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klm617
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Tue Jul 14, 2020 9:39 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
klm617 wrote:
Will people be forced to relocate to fill the voids that were left from all the retirements and lay-off or will Delta rebuild it's network according to where it's staff is.


I don't think anybody who knows the U.S. industry needs to ask that question. Pilots and FAs will bid in to bases that have opportunities. Some people will chose to commute. Some workers may see relocations required to retain employment. You rebuild the network around passenger demand and understanding of hub efficiencies, not because you've got x,xxx surplus people at XXX.


I have been told by an airline employee that growth in some markets can not be facilitated because of lack of staff to service the growth in that market. So if an airline employee doesn't know I don't know who does.
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
FSDan
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Tue Jul 14, 2020 11:42 pm

jayunited wrote:
In DL's Q2 report they recorded an impairment charge to the tune of $200 million against their investment in VS, a $770 million dollar charge against their investment in AeroMexico, and a $1.1 billion dollar charge against LATAM. These charges are in addition to the (not surprisingly) $5.7 Billion dollars operational lost for Delta in Q2.

At some point in the future things will turn around for the industry and these partnerships and JV's will once again be profitable but for now they are costing Delta dearly.


The investments are sunk costs, though. I don't believe the AM/LA/VS financial issues have caused DL to blow through any more cash in Q2 than they would have blown through without the investments. They just had less cash going into the crisis than they might have had (assuming they didn't spend those billions on something else, which they probably would have done). The interesting thing to me is that a large part of DL's calculated value from the investments would appear to be the partnerships themselves. If these carriers emerge from the other side of bankruptcy and maintain their JVs with DL, I'm not sure how DL could/would value the partnerships on the balance sheet, but they'd still have much of what they wanted to get out of the investments IMHO.
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tphuang
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 12:06 am

FSDan wrote:
jayunited wrote:
In DL's Q2 report they recorded an impairment charge to the tune of $200 million against their investment in VS, a $770 million dollar charge against their investment in AeroMexico, and a $1.1 billion dollar charge against LATAM. These charges are in addition to the (not surprisingly) $5.7 Billion dollars operational lost for Delta in Q2.

At some point in the future things will turn around for the industry and these partnerships and JV's will once again be profitable but for now they are costing Delta dearly.


The investments are sunk costs, though. I don't believe the AM/LA/VS financial issues have caused DL to blow through any more cash in Q2 than they would have blown through without the investments. They just had less cash going into the crisis than they might have had (assuming they didn't spend those billions on something else, which they probably would have done). The interesting thing to me is that a large part of DL's calculated value from the investments would appear to be the partnerships themselves. If these carriers emerge from the other side of bankruptcy and maintain their JVs with DL, I'm not sure how DL could/would value the partnerships on the balance sheet, but they'd still have much of what they wanted to get out of the investments IMHO.

However, if their ownership stakes get wiped out, those airlines could easily turn their backs on delta down the line
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 11:25 am

(Reuters) - Delta Air Lines (DAL.N) said on Wednesday it would record charges of up to $3 billion on employee voluntary retirement and separation plans in the current quarter, as the U.S. carrier looks to cut costs due to the coronavirus crisis.

Early-out packages have a cost that has to be recognized even if it's not all lump-sum payments.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-heal ... 4G1AV?il=0
 
jagraham
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 12:39 pm

jayunited wrote:
jagraham wrote:
London to NY is the largest and most profitable city pair by any measure except raw flights (some Asian commuter pairs have more flights, but much shorter route and smaller planes). DL was a non factor in this very significant market. But DL + VS have 8 departures each way now versus 12 for BA+AA. And DL still flies between LHR and 8 other cities while VS flies between LHR and 11 other cities (note - they both fly from LHR to BOS and ATL; also, one of VS other flights from LHR is to EWR). viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1426927#p21510531

BA grosses over $1 billion on this route alone https://www.cnbc.com/2019/08/18/british ... outes.html But Forbes noted that 2019 revenue was down 10% on this route for BA, no doubt due to increased competition.

DL was a non factor in the biggest revenue and profit city pair in the world. They found a way to compete via VS. And as long as VS doesn't collapse, DL/VS will continue to be competitive on this route.

That's what DL got out of their VS investment.


In DL's Q2 report they recorded an impairment charge to the tune of $200 million against their investment in VS, a $770 million dollar charge against their investment in AeroMexico, and a $1.1 billion dollar charge against LATAM. These charges are in addition to the (not surprisingly) $5.7 Billion dollars operational lost for Delta in Q2.

At some point in the future things will turn around for the industry and these partnerships and JV's will once again be profitable but for now they are costing Delta dearly. The LATAM deal alone was worth was worth $1.9 Billion just last year and now Delta has to write down $1.1 Billion dollars.


I agree that the partnerships are costly right now. But the partnerships allow DL to do things they could not do otherwise. Also, what is happening here is COVID related, which no one could have foreseen when these partnerships were created. In any case, as long as the partner airlines don't liquidate, the benefits will return when we have a vaccine. Which is looking quite promising now for the end of the year.
 
Detroit313
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 3:01 pm

Massive cuts for August... Fall and winter will be so miserable.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 3:06 pm

Detroit313 wrote:
Massive cuts for August... Fall and winter will be so miserable.

Elaborate?

Right now its hard to say "cuts" since its slowing and/or pausing the rebuild/growth.

The original plan was to add 1000 flights in August vs July. Then they are rolling it back to only 500 incremental in August vs July.
Obviously nowhere near the pre-covid schedule, but its not cuttting from the current new-normal baseline.
 
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NWAESC
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 3:20 pm

klm617 wrote:
Will people be forced to relocate to fill the voids that were left from all the retirements and lay-off or will Delta rebuild it's network according to where it's staff is.


Short answer: No one is ever forced to relocate. The choice will be to either follow the work or separate from the company. Never an easy choice.

