Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Re: Air Canada NS21 International service changes

Fri Oct 09, 2020 1:22 am

Tons of connections to GRU on my YVR-YUL flight back in January
 
Dominion301
Posts: 2877
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2016 1:48 pm

Re: Air Canada NS21 International service changes

Fri Oct 09, 2020 1:04 pm

yulexpansion wrote:
flyingqueen wrote:
I don't understand what the problem with Air Canada is. It is a cosy duopoly in a rich nation. From the friends I have, I also hear YUL to GRU is loss making ego route of the bosses. I also surprise they do not go to more places from YYZ or add frequency.


It's always great to throw bland statements around with no facts - clearly your friends and yourself have no idea what you're talking about.


In this environment, the fact that AC are indicating YUL-GRU is going year-round points to a successful route, likely backed by very strong cargo demand...while I have no evidence to back that up, given how low pax demand is these days and how AC’s made a big cargo push in recent months, it’s probably a safe bet. AC have not been in the business of “prestige” routes for a very long time.
 
Skywatcher
Posts: 897
Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2002 11:19 am

Re: Air Canada NS21 International service changes

Fri Oct 09, 2020 2:43 pm

Brazil has become a "hot" go to destination for millenials. Although Quebecers are not big domestic Canada/USA flyers they punch above their weight with international flying.
I would think that GRU-YUL-asia would work over the pole just as easily as GRU-YYZ-asia. It all depends on which is the more cost efficient routing.
 
yulexpansion
Posts: 108
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:08 pm

Re: Air Canada NS21 International service changes

Fri Oct 09, 2020 5:10 pm

Dominion301 wrote:
yulexpansion wrote:
flyingqueen wrote:
I don't understand what the problem with Air Canada is. It is a cosy duopoly in a rich nation. From the friends I have, I also hear YUL to GRU is loss making ego route of the bosses. I also surprise they do not go to more places from YYZ or add frequency.


It's always great to throw bland statements around with no facts - clearly your friends and yourself have no idea what you're talking about.


In this environment, the fact that AC are indicating YUL-GRU is going year-round points to a successful route, likely backed by very strong cargo demand...while I have no evidence to back that up, given how low pax demand is these days and how AC’s made a big cargo push in recent months, it’s probably a safe bet. AC have not been in the business of “prestige” routes for a very long time.


Nice to see some people thinking rationally on a.net
Clearly flyingqueen is vindictive and should make new friends.
 
andrew1996
Posts: 82
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2020 6:41 pm

Re: Air Canada NS21 International service changes

Fri Oct 09, 2020 6:02 pm

HJM wrote:
Need to remember that much of the traffic to Brazil comes from many places, not just only Montreal. YUL likely is a less costly airport for AC to operate from and convenient for connecting passengers.


I never thought of that as a factor of YUL being cheaper than YYZ as being one of the reasons why AC may want to funnel more traffic through YUL. However, wouldn't it be more efficient and economies of scales to focus all on YYZ to offer even more connections and greater economies of scale and make transiting cargo easier too or does YUL provide a good amount of O&D for GRU?

YYZ offers more flights to Europe and Asia as YYZ offers HND/NRT, ICN, PEK, HKG on top of what YUL offers, which is just NRT and PVG on AC.
 
yulexpansion
Posts: 108
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2019 3:08 pm

Re: Air Canada NS21 International service changes

Fri Oct 09, 2020 7:14 pm

andrew1996 wrote:
HJM wrote:
Need to remember that much of the traffic to Brazil comes from many places, not just only Montreal. YUL likely is a less costly airport for AC to operate from and convenient for connecting passengers.


I never thought of that as a factor of YUL being cheaper than YYZ as being one of the reasons why AC may want to funnel more traffic through YUL. However, wouldn't it be more efficient and economies of scales to focus all on YYZ to offer even more connections and greater economies of scale and make transiting cargo easier too or does YUL provide a good amount of O&D for GRU?

YYZ offers more flights to Europe and Asia as YYZ offers HND/NRT, ICN, PEK, HKG on top of what YUL offers, which is just NRT and PVG on AC.


Until early-2020, T1 YYZ was pretty much maxed out. It's a function of growing where operationally feasible as well.
 
behramjee
Posts: 5118
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 4:56 am

Re: Air Canada NS21 International service changes

Fri Oct 09, 2020 7:54 pm

andrew1996 wrote:
HJM wrote:
Need to remember that much of the traffic to Brazil comes from many places, not just only Montreal. YUL likely is a less costly airport for AC to operate from and convenient for connecting passengers.


I never thought of that as a factor of YUL being cheaper than YYZ as being one of the reasons why AC may want to funnel more traffic through YUL. However, wouldn't it be more efficient and economies of scales to focus all on YYZ to offer even more connections and greater economies of scale and make transiting cargo easier too or does YUL provide a good amount of O&D for GRU?

YYZ offers more flights to Europe and Asia as YYZ offers HND/NRT, ICN, PEK, HKG on top of what YUL offers, which is just NRT and PVG on AC.


Yes the main reason why YYZ has more flights on offer not only by AC but also other carriers to both Asia and Europe is because baseline p2p demand to begin with is much higher versus YUL.

