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freakyrat
Posts: 1963
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Sun May 10, 2020 10:36 pm

Delta Connection Carrier Skywest has about a dozen or more CRJ7's and CRJ9 aircraft parked on their maintenance ramp and adjacent ramp at SBN (Covid19 Storage)
 
FlyGuyNash
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Mon May 11, 2020 2:33 am

freakyrat wrote:
Delta Connection Carrier Skywest has about a dozen or more CRJ7's and CRJ9 aircraft parked on their maintenance ramp and adjacent ramp at SBN (Covid19 Storage)


Yea, I was just going through the May/June schedule internally and it shows no CRJ9 flying at all for Skywest, only 1 CR7 is scheduled so it can do ASE while it looks like Endeavor took about 30 CRJ9s out of storage to cover that Skywest CRJ9 flying.

While officially not announced by Delta, in Skywest Q1 filing 55 of Delta CRJ2s are scheduled to be up for renewal this year and they don't expect Delta to renew and are planning to return 19 of those planes back to Delta and park the rest they own.
 
freakyrat
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Mon May 11, 2020 12:50 pm

FlyGuyNash wrote:
freakyrat wrote:
Delta Connection Carrier Skywest has about a dozen or more CRJ7's and CRJ9 aircraft parked on their maintenance ramp and adjacent ramp at SBN (Covid19 Storage)


Yea, I was just going through the May/June schedule internally and it shows no CRJ9 flying at all for Skywest, only 1 CR7 is scheduled so it can do ASE while it looks like Endeavor took about 30 CRJ9s out of storage to cover that Skywest CRJ9 flying.

While officially not announced by Delta, in Skywest Q1 filing 55 of Delta CRJ2s are scheduled to be up for renewal this year and they don't expect Delta to renew and are planning to return 19 of those planes back to Delta and park the rest they own.


Skywest can do maintenance at SBN on all models of their CRJ's. Presently it looks like they also have a bunch of CRJ9's parked on the west terminal ramp at SBN and on an adjacent taxiway for a total of 24 aircraft parked which is half of their Delta Connection CRJ 7 and 9 fleet. Rumor has it that Delta was only going to operate the DTW flights out of SBN with CRJ2's and that ATL and MSP will all go to CRJ7 and CRJ9 aircraft. This was for future flying. My guess is that the Covid19 thing accelerated those plans. I aso believe that when this is over Delta is going to give all the ATL flying out of SBN to Endeavor.
 
bugsbegone
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Mon May 11, 2020 12:58 pm

FlyGuyNash wrote:

Yea, I was just going through the May/June schedule internally and it shows no CRJ9 flying at all for Skywest, only 1 CR7 is scheduled so it can do ASE while it looks like Endeavor took about 30 CRJ9s out of storage to cover that Skywest CRJ9 flying.

While officially not announced by Delta, in Skywest Q1 filing 55 of Delta CRJ2s are scheduled to be up for renewal this year and they don't expect Delta to renew and are planning to return 19 of those planes back to Delta and park the rest they own.


After this Covid thing has passed, I wonder if Delta is planning on transferring those 19 planes to Endeavor?
 
freakyrat
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Mon May 11, 2020 1:20 pm

bugsbegone wrote:
FlyGuyNash wrote:

Yea, I was just going through the May/June schedule internally and it shows no CRJ9 flying at all for Skywest, only 1 CR7 is scheduled so it can do ASE while it looks like Endeavor took about 30 CRJ9s out of storage to cover that Skywest CRJ9 flying.

While officially not announced by Delta, in Skywest Q1 filing 55 of Delta CRJ2s are scheduled to be up for renewal this year and they don't expect Delta to renew and are planning to return 19 of those planes back to Delta and park the rest they own.


After this Covid thing has passed, I wonder if Delta is planning on transferring those 19 planes to Endeavor?