Longer(ish) answer: We know some cities will have openings, and some will have overages. That will take a little time to sift out (employees also have until 7/28 to rescind their application for one of the 2 packages). On a larger scale, some departments will need some help while others like Inflight won't. You may see not just station-to-station transfers, but also department-to-department (perhaps an F/A going to Res for a year or two).

Either way, the network will be revamped based on where demand is. The silver lining here is that there is some slack in the system allowing DL to pivot quickly as needed.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 4:46 pm

The ten 73Gs will also be retired. https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news ... 0s-by-ye20

The A220-300 can replace them in practical function.
 
panamair
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 4:55 pm

Delta published their Q2 2020 10Q today and it looks like the 'partial retirement' of the 763ER and A320 fleet includes 7 763ERs and 10 A320s. The impairment charges for these 17 planes were already accounted for in the Q2 results:

".....In the June 2020 quarter we recorded impairment charges of $1.4 billion related to the 777 fleet, $330 million related to the MD-90 fleet, $220 million related to the 737-700 fleet, $180 million related to the seven retired 767-300ER aircraft and $60 million related to the ten retired A320 aircraft in restructuring charges in our Condensed Consolidated Statements of Operations and Comprehensive (Loss) Income ("income statement")...."


NWAESC wrote:
On a larger scale, some departments will need some help while others like Inflight won't. You may see not just station-to-station transfers, but also department-to-department (perhaps an F/A going to Res for a year or two).


That's what I heard as well, that Res will need people while IFS will still be over, so they are exploring cross-departmental transfers etc to preserve jobs.
 
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NWAESC
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 5:11 pm

I would also like to hear a clearer plan/timeline for insourcing work. There's been bits and pieces, but nothing comprehensive.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
adtall
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 5:26 pm

NWAESC wrote:
I would also like to hear a clearer plan/timeline for insourcing work. There's been bits and pieces, but nothing comprehensive.


I'm not expecting anything with any specificity until early August after all the retirements are finalized then a week or two to put things together, but from the way they spoke on the town hall they're definitely anticipating having a lot of opportunities for those that want to move or work in a different department for a while. I know some guys in ATL that commute from Florida due to the ridiculous seniority down there hoping enough guys down there retired so they can transfer for instance. Same for all the Memphis and Cincinnati guys.
 
nwadeicer
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 5:51 pm

NWAESC wrote:
klm617 wrote:
Will people be forced to relocate to fill the voids that were left from all the retirements and lay-off or will Delta rebuild it's network according to where it's staff is.


Short answer: No one is ever forced to relocate. The choice will be to either follow the work or separate from the company. Never an easy choice.

Longer(ish) answer: We know some cities will have openings, and some will have overages. That will take a little time to sift out (employees also have until 7/28 to rescind their application for one of the 2 packages). On a larger scale, some departments will need some help while others like Inflight won't. You may see not just station-to-station transfers, but also department-to-department (perhaps an F/A going to Res for a year or two).

Either way, the network will be revamped based on where demand is. The silver lining here is that there is some slack in the system allowing DL to pivot quickly as needed.


That is one thing I have heard from some managers that I feel is valid. Some people might be asked, or based on seniority, told that they will have to transfer to a different division due to staff changes related to the early outs. Somebody in cargo might be told they have to go to gate/ticketing etc. This would be at the employees own station, nothing was said about any forced transfers to a different station.
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nwadeicer
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 5:55 pm

adtall wrote:
NWAESC wrote:
I would also like to hear a clearer plan/timeline for insourcing work. There's been bits and pieces, but nothing comprehensive.


I'm not expecting anything with any specificity until early August after all the retirements are finalized then a week or two to put things together, but from the way they spoke on the town hall they're definitely anticipating having a lot of opportunities for those that want to move or work in a different department for a while. I know some guys in ATL that commute from Florida due to the ridiculous seniority down there hoping enough guys down there retired so they can transfer for instance. Same for all the Memphis and Cincinnati guys.


I know a couple of years ago the wife and I thought about moving south (TPA MCO) to get away from the MSP winters. Spoke to a couple of ramp agents there, they asked how much time I had in, when I said 20 they chuckled and said I might be able to hold a part time line, if one ever opened up. Full time line was out of the question.
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lightsaber
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 5:58 pm

Atlanta is short on gates and congestion made expansion less economical. I hope during the coming recession we build up airports, including ATL.

We already know SLC will get its overdue terminal expansion.

I'm sad LAX expansion is on hold.

Can DTW be expanded?

Lightsaber
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danipawa
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 6:04 pm

so how was the fleet before the pandemic and how its going to be after this retirements ?
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 6:06 pm

DTW has ample capacity in all facets - airside and landside pre-COVID. There will be absolutely zero need for any sort of capacity increase until at least well into the 2030s.

End of story.

Lets not go down the path, otherwise this will devolve into a DTW thread.
 
FSDan
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 6:16 pm

lightsaber wrote:
I'm sad LAX expansion is on hold.


It's not on hold. Per DL it's been accelerated.

lightsaber wrote:
Can DTW be expanded?


No need. DL sealed off some unneeded gates at the end of concourse C a few years ago that they could always reopen if they need more gates. As is, even with the peak summer 2019 traffic levels and those C gates closed off, there was maybe 1 out of 8 or so daily hub banks that came close to filling up the gate profile DL has at the airport.
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alfa164
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 6:38 pm

FSDan wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
I'm sad LAX expansion is on hold.

It's not on hold. Per DL it's been accelerated.


I am thinking he might be referring to LAX airport expansion in general (e.g., the "Terminal 0" plan), rather than Delta's terminal renovation.
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micstatic
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 6:45 pm

@KLM617 all airlines balance high yield vs lower yield traffic. In delta's case thats the reason they created comfort+/basic economy etc and other segmentation initiatives. but right now it's not necessarily a simple binary decision. IE, Florida is bad, the midwest is good. Everything is bad right now and sadly many times its more cost effective to just park the planes. Not to mention you are assuming ATL is one of the weaker hubs in terms of profitability yet you have no data that actually agrees with this.
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PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 6:48 pm

danipawa wrote:
so how was the fleet before the pandemic and how its going to be after this retirements ?


