for SFO-FLL and AA for SFO-MIA for nonstop flights.


Yes, UA flies MIASFO. UA is also not discontinuing FLLSFO, it is a seasonal suspension. In addition, Alaska still flies FLLSFO and Spirit is soon starting FLLOAK.


I am flying AS SFO-FLL-SFO in the middle of April. Flight leaves FLL at 6 AM with a 0930 AM arrival in SFO and the return is a 8 PM departure arriving in FLL at 0430 AM. An unusual schedule which seems to be in place only for spring break and Easter.
 
alasizon
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:10 pm

Pi7472000 wrote:
Sad to see United shrink so much! Are they more impacted than AA or Delta? They do not seem to be as impacted or taking such drastic measures as United. I guess UA also has an oil based hub in IAH which will continue to be impacted by low oil prices. The SFO hub seems to be struggling as well. Amazing that just a few months ago United seemed to be turning around and expanding its network!


UA's strengths of SFO & Asia does hurt them a bit here; DL and AA likely are getting ready to do a bit of a capacity change as well for Apr/May but are likely waiting till next week to see how the virus progresses. Middle of the country hubs of DEN and ORD are much more easily scaled though than the coastal hubs which helps adjust for capacity shocks/changes.
Airport (noun) - A construction site which airplanes tend to frequent
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:15 pm

enilria wrote:
**NK MSY-SAP JUN 0>0.3[0] JUL 0>0.4[0] AUG 0>0.4[0] SEP 0>0.4[0] OCT 0>0.4[0] NOV 0>0.3[0]

Great to see them still going forward with their international expansion from MSY.

They seem pretty bullish on SAP. :smile:



Ishrion wrote:
So it looks like UA's cutting SFO-MSY

Temporary. As of now, scheduled to return in June.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
Ishrion
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:26 pm

LAX772LR wrote:

Ishrion wrote:
So it looks like UA's cutting SFO-MSY

Temporary. As of now, scheduled to return in June.


Huh?

UA MSY-SFO APR 1.0>0.4[2.0] MAY 1.1>0.2[1.9] JUN 1.0>0[1.1] JUL 1.0>0[1.0] AUG 1.0>0[1.0] SEP 1.0>0[1.0]

Was this loaded wrong? Or has it not been updated?
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:46 pm

Ishrion wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:

Ishrion wrote:
So it looks like UA's cutting SFO-MSY

Temporary. As of now, scheduled to return in June.


Huh?

UA MSY-SFO APR 1.0>0.4[2.0] MAY 1.1>0.2[1.9] JUN 1.0>0[1.1] JUL 1.0>0[1.0] AUG 1.0>0[1.0] SEP 1.0>0[1.0]

Was this loaded wrong? Or has it not been updated?

My bad, read it wrong. Last flight is June 4.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
hpff
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 1:13 am

czbb wrote:
Heavily dependent on cruise traffic? Under 1m cruise passengers/yr and 25m passengers/yr through YVR Even if every passenger flew from YVR to/from Vancouver for a cruise that's still well under 10%

The only airport that's 'heavily' dependent on cruise traffic is likely FLL


YVR is not, but I would imagine a IAH-YVR summer route to have a good amount of IAH tourist point of sale, as Canadians wouldn’t travel to Houston in the summer for tourism (if at all, and especially not from YVR when they could go to Honolulu, Phoenix, or Mexico/Caribbean.)
 
mfricke
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 1:57 am

The PHX-PIT drop is surprising to me, as I remember when collecting timetables in the early 1980's, that PHX (and TUS), were the first cities USAir flew to out west.

http://www.departedflights.com/US060181.html
ONT - Southern California's Ontario!
 
YYZORD
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:31 am

It could be that maybe AC is replacing YVR-IAH, YEG is permanently gone as YYC is nearby.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:48 am

It looks like DL is in the process of making their Covid-19 related changes for April. They haven't hit OAG yet. I have a couple of reservations out there for April and DL has no zero'd out inventory on some of these flights. They still show up in the schedule but as sold-out. Thus, I anticipate getting rebooked onto something else once they process these close-in cuts.
 