I can see that and base them at DTW. Prior to this Covid thing Delta never had enough seats for the SBN-ATL flights for paying passengers and non-revs but the convenience of Skywest having maintenance for CRJ2's at SBN meant they could fly planes in for overnight maintenance and then put these planes back in circulation in the morning. However now they can service any model of the CRJ's at SBN. So when this Covid thing is over and flying returns to near normal Delta may accelerate their initial plans to phase out the CRJ2's at SBN except for the DTW flights.
 
Web
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Mon May 11, 2020 1:30 pm

bugsbegone wrote:
FlyGuyNash wrote:

Yea, I was just going through the May/June schedule internally and it shows no CRJ9 flying at all for Skywest, only 1 CR7 is scheduled so it can do ASE while it looks like Endeavor took about 30 CRJ9s out of storage to cover that Skywest CRJ9 flying.

While officially not announced by Delta, in Skywest Q1 filing 55 of Delta CRJ2s are scheduled to be up for renewal this year and they don't expect Delta to renew and are planning to return 19 of those planes back to Delta and park the rest they own.


After this Covid thing has passed, I wonder if Delta is planning on transferring those 19 planes to Endeavor?


9E guy here. Before COVID, management was openly talking about transferring ~20 CR2s from OO, starting roughly in Q4 of 2020. Who knows what the plan is now.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Mon May 11, 2020 2:03 pm

I mentioned in the other OAG thread, that for June, the OO/Skywest at-risk markets out of DTW that are not EAS are now being flown with Endeavor/9E CR2s.
Markets like ERI, SCE, AVP etc that has been Skywest are going to Endeavor.

I am guesing that during the downturn, its advantageous for DL to have Endeavor as a wholy-owned do more flying than to use Skywest for capacity purchase.
Not fully versed in the financial matters, but Endeavor flying is more of a soft-dollar cost (internal company) versus Skywest which is hard-dollars (external company)
 
IPFreely
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Tue May 12, 2020 1:30 am

slcdeltarumd11 wrote:
But all airlines can't say MHT is in the Boston area and not fly to it at all.


Why not? Is there a law that says an airline has to serve MHT even if no passengers use the service?
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Tue May 12, 2020 1:40 am

Michigan government officials against DL request to suspend service to AZO, LAN, FNT
https://www.detroitnews.com/story/busin ... 111277001/

Not surprising. DL should've known better than to request LAN, the state capital.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Tue May 12, 2020 2:03 am

IPFreely wrote:
slcdeltarumd11 wrote:
But all airlines can't say MHT is in the Boston area and not fly to it at all.


Why not? Is there a law that says an airline has to serve MHT even if no passengers use the service?


It doesn't matter if passengers use MHT or not. The DOT Show Cause order that implemented CARES Act Payroll Support grants defined MHT (and PVD) into the BOS area. It's in the docket. Serving BOS meets the must-serve requirements.

https://beta.regulations.gov/docket/DOT-OST-2020-0037
 
FlyGuyNash
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Tue May 12, 2020 8:47 pm

12/19 of the Delta owned CRJ2s have been parked in IGM. Historically this is the long term storage for CRJs but Delta has been known to take them out as well multiple times, I honestly would not expect any of these planes to come out of storage anytime soon. I don't think Delta will be spending the money to conform these for Endeavor.

I think the new plan may be to have Endeavor stay east and Skywest stay west and that's it. I could see no more Skywest flying in DTW/ATL and 9E/OO sharing MSP flying. Question I have is what happens with Republic, while it doesn't matter right now Delta lost 35 large RJs due to the pilot contract and I wonder if Delta will keep Republic around or if they will just give Endeavor the old Compass, Delta owned ERJs and reduce the DC fleet by not using Republic anymore.
 
NLINK
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Tue May 12, 2020 9:56 pm

Republic owns slots Delta needs at LGA. Delta tried to get them back when Republic was in bankruptcy but failed.
 
TYWoolman
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Tue May 12, 2020 10:21 pm

I can understand Michigan's stance. But is Michigan in a position to subsidize any routes abandoned? They cannot be expected to. Michigan's argument is effective if the bailout is a sure-fire way to guarantee demand returns. There are no crystal balls. Delta has to do what it has to do for its survival. I doubt Northwest would have abandoned them, which may be the reason for Michigan resentment on the Delta move here IMO.
 