B717:
YE2019: 91
Current: 47 in-service, 44 in temp storage
Projection: With the exception of a few owned frames, the fleet is leased. Unverified rumors circulated several months ago about perhaps making a deal to return B717 to Boeing in exchance for a future MAX order.
Pilot advanced displacement bid realigned future pilot bases to ATL & DTW only, and planned on operating 30-45 frames through 2022. Fleet is facing an airworthiness directive at the end of 2022 requiring seats to be replaced.
Currently all 717 flying is out-and-backs from ATL primarily backfilling the routes previously flown by MD88/90.

B73G:
YE2019: 10
Current: 5 in-service, 5 in temp storage (1 was just flown yesterday from MWH-ATL)
Projection: Retiring all by end of 2020. Announced yesterday, that all 10 73Gs to retired by end of the year

B738:
YE2019: 77
Current: 48 in-service, 29 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions

B739:
YE2019: 130
Current: 75 in-service, 55 in temp storage
Projection: All 0-6 years old, all should return to service

B752:
YE2019: 111
Current: 37 in-service, 74 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions. Its possible there could be some early retirements or rationalization of subfleets. This could happen of an accelerated timeframe. The domestic non-ETOPS are probably most at-risk. Any retirements are more likely to be based on frames approaching heavy maintenance checks

B753:
YE2019: 16
Current: 11 in-service, 5 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions. Many were pulled out of storage for July flying, a few frames were in the midst of heavy maintenance that will be finished-up. These frames will likely stick around since they just went through heavy maintenance.

B763:
YE2019: 56
Current: 12 in-service, 44 in temp storage
Projection: 7 announced to be retired in 2020, per yesterdays announcement. This fleet is likely to continue to see accelerated retirements depending on trajectory of international demand

B764:
YE2019: 21
Current: 1 in-service, 20 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions. Fleet was in the midst of D1 mods when the pandemic broke

B777:
YE2019: 18
Current: 9 in-service, 9 in temp storage
Projection: Retiring all by end of 2020. Includes all 77E & 77L aircraft

A221:
YE2019: 28
Current: 30 in-service, 1 in temp storage, 14 on-order
Projection: New fleet no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A223:
YE2019: 0
Current: 0, 50 on-order
Projection: New fleet, no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A319:
YE2019: 57
Current: 39 in-service, 18 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions

A320:
YE2019: 62
Current: 14 in-service, 48 in temp storage
Projection: 10 announced to be retired in 2020, per yesterdays announcement. All were parked for April-June, but frames are being slowly returned to service. This fleet is likely to continue to see accelerated retirements depending on trajectory of demand recovery

A321(CEO)
YE2019: 96
Current: 73 in-service, 27 in temp storage, 27 on-order
Projection: All 0-3 years old, all should return to service. No official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A321(NEO)
YE2019: 0
Current: 0, 100 on-order
Projection: First deliveries were to occur 2nd half of 2020, no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A332:
YE2019: 11
Current: 0 in-service, 11 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions. Aircraft around midlife ~15 years. No rumors of anything but could be targeted as a subfleet to remove, possibly a decision of removing A332 subfleet or accelerating more B763 retirements?

A333:
YE2019: 31
Current: 13 in-service, 18 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions.

A339:
YE2019: 4
Current: 3 in-service, 2 in temp storage
Projection: New fleet no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A359:
YE2019: 13
Current: 13 in-service, 0 in temp storage (Some in rolling storage at the hubs)
Projection: New fleet no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

MD88:
YE2019: 47
Current: 0, all 47 retired
Projection: These were already planned to all retire by end of 2020

MD90:
YE2019: 30
Current: 0, all 30 retired
Projection: These were scheduled to retire by end of 2022


---
Current count of accelerated 2020 retirements:

47 MD88
30 MD90
10 A320
10 B73G

8 B77E
10 B77L
7 B763

94 narrowbodies, 25 widebodies = 119 aircraft.
Granted the MD88 were only pulled ahead a few months.
Last edited by PSU.DTW.SCE on Wed Jul 15, 2020 6:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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klm617
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 6:49 pm

PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
DTW has ample capacity in all facets - airside and landside pre-COVID. There will be absolutely zero need for any sort of capacity increase until at least well into the 2030s.

End of story.

Lets not go down the path, otherwise this will devolve into a DTW thread.


Agreed DTW has a lot of room to grow. To be honest 2030 is even optimistic as far as infrastructure goes.
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
panamair
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 7:29 pm

PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
danipawa wrote:
so how was the fleet before the pandemic and how its going to be after this retirements ?


B717:
YE2019: 91
Current: 47 in-service, 44 in temp storage
Projection: With the exception of a few owned frames, the fleet is leased. Unverified rumors circulated several months ago about perhaps making a deal to return B717 to Boeing in exchance for a future MAX order.
Pilot advanced displacement bid realigned future pilot bases to ATL & DTW only, and planned on operating 30-45 frames through 2022. Fleet is facing an airworthiness directive at the end of 2022 requiring seats to be replaced.
Currently all 717 flying is out-and-backs from ATL primarily backfilling the routes previously flown by MD88/90.

B73G:
YE2019: 10
Current: 5 in-service, 5 in temp storage (1 was just flown yesterday from MWH-ATL)
Projection: Retiring all by end of 2020. Announced yesterday, that all 10 73Gs to retired by end of the year

B738:
YE2019: 77
Current: 48 in-service, 29 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions

B739:
YE2019: 130
Current: 75 in-service, 55 in temp storage
Projection: All 0-6 years old, all should return to service

B752:
YE2019: 111
Current: 37 in-service, 74 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions. Its possible there could be some early retirements or rationalization of subfleets. This could happen of an accelerated timeframe. The domestic non-ETOPS are probably most at-risk. Any retirements are more likely to be based on frames approaching heavy maintenance checks

B753:
YE2019: 16
Current: 11 in-service, 5 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions. Many were pulled out of storage for July flying, a few frames were in the midst of heavy maintenance that will be finished-up. These frames will likely stick around since they just went through heavy maintenance.