The only main segments where demand from YUL is higher than YYZ (in AC's online network pre-Covid) are CDG, CMN, ALG, TUN and GVA hence why you see AC's North African network operate from YUL iso YYZ primarily and why pre-Covid YUL-GVA was year round unlike YYZ-GVA.
 
Thenoflyzone
Posts: 3018
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 4:42 am

Re: Air Canada NS21 International service changes

Fri Oct 09, 2020 8:44 pm

andrew1996 wrote:
HJM wrote:
Need to remember that much of the traffic to Brazil comes from many places, not just only Montreal. YUL likely is a less costly airport for AC to operate from and convenient for connecting passengers.


I never thought of that as a factor of YUL being cheaper than YYZ as being one of the reasons why AC may want to funnel more traffic through YUL. However, wouldn't it be more efficient and economies of scales to focus all on YYZ to offer even more connections and greater economies of scale and make transiting cargo easier too or does YUL provide a good amount of O&D for GRU?

YYZ offers more flights to Europe and Asia as YYZ offers HND/NRT, ICN, PEK, HKG on top of what YUL offers, which is just NRT and PVG on AC.


GRU-YUL, unlike GRU-YYZ, is a daytime flight, and therefore doesn't connect with any of the YUL-Asia flights.
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
SpaceshipDC10
Posts: 7054
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:44 am

AC to resume YVR-SYD flights Dec '20

Thu Oct 15, 2020 11:34 am

So far 3x weekly until Jan. 10, '21. Good to see such route return. I wonder if there's a typo on the days of departure from SYD on the linked post?

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... -dec-2020/
 
smi0006
Posts: 2586
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2008 7:45 am

Re: AC to resume YVR-SYD flights Dec '20

Thu Oct 15, 2020 11:46 am

Be interesting if they can actually carry any passengers inbound though, at this stage the Australian border is closed to everyone except returning residents and citizens(exception will be NZ to NSW and NT from tomorrow), and even then there are strict capacity restrictions in place to facilitate quarantine- admittedly the capacity is going to be increased- currently Sydney is limited to approx 40-50 pax per flight. Governments goal is to get all Aussies home by Xmas, so not sure who AC will be carrying...
 
qf002
Posts: 3681
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2011 11:14 am

Re: AC to resume YVR-SYD flights Dec '20

Thu Oct 15, 2020 11:48 am

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
I wonder if there's a typo on the days of departure from SYD on the linked post?


Looks okay to me? Remember you arrive into SYD two days after you depart YVR due to the date line.
 
User avatar
RyanairGuru
Posts: 8469
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:59 am

Re: AC to resume YVR-SYD flights Dec '20

Thu Oct 15, 2020 11:51 am

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
So far 3x weekly until Jan. 10, '21. Good to see such route return. I wonder if there's a typo on the days of departure from SYD on the linked post?

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... -dec-2020/


No typo. Having crossed the date line the aircraft arrives in SYD two days after leaving YVR. Therefore:

Day 2 YVR-SYD is day 4 SYD-YVR
Day 4 YVR-SYD is day 6 SYD-YVR
Day 7 YVR-SYD is day 2 SYD-YVR

Seems like an odd choice of seasonal route. Flights to Australia must survive on cargo because inbound passenger capacity is capped, and equates to about 30-50 pax per flight. The seasonal nature for the "peak" season suggests it is passenger focussed, which I really can't see working given the current restrictions on entering Australia.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
SpaceshipDC10
Posts: 7054
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:44 am

Re: AC to resume YVR-SYD flights Dec '20

Thu Oct 15, 2020 12:02 pm

RyanairGuru wrote:
No typo. Having crossed the date line the aircraft arrives in SYD two days after leaving YVR. is passenger focussed, which I really can't see working given the current restrictions on entering Australia.


Oh yes, there's that. Thanks.
 
zkncj
Posts: 3914
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 4:57 pm

Re: AC to resume YVR-SYD flights Dec '20

Thu Oct 15, 2020 5:19 pm

RyanairGuru wrote:

Seems like an odd choice of seasonal route. Flights to Australia must survive on cargo because inbound passenger capacity is capped, and equates to about 30-50 pax per flight. The seasonal nature for the "peak" season suggests it is passenger focussed, which I really can't see working given the current restrictions on entering Australia.


AC is currently running an daily 77W cargo services on YVR-SYD-AKL-YVR.
 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Fri Oct 16, 2020 1:55 pm

https://www.newswire.ca/news-releases/c ... 56029.html

After 12 years serving as AC’s CEO, Calin will step down in early 2021, to be replaced by Michael Rosseau.

Calins done an amazing job in helping with the transformation of Air Canada and seeing them through the transformation of the airline, and now with covid. Had to happen eventually
 
codyul
Posts: 130
Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2018 6:43 pm

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Fri Oct 16, 2020 4:24 pm

This is brutally sad for this AC employee. He is a trusted and proven leader.
YUL PNC :weightlifter:
 
ramprat320
Posts: 21
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2015 8:17 pm

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Fri Oct 16, 2020 4:25 pm

Inevitable. Not surprising. Very disappointing.
 
cirrusdragoon
Posts: 236
Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2018 6:42 pm

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Fri Oct 16, 2020 6:44 pm

Air Canada is in good hands with the successor. All the best in his retirement, he did wonders for Air Canada [applause]
 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:06 pm

codyul wrote:
This is brutally sad for this AC employee. He is a trusted and proven leader.