AZORMP
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Tue May 12, 2020 10:56 pm

TYWoolman wrote:
I can understand Michigan's stance. But is Michigan in a position to subsidize any routes abandoned? They cannot be expected to. Michigan's argument is effective if the bailout is a sure-fire way to guarantee demand returns. There are no crystal balls. Delta has to do what it has to do for its survival. I doubt Northwest would have abandoned them, which may be the reason for Michigan resentment on the Delta move here IMO.



A lot of the stations listed in DL’s DOT filing are contract; specifically, they’re all DGS, with the exception of MDW.

I know that a lot of the DGS agents on the chopping block in MI are concerned about what’s going to happen with their pay, since there hasn’t been any real clear answers on whether or not they’ll get PPP.

At the same time, you’ve got to wonder if some of these drops in demand are self-inflicted. Look at AZO’s one daily departure. It leaves at 1810. Historically that last daily departure is used by folks traveling out west at the end of the day or for folks departing for Europe. LAN isn’t much better, with their flight leaving at 1615.

There are painfully few domestic connections out of DTW these days (at least in the mid-evening), meaning that flying from AZO or LAN to connect in DTW is basically worthless.
 
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NWAESC
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Tue May 12, 2020 11:13 pm

AZORMP wrote:
A lot of the stations listed in DL’s DOT filing are contract; specifically, they’re all DGS, with the exception of MDW.


From the 10 suspended stations, MDW has mainline ramp and AW, OAK and PVD have mainline agents above wing.

From the earlier petition, FNT has mainline ramp and AW and MLB has mainline AW.

Your point about a lack of connectivity is dead on.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
MohawkWeekend
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Tue May 12, 2020 11:24 pm

I'm not sure why Delta's Govt Affairs people aren't arguing to Senior Management that dropping a State Capital is a political error. How many representatives does Michigan have in Congress (those Michigan Congressmen and Senators who just subsidized Delta) ? How much could 2 20 minute flights on a CRJ2 cost?

It might just make round two of subsidies a little more difficult.
    300 319 320 321 707 717 720 727 72S 737 73S 734 735 73G 738 739 747 757 762 ARJ B11 C212 CRJ CR2 CR7 CR9 CV5 D8S DC9 D9S D94 D95 D10 DH8 DTO EMB EM2 E135 E145 E190 FH7 F28 F100 FTRIMTR HRN L10 L15 M80 M90 SF3 SWM YS11
     
    ethernal
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    Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

    Wed May 13, 2020 12:39 am

    MohawkWeekend wrote:
    I'm not sure why Delta's Govt Affairs people aren't arguing to Senior Management that dropping a State Capital is a political error. How many representatives does Michigan have in Congress (those Michigan Congressmen and Senators who just subsidized Delta) ? How much could 2 20 minute flights on a CRJ2 cost?

    It might just make round two of subsidies a little more difficult.


    Agree but on the flip side it's just a dumb route. MSP-LAN at least makes some sense, but LAN-DTW is something like the fourth shortest Domestic US route. The only reason it may save any time at all is because it's basically a low volume terminal that is fast to get into and may help avoid traffic. The block time is 40 minutes and MCT is 30 minutes which means that from the time you step on the plane to when you get to your earliest flight from DTW is 1 hour 10 minutes. It's about a 1h15m drive without traffic (worst case 1h40m with traffic). So - on the best day - you may save 30-40 minutes over just driving to DTW. With the added headache of having a connection. And flying on a CR2.

    Most of the value derived from it is probably making it easier for state reps to get status since it counts as an extra leg and 500 MQM.
     
    AZORMP
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    Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

    Wed May 13, 2020 12:56 am

    NWAESC wrote:
    AZORMP wrote:
    A lot of the stations listed in DL’s DOT filing are contract; specifically, they’re all DGS, with the exception of MDW.


    From the 10 suspended stations, MDW has mainline ramp and AW, OAK and PVD have mainline agents above wing.