Bingo1
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:27 am

6 or 7 years ago YEG-IAH was double or triple daily on A320's. UA used to serve ORD, EWR, IAH and DEN from YEG. Now just DEN. Transborder prices out of YEG are usually ridiculously high so I'm surprised to see the continued service losses. It's not uncommon for small Alberta airports such as YQU or YXJ to be cheaper to the USA than YEG which has more direct flights.
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enilria
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 1:32 pm

iyerhari wrote:
Thank you enilrea for all your efforts - you still managed to keep the time despite the daylight savings time change :)

My eyes are still heavy a day later! Thnx
BA wrote:
enilria wrote:
SyracuseAvGeek wrote:

This IS very interesting. I worked for Kenmore Air last summer at BFI, they only have 3 land based Cessna Caravan’s , in the summer the flights between BFI-ESD/FRD were completely full and they operated at about 5-6 daily each plus they also operate the mountain scenic to Rainer/Helens. I wonder if they will be finally getting more aircraft or if they plan on decreasing the current route offering out of BFI. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

Also, Kenmore is not a Part121 carrier, so they do not need security checkpoint. So they might be operating out of somewhere other than the main terminal.

So perhaps these do not count under the slot formula.


Kenmore Air will not be using any of the 24 slots as it only applies to Part 121 carriers.

San Juan Airlines, which is also not a Part 121 carrier, already has been flying from PAE since last year. They're not using the new terminal either, but an FBO across the street. I expect Kenmore Air will be doing the same.

Kenmore Air will probably run them off the Friday Harbor route.

There was an article a few days ago in the Everett Herald about the three unused slots. They are still held by United for the time being.

Excellent summary. Thanks.
hiflyeras wrote:
*SY BNA-PDX AUG 0.6>0.2[0.6]
SY DFW-MSP MAY 0.6>0.4[0.1]
*SY HNL-PDX JUN 0.3>0[0.3] JUL 0.3>0[0.3] AUG 0.2>0[0.3]
*SY LAS-PDX MAY 0.3>0.0[0.6]
SY MSP-ORD MAY 0.6>0.5[0.6]
SY MSP-SAN MAY 0.8>0.6[0.7]
*SY PDX-SFO JUN 0.3>0[0.5] JUL 0.3>0[0.8] AUG 0.2>0[0.9]

SY thought they were going to saunter into PDX and steal business from AS. Looks like the spanking is complete...adios SY.

Yeah. I think they moved crew there.
admanager wrote:
Lots this week - thanks.

:)
Iggy500 wrote:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that AS still flies SFO-FLL seasonally.

I would assume it is basically chaos in airline network planning, so I expect things to flip in and out willy nilly. Who knows.
rabader wrote:
enilria wrote:
4O GDL-LAS JUN 1.0>0.4[1.0] JUL 1.0>0.5[1.0] AUG 1.0>0.4[1.0] SEP 1.0>0.4[0.9] OCT 1.0>0.4[0.9] NOV 1.0>0.4[1.0] DEC 1.0>0.4[1.0]
4O GDL-LAX JUN 1.0>0.6[2] JUL 1.0>0.6[2] AUG 1.0>0.6[2] SEP 1.0>0.6[1.5] OCT 1.0>0.5[1.6] NOV 1.0>0.6[1.0] DEC 1.0>0.5[1.0]
4O GDL-ORD JUN 1.0>0.6[1.0] JUL 1.0>0.6[1.0] AUG 1.0>0.6[1.0] SEP 1.0>0.6[1.0] OCT 1.0>0.5[1.0] NOV 1.0>0.6[1.0] DEC 1.0>0.5[1.0]
4O GDL-SAT JUN 1.0>0.4[1.0] JUL 1.0>0.4[1.1] AUG 1.0>0.4[1.1] SEP 1.0>0.4[1.0] OCT 1.0>0.5[1.0] NOV 1.0>0.4[1.0] DEC 1.0>0.5[1.0]
4O GDL-SFO JUN 1.0>0.5[1.0] JUL 1.0>0.6[1.0] AUG 1.0>0.6[1.0] SEP 1.0>0.6[1.0] OCT 1.0>0.5[1.0] NOV 1.0>0.6[1.0] DEC 1.0>0.5[1.0]
4O JFK-MEX JUN 2>1.0[3] JUL 2>1.0[3] AUG 2>1.0[3] SEP 2>1.0[3] OCT 2>1.0[2] NOV 2>1.0[2] DEC 2.0>1.0[2]


Interjet slashing peak season services, the future doesn't look good for therm

If oil hadn't crashed more airlines would be stopping already.
tphuang wrote:
What do you think enilria? It seems like straight shifting of slots from one carrier to another for June to August.