Agreed. It was inevitable though, it sounds like he still wants to do some work before he leaves to make sure AC is set for the next year and beyond in terms of recovery.
 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:07 pm

cirrusdragoon wrote:
Air Canada is in good hands with the successor. All the best in his retirement, he did wonders for Air Canada [applause]


 
User avatar
IrishAyes
Posts: 2435
Joined: Sat Jan 26, 2008 6:04 pm

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:11 pm

He did remarkable work for Air Canada. As an honorary Canadian, I felt my love rekindled for AC under his leadership.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yabstkLyTMc
 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:28 pm

IrishAyes wrote:
He did remarkable work for Air Canada. As an honorary Canadian, I felt my love rekindled for AC under his leadership.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yabstkLyTMc


He definitely did an amazing job as did the whole executive board. The transformation AC has undergone took a long time but it completely changed the airline for the better in a lot of ways. His leadership skills are amazing, it will be sad to see him go.
 
YYZORD
Posts: 521
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2019 5:26 pm

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Fri Oct 16, 2020 8:52 pm

Does this mean that AC will stop being a protectionist airline?
 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sat Oct 17, 2020 3:43 pm

YYZORD wrote:
Does this mean that AC will stop being a protectionist airline?


Never!
 
codyul
Posts: 130
Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2018 6:43 pm

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sat Oct 17, 2020 4:38 pm

777luver wrote:
YYZORD wrote:
Does this mean that AC will stop being a protectionist airline?


Never!

:lol:
YUL PNC :weightlifter:
 
Whiteguy
Posts: 1573
Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2003 6:11 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sat Oct 17, 2020 5:18 pm

YYZORD wrote:
Does this mean that AC will stop being a protectionist airline?


Shouldn’t be an issue, with zero support for Canadian airlines from this government there won’t be any left anyway.....I’m sure EK will be more then willing to jump in and save you all from high airfares!!
 
codyul
Posts: 130
Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2018 6:43 pm

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sat Oct 17, 2020 9:52 pm

Man I'm cracking up :lol:
YUL PNC :weightlifter:
 
PWA732
Posts: 14
Joined: Sun Mar 22, 2020 10:43 pm

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sat Oct 17, 2020 10:29 pm

He made quick work of the Unions for sure. They never knew what hit them until it was over. He left them divided, confused and earning far less than they were a decade ago. In fact most unionized AC employees still don't get what happened.

His "divide and crush" union tactics would make for an amazing business playbook. The shareholder benefited nicely. Great work!


FWIW, It was a bit sad though. The employees were never more than a "cost unit" that needed to be driven down. The rise in share price was reflected in their direct loss.

Pete.
 
9252fly
Posts: 1046
Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 7:19 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sat Oct 17, 2020 10:56 pm

PWA732 wrote:
He made quick work of the Unions for sure. They never knew what hit them until it was over. He left them divided, confused and earning far less than they were a decade ago. In fact most unionized AC employees still don't get what happened.

His "divide and crush" union tactics would make for an amazing business playbook. The shareholder benefited nicely. Great work!


FWIW, It was a bit sad though. The employees were never more than a "cost unit" that needed to be driven down. The rise in share price was reflected in their direct loss.

Pete.


Indeed, he will be remembered ruthless negotiating skills, whether that be the employee groups or suppliers. Love him, or hate him he did the job he was paid to do and will leave the company in a much stronger position to survive the pandemic downturn.
 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 5:30 am

PWA732 wrote:
He made quick work of the Unions for sure. They never knew what hit them until it was over. He left them divided, confused and earning far less than they were a decade ago. In fact most unionized AC employees still don't get what happened.

His "divide and crush" union tactics would make for an amazing business playbook. The shareholder benefited nicely. Great work!


FWIW, It was a bit sad though. The employees were never more than a "cost unit" that needed to be driven down. The rise in share price was reflected in their direct loss.

Pete.


What exactly are you referring to when you say “left them divided, confused and earning far less than they did a decade ago”? And “AC employees still don’t get what happened”? No idea what you’re referring to as a direct loss either.
 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 5:30 am

codyul wrote:
777luver wrote:
YYZORD wrote:
Does this mean that AC will stop being a protectionist airline?


Never!

:lol:


Sarcasm lol
 
Canuck600
Posts: 299
Joined: Tue Aug 01, 2017 5:24 pm

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 5:56 am

I really don't understand why so many airliners.net members enjoy seeing employees being screwed over by management.
 
Blerg
Posts: 4271
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:42 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 6:15 am

So what exactly has he done for the airline? I am genuinely interested in finding out. I see in their 2019 financial report that their income and profits grew, debt was considerably reduced but from what I heard the overall flying experience with them is not that great. From a passenger's perspective at least.
 
B777LRF
Posts: 2737
Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 4:23 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 10:51 am

Canuck600 wrote:
I really don't understand why so many airliners.net members enjoy seeing employees being screwed over by management.