    From the earlier petition, FNT has mainline ramp and AW and MLB has mainline AW.

    Your point about a lack of connectivity is dead on.


    Yes, my mistake. I got the nine in the DOT filing and the ten listed last Friday messed up.
     
    AZORMP
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    Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

    Wed May 13, 2020 1:03 am

    MohawkWeekend wrote:
    I'm not sure why Delta's Govt Affairs people aren't arguing to Senior Management that dropping a State Capital is a political error. How many representatives does Michigan have in Congress (those Michigan Congressmen and Senators who just subsidized Delta) ? How much could 2 20 minute flights on a CRJ2 cost?

    It might just make round two of subsidies a little more difficult.


    The same could be said for AZO, from a business standpoint. Most of the pax who fly out of AZO on Delta are business travelers from Stryker, Pfizer, and Kellogg, to name a few. I know Denso flies folks in from Japan that are considered VIPs. I think Western Michigan sends some of their folks out on Delta too.

    Granted, business travel is basically dead right now. But when it eventually comes back (I imagine it will before leisure travel does), I highly doubt that those folks are going to be happy having to drive to GRR or SBN or even directly to DTW. They fly AZO because it’s convenient and, before the pandemic, there were a lot of options for DL. Heck, I even heard that Kellogg was trying to push for the AZO-ATL flight back.
     
    MohawkWeekend
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    Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

    Wed May 13, 2020 1:47 am

    Politicians remember things - thats why companies spend money to cultivate those relationships. Pretty hard to argue your backs against the wall when you've just taken a bailout and the rest of Michigan (including the Big 3 ) are in a world of hurt and hasn't gotten the same terms that the airlines did.
      300 319 320 321 707 717 720 727 72S 737 73S 734 735 73G 738 739 747 757 762 ARJ B11 C212 CRJ CR2 CR7 CR9 CV5 D8S DC9 D9S D94 D95 D10 DH8 DTO EMB EM2 E135 E145 E190 FH7 F28 F100 FTRIMTR HRN L10 L15 M80 M90 SF3 SWM YS11
       
      TW870
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Wed May 13, 2020 2:50 am

      I think the pilot displacement bid, which will be out sometime soon, will be the first clear indication of what management thinks the market is going to look like next summer. All these summer 2020 cuts are essentially meaningless, as we are only at 6 or 7% of last May's market, and all they are doing is trying to make a basic network out of empty flights. They are not going to retrain pilots for this tiny of a business, because they would have just too much cascading training as they would need to be continually calling people back. My guess is you will see them scale the pilot bid for the operation they think they will have next summer. Furloughs would begin 10/1, and average line values will be minimum contractual for everyone else, with many others not furloughed basically never flying until the operation gradually picks up - most of which will be in 2021. But if you take the total number of pilots they don't furlough, you will get a sense about what they will be ready to fly next summer.
       
      freakyrat
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Wed May 13, 2020 5:24 pm

      AZORMP wrote:
      MohawkWeekend wrote:
      I'm not sure why Delta's Govt Affairs people aren't arguing to Senior Management that dropping a State Capital is a political error. How many representatives does Michigan have in Congress (those Michigan Congressmen and Senators who just subsidized Delta) ? How much could 2 20 minute flights on a CRJ2 cost?

      It might just make round two of subsidies a little more difficult.


      The same could be said for AZO, from a business standpoint. Most of the pax who fly out of AZO on Delta are business travelers from Stryker, Pfizer, and Kellogg, to name a few. I know Denso flies folks in from Japan that are considered VIPs. I think Western Michigan sends some of their folks out on Delta too.

      Granted, business travel is basically dead right now. But when it eventually comes back (I imagine it will before leisure travel does), I highly doubt that those folks are going to be happy having to drive to GRR or SBN or even directly to DTW. They fly AZO because it’s convenient and, before the pandemic, there were a lot of options for DL. Heck, I even heard that Kellogg was trying to push for the AZO-ATL flight back.