That's a good theory, but it may also be that B6 was underflying and is afraid of getting caught up in the NK lawsuit against PANYNJ. OR they are going to make the case they are fully using those to justify getting AA's. OR they leased them as you suspect. What terrible timing to take on a bunch of slots? I wonder if they would do a deal like that in this climate?
LAX772LR wrote:
enilria wrote:
**NK MSY-SAP JUN 0>0.3[0] JUL 0>0.4[0] AUG 0>0.4[0] SEP 0>0.4[0] OCT 0>0.4[0] NOV 0>0.3[0]

Great to see them still going forward with their international expansion from MSY.

They seem pretty bullish on SAP. :smile:

That was mega-ballsy to add anything last week. I'm sure all the media coverage was "NK Adds Routes During Pandemic".
PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
It looks like DL is in the process of making their Covid-19 related changes for April. They haven't hit OAG yet. I have a couple of reservations out there for April and DL has no zero'd out inventory on some of these flights. They still show up in the schedule but as sold-out. Thus, I anticipate getting rebooked onto something else once they process these close-in cuts.

They put out a COVID email to customers today with no mention of cuts, but I don't doubt it.
 
Miamiairport
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 1:34 pm

The PHX/TPA cut in summer time I assume has to do with lack of Max a/c.
 
ScottB
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:56 pm

admanager wrote:
Is BFI-PAE now the only scheduled route within a metro area in the US?


Not intra-MSA, but BOS-PVC and BOS-HYA are both intra-CSA routes. LAX-PSP (apparently still flown by UAX) is also intra-CSA.

czbb wrote:
Heavily dependent on cruise traffic? Under 1m cruise passengers/yr and 25m passengers/yr through YVR Even if every passenger flew from YVR to/from Vancouver for a cruise that's still well under 10%


YVR as an airport isn't specifically dependent on cruise traffic, but a route like YVR-IAH is likely to see far more cruise passengers as a percentage of demand than most other routes at the airport. That route almost certainly needs cruise passengers to turn a profit, unlike something like YVR-YYZ or YVR-YYC.

golfingboy wrote:
Sounds like similar reason PHX-BWI was cut.


PHX-BWI would have been cut because it's a hub-to-hub route for WN (yes, I know, WN doesn't officially have hubs). There's no way AA can effectively compete with WN on pricing and schedule in that market, so they might as well just focus on PHX-DCA which WN cannot serve non-stop.
 
pmanni1
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 3:23 pm

DX weakens for SY
*SY BNA-PDX AUG 0.6>0.2[0.6]
SY DFW-MSP MAY 0.6>0.4[0.1]
*SY HNL-PDX JUN 0.3>0[0.3] JUL 0.3>0[0.3] AUG 0.2>0[0.3]
*SY LAS-PDX MAY 0.3>0.0[0.6]
SY MSP-ORD MAY 0.6>0.5[0.6]
SY MSP-SAN MAY 0.8>0.6[0.7]
*SY PDX-SFO JUN 0.3>0[0.5] JUL 0.3>0[0.8] AUG 0.2>0[0.9]

What are they doing with the freed up planes? Several of these routes reduced from PDX keep a plane occupied nearly all day.
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 6174
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:06 pm

ScottB wrote:
admanager wrote:
Is BFI-PAE now the only scheduled route within a metro area in the US?


Not intra-MSA, but BOS-PVC and BOS-HYA are both intra-CSA routes. LAX-PSP (apparently still flown by UAX) is also intra-CSA.

czbb wrote:
Heavily dependent on cruise traffic? Under 1m cruise passengers/yr and 25m passengers/yr through YVR Even if every passenger flew from YVR to/from Vancouver for a cruise that's still well under 10%


YVR as an airport isn't specifically dependent on cruise traffic, but a route like YVR-IAH is likely to see far more cruise passengers as a percentage of demand than most other routes at the airport. That route almost certainly needs cruise passengers to turn a profit, unlike something like YVR-YYZ or YVR-YYC.

golfingboy wrote:
Sounds like similar reason PHX-BWI was cut.


PHX-BWI would have been cut because it's a hub-to-hub route for WN (yes, I know, WN doesn't officially have hubs). There's no way AA can effectively compete with WN on pricing and schedule in that market, so they might as well just focus on PHX-DCA which WN cannot serve non-stop.


A big part of IAH-YVR is for feeding Latin America. I cant imagine itll be gone permanently.

YEG is a different story. As goes oil goes this route.
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ScottB
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:29 pm

LAXdude1023 wrote:
A big part of IAH-YVR is for feeding Latin America. I cant imagine itll be gone permanently.


That's not as important as you think. The big markets are available via YYZ or EWR, and loyalty-bound passengers will still accept a double-connect since the options on other carriers really aren't much better.
 