They're kids who fancy themselves as being owner or CEO of an airline, when reality is the most they're likely to ever own or run is a lemonade stand. It's also mainly US thing.

One could use the analogy they're turkey's voting on whether to be cooked in an oven or fried in oil.
Signature. You just read one.
 
flyyul
Posts: 4460
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2000 11:25 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 12:20 pm

Blerg wrote:
So what exactly has he done for the airline? I am genuinely interested in finding out. I see in their 2019 financial report that their income and profits grew, debt was considerably reduced but from what I heard the overall flying experience with them is not that great. From a passenger's perspective at least.


Let me see

Best airline in North America by SkyTraxx for 5 years
Best Business class in North America

Have you flown AC or are you relying on the peanut gallery?
 
ElPistolero
Posts: 2117
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 12:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 3:42 pm

flyyul wrote:
Blerg wrote:
So what exactly has he done for the airline? I am genuinely interested in finding out. I see in their 2019 financial report that their income and profits grew, debt was considerably reduced but from what I heard the overall flying experience with them is not that great. From a passenger's perspective at least.


Let me see

Best airline in North America by SkyTraxx for 5 years
Best Business class in North America

Have you flown AC or are you relying on the peanut gallery?


Blerg’s not wrong. Rovinescu has done great work on the financial and labour fronts, but the cost-cutting, particularly in Y, has been evident over the past decade.

The signature lounges and J product(s) introduced under him are generally very good, but the vast, vast majority of AC pax fly in Y, and the reviews have been uniformly bad.

Take Skytrax. Notwithstanding it’s questionable methodology (“consulting fees”), it’s own website points to poor customer satisfaction (mainline - 4/10; rouge - 3/10). (For context, DL gets 5/10 hence methodology issues.)

https://www.airlinequality.com/airline- ... ir-canada/
https://www.airlinequality.com/airline- ... ada-rouge/

More reputable firms like JD Power tell a similar tale.
On the international front, it puts AC at below average.

- On TPAC, AC is joined in the sub-par “the rest” category by UA, AA and MU.
- On TATL, it is one of two sub-par airlines, the other being a ULCC (DY).

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press- ... tion-study

The North American surveys aren’t better. AC finds itself below average, and in the esteemed company of ULCC’s Frontier and Spirit.

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press- ... tion-study

Which is to say, the record profits go hand-in-hand with cost cutting, and the vast majority of AC pax have experienced it across the board. It prompted the whole air passenger rights thing, and some of the criticism seems to have stung Rovinescu enough pre-COVID to prompt this February 2020 announcement:

“This spring, we will launch a redesigned interna­tional Economy Class meal service. We are intro­ducing hot-towel service, new beverage selections including a sparkling-wine cocktail, a chef-inspired meal choice, healthier green salad, a separate dessert service, and yogurt and fruit for break­fast. “

https://www.aircanada.com/content/airca ... isine.html

He’s taken AC on quite the journey since 2009. Some good; some not so good. Profits have gone up and the J experience has improved, but 2019 AC would struggle to make the Y pax experience any worse.

I think he’s smart to walk away now. Nobody knows what’s coming next; we may well be at an inflection point for air travel. He’s done his bit to leave AC in a financially solid position. The next guy can figure out how to deal with evolving customer expectations and travel patterns.

That said, his immense success as a first-generation immigrant is worthy of respect even from detractors. His self-admitted source of his drive - the immigrant’s fear of losing everything they’ve achieved - resonates with many immigrants. Disagree with him on a lot, but can only admire and learn from the way he fought his corner.
 
Skywatcher
Posts: 897
Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2002 11:19 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 4:09 pm

AC was a financial mess in the past. Despite what the anti-Colin people say at least the pension plan has been rehabilitated along with shareholder value. How would those same people feel if the plan had gone bust?
 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 4:28 pm

flyyul wrote:
Blerg wrote:
So what exactly has he done for the airline? I am genuinely interested in finding out. I see in their 2019 financial report that their income and profits grew, debt was considerably reduced but from what I heard the overall flying experience with them is not that great. From a passenger's perspective at least.


Let me see

Best airline in North America by SkyTraxx for 5 years
Best Business class in North America

Have you flown AC or are you relying on the peanut gallery?


He’s relying on tbe peanut gallery by the sounds of it
 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 4:33 pm

Skywatcher wrote:
AC was a financial mess in the past. Despite what the anti-Colin people say at least the pension plan has been rehabilitated along with shareholder value. How would those same people feel if the plan had gone bust?


Finances completely turned around, it’s unfortunate there are some people out there who are the type that come across as “damned if you do, dammed if you don’t” because it doesn’t align with realistic thinking.
 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 4:37 pm

ElPistolero wrote:
flyyul wrote:
Blerg wrote:
So what exactly has he done for the airline? I am genuinely interested in finding out. I see in their 2019 financial report that their income and profits grew, debt was considerably reduced but from what I heard the overall flying experience with them is not that great. From a passenger's perspective at least.


Let me see

Best airline in North America by SkyTraxx for 5 years
Best Business class in North America

Have you flown AC or are you relying on the peanut gallery?