B763:
YE2019: 56
Current: 12 in-service, 44 in temp storage
Projection: 7 announced to be retired in 2020, per yesterdays announcement. This fleet is likely to continue to see accelerated retirements depending on trajectory of international demand

B764:
YE2019: 21
Current: 1 in-service, 20 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions. Fleet was in the midst of D1 mods when the pandemic broke

B777:
YE2019: 18
Current: 9 in-service, 9 in temp storage
Projection: Retiring all by end of 2020. Includes all 77E & 77L aircraft

A221:
YE2019: 28
Current: 30 in-service, 1 in temp storage, 14 on-order
Projection: New fleet no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A223:
YE2019: 0
Current: 0, 50 on-order
Projection: New fleet, no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A319:
YE2019: 57
Current: 39 in-service, 18 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions

A320:
YE2019: 62
Current: 14 in-service, 48 in temp storage
Projection: 10 announced to be retired in 2020, per yesterdays announcement. All were parked for April-June, but frames are being slowly returned to service. This fleet is likely to continue to see accelerated retirements depending on trajectory of demand recovery

A321(CEO)
YE2019: 96
Current: 73 in-service, 27 in temp storage, 27 on-order
Projection: All 0-3 years old, all should return to service. No official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A321(NEO)
YE2019: 0
Current: 0, 100 on-order
Projection: First deliveries were to occur 2nd half of 2020, no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A332:
YE2019: 11
Current: 0 in-service, 11 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions. Aircraft around midlife ~15 years. No rumors of anything but could be targeted as a subfleet to remove, possibly a decision of removing A332 subfleet or accelerating more B763 retirements?

A333:
YE2019: 31
Current: 13 in-service, 18 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions.

A339:
YE2019: 4
Current: 3 in-service, 2 in temp storage
Projection: New fleet no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A359:
YE2019: 13
Current: 13 in-service, 0 in temp storage (Some in rolling storage at the hubs)
Projection: New fleet no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

MD88:
YE2019: 47
Current: 0, all 47 retired
Projection: These were already planned to all retire by end of 2020

MD90:
YE2019: 30
Current: 0, all 30 retired
Projection: These were scheduled to retire by end of 2022


---
Current count of accelerated 2020 retirements:

47 MD88
30 MD90
10 A320
10 B73G

8 B77E
10 B77L
7 B763

94 narrowbodies, 25 widebodies = 119 aircraft.
Granted the MD88 were only pulled ahead a few months.


Thanks for this list..just a quick point about the 764s, many of the modified ones never really went into “storage” in the traditional sense (ie ILN or MJZ etc) when the pandemic hit. They were left at JFK and ATL and used occasionally when needed. A few of them were also actively used in June on scheduled routes like JFK-AMS and JFK-CDG before those switched over to the A333s. Right now, I see two of them have had some activity in July; N838MH for example has been doing a lot of domestic runs lately.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 7:44 pm

Yes, the storage numbers are "murky" in the sense as you point out there are so many frames in "rolling" storage at the hubs, particularly widebodies. Like you said they may fly every few days or enough to keep them active or to avoid having to perform short-term storage procedures. Planespotters counts many of these as stored since they may go several days without flying.
The aircraft in places like VCV, MZJ, SBD, MWH, ILN, BHM, and MCI have been put into short term storage.
 
FSDan
Posts: 3312
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Wed Jul 15, 2020 8:15 pm

panamair wrote:
Delta published their Q2 2020 10Q today and it looks like the 'partial retirement' of the 763ER and A320 fleet includes 7 763ERs and 10 A320s. The impairment charges for these 17 planes were already accounted for in the Q2 results:

".....In the June 2020 quarter we recorded impairment charges of $1.4 billion related to the 777 fleet, $330 million related to the MD-90 fleet, $220 million related to the 737-700 fleet, $180 million related to the seven retired 767-300ER aircraft and $60 million related to the ten retired A320 aircraft in restructuring charges in our Condensed Consolidated Statements of Operations and Comprehensive (Loss) Income ("income statement")...."


I wonder if the 7 retired 763s will be to eliminate the 76T (or 76L) subfleet, or whether it'll just be a mix of aircraft across subfleets that are next due for HMVs?
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atlflyer
Posts: 723
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 11:13 am

Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:10 am

FSDan wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
I'm sad LAX expansion is on hold.


It's not on hold. Per DL it's been accelerated.

[quote="lightsaber"]

And per the May board meeting at LAX, they confirmed Delta would expedite T3 construction. Basically the phase that was supposed to begin in 2021 that includes reconstruction of the west head house and satellite/fixed link gate area (as they call it) will begin now.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:21 am

atlflyer wrote:
FSDan wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
I'm sad LAX expansion is on hold.


It's not on hold. Per DL it's been accelerated.

lightsaber wrote:

And per the May board meeting at LAX, they confirmed Delta would expedite T3 construction. Basically the phase that was supposed to begin in 2021 that includes reconstruction of the west head house and satellite/fixed link gate area (as they call it) will begin now.

Thank you, I read something wrong.

Lightsaber
Flu+Covid19 is bad. Consider a flu vaccine, if not for yourself, to protect someone you care about.
 
B757Forever
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:42 am

FSDan wrote:
panamair wrote:
Delta published their Q2 2020 10Q today and it looks like the 'partial retirement' of the 763ER and A320 fleet includes 7 763ERs and 10 A320s. The impairment charges for these 17 planes were already accounted for in the Q2 results:

".....In the June 2020 quarter we recorded impairment charges of $1.4 billion related to the 777 fleet, $330 million related to the MD-90 fleet, $220 million related to the 737-700 fleet, $180 million related to the seven retired 767-300ER aircraft and $60 million related to the ten retired A320 aircraft in restructuring charges in our Condensed Consolidated Statements of Operations and Comprehensive (Loss) Income ("income statement")...."