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AVLAirlineFreq
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:33 pm

Seems like quite a few frequencies dropped by AA out of PHL. Virus-related? Cutting feed to Europe?
 
BatonOps
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:39 pm

AVLAirlineFreq wrote:
Seems like quite a few frequencies dropped by AA out of PHL. Virus-related? Cutting feed to Europe?


Anyone know why AA is reducing ITH-PHL to 1.5 a week for July only? In August its back up to 3.0 a week.
 
LAXdude1023
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:08 pm

ScottB wrote:
LAXdude1023 wrote:
A big part of IAH-YVR is for feeding Latin America. I cant imagine itll be gone permanently.


That's not as important as you think. The big markets are available via YYZ or EWR, and loyalty-bound passengers will still accept a double-connect since the options on other carriers really aren't much better.


I’ve seen the data on it and no. It’s not a huge market but it does drive this flight a lot. I’m not speaking of Deep South America but rather Central America and no EWR and YYZ are not good substitutes for that.

However, the demand for that drops off in the summer where cruise traffic picks up. Given that cruise ships are pariahs right now, it makes sense that way.
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PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:15 pm

enilria wrote:
PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
It looks like DL is in the process of making their Covid-19 related changes for April. They haven't hit OAG yet. I have a couple of reservations out there for April and DL has no zero'd out inventory on some of these flights. They still show up in the schedule but as sold-out. Thus, I anticipate getting rebooked onto something else once they process these close-in cuts.

They put out a COVID email to customers today with no mention of cuts, but I don't doubt it.


The tell-tale sign is when you go to book a flight and see flights were every fare-class is sold out. They haven't pulled the flights out of the schedule just yet, but its a clue they aren't going to operate these flights. Its something in the process of zero'ing out the fare classes, rebooking existing passengers, and pulling the flight.

I'm seeing various day-of-the-week cancellations like this in April all over the place. Just spot-checking (and on flights I've got) I'm seeing this on routes like:
DTW-DFW
DTW-DEN
ATL-DEN
ATL-BOS
ATL-ORD

I'm sure we'll see the full scope of DL's April capacity reductions reflected in next weeks OAG thread.
 
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:30 pm

iyerhari wrote:
enilria wrote:
*AA BNA-JFK JUN 2>1.1[2] JUL 2>1.0[2] AUG 2>1.5[2]
*AA BOS-JFK JUN 6>3[1.0] JUL 6>3[0.6] AUG 6>4[0.5]
*AA BWI-JFK JUN 5>1.9[1.0] JUL 5>2.0[1.0] AUG 5>3[1.0]
*AA CLE-JFK JUN 1.8>0[1.0] JUL 2>0[1.0] AUG 2>0.9[1.0]
*AA CMH-JFK JUN 1.9>1.0[1.0] JUL 2>1.0[1.0] AUG 2>1.5[1.0]
*AA DCA-JFK JUN 4>3[0.6] JUL 4>3[0.1]
*AA DFW-JFK JUN 4>1.7[2] JUL 4>1.7[2] AUG 4>3[2]
*AA JFK-LAS JUN 1.8>0.9[1.7] JUL 2>1.0[1.2] AUG 2>1.5[1.0]
*AA JFK-MXP APR 1.0>0.2[1.0]
*AA JFK-ORD JUN 4>0.9[1.9] JUL 4>0.9[2] AUG 4>2[2]
*AA JFK-ORF JUN 1.8>0.9[3] JUL 2>1.0[3] AUG 2>1.5[3]
**AA JFK-PHL JUN 5>0[0] JUL 5>0[0] AUG 5>2[0]
*AA JFK-PIT JUN 4>1.0[1.0] JUL 4>1.0[1.0] AUG 4>2[1.0]
*AA JFK-RDU JUN 4>2[2] JUL 4>2[2] AUG 4>3[2]
*AA JFK-RIC JUN 3>1.0[0] JUL 3>1.0[0] AUG 3>1.9[0]
*AA JFK-YUL JUN 1.9>1.0[1.0] JUL 2>1.0[1.0] AUG 2>1.5[1.0]
*AA JFK-YYZ JUN 1.8>0[2] JUL 2>0[2] AUG 2>0.9[2]


These are pretty brutal JFK cuts


For the most part it's extending the cuts they've already put in place at JFK since the MAX crisis started. A few markets are actually better off in this schedule (e.g. SAN and LAS, which have both been cut entirely in previous months), while a few like LAX, RDU, and CUN are down from May to June. Most markets are constant from May to June. Overall JFK looks to be sitting just shy of 80 daily departures for AA this summer.
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enilria
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 8:10 pm

PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
enilria wrote:
PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
It looks like DL is in the process of making their Covid-19 related changes for April. They haven't hit OAG yet. I have a couple of reservations out there for April and DL has no zero'd out inventory on some of these flights. They still show up in the schedule but as sold-out. Thus, I anticipate getting rebooked onto something else once they process these close-in cuts.