Blerg’s not wrong. Rovinescu has done great work on the financial and labour fronts, but the cost-cutting, particularly in Y, has been evident over the past decade.

The signature lounges and J product(s) introduced under him are generally very good, but the vast, vast majority of AC pax fly in Y, and the reviews have been uniformly bad.

Take Skytrax. Notwithstanding it’s questionable methodology (“consulting fees”), it’s own website points to poor customer satisfaction (mainline - 4/10; rouge - 3/10). (For context, DL gets 5/10 hence methodology issues.)

https://www.airlinequality.com/airline- ... ir-canada/
https://www.airlinequality.com/airline- ... ada-rouge/

More reputable firms like JD Power tell a similar tale.
On the international front, it puts AC at below average.

- On TPAC, AC is joined in the sub-par “the rest” category by UA, AA and MU.
- On TATL, it is one of two sub-par airlines, the other being a ULCC (DY).

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press- ... tion-study

The North American surveys aren’t better. AC finds itself below average, and in the esteemed company of ULCC’s Frontier and Spirit.

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press- ... tion-study

Which is to say, the record profits go hand-in-hand with cost cutting, and the vast majority of AC pax have experienced it across the board. It prompted the whole air passenger rights thing, and some of the criticism seems to have stung Rovinescu enough pre-COVID to prompt this February 2020 announcement:

“This spring, we will launch a redesigned interna­tional Economy Class meal service. We are intro­ducing hot-towel service, new beverage selections including a sparkling-wine cocktail, a chef-inspired meal choice, healthier green salad, a separate dessert service, and yogurt and fruit for break­fast. “

https://www.aircanada.com/content/airca ... isine.html

He’s taken AC on quite the journey since 2009. Some good; some not so good. Profits have gone up and the J experience has improved, but 2019 AC would struggle to make the Y pax experience any worse.

I think he’s smart to walk away now. Nobody knows what’s coming next; we may well be at an inflection point for air travel. He’s done his bit to leave AC in a financially solid position. The next guy can figure out how to deal with evolving customer expectations and travel patterns.

That said, his immense success as a first-generation immigrant is worthy of respect even from detractors. His self-admitted source of his drive - the immigrant’s fear of losing everything they’ve achieved - resonates with many immigrants. Disagree with him on a lot, but can only admire and learn from the way he fought his corner.


Can you elaborate on what cost cutting measures you think they’ve done in mainline Y over the last decade?
 
NZ321
Posts: 1235
Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:00 pm

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 4:40 pm

flyyul wrote:
Blerg wrote:
So what exactly has he done for the airline? I am genuinely interested in finding out. I see in their 2019 financial report that their income and profits grew, debt was considerably reduced but from what I heard the overall flying experience with them is not that great. From a passenger's perspective at least.


Let me see

Best airline in North America by SkyTraxx for 5 years
Best Business class in North America

Have you flown AC or are you relying on the peanut gallery?


I've flown AC a number of times in the past 10 years, but only two times medium - long haul. As a frequent flyer with up to 50 return journeys a year I can't say I rate them so flash. Last flight I booked was an AC flight number but a Rouge aircraft and the legroom was laughable. Tired 767s. The last two flights I had up the west coast on the A320 were also a joke, and running seriously late with cabin crew who couldn't have cared less. I haven't tried the latest product up front in business which sure looks good - so can't comment on the recent transformation. But since being scared off I tend to book with Cathay or Swiss if I can. I am keen to try them again in the near future.
Plane mad!
 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 4:41 pm

ElPistolero wrote:
flyyul wrote:
Blerg wrote:
So what exactly has he done for the airline? I am genuinely interested in finding out. I see in their 2019 financial report that their income and profits grew, debt was considerably reduced but from what I heard the overall flying experience with them is not that great. From a passenger's perspective at least.


Let me see

Best airline in North America by SkyTraxx for 5 years
Best Business class in North America

Have you flown AC or are you relying on the peanut gallery?


Blerg’s not wrong. Rovinescu has done great work on the financial and labour fronts, but the cost-cutting, particularly in Y, has been evident over the past decade.

The signature lounges and J product(s) introduced under him are generally very good, but the vast, vast majority of AC pax fly in Y, and the reviews have been uniformly bad.

Take Skytrax. Notwithstanding it’s questionable methodology (“consulting fees”), it’s own website points to poor customer satisfaction (mainline - 4/10; rouge - 3/10). (For context, DL gets 5/10 hence methodology issues.)

https://www.airlinequality.com/airline- ... ir-canada/
https://www.airlinequality.com/airline- ... ada-rouge/

More reputable firms like JD Power tell a similar tale.
On the international front, it puts AC at below average.

- On TPAC, AC is joined in the sub-par “the rest” category by UA, AA and MU.
- On TATL, it is one of two sub-par airlines, the other being a ULCC (DY).

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press- ... tion-study

The North American surveys aren’t better. AC finds itself below average, and in the esteemed company of ULCC’s Frontier and Spirit.