I wonder if the 7 retired 763s will be to eliminate the 76T (or 76L) subfleet, or whether it'll just be a mix of aircraft across subfleets that are next due for HMVs?



My guess is the 76T (ships 1607-1613) aircraft get sold. They are the highest gross weight 767 aircraft and among the youngest in the DL fleet. With flight reductions and added A330 aircraft, their ability to fly long range with increased load is no longer needed. They would be perfect for a freighter operation.
The Rolls Royce Dart. Noise = Shaft Horsepower.
 
deltairlines
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:45 am

FSDan wrote:
panamair wrote:
Delta published their Q2 2020 10Q today and it looks like the 'partial retirement' of the 763ER and A320 fleet includes 7 763ERs and 10 A320s. The impairment charges for these 17 planes were already accounted for in the Q2 results:

".....In the June 2020 quarter we recorded impairment charges of $1.4 billion related to the 777 fleet, $330 million related to the MD-90 fleet, $220 million related to the 737-700 fleet, $180 million related to the seven retired 767-300ER aircraft and $60 million related to the ten retired A320 aircraft in restructuring charges in our Condensed Consolidated Statements of Operations and Comprehensive (Loss) Income ("income statement")...."


I wonder if the 7 retired 763s will be to eliminate the 76T (or 76L) subfleet, or whether it'll just be a mix of aircraft across subfleets that are next due for HMVs?


My guess is that it'll be a mix, but keep in mind Ships 171-179 are all 29+ years old at this point, which is much of their useful life. These planes are also all in the C36Y175 configuration. There's also the weird subfleet of 767s (all 76Z) but have 3 sets of doors and only one overwing exit that could be another oddball type to go (there are 5 of these left; 2 have been scrapped). I wouldn't mind seeing these planes go; as much as I love boarding via 2L and not having passengers walk past me while boarding, I dislike that they lack overhead vents, which is much appreciated when I've got the bed fully laid out.

I doubt the 76Ls (I think that's the one) go - these are the ones with the dedicated crew rest area that are eligible to go on the 12+ hour flights. These planes are only 20 years old, and with demand going to be down for the next couple of years, and I'm going to guess these are all paid off so you're paying fuel, crew and insurance and not aircraft cost which makes it a lot cheaper, these might be seeing a decent bit of work.
 
deltairlines
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:49 am

B757Forever wrote:
FSDan wrote:
panamair wrote:
Delta published their Q2 2020 10Q today and it looks like the 'partial retirement' of the 763ER and A320 fleet includes 7 763ERs and 10 A320s. The impairment charges for these 17 planes were already accounted for in the Q2 results:

".....In the June 2020 quarter we recorded impairment charges of $1.4 billion related to the 777 fleet, $330 million related to the MD-90 fleet, $220 million related to the 737-700 fleet, $180 million related to the seven retired 767-300ER aircraft and $60 million related to the ten retired A320 aircraft in restructuring charges in our Condensed Consolidated Statements of Operations and Comprehensive (Loss) Income ("income statement")...."


I wonder if the 7 retired 763s will be to eliminate the 76T (or 76L) subfleet, or whether it'll just be a mix of aircraft across subfleets that are next due for HMVs?



My guess is the 76T (ships 1607-1613) aircraft get sold. They are the highest gross weight 767 aircraft and among the youngest in the DL fleet. With flight reductions and added A330 aircraft, their ability to fly long range with increased load is no longer needed. They would be perfect for a freighter operation.


Come to think of it (you were typing your post as I was writing mine) but your logic makes a lot of sense. There's value in those 767s right now being sold (thus raising some cash) and with plenty of free A330s (including -900s) that would make sense - those 767s were getting a lot of work out of SEA prior to the 339s coming online, and that's where the 339s were moving into pre-COVID. The number of frames also lines up perfectly, with 7 getting retired and there are 7 of those 767s.
 
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DL_Mech
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:04 am

FSDan wrote:
I wonder if the 7 retired 763s will be to eliminate the 76T (or 76L) subfleet, or whether it'll just be a mix of aircraft across subfleets that are next due for HMVs?


I suspect the 76Ts have the crosshairs on them. They have the popular CF6-80C2 FADEC engines, small TV's in Economy and 2 less seats in J due to the crew rest stairwell.

deltairlines wrote:

My guess is that it'll be a mix, but keep in mind Ships 171-179 are all 29+ years old at this point, which is much of their useful life.


I wonder what will happen with 171? Due to be retired, it was surprisingly sent to HMV in January and scheduled to be finished in March. Anybody want to buy a 135,000+ hour freshly overhauled PW4000 767?
This plane is built to withstand anything... except a bad pilot.
 
tjerome
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 4:40 am

adtall wrote:
NWAESC wrote:
I would also like to hear a clearer plan/timeline for insourcing work. There's been bits and pieces, but nothing comprehensive.


I'm not expecting anything with any specificity until early August after all the retirements are finalized then a week or two to put things together, but from the way they spoke on the town hall they're definitely anticipating having a lot of opportunities for those that want to move or work in a different department for a while. I know some guys in ATL that commute from Florida due to the ridiculous seniority down there hoping enough guys down there retired so they can transfer for instance. Same for all the Memphis and Cincinnati guys.


For the package, were there a lot of takers in ATL? Just trying to understand what opportunities to transfer there may be like.
 
adtall
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 6:04 am

tjerome wrote:
adtall wrote:
NWAESC wrote:
I would also like to hear a clearer plan/timeline for insourcing work. There's been bits and pieces, but nothing comprehensive.