They put out a COVID email to customers today with no mention of cuts, but I don't doubt it.


The tell-tale sign is when you go to book a flight and see flights were every fare-class is sold out. They haven't pulled the flights out of the schedule just yet, but its a clue they aren't going to operate these flights. Its something in the process of zero'ing out the fare classes, rebooking existing passengers, and pulling the flight.

I'm seeing various day-of-the-week cancellations like this in April all over the place. Just spot-checking (and on flights I've got) I'm seeing this on routes like:
DTW-DFW
DTW-DEN
ATL-DEN
ATL-BOS
ATL-ORD

I'm sure we'll see the full scope of DL's April capacity reductions reflected in next weeks OAG thread.

From talking to people in the industry I get the impression that UA's 10% April domestic cut will be made more or less standard for the other airlines.
FSDan wrote:
iyerhari wrote:
enilria wrote:
*AA BNA-JFK JUN 2>1.1[2] JUL 2>1.0[2] AUG 2>1.5[2]
*AA BOS-JFK JUN 6>3[1.0] JUL 6>3[0.6] AUG 6>4[0.5]
*AA BWI-JFK JUN 5>1.9[1.0] JUL 5>2.0[1.0] AUG 5>3[1.0]
*AA CLE-JFK JUN 1.8>0[1.0] JUL 2>0[1.0] AUG 2>0.9[1.0]
*AA CMH-JFK JUN 1.9>1.0[1.0] JUL 2>1.0[1.0] AUG 2>1.5[1.0]
*AA DCA-JFK JUN 4>3[0.6] JUL 4>3[0.1]
*AA DFW-JFK JUN 4>1.7[2] JUL 4>1.7[2] AUG 4>3[2]
*AA JFK-LAS JUN 1.8>0.9[1.7] JUL 2>1.0[1.2] AUG 2>1.5[1.0]
*AA JFK-MXP APR 1.0>0.2[1.0]
*AA JFK-ORD JUN 4>0.9[1.9] JUL 4>0.9[2] AUG 4>2[2]
*AA JFK-ORF JUN 1.8>0.9[3] JUL 2>1.0[3] AUG 2>1.5[3]
**AA JFK-PHL JUN 5>0[0] JUL 5>0[0] AUG 5>2[0]
*AA JFK-PIT JUN 4>1.0[1.0] JUL 4>1.0[1.0] AUG 4>2[1.0]
*AA JFK-RDU JUN 4>2[2] JUL 4>2[2] AUG 4>3[2]
*AA JFK-RIC JUN 3>1.0[0] JUL 3>1.0[0] AUG 3>1.9[0]
*AA JFK-YUL JUN 1.9>1.0[1.0] JUL 2>1.0[1.0] AUG 2>1.5[1.0]
*AA JFK-YYZ JUN 1.8>0[2] JUL 2>0[2] AUG 2>0.9[2]


These are pretty brutal JFK cuts


For the most part it's extending the cuts they've already put in place at JFK since the MAX crisis started. A few markets are actually better off in this schedule (e.g. SAN and LAS, which have both been cut entirely in previous months), while a few like LAX, RDU, and CUN are down from May to June. Most markets are constant from May to June. Overall JFK looks to be sitting just shy of 80 daily departures for AA this summer.

Yes, it is a slight change. I wonder what will happen with unused slots in the Corona world...
 
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 9:52 pm

My suspicion is that the PHX-TPA/PIT/CMH cuts are Coronavirus and lack of a/c related. I suspect they'll be back in October like they're slated to right now and will be back on their normal schedule after that. We'll see in October though...
 