      The only flights at SBN that seemed to be continuing through this is both of the AA flights to DFW which offer employees of Zimmer Biomed, a Warsaw, IN company, connections to AUS. All DL SBN-ATL service is suspended for the forseeable future as is MSP. DL only has 1 SBN-DTW flight operating at the present. Funny DL use to be the big carrier until this pandemic hit now AA is numero uno at SBN.
       
      AZORMP
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Wed May 13, 2020 5:39 pm

      freakyrat wrote:
      AZORMP wrote:
      MohawkWeekend wrote:
      I'm not sure why Delta's Govt Affairs people aren't arguing to Senior Management that dropping a State Capital is a political error. How many representatives does Michigan have in Congress (those Michigan Congressmen and Senators who just subsidized Delta) ? How much could 2 20 minute flights on a CRJ2 cost?

      It might just make round two of subsidies a little more difficult.


      The same could be said for AZO, from a business standpoint. Most of the pax who fly out of AZO on Delta are business travelers from Stryker, Pfizer, and Kellogg, to name a few. I know Denso flies folks in from Japan that are considered VIPs. I think Western Michigan sends some of their folks out on Delta too.

      Granted, business travel is basically dead right now. But when it eventually comes back (I imagine it will before leisure travel does), I highly doubt that those folks are going to be happy having to drive to GRR or SBN or even directly to DTW. They fly AZO because it’s convenient and, before the pandemic, there were a lot of options for DL. Heck, I even heard that Kellogg was trying to push for the AZO-ATL flight back.


      The only flights at SBN that seemed to be continuing through this is both of the AA flights to DFW which offer employees of Zimmer Biomed, a Warsaw, IN company, connections to AUS. All DL SBN-ATL service is suspended for the forseeable future as is MSP. DL only has 1 SBN-DTW flight operating at the present. Funny DL use to be the big carrier until this pandemic hit now AA is numero uno at SBN.


      It’s the same at AZO, almost. DL had the top spot with 6 daily departures (it was about to go up to 7 for the summer) and now everyone is more or less down to one a day, with random cancellations scattered about.

      I’m hoping that eventually we’ll see the retirement of the CRJ2 from the DL fleet. I know AA retired or is going to retire 19 of them; granted, I’m fairly certain the 145 is the mainstay of their 50 seat fleet.
       
      freakyrat
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Wed May 13, 2020 6:12 pm

      AZORMP wrote:
      freakyrat wrote:
      AZORMP wrote:



      It’s the same at AZO, almost. DL had the top spot with 6 daily departures (it was about to go up to 7 for the summer) and now everyone is more or less down to one a day, with random cancellations scattered about.

      I’m hoping that eventually we’ll see the retirement of the CRJ2 from the DL fleet. I know AA retired or is going to retire 19 of them; granted, I’m fairly certain the 145 is the mainstay of their 50 seat fleet.


      After things return to normal or near that DL will be phasing out the OO CRJ2's 19 of OO's are being returned to DL. SBN-ATL flights when traffic returns will go to all CRJ9's. MSP who knows what aircraft but DTW will stay all CRJ2's.
       
      AZORMP
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Wed May 13, 2020 9:41 pm

      freakyrat wrote:
      AZORMP wrote:
      freakyrat wrote:


      After things return to normal or near that DL will be phasing out the OO CRJ2's 19 of OO's are being returned to DL. SBN-ATL flights when traffic returns will go to all CRJ9's. MSP who knows what aircraft but DTW will stay all CRJ2's.


      Are you talking SBN-specific for the DTW flights?

      I know AZO was supposed to get regular CRJ9 service this summer; I can’t remember what flight specifically, but it was either the 0800 that was returning as the 7th daily departure or the 1400 turn, or both. I know it wasn’t the 0530 departure, because that was downgauged from an RJ7 to an RJ2 a while ago, before the schedule was blown to he77.
       
      freakyrat
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 12:20 am

      AZORMP wrote:
      freakyrat wrote:
      AZORMP wrote:


      After things return to normal or near that DL will be phasing out the OO CRJ2's 19 of OO's are being returned to DL. SBN-ATL flights when traffic returns will go to all CRJ9's. MSP who knows what aircraft but DTW will stay all CRJ2's.