I'm not expecting anything with any specificity until early August after all the retirements are finalized then a week or two to put things together, but from the way they spoke on the town hall they're definitely anticipating having a lot of opportunities for those that want to move or work in a different department for a while. I know some guys in ATL that commute from Florida due to the ridiculous seniority down there hoping enough guys down there retired so they can transfer for instance. Same for all the Memphis and Cincinnati guys.


For the package, were there a lot of takers in ATL? Just trying to understand what opportunities to transfer there may be like.


I don't have any inside knowledge about how many in ATL took the package (and if I did, I wouldn't say) or any specifics about what they may do; it's my semi-informed thoughts based on what the higher ups have said to employees in this week's town hall plus what they've done already with job moving etc. Like I said, I doubt any specifics will be known before mid-August.
 
bravoindia
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 11:26 am

klm617 wrote:
PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
DTW has ample capacity in all facets - airside and landside pre-COVID. There will be absolutely zero need for any sort of capacity increase until at least well into the 2030s.

End of story.

Lets not go down the path, otherwise this will devolve into a DTW thread.


Agreed DTW has a lot of room to grow. To be honest 2030 is even optimistic as far as infrastructure goes.


DTW might have airport room but the airspace and airport is not designed to allow for heavy banks of arrivals and departures like ATL is set up to do. Some people may not like Atlanta but there is not a more efficient well run airport from an operations per hour standpoint. Don’t think that DL doesn’t factor these things in.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 11:50 am

bravoindia wrote:
DTW might have airport room but the airspace and airport is not designed to allow for heavy banks of arrivals and departures like ATL is set up to do. Some people may not like Atlanta but there is not a more efficient well run airport from an operations per hour standpoint. Don’t think that DL doesn’t factor these things in.


DL doesn't need 14 banks, or an avg of 13 flights/gate/day, to grow at DTW. It could handily grow 50% from last summer's 461 flights/day (thank you FSDan!) and if timed reasonably not be crowded. There were big parts of the day - even summer peak days - where even the A Concourse was just empty and dead. There was still plenty of opportunity for upgauging, too: passenger numbers growth without added aircraft movements.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1420613
 
Dalmd88
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:15 pm

tjerome wrote:
adtall wrote:
NWAESC wrote:
I would also like to hear a clearer plan/timeline for insourcing work. There's been bits and pieces, but nothing comprehensive.


I'm not expecting anything with any specificity until early August after all the retirements are finalized then a week or two to put things together, but from the way they spoke on the town hall they're definitely anticipating having a lot of opportunities for those that want to move or work in a different department for a while. I know some guys in ATL that commute from Florida due to the ridiculous seniority down there hoping enough guys down there retired so they can transfer for instance. Same for all the Memphis and Cincinnati guys.


For the package, were there a lot of takers in ATL? Just trying to understand what opportunities to transfer there may be like.

There is no idea at this point. All any of us know is our very local coworkers count. And even that really doesn't really tell much. I know ten AMT's in my Dept took the package. Will all those slots be back filled?

I know the waiting is hard on all of us. That is all we can do for the next few weeks.
 
danipawa
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 3:33 pm

PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
danipawa wrote:
so how was the fleet before the pandemic and how its going to be after this retirements ?


B717:
YE2019: 91
Current: 47 in-service, 44 in temp storage
Projection: With the exception of a few owned frames, the fleet is leased. Unverified rumors circulated several months ago about perhaps making a deal to return B717 to Boeing in exchance for a future MAX order.
Pilot advanced displacement bid realigned future pilot bases to ATL & DTW only, and planned on operating 30-45 frames through 2022. Fleet is facing an airworthiness directive at the end of 2022 requiring seats to be replaced.
Currently all 717 flying is out-and-backs from ATL primarily backfilling the routes previously flown by MD88/90.

B73G:
YE2019: 10
Current: 5 in-service, 5 in temp storage (1 was just flown yesterday from MWH-ATL)
Projection: Retiring all by end of 2020. Announced yesterday, that all 10 73Gs to retired by end of the year

B738:
YE2019: 77
Current: 48 in-service, 29 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions

B739:
YE2019: 130
Current: 75 in-service, 55 in temp storage
Projection: All 0-6 years old, all should return to service

B752:
YE2019: 111
Current: 37 in-service, 74 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions. Its possible there could be some early retirements or rationalization of subfleets. This could happen of an accelerated timeframe. The domestic non-ETOPS are probably most at-risk. Any retirements are more likely to be based on frames approaching heavy maintenance checks

B753:
YE2019: 16
Current: 11 in-service, 5 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions. Many were pulled out of storage for July flying, a few frames were in the midst of heavy maintenance that will be finished-up. These frames will likely stick around since they just went through heavy maintenance.

B763:
YE2019: 56
Current: 12 in-service, 44 in temp storage
Projection: 7 announced to be retired in 2020, per yesterdays announcement. This fleet is likely to continue to see accelerated retirements depending on trajectory of international demand

B764:
YE2019: 21
Current: 1 in-service, 20 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions. Fleet was in the midst of D1 mods when the pandemic broke

B777:
YE2019: 18
Current: 9 in-service, 9 in temp storage
Projection: Retiring all by end of 2020. Includes all 77E & 77L aircraft

A221:
YE2019: 28
Current: 30 in-service, 1 in temp storage, 14 on-order
Projection: New fleet no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A223:
YE2019: 0
Current: 0, 50 on-order
Projection: New fleet, no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A319:
YE2019: 57
Current: 39 in-service, 18 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions

A320:
YE2019: 62
Current: 14 in-service, 48 in temp storage
Projection: 10 announced to be retired in 2020, per yesterdays announcement. All were parked for April-June, but frames are being slowly returned to service. This fleet is likely to continue to see accelerated retirements depending on trajectory of demand recovery

A321(CEO)
YE2019: 96
Current: 73 in-service, 27 in temp storage, 27 on-order
Projection: All 0-3 years old, all should return to service. No official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A321(NEO)
YE2019: 0
Current: 0, 100 on-order
Projection: First deliveries were to occur 2nd half of 2020, no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A332:
YE2019: 11
Current: 0 in-service, 11 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions. Aircraft around midlife ~15 years. No rumors of anything but could be targeted as a subfleet to remove, possibly a decision of removing A332 subfleet or accelerating more B763 retirements?