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 10:04 pm

FSDan wrote:
iyerhari wrote:
enilria wrote:
*AA BNA-JFK JUN 2>1.1[2] JUL 2>1.0[2] AUG 2>1.5[2]
*AA BOS-JFK JUN 6>3[1.0] JUL 6>3[0.6] AUG 6>4[0.5]
*AA BWI-JFK JUN 5>1.9[1.0] JUL 5>2.0[1.0] AUG 5>3[1.0]
*AA CLE-JFK JUN 1.8>0[1.0] JUL 2>0[1.0] AUG 2>0.9[1.0]
*AA CMH-JFK JUN 1.9>1.0[1.0] JUL 2>1.0[1.0] AUG 2>1.5[1.0]
*AA DCA-JFK JUN 4>3[0.6] JUL 4>3[0.1]
*AA DFW-JFK JUN 4>1.7[2] JUL 4>1.7[2] AUG 4>3[2]
*AA JFK-LAS JUN 1.8>0.9[1.7] JUL 2>1.0[1.2] AUG 2>1.5[1.0]
*AA JFK-MXP APR 1.0>0.2[1.0]
*AA JFK-ORD JUN 4>0.9[1.9] JUL 4>0.9[2] AUG 4>2[2]
*AA JFK-ORF JUN 1.8>0.9[3] JUL 2>1.0[3] AUG 2>1.5[3]
**AA JFK-PHL JUN 5>0[0] JUL 5>0[0] AUG 5>2[0]
*AA JFK-PIT JUN 4>1.0[1.0] JUL 4>1.0[1.0] AUG 4>2[1.0]
*AA JFK-RDU JUN 4>2[2] JUL 4>2[2] AUG 4>3[2]
*AA JFK-RIC JUN 3>1.0[0] JUL 3>1.0[0] AUG 3>1.9[0]
*AA JFK-YUL JUN 1.9>1.0[1.0] JUL 2>1.0[1.0] AUG 2>1.5[1.0]
*AA JFK-YYZ JUN 1.8>0[2] JUL 2>0[2] AUG 2>0.9[2]


These are pretty brutal JFK cuts


For the most part it's extending the cuts they've already put in place at JFK since the MAX crisis started. A few markets are actually better off in this schedule (e.g. SAN and LAS, which have both been cut entirely in previous months), while a few like LAX, RDU, and CUN are down from May to June. Most markets are constant from May to June. Overall JFK looks to be sitting just shy of 80 daily departures for AA this summer.


This one is weird for me, because they normally adjust one month at a time and this time adjusted 2 and half month at a time. At the same time JetBlue somehow found enough slots to add about 14 daily trips. Since I find it hard to believe that B6 could be sitting on 50 unused slots for most of the year in past few years, I'm concluding that some of AA is ending up in JetBlue's hand (through leasing most likely). We will see how this works out. Hard to see how AA can retain all their slots with PA looking to taking them away.

Also, I don't see how BNA/YUL/RIC/BWI/CLE/YYZ/ORF/PIT stick around long term when there is nothing to connect to. Now that they are putting a renewed effort, BOS and RDU will probably stick around.

But if they want to be more competitive on JFK-BOS/RDU, they really need to upgauge to at least 76 seaters on these route. Otherwise, the high cost of 44/50 seaters is killing them here.

I anticipate there to be some near term cuts from AA out of JFK this week or next due to coronavirus.

Most likely, LHR/LAX/SFO will see reductions. The LF recently on JFK-LHR have been horrible. AA doesn't have enough cash flow around to keep flying empty planes.
 
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 10:16 pm

Me thinks it will no longer be a MAX cut, it will be a CORONA cut for airline industry for the coming two quarters.
 
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Mon Mar 09, 2020 10:19 pm

tphuang wrote:
But if they want to be more competitive on JFK-BOS/RDU, they really need to upgauge to at least 76 seaters on these route. Otherwise, the high cost of 44/50 seaters is killing them here.

JFK-BOS is all Mainline and I'm not sure that JFK-RDU needs to be a 76 seater when most of the O&D market is going to go through LGA (where they do have E75s/E90s running the route). The cost of two daily ERD trips isn't the killer you make it out to be when compared with the cost of getting the additional E75 into the rotation and off possibly more profitable routes out of the other hubs.

tphuang wrote:
Most likely, LHR/LAX/SFO will see reductions. The LF recently on JFK-LHR have been horrible. AA doesn't have enough cash flow around to keep flying empty planes.

JFK-LHR has only really been bad on two of the departures each day (and at that they are flying roughly half-full, not empty). I would expect the trim will be a single 772 each day and that'll be it.
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 12:37 am

tphuang wrote:
Also, I don't see how BNA/YUL/RIC/BWI/CLE/YYZ/ORF/PIT stick around long term when there is nothing to connect to. Now that they are putting a renewed effort, BOS and RDU will probably stick around.