      Are you talking SBN-specific for the DTW flights?

      I know AZO was supposed to get regular CRJ9 service this summer; I can’t remember what flight specifically, but it was either the 0800 that was returning as the 7th daily departure or the 1400 turn, or both. I know it wasn’t the 0530 departure, because that was downgauged from an RJ7 to an RJ2 a while ago, before the schedule was blown to he77.


      SBN specific for DTW flights. This was a plan long ago to upgrade ATL flights. I think it will just be delayed a bit by this virus thing. The reason for not upgrading DTW was the flown distance.
       
      PSU.DTW.SCE
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 3:15 am

      Moot point really talking about anything significant about AZO or SBN at this point. They'll each be getting 1 daily flight on DL at best for the next month or two.
      AZO at risk of being temporarily dropped based on the DOT allowing a select number of markets to be suspended per carrier. Its going to be awhile before service to more than one hub returns, maybe well into 2021 at this point.

      The airline/industry we knew 3 months ago is dead.
       
      PSU.DTW.SCE
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 3:18 am

      Rumors per APC about giving Boeing a "heads-up" about an announcement coming by next week.

      Could be related to any of the following:
      1) Lease terminations / parking of the 717 fleet
      2) Parking of the 777 fleet
      3) Retirement of significant amount of 757/763 aircraft
       
      FlyGuyNash
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 3:55 am

      PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
      Rumors per APC about giving Boeing a "heads-up" about an announcement coming by next week.

      Could be related to any of the following:
      1) Lease terminations / parking of the 717 fleet
      2) Parking of the 777 fleet
      3) Retirement of significant amount of 757/763 aircraft


      Per the video Ed had said he was on the phone with Boeing CEO giving him a heads up of an announcement within the next couple days. I would expect the announcement by Friday.

      Curious as to what Boeing would need a heads up on, the only logical thing I can think of is returning the 717s. I don't understand why Ed would call Boeing to tell them they are planning to park 18 777 or any portion of the 75/76 fleet since that would not surprise many people anyway.
       
      FlyGuyNash
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 4:07 am

      My personal theory is Delta will announce they are returning the leased 717s back to Boeing but since the airlines just got the grant money and public perception will look bad, they will not want to immediately release a statement about newly ordered aircraft. So Delta at a later date would announce the order for 100 MAXs or what could be the big blow to Boeing is Delta just not renewing the leases and as 717s come off leases Delta has a new order in for 100 more 220s that will eventually replace the 717s. I don't know is when those 717s leases are up and there was the rumor they extended them to 2030 but not sure if that ever officially happened or not.
       
      deltaguy767
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 12:49 pm

      FlyGuyNash wrote:
      PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
      Rumors per APC about giving Boeing a "heads-up" about an announcement coming by next week.

      Could be related to any of the following:
      1) Lease terminations / parking of the 717 fleet
      2) Parking of the 777 fleet
      3) Retirement of significant amount of 757/763 aircraft


      Per the video Ed had said he was on the phone with Boeing CEO giving him a heads up of an announcement within the next couple days. I would expect the announcement by Friday.

      Curious as to what Boeing would need a heads up on, the only logical thing I can think of is returning the 717s. I don't understand why Ed would call Boeing to tell them they are planning to park 18 777 or any portion of the 75/76 fleet since that would not surprise many people anyway.


      Memo to DL employees released this morning confirming one of those options, the formal press release should be out soon.
      A Good Landing is one you walk away from! Any comments made on this board are my own and do not reflect the opinions or actions of my employer.
       
      VetteDude
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 12:51 pm

      https://twitter.com/DeItaOne/status/1260913674346205184

      Delta retiring 777 fleet by end of 2020.
       
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      NWAESC
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 1:00 pm

      deltaguy767 wrote:

      Memo to DL employees released this morning confirming one of those options, the formal press release should be out soon.