A333:
YE2019: 31
Current: 13 in-service, 18 in temp storage
Projection: No official announcement of any pending decisions.

A339:
YE2019: 4
Current: 3 in-service, 2 in temp storage
Projection: New fleet no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

A359:
YE2019: 13
Current: 13 in-service, 0 in temp storage (Some in rolling storage at the hubs)
Projection: New fleet no official announcement on revised delivery schedule

MD88:
YE2019: 47
Current: 0, all 47 retired
Projection: These were already planned to all retire by end of 2020

MD90:
YE2019: 30
Current: 0, all 30 retired
Projection: These were scheduled to retire by end of 2022


---
Current count of accelerated 2020 retirements:

47 MD88
30 MD90
10 A320
10 B73G

8 B77E
10 B77L
7 B763

94 narrowbodies, 25 widebodies = 119 aircraft.
Granted the MD88 were only pulled ahead a few months.


wow, huge amount ! but lof of new planes coming too
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 3:55 pm

Considering here were the planned deliveries as of 12/31/19:

2020:
17 A221
6 A223
31 A321 (CEO)
1 A321 (NEO)
7 A339
4 A359

66 - 55 narrowbody, 11 widebody

2021:
12 A223
41 A321 (NEO)
11 A339
2 A359

66 - 53 narrowbody, 13 wideboy

2022:
18 A223
40 A321 (NEO)
8 A339

66 - 58 narrowbody, 8 widebody

After 2022:
14 A223
18 A321 (NEO)
7 A339
10 A359

49 - 32 narrowbody, 17 widebody

Granted this delivery schedule will all be revised going forward.
Its a big number of early retirements, but again the 47 MD88s were already planned to all be retired by the end of 2020 and their replacement capacity was already in planned deliveries for the year.
It will be really interesting to see what the revised delivery timeline looks like and how that jives with additional retirements.
 
tjerome
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Thu Jul 16, 2020 10:46 pm

The number is now at 1,700 for the pilot retirement program. Was 900 last week.
 
FlyGuyNash
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Sat Jul 18, 2020 3:12 am

tjerome wrote:
The number is now at 1,700 for the pilot retirement program. Was 900 last week.


Last I heard today it was over 1900. I am not gonna be surprised to see over 2200 sign up for it. Question remains as to how many will back out though.
 
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DL747400
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Sat Jul 18, 2020 2:21 pm

FlyGuyNash wrote:
Last I heard today it was over 1900. I am not gonna be surprised to see over 2200 sign up for it. Question remains as to how many will back out though.


I'd expect the number of pilots who sign up for the retirement package and then retract it before the deadline will be quite small. They've likely already done the math and are financially, emotionally and intellectually ready to leave, so I just can't see that many pilots getting cold feet at the last moment.

Perhaps there will be a somewhat higher (but still not large) number of last minute retractions among the FAs, ACS, TechOps, RES and other ground workers.
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Cactusjuba
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Sat Jul 18, 2020 7:45 pm

DL747400 wrote:
FlyGuyNash wrote:
Last I heard today it was over 1900. I am not gonna be surprised to see over 2200 sign up for it. Question remains as to how many will back out though.


I'd expect the number of pilots who sign up for the retirement package and then retract it before the deadline will be quite small. They've likely already done the math and are financially, emotionally and intellectually ready to leave, so I just can't see that many pilots getting cold feet at the last moment.

Perhaps there will be a somewhat higher (but still not large) number of last minute retractions among the FAs, ACS, TechOps, RES and other ground workers.


The issue is when you will be granted a retirement date. Some awards will be right away, others not until 2022. Some folks are younger, so an immediate retirement date means more time without medical coverage. Others want to punch-out ASAP, and a lengthy wait may kill the incentive. Several have put in for it just to see what date they'll get, then decide.

It was already stated they won't backfill pilots who reneg on their retirement offer. EX: Pilot A & Pilot B put in for an early retirement. Pilot A gets awarded, pilot B does not. If Pilot A later decides to revoke his award, Pilot B will still NOT get awarded an offer. So it will be interesting to see the final numbers.
 
TonyClifton
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Sat Jul 18, 2020 8:05 pm

bravoindia wrote:
klm617 wrote:
PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
DTW has ample capacity in all facets - airside and landside pre-COVID. There will be absolutely zero need for any sort of capacity increase until at least well into the 2030s.

End of story.

Lets not go down the path, otherwise this will devolve into a DTW thread.


Agreed DTW has a lot of room to grow. To be honest 2030 is even optimistic as far as infrastructure goes.


DTW might have airport room but the airspace and airport is not designed to allow for heavy banks of arrivals and departures like ATL is set up to do. Some people may not like Atlanta but there is not a more efficient well run airport from an operations per hour standpoint. Don’t think that DL doesn’t factor these things in.

Airspace shouldn’t be a major issue these days, DTW airspace was totally rebuilt and implemented last year, full RNAV SID/STAR and triple approaches were happening here and there. I think 22R used an offset RNAV to accommodate approaches on the Inboard.
 
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NWAESC
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Sat Jul 18, 2020 8:23 pm

DL747400 wrote:
FlyGuyNash wrote:
Last I heard today it was over 1900. I am not gonna be surprised to see over 2200 sign up for it. Question remains as to how many will back out though.


I'd expect the number of pilots who sign up for the retirement package and then retract it before the deadline will be quite small. They've likely already done the math and are financially, emotionally and intellectually ready to leave, so I just can't see that many pilots getting cold feet at the last moment.

Perhaps there will be a somewhat higher (but still not large) number of last minute retractions among the FAs, ACS, TechOps, RES and other ground workers.