Yeah, with the terminal renovation and BA move-in, the renderings all seemed to show the RJ gates being repurposed as additional widebody gates. AA has also indicated that their gameplan with NYC is increasingly focused on O&D, so I suspect you're correct that most of the short feeder markets will fall by the wayside over the coming years. Heck, in the past CLE and YYZ were often operated with higher frequency than most of the similar markets they've kept around, and they've been fine with cutting those completely on a rolling basis for a while now...
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 12:37 am

alasizon wrote:
tphuang wrote:
But if they want to be more competitive on JFK-BOS/RDU, they really need to upgauge to at least 76 seaters on these route. Otherwise, the high cost of 44/50 seaters is killing them here.

JFK-BOS is all Mainline and I'm not sure that JFK-RDU needs to be a 76 seater when most of the O&D market is going to go through LGA (where they do have E75s/E90s running the route). The cost of two daily ERD trips isn't the killer you make it out to be when compared with the cost of getting the additional E75 into the rotation and off possibly more profitable routes out of the other hubs.

tphuang wrote:
Most likely, LHR/LAX/SFO will see reductions. The LF recently on JFK-LHR have been horrible. AA doesn't have enough cash flow around to keep flying empty planes.

JFK-LHR has only really been bad on two of the departures each day (and at that they are flying roughly half-full, not empty). I would expect the trim will be a single 772 each day and that'll be it.

A321T has really high cost too. It might be as high as 50 seaters. Sure 2 daily ERDs don't kill you, but 20 flights a day on ERDs out of a station where you are competing against small mainlines will kill you.

There has been many reports of planes that are far more empty than that on LHR-JFK. Even BA is cutting a flight. We will see what happens, but I would be shocked if we don't see JFK get hammered when AA starts to cut flights for coronavirus.
 
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 2:20 am

enilria wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:
enilria wrote:
**NK MSY-SAP

Great to see them still going forward with their international expansion from MSY.
They seem pretty bullish on SAP.

That was mega-ballsy to add anything last week. I'm sure all the media coverage was "NK Adds Routes During Pandemic".

They were smart about it, in that they tackled the issue head-on in local media releases, and co-opted the narrative to their own advantage.

Example:
https://www.nola.com/news/business/arti ... 4a6cd.html
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 2:43 am

enilria wrote:
From talking to people in the industry I get the impression that UA's 10% April domestic cut will be made more or less standard for the other airlines.

I figure it would be worse that than, I was figuring 20-30% for April.

That said, like you mentioned elsewhere its really challenging to do close-in cancellations. Other than the ones in Feb & Mar where specific international routes have been suspended, its more challenging domestically. At least for the next 5-6 weeks, they have domestic leisure travel for spring break propping-up many routes.

Frankly, this sucks. Sad to see how quickly things can take a turn for the worse. It was exciting and interesting to see all the route additions and capacity increases over the nearly past decade.
Now were back to the same crap we saw in 2005-2010 of reductions, cancellations, and reactions. Its not fun for anyone in the industry.
 
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enilria
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 2:51 am

PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
enilria wrote:
From talking to people in the industry I get the impression that UA's 10% April domestic cut will be made more or less standard for the other airlines.

I figure it would be worse that than, I was figuring 20-30% for April.

That said, like you mentioned elsewhere its really challenging to do close-in cancellations. Other than the ones in Feb & Mar where specific international routes have been suspended, its more challenging domestically. At least for the next 5-6 weeks, they have domestic leisure travel for spring break propping-up many routes.

Frankly, this sucks. Sad to see how quickly things can take a turn for the worse. It was exciting and interesting to see all the route additions and capacity increases over the nearly past decade.
Now were back to the same crap we saw in 2005-2010 of reductions, cancellations, and reactions. Its not fun for anyone in the industry.

These are dark days. I'm with you. Let's hope 80F temps kill this thing.
 
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:01 am

The story I've heard for April, particularly regarding domestic cuts has to do a lot with crew/fleet scheduling.

Since these close-in reductions are being made within the typical timeframe for crew bid packages there are some extra steps from a contractual perspective and from a IT/systems prespective.

Basically, for example, DL already has a schedule out for April that has been firm since basically January. They had the inventory for sale, they posted crew bids and awarded for such on the original schedule. Now they are essentially triaging the schedule and trimming out what they perceive as as non-essential/low yield/low booking/easy to reaccomodate flights. Crews will get compensated based on the original schedule, regardless of the flights being cancelled-out. There is a whole work flow involved at this point for close-in cancelations that is a lot more complex than when they do cancelations/adjustments that are 3-6 months where they haven't release crew bid packages and so-forth.
 