      Soon indeed. That memo hit our inboxes less than 20 minutes ago, and it's already all over social media.
      "Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
       
      Alias1024
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 1:12 pm

      The writing has been on the wall for the 777 at Delta since the LATAM deal was announced. All those extra A350s had to go somewhere.
      It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems with just potatoes.
       
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      Web500sjc
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 1:13 pm

      So the 777 will be parked within 10 months of finishing a Major overhaul of the aircraft. The last LR finished The D1 suite in 02/2020, first 777 finished the D1 suite in 03/2019.


      From a route structure, this obviously puts JNB in an interesting position, especially with South African Airways having trouble.
      Last edited by Web500sjc on Thu May 14, 2020 1:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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      TropicalSky
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 1:13 pm

      Gonna find out just how those 350's perform in the DAL network on LAX-SYD & ATL-JNB.....
       
      DiamondFlyer
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 1:30 pm

      freakyrat wrote:
      AZORMP wrote:
      freakyrat wrote:


      After things return to normal or near that DL will be phasing out the OO CRJ2's 19 of OO's are being returned to DL. SBN-ATL flights when traffic returns will go to all CRJ9's. MSP who knows what aircraft but DTW will stay all CRJ2's.


      Unlikely. SBN will be lucky to have 2 200's to ATL by the end of the year. MSP may not come back, or might be daily on a 200. Before all the craziness happened, there was a plan to move those 19 CR2's from OO to 9E, we will see if that still happens once things start to settle out.
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      acavpics
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 1:40 pm

      TropicalSky wrote:
      Gonna find out just how those 350's perform in the DAL network on LAX-SYD & ATL-JNB.....


      And JFK-BOM.
       
      tphuang
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 1:53 pm

      acavpics wrote:
      TropicalSky wrote:
      Gonna find out just how those 350's perform in the DAL network on LAX-SYD & ATL-JNB.....


      And JFK-BOM.


      I think a lot of these ULH routes will be gone for a while. They were the most challenging routes in terms of profitability before and they will be even more challenging now with demand down. With additional pips on A350, I'd expect them to be able to perform these routes down the road when demand comes back (even if they can't right now).
       
      freakyrat
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 1:54 pm

      DiamondFlyer wrote:
      freakyrat wrote:
      AZORMP wrote:


      After things return to normal or near that DL will be phasing out the OO CRJ2's 19 of OO's are being returned to DL. SBN-ATL flights when traffic returns will go to all CRJ9's. MSP who knows what aircraft but DTW will stay all CRJ2's.


      Unlikely. SBN will be lucky to have 2 200's to ATL by the end of the year. MSP may not come back, or might be daily on a 200. Before all the craziness happened, there was a plan to move those 19 CR2's from OO to 9E, we will see if that still happens once things start to settle out.


      We will see how this all shakes out but before this virus thing the plan was to go to the CRJ9's for the ATL flights. I do believe that regardless of the OO maintenace base at SBN that Delta will bring this flying back in house with 9E. Eventually when flying does return to normal the CRJ9's will come in. MSP will get a daily CRJ200 to connect to west coast flights. It's just going to take awhile before flying gets back to pre pandemic levels.
       
      freakyrat
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 2:29 pm

      DiamondFlyer wrote:
      freakyrat wrote:
      AZORMP wrote:


      After things return to normal or near that DL will be phasing out the OO CRJ2's 19 of OO's are being returned to DL. SBN-ATL flights when traffic returns will go to all CRJ9's. MSP who knows what aircraft but DTW will stay all CRJ2's.


      Unlikely. SBN will be lucky to have 2 200's to ATL by the end of the year. MSP may not come back, or might be daily on a 200. Before all the craziness happened, there was a plan to move those 19 CR2's from OO to 9E, we will see if that still happens once things start to settle out.