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press- ... tion-study

Which is to say, the record profits go hand-in-hand with cost cutting, and the vast majority of AC pax have experienced it across the board. It prompted the whole air passenger rights thing, and some of the criticism seems to have stung Rovinescu enough pre-COVID to prompt this February 2020 announcement:

“This spring, we will launch a redesigned interna­tional Economy Class meal service. We are intro­ducing hot-towel service, new beverage selections including a sparkling-wine cocktail, a chef-inspired meal choice, healthier green salad, a separate dessert service, and yogurt and fruit for break­fast. “

https://www.aircanada.com/content/airca ... isine.html

He’s taken AC on quite the journey since 2009. Some good; some not so good. Profits have gone up and the J experience has improved, but 2019 AC would struggle to make the Y pax experience any worse.

I think he’s smart to walk away now. Nobody knows what’s coming next; we may well be at an inflection point for air travel. He’s done his bit to leave AC in a financially solid position. The next guy can figure out how to deal with evolving customer expectations and travel patterns.

That said, his immense success as a first-generation immigrant is worthy of respect even from detractors. His self-admitted source of his drive - the immigrant’s fear of losing everything they’ve achieved - resonates with many immigrants. Disagree with him on a lot, but can only admire and learn from the way he fought his corner.


And those surveys are not based off a large sample pool , it’s based off of 6,287 people taking the survey.... AC carried 51.5 million passengers in 2019. It seems like some people will bash AC just because..........
 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 4:50 pm

NZ321 wrote:
flyyul wrote:
Blerg wrote:
So what exactly has he done for the airline? I am genuinely interested in finding out. I see in their 2019 financial report that their income and profits grew, debt was considerably reduced but from what I heard the overall flying experience with them is not that great. From a passenger's perspective at least.


Let me see

Best airline in North America by SkyTraxx for 5 years
Best Business class in North America

Have you flown AC or are you relying on the peanut gallery?


I've flown AC a number of times in the past 10 years, but only two times medium - long haul. As a frequent flyer with up to 50 return journeys a year I can't say I rate them so flash. Last flight I booked was an AC flight number but a Rouge aircraft and the legroom was laughable. Tired 767s. The last two flights I had up the west coast on the A320 were also a joke, and running seriously late with cabin crew who couldn't have cared less. I haven't tried the latest product up front in business which sure looks good - so can't comment on the recent transformation. But since being scared off I tend to book with Cathay or Swiss if I can. I am keen to try them again in the near future.


Why were those 320 flights a joke? they are def a tired, old a/c and outdated interior wise but they work for AC.
 
ElPistolero
Posts: 2117
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 12:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 4:56 pm

777luver wrote:
ElPistolero wrote:
flyyul wrote:

Let me see

Best airline in North America by SkyTraxx for 5 years
Best Business class in North America

Have you flown AC or are you relying on the peanut gallery?


Blerg’s not wrong. Rovinescu has done great work on the financial and labour fronts, but the cost-cutting, particularly in Y, has been evident over the past decade.

The signature lounges and J product(s) introduced under him are generally very good, but the vast, vast majority of AC pax fly in Y, and the reviews have been uniformly bad.

Take Skytrax. Notwithstanding it’s questionable methodology (“consulting fees”), it’s own website points to poor customer satisfaction (mainline - 4/10; rouge - 3/10). (For context, DL gets 5/10 hence methodology issues.)

https://www.airlinequality.com/airline- ... ir-canada/
https://www.airlinequality.com/airline- ... ada-rouge/

More reputable firms like JD Power tell a similar tale.
On the international front, it puts AC at below average.

- On TPAC, AC is joined in the sub-par “the rest” category by UA, AA and MU.
- On TATL, it is one of two sub-par airlines, the other being a ULCC (DY).

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press- ... tion-study

The North American surveys aren’t better. AC finds itself below average, and in the esteemed company of ULCC’s Frontier and Spirit.

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press- ... tion-study

Which is to say, the record profits go hand-in-hand with cost cutting, and the vast majority of AC pax have experienced it across the board. It prompted the whole air passenger rights thing, and some of the criticism seems to have stung Rovinescu enough pre-COVID to prompt this February 2020 announcement:

“This spring, we will launch a redesigned interna­tional Economy Class meal service. We are intro­ducing hot-towel service, new beverage selections including a sparkling-wine cocktail, a chef-inspired meal choice, healthier green salad, a separate dessert service, and yogurt and fruit for break­fast. “

https://www.aircanada.com/content/airca ... isine.html

He’s taken AC on quite the journey since 2009. Some good; some not so good. Profits have gone up and the J experience has improved, but 2019 AC would struggle to make the Y pax experience any worse.

I think he’s smart to walk away now. Nobody knows what’s coming next; we may well be at an inflection point for air travel. He’s done his bit to leave AC in a financially solid position. The next guy can figure out how to deal with evolving customer expectations and travel patterns.

That said, his immense success as a first-generation immigrant is worthy of respect even from detractors. His self-admitted source of his drive - the immigrant’s fear of losing everything they’ve achieved - resonates with many immigrants. Disagree with him on a lot, but can only admire and learn from the way he fought his corner.


And those surveys are not based off a large sample pool , it’s based off of 6,287 people taking the survey.... AC carried 51.5 million passengers in 2019. It seems like some people will bash AC just because..........