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 3:48 am

If I'm understanding well, Spirit is reducing FLL-SAP? Quite amazing if that's the fact as these guys don't have empty flights.
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 4:40 am

Perhaps it’s COVID-related, but we continue to see F9 at less than 2 a day in the majority of markets. From a consumer perspective, that would make me want to take another carrier. The double nightmare of both F9’s inability to reaccom passengers on their own metal plus their inability to reaccom on OAL means getting a hotel (not paid by F9 apparently) and waiting around a long time if things go south. F9’s fares can be great at first glance, but once you add a checked bag and a seat assignment, the difference is often too small to keep one from choosing another carrier. A lot of people still haven’t figured this out and are paying the price when they book a connection with them.
 
 
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enilria
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:22 am

PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
The story I've heard for April, particularly regarding domestic cuts has to do a lot with crew/fleet scheduling.

Since these close-in reductions are being made within the typical timeframe for crew bid packages there are some extra steps from a contractual perspective and from a IT/systems prespective.

Basically, for example, DL already has a schedule out for April that has been firm since basically January. They had the inventory for sale, they posted crew bids and awarded for such on the original schedule. Now they are essentially triaging the schedule and trimming out what they perceive as as non-essential/low yield/low booking/easy to reaccomodate flights. Crews will get compensated based on the original schedule, regardless of the flights being cancelled-out. There is a whole work flow involved at this point for close-in cancelations that is a lot more complex than when they do cancelations/adjustments that are 3-6 months where they haven't release crew bid packages and so-forth.

Agreed. With crew paid and fuel prices crashing, variable cost becomes very low.
 
wedgetail737
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Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 12:28 pm

n7371f wrote:
F9 bails on GEG-LAS


Perfect opportunity for AS or G4 to take that route over.
 
Aliqiout
Posts: 382
Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2016 6:10 pm

Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 12:44 pm

[photoid][/photoid]
YYZORD wrote:
It could be that maybe AC is replacing YVR-IAH, YEG is permanently gone as YYC is nearby.

How many people use YYC when their destination is YEG?
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 6174
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 1:14 pm

Aliqiout wrote:
[photoid][/photoid]
YYZORD wrote:
It could be that maybe AC is replacing YVR-IAH, YEG is permanently gone as YYC is nearby.

How many people use YYC when their destination is YEG?


Literally no one.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD BRING BACK THE PAYWALL!!!!
 
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flyPIT
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Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 4:06 pm

Aliqiout wrote:
How many people use YYC when their destination is YEG?


10 years ago that number stood at 750,000 people so that would mean 1.5 million passengers as far as airport total passenger statistics go (assuming those people are making round trips).
https://flyeia.com/corporate/media/news/edmonton-international-airport-launches-intervention-campaign/

Not sure what the numbers are today.
FLYi
 
Rdh3e
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Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:09 pm

Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 4:41 pm

LAXdude1023 wrote:
Aliqiout wrote:
[photoid][/photoid]
YYZORD wrote:
It could be that maybe AC is replacing YVR-IAH, YEG is permanently gone as YYC is nearby.

How many people use YYC when their destination is YEG?


Literally no one.

Air Canada flies YYC-YEG 10X daily, likely passengers will end up connecting through YYC rather than using it as the end of their journey.
 
ScottB
Posts: 7000
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2000 1:25 am

Re: OAG Changes 3/8/2020:AA Drops PHX-PIT/TPA,CHAPHL,DFWOAK Adds ORDHNL;DL Drops KIXSEA;UA Drops IAHCAK,FLLSFO,IAHYEG,MS

Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:28 pm

usdcaguy wrote:
we continue to see F9 at less than 2 a day in the majority of markets. From a consumer perspective, that would make me want to take another carrier. The double nightmare of both F9’s inability to reaccom passengers on their own metal plus their inability to reaccom on OAL means getting a hotel (not paid by F9 apparently) and waiting around a long time if things go south. F9’s fares can be great at first glance, but once you add a checked bag and a seat assignment, the difference is often too small to keep one from choosing another carrier. A lot of people still haven’t figured this out and are paying the price when they book a connection with them.


Yes, a lot of people don't understand the potential problems which can happen when you miss a connection on F9 or similar carriers which operate sub-daily and do not interline. The business model of the ULCCs is basically predicated on a low headline price to get the customer to commit and then charging a bunch of near-unavoidable add-on fees to those who don't know how to get around them.

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