      1/2 of OO's Delta Connections CRJ9 fleet is now parked on the ground at SBN. They are parked there because OO has a maintenance base there and can get these back in service when the time comes. The plan was to transfer 19 OO CRJ2's back to DL and eventually to 9E. We will see if that happens. DL had planned to operate some SBN ATL flights with CRJ9's and was already doing some with 9E before this pandemic hit. If the traffic eventually comes back and with OO capable of servicing these jets at their SBN maintenance base DL could operate One morning flight to ATL with a CRJ9 where they have 2 CRJ2's now and the late evening flight with a CRJ9 so that OO could perform ovenight maintenance on the aircraft like they do with the CRJ2's now and their AA CRJ7's now. I agree with you that it will be a slow build back to normal but it will come. The normal ops for Delta is all CRJ2's with 3-4 flights to ATL, 4 to DTW and 1-2 to MSP.
       
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      LAXintl
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 2:40 pm

      Ed Bastian employee letter today.

      Tough times, tough decisions. Sure many more dominos will fall in subsequent months.

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      lightsaber
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 2:49 pm

      Please discuss the pilots in this thread:

      viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1446217
      IM messages to mods on warnings and bans will be ignored and nasty ones will result in a ban.
       
      User avatar
      UPlog
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 2:54 pm

      Can't say we are shocked.

      All the CEOs have clearly signalled they will have smaller airlines headed into winter, so clearly fleets and staffing to support such reduced flying will likewise be smaller.

      While painful decisive action is needed as daily bleed of $50mil (thats $1.5bil monthly!) clearly cant be sustained.
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      mercure1
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 3:22 pm

      I see these US global airlines being less global in years ahead.

      In case of Delta probably rely even more on partners to do the international lifting.
      mercure f-wtcc
       
      PSU.DTW.SCE
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 3:45 pm

      I see the world being a whole lot less global in the next few years ahead.
      At least the US has a robust domestic network that will be needed to pull its weight.
      It is going to be a mess out of this from closed borders, decimated global tourism, health & safety protocol, and decimated economies.

      Some of these international partners are going to be in a bad spot that don't have domestic /short haul networks to fall back upon.
       
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      LAXintl
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Thu May 14, 2020 9:17 pm

      You'll have airlines shrink back to their cores, and stuff they think have a chance of making money, or atleast not bleeding too much.

      We've had lots of excess last few years especially in the international route arena, so there is much fat to cut.
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      jeffrey0032j
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Fri May 15, 2020 1:23 am

      mercure1 wrote:
      I see these US global airlines being less global in years ahead.

      In case of Delta probably rely even more on partners to do the international lifting.

      That is if its partners are still around. The only one I can think of that is on less shaky ground is AFKL, specifically KL and possibly LATAM. As for VS, VA, KE, they are in deeper trouble.
       
      bravoindia
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Fri May 15, 2020 4:42 am

      Does shrinking back to cores hurt DL vs AA/UA. As in with more and more international cuts combined with a domestic network, does ATL/DTW seem to stay pretty strong and is ATL strong enough to stay busiest.
       
      slcdeltarumd11
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      Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

      Fri May 15, 2020 5:09 am

      PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
      I see the world being a whole lot less global in the next few years ahead.
      At least the US has a robust domestic network that will be needed to pull its weight.
      It is going to be a mess out of this from closed borders, decimated global tourism, health & safety protocol, and decimated economies.

      Some of these international partners are going to be in a bad spot that don't have domestic /short haul networks to fall back upon.


      I think you are correct passenger international travel will be very low here for a while. They need business travelers to make money, and they are not gonna be back in significant numbers for a while.

      Domestic travel i do think will pick back up on the leisure side. Hubs will be more important than ever to cost effectively connect people when domestic travel comes back. It's a whole new world and destinations and demand will be impossible to predict. I do see MCO and LAS taking longer to come back to their massive O&D numbers.

      I think Delta is a very good position with ATL,SLC, MSP, and DTW all being very efficient and affordable hubs to connect people thru. An airline like United will get killed with the high costs at LAX, SFO, ORD, EWR and IAD.

      Don't get me wrong it will be horrible and difficult for all airlines. Delta will have massive layoffs coming, but i do think we are gonna see Delta lean on its lower cost hubs and do better because of them.

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