A fair point, but it was only brought up in the context of the Skytrax awards, which are about as dodgy as they come on methodology (to wit, how does one square a 3-star DL scoring higher on surveys than 4-star AC)?

I don’t really put stock in these rankings and awards, but if AC employees are going to pump the Skytrax nonsense over the PA system (and in forums), it’s fair game. At least JD Power is transparent about its methodology. And has a stronger reputation on brand surveys.

The 51.5 million is a non-sequitir. Millions fly Frontier and Spirit too. They still rank it the way they do. Sometimes you put up with sub-par stuff because other things need to get done. But anyway, I’ll respond to your other questions separately.
 
777luver
Posts: 171
Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 5:11 pm

ElPistolero wrote:
777luver wrote:
ElPistolero wrote:

Blerg’s not wrong. Rovinescu has done great work on the financial and labour fronts, but the cost-cutting, particularly in Y, has been evident over the past decade.

The signature lounges and J product(s) introduced under him are generally very good, but the vast, vast majority of AC pax fly in Y, and the reviews have been uniformly bad.

Take Skytrax. Notwithstanding it’s questionable methodology (“consulting fees”), it’s own website points to poor customer satisfaction (mainline - 4/10; rouge - 3/10). (For context, DL gets 5/10 hence methodology issues.)

https://www.airlinequality.com/airline- ... ir-canada/
https://www.airlinequality.com/airline- ... ada-rouge/

More reputable firms like JD Power tell a similar tale.
On the international front, it puts AC at below average.

- On TPAC, AC is joined in the sub-par “the rest” category by UA, AA and MU.
- On TATL, it is one of two sub-par airlines, the other being a ULCC (DY).

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press- ... tion-study

The North American surveys aren’t better. AC finds itself below average, and in the esteemed company of ULCC’s Frontier and Spirit.

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press- ... tion-study

Which is to say, the record profits go hand-in-hand with cost cutting, and the vast majority of AC pax have experienced it across the board. It prompted the whole air passenger rights thing, and some of the criticism seems to have stung Rovinescu enough pre-COVID to prompt this February 2020 announcement:

“This spring, we will launch a redesigned interna­tional Economy Class meal service. We are intro­ducing hot-towel service, new beverage selections including a sparkling-wine cocktail, a chef-inspired meal choice, healthier green salad, a separate dessert service, and yogurt and fruit for break­fast. “

https://www.aircanada.com/content/airca ... isine.html

He’s taken AC on quite the journey since 2009. Some good; some not so good. Profits have gone up and the J experience has improved, but 2019 AC would struggle to make the Y pax experience any worse.

I think he’s smart to walk away now. Nobody knows what’s coming next; we may well be at an inflection point for air travel. He’s done his bit to leave AC in a financially solid position. The next guy can figure out how to deal with evolving customer expectations and travel patterns.

That said, his immense success as a first-generation immigrant is worthy of respect even from detractors. His self-admitted source of his drive - the immigrant’s fear of losing everything they’ve achieved - resonates with many immigrants. Disagree with him on a lot, but can only admire and learn from the way he fought his corner.


And those surveys are not based off a large sample pool , it’s based off of 6,287 people taking the survey.... AC carried 51.5 million passengers in 2019. It seems like some people will bash AC just because..........


A fair point, but it was only brought up in the context of the Skytrax awards, which are about as dodgy as they come on methodology (to wit, how does one square a 3-star DL scoring higher on surveys than 4-star AC)?

I don’t really put stock in these rankings and awards, but if AC employees are going to pump the Skytrax nonsense over the PA system (and in forums), it’s fair game. At least JD Power is transparent about its methodology. And has a stronger reputation on brand surveys.

The 51.5 million is a non-sequitir. Millions fly Frontier and Spirit too. They still rank it the way they do. Sometimes you put up with sub-par stuff because other things need to get done. But anyway, I’ll respond to your other questions separately.


I will agree with Skytrax not being transparent, and airlines paying to give their best for receiving the ranking doesn’t give much merit to everyday passenger experience.

Not disagreeing that the number of passengers carried isn’t a very good indicator of whether an airline is 3/4 stars. I just think a 6.287 sample group is extremely poor. Airlines are subjective, poeple have good and bad experiences and that leaves a impression on them.
 
hoons90
Posts: 3691
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2001 10:15 pm

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 5:12 pm

777luver wrote:
ElPistolero wrote:
flyyul wrote:


Can you elaborate on what cost cutting measures you think they’ve done in mainline Y over the last decade?


I fly across the Pacific pretty much every year and both DL and AA have better meals in Y (in terms of both quality and quantity) than AC.

Trivial, but for the sake of comparison, AC doesn't even include gochujang sauce with their bibimbap.

Having said that, I still don't think AC's product is that bad.
Flown: 2L 7C 9E 9L AA AB AC AF AY AZ BA BR BX B6 CA CO CP CX DL EK EY JL KE KL LA LH LX MQ NW OZ PD RW SQ TG TP TR TS US WG WN WS XE XJ
 
ElPistolero
Posts: 2117
Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 12:44 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 5:22 pm

777luver wrote:
ElPistolero wrote:
flyyul wrote:

Let me see

Best airline in North America by SkyTraxx for 5 years
Best Business class in North America

Have you flown AC or are you relying on the peanut gallery?