Very anecdotal, all but 1 person awarded a package in my station has already worked their last day.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
TropicalSky
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Sat Jul 18, 2020 11:01 pm

DAL requesting 15% pay cut from pilots to ensure 1 yr of no furloughs
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-heal ... 4I2UR?il=0
 
cokepopper
Posts: 518
Joined: Wed May 28, 2008 9:44 pm

Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Mon Jul 20, 2020 4:15 pm

https://wsau.com/news/articles/2020/jul ... 8.facebook

Looks like 2235 pilots are leaving so far
 
HNLSLCPDX
Posts: 201
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Mon Jul 20, 2020 5:20 pm

This thread is full of so many false narratives and wishful thinking. I think it’s to a point where many people here on a.net, and specifically on this Delta thread are in a rush to talk in an educated manner about things y’all know nothing about. If you want to get accurate news on the current state of Delta then watch the many interviews Ed Bastian and corporate have been giving on Fox Business, CNN, Sky Hub, etc.

It’s dangerous and simply foolish to speculate about things that have not happened yet especially when it comes to people’s livelihoods, employment, and the overall state or future of Delta. It reminds me of the predictions Fauci and all these medical “experts” have been given the public the last six months and yet not one of them has been correct. Same thing here on this thread. We simply do not know what’s going to happen. Stick to the facts and make sure the information you get is directly from Delta.
 
micstatic
Posts: 766
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2001 10:07 pm

Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Mon Jul 20, 2020 5:25 pm

HNLSLCPDX wrote:
This thread is full of so many false narratives and wishful thinking. I think it’s to a point where many people here on a.net, and specifically on this Delta thread are in a rush to talk in an educated manner about things y’all know nothing about. If you want to get accurate news on the current state of Delta then watch the many interviews Ed Bastian and corporate have been giving on Fox Business, CNN, Sky Hub, etc.

It’s dangerous and simply foolish to speculate about things that have not happened yet especially when it comes to people’s livelihoods, employment, and the overall state or future of Delta. It reminds me of the predictions Fauci and all these medical “experts” have been given the public the last six months and yet not one of them has been correct. Same thing here on this thread. We simply do not know what’s going to happen. Stick to the facts and make sure the information you get is directly from Delta.



It's a forum dude. A place for people to share things. Opinions/facts. Granted some people tend to present opinion as fact. Fauci and "these medical experts" have been wrong about certain things. They've also been right about certain things. I hope you are not one of those guys who still thinks the whole covid virus is a myth. Because if you do, perhaps you shouldn't be on here telling people to be accurate.
S340,DH8,AT7,CR2/7,E135/45/170/190,319,320,717,732,733,734,735,737,738,744,752,762,763,764,772,M80,M90
 
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klm617
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Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Mon Jul 20, 2020 5:31 pm

HNLSLCPDX wrote:
This thread is full of so many false narratives and wishful thinking. I think it’s to a point where many people here on a.net, and specifically on this Delta thread are in a rush to talk in an educated manner about things y’all know nothing about. If you want to get accurate news on the current state of Delta then watch the many interviews Ed Bastian and corporate have been giving on Fox Business, CNN, Sky Hub, etc.

It’s dangerous and simply foolish to speculate about things that have not happened yet especially when it comes to people’s livelihoods, employment, and the overall state or future of Delta. It reminds me of the predictions Fauci and all these medical “experts” have been given the public the last six months and yet not one of them has been correct. Same thing here on this thread. We simply do not know what’s going to happen. Stick to the facts and make sure the information you get is directly from Delta.


While you maybe right why would you just listen to Ed Bastian. He's not going to tell you the full truth he's only going to tell you what he want's you to know. That's a common misconception here that only people in the know tell the truth. Everyone has an agenda this days and half truth are the flavor of the day. Truth that only fits the narrative that suits the agenda. Great examples of this are the elimination of the MEM and CVG hub that Delta management swore were not going to close. We need to see the picture from all sides and perspective's not just the side that cooperate want's us to see. I welcome all the posts I read even the far fetched ones because if you don't like the content just scroll on by. It's not just about the airline and it's management and their perspective it's about all the other cascading events that are effected by the decisions a company makes and those effects need to be brought to light as well.
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
HNLSLCPDX
Posts: 201
Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2015 5:40 pm

Re: Delta plans to emerge a "smaller" carrier

Mon Jul 20, 2020 5:49 pm

klm617 wrote:
HNLSLCPDX wrote:
This thread is full of so many false narratives and wishful thinking. I think it’s to a point where many people here on a.net, and specifically on this Delta thread are in a rush to talk in an educated manner about things y’all know nothing about. If you want to get accurate news on the current state of Delta then watch the many interviews Ed Bastian and corporate have been giving on Fox Business, CNN, Sky Hub, etc.

It’s dangerous and simply foolish to speculate about things that have not happened yet especially when it comes to people’s livelihoods, employment, and the overall state or future of Delta. It reminds me of the predictions Fauci and all these medical “experts” have been given the public the last six months and yet not one of them has been correct. Same thing here on this thread. We simply do not know what’s going to happen. Stick to the facts and make sure the information you get is directly from Delta.


While you maybe right why would you just listen to Ed Bastian. He's not going to tell you the full truth he's only going to tell you what he want's you to know. That's a common misconception here that only people in the know tell the truth. Everyone has an agenda this days and half truth are the flavor of the day. Truth that only fits the narrative that suits the agenda. Great examples of this are the elimination of the MEM and CVG hub that Delta management swore were not going to close. We need to see the picture from all sides and perspective's not just the side that cooperate want's us to see. I welcome all the posts I read even the far fetched ones because if you don't like the content just scroll on by. It's not just about the airline and it's management and their perspective it's about all the other cascading events that are effected by the decisions a company makes and those effects need to be brought to light as well.


I respectfully disagree with you. From the beginning of this pandemic Ed Bastian and corporate said they would be honest and transparent with the information they give. I believe they have been.

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