Blerg’s not wrong. Rovinescu has done great work on the financial and labour fronts, but the cost-cutting, particularly in Y, has been evident over the past decade.

The signature lounges and J product(s) introduced under him are generally very good, but the vast, vast majority of AC pax fly in Y, and the reviews have been uniformly bad.

Take Skytrax. Notwithstanding it’s questionable methodology (“consulting fees”), it’s own website points to poor customer satisfaction (mainline - 4/10; rouge - 3/10). (For context, DL gets 5/10 hence methodology issues.)

https://www.airlinequality.com/airline- ... ir-canada/
https://www.airlinequality.com/airline- ... ada-rouge/

More reputable firms like JD Power tell a similar tale.
On the international front, it puts AC at below average.

- On TPAC, AC is joined in the sub-par “the rest” category by UA, AA and MU.
- On TATL, it is one of two sub-par airlines, the other being a ULCC (DY).

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press- ... tion-study

The North American surveys aren’t better. AC finds itself below average, and in the esteemed company of ULCC’s Frontier and Spirit.

https://www.jdpower.com/business/press- ... tion-study

Which is to say, the record profits go hand-in-hand with cost cutting, and the vast majority of AC pax have experienced it across the board. It prompted the whole air passenger rights thing, and some of the criticism seems to have stung Rovinescu enough pre-COVID to prompt this February 2020 announcement:

“This spring, we will launch a redesigned interna­tional Economy Class meal service. We are intro­ducing hot-towel service, new beverage selections including a sparkling-wine cocktail, a chef-inspired meal choice, healthier green salad, a separate dessert service, and yogurt and fruit for break­fast. “

https://www.aircanada.com/content/airca ... isine.html

He’s taken AC on quite the journey since 2009. Some good; some not so good. Profits have gone up and the J experience has improved, but 2019 AC would struggle to make the Y pax experience any worse.

I think he’s smart to walk away now. Nobody knows what’s coming next; we may well be at an inflection point for air travel. He’s done his bit to leave AC in a financially solid position. The next guy can figure out how to deal with evolving customer expectations and travel patterns.

That said, his immense success as a first-generation immigrant is worthy of respect even from detractors. His self-admitted source of his drive - the immigrant’s fear of losing everything they’ve achieved - resonates with many immigrants. Disagree with him on a lot, but can only admire and learn from the way he fought his corner.


Can you elaborate on what cost cutting measures you think they’ve done in mainline Y over the last decade?


Gladly:

- The banana / spiced bread-like ...thing for breakfast. Dates back to at least 2012. I recall a time when AC offered more than that for “continental breakfast”
- Crunching Y economy to make room for extra legroom seats on the domestic birds
- 30” pitch on 787s that do 14 hour flights, with correspondingly less recline than all of the airlines ranked above it. I think the 777s are also in that club now. (I’ll gloss over the 3-4-3 thing because that’s all the rage everywhere; the 30 inch/minimal recline is not).
- General Y catering for the past decade - about the most miserly in the world (don’t believe me - look at images of LH or AF Y meals)
- no Y blankets on offer on Transcontinental Y+ (that would be premium economy on the WBs) red eyes. I include it because AC treats it as part of the Y cabin (can’t even be bothered to close the curtain. And those Monty wraps as a second meal on TATL)
- Cleanliness (I can send you a link by private message - it links or a frequent flyer site you’re probably familiar with, where travellers have posted pictures).
- OTP - one of the worst in the world thanks to the cost-driven emphasis on aircraft utilization and the corresponding refusal to use adequate block times (https://ca.finance.yahoo.com/news/west- ... 54688.html).

Those just came to mind straight off the bat from my Y/Y+ experiences. I can probably think up some more, but what would be the point? These are all the less attractive part of Rovinescu’s legacy.

Note that I’ve taken your cue and avoided including AC Rouge, with its stellar reputation. It’s part of the AC Y experience - not sure why we should pretend otherwise. Was Rovinescu not involved in that?
 
andrew1996
Posts: 82
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2020 6:41 pm

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 6:29 pm

Was this planned retirement or did COVID-19 speed up his retirement?

I think the last 10 years AC was ahead of its peers in North America but UA/DL/AA have caught up. They now all are installing direct aisle J seats, they all have Premium Economy now and frankly I think UA's Y is better than AC's now too even though the marketing may still give AC Y as superior.
 
ramprat320
Posts: 21
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2015 8:17 pm

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 6:40 pm

The man is 65 ....sure he could’ve kept working...but why? He has nothing left to prove. He forgoes 1.4million in salary in 2020 Due to COVID. Why not retire and collect the $800,000 pension.
 
Skywatcher
Posts: 897
Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2002 11:19 am

Re: Air Canada’s CEO Calin Rovinescu to Retire Feb 2021

Sun Oct 18, 2020 6:52 pm

I'm sure Colin will continue to be active in other ways. High performers like him don't just suddenly go fishing every day. I'm always amazed at how many people routinely cut CEO's and other senior executives down. They work non-stop at a very high stress level. Most mere mortals couldn't hack it for a day. Sure they're overpaid but their work ethics are hyper-drive like.

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